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Narong Sangnak / EPA
Joe Gordon, 55, looks on from inside a cell at the criminal court in Bangkok, Thailand, on Thursday.
BANGKOK - A court in Thailand sentenced a U.S. citizen to two-and-a-half years in prison Thursday for defaming the country's royal family by translating excerpts of a locally banned biography of the king and posting them online.
The verdict is the latest so-called lese majeste punishment handed down in the Southeast Asian kingdom, which has come under increasing pressure at home and abroad to reform harsh legislation that critics say is an affront to freedom of expression.
The 55-year-old Thai-born American, Joe Gordon — also known as Lerpong Wichaikhammat — stood calmly with his ankles shackled in an orange prison uniform as the sentence was read out at a Bangkok criminal court.
"The defendant is found guilty ... The court sentenced him to five years in prison. But he pleaded guilty. That makes the case easier, so the court decided to cut it in half to 2 years and six months," a judge said at the criminal court in Bangkok.
The sentence was relatively light compared to other recent cases. In November, 61-year-old Amphon Tangnoppakul was sentenced to 20 years in jail for sending four text messages deemed offensive to the crown.
Gordon's lawyer, Anon Nampa, said there would be no appeal against the verdict. "One month from now, we'll submit a request for a royal pardon," he added.
Gordon posted links the to banned biography of King Bhumibol Adulyadej several years ago while living in the U.S. state of Colorado, and his case has raised questions about the applicability of Thai law to acts committed by foreigners outside Thailand.
Speaking after the verdict, Gordon said, "I am an American citizen, and what happened was in America."
'This is just the system'
He also said he had no expectation of being let off easy. "This is just the system in Thailand," he said. Speaking later in Thai, he added: "In Thailand, they put people in prison even if they don't have proof."
Gordon had lived in the U.S. for about 30 years. He was detained in late May during a visit to his native country to seek treatment for arthritis and high blood pressure. After being repeatedly denied bail, he pleaded guilty in October in hopes of obtaining a lenient sentence.
Thailand's lese majeste laws are the harshest in the world. They mandate that people found guilty of defaming the monarchy — including the king, the queen and the heir to the throne — face three to 15 years behind bars. The nation's 2007 Computer Crimes Act also contains provisions that have enabled prosecutors to increase lese majeste sentences.
The U.S. Embassy's consul general, Elizabeth Pratt, told reporters in Bangkok after the ruling that Washington considered Gordon's punishment "severe because he has been sentenced for his right to freedom of expression."
Opponents of the laws say that while the royal family should be protected from defamation, lese majeste laws have often been abused to punish political rivals. That is especially true since the nation suffered a 2006 military coup.
Asked if he would stay in Thailand after serving his time, Gordon said: "I would like to stay and see some positive Thailand. I want to see the real, amazing Thailand, not the messy Thailand."
Many had hoped that the administration of Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra, which has some prominent supporters who have been accused of lese majeste, would reform the laws. The issue remains highly sensitive, however, and Yingluck's government has been as aggressive in pursuing the cases as its predecessors.
Last weekend, New York-based Human Rights Watch urged authorities to amend the laws, saying the penalties being meted out were "shocking."
More targets online
The rise of the Internet in recent years has given Thai authorities many more targets to pursue. Last month, Information Minister Anudith Nakornthap said Facebook users who "share" or "like" content that insults the Thai monarchy are committing a crime. Anudith said Thai authorities asked Facebook to remove 86,000 pages between August and November because of alleged lese majeste content.
The Bangkok Post reported that the Thai government said Wednesday it had set up a committee to seek out and clamp down on websites that publish content considered insulting or offensive to the monarchy.
Gordon, a former car salesman, is accused of having translated excerpts from the unauthorized biography "The King Never Smiles," published by Yale University Press, into the Thai language and publishing them in a blog. He also provided links to the translation to other two Web forums, prosecutors say.
In the banned book, author Paul M. Handley retraces the king's life, alleging that he has been a major stumbling block to the progress of democracy in Thailand as he consolidated royal power over his long reign.
Bhumibol, the world's longest-reigning monarch, is profoundly revered in Thailand and is widely seen as a stabilizing force. He was feted Monday on his 84th birthday, during which he called on his countrymen to unite in response to the worst floods in more than half a century.
The king is frail and has stayed at a Bangkok hospital for more than two years.
The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report.
Read more content from msnbc.com and NBC News:
Leave a Comment:
It's a shame that the monarchy feels so little for the people that they need to stifle expression. Revered or not, the monarchy is to be pitied for such narrow-mindedness.
Oops, guess I better stay away from Thailand, now. I hope they don't believe in extraordinary renditions.
What a royal dick. I'll never go to Colorado.
Looks like the monachy is more feared than revered, but prefer to be willfully blind to that fact..... LOL
Talk about forcing your people to 'love' you....or go to jail....
Hope I am not locked up now for noting that....
On the other hand, how is it possible for that country to lock up an American citizen for exercising his right to freedom of speech in his own country... the USA?
Why would anyone who was aware of the repressive nature of the monarchy as well as government of Thailand who had written an expose of their dispicable "King", be so stupid as to put himself in the position of being subject to the capricious and barbaric rule of said "King" and his minions - those who populate the Thai government?
If you will stick your hand in a meat grinder deliberately, who is to blame for the end result - you or the meat grinder? This man was either extremely ingenuous or extremely stupid beyond belief to even go to what is arguably a God forsaken country: Thailand.
It looks like the "Eastern World" may be finally coming out of their Feudal Ages. I suggest the Monarchies read about the French Revolution to ease their pain.
Go do some research on Thai laws. The monarchy has absolutely nothing to do with enforcing the lese majeste law. The King has tried to change or abolish it on multiple occasions, but he has to do it through a politician, and he can't interfere with politics... it's a @!$%#ed up situation, but it ain't the King's fault.
Hummmmmmmmmmmm 'This is just the system' Where have I heard that before?
In complete violation and disregard of Thai law, I would like to say King Bumballs can go straight to hell. While he's there, he can take his entire corrupt and lying administration with him.
Lese majeste used to be a big deal everywhere - the same as heresy and sacrilege - people used to be burned at the stake. People are forgetful of this nasty little element in human development. In many Islamic countries even today people consider insulting the prophet grounds for execution.
I suppose it would be the normal thing to say what idiots the King and Queen of Thailand are, then welcome them to come and arrest me. But then I shouldn't speak ill of anyone in authority.
Majeste my ass...Thailand needs to start the "Arab spring" of their own to end this bullsh!t....this mornachy thing is just scam to live well and amass wealth while impoverishing your fellow country men.
If the Brits (the mighty British Empire) can freeze the queen's allowance and send her to the soup line, who the hell are these majestes....Thai's need to wake up and have a free democratically elected government and get rid of this monarchy thing....it's the 21st century, you are being taken for a ride....
Most would probably agree that this guy fared worse than Dixie Chicks but much better than Diana.
BZe
The guy when back to Thailand to receive healthcare. They would not have been able to touch him if he stayed in Colorado since he was officially a citizen but...as soon as he stepped foot back into his home country they sure enough could snatch him up and try him since he was born there and there to receive care. He would have been safer to try and see a Dr here in the US. Lessons learned I guess.... 2 year and 6 months lesson learned. It could have been worse.
Oops. me too. No trips to Thailand. No restaurants either. NO products! I'm behind this man.
Their country their law, would we let another country tell us what to do, I don't think so, yet people here think every country should be like us and We wonder why We are so hated ..... MIND OUR OWN BUSINESS, I'm sure we would clamp the bracelets on someone that broke our law and was not a US citizen and besides that he was born there and should have known better ...
I think I'll join the parade of folks in this thread that are committing heinous crimes by informing the Royal Family that they are Royal a**h****. My message to the Royal Family of Tailand: You are all pathetic, worthless, self-important fools and I don't think any of you are worthy to mow someone's lawn let alone rule a country.
Come and get me, morons.
"Anudith said Thai authorities asked Facebook to remove 86,000 pages between August and November because of alleged lese majeste content."
I don't use Facebook personally, but I certainly hope that Facebook does not bow to these weak-minded Thais.
What kind of little girl throws people in jail for insulting him? They are brining down more insults by crying about a few negative comments.
No, the man was arrested for something he did in *OUR* country. In any case, your absurd "their country their laws" position would not allow anyone to say that Nazi Germany was wrong. After all, it was "their country their laws". You see, that's the problem with your Cultural Relativism: it doesn't all you to ever criticize another country's laws, even the worst ones imaginable.
Here's a quote from the news article:
"Gordon posted links the to banned biography of King Bhumibol Adulyadej several years ago while living in the U.S. state of Colorado, and his case has raised questions about the applicability of Thai law to acts committed by foreigners outside Thailand."
Reading is fundamental.
Well That's why they come here, Boycott Bangkok !
Janicon - I guess you failed to comprehend the situation, and then passed judgement like the Thai government. Thai laws got this guy pinched, and yes he was in the US when it happened. Apparently, not sure if you read the outcome of the story (I have to assume you did), but the guy was arrested, due to said Thai laws he broke, when he entered the country. It's their business, and apparently they don't care where one commits a crime. We can decry them all we wish, but it's their king, their country. Should the people of Thailand finally have enough, and rise up then so be it. Until then, comprehension is as fundamental as the content you are reading.
The Ironic part is. The King was born in the USA. He was born in Cambridge, Mass. So, I guess we could try him if he were to come here too..
Hey Judge - how about taking another 2 years and 6 months off his sentence because he's innocent.
You know, people say mean, cruel, and untrue things about the President of the United States (I'm not just talking about Obama, think of every President after George Washington) ALL THE TIME! Do they get thrown in jail? No! And the President of the USA certainly has more power than the king of Lala land *cough* I mean Thailand. These "royals" need to man up. So someone defamed you. Cry me a f*cking river! Some fat little racist white guy published a book called "Where is the Birth Certificate?". Is he in jail now? NO. Why should this guy be in jail for translating and publishing a book defaming the Thai king?
The United States needs to lean down on Thailand politically for persecuting OUR citizens who were exorcising OUR rights in OUR country!
Christian Blasphemy laws are still on the books in England. If you yelled
“Jesus is a dick” in England,
you could do some serious time.
Even so called democracies have archaic laws on the books
that are a throw back to a less enlightened time.
I do not think that it is fair to condemn Thailand
for backward thinking laws, when in the so called more liberal West such laws
still exists.
Thailand
will no doubt reform their laws eventually.
However we can not expect a more rapid reform than our own Democracies
which still have laws on the books that seriously violates freedom of speech
and assembly.
Not saying this judgement is right, but let's look at it with an understanding of the complexities of Thailand. It is akin to burning an American flag during a July 4th parade. The Thai monarchy is the symbol of unity in a country with immense social and economic problems. On the other hand, Thais are a forgiving people and I bet this guy will be released...The king himself might do it.
Motz - You don't go to jail in this country for burning an American flag
Man, what a dilemma -- the pathological smart-a$$ in me desperately wants to lambaste the Thai monarchy and government . . . but the traveller in me still wants to visit Thailand someday w/o the risk of imprisonment. Gonna have to think about this one some more . . .
i smoked some thai-stick once...it made me feel like the king of spain...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8Twcp46kT4&feature=related
If he wouldn't have gone to Thailand he would have been fine, or assuming other Asian countries would allow them to arrest and American citizen for breaking a Thai law and ship him to Thailand. If he'd just stayed here he could enjoy his First Amendment right all he wanted.
Remember we are the only country with this right. Even in Britain and France you can be arrested for saying "mean" or "hateful" things.
Well brian I disagree. Its called arson if thay want you thay will get you
Sure is a crazy world we live in!
Most of you clearly have no idea what you're talking about. The kind of Thailand himself has come out AGAINST these lese-majeste laws and their enforcement. This is not his doing. It's a corrupt government presuming to act in his name.
I'm sure the american media attention will help him out a little. there is nothing american media hates more than Asiatic countries stifling free speech.
Wow, what a bunch of overly sensitive royal dicks they are. How much of wimpy wounded soul does one have to be that they can't handle something as trivial as being insulted. Sticks and stones?! Apparently not in Thailand.
@Miker-3057253 You say "the kind of Thailand" LOL! If he the king did come out, why is the guy still locked up?
To those of you on here that just said bad things about the Royal Family of Thailand, they are at this moment asking the US to hunt you down and punish you. :-)
Why did he go back? Certainly he must have known he wasn't well loved or appreciated.LOL. I mean really...talk about "poking the bear". Lets see here, I'm going to poke the bear...then go into the bears cave and see if it made him mad or not. Hell I have arthritis too...but the last thing I'd want to do is go to some painfully humid country to recieve treatment for it...especially since I'd pissed off a crowd notoriously lacking in a sense of humor.
Did you hear that noise? It was a collective sigh-of-relief from the State of Colorado.
What does Colorado have to do with this? You are the "royal dick".
Well, now there's only one thing for everyone on the Internet to do.
We must all find some Facebook page that defames this monarch with the "thin skin" and Like that page.
Seriously, cannot even believe this type of nonsense still exists in the 21st century.
.
It looks like MSNBC staff and wire best not go to Thailand after publishing this article.
Dussenheim (obamanatic), you can yell anything you want in England and no one is going to arrest you. try researching a bit before declaring silly things like that. You obviously have never been there. brits yell the nastiest, most horrible stuff you have ever heard ROUTINELY in the streets and no one says anything. My soldiers used to beat the snot of out of them all the time because they particularly like to insult peoples wives and children whilst standing in their cues just for fun. They would get in peoples faces and say horrible insults (usually because so many of them have bad drinking problems). They LOVE to pick fights, word fights, and forget that most people around the world just plain fight when you get in their faces. Imagine their surprise when they hit the street. Then you always hear them say "why'd E it me?" DUH!
We had two female friends there (nice people actually) but their common greating to each other were insults excentuated with the F-bomb. (we taught them not to speak that way around our kids) and they had degrees! Even my neighbor a professor no less, used the F-bomb so much he wore the damn thing out.
I lived there 3 years and have heard some of the most horrible stuff in public places because the brits have NO SENSE of civility, compassion for others. They say things that would get them arrested for hate speach anywhere and no one cares; racist, nasty, profane and vulgar in public is normal in any city there. Just head to any pub, stadium, shopping mall, parking lot, restaurant...whatever. You will hear stuff that will offend anyone with a mind, regularly.
We joked regularly with friends that England was great, except for the English.
Stuff they did there, routinely would shock most people here, even gangbangers could take a lesson in nastiness from the brits, not kidding.
And for you PC crowd, yes, there are some LOVELY brits in the world with kind loving hearts, but that is NOT the majority of Brits. Watch the movie, "Hanna". They got Brits down pretty well in that movie, no controls, no limits, no morals.
Misleading article title, so I'm not surprised readers have an assumption before they read a little further. The King of Thailand is against this punishment and will most likely pardon Joe Gordon.
No, maybe they should... Oh, did I say that outloud?
Hey King Bhumibol, you and your family (your wife and your aire to the throne) are nothing but a bunch of self-centered, living in the dark ages, human rights violators.
Now Thailand just try to come and arrest me, I double-dog dare you. Yeah, that's what I thought, good luck with that.
My husband and I were considering a trip to Phuket and Chang Mai in the spring, but if the Thai government is locking up American citizens for infractions as small as insulting their king, we'll find a safer place to visit.
Note to Thailand authorities: Not a smart way to increase your tourism.
Perhaps it is time to overwhelm them with negativity on the internet and snail mail. This is ridiculous in that it is even happpening.
Yet "me"... as a society they have existed for around a thousand years before our time on earth as a goverment...which just so happens to be crumbling as we speak. Ever think that they just don't care what anyone thinks and have not devolved into a nation of apologists who scream foul at anything even slightly off hand?
Hell.... I'd much rather have it layed out in the open than to have it whispered behind my back in the hypocritical way our own society seems to operate. No one here has the guts to say what they think and when it is said.... they all jump up on the bandwagon of judgement just so they won't be labled a politically incorrect outcast...so as not to offend this populations feigned attempts at true sincerity.
God love the Brits for saying what they really think...rather than finding out what you thought they meant was actually all an act in order to appear empathetic! This nation is far too thin skinned anymore...full of false sensitivity and accomidation,even to the very exclusion of their own thoughts and feelings. Emotional dishonesty is the worst of all!
All in the name of safety and security. Do you feel any safer?
hell no!
Where the hell is the State Dep't. in all this mess? This man has been an American citizen for 30 years and has the right to say anything he wants about anyone he wants in this country. He is no longer a subject of the Thai crown, his "crime" was not committed on Thai soil, therefore, the Thai government has no jurisdiction over what he said while living in Colorado.
And they weren't even his own words! He merely translated a text written by Yale University! Is the Thai government now going to go after every Yale alum in their country because they happened to graduate from the same college that originated the "insults"? Are they going to start screening incoming passports against a Facebook profile or university affiliation, looking for reasons to lock up American tourists, reporters and businessmen?
I always had Thailand high on my list of places in Asia I'd like to visit. Not anymore! I wouldn't go to this backwards, corrupt, heroin-exporting, pedophile's paradise if you paid me to, now. I'd also stop any foreign aid payments to their country until he is freed, if I had the power to do so.
The fact that the Obama admin is not DEMANDING that our citizen be returned to us IMMEDIATELY only underscores his complete ineptitude when dealing with foreign leaders.
One last thing. I hear the talk about fat cats and all that but when I see where the large "donations" come from I think. Both sides aren't opposed to playing both sides. Why would this occur? Classes? What a novel idea, I know I'm a slow read. They go at it all day, everyday and project the feelings that they should be feeling onto those who actually have a heart. Master Manipulators.......yep that sums it up. Theirs nothing that says a leader can't have a forgiving heart with a strong moral compass.
Hello All:
This arrest isn't so strange. Under a European Union treaty, a Welshman can do something in his own home and be dragged out of bed at night and extradited to Greece for breaking a GREEK LAW inside his own home in the UK. And I'm not talking about some internet crime crossing national borders. A UK citizen does not need to have any contact with another country for a foreign country to grab him and prosecute him! Sounds hideous to me.
Look folks. Thailand is a very old and poud nation. Most of the Thai I know revere the King. The guy may have been an American citizen, but he broke Thai laws, and then foolishly went to Thailand. They have the right to make their own laws. The guy broke them and now he is paying for it. Bottom line is don't think that as an American you can go gallivanting around the world doing as you please. He made a gamble that he could get in and out and receive free health care, and he lost. That makes a statement about our own nation, the richest one in the world and we can't take care of our own. Thailand makes a lot of our tires and hard drives for computers and various other products, but they have the resources to care for their own, even if they don't live there and have dual citizenship with another country. Makes one think doesn't it.
thai-stick it...LOL...
I wonder if American health care prices drove him to Thailand. In the future, he should check out Canada or Mexico heath care cost. Think of the money, he could have saved on air fare. No, doubt our state dept. is working on his release. After a short time he'll return home to the good old USA. We can only hope Thailand rethinks this policy. Its better to allow free speech than to suffer an embarrassing abdication in the future.
The moral of the story is...Leaplong Whatchamacallit should have sought treatment for his arthritis in Colorado.
It is the reason, I will never visit Thailand again. Boycott this country, where the people are wonderful, but the government, headed by this royal family are thugs! As a foreigner, you are the greatest source of bribes for the crooked police, who will monitor your every move. Boycott your travels to Thailand.
why was nantucket's comment collapsed? made perfect sense to me.
Although the person was a U.S. citizen and has spent 30 years in america, he also was a dual citizen of his native Thailand and should have known better. Right or wrong under our laws, he knew the risk he was taking by leaving the sanctity of his adopted country and could possibly be prosecuted should he return to his native country. He pled guilty to breaking their laws and hopefully he will be pardoned in a month. That is the best he can hope for at this time although, I do believe his stating his intentions of staying in Thailand after his release would have been better for him during the pardon process had he just said no comment at this time.
Thailand's LOSER'S that believe they are "all that" are MAJOR JOKES!!!!! Yes. I said that. I also think you are all total fools!!!!!! Who the hell do you think you are anyways? To me, and probably to most people you are just nobodies! IDIOTS, yes that includes your jerk in charge. I feel soo sorry for the Thai people that live in and under such a ass and country!! GOD BLESS AMERICA!!!!!!!
mick - Get a grip! Better yet chill out. Check your pulse rate and try not to stroke out. Its just not worth it and you are internalizing this matter that doesn't deserve your attention or hostile attitude.
best ...leave your... destination unknown...now crank it up...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXG8V4zY2Pc&feature=related
I think everyone should post something "offensive" about the Thai monarchy to remind them that freedom of speech is always more important than some King's feelings. And they cannot, from another country, control your rights to free speech as an American.
The probably consider this very story on MSNBC to be offensive too, watch out MSNBC reporters in Thailand!
Maybe you should get off our tail, travel to Thailand and do this in the country itself...Ching Ching Farang
Let me guess, he went to "Thai Land" just for the vacation in jail?
What part of "piss off some one" and stay as far away from their wrath as you can get, didn't he get.
Pay back is a bee-atch.
The King doesn't like the laws and wants them changed. Why the politicians in Thailand can't figure out the obvious--especially when the King himself thinks the law should be changed--is beyond me. On the other hand, our own politicians can't figure out the obvious, so why should I think Thailand would be different?
That is so true, if they can count pass the fingers and toes they have I would be really impressed ... LMAO
While I agree that another country shouldn't be able to take our citizens out of our country, this guy went to Thailand. He went after he knew he posted defamatory stuff about the ruling body of the country. He returned in hopes of getting that country to cover his health care costs for arthritis - not exactly a life-threatening condition.
Posting something controversial online about a country's leadership then go to that country seeking assistance from that same leadership is pretty crazy, especially when you know that country has a very harsh judicial system (which this guy says he knew).
Don't be too quick to trash the king. Remember, Obama is very jealous right now. He has been trying for 3 years to obtain such laws, but has only been successful in bullying people and companies to keep their mouths shut and pay exorbitant fees for the privilege of keeping him off their backs.
@THX
It does not cancel out the fact that the law is being used the point of being absolute madness though. I, for one, support better freedom of speech in Thailand but over the years this single law has been acting as a giant wall stopping any improvements in freedom of speech.
What I find ironic about this law is the fact that even the King himself opposes it... And yet the government keeps it in the system as a weapon against opposition...
As I have 0 plans to travel to Thailand, I'll join in: The king is an idiot for allowing these laws to continue. Sounds like more of a puppet king to me, as the politicians are obviously making the rules and probably using this law to just jail people they deem a threat.
@Brokinarrow
Not quite a puppet, but more as a shield. The King is a respected figure for the locals, but the government isn't, so the government is basically using the King as an excuse to do thing, regardless if the King agrees or not.
unrelated - Sad state of affairs that. Oddly, this makes it sound like it'd be better if the KING actually had more power than the people...
Oh, witchrunner, the laws in Thauiland have nothing to do with politics in the US. But if you're going to insist on politicizing this anyway, please provide even one legitimate source showing that President Obama has made any such attempt to get laws passed to prevent people from criticizing him.
CJ: I realize some have short memories. Of course, that's why we got into this mess economically in the first place. That being said, who can forget the memo sent out from the administration trying to shut up insurance companies and health care providers from criticizing Obamacare.
Well I never want to travel to any foreign country. You never know if they will get pissed. I'm very surprised nothing was mentioned here about the U.S. backing one of it's citizens. I am sure Rushdie knew better than to go back home, but if he did, would the western world be in an uproar over what would happen to him ? Britain should have tried Assange right there.
While I am proud to be an American, it saddens me that we have no respect for other people's culture or laws. For some reason most Americans seem to think that our rights follow us everywhere in the world. Yes, I agree that the sentence was harsh, but at the same time he knew what he was writing was wrong/offensive then had the audacity to go back to Thailand. I have no sympathy for stupidity.
Salvia58-3789575
Well I never want to travel to any foreign country. You never know if they will get pissed.
Good Idea, keep the tourism trade down and uncrowded for those who love to travel.
The Thai Monarchy is a figurehead just like in England. They have no political power, other than to make suggestions. The Thai government is trying to make people respect the government in keeping these laws on the books, despite the King's wishes. BTW I know several Thai folks. The ones that were born there and immigrated here are the hardest working people I have ever met. They are also a fiercely intelligent people, and very shrewd businesspeople. So you nay-sayers could stand to improve yourselves by taking example from them...Things are changing in Thailand, just like everywhere else. Lets hope that it is a good change.
Hey Culbert! Imagine the propaganda poopstorm if this had been an American Citizen criticizing the Ayatollah, and Iran put him in jail... And how long before the same behavior with some different rationale but same effect puts Americans in the Guantanamo Gulag? And if the 'King' disapproves of this policy, what's 'king' mean anyway in this context when the very officials who have abused this guy ignore the wishes of the King (unless the guy above doesn't know what he's talking about but sounds like he does). What greater disrespect to the King than to simply ignore, nay, deny his expressed wishes? Naw. This is a psychopathic elite propping up an antique symbol of their own power which still has sway over a superstitious population. "Kings" come right from g-d, dontcha know, like a toenail or haemorrhoid or something. Kinda like what our own parasite would like to do here with our own superstitious symbol worshipping hatemongering christers. This is purely 'political' and has little to do with the King, per se. But, if you respect fascism, then I see your point, or at least the origin of your objection.
3 deleted, Jerrytrth with a derail about the POTUS. Write your own article.
@ William Bjornson
While I do think that this is a rather harsh punishment, I can see where Culbert is coming from. We as Americans do seem to forget that our laws do not protect us when we go to foreign countries. I lived in a Eurpoean country for 2 years and there were many laws that were different. It was my responsibility to learn those differences. Ignorance doesn't keep you from being punished for them. It's the same in America. A simple example would be driving on a road where you haven't seen one speed limit sign, and then being pulled over for speeding. Telling the cop you don't know what the speed limit was isn't going to save you from getting a ticket. You chose to drive, it was your responsibility to know the law. It sounds to me like this guy knew what he was getting himself into. From what the article quotes, to me, he didn't seem surprised that something like this could happen.
Also, from what I've seen from my travels, Americans have a bad rap as tourists, and after seeing some of the things that I did, I quickly learned why. Most Americans are rude, loud and arrogant. I got sick of American tourists getting mad at the locals for not being able to speak English, and for insulting the local culture. While I understand that this is not what the man did while in Thailand, I can see exactly what Culbert was trying to say in his comments.
What a backwards third world chit hole. As Paul Harvey used to say it isn't one world.
The US has passed that threshold long time ago.
A backwards chit hole where some think "The Flintstones" is a documentary.
Hey. Keep Fred and Wilma out of this.
I worship King Fred and Queen Wilma as worthy heirs to the crown of Thailand
How about Bam Bam?
ill insult the @!$%#!! FELT GOOD
The corruption in Thailand makes China look like Scandanavia.
@ Randy I disagree, the "corruption" i.e. the number of people you have to pay to get things done in Thailand is around 3X that of China otherwise Same, Same process. Which also increases the time (which Thais have no concept of, "Late" can mean 5 minutes or a year..)
Since the King is the representative of the entire country the process of getting anything done in the Kingdom can make you want to cuss him, which is the equivelant to stomping on or burning the flag to Americans.
If you had a beef with the American government, would you stomp on the American flag and burn it, all the while chanting "death to America"?
I didn't think so.
I curse our president (both present and past presidents) and congress reps quite regularly, however I would likely have to restrain myself from taking a swing at someone that dared to stomp/burn our flag in front of me. Our country has it's problems, but there isn't a better place in the world to live.
Spartan , maybe you can explain to me how translating an unauthorized biography of the king from English to Thai, written by Yale University, and posting excerpts from it on the web correlate to burning the American flag and defaming the government, because I don't see the connection.
Hey Thai King, How about all those little children you let get molested in you Country. Its a center of Children for sale. Well you are not my King MoFo.
Thailand is indeed one of the leading spots for sex tourism, especially underage sex tourism. If the Thai monarch didn't secretly approve of child prostitution (and get his own taste of it as well), why would the sex tourism underground business in Thailand be doing so well, without much official crackdowns? What excuse does the Thai government have for not doing a single thing about protecting the rights of children and women?
The King isn't the center of political power. Thailand's a constitutional monarchy, so the country's run by a prime minister. Tourism is the main source of income and since so many people go to Thailand for sex, the government wouldn't crack down on prostitution of any sort--as long as it's popular. Cops aren't paid a whole lot so they're extremely corrupt, and politicians are corrupt too, so crackdowns have very little chance of succeeding. The cops would accept payment and the criminals would go into hiding. Some time after the cops leave, they would come back out and resume business.
Here's two words for the so-called king and his whore of a wife, "Fah-Que"
Excellent..........my sentiments exactley!
The former Thai was arrested in THAILAND.
While he was taking advantage of the Thai Citizens inexpensive health care...
Like a US Citizen, if you VIOLATE - US laws in another country... You can be held ACCOUNTABLE...
IMO - I think it is funny that he wanted to use the Thai system for his advantage, but was unwilling to abide by the Thai Laws...
BTY - The USA banned 'for life' a UK college student from traveling to the USA, for E-mailing Obama and referring to him as a PR!CK...
Obviously you didn't read the article, but did you even bother to read the entire headline? He didn't violate any US laws at all (as you stated), and if you meant to say violate a foreign country's laws while in that country... well, he didn't do that, either! He was in Colorado, which is definitely not in Thailand.
So basically the message this sends is that anyone who has ever insulted the Thai monarchy, irrespective of where they were at the time, or of what citizenship, can be arrested and jailed if they happen to visit Thailand.
Talk about a dangerous, slippery slope. I hope the US diplomatic corps get involved in this.
If you were born Thai, you are accountable for their laws, irrespective to where you are currently living...
If you are visiting Thailand and insult the King you can be held accountable...
BTY - I live in Thailand and know more about this case that just what the supposed news article is stating...
Here is another example:
If you are a US Citizen and have sexual relations with someone younger than 18 (US method), you have committed a felony and can be convicted in the US Court system...
BTY - The Thais count their birth date as one year. So when a Thai tells you their age, they are one year younger, using the US method...
Ignorance of the Law, even in a foreign country is no excuse...
AC, I'm sorry, but some of the things you've stated are simply not true at all. Respectfully, living in Thailand does not make you an expert on their culture or legal system. I'm an American living just south of you in Malaysia, have been here for quite awhile now, and I'd never pretend to be an expert on their laws and social nuances. Hell, most Americans are woefully ignorant of American laws! Residing in a place certainly isn't synonymous with being super-knowledgeable about it.
This man wasn't a Thai citizen any longer, regardless of where he was born. There is no way any country can claim planetary jurisdiction, even over people who aren't citizens of that country. You claim as fact that any person born in Thailand, no matter where they are in the world, no matter whether or not they're Thai citizens, are still accountable to Thailand for its laws? Prove it.
And yes, people can be prosecuted under child sex/porn laws in the US, if they are US citizens and commit those crimes outside of the US, but it's definitely not "under 18." Most US states have 16 and 17 as legal ages of consent, along with virtually every country in the free world. If a 25 year old American goes to Ireland and has sex with a 17 year old Irish citizen, the US cannot prosecute that act, even if they wanted to. The age of consent in Ireland is 16. Your post claims that the American has committed a felony and can be tried in the US. That's utterly wrong.
Ignorance of the facts, when they're so easily available for checking online, is no excuse...
The informed versus the misinformed. Go Chad.
When I was traveling internationally for the U.S. Government (including Thailand), we were always told by State we were under the laws of the host nation and needed to act carefully while there. We never considered whether something we had done at home might carry across the oceans and we be held accountable there. It's mind boggling.
I'm sure Joe Gordon never thought he'd have to answer for acts he committed while he was living in CO that are perfectly legal, even protected here but illegal in Thailand. The one mitigating factor might be the internet; if he had published a book in CO that never made it to Thailand, would he still be in jail? Since this was on the internet, one could argue he was purposly publishing an illegal publication internationally. Maybe?
The Thai law is barbaric and is counter to everything we hold dear here. When I traveled, I was grateful to come home to the freedoms we take for granted that other countries don't have. It was very obvious to me even when going to relatively free places like New Zealand, Austrailia, and Germany. I won't even get into the corruption we encountered in most Asian countries.
AC Robertson said:
The USA banned 'for life' a UK college student from traveling to the USA, for E-mailing Obama and referring to him as a PR!CK...
Takea look at this from an Associated Press article...
Vancouver psychotherapist Andrew Feldmar has been barred from entering the United States. The reason? During a random stop-and-search at a US/Canadian border crossing, a Google search of his name led to his article from the Spring 2001 'Janus Head: Journal of Interdisciplinary Studies in Literature, Continental Philosophy, Phenomenological Psychology, and the Arts.' In it Feldmar describes two acid trips he took under the supervision of his graduate advisor in psychology -- in 1967. This turns out to have been enough to earn him a life-time ban under the grounds of 'admitted drug use.'
Bad thing about this is that while he lives in Vancouver and is a Canadian citizen, his children and several grandchildren live here in the US and he can't see them now unless he sneaks into the country 'illegally'... all because he took a couple of acid trips in 1967 as a psych experiment.
AC - It's people like you that see nothing wrong with laws that restrict freedom that would be the downfall of the free world, if it weren't for people like us that are willing to fight to protect said freedoms.
I'm going to have to agree with AC Robertson on this one. John Walker Lindh, for example, is a US citizen. He lived in Afghanistan and supported the Taliban. He was captured and tried for breaking eight US law while living in Afghanistan (including conspiracy to murder US citizens, providing material support to terrorists, and using a firearm during crimes of violence). Why should he be punished for breaking US law while in Afghanistan?
Joe Gordon is a dual citizen of Thailand and the US. The US does not formally recognize dual citizenship so to the US, he is officially a US citizen. However, to Thailand, he is still a citizen of Thailand. And he broke Thailand's laws, like Lindh broke the US laws.
AC Robertson- aren't you the same AC Robertson who last year posted that the King of Thailand's mother wears Army boots........
Sabre - Lindh was committing treason by actively fighting against his country... Joe Gordon committed no crime. I don't recognize any country's right to outlaw basic universal human rights.
You mean, no crime according to US law? Just like John Walker Lindh committed no crime according to Afghan law, where he lived.
Sabre, I'm not sure your comparison is valid. Lindh was a US citizen committing treason against the US -- doesn't matter where you do that from. It's treason. US citizens are bound by certain US laws even when they are outside the country. There's no question about that.
I read the article very carefully and didn't see any mention of Gordon's Thai citizenship. It mentioned specifically that he was a US citizen at least three times, however. If he has indeed maintained his Thai citizenship, then that changes everything, to me.
I still think the punishment is insane, but if he is a Thai citizen, then surely he would be bound by this law. But, you or I, as American citizens, can sit in our non-Thai homes and post whatever comments we want about the Thai king (in fact, you can see quite a few such comments on this very page). If Gordon is an American citizen only, then he should have that same freedom. After checking on a few other sites, including BBC and even Thai news, I still find no mention of him being a Thai citizen whatsoever.
In fact, one story had this:
"After being sentenced, [Gordon] told the Bangkok court: "I'm not Thai, I'm American. I was just born in Thailand. I hold an American passport. In Thailand there are many laws that don't allow you to express opinions, but we don't have that in America."
Doesn't sound like he's a Thai citizen at all to me.
Moreover, this man didn't even actually insult the monarchy! He merely translated a book from English to Thai and posted it online, along with a couple of links.
You who posted "banned a UK college student because he called the President a prick."
Source that! if there is a solid factual reporting. If not, gotcha!!
Chad, like the United States, anyone born to Thai parents while living in Thailand automatically acquires Thai citizenship (however, unlike the US, one parent must be a Thai citizen) according to Thailand's Nationality Act of 1965. Whether or not he says he is Thai does not change it. He can renounce his citizenship through Thailand's government (like a US citizen can through the State Department); however, there is no indication that he has done so.
While it is true that he has US citizenship, that does not automatically mean that he doesn't have Thai citizenship.
Felony for having sex with minor in foreign country - The United States has taken legislative action against the growing evils of child sex tourism. In 1994, Congress established 18 U.S.C. § 2423(b), which is aimed towards prosecution of child sex tourists. Section 2423(b) criminalizes traveling abroad for the purpose of engaging in illegal sexual activity with a minor.
The federal government has successfully utilized § 2423(b) to target several child sex tourists. Current proposals to eliminate the intent requirement may broaden the government's prosecutorial power by allowing the government to prosecute United States citizens who engage in sexual acts with children while abroad, regardless of when they formed the intent to do so.
Clinton signed a International agrement to enforce this law...
Concerning the UK student banned fron the USA see - http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/3135327/Obama-rant-Brit-banned-from-US-for-life.html
Ignorance of the law is no excuse...
While I may never become a Thai Citizen, my Thai children can not renounce their Thai Citizenship...
There was this country once, they had this king that was real D@#k, he tried to make the people drink tea and pay this real heavy tax on it, so the people threw the tea in the ocean and that started a rebellion, the people kicked the king out of thier country and the country eventually grew into the greatest country in the world.
We should send this message to the Thailand People, and then we should give them guns.
And oh! I almost forgot, instructions on how to choke-hang former kings.
You have obviously never been to the Kingdom of Thailand...just cause its different does not mean it is wrong. Many Thai's point to the current problems in America and say how glad they are they do not have to live in such a horrible system it has become. Who in their right mind would live anywhere which taxes them 50%
And look how far this so-called "greatest country in the world" has fallen.
Thailand doesn't need a rebellion--it just needs new laws. The King has tried to get rid of lese majeste laws for many years now--but he can't do it himself. Politicians are required to abolish the law, but abolishing it would cause it to be broken in the process. Rival politicians won't let go of this fact. And the King can't simply issue the "offending" politician a pardon since he's not allowed to interfere in politics.
I'm sorry. Sometimes, it IS wrong. Freedom of Conscience (expression) is a universal human right.
Spartan, I can imagine that if the "King" was so adament about changing the Law that he decided to abdicate the Thrown and abolish the Monarchy, then something would happen. I think he just does not care that much.
People vote with their feet, and he needs to get moving....but no, the wealth and position are just to appealing. Someone in his position can really make a change if he wanted to.
@Spartan:
But if the king were to say "I wasn't offended by that statement, in fact, I found it amusing.", then would that not satisfy the law, as it would invalidate the violation?
guess we'll see in 30 days when he asks for the Royal pardon.
"American" in asia - You know what, I'd much rather live in a country where I know my children will not be sold into sex slavery, where I can insult my elected officials till I'm blue in the face, and can generally say whatever the hell I want without fear of persecution. If you hate these freedoms so much, I'm glad you're not in the US, and why not go ahead and give up your US citizenship as you obviously don't care for it?
Amen! and Hoorah, Brokinarrow!
You have a real "George Bush" mentality, Brokinarrow. "Yer either for us, or yer against us." Nobody said they hated America. The point was, very simply, just because it's different doesn't mean it's wrong.
And here's a news flash for you: Though it may not happen now, you actually DO live in a country where people were sold into slavery for about the first hundred years of the country's existence, so let's not get too high and mighty, eh? For a country founded on the principles of equality, we didn't give women the right to even vote until, oh, 160 years later. Took another 30-40 years after that for black people to be given full legal equality. And plenty of Americans are STILL struggling for real equality. So you might just want to adjust your throne a bit as you look down on the rest of the world. Where exactly do you think the buyers for those children who are sold come from? If you guessed "America and Western Europe," you'd be about 90% correct.
I believe getting 20 years in prison for sending four disparaging text messages about the king and queen is completely wrong, naturally, but guess what? Much of the world looks at America and thinks we're wrong (or insane) to allow our country to be overrun with guns and plagued by gun violence. So it's all a matter of perspective.
I'm also an American living in Asia now, but it's not because I hate America. Quite the opposite, I love my country tremendously, but I can assure you that our ways are not the only ways, nor are they always the best ways (thought I do believe that sometimes they are).
.Chad.....if Thailand ever catches up, in maybe another hundred years or so with their human rights policies ............let us know......and you could try a little harder to defend America overseas when those foreigners make unfair attacks on America........
Chad, I was with ya on everything you posted on this topic, but you jumped the shark with your last comment.
No government in existence is clean. No government on Earth does not have things in their past they'd like forgotten. However, the sin of slavery WAS abolished in America, and in a remakably short period of time after our country's inception. Thailand's record of human trafficking has been well-known and well-documented for centuries, and is still happening to this day. The lies and distortions of American life told to the native Thai people in order to keep them suppressed and compliant with their tyrannical regime are just that--lies and distortions. Just like North Korea or Soviet Russia, they want their citizens to think that life is so much better for them at home than in America that they won't leave. It's all propoganda.
Truth is, you'd be safer walking the streets of South Central at night than you would in Bangkok during broad daylight.
NeighborOfTheBeast,
I have lived in BKK and across Thailand and many other countries.
Even during the political protest, I had no problem with traveling anywhere in Thailand or BKK...
Would I walk the streets of DC, Detroit, Chicago, or El Centro during the night??? Hell No...
"while the royal family should be protected from defamation"
Er...why exactly? If we have to have monarchies at all, then it would certainly reflect better on a nation if it's king or queen didn't have a fragile ego and no sense of humor.
The Thai monarch is simply concerned that the public will learn of his exotic taste for children. If only the full truth came out, Sandusky would look like Gandhi himself.
Thai royalty have very little political power. They have no say in the matter, even though it clearly concerns them. The most they can do is issue a pardon. Get your facts straight.
Well guess what, if your standing in a court in The United States of America and you call the judge an @!$%# you'll get locked up too. How free are we really?
Agreed. But you can do it online as long as you don't expect to confront that judge at a later date.
Done been there,done that.
I agree it's hardly the same thing, but we still aren't as free as we like to think we are.
The governor of Wisconsin, Scott Walker, would like very much to have the same types of punishment available for demonstrators and people who don't like him or his totalitarian minded cronies, which is quite a few people.
Yeah, Aengus, it happens to be the MAJORITY of the people in Wisconsin. The private citizens of WI are sick and tired of seeing their public-sector counterparts being paid TWICE what they earn, on average, particularly since the money to pay them comes from taxes taken from private citizens. Add to that their "Cadillac" health care plans, extravagant vacation packages, pensions-for-life and paid holidays that everyone else has to work (Arbor Day, Flag Day, President's Day, Earth Day, etc., ad infinitum), and it's no wonder that Gov. Walker, the Republicans in the WI State congress and the vast majority of non-union workers in WI wanted to see the collective blackmail--oops, I meant "bargaining"--that has the State of WI paying out more money than it takes in to STOP!!! What part of being over $6,000,000,000 in debt do you not understand? And the public union workers are demanding pay raises? Crying over being asked to contribute 3% of their inflated incomes to their own retirement fund? What color is the sky on the planet where you live, sir?
What a LOAD.
"When in Rome , do what the Romans do". People will never learn. Look at that man in the picture, he's a thai not American by birth. The king is the most revered in the nation and he has nothing to do with lese majeste laws which have not been updated for almost a century. Thailand is under constitutional monarchy in which PM and his cabinet are running the country. Please read below so as you all can understand better about the King.
* Two days ago on Dec.5, all over Thailand celebrated its National
Day and H.M. The King's 84th Birthday, the most revered in the nation of 65
million people. Over 65 years, King Bhumibol has initiated more than
4,000 development projects - from irrigation, farming, drought and flood
alleviation, crop substitution, public health, distance learning to
employment promotion. His Majesty also developed a philosophy of
"sufficiency economy" as a way of life for the Thai people.
H.M. The king is a devoted all-rounder both the arts and music. As an
accomplished jazz musician, H.M. composed in total of 78 songs over a period
of 5 decades. Besides his musical talents, King Bhumibol is also a painter,
photographer, best-selling author and translator. Not to mention H.M.
skilled in sailing and design sailboats. H.M. won a gold medal for sailing
in the 4th SEA games in 1967.
In November 1999, H.M. was conferred honorary Doctoral of Science from
University of Victoria, British Columbia, Canada for his service to the Thai
people with dignity and selfless dedication for more than five decades.
In May 2006, H.M. was presented with the first United Nations' first Human
Development Lifetime Achievement Award, for his efforts to human development
to improve the lives of his people across the country. The award was
presented by Mr. Kofi Annan, Secretary-General of the United Nations at the
time. His address lauded H.M. as "the World's Development King"
King Bhumibol was born in Cambridge, Massachusetts on Dec. 5, 1927,
graduated from Lausanne University in Switzerland and ascended to the throne
on the 9th of June 1946. H.M. is the World's longest reigning Monarch .
Over 6 decades, H.M. has never stopped searching for ways to enhance the
well being of his people and leading Thailand to the 21st century.
He, the King, is also keeping the Islamic forces from poisoning the minds of the people.
Art, ya shoulda stopped with your first sentence, 'cause you run off the rails a little after that. It doesn't matter where this man was born, he has been an American citizen for 30 years. His alleged "crime" took place while he was in Colorado, not Thailand, so Thai law does not apply here. Your glowing, but slightly creepy synopsis of the Thai king's life acheivements doesn't mean much in a world where Barack Obama can win the Nobel Peace Prize for doing nothing but regurgitate platitudes and cliches. If the king is supposed to represent all that is good about Thailand, he's doing a lousy job, and if he has single-handedly advanced the cause of the Thai people on the world stage, what does he have to show for it? Most of their country is living a Stone Age existence, and what little advancements are to be seen are in the way of heroin production and more efficient participation in the world's biggest sex-slave market. Oh, and they can beat you up with their elbows and knees. Wow! That's a lot to be proud of!
Talk about having this both ways. First of all, he's just a symbol of the country akin to the British Monarch, has no political role, is above politics, etc. Then he single-handedly initiated over 6,000 "development" projects in agriculture, flood control, public health, etc., which sound good but precisely like "political leadership". Then also he is apparently a world-renowned painter, composer, etc., which makes him sound more akin to "Great Leader" Kim of North Korea. I don't accept that "the king is apolitical and above reproach and by the way he does a great job running the country," because the second trumps the first and means that he is an executive king and hence really a hereditary politician, but, like a medieval king in the West, somehow above criticism. In the West this was based on the "Diving Right of Kings" Theory. What is the Buddhist equivalent, since apparently there must be one of which I am unaware?
Only 15 posts here and none at:
Only 15 posts here and none at: Town Hall America Debates
While I think the law is despicable, Mr. Gordon is a dual citizen it seems, and I presume knows the culture well. And the article mentioned that he was in Thailand (the land of his birth) seeking medical care - taking advantage of the low cost of the care there. He k(It appears that Thailand is more civilized than the US in providing proper medical to its citizens.) He knew the risk he took when he went there to take advantage of its health services - while not having lived there to pay taxes. And he was given a lighter than normal sentence.
I don't think this is any concern of the US (or ourselves).
Medical services in Thainland cost 30% of the US and are more advanced, by about 2 years, than US healthcare.The Thai medical system does what is right for the people, not their gov't
I'm not sure about "more advanced", but the Thai medical system is defintely better than the American one. For starters, if you're poor and you get sick, you aren't left to die.
As a Thai Citizen their 'Universal Medical Care' cost them $1+USD per Doctor or Hospital visit, with NO deductable or premium cost...
As a foreigner I pay;
The average Thai Dentist charges $30+USD a hour, which includes medication and X-rays...
My last physical, which included; up-dated vaccinations, X-rays, and blood work-up, cost me $110+USD...
Most Thai doctors were trained in western hospitals, at the Thai government expense, and they use the same equipment they were trained with...
Look, if you are between 7-50 years old, have no genetic anomalies and didn't draw the short straw in life's health lottery, the simple fact is, YOU DON'T NEED A DOCTOR!
Try getting a hip replacement or gall bladder surgery in a country with socialized health care. In the U.K., your wait will be 9 months or more. In the U.S., it is 2 weeks, max. In the U.S., if you need a bypass, you'd be out of surgery within 14 hours after admission. In the U.K., you'd be given minimal support therapy and put on a list. Nearly 40% of people waiting for bypass surgery in the U.K. die while on that list.
Doctors in socialized medicine get paid whether they fix you or not. But they have quotas on the number of operations they are allowed to perform in a year. As the year's end approaches and their quotas are filled, they go on vacation, and people die unnecessarily.
FACT: people who live in free market medical environments live longer, healthier, less pain-filled lives than those who live under socialized medicine.
In Europe, with costs capped by the EU, there is no incentive for a pharmaceutical company to develop new drugs. They can easily cost more than a billion dollars to develop, but the results are worth every penny. That bypass surgery? It was one of the most lucrative surgeries of the 80s. Now, it's been demoted to a last-ditch effort if blood thinners and anti-cholesterol drugs don't work.
In Europe, doctors and their bosses (read: governments) have no vested interest in keeping people alive. Health care is rationed. 90% of their socialized health care is used up by people in the last six months of life. By denying them health care (read: death panels), they kill two birds with one stone. Save money and get rid of the primary users. In Holland, old people, children with birth defects and anyone with a chronic disease are routinely "medically terminated" to save the state money. Terminal cancer? Treatable in the U.S., but they'd rather just turn up the morphine drip and let Grandma slide into the night.
In France and Germany, world renowned surgeons are paid fractionally more than less competent doctors.
Remember SARS (Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome) a few years ago? Killed 50,000 worldwide? Killed 5 out of 10 infected, even in Canada, which is advanced and reacted quickly. Cases that reached the U.S. were given another name--MARS (Mild Acute Respiratory Syndrome). Same exact bug. Not. One. Person. Died. Zero. Why? As America ages, the sheer number of health care providers has exploded. We don't wait for hours, let alone weeks, for our health care. That big, bad bug SARS became MARS, a bad cold.
Well put, my friend! Anyone who believes in socialized healthcare is signing a death warrant. Just another way for Obama and his leftist, Socialist cronies to gain additional control of this country's citizens.
They must have a written law somewhere to have this man arrested. On the flip side, we too have lost our freedom because we are prisoners of our congress and all the politicians in Washington. Look in your own backyard first before you cast the first stone.
There are certain laws you just don't push in this region like insult the Thai King or anything to do with drugs in Singapore.
"Mexican Extremest Cell Attempts to Murder Senator"
Don't you mean a Mexican National named, Juan Jose 'the lizard' Esconbedeo
insulted an American Senator asking him about his son's sex and showing him
his nasty brown finger. I think they intended just to restain him rather than seek
deadly force to defend against this deadly cell. Death waits for no man, and it
won't wait for the.
Professor Maltus Sergio Walterman, Professor of Law and Crime, Yale University,
College of Law, Interpol, Current Applications Only.
People don't seem to understand that in Thailand, the King isn't the one who sues or presses charges for lese majeste. This is actually part of their Constitution. The rule was originally meant to prevent the King from becoming a dictator, but these days it's used by politicians to get rid of opponents. The King has the right to issue a pardon, but that's about it. He doesn't have a whole lot of political power and never gets to decide whether someone has committed lese majeste or not--that's left up to the courts.
The King has said many times, over more than a decade, that the old lese majeste law needs to be changed or abolished. No politician has tried to change it, simply because it's impossible to change it without breaking it in the process. Many politicians don't even want to change it, since it's such a powerful weapon to use against their opponents.
In this particular case however, I'd still say that the government shouldn't have imprisoned him. Deportation and banning is sufficient. After all, people are usually allowed to spread hateful lies in a free country without fear of imprisonment (Fox Noise is a prime example).
From what I've heard, he used Thai Passport to enter the country.
That's why he got the prison's term.
He will get pardon from the very King he insulted in about a month.
I
You are a freaking dumb ass!
Looks like the Thai Monarchy never learned, "Sticks and stones shall break my bones ... " LOL!
Freedom of Speach == Freedom from Consequences?
Not all the time. If I was in a crowded theater along side some of your family members, and I yell "fire" knowing full well there isn't one, and one of your family members gets trampled to death in the ensuing stampede to vacate the theater, would you not want me brought up on charges of at least man slaughter? Americans are free here in America. If you go to visit another nation, their laws apply, not ours, so make yourself aware.
The prison sentence is so his family loses face in the country...especially since he live outside the country it is important that he be sentenced to prison; If they do that to a Thai who is offshore what will they do to a local?
can't we get casey anthony to say something nasty about the king? please?
So a Thai descendant born in the USA as Joe Gordon aka Lerpong Wichaikhammat criticized Thailand's Royal Family knowing it was a crime to do so.
Then he jumps on a jet and goes to Thailand to take in the cheap medical services. He must be as dumb as they come. What did he expect was going to happen? Sorry I think he got what he deserved. He was blogging so he had to have known it was illegal.
I really couldn't imagine what the Thailand border guard was thinking when he walked up and handed over his passport to be stamped into the country and it comes up and says "wanted for defamation of the Royal Family"?
At least in Thailand they uphold the laws that are written and don't try to read into them like back in the US as to who they apply to. Hence the insider trading that applies to all citizens of the US and those in Government are exempt kind of like health care etc..
I don't even know where to start with you so i'll just pat you on your head, hand you a cookie, and send you on your way.
W O W thailand has a bunch of homo laws idc if he was born there or not hes been a american for 30 years thats all i need to here. each country is like Vegas what happens there stays there in my opinon. now if he was in thailand and did that okay i could understand, but the fact is we as americans have the right of freedom of speech. now i dont know the whole story as to why he posted this stuff. maybe he just wanted people to now more about someplace 98% of us will never actually care to go to. to each his own right? its not right to take away part of anyones life over a comment they made, or something they in this case refrenced. as an american im outraged. as a person who consistantly hates on my goverment i blame them for not trying hard enough 30 years of his life paying you greedy slobs on wallstreet not good enough to get one of our own back shame on you.
If the Thai king would change his last name to Turd, he would have less questionable insults.