E-mail updates
Follow on Twitter
Subscribe to RSSThousands of anti-voting fraud demonstrators turn out in the streets of Moscow, Russia, to voice their displeasure over recent elections. NBC's Stephanie Gosk reports.
Updated at 10:33 a.m. ET: Demonstrations have ended peacefully at 6:11 p.m. local time, with a few people and police left behind, according to the Moscow Times. “Thus ends a truly remarkable day of action,” the Times wrote on its blog.
Updated at 8:30 a.m. ET: Moscow Times says the anti-voter fraud demonstration in Moscow has thinned but several thousand people seem "determined to stay to the very end." The protest is officially allowed until 9 a.m. ET.
Updated at 8:20 a.m. ET: Moscow police say "about 10" people have bee arrested at the anti-vote fraud demonstration in a central square and will be charged with administrative violations, The Moscow Times reports. A reporter for the paper says there is a sizable contingent of security personnel in riot gear -- estimated at about 1,000 officers and 30 trucks -- just south of the square.
Updated at 7:45 a.m. ET: Organizers of the anti-vote fraud protest in Moscow claim 85,000 people are in the crowd; Russian civic organization estimates there are 50,000 people, Tony Halpin, Moscow correspondent for U.K. newspaper The Times, says in a message on Twitter. "It's definitely more than 35k who said they'd come on Facebook," he writes.
Updated at 6:15 am ET: Police say at least 15,000 people have gathered in Moscow's central Bolotnaya Square to protest about alleged electoral fraud and against Prime Minister Vladimir Putin, The Associated Press reports.
Elsewhere in Russia, crowds of several hundred people to about 1,000 gathered in some 15 cities, according to the AP.
Updated at 5:40 a.m. ET: NBC News correspondent Stephanie Gosk reports that there are already so many protesters in the Moscow square where the officially sanctioned demonstration is taking place that "police are no longer letting them in the square," in a message on her Twitter account.
Published at 4:30 a.m. ET: Russians angered by allegedly fraudulent parliamentary elections protested Saturday in rallies across the country, a widespread wave of anger that tests Prime Minister Vladimir Putin's hold on power.
The centerpiece is to be a massive rally in Moscow, where more than 30,000 people are expected. But demonstrations attracting anywhere from several hundred to 1,000 people took place earlier in cities in Siberia and the Far East.
Demonstrations have been called for more than 70 cities, in what is likely to prove the largest public show of discontent in post-Soviet Russia.
The Russia Today news service sent out a message on Twitterusing the hashtag, Russianwinter, echoing the Arab Spring uprisings in the Middle East.
The protesters are both angered by reports of flagrant vote fraud in the Dec. 4 election and energized by the sense that the elections showed Putin and his United Russia party to be newly vulnerable. The party held an overwhelming two-thirds of the seats in the previous parliament, but its share plunged by about 20 percent in the recent vote.
That result was a significant loss of face for the party that has dominated Russian politics, and protesters say that even its reduced performance was inflated by ballot-box stuffing.
Unscheduled high school test
Russia's Itar-Tass news agency reportedthat Moscow’s deputy mayor, Alexander Gorbenko, said that "the organizers have agreed to hold the rally in Bolotnaya square, which was offered to them by the authorities for safety reasons."
After protests erupted earlier this week, Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin turned his anger on the United States, blaming Hillary Clinton in a war of words.
He added that the rally has permission to run from 2 p.m. to 6 p.m. Moscow time (5 a.m. to 9 a.m. ET). "According to his estimates, 5,000-7,000 demonstrators may take part," Itar-Tass said.
Itar-Tass reported that Moscow city’s education department had ordered an unscheduled Russian language test for high school students at 3 p.m. Moscow time (6 a.m. ET).
"It is impossible to believe that there may be grown-up people in their right mind who would feel upset school students are busy at school during some street demonstrations," the chief of Moscow’s education department, Isaak Kalina, told the news agency.
"Any normal adult will not only refrain from urging them to go there, but will do everything in his powers to keep children in safety," he added.
Meanwhile, in Vladivostok, several hundred protesters rallied along a waterside avenue where some of Russia's Pacific Fleet warships are docked. They shouted "Putin's a louse" and some held a banner caricaturing United Russia's emblem, reading "The rats must go."
Police stayed on the fringes of the demonstration and made no arrests. But the Interfax news agency reported that an unsanctioned flash-mob protest in the Far Eastern city of Khabarovsk was broken up by police, who arrested about half the 60 participants.
Putin wants to talk
President Dmitry Medvedev conceded this week that election law may have been violated and Putin suggested "dialogue with the opposition-minded" — breaking from his usual authoritarian image.
The Kremlin has come under strong international pressure, with U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton calling the vote unfair and urging an investigation into fraud.
The opposition predicts at least 30,000 demonstrators will assemble for the Moscow protest.
If Saturday's protests are a success, the activists then face the challenge of long-term strategy.
Even though U.S. Sen. John McCain recently tweeted to Putin that "the Arab Spring is coming to a neighborhood near you," things in Russia are not that simple.
The popular uprisings that brought down governments in Georgia in 2003, in Ukraine the next year and in Egypt last spring all were significantly boosted by demonstrators being able to establish round-the-clock presences, notably in Cairo's Tahrir Square and the massive tent camp on Kiev's main avenue.
Russian police would hardly tolerate anything similar.
Pressure on social media
In Ukraine and Georgia, police were low-profile, staying on the edges of the protests and keeping their numbers small. That's far different from Russian police's usual crowd-controlling method of flooding any protest zone with hundreds of helmeted police who seem to relish violence.
Opposition figures indicated Friday that the next step would be to call another protest in Moscow for next weekend, with the aim of making it even bigger. But staged events at regular intervals may be less effective than daily spontaneous protests.
The opposition is also vulnerable to attacks on the websites and social media that have nourished the protests. This week, an official of Vkontakte, a Russian version of Facebook, reported pressure from the FSB, the KGB's main successor, to block access to opposition groups, but said his company refused.
On election day, the websites of a main independent radio station and the country's only independent election-monitoring group fell victim to denial-of-service hacker attacks.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
Read more content from msnbc.com and NBC News:
- Some see Twin Towers blast in architect's design
- Giant Eurobank accused of gouging US consumers
- Security goes private as US military leaves Iraq
- Mugabe still thunders at foes, but can he really rule forever?
- Iraq still likely to be prime customer for US arms
- Israelis to debate ban on Muslim call to prayer
Leave a Comment:
I wonder how long Putin will allow these protestors to keep saying sh-it about him before he just sends them all to Siberia for a long vacation or P.P.P (Putin protestor prison).
I know right?....When did Russia become a twin to America.....walk softly russian people, because the Kremlin can come down on you....go big or go back
Tthe same will happend here
If Shakespeare were alive, he'd write about the US. How funny and tragic it is that the WHOLE World is waking up to democracy, while one of the founding cornerstones is turning its back to it. There used to be a time when I would say, "At least I don't live in a country where I can get locked up for nothing and never see the light of day for saying the government sucks.", Until now.
There have only been two times I have been ashamed to be called an American, when we passed the Patriot Act and legalized torture. And now with the passage of The National Defense Authorization Act for 2012. Our freedom is gone, and don't doubt for a moment that if you dissent, you won't be associated with a "Terrorist Group" in one fashion or another. I wonder if those Fema Camps are run like private ones? Work for 1 dollar a DAY, get charged 5 dollars a MINUTE to use a "Payphone"?
.. where is this train is heading, Arab Spring, Wall St. Fall (Autumn), Russian Winter...
How dare the people speak when not spoken to!
If Mr. Putin finds himself unemployed, he can always apply for work here in the U.S.....America hires dictators ...and...American citizenship is no longer required...!!!!!!
Wounder how many K G B officers are in the crowds ??? As we all know in the end a lot of protesters will disappear . The question is how long can the protesters hold out and how wide spread is there movement ???
This bunch of protesters mostly from the comunist party who wants more power in the governmemt.
Diversity is working well in Mother Russia, who would of thought..
This is refelective of a major error by Putin. He has labored very hard indeed to portray himself as a "macho man" sort of Village People President. Appearing shirtless with regularity, hunting tigers, SCUBA diving, fighting forest fires (that he contributed to starting), flying aircraft, in judo contests, and many, many more. This has basically been his attempt to adopt "American style" politics to Russia and go for image over substance, especially while Medveyev was the actual President.
Now he gets to see how fragile image really is, and especially how quickly it can disappear if he tries strong-arm tactiocs to stop the protests.
A Russian uprising would have to be called "Vodka Spring"!
The anti-democracy comments are from the same bunch. It's their country and they deserve a voice. Purge all of the governments of war hawks and chicken hawks and live in peace.
The USSR fell under the weight of the military siphoning all the money, corruption, and robbing people of a voice. Sounds like our government.
During the build up to the election Clinton was publicly admitting that American tax dollars were sent to Russia to try and sway the election the way we want it to go. When that was unsuccessful she cried rigged election to start problems. Cain too. What the heck is going on here and why should our tax dollars go toward rigging elections instead of paying off debts to communist china?
Unlimited democracy creates a ruler ship of the majority over any individual.
The United States was created as a Representative Democracy with the US Constitution specifically created to protect the individual citizens from tyrannies.
Just days ago the US GOP lead Congress passed and sent to the Whitehouse for President Obama’s signature a bill that circumvents The Fourth Amendment’s guarantee to US citizens the right to a fair and speed trial, the right to an attorney, the right to face his accuser.
If President Obama signs this legislation into law, the Congress has given not only our current president, but all presidents elected in the future the legal ability to with only the simple accusation of supporting terrorism, to order any individual US citizen held without attorney, without releasing the specific accusation, without trial, and will keep his accuser clocked in secrecy for as long as the current president desires to do so.
Support of terrorism as being defined as any shape or form, by accident or intention.
One of the only seven dissenting votes, Republican Rand Paul of Kentucky verbally listed just a few of the suspect reasons for being a possible terrorist on this legislation … to be having fingers missing from your hands, owning guns, and gun powder … the full list includes almost every citizen in the United States in one form or another.
It is sickening to see the Cowards in Congress cower under their desk anytime just the word terrorism is spoken, given the number of US Service members bravery to give their very lives as these Cowardly US Congressmen who haven’t even had so much as a paper cut during the entire 10 plus years of both the Afghanistan and Iraq conflicte pass such utterly UN-American Cowardly legislation.
Cowards, Deviants, Inside traders, rewarding failed Bankers with bonuses, repealing banking regulations that created the banking demise, housing bust, millions unemployed, a bankrupt America wiping their very large butts with the US Constitution..
Gutless cowards all save seven.
Freemannogod,
People like you make American look poorly educated, ignorant and above all - dumb. Do us a big favor - stop posting your brainwashed, primitive crap.
appears, Stalin is alive & well...the names changes, but the product is the same currently........
Uhm, I know how difficult it is to avoid blaming republicans for everything, but perhaps you should look at the democrats, in the Senate, who passed the bill.
Mygirl1. You may not know this. But John Mccain helped WRITE IT.
Ias far as elections go, it isnt like the U.S is any diffrent, just ask Bush or ACORN.
Yup, I know ol' McCain had a hand in writing the bill. The man was also really gung-ho on blasting Libya to bits, he's a hawk of the old school. As to Obama, Bush, Clinton (Hillary and Billary) they're all part of the same ol' same ol' as well. Anyone who honestly believes there's a whole lot of difference between the two parties needs a wake-up call.
You sheep need to really take a good hard look at what has happened with Egypt & Libya! The change under mob rule brings anarchy not the utopia you seek. Look at Libya all the infrastructure is ruined people are thirsty hungry, unemployed & now pay the criminal price for fuel. I say better the devil you know than the devil put into power by covert CIA selection.
Think hard & long before you run after the west, there is no Brady bunch or even happy days ask any American it's more like working for Scrooge & what Scrooge doesn't steal from you, your blessed government will appropriate through new taxes.........beware don't be sheep!
Nick, so this explains our government?
I thought I was just taking another on for the team
You really don't know HOW MUCH Russia differs from West. If you had to move to Russia, you immediately would appreciate your country. (sorry for my English)
Cool Nick, I agree that we shouldn't be sheep. So, better to be a good little worker ant in a nest of other little worker ants blindly following the dictates of the head ant? There was one head worker ant, Uncle Joe Stalin, and look at what he did. He drained the citizens of their sustenance, causing millions to starve to death. Lol, hey guy, I'll take the world of sheep anytime running free than the world of the worker ants. Yeah, all lined up and marching to the worker ant paradise.
Nick; When you say you sheep , you need to look in the mirror, and say Baa Baa then go find a Re Pug to brown nose up to like McConnell, OR one of the other classic examples, so you can feel like your being taken care of!!!
Why would you just lay down and follow anything, thinking that If you are a good brown nosier they will trickle something down to you, We sheep like freedom to much for that, and we know where they get all their money!!!
@Nick,
Better the devil you know???? Covert CIA selection????? The eastern tribes in Libya were the greatest suppliers of "foreign fighters" to al-Quaeda in Pakistan and Afghanistan and to a lesser degree in Iraq. If they were controlled by the CIA, then there needs to be some serious house-cleaning at Langley. And as far as the devil you know, the new Prime Minister is a retired University of Alabama electrical engineering professor. Roll Tide!
@ chris-749391
start your own buisness than you idiot. noone stole from you , you agreed to work for the amount you get just like everyone else. if you werent so stupid you would not be blaming others for your failure to succeed in a country where anyone from anywhere can make a wonderful life for themselves. You beggers and complainers like to throw the word elitist around allot but gues what your american that makes you the spoiled elitist. you are the problemn you selfish greedy begger and complainer.
Sorry Chris, but when those Eastern Libyan fighters were doing the sole fighting, they were getting their asses kicked. It has come out that British and French Spec Forces were indeed on the ground, and not just training, etc either. It sure wasn't Libyan smart bombs and drones that were flying overhead. Number one reason Qaddafi was taken out was he was fast developing a Central Bank for all of Africa, so they would be independent of Western finance. For that reason alone, this Arab Spring crap was created. You get a small ass group that is disenfranchised with the current regime, give them a ton of $$$$$$$$$, with a lot of international media attention, and voila, you have yourself the making of a pro Western finance revolution. Every so called revolution we have helped out with these CIA front NGOs has done nothing but put pro Western finance puppets in power that do what the banksters want, even if it hurts the people of their respective countries.
Hey Chris, again, how are you supposed to start your own business when the banks are not lending any money for said type of ventures. How are you even supposed to start a business without any capital at all? You call these people beggars and complainers, but face it many of them are victims of the biggest scam in history and they are pissed. You are going to tell a poor black kid with no real athletic ability,but with decent grades, that he can go to college on a limited scholarship/no scholarship? You think clooege kids paying $200 for one book is cool? How is a poor or even lower middle class person going to start their own business with no capital and the banks are drying up that type of lending? Their are jobs out there like you say Chris, but what if you got your good paying job outsourced, have a wife and 2-3 kids and are forced to work two Wall Mart/McDonalds type jobs and still not making the same.
Bruce, it's always the people of the country that get the shaft, if not from Western puppet leaders then from the "For the people" masters helped into power by the Communists. There hasn't been a true revolution for the people since our Revolution. And, that's debatable because England's arch rival, France, made our revolution victorious with French money, arms, and the French fleet. Well, we paid France back in the War of 1812, keeping English troops tied down and the English fleet looking over it's shoulders for those damn privateers from the "Colonies." And, when we landed in France, WWI, we mouthed the slogan, "LaFayette, we are here." Well, anyway, when people want change they revolt, so, better the revolt is with our support than from the PRC. Or, worse, some war lord.
Robert
I didn't need any money to start my Business. I worked hard and SAVED for the purchase of the USED equipment needed for my Cabinet Shop. I started the shop in 1980. Remember 1980??? Stagflation? Look it up. I was the ONLY Employee for 5 or six years. My business grew and I hired Employees. Now I have a net worth over 1 Million. I didn't need to borrow any money. Yet you think that a person NEEDS to borrow money to start a business. How uninformed you are.
Lol 1 mil that is it...you are almost poor compared to the top 1000 or so. They have a large percentage of you fooled into thinking you have a chance when, they are only letting you "play". They still control you and force you to follow like a bunch of lemmings. Math and history says your system will not lead us to utopia either so wtf?
I say "no @!$%#" mob rule is not the best, but neither is kissing your nasty asses. I will take mob rule over being your bitch, sorry I am a man, and I do the f***ing. I do not get f***ed. Who is going to be crying when people start dying? Wake up and become part of the solution and stop being part of the problem. Bunch of greddy asses, we are tired of chasing after carrots and are not that stupid. Maybe you are, but we are not.
The same crowd tells us to "vote" and look at wtf happens, you live "a win at all costs" style of life and then cry when others do the same. I get tired of telling people that the 1% are addicts and need to be helped one way or another. THEY CANNOT STOP THEMSELVES THEY ARE ADDICTS!
It's not like The U.S is any diffrent. just ask Bush, or ACORN.
sorry Chris-749391
the earlier comment was aimed at Nick Mihaleff-1050520 not you.
Who is the we you are talking about Tired-2176559? If i was to guess your jealous and lazy but i dont have to anymore because you just told everyone your stupid. here is a good question.....if there is some conspiracy of the top one percent than did they specificly choose mike zuckerberg and oprah and bill gates to join their club of ruling the world? your funny man. your the kind of guy that will tear down someones house because you dont know how to build your own rather than learn and work for it like they did. I am not rich i am considered in poverty by my income but i have everything i need and If i wanted to i could pay my taxes and bills for the rest of my life without working for THE MAN ever again. why because im smart enough to do what i want and have what i want without begging goofy presidents like bush and obama(one of which i am sure you voted for) for handouts. I am a man...i make the rules....i decide my success....you are still a spoiled child.
The protest are the work of the ever growing Radical muslims gaining a larger and larger foothold in Russian government.
I assume you know this because you've been closely following events in Russia for the last 20 years, especially helped by your fluency in Russian?
It's tricky, playing "pretend democracy". Lets see how well Putin pulls it off! His party owns the Russian Supreme Court, so there should be a TON of "hanging chads" to discard, right?!?
It looks like people in the world are really getting tired of all the "corruption" I know I am
A very controlled protest movement. Don't do this, don't do that, do it this way, it's happening there.....yep, a dictator dictating all right. A show for the West...meanwhile he rigged the elections. What a phony this Putin.
Kinda like our own "Dear Leader" huh?
All these idiots fighting any attempt to require a proof of a valid right to vote. That's going to really help. all those who think we are as bad as Russia should leave immediately. The OWS whiners want everyone to support them so they should feel right at home,e in a collective.
As soon as "your guy" doesn't win is fraud. No. It's just that your guy sucked.
Heyyyy...this is no setback at all. The US private sector were at her most profitable when they were cranking out weapons for sale the the 'gummerment' during the cold war years.
It's not a crisis....it's an opportunity for your Boeings, Lockheeds, Thiokols, Westinghouses, GE's and all the rest to get back into pumping out nukes and delivery systems - making the country great again.
Fear is the key...they key to insane profits! Happy days are here again.
I wonder how much longer it will take before America looks at a new "revolution" given our current political posture. I can see some parallels with the discontent overseas and the arguments of both the TEA party and the Occupy movement. I wonder how America would react to a million people marching on Washington D.C. to demand change? Likely ignore it...
Thay will gut us like pigs wait you will see our own militry used on us thay allready tride to pass the law! EYES OPEN PEPOLE
All you'll see from Americans is what you see on here...a lot of "keyboard commando" talk, but when it comes down to it, no one will get off their cell phone or stop watching "Dancing With The Stars" long enough to stop the tyranny that takes more and more control of our country every day...
Except they don't have a clue what they want. Yes, they want everything for free.
Keep it peaceful while we can and vote. Join the RON PAUL REVOLUTION
All Americans should see this video. Tragically even those who see it will not believe it.
This is part of the reason our morality is in a cesspool today. Morality is only one part of the master plan which is well under way to their stated goals. All this started a little over 50 years ago, and they have made significant progress. Watch and send on
What video?
The issue is 'a rigged election' and now, let's all watch as Putin tries to spin the issue into 'The USA did it and Hillary spoke code words to start the riots.' The world is watching you Vlad and we all know what you are trying to do. Know this, even if you crush the protests, we shall not forget that you are just the same as the rest of Russia's brutal unelected leaders. Without the people you are nothing therefore freedom is what they deserve.
hell, we've had our own "rigged" elections here, so why are we so outraged abt. a "rigged" election in another country? Hillary Clinton needs to take her manly looking ass somewhere and sit down, she is REALLY on a power trip.
Fred, how come every election where a non Western finance puppet wins is rigged, where ifthe Western candidate wins it was fair and honest. Noteveryone in the world wants to become America. Sure they want freedom, but freedom on their own terms. Every nation in the past 8 years that has had a "revolution" is worse off probably that before since their new masters are Western finance puppets. Ukrainians lost 40-50% of their savings' buy power after the Oranges pegged the hryvnna to the dollar. Libya is totally screwed, and the Geogrian president is not very well liked either.
For those of you who think we do not live in a police state maybe you should check out the Occupy movement and some of their videos! www.occupywallst.org Those in power will not go easily!
Ok your freedom means I can move into your house, cook dinner and never leave because I have the right to occupy private property.
I for one don't think America is a police state. People can freely assemble and speak out against the government, even calling for overthrow of the government. The penalty for doing that? Lol, being rounded up and arrested when told to move on and get out of the way of people going about their every day lives. That's indicative of a police state? I don't think many folks know the meaning of a police state, one where in school children are taught to turn in parents if overhead making disparaging remarks about leaders. I haven't seen ranks of tanks and APC's lined up and ready to roll against the people or barracks full of armed troops ready to march out. But, I have seen police ready to enforce the right of people to go on about their daily lives free of protesters in their way. Americans are free to come and go as they please, work where they want and at what jobs they want. If of course they are qualified. Hell, they can even go on camping trips staying at public campgrounds while they look for work. A police state would never allow that, workers would be allocated out to jobs, and, paid what the government deemed suitable. Lol, "You don't like your job? Tough citizen, get back in line!" Anyway, America is far from being a police state. Man, there are millions in other countries who would love to live in our "Police state."
Love the whiners who complain because they aren't given everything in life for free and with no effort. Trample over private property and take it over at will. THIS you complain about? You are a bunch of losers.
Mellowfello, we may not be a police state yet, but if the President sign's the NDAA bill that was almost unanimously signed by the senate, we could be.
I don't think so PJ, and all the "Police state" rhetoric has been made before, like when the Civil Rights Bill was passed and troops from the 101st Division were sent to Little Rock. People said we were living in a police state when troops went to put-down the L.A. riots. Remember the sedition legislation? Anyone speaking against the President was guilty of sedition. Well, we didn't turn into a police state. Maybe the term needs defining, to many obeying traffic laws is a police state tactic as is paying taxes. We'll be a police state when there's a block Party committee head overseeing the life of every citizen, when there is a universal draft, again. We'll be a police state when we fear the dreaded knock at the door and being taken away to re-education camps. We'll be a police state when a citizen's job skills are crucial to the State, enough so to have the citizen assigned work wherever he is needed. And, forced there if need be. Anyway, there's a lot involved in being a police state and America is far from that. 'Course, there are many who would welcome it, running lap dogs of the Left hoping to move up and be a petty master if not a big master.
What's not to protest about? Russia's gone
viraltoxic.I'd like to say hi to all my Russian friends if they're watching.
? friends watching ? this isn't "the price is right ?
Human Rights: Food. Clothing, Shelter, Education, Work, and Healthcare. Why do we need to go to jail in this country for them? Let's change our constitution to include these rights!
As long as there is a monetary system, socialism is doomed to fail. What happened to "Christian charity"?
So you want everything for free without earning it. Let me know how that works out for you. Throw in cable tv and internet and a nice car while you're at it.
What will you do to deserve it besides suck up my valuable air?
arab spring russian winter i want to hear about obamas demise
Must be democrats
In Soviet Russia, Prime minister assassinates you.
If around forty million people would ban together, and donate one hundred dollars per month to be invested in things that would help the middle class and poor, they could build an empire that would become a force for good, say if they invested in shopping centers, or some manufacturing, apartments, hotels banks, and other things, property, homes, and started to generate profits, to be invested again, they could write their own rules, and give good jobs to people and form a membership list, and vote, for things that they feel were right, news letters, membership benefits, at some point they could buy or start a bank , something like a credit union, members could direct their buying to business that were run by the group, all within the laws, people can shop where they chose, create a symbol, write the rules, with clear objectives, start the news letter, start taking members, and don't protest anything just simple change things!!!
Tens of thousands of poor middle class people could be helped relatively fast, these who are helped could pledge to continue to help others, if it grows, it would eventually make a difference in the for gotten middle class workers life, eventually they could even start a clinic, to be run as an example for how a hospital should be run, without so much greed!!!
The only problem with that idea is the government would get involved and steal most of it.
ATFMAN: Not if the group were set up right! We are the government, I'm not saying go against anyone, but do things the way we the government want it done, the laws could protect the way business was done, think about how many churches there are who all ready have the expertise needed to get it going, and many of them would help set it up, and would probable donate to it, if things would have to be done decently and in order, not by any one person, but through a committee, they could raise billions of dollars over night, and start making strides almost immediately, the Republicans should love it if people were helping people, it would take some of the cost away from the government, who knows, if say 500 million people would become involved and support it they could help people all over the world! one never knows if one never tries!!!
I applaud your idea Dale, but when the gov. finds out there is large sums of money being used without their involvement, they'll find a way to step on it...remember the old saying, "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you..."
Dale, forty million? A lot more than forty million is invested through pension plans, plans for working people. That money is invested to do what you suggest. And, as things go around and bad times come the money is lost because investments don't prove out. But, the money left in our pockets after pension plans, non-voluntary, is deducted is for us to use with discretion. Lol, some do and some don't.
we really hsve NO right to judge how other countries are run...or not run, or if they are corrupt.
we should look at our own mess...and mind our own business!
We live in a small world Stevo, and what another country does because of how it's run could affect us big time. If we had paid attention to what Germany was planning prior to WWII and interfered, the world would have been saved a lot of grief. Another example of interfering was our opposition to the Soviet goal of over-running Western Europe. We interfered when we stood tank to tank, gun barrel to gun barrel in East Berlin, and, initiated the Berlin Airlift. We made the mistake once of keeping our heads in the sand and wound up fighting WWII.
Irony of Ironies. Putin gives Clinton credit for something positive to come out of Russia.
WTF?
Hilary Clinton needs to be brought up on war crimes charges. She is a power-hungry nut looking to be in a damn history book. It's women like this that shine a dim, disgraceful light on the very essence of what a woman is supposed to be as created by God. She disgusts me!!!!!
"essence of what a woman is supposed to be as created by god"? What god are you talking about?
Right Tomorrow, Adam was so happy in the garden. Until, God put Eve before him and he discovered a use for his genitals, lol. Then, the fun began and he, Man, became a captive of woman. Hey, there's a term for that but if used might result in a collapse, lol.
If the Ruling Party in Russia can change their Constitution at any time they want ( Just like Hitler did), Then the Russian people need to make sure it is Carved in Stone and only Ammendments be Introduced, just like any other Democratic Country. Remember that Democracy is not perfect, but it is a whole lot better than the alternative. Which is He who has the most Guns Wins.
Isn't that the U.S.'s motto?????
As he was leaving the convention on Monday Sept. 17th of 1787, A lady cried out. "Mr. Franklin. What have you wrought?" (in other words what type of government have you given the people)
Mr. Franklin replied simply.. "A Republic... If You Can Keep It."
Cool, but how are the people going to do that? How are they going to get past the guns that determine the government's security?
The Protesters are pointing out many problems, and millions of people or billions of people are feeling some of the things they are protesting!
It is time to start doing, more and protesting less, form a group, and get people to become members, if even one billion people would join, and pay one hundred dollars for membership, they could raise, a hundred billion dollars overnight, it would soon grow to become a trillion, this kind of money invested in the right places is much more effective than protesting, we the people of the world dont need to protest we need to invest, then most of what we protest will fall into place without the protesting, we might all be sheep, so to speak, if we dont help ourselvesinstead of whining and crying for someone who will never do it to do it!!!
its our choice, stop whining about it and do it!!!
All these protest were funded by the west behind the scenes. West was quite clever to brain wash their citizens in believing that they have some form of democracy. It's only and illusion of democracy and when it shows up it is a MOB rule. Russia is so massive and diverse that only force and sometimes extreme force can keep it in check. This also goes for China. West is so naive to believe anything otherwise. Actually it would not be a bad idea to unleash POGROMS here in the west to clean up corruption and decadence . Half of the protesters in Red Square are gay and lesbian pedophiles and are mad because the Orthodox church won't let them march around Red Square. Real Russians are working and quite happy with Putin. Hopefully they elevate him to Ceaser , so he can rule unabated. High oil prices are the best thing that happened to Russia. They have so much cash now the west is already in a begging mode to be saved.
Xristos Voskrese! Voistiny Voskrese!
wait a minute, are you putin using a psudo name? I just returned from russia and appearently we know different people because i think they are happier with the puppet pres now than they were with putin. and sometimes force is necesary but usually only in defense of justice, not maintaining your power. real russians are quite happy being left alone . they are not happy to be governed by ceaser.
Just hilarious -- on an aMessNBC television supposed-news show, they trot out Al Sharpton to complain that voter registration suppresses the vote in a "progressive" way. Immediately after, the report of Russian voter fraud is aired with the mandatory implied shock of how disgusting their "system" of government is...
Do they really believe that viewers are convinced that there's a difference between socialist fraud in Russia and progressive fraud in the U.S? I can only imagine that Alexandra Witt's production staff are much more witless than she is. Or, put this way, maybe "progressives" are really that reality-isolated.
Sharpton wants the ability to vote on the number of kids you are collecting on. I see not problem being able to prove who you are and having the legal right to vote.
This could just as well be the United States ! i mean with all the current movements to disenfranchise voters of so the country, under the cover of voter ID ! which is completely against the constitution and the 14 amendment of the same ! but somehow the republicans and tea-party only worry about the constitution when it serve their cause ! and not if it is legal or not !
@ schooldog...Ron Paul is the CHAMPION of our Constitution with a 40 year record to prove it! Never swayed. Every question or vote he cast, the 1st thing that comes into his mind is. "Is this Constitutional ?" I know that this is what our founding fathers wanted. It was supposed to be easy. We the people are supposed to watch leaders and only vote in leaders with this principle. We have truly lost our way though. I am voting for the man who will not barter nor bargain for the Presidency. The President of the PEOPLE... Ron Paul 2012
So "schooldog" -- it's unconstitutional to verify the birth or naturalization legality of a voter? You are truly demented in your thought process... there is no equal protection for illegally casting a vote.
I use to think there was no hope for the russian people as long as these "old guard" politicians held on to power and continue to corrupt the USSR...!! I now see they are pretty much the same as us along with some of the same problems. May they bring back Russia from the brink and help change the world for the better, and also help in the fight to rid us of our common "enemies".... the russian people deserve more than what they have gotten.. !!!!