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Damir Sagolj / Reuters, file
A North Korean child suffering from malnutrition rests in a bed in a hospital in Haeju, September 30, 2011
Months before the death of North Korean dictator Kim Jong Il, an array of UN food experts and nonprofit groups urged immediate food aid for the isolated north Asian nation. Three groups that investigated conditions in the country described the urgent need for food, reporting “acute malnutrition” among North Korean children, “widespread consumption of grass” and elderly people on “knife edge.”
Despite these dire assessments, and warnings that conditions are worsening, the Obama administration has balked on a decision over food aid for the isolated Asian nation. This week, just as promising talks were under way in Beijing between U.S. and North Korean envoys, the news broke that Kim had died. That change put the question of aid on the back burner again.
“We need to see where (the North Koreans) are and where they go as they move through their transition period,” said State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland addressing questions about food aid on Tuesday. “We will obviously need to reengage at the right moment, but… we haven’t made any internal decisions here.”
The World Food Programme says millions of children in North Korea are facing starvation and that up to six million people are in need of urgent aid. They've released a shocking and rare footage of emaciated children in hospitals and orphanages, barely clinging to life. John Sparks of Europe's Channel 4 reports.
Some provisions of a food aid deal that was purportedly being discussed in Beijing surfaced in South Korean press reports. The United States would provide 240,000 tons of high-protein biscuits and vitamins — 20,000 tons a month for a year, the reports said – targeting North Korea’s most vulnerable people — pregnant and lactating women, children, and hospital patients. Nuland would not confirm these reports.
The terms that were under discussion, she said, were related to monitoring to ensure the food reached its intended recipients, and “the kinds of food aid that we would consider if the conditions were right and if the right decisions were made.”
Eating bark, grass
Meanwhile, there is substantial evidence of a growing food crisis for millions who live in the countryside, beyond the relative comfort of Pyongyang, researchers and humanitarian groups say.
“What we saw… was extensive chronic malnutrition and cases of acute malnutrition, which is where the person is basically dying,” said David Austin, director of the North Korea program for Mercy Corps., one of five nonprofits dispatched to investigate the situation in February.
“More than 50 percent of people who are reliant on (state-provided grain) were out seeking out alternative food—things like bark, wild grass, and leaves—and mixing it in with food. We found there was no protein or fat in people’s diets.”
The mission was undertaken at the request of the federal government’s humanitarian aid agency, USAID after North Korea called for international food aid in January. Their report and a strong recommendation to proceed with the food aid went to USAID in April.
When Austin returned to North Korea in September, he says he learned that government grain rations had been cut by more than half to about 150 grams per day.
“That’s basically (the equivalent of) one potato,” he said.
In addition to the report by the U.S. group of nonprofits, two other groups—one made up of UN agencies and a group representing five European nonprofits—came to the same conclusions.
Marcus Noland, senior fellow and Asia expert at Peterson Institute for International Economics, said data support the eye witness reports.
“The price (of grain) is rising rapidly. That’s bad news,” said Noland. “Normally after the fall harvest, there’s plenty of food, so the price goes down, and then it starts spiking in the late spring -- the so-called ‘lean season.’ This year the prices have basically continued rising right through the harvest… because there isn’t enough food in the country.”
The price is also rising on corn, and coal, which used by many North Koreans to heat their homes, he said.
Since last spring, humanitarian groups have been pressing the U.S. government to step in, as it has before, as a major contributor to North Korean aid needs. The last U.S. food handouts ended in March 2009, when North Korea expelled U.S. aid groups that were monitoring the distribution. Shortly afterwards, the North conducted long-range rocket and nuclear tests that prompted tough international sanctions.
Even though Pyongyong politics are opaque and in flux, not everyone agrees with U.S. “wait and see” posture on food.
“As far as we understand, the North Koreans have not withdrawn their request for food aid,” said Austin. “But the U.S. government has continued to delay its decision. We think there is a humanitarian need that must be answered. Children are dying.”
And some observers argue that the transition may present an opportunity to test the waters with Pyongyang’s newly named leader, 27-year-old Kim Jong Un.
“The fiscal price tag for 240,000 tons is not that big, so it seems to me as a conciliatory gesture at the beginning of this new leadership, you have more to gain than lose,” said Noland of the Peterson Institute. “This guy could turn out to be even crazier or more brutal than his father or grandfather…. But it strikes me that given the circumstances the downside risk of moving forward is very low, compared to the ill will from backtracking.”
What officials are not making explicit is how the food aid is linked to concessions from Pyongyang, such as promise to halt its uranium enrichment program or to resume six-party nuclear disarmament talks, which ground to a halt three years ago.
Food for nukes?
From the point of view of humanitarian groups, aid should completely independent of politics.
“We don’t want to see the humanitarian principals linked to things such as giving up nuclear weapons,” said Austin of Mercy Corps. “It undermines the moral authority of both.”
The State Department maintains that U.S. humanitarian assistance should not be politicized, but merely compliment U.S. foreign policy.
So, coincidentally – or not -- when U.S. humanitarian envoys were discussing food aid with the North Koreans in Beijing over the weekend, the U.S. nuclear nonproliferation envoy was also holding talks in the Chinese capital. According to the AP report, sources close to negotiations said the food aid talks with North Korean officials in Beijing “yielded a breakthrough on uranium enrichment.”
Food aid that is dependent on nuclear concessions is not fated to go far in Pyongyang during a leadership transition. North Korea watchers say that the anointed leader, who lacks the stature of his father or grandfather, is likely under immense pressure to prove his bravado to the military establishment, not compromise on defense issues.
The Obama administration has its own politics considerations. Without securing progress on nuclear disarmament, providing aid to North Korea may become bludgeon for Republicans to use against him in an election year.
“If you were the Obama administration and looking at this situation with the North Koreans," Noland said, "are you going to expend any political capital on these guys? You’ve got other issues... Do you want to take on dealing with North Korea in Congress? The answer is no.”
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
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Leave a Comment:
It is not an American problem.
Yup let them eat grass. Kim Jung Un looks like a pig with two legs. He will starve his people just like his evil father. And they crowds all cry on command "Ok the cameras are rolling now CRY". Yeah these people really miss "dear leader". Evil leader of starvation. No better than Mao. There is a reserved room in hell for people like this.
AD'M
I agree !!!!!
Let the one or two friends they have left in the world feed them . We here at home have far and away to many people living on the edge now. Some day if and when North Korea gets it's act together maybe we will think about helping them out . But for now let China or some other nation do it.
bob
Sad, but I agree that is not an American problem. It is a humanitarian disaster though. Maybe the N. Korean government views this as population control. However you think about it, it is sick, and the leaders of N.Korea all deserve to die and then burn in hell for what they have done to their own people!
I seriously doubt that much of the food/aid sent to the "people" of North Korea ever gets to the people. Just like most of the other aid we send, it is intercepted by those in power and then used to reward their friends and taunt their enemies. The problem is that their political system starves the people by pouring all the country's resources into the army and squashing dissent. There is a direct correlation between the freedom of a country and the well being of their masses, something we should heed well in this country. As we become ever more under the thumb of the bloated Federal government, we see our own prosperity as a nation waning.
While it's not pleasant to watch any starve, 'lil Kim spent every dime on his military complex, knowing that others in the world (US included) wouldn't stand by and watch his people starve. It worked, and 'lil bastard will do the same. The only way for any chance of change is to cut aid; people aren't stupid, and they'll figure out why they're dying, only fools will place blame on other nations that didn't 'help' as that's NOT the reason or problem.
'I spent every penny my people's nation had, and for that, you're going to make THEM suffer and starve?' Same every year. No matter how tough to some, accountability has to start some time; let it be now. Maybe they'll see just how good their buddies next door really are.... don't they seem to have a few bucks from Someone's country selling out their economy to them?
China and Russia can feed them as they have been backing up Great Crazy evil leader. the US have been toooooooo generous and bowing too much to North Korea bluffing. Malnourishment in N Korea is man made, it is Great Evil doing to make the population/masses suffer, starve and the armed forces follow. Well fed people will create problem for his family , staving people will look for food to eat and not create chaos in Great Evil kingdom If the US start delivering food it will definitly go to N Korean armed forces not to its starving people. Why feeding the enemy they are ungrateful anyway and will continue blackmailing to get free food from US taxpayer so let CHina and Russia feed them is their cohort. The US need to look what had happen in the past when dealing with bellycose N Korea, never kept it's promises or pledges.
With their history, what is to say that the people are going to get the food? They believe in Reagan's trickle down theory, we have seen how that has helped the US now haven't we?
There is one particular North Korean that obviously does not have that problem.
Agreed, it's about time we do a hand-off. If China/Russia want to undermine the US economy and US influence, let them deal with the bullsh!t that the US has been dealing with for half a century while we sit back and recover.
While we're at it, let our allies fight their own wars.... they criticize the US for our military spending, when the only reason they don't have to spend much of anything on their military is because the US is basically their proxy military. F'kn hypocrisy.
If the North Korean people want to change their lives their going to have to grow a pair and storm the wire, In other words violently overthrow their repressive government and don't be kind about it. They should string these fat cat commies up by their heels and take their country back. Whenever the UN or the United States sends aid to this country all it does is strengthen North Korea's repressive regime. If all aid were to come to a halt the whole damn country would fall apart overnight. I know this sounds cruel and it is but the fact is until the world starts saying NO, things in this communist hell hole will never change.
We have people in our own country, who doesn't have enough to eat. Take care of them first. North Korea has played this card a few too many times.
Uh ... which wars are we fighting for our allies? We dragged our allies into OUR wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and US conservatives were anxious to get involved in Libya (that is,until we actually did get involved). There's a reason that we have defense treaties and provide defense "umbrellas." And that is because they result in more stable regions, indeed, a more stable world. As the world's largest economy that depends on selling our products around the world and buying raw materials globally, we benefit the most from a stable, predictable environment. It is also a good investment. Imagine what it could have saved America in lives and money if stationing a few hundred thousand troops in Europe could have prevented the European portion of WWII.
I agree with Big Al here, hate to admit it lol. One might consider me being 9 times out of 10 a lefty social liberal..... but not in this case, or in most foreign policy for that matter.
The US is being hoodwinked, and the only reason the NK's have been a thorn in our side for decades is because we prop them up!
I understand that we are seeking stability in the region and to maintain our foothold in SK, and so far feeding this nutcase country has been partially successful.... Maybe we see the cost of supporting NK as worth the potential cost of a war with NK on the side of the South.
It appears we have ourselves in a tight spot, and war would definitely not be in anyone's interest. We have China and Russia sitting back chuckling, watching US struggle in the muck, because we put ourselves there in our bid to isolate Communism in the Korean War. The Chinese have notoriously long memories.... They know we committed ourselves to a money sink so long as NK is led by nutcases, and are more than happy to let us throw our money at the problem.
So what would be the non-war long-term solution? I'd say let them collapse, which will either force China to take up humanitarian aid - or will force a regime change. With that window of opportunity, it might be possible to gain further influence in the North - maybe even democratic unification.
China definitely would not like it, but they cannot afford any overt hostilities right now - they are too political tied and too dependent on US consumers. Their military may be large, but their equipment and technology is nowhere near what the US has at the moment. If the US waits too long though, and China continues on this path of growth - that advantage will only continue to shrink. I say call their bluff.
You might say we are tied to China - but if trade was cut off .... we HAVE the infrastructure (it's just shut down) we HAVE the factories (they are just shut down) and we definitely have the workers... they are just unemployed.

Libya - and the only reason they haven't had to fight more is because everyone knows that it's actually the US military that they are challenging, not our ally's military.
I guess America will borrow more money so that they can give it to North Korea.
We have a Republican House and a forced 60 votes in the Senate so I don't think we will be helping these hungry, desperate people - the Repubs do not believe in helping the downtrodden, especially their fellow countrymen that are unemployed and living on the street. Send these people the Republican message to suck it up, get off their butts and get jobs!
I agree somewhat, I understand the reasoning - but the game has changed. This is just the very beginning of what will be a shift in the global dynamic. Since WWII our global strategy has been relatively successful, but things have change... something isn't working. If US enforced stability is such a great thing, why are we no longer reaping the majority of the rewards?
I am being a bit too adversarial, I'm just tired of the hypocrisy of those who complain about the size of the US military when they are directly benefitting from it. I hear things like "well, if you didn't spend so much on your military, you wouldn't be in an economic crisis".... and I want to spit back "if we didn't spend so much on our military, you'd be in the middle of a war right now."
China's problem. The money China is raking in exporting junk to Walmart, alone, can easily fund a few thousand train-loads of grain to THEIR PALS.
This ain't Britain, France, Germany, etc. we're talking here. This is what happens when you tell the world to "F = = = Off!"
While I hate sending any money overseas, all of you comparing our people who need food with the people of NK or are EATING GRASS and TREE BARK and DYING need to come to terms with reality. A family sustaining themselves on food stamps/ebt, WIC, soup kitchens, churches, and other food sources is NOT in the same predicament as people literally dying of malnutrition. I agree we need to help our own, but for pete's sake you can't compare the two situations!!
Rewriting history are you. It was your savior Obuma, along with his ilk in Congress, that got us involved in Libya.
Libya was politics as usual soon as the Right figured out what Obama was going to decide on. Before Obama clearly stated that the US was to be involved - the right-wing pundits did nothing but criticize his inaction in Libya (likely because they assumed he wasn't going to do anything). Soon as Obama said "ok, let's go to Libya' the right-wing pundits began criticizing him for going to Libya.
It was painfully transparant politics.
Although, whether or not it was the R's or D's that supported Libya is completely irrelevant to the point I made anyway, so I'm not sure why Barry even brought it up.
7 billion people on earth, about 3 billion in jeapardy of starving or actually starving now. Approx 120 million Americans in the private sector workforce trying to take care of 320 million Americans, about 200 million Africans, while flooding our jobs and cash to China's 1.2 billion people, while maintaining huge military cash outflows to Europe, Japan, Isreal and Korea, while buying their products, while fighting our own food price problem caused by turning corn to motor fuel, while paying 25% of the cost of operating the UN while paying for the majority cost of operating NATO, while offering the Mexicans our jobs and technology through NAFTA. Now some guy takes a picture of a starving kid in yet another pissant country and out trot the apologists and humanitarians telling us we need to forget that N Koreans want to kill you and you children and we should just shutup, work harder and longer and send them food. You know what ? - tell it to the Chinese and Europeans. It's about time they show some of their humanity.
Dmac ... it is you who is being selective in your history. As Shuklack pointed out, it was the Republicans who criticized Obama's lengthy delay on making a decision to get involved. It was only AFTER he made that decision that the Republicans decided it was a bad idea, probably because it was going to result in a victory without a significant cost in lives or money.
Who is to say that we're not? We're still the world's largest economy. And, despite the rise of a more united Europe and China, very little of significance get done in the way of global politics without our approval. We still control the course of world events in the way that no other nation does.
We are no longer "Fortress America". That's an outdated idea of the 1930's. What happens in the world affects us all, and we're better off being proactive and shaping the world to our liking, even if it takes decades. The Chinese understand that. They look to the long-term. If we don't get results in a year to 18 months, our people conclude that a policy has failed.
Quick we must send them food, I hear their military is running low on food supplies.. Anyone who thinks everything we send wont wind up in the stomachs of NK soldiers is a fool.. Good going there Obama, one of the few times I can agree with you..
While I feel badly for the people there, ultimately it is their own responsibility to take care of themselves, and that includes throwing off the oppressive yolk of their authoritarian collectivist slaver masters. Communism, Socialism, fascist fiscal Progressivism... all of it ultimately leads to economic stagnation and decay while true individual liberty offers a proven path out of the misery and nightmare. But since we're dealing without own tyrants trying to curb out liberties and destroy our freedoms in the Democratic party today (Democrats = civil liberties but economic tyrrany and terror, while Republicans = economic liberty but curtail civil liberties), we have more pressing issues at home to deal with at the moment.
I'm no President Obama fan, but I agree with him on this one. North Korea has a history of sabre waving to get aid. It worked really well with the Clinton administration- where we decided that we'd send Jimmy Carter over to "negotiate" with them. That lead to us giving them hundreds of millions of dollars in aid, food, oil and even a nuclear reactor..... and Jimmy Carter came back with a "declaration of peace" from them (that they'd stop developing nuclear weapons). Guess what, they finished up on their nuclear weapons development program using our aid money and starved an estimated million plus at the same time. So we were out a huge amount of money and aid, and a nuclear reactor and nuclear materials, but we got a Chamberlain declaration of peace. YAY!
So, at least President Obama realizes that the aid for peace program doesn't work with them. North Korea supplies tactical weapons and nuclear secrets to rogue nations and terrorists. Unless they implode and restart it's a very bad investment to help them. All it will lead to is more being spent on their elite communist infrustructure (cronieism- sound somewhat familiar) and the rest get nothing.
I think its a razor wire situation, I don't want to just throw food at them (better than money) because they are nowhere near our allies and it might push their people to revolt. However, if we keep treating each new leader like the old leader all we are doing is ensure they treat US like the old leader did. Its kind of a catch-22.
Reaching out an olive branch might be good, or it might be a waste of time. I think we should (and its still a tough decision I'm not 100% on) hold off on giving away a lot of food (maybe a little bit initially while we figure out everything and to show we want to work with them) until everything is sorted out. They see us as an enemy, and I doubt they trust us as more than we trust them, so approaching as a possible ally has to get past a lifetime of being taught how evil we are (food and good deeds help). We don't want to get taken advantage of though, and we are stretched thin as is. It is a tough decision, we can only hope the change in leadership opens NK up, so this big silly pissing contest is over (that results in their people starving to death).
Its hard not to make humanitarianism political, as politics got them to the point that they need the food and if they'll abuse our generosity.
JPM77-That is the most ignorant and confused garbage I've seen posted here. Please take your Ayn Rand crap to some Teaparty rallies where they might actually believe some of that junk political philosophy. "Fascist fiscal Progressivism"?? Are you just making this @!$%# up as you go along? Or maybe you're just parroting the drug addled Limbaugh or the morons on Fux.
They should eat grass and give milk. If they can't, they should be replaced with cows...
Right on... F#$% the children... At least they won't have an obesity problem...
Jesus once said... "Take care of your own first and screw all the rest."
Goddammit... For the first time I understood the meaning of "Ignorance is bliss".
Double post.
Replace "North Koreans" with "Americans", and Obama is doing the same to us. The cost of Grain is up, (bought bread and cereal lately?), by spring the cost of Corn and Coal for heating will be up, (Seen Food Prices, and the cuts in heating assistance Obama Made?) Obama has been practicing on North Korea, and is now, along with Wall Street, doing the same thing to Us.
I agree with President Obama (boy that was hard to type).
Radical said "cuts in heating assistance Obama Made" . If you need heating assistance then disconnect from the Internet, its not a necessity. I don't need or want to pay your bills.
Of course it should be, and in a perfect world it would be.
However, we are talking about "the crazies" again who are running that country and they are using their money and resources to build arsenals and nuclear weapons instead of taking care of their people.
At what point do we say "enough is enough"? When do we stop trying to save the world from itself or change the world to what we want it to be..... and start taking care of our own problems here of which there are plenty!
I agree that it's a China and Russia problem. If they had not financed their war effort there would not have been a separate North and South Korea.
On the other side, just look at how they are now and picture how this country will be if the Republicans have their way and cut everything so the wealthy can get wealthier.
Wickedly BIASED article? Really, send the 'journalist' back to school.
@Radical
Wait, are you complaining that Obama has cut back on a few social programs, while at the same time Republicans continue to spout off about him turning us into a socialist (read: communist) country?
You people need to pick one: Either he is an evil socialist, or he is trying to destroy all federal social programs. You can't have it both ways.
Agree, not an American problem. It's harsh, but that country needs to be dealt with, and I don't mean it needs more food for its military, which is exactly where the aid goes.
This is a much more complex problem than the posters on here seem to realize.
1) Regardless of overinflated claims about the ability of the US to take them on, the North Korean Army is the 5th largest in the world. They are well supplied and well armed despite their apparent lack of new technology. The entire country is highly fortified with many more deep rock bunkers than we even have bunker buster bombs.
2) These people are neither crazy nor stupid. The North Koreans have been carefully playing a very high stakes game of brinkmanship for over 50 years. And very successfully at that. They know exactly what they are doing and every provocation and retreat from an agreement has its purpose.
3) Malnutrition is rapidly becoming a major issue for both North and South. The South watched West Germany struggle to assimilate East Germany with its out-of-date industry, poorly trained workforce and incredible polution. Beside North Korea East Germany was a shining example of modern perfection. Every day more and more young professional South Koreans are turning against any eventual reunification except one that retains the partition and slowly, over many decades, tries to raise the North's standard of living before reunification. A major reason for this is the widespread malnutrition. While the elite prosper and the military barely gets by, the rest of the population is so much hit by malnutrition that the average North Korean IQ has dropped by more than 15 points. To make it more clear --- this is a country where 70% of the people would qualify for Special Education classes in the US because of low mental acuity.
4) The DMZ is the most heavily fortified region in the world. Thousands of peek-and-shoot heavy mortars, rockets, and artillery are deep in caves and pre-sighted in on the Seoul-Inchon Corridor and ROK and US forces and advanced bases and supply depots along the DMZ for as much as 50 miles deep into South Korea. On initiation of any general hostilities (remember they are still in a state of declared war) that area would become a hell on earth. 28,000 US troops and 150,000 ROK troops would become combat ineffective because of casulties. The capital of South Korea, along with its financial center, major port, and most of its industrial capacity would be gone.
5) In the case of such a massive outbreak of hostilities in the Korean Peninsula, it is less than a 50/50 chance that Japan would participate or allow its territory or US bases there to be used to attack North Korea. The Koreans (both North and South) hate the Japanese and the Chinese are not far behind them desp[ite China being Japan's largest trading partner. Japan would be very wary of getting involved.
6) China is in much the same position with North Korea that we are with Israel. Both Israel and North Korea are essentially rogue states who frequently try to drag their sponsors into open conflicts not of the sponsors' making. China would be loath to entertain a war on its border because of the economic collapse that would result. The Chinese government depends on a pretty consistent growth in the economy in order to stay in power. Consistent growth depends absolutely on a calm political environment.
7) The US, China, Russia, and South Korea only have one card to play against North Korea's stacked deck --- food aid. The North Koreans well know the havoc that malnutrition is causing in their own country. The problem is three fold --- a) all the countries want to get something in return for the aid, b) the aid can only be in a form that cannot be raked off and sold by the elite and military --- basically "dog biscuits" and vitamin pills, and c) once the aid is committed, that card loses its value, at least for a year or so.
At this point Obama/Clinton are wise to step back from the Six-Party (really Five-Party) Talks and not make any concrete offers of aid until the dust settles from the transition --- something that could take as much as five years. They need to keep the North Koreans engaged so that the carrot is there, but just not offer the carrot quite yet unless dramatic concessions are unilaterally made by the North Koreans (not very likely.)
The US, Japan and South Korea also need to be prepared for a series of provocative military actions from naval and land engagements to missile launches over Japan. These incidents are how the North Korean civilian and military elite make sure that the army is still loyal and not any hint of hesitation or deviation is shown.
The bottom line is that it is a very high stakes game of brinkmanship. One miscalculation by any player and the whole Peninsula could easily erupt into a shooting war that would kick off with 20,000+ American casualties. Everyone involved needs to be stepping back, taking lots of deep breaths, and calmly considering their options.
Chris, while I disagree with you sometimes, I always appreciate your in depth explanations of your point of view and where it comes from.
To add, let's not forget the lesson that Somalia, still recent by the way in terms of history, taught us. Its actually a lesson taught long before, and will be long after. The lesson is that food is power. When you walk into a country with the intent of feeding and helping the malnourished, you at least must consider that your very act of humanity is threatening someone else's hold on power. Understanding that goes miles into committing in something other than a naive sort of way. I'm not even saying we should, or shouldn't assist NK with food. I am simply saying that the NK tyranny uses the food to control. They give it to those who are their allies, and starve their internal enemies or those who can't help them maintain power.
Agreed. China's problem, not ours. they're not our friend so f@&k them.
Sad thing is, the population of NK will probably NEVER rise up against it's government. The combination of fear and brainwashing have pretty much created a permanent chattel class. It's like nothing seen anywhere else in the world, even China is simply too large and populous for that level of thought control.
They'll get pissed because they're starving, to be sure, but it doesn't translate to "we need a new government". They probably can't even form that thought at this point.
And that, Mr. Noland, is why you're a think-tank economist, versus a professional negotiator. Give-to-get is the name of the game. It's a tough old world, and the North Korean regime needs to learn there's no such thing as a free lunch . . . literally.
Looks like we all agree on one thing... that China and/or Russia could and should address North Korean hunger crisis, NOT us. Now if there's a deal to be made to make one of us some money somewhere, that's a whole new story. It shouldn't be, but it will be. Money first... and a whole long list of "seconds" that are WAY behind money.
North Korea hates us. They have made that perfectly clear. If we sent them food it would never go to the people it was intended for. Let them get food from their allies.
Leave them alone. If we feed the people we feed the politics there as well. What we do by offering aid and what their government tells the people always have been and always will continue to be two different things. Once enough people watch their children and family members starve to death and die. Once they themselves realize they have nothing left to lose. Then and only then will the public overthrow their government. Terrible as it is to say. It is not up to us to help prop up their failed government in the name of humanity, just as it is not up to us to fight their battles for them.
Definitely not a US problem. The people of North Korea will never revolt. They don't have the ability to do so. Hand sickles and farm tools against tanks, AK47s and poison gas won't work If a revolt comes it will have to be lead by the military. But they have rank, privilege and food. The Kims and the Chinese government have many allies and pawns in the military power positions. So unless it comes from lesser officers it won't happen. Just like when the German military tried to kill Hitler and stage a coup. The Kims have a system of spies watching every move of everyone second to none. The North Korean government stays in power because China and to a lesser degree Russia want it to. Without North Korea hundreds of thousands of Chinese could and would just walk out of the country. The Chinese government knows it. How else can China not wanting the 13 largest economy right on their border bringing development and cash with it be explained? They sure don't want US Army right on the Yalu River. Could China be using North Korea as a pawn to get Taiwan? While sitting back and letting the people starve is not pleasant it may be the best coarse for us. Food aid should be only given after the weapons pointed at Seoul are removed, a partial reduction of the number of troops in their military, destruction of all nukes, destruction of their reactors, and a final peace treaty is signed. If they do all that we pull all 28k of our troops out.
And that, Mr. Noland, is why you're a think-tank economist, versus a professional negotiator. Give-to-get is the name of the game. It's a tough old world, and the North Korean regime needs to learn there's no such thing as a free lunch . . . literally.
---------------
Completely agree with you...we tried that crap in 1994 and how successful was that. We were days away from invading NK (trust me, I know, I was involved in the preparation). For once, liberals and conservatives on this blog mostly agree on something! How scary is that??????
@Derek,
I don't expect everyone to agree with me. I learn the most from those I do not agree with.
I would make one point --- the ONLY food aid being currently considered by the US is high protein bars (usually called dog biscuits by relief workers because of their appearance and taste) and pre-natal vitamins (regular vitamins with additional calcium and folic acid.) Neither of these has very much potential for being ripped off and sold by the elite or military. That's why they were developed in the first place. They are unpalatable, but potentially life-saving. The other aid that is possibly (no one has yet admitted that they are thinking about it) is corn. Both ConAgra and ADM are lobbying heavily for the US to supply massive amounts of corn to the North Koreans. Because of the current record high corn prices, this would serve to drive corn prices up even further, further enriching ADM and ConAgra (but not the American farmer.) I would hope that the State Department doesn't cooperate with the corn lobby.
Yep---if china likes these a-holes so well let it be china's problem. Hell, they're thinning their own ranks so let them.
Merry Christmas you selfish bastards! Children are starving and it doesn't matter what country they are from. How Christian of you!
And a happy new year ya ignorant sissy.
Matthew19685, you need a reality check. It looks like you are not clear about the concept. Ah well, ignorance is bliss, eh.
Their hunger is NOT America's problem. Let them starve to death or rise up against their fat leader jerks. Next option is China to help since they are their "friends", they say.
I knew some libtard would try to turn this into a partisian issue. Typical.
It annoys me when people even attempt to claim we have starving people here in the US. If they are starving it's by their own choice. There are many, many options when it comes to feeding yourself or your family. I'm so sorry that you are forced to eat bologna sandwiches and such instead of organic tomato's or free range chicken. I have yet to see someone here forced to eat leaves and bark because they had no other choice.
It must be so easy for you since you don't have to look that dying North Korean child in the face and say "Sorry you are about to die. We can't give you any food because we want to teach your government a lesson." Welcome to the new US. Our motto: 'Me First!"
Starvation should never be a weapon. Yet by with holding food aid, we are doing exactly that. Letting them starve until either they are all dead, or they end up doing what we want them to do.
impatient girl ----- YOU need to face reality !!! Food aid given to North Korea STAYS with the fat cats. It DOES NOT go to the people!
POLITICS TRUMP HUNGER IN NORTH KOREAPOLITICS TRUMP HUNGER AROUND THE WORLD
(I rarely use caps, if ever.) The world is as guilty as North Korea. C'mon now and use some common sense and honesty. When didn't politics ever NOT trump life's important issues?
IMHO politicians (and media in their pockets) promulgate scum headline 'news' whilst ignoring the real issues facing our species. Search the internet for what it costs to kill an 'enemy' for a real shocker. For the cost of killing a person we could, for FAR less, feed and shelter them and invest for them a lifelong enterprise for self sufficiency. Sheesh.
I get stuck however when trying to figure out a way to steer the ship toward a better course. Our leaders around the world need to do a much better job. We plain folk also need to do a better job and live nobler lives right where we are today.
I dunno. Kim jong un looks well fed to me. Maybe they should talk to their buddies in China and Iran and see if they can help em out. It's not our place to tell them how to live,and it's not our job to feed the world for free.
Very true, its not our job to feed the world. The North Koreans probably wouldn't accept our food anyway with how brainwashed the people are. Its kinda ironic that Kim jong il was one of the biggest buyers of cognac while his people eats grass and bark. Just surprised that we didn't try to overthrow this dictator.
WOW. I am somewhat surprised by the callousness expressed by so many people here. Life is sacred. If you have the means to meet a need, you should do that.
Humanitarian aid to N. Korea should be linked to permitting aid organizations monitor and distribute the aid. Without it, this evil government will take the food and let the people continue to starve.
Better to let the bad guys be bad guy's, for all to see then - to remove them from the planet and look like a tyrant...
While images of starving children are heart breaking, N. Korea is an unstable nuclear state that focuses more on trying to unleash fireballs of death on the Korean penninsula, rather than spend that money feeding its own people. Hopefully their new child-leader will have 5% more common sense than his idoit father, and lead his country to a civilized, people focused state. Yes, it's a dream, but it's also Christmas right? Why should we give this country money if all they do is threaten the stability of the region with their threats and spend their money on that instead of their own people? The US cannot save the world. We can try, and as the world leader we do, but we shouldn't waste our money on this lost cause until they make some changes of their own. I'm with Obama on this one!!!
The North Koreans have been starving their populous for years. Aid we send ends up making the new baby leader fatter. It's a bad situation, and, like Burma, the only way to change it is popular revolt. If the people stood up, I'd be all for dropping food in every village, along with guns, ammo, instructions, and providing massive air-cover and air support. Beyond that, it's like throwing money at Pakistan; it only strengthens the enemy, because the will never use it to help the common people.
Lilolme...tried that before; didn't work.
Hey genius, they've been accepting it for the last 20 years.
What? no bread, then let'em eat cake.
or nuclear warheads
Perhaps it sounds cruel, but we have enough going hungry in this country and enough national debt in this county to worry about the US alone for awhile. I do NOT feel that we need to be spending $$ to help a country who has declared themselves our enemy. Granted, I am sorry that there are starving people there. My heart grieves for them. But, my heart grieves more for OUR country and the financial issues we are facing here and now. Our government needs to worry about getting our debt under control and NOT about what is happening in other nations. If US citizens want to help the starving in N. Korea, then let them make personal monetary donations to the Red Cross, but do not spend my tax dollars to do it.
Tiger,
I feel bad, in fact, knowing the people of N Korea are eating grass and bark makes me feel terrible. I can imagine myself in that situation. It is obvious the N KOreans need aid; there is no doubt about that. The question is really about who will supply this aid. That's the only question. Anything else is politics. If Russia and China can afford it, they should do it. I think it's up them them to show some compassion. I won't mention any sort of politics because all it really is, is posturing.
Tiger, the people of North Korea have not declared you or us to be their enemy. Their government has taken this position and their isn't a lot they can do about it. Can you argue with that? As for those who post that we can barely feed our own people, perhaps we could come to taxing the 3 trillion dollars in cash that our corporations are sitting on, or should Americans and North Koreans starve? This vine is a nest of heartless self righteous bastards.
Tiger- don't forget that little if any of the food would actually make it to those that really need it. That's the problem with foreign aid- we don't truely have any say in how it's distributed.
The problem with sending aid to NK isn't a question of what the right thing to do is, or who (which countries) should send the aid.
The issue Obama (and we as a nation) have with sending aid is, at the present time, we have no way to ensure that aid gets into the hands of the people who need it. Experience has taught us that any aid we send will just be hoarded by the NK government and its military. The people of NK will still starve to death despite our best efforts to help, and the NK government will turn around and blame *us* for their deaths.
I absolutely hate to agree with you, Tiger, but I have to. We have homeless, starving children here in the states that we can't seem to take care of. In the past, aid that we've sent to N. Korea hasn't been distributed. My heart breaks for these starving people, who are suffering at the hands of an unjust government, but we can't even be sure they'll receive any help we sent.
Sorry, Tiger...the vine is a nest of bleeding heart liberals who are very charitable with other people's money and want to give everything to everyone; who don't believe in consequence; who believe that success should be punished rather than encouraged; who believe, in the words of Karl Marx, "To each according to his needs; from each according to his ability." Who no longer believe in their revered JFK who stated "ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country!" Liberals gave up on that along time ago...it's now all about "give me this, give me that...I'm entitled - eventhough I didn't have to pay for any of it!"
Bull@!$%# on the starving kids in this country! We waste enough food to feed the whole country! No one is starving here.
POLITICS TRUMP HUNGER AROUND THE WORLD
(I rarely use caps, if ever.) The world is as guilty as North Korea. C'mon now and use some common sense and honesty. When did politics ever NOT trump life's important issues?
IMHO politicians (and media in their pockets) promulgate scum headline 'news' whilst ignoring the real issues facing our species. Search the internet for what it costs to kill an 'enemy' for a real shocker. For the cost of killing a person we could, for FAR less, feed and shelter them and invest for them a lifelong enterprise for self sufficiency. Sheesh.
I get stuck however when trying to figure out a way to steer the ship toward a better course. Our leaders around the world need to do a much better job. We plain folk also need to do a better job and live nobler lives right where we are today.
We have to work through China with this. China is the only nation North Korea trusts
kevin I agree see my post below "Let the Chinese buy food from us with all the money we owe them and give it to the N Koreans. It sure would help the US farmers. Just think it would also solve the problem in Alabama as with all the money the farmers would be making they could afford to pay people a decent wage, lowering unemployment"
no! "We" don't have to do a darned thing. Let the Chinese carry some weight for a change.
I agree. We're still technically at war with these a**holes. They refuse to declare anything but a cease fire. I can't remember it ever being a good idea to feed your enemy's population while they work towards your destruction. You want a concession for them? Make them declare peace for food.
I would rather pay for Obama to travel to NYC and Paris for dinner. I would rather pay for his jets and entourage to the Vineyard and Hawaii for his well needed vacations. Let these kids starve, let them eat grass, let them eat cake. It follows the new American way of life; where one in four American child goes to bed hungry. Hells Bells, let China pay for it. After all, the parents of little Chinese children, are telling their kids to finish their dinners, clean their plates as there are "hungry children in America."
Here is the deal. I will not let up on this one my fellow Americans. I have just begun by sending of emails to my Senators and Congressmen, I know it is a joke, but it is a start.
Santa has, for over ninety years, left an apple and an orange in my stocking. This year Santa went to the grocery store only to find that a single beautiful naval orange was 88 cents. Yes 88 cents for one. This summer a single cucumber was one dollar. I asked the produce manager if they were going to discount the cucumbers as they were half rotten, all soft and squishy. "No sir, we will not. We will dump them in the trash." Here is deal folks. Grocery stores, across our great nation, make more money by dumping the old than from discounting the price and selling them.
The reason is because they get to write off the loss on their taxes. In short, we the tax-payers are subsidizing their mismanagement. They buy in more than they can sell, or their prices are so high that the average American cannot afford it. There was a time when the grocery store would give the food to a shelter, or a soup kitchen. They no longer do that due to the legal liability. Should they give it to a soup kitchen and a person at the soup kitchen gets sick from eating their donated food that person can then sue the grocery store.
I have been talking to people about this. The other day I was told by an employee of a major US grocery chain that the story gets even worse or better depending on your point of view. This is the same grocery chain where Mr. and Mrs. Obama prefer to buy their arugula. They once dumped their unsaleable food into their dumpster for the trash man to haul away. They found that people were going into the dumpsters and taking the tossed out food and eating it. Then they decided to add locks to their dumpsters. They soon found that the lock did not deter dumpster divers with a serious hunger; they broke the locks and took what they needed. To stop this the same grocery store started adding "rat poison" to the food in the dumpster. Naturally they posted this fact on the outside of the dumpster for all to read.
That's it folks. I am tired of supporting American companies who cannot manage their finances. We bailed out automobile companies, banks, investment houses, and on and on. Now we subsidize grocery stores and food rots as children in America and around our world grow hungry and some starve.
I suggest that we end the tax write-off that is given to grocery stores. Once again, we have our nation rewarding F- Ups, bad management, along with their I don't give a damn attitude. They know that their "K" street lobbyists, former congressmen with save their fat asses; and they do, time after time, and we the people end up eating it or not eating it.
MrCool:
If one in four U.S. kids "go to bed hungry", as you say, then their parents also are as poor at managing their finances as some big U.S. companies that you cite, and are either too lazy, drunk, stoned, or whatever to avail themselves of what is out there. Times are tough, but not that tough. Now I would prefer that all food be given to organizations like Second Harvest before it spoils and is wasted, and if I had hungry kids, I'd "dumpster dive" before they did without. I can't believe that with all of the food aid, WIC, SNAP, etc., that this is such a huge problem that they are beginning school dinner programs since supposedly kids can't even get one meal at home (it is kinda hard to feed your kids when most of your money is going to real priorities like name brand cigarettes, premium beer, and more "body art" and piercings). And somehow most of the kids I see (and I work in a pretty poor area) look more overfed than emaciated.
Will agree that Mrs. O. should get the entire White House supply of arugula from the organic garden on the grounds and boytcott that particular grocery chain.
What a sad deal this is, even if we sent food, how do we know the needy of N. Korea will get it? It's heartbreaking, but China needs to step up, they seem to protect the N. Koreans, so dig deep China, it's your turn. We have starving children right here at home that need care.
you know what your right ad'm its not an American problem, its not Americans problem that thousands will die from STARVATION!
zulu do you think any food we sent would go to feed the people, it would all go to feed the military after they took of all US labels, remember we are the enemy how would it look if the enemy was feeding their people
Agree with double. We and the South Koreans have given them aid for years, but only their government knows it's from us. The government repackages and distributes the food as gifts from the dear leader, and then they tell the their people that the US is across the border waiting patiently to invade, and that we're the reason they starve. So the people put up with it. Thousands may die of starvation, zulu, but if we just let the cycle continue, millions may starve during the next 50 years of totalitarian rule.
Zulu, how naive you really must be...the world is cruel, especially to arseholes like North Korea...trust me, I'm not losing any sleep over these people. It's their govt's fault and responsibility, not ours.
You all are making the point to people like Zulu but maybe it needs to be spelled out explicitly. The only reason people there are starving is collectivism. Why is there a "famine" in places like NK, Burma, and the old Soviet Union (when it was still going) nearly every year? Is their weather all that much worse than ours? Hell no, it's because people aren't very productive when they are forced to work for the "collective good of the workers' and peasants' state and the greater glory of our Dear Leader and protector" as they are when they are working for the interests of themselves and their families and dare I say it, profit. As long as we give them just enough aid to keep them alive (at best the most the common folk will get) we ensure their continued enslavement to the State. As cruel as it seems, it's even crueler to help the DPRK govt. to exploit its own people.
They need to take some of their paranoid defense budget and allocate it to developing farming and agriculture. It's up to them to develop a way to take care of themselves and if they need help, open their doors,
As a very conservative American, of course I would want to help to feed starving people. Its called charity. Giving of yourself to help others is an act of love. Lets not confuse that with taking things away from one person to give to another. That would just be theft. Loving your neighbor, even if your neighbor is thousands of miles away, is always a good way to live.
Bill hates racism - As a "very conservative American", don't you think we should take care of issues like this in America first? We have children that also need food. And, alwaysanother is correct....let North Korea's allies step up and help out first......that's what friend's do, right? And, if N. Korea's "friends" don't step up to help out.......and they expect America to step in to help out.....what does that tell you about the "friends" that North Korea has???? Something to think about!!!!!
As long as the North Korean populace is underfed there will never be a popular uprising against the Kim regime. People who have no food have no energy. This is how his brainwashing works -- feed them propaganda and not food and you will have them eating up everything you say. And yes, the food we send might be going to the military, but that should open up domestic food supplies for the people.
You so-called"conservatives" think it's just fine for children, the elderly, and the disabled in your own country to go hungry and without adequate medical care, bu we should feed the poor, elderly, disabled, and anyone else in other countries who wants a handout as opposed to doing what is needed to overthrow a dictatorship that is starving them and has been for many years?
I don't think so. It was one thing when we were a world power. Sadly, we no longer are anything worldwide but a laughingstock and we will continue to be a laughingstock until we give adequate suport to our own.
Where did Bill say he didn't want to help Americans? His post implied that we should help ANYONE in dire need, regardless of what country they live in.
@Registered RN
Wow. Just wow. You make me ashamed to call myself a Liberal.
Oh wait, never mind, I'm not a Liberal, I'm a Moderate (that "evil" political faction that no one remembers, which was destroyed by the far-right AND the far-left back in the 80's).
I *am* ashamed that we as a nation have devolved into a beacon of hate, where every opinion has to conform to one of two extremes.
Janelle, you make a really solid point.
Bill, the Bible also says, "Don't cast your pearls before swine, lest they trampled upon them." We can't just throw food at them, and hope that the people who actually deserve to be fed are actually fed. We know that NK would not allow U.S. humanitarian agencies to monitor how the food is distributed. Some of these posters are absolutely correct when they say that NK would only distribute the food among members of the military (the "swine"), and not the starving populace for which it is intended. We're doing the right thing by taking this "hands off' approach until we see what happens.
Bill...
Or more accurately, that would be US-style liberalism!!!!!!!
Calling me ugly names doesn't change reality, nor does inferring that I am less than sympathetic to the plight of the starving. Our offerings A) will never reach their intended recipients, B) will nourish and enrich those who caused this problem in the first place, and C) will once more prove that we are weak and ineffectual (because we cannot control where and how the food is distributed but continue to send it anyway despite overwhelming proof that it can and should be distributed first in our own country).
Sorry, folks, but I call it the way I see it, and my Marine Corp father is probably spinning in his grave because of our foreign "policies" right now. This is not why he was in the first platoon that hit the beach on Iwo.
Excellent clarification of your position. Thank you. Also, glad to see your pride in your USMC father. First platoon at Iwo, wow. My Navy father always respected and admired the Marines and hated to see how many of them died in unseaworthy landing craft and especially "amphibious" tanks that really weren't, supplied by our illustrious defense contractors.
Kat--
Rest of your Scriptural quote about the swine ... "and then turn and rend you". When people are governed by our avowed enemies, it seems more likely that we would be strengthening them for an attack than really appeasing them or "reaching out" to them.
Can't believe I'm agreeing with Obama on anything, but he's right not to send anything to this particular hellhole. Any food shipments will be immediately stolen by the NK government/ military and sold to the highest bidder, with proceeds going to support their nuclear program. The ordinary people will continue to starve, no matter what we do.
AMEN
Unfortuantely, that is an accurate assessment.
Now if OBeezy could just omit the last few years of f*ck ups, he might have a chance at re-election.
But seriously tho--don't re-elect him, remember the f*ck ups
Never fails. Stalin, if you are going to speak about the President of the United States at least get his name right. Are you an adolescent. I have seen many Presidents come and go and some that I never approved of and disliked but I never insulted them with childish names and derogatory comments. Not saying that you have made one. It's not American Sir and there is nothing you can say that will ever convince me otherwise.
Compared with the last one, this president I think is a little smarter and more admired. I believe his color makes a lot of people just focus on anything to make a coplete fuss over. It's only one year, surely we can try to wish this man a respectful chance to do his job or do we want this Country to fail completely. Who would wish worse for their own country. If you can't be behind your President who will you be behind? What other choice do any of us have? Let us at least wish him well. Our livelihood and advancement and future depend on him moving us a positive direction. Why would any descant American not wish him well. I don't understand.
No food for N. Korea at this moment. Sad situation but China has the obligation to help their allies not the U.S.
Hey...I'm so liberal I make Barry Obama look like Barry Goldwater...but I agree: Zero food aid to North Korea. It's the Chinese turn. And, if THEY don't...then Russia's. And...if THEY don't...then sit back and see what shakes out.
This is a crazy country. I wouldn't be surprised if this power change ends up in military conflict.
My money's on a military coup, too.
One of the few places left where that could be a big improvement, depending on which generals lead it and what they do to the Kim family "loyalists" afterwards.
As the old Chinese saying goes First fix self, then fix family, fix village, country and finally world most of us are trying to fix family and village so we have a long way to go before we should be helping the North Koreans. Let the Chinese buy food from us with all the money we owe them and give it to the N Koreans. It sure would help the US farmers. Just think it would also solve the problem in Alabama as with all the money the farmers would be making they could afford to pay people a decent wage, lowering the unemployment
"Let the Chinese buy food from us with all the money we owe them.
LOL
I don't think you understand how this debt thing works.
@rch101196
I think he means, the US can pay down some of its debt by offering free food aid to the Chinese, that they can then give to NK, and the Chinese get all the credit for helping NK.
As usual, it will be the poor who suffer most, and most of the country is poor. They need to stop spending money developing an arsenal and start taking care of their starving population. Those in the upper class of their own government are responsible for this but, because they are well fed, it's not an issue. We cannot continue to take care of the entire world when many millions in this country are going hungry Charity starts at home.
Yeah, looks like little FAT Kim that died, and his FAT now leader son are WELL FED! We have millions below the poverty line now in our country that are starving and can't pay their bills. Please don't put FAT Gingrich in office either or we'll be in the same boat. Fat leader, starving people in both countries!!!
this is one reason why I believe in God - somebody who will, sooner or later, make these horrible government leaders PAY big time for what they've done. I have to believe in afterlife punishment, or I'd just go through life bitter and angry at all the horrible people who get away with doing horrible things in this life. We should stop this if we can, but our leaders would never invade NK.. we'd rather focus on imaginary threats from whatever government it would be most profitable to depose.
It's terrible and tragic what is happening to the people in the countryside of N Korea, but if their government can pay the 3rd biggest army, and fund nuclear research, then it ought to feed it's own people. I'm w/ O'bama on this one. We've given food before, and gotten worse relations as our thank you. No-one like to think of people starving, but perhaps pressure now will help every1 in the future
Crazy, the Chinese don't step up? What about Hugo & Castro etc. Nobody likes us till they need us. even then I have heard from boys in the military that went to Haiti that they blame the US for the quake. In the end though it still comes down to innocents starving so we should help out unconditionally because we are a humane country and people. What's a few more dollars in debt going to hurt at this point?
GARY --- Go back to First grade and learn to read. THE STARVING
DO NOT GET OUR FOOD AID. It all goes to the fat cats.
“We don’t want to see the humanitarian principals linked to things such as giving up nuclear weapons,” said Austin of Mercy Corps. “It undermines the moral authority of both.”
I don't think so. Rather it would be immoral to support the dictator by sustaining his failed system with food aid without conditions. Besides, we cannot control how the food will be distributed, if really children and pregnant women get it, or if it is given to the people at all. This was a similar problem in Somalia and good intentions caused more harm than benefit.
Any aid provided to this country subsidizes its military aspirations. With the largest and presumably well fed army in the world and nuclear aspirations, it's clear where the money goes and that is Their Choice. It's an unfortunate fact that THEY are starving their people by not providing them with food from the funds they have. Sorry, but until they decide their people are more important than their military, let's spend some more money we don't have here in our own country.
When did North Korea's army become the largest in the world?
The military budget of NK is approximately $6 billion. The military budget of the US is approximately $680 billion!
It's not the largest (the Chinese Army is) but what a travesty that a small, poor country (not in the top fifty in the world in population, not very much area, and only two borders to defend, one of which is with a supposed ally) has an Army in the top five, while the civilian population starves. The largest item of all in the U.S. defense budget is for salaries and benefits. How much do you think that NK provides of either, at least to the enlisted personnel, and damned little to the junior officers either, I'd wager, so they have very little of what is our main expense.
NK cynically uses its starving population to essentially get foreign aid to support its military. It can put massive amounts of money into its military and nuclear arsenal because the rest of the world will feed its people. That is backdoor military aid. And the food is diverted to the military anyway.
My heart says to send food not matter what to try to feed at least some people. My head however tells me that we should send aid only when we are able to control its distribution. I'm even willing to separate food aid from the nuclear talks, but I'm not willing to provide food that will never reach who needs it.
The posts that refer to China are correct. China is the country that must lead engagement with NK as they will suffer the greatest consequences if they don't. When the NK population starts swarming over a border, China will be that border and they will end up feeding hundreds of thousands, if not millions of refugees. NK is the one country I don't think I would mind hearing China had invaded to eliminate a psychotic regime.
Can't believe I'm agreeing with all the conservatives on this, but hard as it is to think of people eating bark and grass and still starving, trying to feed them just won't work. Even if the food did get to those who need it, the fundamental problem would not be alleviated - just prolonged.
The NK gov't uses the starving people as poker chips. We killed a few hundred thousand Iraqis in a misguided search for WMD, while we KNOW the NK's have them. Maybe the new 'Dear Leader" will be a softie and actually care about the people he "leads."
two chances of that - slim, and fat.
Sorry, but this country needs to learn that you either get busy living or get busy dying. If they don't want to put aside their hateful ways, I choose the latter.
jorlwebb...you are going to have to do better than quote a line from the Shawshank Redemption to make your point.
I'm saddened by the decision, but I also understand it.
China can easily provide aid and they should, since they are politically aligned with Pyongyang. They can also provide agriculture technology to make NK food independent. The NKP considers the U.S. as enemies. Why feed an enemy that may come back to fight us later? China must be called to aid NK. A starving enemy will strike out and take what it needs, putting the South in peril and drawing us into yet another armed conflict.
We have people who are hungry in this country. Charity begins at home.
Do not send anything to that dogcrap country! No food no money no anything and let China deal with that pot belly pig Ho Flungpoop! any attempt to help goes straight to the military!
You folks do realize that if we actually SEND food their is NO guarantee it will actually REACH the starving people. If you want to topple the regime you need to have the people rise up against the system. We have been trying to negotiate with these Aholes for decades and where has that gotten us?
very true. if aid is to reach the people who really need it, it's absolutely futile to go through "official" channels. The people who are oppressed and starving - they're in no condition to stand up to their well-fed military and government officials. Forget Saddam, we should have invaded NK and put a stop to it. But we don't, because it wouldn't be good "policy".
Your damned right it wouldn't be good policy to invade a country full of completely propagandized fanatics with wanna-be nuclear power status which lies 35 miles north of the capital of one of our major allies, which is easily within range of their heavy artillery. It was hard enough to fight in a country that by comparison was far more modern, sophisticated, and less devoted to its hierarchy with the exception of some of the dictator's own tribesmen.
Feed America first and quit sending billions of dollars in aid to these thrid world @!$%# holes.
sure, because you had absolute control over where you were born and decided you wanted to be an American so your larder would always be well stocked. and we shouldn't help them because they chose to be born into a starving third world country....
your logic is stunning. did it ever cross your mind - that could easily have been you lying there in that hospital dying of hunger. It's only by luck and chance that you aren't.
su -314019 ,, you are correct, but "luck" and "chance" were both on my side, see ya @ Burger King..I remember hearing many years ago , the grass is always greener on the other side. NK,,,Bolt + Nut + Turn Clockwise = #%^@ YOU!!! Thanks for playing, please drive thru. COMMIE PHUX..............
su-314019,
The sad truth, which is not going to be popular here, is that the North Korean population has through indifference, lack of education, and sheer apathy allowed this to happen.
Another sad truth, which ALSO will not be popular here, is that the US is going straight down the same path and most of our citizens are not bright enough or well-informed enough to recognize it and are simultaneously too dead lazy to do anything about it. The most frightening words I've ever heard are, "The government knows what is best for us and has our best interests at heart."
We don't have the excuse of the apathy/lethargy that years of malnutrition causes, but we have millions who are "too busy" to pay attention to political issues but are "Keeping up with the Kardashians" or their "fantasy football" teams.