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MOGADISHU, Somalia -- Gunmen kidnapped an American man in the northern Somali town of Galkayo on Saturday, officials said, the same day an airstrike killed a senior insurgent leader with ties to al-Qaida in another part of the country.
The gunmen surrounded the man's car shortly after the man left the airport, said policeman Abdi Hassan Nur, who witnessed the incident. He said they then forced the American into another vehicle.
Local government officials said they believed the assailants had been the man's own guards and might be linked to a pirate gang.
"Gunmen kidnapped the foreigner and we understand they took him to Hobyo," Abshir Dini, interior minister of the semi-autonomous region, told Reuters, referring to a coastal town that is a known pirate base.
Galkayo is on the border between the semiautonomous northern region of Puntland and a region known as Galmudug. It is ruled by forces friendly to the U.N.-backed Somali government.
A minister from the Galmudug administration said the gunmen severely beat the foreigner's Somali companion when he begged them not to take the man. The minister spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the press.
A staff member at the Embassy Hotel, where the man was staying, said the American had gone to the airport to drop off an Indian colleague. The hotel said that the man had both American and German citizenship. The staff member asked not to be identified because he was not supposed to give out information about guests.
In October, gunmen kidnapped an American woman and a Danish man working for the Danish Demining Group from the same town. They are still being held.
Kidnapping for ransom is has become increasingly common in Somalia over the past five years. Currently at least four aid workers, a French military official, a British tourist taken from Kenya and hundreds of sailors are being held captive.
In a separate incident in the south of the country outside the capital of Mogadishu, a British-Lebanese commander of the al-Shabab militant group was killed along with two others when a missile struck the car they were traveling in, al-Shabab spokesman Sheik Ali Rage said.
Rage identified the British-Lebanese commander as Bilal-Berjawi, saying he was a close associate of late al-Qaida operative Fazul Abdullah Mohammed, the mastermind behind the 1998 bombings of the U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania who was killed by a Somali soldier in June 2011.
Further south, another airstrike killed six people near the insurgent stronghold of Kismayo on Saturday, according to Sheik Mohamud Abdi, a senior al-Shabab commander. Kenya sent troops into Somalia in October amid concerns that Somalia's 21-year-old civil war was spilling over the countries' joint border.
The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this story.
More from msnbc.com and NBC News:
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One of the most dangerous area's to go to in the world..and they still go there, IDIOTIC!
Agreed. No amount of money is worth the risk. What was this guy thinking?
This is just going to ruin an already bleak tourist season.
Yea, you don't go there without your own defense contractor and able to support both an outer and inner parameters!
He would have done better to quit his job when he got the assignment.
Seems to me that some of the attitudes being taken here are contrary to the attitudes that I was seeing regarding the "hikers" in Iran?
This man went to Solmalia, he thought he was in a territory that was safe. I still disagree with him opting to go based on my feeling regarding Somalia after our endeavors there in the 90's, but he was trying to do something that may have allowed them to build a deep water port that would have improved financial opportunities for the country.
It seems to me that the American State Department needs to issue a statement that all aid (regardless of the source), all support for the country will come to an abrupt halt until all captives are released and if the people of that country do not stand up against their own home grown thugs they will wither and die as a nation.
There are some places you just don't go, Somalia and South Chicago after dark to name two. When you do you travel at your own peril.
As far as possible, we have to keep away from nations full of Islamic Nazi bigots.
Somalia, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and some more. Nigeria is on the line. Even helping them such as on aids mission is dangerous.
Now, as usual, they will be asking for hefty ransom.
That would only work if we were dealing with sane civilized people.
Its time to call the exterminators.
“All I know is if you look at history and if you compare good medical care and you compare famine, the countries that are more socialistic have more famines. If you look at Africa, they don’t have any free market systems and property rights and they have famines and no medical care. So the freer the system, the better the health care.” ~ Ron Paul
So let me get this straight. Your telling starving malnourished people that they should go fight people (who have guns) to release a single america hostage? What are they supposed to fight them with? Sticks?
God I'm glad you dont handle foreign policy.
hahaha! you dont want to be kidnapped? stay in america.. dont people understand that?
Sam,
I get your implications. However that attitude is exactly why radical elements of Islam are still in existence today.
Let the idiots sit they wanted to be there.
@ creampieman,
I am just so THANKFUL that there are NO KIDNAPPINGS ever here in the US ! Can you imagine anyone ever getting Kidnapped in say Chicago, or California??? OMG how horrable for the citizens of the US if it ever started here. RIGHT ??????
How could they possibly consider building a port in a failed state warzone like Somalia?
You mean that there are people who don't like Americans? Even though so many of us are such nice folks? Shocking! (Wonder what the "incentive" pay is to go and do a feasibility study in Somalia? Apparently, not nearly enough.)
Deep water port? Why, so pirates are able to get bigger ships they seize into port easier? Make a lot of sense to me.
Sam the aid goes to the warlords who steal it to stay in power. Its not in the warlords interest to have natives able to feed themselves and they sabotage efforts to help the people. If you stop giving aid the warlords could only stay in power by supporting food production instead of sabotaging it.
Right. If you are the only guy around who can feed his workers, then it's a lot easier to "recruit" workers and maintain their support. If they can just quit if they get ready to, find another job, and buy their own food, then you aren't much of a warlord.
If you are stupid enough to go there, well, you get what you should expect in a @!$%#-hole like that.
Jarhead's on target. If you're stupid enough to hike near Iran or go to Somalia for ANYTHING we shouldn't be wasting our State Department's time. That tells the world that we're worried about our stupid citizens. We NEED them. How else would Newt get any exposure?
I got a few things out of this article that made me go hmmmm, first off: the incident was witnessed by policeman Abdi Hassan Nur, so, what did he do, just stand there and go, "Oh my, my, my, my, Oh My, My!!!!" Secondly, the great editing once again oh here, "Kidnapping for ransom 'is has' become..... Seriously? and thirdly, exactly what T Melora said, a deep water port in a "Known" pirate stronghold, WOW!!!!!
If the whole world were an outhouse, Somalia would be the corncob! Maybe we should tell Iran that they can test their nukes there.
It's either warlords or pirates running the show. What a pathetic excuse for a country.
Jarhead In WI,
If you ever have been to Islamic Africa (Somalia, Sudan, etc.) you would know that you DO NOT GO THERE UNLESS YOU HAVE AT LEAST A COMPANY SIZED (about 300 trained and experienced in Counter Insurgency, Counter Terrorism; and Rescue, Recapture, Recovery Operations; and visibly armed to the teeth for sustained operations) SECURITY FORCE and that is just to keep a couple of people safe.
That does NOT matter let the US Military Engineers do that just like UN Mission Somalia I and UN Mission Somalia II, the situation at Somalia is worse than in the 1990s as the Al Sheebah (Fundamentalist Islamic Arabic Omani Muslims) basically have free reign and tore up all the progress from UN Missions Somalia I and II by destroying everything "Western", "Modern", "Non Islamic", that was originally built to stop the cycles of droughts and starvation as Islam routinely uses Starvation as a Weapon. This is why they are having the current Droughts and Famine, causing the men to join Al Sheebah and the women and children (Male children old enough to carry a AK or RPG and are grabbed and becomes a Child Soldier of Al Sheebah) to flee to Kenya; and Kenya only doing the minimum as Kenya is actually Ruled by the Fundamentalist Islamic Arabic Omani Muslims and treat the Swahili as Fourth Class Citizens; this is why President Obama's Father named him a Arabic Omani Muslim name as to be named a Swahili name is an automatic disadvantage for life at Kenya (after UN and African Union Observer Mission to Sudan (Darfur) we had R&R at Kenya).
By the way who do you think will seize and use the deep water port after it is built (to park all the hijacked ships).
Stopping Aid will only help the Anti Government Al Sheebah and starve the people. And just like the US Citizens, they do not believe in taking care of the problems themselves and let someone else do it, as the identical reason why only 1/2 of 1 % of US Citizens are currently serving in the US Military, and 92% NEVER Served in the US Military (and yet have the most to say about those matters that they never experienced or are trained to accomplish).
US Department of State STAY THE F**K OUT OF THESE COUNTRIES LIST:
http://www.travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_1764.html
Palestine is noton the list as they are not recognized by the US as a Country, we can discuss that also as part of Amin Al Husseini's Anti Jew Pan Arabic Plan (moving as many Arabs (mostly from Jordan) into Palestine before the arrival of the Jews and forcing the original Palestinians (Orthodox Christians, and Jews) out.).
Other Nations like US Ally Turkey (unless you are US Military), Turkmenistan, Uzebekistan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyzstan, Jordan, some of the former USSR Nations, South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Chechnya and Eastern Europe, etc. should also not be visited for any reason (unless you can justify your own suicide, and do NOT say we should violate a Sovereign Nation by coming to rescue your arse. STOP imposing your no experienced academic idealistic bullsh!t ideas on the Real World Life or Death School of Hard Knocks.). Good luck AFRICOM.
I'm in East Africa in a country called Djibouti supporting US military and US contractors, and I'm here for the opportunity after Iraq. Everyone isn't ready to face risk and the consequences of those decision and to many Americans who have never been beyond the borders of the US who are shocked and amazed at prior service vets and voluteers like myself who have taken risk in places such as Iraq and now Africa for money or the chance to try an make a diferrence. Its better that you just blog or comment because you have no idea. I have no doubt that a person who ends or decides to go to Somalia or any dangerzone isn't aware of the risk. Even last month, I had planned to go to Somalia. Did I? Hell no! Because I know the potential for being sold out by the very people you are tyring to help and I know I'm not important enough to the US government to bother about; sure I could make the news, but if I was a hostage I would still be stuck. LOL! No one is coming to pay a ransom for any of those persons like myself who choose to take the risk. I would like to help retrieved the persons who have been kidnapped though. . .
and Kenya only doing the minimum as Kenya is actually Ruled by the Fundamentalist Islamic Arabic Omani Muslims and treat the Swahili as Fourth Class Citizens; this is why President Obama's Father named him a Arabic Omani Muslim name as to be named a Swahili name is an automatic disadvantage for life at Kenya (after UN and African Union Observer Mission to Sudan (Darfur) we had R&R at Kenya).......................You are sooooo off target with this info. I won't even bother asking where you got your info from as I don't think it could have been published anywhere reputable. So, I may agree with what you are trying to say, but your stats, or "facts" are so ludicrous it totally discredit you.
Perhaps not so idiotic - I mean, I doubt he went there on an $8 an hour gig. If enough $$ is being offered, you'll always find people willing to go to dangerous places and run great risks to earn it.
Assumption is that if you do your homework, avoid the mistakes made by others, and trust in your skill (and luck), things will pan out for you where they didn't for others. Obviously didn't pan out for this guy, but there's no doubt that plenty of optimists out there are willing to run the risk if the $$ is good.
And finally, unlike getting kidnapped by jihadis in Pakistan or Iraq, which invariably ends in a beheading posted on the internet, Somali kidnappers are usually just after the ransom $$ and are more interested in getting paid than in slaughtering infidels. So getting kidnapped there, while an unpleasant experience, is seldom the end of the road - most of the time it's just a matter of enduring being locked up in some warehouse without AC while being fed crappy food and drinking nasty water for the 6 months or so it takes for a ransom to get negotiated and paid, then you're on your way.
FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE. Before US AFRICOM was formed it was our unfortunate (dumped on us) Area of Responsibilty (Islamic Nations of Africa). The same occured with our involvements with Islamic Asian Nations (Area of Responsibility Dumped on us). Our arses where going from one end of the Earth to the other when sh!t happened. So to stop this they finally created US Military AFRICOM, and increased the Stength of US PACOM SOC (Asia) with these Commands trying to continually steal experienced personnel from us.
Tell me which one's and if they are not classified, I will tell you who, what, were, how, when, why, etc. (as we keep detailed notes so that the US Politicians cannot use us as Politicially Expedient Scapegoats in case something fails). The other means for me to let you figure out things is by finding unclassifed versions of the classified.
example: US AFRICOM INSUM (Classified), so I can give you Unclassified: Somalia resembling Afghanistan under Taliban, http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38802019/ns/world_news-africa
So what other Facts do you want validity on.
You don't tug on Superman's cape,
you don't spit into the wind,
you don't pull the mask off that old Lone Ranger...
Oh, AND STAY THE HELL OUT OF SOMALIA!
That's easy, you nuke the whole place until it's one gigantic crater and let it fill in with seawater forming a nice harbor.
Look up Operation Plowshare on Wikipedia.
David-475776, how about these statements " Kenya is actually Ruled by the Fundamentalist Islamic Arabic Omani Muslims and treat the Swahili as Fourth Class Citizens; this is why President Obama's Father named him a Arabic Omani Muslim name as to be named a Swahili name is an automatic disadvantage for life at Kenya (after UN and African Union Observer Mission to Sudan (Darfur) we had R&R at Kenya)."
Hint: learn a little background on the language and the people of Swahili and try to justify that the name Barak is not from the Swahili word for blessing -baraka- . Seeing that swahili is actually rooted in arabic, I wonder why a swahili name would be frowned upon, but an arab name is better, when it's from more or less the same word in both languages. see my point? And that Kenya is ruled by fundamentalist Islamic...blablabla????? Huh? Are you talking about President Kibaki or Prime minister Raila or WHO exactly is a fundamentalist???? Last time I checked, they were both christians. Or ar you talking about the population??? I believe more than 90% of population is non-muslim, and of the 10% who are muslims, I bet a HUGE MAJORITY are NOT fundamentalists. Swahili as 4th class citizens?? HUH again???? I can only wonder what else in your statement is as outlandish as the ones I have highlighted so far
Whatwastha?,
Try again go look up the actual spellings. Then go look up the Arabic, next you are going to tell me that Hussein and Obama are Swahili.
The History of Kenya is very simple. It was the Arabic Omani Muslims that were capturing the Africans (Swahili) and selling them as Slaves. The Arabic Omani Muslims at Kenya have a Islamic word for Africans (Swahili), Kaffir (Kuffur), go look that up (NOT wikipedia).
You go to Kenya like we did on R&R after the Sudan and tell me about why the Kenyan Government leaves the Swahili to dig in dumps for food or things to make enough money to buy glue to sniff. While the Arabic Omani Muslims are living it up. So until you have been to Kenya do not tell me about crap that you read in a book written by non participants based on information from other non participants. I AM TALKING ABOUT FIRSTHAND EXPERIENCE.
Because I went to College at Egypt to learn Arabic, then later on went to College at Egypt again to learn Islam, I was treated very well at Kenya (and we NEVER used Christian Names at Islamic Nations). As when I was at College at Egypt I screwed up and used my Christian name, david, and was "panted" in public to see if I was a Jew (and they do not give a f**k if you were circumcised for hygienic reasons).
"...do not tell me about crap that you read in a book written by non participants based on information from other non participants."
Where would you get an idea like that - pretty close to home?
This place is exactly why indiscriminate carpet bombing is useful.
When they are killing each other and now many starving, it may not be even worth it.
But don't take a single liability inside the US, Britain and other western nations.
It is too bad that our 200k+ troops on the way back from Iraq can not make a stop off in Somalia. March from one end of the country to the other, clean out all the rubbish, and on the way back to the boats take out any residue.
What we should do, is send over a bunch of top irs dirt bags and let them start auditing the pirates, who knows, if we get lucky, NONE of them will come back. Sounds like a plan to me.
What year is this, who is President. Haven't you heard all the US Military are already back from Iraq and Stateside according to President Obama's Reelection speeches. Of course what he did not mention is that most are now going on Unemployment as No Mission means no justification(s) for any US Military Defense Budget as US Congressional Appropriations to retain them.
If you want to be that way, volunteering others to do what you refuse to do, YOU GO SIGN UP NOW.
Same reason why the USSR 40thArmy failed here (Afghanistan), as your WWII "Carpet Bombing" mentality, just created more Combatants while killing both Combatants and Innocents alike; so when the Innocents were killed, more joined the Combatants as the 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen that we trained (We, US Military Training Teams attached to SAD, did NOT train Osama Bin Laden he was still living with his Rich Saudi Arabian Relatives creating his Anti Saudi Government and Anti US Islamic Jihadists Organization, Al Quada. And we did NOT train the 1990s Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban (supported by Fundamentalist Islamic Iran), I explained where they came from in other Newsvine posts based on Firsthand Experience, not any of your Wikipedia baloney ("Wikipedia General Disclaimer: WIKIPEDIA MAKES NO GUARANTEE OF VALIDITY, Please be advised that nothing found here has necessarily been reviewed by people with the expertise required to provide you with complete, accurate or reliable information.", http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:General_disclaimer
The only CIA that Osama Bin Laden would have been associated with would have been the NYC Culinary Institute of America while he was at NYC prior to the 1993 First World Trade Center Bombing. So put your tin foil hats away.
It was the 1990s Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban supported by Fundamentalist Islamic Iran (backed by the USSR) that massacred the surviving 20,000 to 50,000 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen after we (US) abandoned ourUS Ally Afghanistan, after the 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen defeated the USSR 40th Army Occupation. So by the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban becoming the Government of Afghanistan as backed by Pro USSR Fundamentalist Islamic Iran, the USSR actually later won Afghanistan (go research the use of "Proxy Fighters"); this changed after the 9/11 2001 Attacks as we were sent in weeks later attached to SAD to: 1. Ovethrow the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government that was providing Osama Bin Laden, Al Quada, and the Islamic JihadistTraining Camps with Islamic Sanctuary., 2. Reestablish what was left of the Democratic Rule of Afghanistan., 3. Seize and Secure Locations for the arrival of the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces., 4. The mission added on after President Bush, in 2006, amended the US No Assassination Policy, the Termination of Osama Bin Laden.
After the US Senate Declared War With Iraq with US Law, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution (the House of Representatives already did Declare War With Iraq with President Clinton's US Law H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998", President Clinton's Justification Weapons of Mass Destruction, that is where that came from NOT Bush, H.R. 4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" becomes US Military Operation Iraqis Freedom 1998 to 2011 after President Clinton's Operation Desert Fox.) we are again attached to SAD to conduct US Military Operation Hotel California (because during the Iran Iraq Wars we were sent to US Ally Iraq as US Military Training Teams attached to SAD, and already had detailed experience and knowledge of Iraq, unlike the US Citizens and especially the US Politicians (All Parties) with the US Politicians f**king up resulting in the loss of Iraq (and Oil Wealth to pay for the US Military Liberation of Iraq) to the Allies of Fundamentalist Islamic Iran, the Chinese and Russian Federation, 2010-2011); this is also like what happened with Libya resulting in the Allies of Fundamentalist Islamic Iran getting the Libyan Oil, the Chinese, as negotiated by Fundamentalist Islamic Iran's Ally Qatar. And don't say that Gaddaffi was not a US Ally, those President Obama Islamic Jihadist Prisoners at Gaddaffi'sPrisons; this is also like the defeats of US Allies, President of Egypt, President of Yemen, etc. with Fundamentalist Islamic Iran achieving Strategic Goals; 1. Surrounding US Ally Saudi Arabia., 2. Control of the Strait of Hormuz, previously acknowledged by the US as the Territorial Waters of UAE, Oman, Iran; US Lost opportunity to sign a Treaty to make this International Waters. Allow Pro Iran Oil Shipments to Chinese and Russian Federation, stop Pro US and US Allies Oil, 3. Strategic Access and Control of the Suez Canal thru the Muslim Brotherhood, as negotiated prior to the "Egyptian Revolution"., 4. Unhindered backing of Islamic Jihadists Worldwide (like Al Sheebah Somalia) ever since President Obama's 2009 Improved Relations with Iran Policy (Iran allowed to do anything without US Interventions)., 5. Part of previous number 4., Iran's Support of the Main Islamic Jihadist Training camp at their Ally, the Kurdistanis Autonomous Region, the Kurdistanis the Armed (men, women, children as "Guerrilla Warfare") Allies of Iran ever since the Iran Iraq Wars., 6. Iran's Strategic Military Build up, with North Korean copies of Chinese copies of USSR SS-18 ICBMs; Iran's building longer range IRBMs similar to US Pershing II's with a third stage and no range limiters; so Russian Federation deploys their Land Based Anti Ballistic Missile Batteries to many former USSR Nations that supply them with Resources years ago., while December 23, 2011 President Obama backpeddles on implementing President Bush's Plan to deploy land based US ABMs to Europe, by deploying US ABMs to Romania (source US Department of State)., 7. Iran's negotiations at South America for the deployment of Iranian IRBMs at South America, Iran's President's Visits 2011-2012., 8. It has been the Strategic Goal of the USSR (now Russian Federation) and the Chinese to get the US and US Allies out of their Backyards (Resources) of the Middle East, Africa, Asia; as what is actually occuring, the Chinese and Russian Federation using Iran as a "Proxy Fighter" and Iran using the Islamic Jihadists as "Proxy Fighters", so the US becomes a third or fourth World Nation (predicted to be replaced by the Chinese as a Super Power by 2015).
Any questions do the Real Research yourselves, DO NOT USE Wikipedia. ("Wikipedia General Disclaimer: WIKIPEDIA MAKES NO GUARANTEE OF VALIDITY, Please be advised that nothing found here has necessarily been reviewed by people with the expertise required to provide you with complete, accurate or reliable information.", http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:General_disclaimer
But wait! Somalia is where I recommend Repugs go as their Utopia. No taxes, small goverment! Don't tell me this system isn't working in Somalia!! It is what they want for their "change" in America.
Will Obama send Hillary to Somalia to work on this?
No tears..... You were warned many times. Americans must learn to stay away from all things Islam. That would include pulling out of every M.E. country and if need be dropping a large bomb on Tehran to quite their continued threats to America/ Israel.
What is America/ Israel?
Fed up Why would you bomb Iran for something Somalia did?
freedman1,
America/Israel is a city in Michigan called Huntington Woods.
@Fed Up, You are so right. It's not just Somalia, its all those other cesspool areas in that part of the world. Any country that threatens the US should be bombed. Because sooner or later they will attack us like they already did. Pre-emptive strikes are a good idea. Sgt. Joe
@Fed Up, I usually try to stay away from forums and comment boards like this, but i couldn't help it this time. What you said was possibly the most ignorant thing i have heard in a long, long time. First of all, there are many AMERICANS that practice the Islamic faith-those terrorists and gun toting militia men out in the middle-east are in no way a representation of their faith. Many have either been led astray by charismatic leaders touting obsure texts and mad ravings or are simply out for money or blood. Secondly, before choosing to bomb certain countries and save others, you should take a good look at each one. Israel is in no way innocent of its own crimes. May we look at the Apartheid Wall that was begun in 2004? Imagine a wall that surrounds the West Bank, which is already full of poor and starving Palestinians, cutting them off from vital supply routes and sentencing citizens to lives in abjectly poor ghettos. Not only does it surround them, it cuts of more than 40% of the land that WAS theirs. Israel's oppression and land-grabbing have been largely ignored, however, regardless of the fact that they have violated the Geneva Convention several times in many different ways. Opression is not limited to one faith, one area, or one race. To protect someone because we have an alliance is no good unless we are all held up to the same standards and are held accountable for our actions.
So, Joe, just kill 'em all and let Allah sort 'em out, right? That's some kind of deep thinking! Please boycott the 2012 elections! (And all of them after that.)
What about the ones our government has assisted with so called refugee status & those who are all ready US citizens?
Whaley94 and Rlquall: I am not a sympathizer when it comes to Islam. You're silly when referring to Palestine as a victim. How many trips have you made to the West Bank? Obviously you're unfamiliar with the region and have no personal ties to Israel to declare such BS. Israel has shown great restraint when dealing with Palestine and if you think otherwise you're indeed being foolish. Do you think America would be so sympathetic to continued rocket fire into their cities from a neighboring region? Run along now and continue supporting the Muslim/ Islam faith.
Other way around, the 1.8% of Islamic Believers living at the US do NOT represent the over 1.5 Billion Islamic Believers Worldwide. And the 1.8% of Islamic Believers living at the US do NOT determine what Islam is or is not.
As far as Palestine, why don't you go research Amin Al Husseini, the Pan Arabic Plan, the Arab League of Nations (co founded by Amin Al Husseini to push the Jews into the Sea), the Islamic World's 1933 Alliance with Hitler (for "as long as a descendant breaths") with the mutual goal of the extermination of the Jews, formation of the PLO after the Arab League of Nations Failed (Arab Israelis Wars) to violently get the Jews and after the PLO failed Hamas, etc.. The Arab League of Nations being sore losers demanding all the land that they lost in combat after attacking Israel.
Yeah, sure, did you take the Mandatory School Curriculum at most Islamic Nations, Hitler's Mein Kampf as a success story, and the blame the Jews for everything, "Protocols of the Wise Elders of Zion", well I did while going to College at Egypt for Language Arabic, and later Islam (taught in Arabic) or be expelled. This Islamic Mandatory School Curriculum is what keeps the hatred by Islamic Believers against Jews going; just like the Islamic Madrasas keep preaching the 109 Suras of the 114 Suras of the Holy Koran (Quran) War Against the Christians (Crusaders), Jews, Unbelievers and the current Islamic Laws that are based on the 109 Suras (Support the Islamic War Against the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers, thru Mandatory Islamic Tithes, etc. or be punished (added to the Islamic Death Penalty Fatawa (Fatwa) lists.).
Most Non Islamic Governments, International Departments of State, International Intelligence Agencies, FinancialInstitutions, International Militaries, etc. are all attempting to shut down the Mandatory Islamic Tithes of the over 1.5 Billion Islamic Believers Worldwide supporting:
the Worldwide Islamic Military (aka Jihadists, Terrorists) consisting of the International Al Quada Franchise (AQ, AQY, AQS, AQI, AQAP, AQIM, AQ Somalia, etc.), Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG aka "the Libyan Rebels"), Army of Islam Pakistan (not the Pakistanis Military), Pakistanis Taliban, Army of Islam Gaza, Hezbollah (Party of Allah, Palestine, Lebanon, Gaza, Libya, South and Central Americas, etc.), Hamas Foreign Fighters (Palestine, Libya, Gaza, South and Central Americas, maybe Mexico, etc.), Islamic Chechen Foreign Fighters, Muslim Brotherhood (Alexandria Egypt), Kongra Gel/Kurdistan Worker's Party (KGK/PKK), Jemaah Islamiya (JI), Abu Sayyaf Group (ASG), Fatah al-Islam (FAI), Ansar al-Islam (AI), Ansar al-Sunna (AS), Abu Nidal Organization (ANO), Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade (AAMS), Al-Shabaab, Ansar al-Islam (AAI), Asbat al-Ansar, Gama'a al-Islamiyya (Islamic Group), Harakat ul-Jihad-i-Islami/Bangladesh (HUJI-B), Harakat ul-Mujahidin (HUM), Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban of Afghanistan, Islamic Jihad Union (IJU), Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan (IMU), Jaish-e-Mohammed (JEM) (Army of Mohammed), Jemaah Islamiya organization (JI), Kata'ib Hezbollah (KH), Lashkar-e Tayyiba (LT) (Army of the Righteous), Lashkar i Jhangvi (LJ), Moroccan Islamic Combatant Group (GICM), Mujahedin-e Khalq Organization (MEK), Palestine Liberation Front (PLF), Palestinian Islamic Jihad (PIJ), Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP), PFLP-General Command (PFLP-GC), Harakat-ul Jihad Islami (HUJI), Jundallah, Moro Islamic Liberation Group (MILF), etc. recently added Haqqani Network (Pakistan) to the US Department of State List.
Quite a few of the above were attending the Main Islamic JihadistTraining Camp located at the entire Autonomous Region of Kurdistan, as supported by Fundamentalist Islamic Iran, with weapons, munitions, Iranian Military Advisers, Iranian Military Trainers (Iranian "Special Forces"), Funding (money laundrying of the Mandatory Islamic Tithes, term used by US Department of State, Mosques used as "Non Established Financial Institutions" to funnel the Mandatory Islamic Tithes (Trillions USDs each year, especially the Oil Rich Islamic Nations (Not the Governments of those Nations)) to the Islamic Jihadists), Military Equipment, etc. as stated by General McChrystal based on captured weapons, munitions, equipment and Islamic Jihadists; being against President Obama's 2009 Improved Relation with Iran Policy, General McChrystal received a Letter of Reprimand from President Obama. These weapons, etc. are being supplied to Iran from the Chinese and Russian Federation in exchange for Iranian Oil;and since the US lost Iraq, the Iraqis Northern (Kurdistanis as Allies of Iran) and Southern (Shiites most came from Iran generations ago as Illegal Aliens and used as cheap labor by the Iraqis (Arabs, Sunnis, Arabic)) Oil Fields.
In 2010, US Ally Turkey Attacked and Raided the Autonomous Kurdistanis Region (this is a big deal, US Ally Turkey attacking Northern Iraq). This caused many of the Islamic Jihadists to flee back to their "Home" Nations, and being trained in Asymmetric Warfare they proceeded to Overthrow any US and US Allies Governments as they were trained to do (as Asymmetric Warfare, the Insurgency Warfare part of creating Civil Wars. Hundreds of Islamic Jihadists getting Thousands to Millions to fight for the Islamic Jihadist's Cause.), as the "Arab Spring". The US Ally Turkey Asymmetric Warfare Colonel (soon to be promoted) that we trained with at Southern Turkey before coming here (Afghanistan) to conduct US Military Asymmetric Mountain Warfare was almost killed 2011. 2012, US Ally Turkey is now in almost a full scale War (Airstrikes, Artillery, Armor, Ground Forces, Special Operations Forces, etc.) fighting hundreds of thousands of Islamic Jihadists at Southern Turkey, Northern Iraq, Western Iran, near the Border of Syria, as well as the Kurdistanis PKK, HPG, KGK. To counter the possibility of these Islamic Jihadist going into the Nation bordering Syria and overthrowing that Nation's Government, US Military have been deployed to that Nation that starts with J. To stop the Islamic Jihadists (Al Quada Syria (AQS) chased into Syria from the Autonomous Kurdistanis Region during US Ally Turkey's Raids) from Overthrowing the Pro Russian Federation Government of Syria the Russian Federation has deployed their Admiral Kuznetsov Aircraft Carrier Battle Group to the Russian Federation Port of Tartus at Syria. Previously, US Ally Israel established the Blockades to minimize the numbers of Hamas Foreign Fighters, Army of Islam Gaza, and the many Islamic Jihadists Organizations of Palestine from returning from the Autonomous Kurdistanis Region as the "Peace Flotillas" (as to why the Israelis Customs Agents (Law Enforcement) that boarded the ships got their arses whipped, as the Islamic Jihadists were previously trained in hand to hand combat, and the Israelis Customs Agents were not).
LOL. Hey, Generation X and Generation Y, this sh!t is all on you, as in less than 6 months most of us will be "Too Old" to ever be Recalled to Active Duty again and finally allowed to go back on Retirement again (line thru our Retirement Orders, Recalls to Active Duty). If you are 18 to 20 years old you will be about age 35* after all the training and operational experience before you are ready to replace us, not including the required languages and cultural training and operational experience based on your Area(s) of Operation.
*That is why the average age of the USN SEALs (RIP) that died in the CH-47 crash August 2011 here (Afghanistan) were about age 35.
Almost forgot, most of the above almost classified information can be verified at the US Department of State Internet Website at: http://www.state.gov/ If you look hard enough.
For the same reason Bush invaded Iraq after 9/11.
When in doubt blame the WRONG President.
Written Proof: US LAWS (with US Congressional Appropriations), it is NOT the US President's Job to create US Laws, that is the job of US Congress, it is also the Job of US Congress to find the money to fund the US Laws US Congress Creates. IT IS NOT THE US PRESIDENT'S JOB TO DECIDE WHICH US LAWS TO ENFORCE:
US LAW, H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" with US Congressional Appropriations, as demanded by President Clinton during his State of the Union Address to a joint Session of US Congress, 1998. Justification WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION, Section 2 "Findings" of US Law H.R.4655 (scroll down to Section 2 "Findings"):
http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/1057063/posts
It was President Clinton NOT President Bush that started that Weapons of Mass Destruction Crap with his 1998 State of the Union Address:
It was believed by President Clinton that Overthrowing President Hussein would "Liberate the Iraqis People". This is when we (US Military Asymmetric Warfare Teams) were sent into Iraq to buyhundreds of thousands of Shiites as assassins and insurgents to Overthrow President Hussein. After this failed, as they were turning each other in for rewards, and being apprehended, tried and executed as Traitors, with President Clinton stating, "Dictator Massacring His Own People".
After these measures failed we were sent in to conduct Target Damage Assessments before the start of Operation Desert Fox. President Clinton as Commander In Chief believed that attacking the Government of Iraq would mean no one left to negotiate, so the urban poor areas of Baghdad were targeted with US Airstrikes and Cruise Missile Attacks (with no input from us, overruled by Presidential/Commander In Chief Orders.). You NEVER ever mess with the poor of Islam, this is when the rest of the Islamic World started to call the US "The Great Satan".
We leave Iraq, and return to US Military Bases at Germany. We are deployed to other Missions.
Weeks after the 9/11 2001 Attacks we are sent to Afghanistan to Overthrow the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government (those millions of Pro USSR Afghans that fled to USSR backed Iran, and returned) that were providing Islamic Sanctuary to Osama Bin Laden, Al Quada, and supporting the Islamic Jihadist Training Camps. As just after the 1993 First World Trade Center Bombing, many Islamic Nations offered the capture and extradition of Osama Bin Laden to the US, like Gaddaffi (President Clinton's response to Gaddaffi's was to bomb the hell out of Libya).
After all the lesser means of US Law H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" (money still being appropriated by US Congress, 1998 to 2011, the US Law does NOT go away until the US Law is Accomplished). US Congress uses the Final Option, the US Military, by DECLARING WAR WITH IRAQ, with US Law, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution with US Congressional Appropriations. The only valid excuse for a US President to NOT enforce a US Law, is if there is no money (US Congressional Appropriations).
US Declaration of War With Iraq, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution:
uspolitics.about.com/od/wariniraq/a/jt_resolution.htm
Read this and read the comments below the Article (my involvement with Iraq, Afghanistan, etc. since the 1980s).
http://david393071.newsvine.com/_news/2011/10/17/8369272-iraq
Gee Dave,
I wasn't making a judgement, just stating a fact. Bush invaded Iraq primarily because they were suspected of developing weapons of mass destruction. Many elements in the world are currently talking about bombing Iran because they are...
suspected of developing weapons of mass destruction (nukes).
This doesn`t bode well for Somalian tourism;)
Don't worry. In Somalia, the Libertarian Paradise™, the free market will straighten things out. Individual entrepreneurship, unfettered by interference by a meddlesome government, will produce wealth, freedom, and a virtual heaven on earth.
Visiting a Muslim nation for tourism is most foolish!
Hey earlyout,
Go find a political site for that stuff.
Somalia is not a free market system. It is a failed state. The country went from colonial rule to a republic than "scientific socialism" which failed miserably and resulted in the failure of the state because socialism doesn't work. They ran out of other people's money (foreign aid). Said Barr, the ruler at the time, favored certain clans over others in government funding which led to an uprising and fighting among the clans. The country collapsed internally in 1990 and anarchy resulted because of a socialistic dictatorship. Don't believe the propaganda!
Anarchy is not libertarian state. Libertarian's believe in limited government and people to live their lives without government intervention except when their actions infringe on the rights of others. I live in Colorado, it is rank as the second most libertarian states. It is an awesome place to live. I don't need the government to tell my how to live my life. I am not that weak, and I don't infringe on the rights of others. It is not that hard.
Somalia is not a Muslim country, but I can pretty easily make the assumption that you're an American based on that view.
It absolutely is. There hasn't been a functional government there in over twenty years. There are no regulations or laws and everyone is free to trade as they wish. Somalia is exactly what an unfettered free market looks like.
First, ask the most prosperous countries in the world how they feel about socialism. I'm referring, of course, to Denmark, Norway, Sweden and Germany.
Second, the country failed due to the civil war where militants overthrew the government in a power grab. It had nothing to do with the economic system and everything to do with thirst for control. You say "don't believe the propaganda" but the facts are laid out bare.
Then I would ask what the population of those countires are?
Denmark 4.5 million
Norway 4.9 million
Sweden 9 million
Germany 82.5 million
So aside from Germany an entire countries social system is only responsible to care for the amount of people that live in one U.S. city. Now compare socialism on a much larger scale, as in the fall of U.S.S.R.
Secondly when you refer to those nations as socialist we are talking mostly about their social structure. All of those nations participate in the free market.
Alan Pugh: I can tell you're another garden variety intellectual quick to discount the fact of Islam's influence on the Somalian people. Good luck with that dribble....
Yeah...Let's get on that "blame the victim" bandwagon some more. He wasn't a tourist. He was there for his job and thought he had body guards to protect him. He wasn't just foolishly wandering around Somalia with a sign on his back that said "Kidnap Me." Give these victims a break. Put the focus where it should be and that is squarely on the perpetrators and those that do not do their job to see that they are brought to justice. This kidnap and pirate thing is out of control. If they can't do anything about it, then let us offer some help---SEAL help. Hell, they even know where he is and can't save him and others that have been captured months ago? I smell some stinking politicians and corrupt officials here. Very little of our food aid is getting to the right people anyway. Sick em!!!
colorblind,
An old friend from high school is actually a navy seal stationed in Africa. They stop a lot more pirates than the media reports.
Alan Pugh: Somalia is victim to the most brutal and repressive practices of Islam.
Bobby...I wish your friend well...and safety in his/her mission. I am glad they are there and hope they can do something to help this man. If not, it will not be for lack of trying, I'm sure. Thank you for the reply.
Bobby- socialism type programs can only work with higher IQ people that enjoy being productive. Once you get to having only 1/2 of adults paying income taxes like in the US the burden of leaches gets to be to much. Black africans pass thou many safe nations where they would have to work to eat to get free benefits.
Alan: What do you mean by ' not a Muslim country?' Do you mean a country where there is a recognized government which is dedicated to practicing a specific form of Islam and in which all other religions are deprecated and/or banned? Well, it is not that because the UN-recognized government is not that (dedicated to the enforcement of a single variety of Islam) but there are areas within the country where the recognized government has about the same level of authority over the populace that I do. It most assuredly IS a "Muslim country" in the sense that most of the population there is at least nominally affiliated with some form of Islam. Of course, in that sense the USA is a "Christian country" and most of us realize that is not actually the case.
That was pretty funny Early Out. Good point made.
Rlquall, yes... basically what you said. They're a Muslim country inasmuch as the United States is a Christian nation. I.e. not on paper as a form of law or rule, but indeed common in practice amongst the populace.
Bobby, the old population argument never ceases to bubble to the top of socialism arguments, nor does the myth that the USSR was a socialist nation.
First, the USSR was socialist in the same way that the United States is capitalist... in name only. In reality, both economies are governed by cronyism amongst the plutocracy, either friends and family of the rulers (in the USSR) or the revolving door between government and industry executives (in the USA). The only difference is that up until the last few years, the United States has mostly concealed their egregious behavior at the top while the USSR was always quite transparently corrupt.
Second, population has nothing to do with the strength of an economic system. If ten people have five homes in one square kilometer, it's no different than ten thousand people having five thousand homes in one thousand square kilometers. Toss a few zeroes on the end and you scale up to what we could have in the United States if we were more patient and altruistic, had Objectivism never ruined our ability to empathize.
You must be pretty young if it was just a couple years ago you realized there was corruption in the American economic system. Corruption is a human trait. In the U.S. more people are employed by small businesses than corporations. So you can't compare USSR complete control of the economic system to the U.S.
Yes population has everything to do with the strength of an economy. Population will put more stress on any form of government, thus creating problems with the economy. It's much better to have a system where people can be self sufficient and achieve. Opposed to a society that relies on it's government.
Our system not only increases the ability to empathize, it has created to most philanthropists the world has seen.
After the 1922 revolution Soviet leaders argued that one-party rule was necessary to ensure that capitalist exploitation would not return to the Soviet Union. They were also the first nation to develop a planned economy, which centralized all control of goods.
The irony is they tried to fix it in the 80's but it was too late. The economy didn't grow as fast as it should have do to the lack of opportunity. When you have lower population numbers, you have more opportunity in a socialized system. You also have a lot less mouths to feed.
I'm not going to spend too much time to address your (seemingly) intentional misreads, such as pretending I said I had "just realized" the corruption instead of pointing out that it was less transparent, or the assumption that I was comparing the two economic systems apples to apples as opposed to the fact that I was just pointing out that neither were pure systems due to cronyism, because I think most would be able to clearly see you're clouding the issues.
However, I will say that you've seriously misread what happened in the 1980s that led to the collapse of the USSR. The IMF and World Bank screwed over Russia pretty hard after Jeffrey Sachs went into their country and demanded neoliberal "reforms" as he had in many countries in the past. When they followed Sachs' rules, they required the same funding as any country that was being transformed by the neoliberal IMF and World Bank... and this time, those organizations didn't deliver. The country was screwed by the system that was pushing the privatized, every man for himself Austrian model that is currently collapsing the United States' economy. Even USSR's corrupt system would've been more stable than what we did to them.
Recommended reading for you: Disaster Capitalism by Naomi Klein.
Heading out for the evening. Cheers!
STOP being just like a F**ked up US Politicians (All Parties), Volunteering others to do what you yourself refuse to do.
US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces (US Army Special Forces, USAF STTs, USMC MARSOC, USN SEALs, etc.) DO NOT just grow on trees as Strategic Assets. Neither does SAD. It takes DECADES of Training and then proving you are trained thru Operational Experience before you are even experienced enough just to survive long enough to gain experience.
This is just like it takes DECADES to implace credible verifiable intelligence assets within Nations. Intelligence usually independently verified by US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces thru Special Reconnaissance (with or without uniforms) as well as being sometimes attached to SAD to conduct "Para Military" (non Official US Military) Actions. This is why the US Intelligence and US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces still have NOT recovered from the President Clinton Gutting of the US Intelligence Agencies (that according to the US Congressional 9/11 Commission left the US Blind to the 9/11 2001 Attacks and having to rely on Intelligence from "Potentially Hostile Nations" (like Jordan and Pakistan)), and the Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces (RIFs) of the US Military and why our arses kept getting Recalled to Active Duty (Our Replacements were never trained, maybe by 2014 our successors (if they survive) will be ready to continue here (Afghanistan) after the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces withdraw in 2014, as our successors will be here (Afghanistan) for Decades after the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces withdraw.).
After the President Clinton Gutting of US Intelligence Agencies most Potentially Hostile and Hostile Nations have deployed more Counter Intelligence to stop the US from rebuilding Intelligence Assets in their Nations.
Colorblind-2498596, go sign up now, volunteer for Coronado. And that is only the start of your training to wear the Eagle and Trident. And if you are a US Military Officer you might get your arse sent to everyone else's Asymmetric Warfare Forces Schools just so that you can lead the Joint Asymmetric Warfare Forces of the US Army, USAF, USMC, and USN as a Task Force; as well as the Basics US Army Air Assault School, US Army Airborne School, US Army or USMC Sniper School, USN or US Army Divers School, etc. and you still must maintain the Requirements of the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces (Advanced Course, Command and General Staff, War College; advanced US Civilian College Degrees (Masters, Doctorate), etc. or be RIFed or QMP'ed (Qualitative Management Program) as in thrown out of the US Military.
David...You don't know a damn thing about me and should not assume that you do. I am a 60 year old retired nurse. I worked in the Kosovar refugee camps and have spent most of my career in ERs and ORs. The last five years I worked in a prison. I retired because I had cancer and had to have surgery that limited my ability to work the 12 hours shifts that were required. I have been licensed for over 38 years, therefore devoted the majority of my life to caring for the sick and injured. I believe in our military and those that serve and am grateful that they are willing to make the sacrifices to serve this country. While in Kosovo, some very challenging situations occurred and I believe that a military crew chief saved my sanity and possibly my life. My son served as a crew chief in Germany....My only son. Take your political crap and place it where the sun is not likely to penetrate.
I know enough about you based on your post of:
As far as age, you can come here (Afghanistan) and work with the Red Crescent (aka Red Cross) as well as my US Military Physician's Assistants of the Teams to provide Medical Treatments to the Afghans. Your skills could be used with the Foward Combat Surgical Teams or the Hospital at Bagram AFB, etc.. Take a rough guess how old most of us (survivors) are (why we will be too old in less than 6 months to ever be Recalled to Active Duty again, eventhough we are considered "Special Category" just like the US Military Medical Service Corps MD, age 69; except our physical burn out is at a lower maximum age (must pass Physical Fitness Tests, minimum would be US Army Ranger PT Test)). As far as working 12 hours, we would not expect you to do that (known degradation of physical capabilities from our training (sleep deprivation) and experiences).
As far as "Political Crap" pertaining to President Clinton that is what happened as Historically Documented, as well as my Firsthand Experience surviving his Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces of the US Military.
And what does "My son served as a crew chief in Germany....My only son." Have to do with anything, as when we are not deployed our "Home Station" is US Military Installations at Deutscheland, with President Obama cutting 10,000 US Military from Germany (ask your son). During my days with the Intermediate Range Nuclear Forces (INF) after my deployments, I was doing Retrogrades of the US Nuclear Weapons and was on over 130 Special Air Missions (SAMs), and walked away from three crashes, as well as a emergency landing at Greenland in a USAF C-141. In less than 6 months we will be returning to Deutscheland for our Debriefings and AARs (After Action Reports), for about a month, as the last time as Joint Forces Task Force. So what is your point, you want me to talk your son into joining our support Aviation, the 160th SOAR; I can talk with their Commander and write a Letter of Recommendation (after I interview your son, I will let him know that he must graduate from the US Military Aviator's version of the US Army Q Course (US Army Special Forces)). And if you want me to say "So What", my younger sister was sent to Bosnia while stationed at Spangdahlem AFB, Germany and got her stup!d arse shot at many times and she is a USAF Officer (Not trained in Ground Combat) now a O-5.
Get over your Political Partisanship. President Clinton got many US Military and US Intelligence Killed Unnecessarily. Like when we went in Blind (no intelligence asset link ups) into Iraq in 1998 attached to SAD in accordance with H.R.4655, to hire hundreds of thousands of Shiites at Iraq (my first "Middle East" Language Farsi) as assassins and insurgents to Overthrow President Hussein. Which Failed because they were turning each other in for rewards; those captured were tried and executed as Traitors, then thrown in mass graves. President Clinton then spun this to "Dictator Massacring His Own People" (caption on the Photos, with Shiite widows crying at the Mass Graves). Why the H3LL do you think US Military Operation Gothic Serpent failed, can you say President Clinton's Gutting of the US Intelligence Agencies leaving us blind at Somalia.
Repeat the same mistakes of President Clinton and expect a different result is what President Obama is doing. RESULTS Matter not the Reelection speechs of any US Politician, that does not give a F**K after they leave Office. Example:
"A Travel Warning is also issued when the U.S. Government's ability to assist American citizens is constrained due to the closure of an embassy or consulate or because of a drawdown of its staff."
http://www.travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/tw/tw_1764.html
You want more examples of Results not your US Politicians words. How about the "US Military Forces have left Iraq" baloney, as the US Military currently protecting the 104 Acres (think how many US Military required, including to conduct preemptive combat patrols to keep snipers, rockets and mortars out of range) of US Embassy Compound as attached to the US Department of State and US Diplomatic Corps. My Brother In Law just returned Stateside from that assignment.
David...Actually, I am an independent...Not political partisan at all. I think that both sides of the aisle in Congress is crap. As for coming to Afghanistan...I already volunteered to do that just before I was diagnosed with cancer and they declined my services. I also volunteered for Northwest Medical Teams and was accepted, but was too sick to go...in that case it would have been Honduras. If you are in Afghanistan, I regret that you are there and I appreciate the sacrifices that you have made and those of your family in order to serve your country and fellow soldiers. I wouldn't send any soldier into harms way unless I thought that they could complete the mission with as few casualties as possible. In fact, I wish our dead beat govt. would bring you home. There is no mission of value in Afghanistan--only the chance that you or your fellow soldiers will be picked of by a group of people that are willing to die just so you can die with them. I admire your service...but, in my way, I too have served. I might guess that I have seen as much senseless blood and horror as you may have--I hope so. I want you safe...Even though you seem to believe that, unless you have served in the military, you are a useless piece of trash that has no clue. Someone has to take care of you when you come home and that would be people like me. The horrors of war are not confined to the front lines...sadly. I want this piracy to stop. I think that, if anyone can do it, it would be our brave men and women that are highly trained as you likely are. You have no reason to insult me and make assumptions when you know little of what I have done with my life. It hasn't all been rosy and comfortable either. Regardless, come home safe when you can and try to have some faith in those that are too old or sick to continue to contribute to humanity, but have as best they can for as long as they could.
Colorblind-2498596,
Being the Officer in Command of my Dysfunctional Family (the family I never had), it is my personal mission to bring them home, and back to you (their families).
I am sorry to hear about your cancer, is it in remission. How about genetic tailored cancer treatments if not.
You do know we need your skills here. Most of us are overwhelmed (yes, I was also trained as a Physician's Assistant as most of us are to conduct our US Military Asymmetric Warfare Humanitarian Assistance Mission and we never know how far away we will be from the nearest Medical Professionals).
I hope not, I would NEVER wish that on anyone. I never discuss this with anyone when I get Stateside.
It was never intended as an insult; but, when you live with the locals for years of consecutive tours you do see the really uninformed things that the US Citizens believe, especially the US Politicians, like "Afghan Mud huts", "Afghans Live in Caves"; and things like never having seen thousands of Iranians covering a battlefield, so many that you cannot see the ground, as killed or wounded while charging US Ally Iraqis Machineguns supported by Iraqis mortars, and Iraqis Artillery during the Iran Iraq Wars. Or the Afghan children missing fingers, limbs, eyes, ears, noses, just because they were caught by the Taliban with a pencil or pen that we gave them. So you tell me that the US Public has a clue, "We should not be at Afghanistan", without realizing that we abandoned the Afghans before to get massacred by the Taliban and when I say we, I was on the US Military Training Teams attached to SAD during Operation Cyclone, so here we are once again planning to abandon US Ally Afghanistan again.
After the US Military f**ked up my US Civilian Careers (2nd Career Teacher, and 3rd Career Retail Manager) with all of these Recalls to Active Duty, I started my own Business (currently at two States). Most of us once we leave Germany and go to our Stateside final Outprocessing and Retirement Briefings are going to remain low profile (never to be found again to be Recalled. we know how to disappear). Some of us are going to be accepting the Earned Citizenship of other Nations or "European Outs".
As serious question, Colorblind-2498596, who would you believe, a 30 year old still living with his parents, or someone over 50 years old that survived this long going thru all the sh!t here:
http://david393071.newsvine.com/_news/2011/10/17/8369272-iraq
http://david393071.newsvine.com/_news/2012/01/03/9928679-iran-2009-to-2012-straight-of-hormuz
By the way it was NEVER my intention to get into this sh!t, I wanted only to be a US Military Officer sitting at a desk.
Doctor or store manager - give it a rest before too many illiterate Archie Bunkers are whipped into a lather.
David...You didn't cause my cancer and your suggestions will not cure it. It doesn't matter. I've seen old and am not anxious to join the ranks. I didn't cause what happened to you and I cannot cure it either. You are getting close to aging out and you don't know what to do with yourself. Like me, your purpose and mission in life will be gone. You are one angry sob...at just about everyone that you have ever met or identified with...with the exception, maybe, of the soldiers under your command. Take a vacation....Wouldn't advise Somalia. Don't bs me...You were NEVER the type to want to lead from behind a desk...Not even in your genes. Stop mixing the crap in with the good stuff. You are intelligent, no doubt, but you are also one judgmental officer--if that is what you still are. Jaded is an understatement. No matter what happened to you, if you lose your humanity, you have lost it all.
Heck, I thought everyone who hated taxes would be lined up to go. You know this is one of those utopia's that don't have income tax!
Indeed. After all, isn't this just a private contractual matter between the kidnappers and the victim's family? No need for any nasty "regulation."
Monaco has no income tax on individuals. It's a bit closer to the Utopia than Somalia.
telcogirl,
I was thinking the same thing as you, except for the substitution of taxes with handouts. They have developed next to no industry, next to no recognizable exports, unexploited natural resources. Their only thing that could be considered as a major source of income is taking from others that which is not theirs and redistributing it to those that choose not to work but instead live off others endeavors.
A virtual liberal mecca!
Wrong lesson, Jarhead. When there's no government, it's impossible for private enterprise to accomplish anything. No industry can be created, no exports can take place, and natural resources can't be tapped.
Since they want to Rob people who have and give to people who don't have, Maybe Oblamea should go there and he can do as he wants.
Hell we have a Communist Terrorist in the White House and he will probably win again this election.
EarlyOut,
That is not correct. Private enterprise does not exist only when there is a government. Private enterprise exists DESPITE government. Speaking of lessons are you unfamiliar with the building of the west here in the United States? It was lawless, it was brutal, and it was dangerous; but yet industry grew, natural resources WERE tapped, and government followed as the people followed.
Why dont you just admit the fact that this man was there to HELP with building a deep water port, something that would have benefitted what you just stated was not possible without a government. It seems to me that the issue is not a lack of government it is a lack of moral fiber within the people of that country that has devolved into a complete lack of respect for life and personal property.
What do ya mean jarhead? They've got a booming pirate industry that exploits the abundant resources of the sea, and they export jihadists all around the world. This is what small government looks like.
yuba2000 is absolutely correct. This is, indeed, exactly what "small government" produces. Really appealing, isn't it?
Actually Yuba2000 and Earlyout are both wrong! Period. The problem is the extremist government in Somalia, not a small government or a non-existent one. The government of Somalia is starving those that are not of their liking and so the moral outrage is against that rather than the pirates. The type of government they have should look like Paradise to both of you. It is the example of what you want in a government. You want them to have total control and you want the government to give you your due. But should you protest it and want a change you will be beaten and starved and not allowed to leave. You guys need to broaden your very narrow view as you have apparently never done any sort of research into what governments do as they grow larger and more restrictive, "for the good of the people".
Such BS from the uninformed!
And what do any of your comments have to do with the illegal activities of pirates and kidnappers? The priates attack ships in international waters and kidnappers take people without recourse.
Your wonderful government didn't stop the 9 year old from being kidnapped in CO did it?
Some people just don't understand Jarhead. It's the result of blind political rhetoric.
How great is life in China for individuals who live under a big government? Or better yet North Korea where government controls everything.
Oops reason and logic.
they don`t have any of anything that makes the world go round.
People please stop picking on liberals, they don't understand and never will, its beyond their ability to reason.
The only way to fix Somalia is to get rid of it.
Actually Jarhead(what an approiate name) I don't think they are robbing the rich to give to the poor. So, no that country wouldn't fall under the heading of socialist.
Agewithout wisdom, Your name says it all. According to your wisdom, warlords, pirates, terrorist training camps, and famine are all thriving because the Somali government is too big? WTF?
Telogirl...Well...It is hard to have an income tax when most of the people don't have income to tax.
colorblind,
Duh.. that's why people who make money need to take care of people who don't. Ahh Utopia....
Somalia doesn't have "small government" it is a failed state. Clearly you don't know the difference between decentralized government and virtual anarchy.
Exactly. No modern economy, free-market or otherwise, can exist without some form of government. No one to enforce contracts on otherwise ensure payment. No medium of exchange, and being limited to barter prevents economic development beyonc a certain point. No infastructure prevents any real quantity of goods getting to markets any appreciable distance from each other. No law enforcement to prevent the "redistribution of wealth" from the poorly-armed and less violent to the better-armed and more violent. Anarchy isn't the ultimate form of liberty, but rather the ultimate form of tyranny.
Yuba2000,
Try reading the post again. I suggested you would enjoy it because it is the type of controlling government you seem to adore. But more important was the last line that you seemed to have missed. What about the government that allowed a 9 year old girl to be kidnapped in CO? You think government should have stopped it?
Sure, however, they do have Al Sheebah, that will shake you down for your Mandatory Islamic Tithes (Islamic Taxes), perverted from the required 2% of everything you have, to the more you give the more Muslim (Subjugated to Islam) you are; and no it does not only pertain to Islamic Believers (Christians, Jews, Unbelievers required to pay the Mandatory Islamic Tithes at most Islamic Nations in accordance with current Islamic Laws based on the Holy Koran (Quran) Sura 9 (all of Sura 9 as not to be taken out of context.). FYI: Mandatory Islamic Tithes are not only monetary. example: After you gave everything (like your male children as Islamic Jihadists and females as indentured servants) your arse must join the Islamic War Against the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers.
This is what happens when you take away the Individual Right to possess firearms, the "Civilians" cannot protect themselves, and the Government Law Enforcement cannot be everywhere at the same time (most Law Enforcement do not believe that they are paid enough to get killed or their families killed or threatened). Same happened at the Sudan (Darfur), here (Afghanistan), Iraq, Philippines (Moro Islamic Liberation Front), Malaysia, etc.. OR it is hack hack slash slash cut cut (bullets cost money) like what the Arabic Omani Muslims did to the Peaceful African Islamic Believers at the Sudan (massacred by the hundreds a day, millions to date) for refusing to attack the Christians (Sudan, Darfur), as still a lesson to all Islamic Believers Worldwide as what will happen to you for not Obeying (Heard it all before when the Imans at the Mosques here incited the Islamic Believers to violently riot, as also stating the Pastor at Florida HAD (past tense) burned the Holy Koran (Quran), not Threatened to.). Most Islamic Believers at Islamic Nations know the true meaning of the Main Islamic Celebration of Ramadan, while most at the US do not know or do not want to admit this; example: Historically, the Islamic Believers were too busy Fighting morning till evening to eat, as to why they are allowed during Ramadan to eat before sunrise and after sunset. Ramadan also celebrates the Islamic Believers defeating the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers defenders of the City of Mecca (Makkah), Jewish defenders at Khaybar, Battle of Mu'tah, Khuza'ah, etc..
Some of you really need to go sign up NOW, and in the future be assigned to US Military AFRICOM, so that you can get some real world experience with Somalia (count me out, been there saw that already). And again to you Female Journalists at Islamic Nations you have been warned before COVER YOUR F**KING HAIR, as "every hair showing is a dagger to the eyes of Allah" per current Islamic Laws. Beating and Rape as a form of Islamic Subjugation (including Male anal rape, like done to the male Taxi Cab Drivers at Tajikistan, bent over their Taxi Cabs and anal raped in Public for previously driving supply trucks to Afghanistan for NATO.); same as happened to my southwest to the Doctors and Nurses "Aid Workers" that were warned to stay out of our Area of Operations (we cannot be everywhere when you do not listen to us, then do stup!d sh!t anyway without our knowledge), beaten, anal raped, then executed. AND for your own sake (your lives) paint over all the "Crusaders Crosses" (Red Cross) with Red Crescents, that does include all your Medical supplies.
David...What do you want from this forum? You are obviously a very intelligent and well educated and well traveled person, but you have no respect for any one or any thing that hasn't been through what you have endured. Why are you so angry with us? Not everyone has the ability to do what you have done and you should be very proud of your accomplishments. Not everyone has what it takes to be a soldier. That doesn't mean that they are worthless or stupid. Some are very productive people that admire our military and are hard working and good people. You seem so angry at the world. Why are you still doing what you are doing? I really don't understand your disregard for anyone that is not a experienced soldier.
telcogirl
I don't think that you understand that by stating that "Jarhead" is an appropriate name for me you just complimented me. Next time you may want to try and inform yourself on what a term means BEFORE trying to use it in a derogatory manner.
Also, I NEVER said anything about Socialism, I stated that it was a liberals mecca, taking that which is not yours because you do not have it and feel you are entitled to it. I would never use the term socialism to refer to the Liberals/progressives in the United States, the term "socialist" is entirely too complimentary.
Somalia is such a tourist hot spot this time of year... in fact I decided not to take the wife and kids to Disneyworld this year and we are headed to Mogadishu in a couple of weeks!!!
I don't think I'd do that. Maybe some nice place in the good old USA would be safer for your children.
Jeff,
You can still ride "Pirates of the Mediterranean!"
why not just visit the local zoo
HE WASN'T A TOURIST. Read the article. He was there on a job and had hired people he thought would protect him. If you don't want to read the story, fine. But, then don't make comments about Disney Land.
How to stop this? $10,000,000 fine and 25 years in jail to anyone/any corporation that pays a ransom.
Yeah... and if it was someone in YOUR family, what would you be saying?
well if it was uncle jane...they could just keep him...
MSCOTT -- going to lock up an entire corporation? Oh, yeah, I forgot, corporations are people, too!
Stupid is as stupid does...
It would be a great place to visit if it weren't a complete @!$%#hole.
The majority on this thread have it right. Barry used the quote I was thinking about. What a moron, I think I will go to the most dangerous place on east to consult on a deep water port. What, so they can bring n larger pirate boats?
No kidding. With a deepwater port, they could hold the REALLY big tankers for ransom.
Just goes to show ya, they don't think things out. a deep water port would be good for their business! bigger ships bigger ransom. Somalis make poor business decisions. the guy was their to help and they kidnap him before he does the work; they should have waited till he finished.
Has it occurred to you that a deep water port might bring a better economy, more jobs, and less starvation to this country? Instead, you people are hell bent on blaming the victim. You want to live in your little protected suburbia while the rest of the world actually wants to see what they can do to assist these countries in making a better life for their starving people. Yes, some people go into harms way for things or causes they believe in. It doesn't mean they deserve to be kidnapped and tortured. Put the blame where it belongs--on the perps.
Sorry, colorblind,
But I've seen what happened when we "see what they can do to assist these countries in making a better life for their starving people". Ask david string-o-numbers about running the Mogadishu Mile.
That sh!t was not funny then and is not funny now. A US Military decimated by President Clinton's Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces of the US Military with minimal personnel left to accomplish any Mission and having to rely on the other Nations Military Forces. What was not depicted in the movies was just how many of us were running for our lives, ditching our empty weapons, empty equipment, still being shot at, picking up AKs and returning fires, etc. and what was happening external to Mo (Mogadishu).
Colorblind-2498596,
Ask yourself why Fundamentalist Islamic Al Sheebah, destroyed all the "Modern", "Western", "Non Islamic" irrigation, farming, etc. built during UN Mission Somalia I and UN Mission Somalia II to stop the cycles of droughts and famine. Same crap the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government did here (Afghanistan) after they massacred the 20,000 to 50,000 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen (US Allies we (US Military attached to SAD) were ordered to abandoned) destroying the Electric Power Stations, trying to fill in the US Built Irrigation Canals, etc.. Same kind of crap that happened at the Sudan. Why do you think the Pakistanis Taliban, Army of Islam (not the Pakistanis Government Military) were stopping all external Aid after the Flood. Again Islam's use of Starvation as a Weapon.
And speaking of Disneyland, as to where all the Idealistic Academics of the US live at, with absolutely NO Real World Life or Death Experience of the School of Hard Knocks.
74...I understand your point of view and know that you are entitled to your opinion. Still, the blame does not rest with the victims. It is on the shoulders of the scum that perpetrate these horrible acts on innocent civilians...and soldiers. Somalia wouldn't be my first choice for a place to go either.
David...I have spent plenty of time in the classrooms of hard knocks....dead babies, maimed children, terminally ill people, grieving families, AIDS non survivors, TB patients, rotten shifts, working holidays, nights, and weekends, mandatory overtime, completed suicides, PTSD victims. Then, of course, there was the alcoholic mother and unavailable father that raised me....Not exactly a Brady Bunch upbringing. So, you make assumptions about people based on the comments on a public vine? Not very bright...Even just a tad cruel...Because you are sooooo much better than the rest of us peons, right? I didn't serve in the military....but I wiped enough butts to consider that I have done my time for humanity.
wtf was he doing there in the first place ,and why would we want somalia to have a "deep water port" for ? more pirate ships to dock or to park the large ships that get captured ??......if anything we should be filling in there ports with cement and seal them in for good :P
Mark S,
My feelings exactly. Did a little reading, and Hobyo is like pirate central with no form of government or economy other than piracy. Perhaps, the "American/German engineer" has more formidable employment. Can you say CIA! It is an election year, and nothing warms the heart of voters more than rescued kidnap(ees).
That's where we ought to go to war. A couple years ago Israel went to war with one of its neighbors over a kidnapped soldier. You have international piracy, international kidnapping and no government to ask for permission to get them. We should stop aid to countries that either encourage or allow such actions against people we send to help them. As for the companies making money building bridges etc. we have bridges here that the money could be used on instead of sending it to these countries.
So how many more Americans need to go there and be kidnapped before we wake up and stay home. Going there is like you are looking to be kidnapped and maybe killed. No amout of money makes a trip like this woth it.
We still owe them for what they did to our troops back in the early 90's.
Where's Seal Team Six when you need them, huh? Probably being used to clean up after the Bush Administration i.e. The Bin Laden Assassination
Like it or not, at least Bush had enough balls to put on a Uniform, unlike the Community Organizer in Chief.
Hey D O G Bush has been gone for three years now. Can't you find someone else to Blame, Like OBLAMEA.
If you people were awake in the 90's when Terrorist were bombing our Embassies , World Trade Center, Khobar Towers and The USS Cole and NOTHING was being done about it.
You People are AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMAZING.
Hey buckyboy, Don't forget the marine barracks in Bierut in '83. All Reagan did was cut and run.
Um, XDm9mm, George W. Bush put on a uniform only for photo ops. His so-called "service" in the National Guard was not exactly a distinguished record, especially he was usually a no-show.
NOt really, If I remember right back in 83 when Reagan Bombed Qaddafi and the Liberals went NUTS.Because of this,
Cut and Run is when carter was in, I am sorry ,he never cut and Run, he just never knew what to do.
A real lame brain.
Hey buckyboy ( I like saying that), Sorry, can't spin that one away. Beirut is in Lebanon, Not Libiya. And that bombing raid was in '86 in response to the disco bombing in Berlin. And Carter has been out of office for 32 years now, can't you find anyone else to blame? I bet you can, let me guess.
If we all stay the hell out of other peoples business there would be more room to drop a nuke !!! resettle after the fall out.
What the hell yuba , your blaming Reagan, He has been DEAD for how many years now.
BUT still yet ,Tell ME what did Clinton do about TERRORIST when he was in Office?????
You named one , I named Four and I forgot about the Empty Aspirin factory he Blew up with no one in it because of Monica testifying that day.
Hey buckyboy, Who is the "TERRORIST" you are referring to. And don't go start blaming Monica.
What was this American even doing there? For what? Why do people in this country want to go to the most dangerous hot spots on the globe only to end up in a situation like this. I just don't understand.
Don't go there , Go to Mexico, It's closer. Or Detroit, Washington DC. LA. Philadelphia,
You can even go to Durham NC, they omly had 350 crimes in 20 days, BUT crime is on the way down.
REALLY.
I'm from Detroit.... Aint neva scured. Didn't say 50% of us are literate, but we are not scared.
Somalia is just a drag on the world. Someone should do the world a favor and turn the whole damn country into an ash pile. No one would miss it and sure as hell would not care.
You have no compassion Lightning Rod-412029! It pains me to know there are people like you in the world!
What the hell good is compassion!? if you don't toast them at least spay and nutter the whole damn country, so the problem will die off in a few years, then the Palestinians can move in and have a country to call their own. solve two problems. at any rate stop bringing them over here.
Patriots? Compassion for Somalia or Somalis?
Somalis
Hopefully AU and Allies kick these savages asses once and for all.
There is always someone willing to go and try to earn a living somewhere bad. Me, Over the Rhine in Cincinnati is as bad a place as I want to go for that.
Somalia is one of those places that would qualify for a bombing to moonscape approach IMO. Perfect place to drop cluster bombs by the hundreds of millions..
This guy is smart enough to become an engineer, yet stupid enough to venture into SOMALIA?
You must be kidding!
Engineers are smart in few areas, not too smart with common sense. I will take a good man with common sense over one with lots of brains when I work on projects. I have son-in-law with not a lick of sense, but wizard with computers.
I heard that Einstein couldn't tie his own shoes.
Uhmmm.... here's an idea.
MS13 and the Crips and several other "gangs" are always looking to stake out their own territories; How about any that get arrested get a one way ticket to Somalia, and when they deplane give them a Glock 17, an M4 and a few magazines for each and bid them a fond farewell. Let the little gang-bangers deal with people that have known nothing but war since birth. That should show them just how bad bad really is.
Then we would have drug crazed pirates!
Fists would fly if these roaches didn't have me in a recliner for the Giants / Niners game Sunday night. I'd give them an advance on the ransom money for a Season Pass and a DirectTV hook up. And if this thing drags on and they think I'm missing the Masters in April, oh it's on like donkey kong...
If you go to Somalia, you are either CIA or plain crazy!
i'm want'n to go there now...i got the plain crazy down pat...
Or plain Stupid!
Why does the politicians of the world put up with this. As long as nothing is ever done about this, nothing will change. We need to send troops to bring order to this. Maybe when there is a presence of authority there will be less chanced of abductions and piracy.
I volunteer to send ... YOUR SON!
where ya goin dear?? i'm going to somalia marge....okee dokee have fun !!! what a friggin dumbarse...