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Subscribe to RSSThe U.S. ambassador to Afghanistan on Tuesday condemned rumors that the United States is planning to divide the war-torn country, saying the suggestions were "lies that dishonor the sacrifice of more than 1,800 American service members who have died in the cause of a unified Afghanistan."
Ambassador Ryan Crocker said in a statement that a "free and independent media plays a vital role in any democracy" and that Afghanistan's media and the Afghan government spokespersons were "important elements in our close bilateral relationship."
But he then went on to say that, "rumors that the United States has a plan to divide Afghanistan or change its form of government are, frankly speaking, lies that dishonor the sacrifice of more than 1,800 American service members who have died in the cause of a unified Afghanistan, governed by its Constitution."
And he added that the idea "that the United States is seeking a secret deal with the Taliban at the expense of the Afghan government and people" was "another false and absurd rumor."
'Democratic and unified'
Crocker stressed that the United States was "committed to supporting the efforts of the central government, to build a strong, secure, democratic, and unified Afghanistan."
"We have no other aim or goal," he added, pointing out that American taxpayers had provided billions of dollars over the past decade to support "the government and people of Afghanistan."
Crocker appeared to be addressing reports in the Afghan media, although The New York Times also reported Thursday last week that Afghan officials were worried about the possibility the Taliban might make a "secret deal" with the United States.
"Afghanistan and the United States both support a peace process for Afghanistan. But only Afghans can decide the future of Afghanistan," he added, according to the statement. "For a peace process to succeed, Afghans must talk to Afghans."
He noted that Afghan President Hamid Karzai had spoken in support of the idea of the Taliban opening an office in Qatar, seen as key for peace talks to go ahead.
Afghanistan's sole music academy, The Afghanistan National Institute of Music, teaches its students music with the hope it will bring comfort and healing and the revival of a rich musical legacy disrupted by war. NBC's Cheryll Simpson reports.
But Crocker said "nothing has been concluded on the opening of an office" and that the Afghan Taliban had to give a "clear statement ... against international terrorism and in support of a peace process to end the armed conflict in Afghanistan" before it could open.
"And for reconciliation to take place, we are in full agreement with the Government of Afghanistan that three conditions must be met by the Taliban and other armed insurgents: a complete break with al-Qaida; an end to violence; and respect for the Afghan constitution, including its protections for women and minorities," he added, according to the statement.
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A waste of American lives. To think we would want anything to do with these tribal scum
is a joke.
You got that right. We spent so much money and time there and in the end they will be anti-American anyways.
Can't we just bomb Waristan province and then leave?
Why have you stayed 10+ years in their country if you hate them so? That is the answer you should seek.
You seem to forget that on the day after 9/11, it was AFGHANS who stood up for America in armed revolt against the so-called 'talib' reign of terror and protection of al Qaeda and their bloodthirst and blasphemous 'anti-prophet', Osama bin Laden, whose rotting corpse lies at the bottom of the sea.
We owe a debt of gratitude to the Lion of Panjshir, to Dr. Abdullah, and to those brave Afghan men, women, and children who supported them and brought defeat to the murderous 'talib' dictators and their equally murderous al Qaeda muharibun 'guests'.
It was a waste of US lives and money, just like Iraq. Busch, Cheney and the rest of the neocon chickenhawks should be tried for getting our country in these stupid wars.
Commonsense...
I don't think they actually just stood up right after 9-11, there were already factions fighting the Taliban prior to 9-11 in a small portion of the country, we just aligned ourselves with them after 9-11....and yes, there are many Afghanis that we should be thankful to for their support, but since this is a tribal society, it really depends on who you are engaging when deciding whether or not we call them friend, enemy or nuetral.
Untold billions of dollars say we DO want something to do with them ...
So is it going to be North and South Afghanistan or West and East Afghanistan?
Once we pull out of Afghanistan the country will descend into a state of lawlessness for at least a while. Then it will be a matter of whether the Taliban or the Pakistanis take control. Karzai's government is weak and completely ineffectual with very little authority or control outside of the capitol of Kabul. The other cities and provinces are basically under the control of local tribal chiefs and warlords. It really does not make sense for us to remain in Afghanistan any longer since all we are doing is delaying the inevitable. It is past time to cut our losses and bring or troops some from this @!$%#-hole of a country.
See perfect example of the news dictating your life. No facts to back it up and you eat it all . Jump on the wagon before you can even say if it is true or not.
Just a wonderful situation. A waste of lives and a waste of taxpayer money. So nice that a bunch of fools and charlatans want to do the same crap all over again in Iran. Brilliant!
We don't want anything to do with tribal scum . The US is only interested in the Opium being produced . Why do you think we are still there or even went in the first place .. The Taliban stopped the growing of poppies and making opium causing a world wide shortage of heroin . The crap they grow in Mexico doesn't even come close to what is produced in Afghanistan and there isn't enough being produced in East Asia . The DEA/CIA had to restart Afghan production because it's such a big money maker for them and now they completely control the market .
"Lies" ?
What about this Administration sending 12,000 troops into Libya recently (and yet to be reported by MSNBC) when Mr. Obama stated otherwise on SEVERAL occasions ?
The "lies" on splitting Afghanistan need to be investigated.
The "truth meter" continues to be broken by this Administration.
Where are your facts, when you claim that the media is "dictating our lives"? I don't know about you, but reading and responding to an article does not change my life in any way whatsoever.
If we want to be the Police of the world, then we need to be compensated. We get one half of each country. No other country, would do this. Imagine, Russian Cop, China Cop. Killing off our poor kids so rich kids can reproduce? Ron Paul is right in that Congress has to declare War, for us to legally enter into war. Our war based economy is about to crash.
Many people are naive enough to let the media "dictate" or "manipulate" their thought at least. Take for instance the presidential candidates....
For one to think that the US gov't doesnt lie....or any gov't for that matter, is just ignorant. Not everythng in the media is a lie, nor is it the truth. However the news is not news anymore....it is just $$$ for the media, and they will twist and turn whatever it is that they can, to increase $$$. The Iraq war was televised like it was the Superbowl. ratings and profits were up big time!
whatever sordid information that the media provides is done because it's what the people want. Just like reality shows such as the Kardashians or Jersey Shore. They wouldn't last 3 episodes if they had no following. It's you that is the naive one. The secret of doing business, ANY business, is to give the people what they want.
Bruno Tam... right f**king on, my brother... dont expect the nitwits on this website to understand it tho
It'll be Left and Right Afghanistan, just like the Good ol' USA!
Why are we still there?
Billions of dollars lost, stolen and wasted and the only ones coming out smelling like roses is China who was busy making deals for these countries minerals and oil. LOL
Seem like we are now fighting for China to profit doesn't it? LOL
The T'publicondinos won't allow us to even spend money on our own infrastructure or think our own people in our own country are worthy of any public safety nets, a Medicare For All health care coverage, rather we should have a miniscule to no government ,no rules, regulations or oversight and be more like Afghanistan. LOL
Peace....
Sounds like some of that "back channel" negotiating. Thank you Mr. President. No, I did not vote for you. I will not vote for you but you are still my president and I disagree with you.
The real issue is what is happening in Iraq. Under Sadaam, a Sunni minority controlled the entire country and brutalized the Kurdish minority and the Shiite majority alike. They even made the Shiites fight against the only Shiite country in the world, Iran. But then came the US like a bul in a china shop. In the First Gulf War, it was recognized that deposing Sadaam would create a power vacuum that could never work out in any way that favored the US. So GHW Bush and company stopped with only tying a knot in his tail. But along came the Second Gulf War without any pretentions of intelligence and undid the knot.
Not Iraq will very much likely split into three partitions. The Kurdish north is well organized and has significant oil and can pretty much fend off all comers. They will become independent and immediately start trying to consolidate the Kurds in Turkey into their homeland. The Sunni's in the west will end up a minority with zero oil and will probably become a puppet state of Syria (or whatever replaces the current Syrian government.) This will become a poverty-stricken pocket of anti-American jihad. The Shiite majority will eventually become a puppet state of the only Shiite country, Iran. Iran will get all of Iraq's oil except that in the north in Kurdistan. Iran will strike a deal with the Kurds that Iran will not oppose their oil or nationalism if they leave Iran out of it. This is moving along so rapidly that most analysts estimate that it will be mostly in place within five years.
Now the people in Afghanistan are paying attention. They are figuring that this is how the US wanted it all long since the situation was well-known at the end of the First Gulf War. It takes little for them to decide that the end result in Afghanistan will be the same as the end result in Iraq. And they will believe that it is what the US wanted all along.
Everybody seems to forget the influence of China. They have done a lot to develop the economy and are still doing it. They get a lot of resources in the process.
We had our chance to divide the country back in 2001 when Iran offered to assist. The North, largely Shia could have had autonomy no different than the Kurds could in Iraq. We moreover could have changed the face of Middle East politics, thru better dialogue. This is today is one of the many outcomes of having a stupid president who knew little and cared little for Muslim culture. The Pashtu here are tribal. They were always a waste of time. Karzai is a waste of time.
What we truly want had nothing to do with the people or even our soldiers. We want the resources, and will give oral to whomever will give us them. Same with contracted work and that includes oil for the Iraq debacle. It is how we do global business.
"Confessions of an Economic Hit man" by John Perkins, also ck Brezhinski in the mid 70's for prediciting that we will find an excuse to go back to Afghanistan, and lastly Dick Cheney's view on the Caspian Oil basin. Whomever controls Eurasia's resources control the much of the world .
Max108, and your excuse for Obama keeping them there until it became a reelection issue is....Than send him to the block as well.
Karzai, that snake can't be trusted. For that matter, none of them can be trusted.
He was the Bush Admin.'s snake of choice. Did you forget who put him and his brother there?
You might be right about Karzai, but he is their elected leader.
As for saying that no Afghan can be trusted, the statement is as absurd as it is biased.
Given the outright fraud that occurred in the last election for Karzai, it may be a stretch to call him their elected leader! Your correct that you can't say that none of them can be trusted, but you can say confidently that Karzai can't be trusted. Karzai would be the one I worried about dividing up the country if I were a resident of that country.
Why not let Afghans decide what's best for Afghans?
Should people trust Karzai? Absolutely not. He's a politician. The same can be said for politicians in Congress, the Senate, and the White House.
Personnally, I don't care if they decide to split the country so long as it doesn't revert back to a safe haven for terrorists. If it does, I suggest a few more surgical strikes like the one used on bin Laden rather than a full scale invasion. It's cheaper and far more effective.
"You might be right about Karzai, but he is their elected leader."
Elected my a$$!!! Elected under a constitution that disenfranchises 50% of the adult population from the word 'go'...the female portion of the population...doesn't count as "elected". And if you think that forcing them to actually allow free elections....where ALL adults are allowed to vote...is forcing our values down their stinking subhuman throats, then fine...we should force out values down their stinking subhuman throats, like McArthur did to Japan (else they'd get to eat a third nuke). But don't tell me that Karzai is their "elected" leader, because he isn't. About high time we pulled an "attitude" with these worthless dogs.
Yes, but "charity begins at home."
Ah no.. Karzai government has so little control anyhow (35 mile radius of Kabul tops), divide and conquer sounds like a much more superior short term solution.
Give the Taliban the southeast, let them eat Pakistan.
Taliban maybe barbaric with their Sharia law, but its efficient, and in a spread out society, they don't have the infrastructure for centralized judicial systems.
Sharia isn't really a very good legal system, and it means something different everywhere you go. Do you need someone to tell you which side to sleep on? Rules on how to 'marry' a woman for a weekend only with no lasting committment? Sharia can help you there.
More to the point, the pseudo-talibs were murdering their countrymen left and right, digging pits for the bodies of women and children massacred in droves. And Afghan Muslims do not need pseudo-talib dictators in order to practice whatever local variant of Sharia suits them, anyway. They are free to do it on their own.
Your plan to "divide and conquer" sounds like a euphmenism for 'divide and surrender'.
Someone needs to write better headlines on these pages, they're really confusing and badly written.
They are supposed to be. It is not poor journalism, it is on purpose.
governed by a constitution, that is a laugh. American's understand that governments see the constitution as an obsticle to wiggle around. Now it is just a suggestion.
All this depends on America and Afghanistan putting their trust and faith in the Taliban. FAT CHANCE! The Taliban, through armed conflict, has come to realize it cannot gain a foothold into the country's political process and social infrastructure. Resultantly, it is now willing to seek conciliation as a means to get through the front door. From there, it will work to cajole the U.S. out of the country. Once we are gone, they will seek to violently overthrow the government of Afghanistan and re-establish themselves as the sole guardians of Afghan authority, culture, religion and society. Then what? Do we go back?
Why are America and Afghanistan even considering getting in bed with those archaic-minded cretans? We are tired of Afghanistan and the war, Afghanistan know it but is too weak to fend off the Taliban once we leave. So to our minds and the Afghans, a deal must be struck. Know this: The Taliban would fight until the end of days if that is what winning back the country would take. They chose simply to change strategy and weapons; fewer guns, more diplomacy, but their objective remains the same. Complete control of Afghanistan.
Many Americans will never understand that they cannot militarily impose their will on others. The decision to invade and occupy Afghanistan was itself dishonorable.
hahahah...what are you ..?? a sleeper cell...???????????
Take issue with the premise and forget the juvenile inuendo. Military will against others... You think you have the right to continually do this halfway around the world and not expect those who are occupied to fight back to protect their property and families?
No, it wasn't.
We had to take out Osama bin Laden to save countless innocent lives.
Now we need to take out Ayman al Zawahiri, and for the same reason.
Sounds reasonable.
Sounds rational.
Roger White...
Remember eliminating the Taliban was never our goal. Our goal has been eliminating Al Queda's safe haven there. If the Taliban re-emerge as a political force that may not be a bad thing. Engaging the Taliban may be effective in achieving our real end goals which should be marginalize Al Queda and to help stabilize the region when we go.
commonsense, the problem is that they do not think reasonable or rational. It's either you convert to their their religion or death. There is no in between. Nothing about that is reasonable or rational. That's exactly why we are wasting lives and billions upon billions amounts of money. Trying to find a middle ground for them when they aren't willing and are not going to accept any middle ground that may actually lead to peace for their people.
Really? Kabul is full of Afghanis and many of them are Taliban. And yet, for some reason, there's peace in Kabul.
Our biggest problem isn't the Taliban. Our biggest problem is people like you who are incapable of understanding that people different from you are also reasonable or rational.
Good post Byron. Thanks.
glockhead,,,,, 100 percent correct, but the pinheads in this country dont get it. what do you expect from a nation built on a foundation of genocide, that thinks god is on their side, and has the balls to talk about "freedom" and "democracy" like they know what those words mean?
"Many Americans will never understand that they cannot militarily impose their will on others."
Total load of crap. You kill enough to destroy their will to resist, then the straggling survivors with half their skin hanging off their bodies will do as you say. Worked for the Romans, worked against Sitting Bull in South Dakota, worked for MacArthur in Japan, finally worked for Russia in Chechnya, AND IT WILL WORK IN AFGHANISTAN if only we have the will to win. Destroying the enemy works every time it's actually tried. They laugh at our politicians for not having the balls to demand unconditional no-compromise victory.
Divide what??? The country would have to be whole before you can divide it. karzi will make a deal and let the eastern side of afcraptistan become the Taliban Autominous Zone. Then the Paki Taliban can take refuge there and start suicide bombing in Pakistan. OR.... The Afghan Taliban and the Paki Taliban can carve up the of northeast Afghanistan and Northwest Pakistan and call itTalibanistan. Karzi can remain in Kabul and keep the southern half of the country and call it the Afdurgistan, home of Heroin Highway. Give the remaining land to Al Queda, the northwestern part of Afghanistan and they will be set up to go after their neighbors, the heritic Shia Iranians. I cannot think of a better use for that useless country. Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini and President Ahmadinejad can have something to really concern themselves with instead of concentrating on Israel. The whole world will get a break from all their extremism and get to watch them kill themselves off. What a great solution.
The 'supreme' poo-bah of Iran is Ali Khamenei. Ruhollah Khomeini died 22 years ago. He did some great things, he did some horrible things, he did some things that were greatly horrible.
I thought the US went in to get Osama Bin Laden, not unify the country of Afghanistan and work on Nation Building projects?
Exactly. As soon as binladen was killed, we should have patted each other on the back for a job well done and packed our bags and got the hell out of there. And beat the hell out of Karzwia or whatever his name is for hiding him next to a military base on our way out. It's demoralizing and insulting how we can "nation build" every other country but our own.
A, "united Afghanistan." They aren't. They never were. And they won't be now.
How can you tell this unity lie with a straight face?
Afghanistan is made-up of tribal areas that have NO allegiance to anyone but their elder.
Most Afghans have NO idea what happened in some place called America, don't care if they do, or are happy for it, and want us to let them get back to their lives, whatever that means to them.
One more illegal war to make Bush feel like a big deal and go down in history as a WAR PRESIDENT, while Cheney enriched himself, Bush and all of their cronies by wasting the lives of 1,800+ American men and women, while destroying thousands of families and forever hurting thousands of mothers, fathers, children and all of their associated families.
Thank you Mr. Bush and Mr. Cheney.
And thank you Mr. Obama, and Mr. Biden, for keeping it going.
I'm sure that if there is a god, he has a special place in whatever hell is for all of you, and the people who voted with you.
The US leaving Iraq and Afghanistan will look like the US leaving Vietnam and have the same result, business as usual.
Yes, another war for war industries profits with the goal of a permanent city-state military base close to Russia and China.
Glockhead, I haven't thought of it like that, but your probably right.
The American people wanted to kill/capture the masterminds of the 9/11 attacks. And so we did. What the American people do NOT want is for the U.S. military to play babysitter while these barbarian children duke it out with bombs. If these people want peace, they'll have it. If they want to fight all their lives then let them. It's not our problem.
Your right! It's NOT or problem or our obligation to support these barbarian thinking people financially. They have been fighting and killing themselves off since history began. ANY country that thinks they can just walk in there and promote democracy, peace, and brotherly love has more than a few brain cells fried extra crispy themselves.
this afghan war cannot end because US is fighting in wrong place...the real hub of terror is neighboring Paksicktan...thats where all terror comes from..US should urgently secure paki nukes and isolate them...without the nukes pakis are nothing....they cant survive a day with toal isolation...only then there can be peace in afghanstan and rest of the world...US needs to tackle paki problem urgently...
It was a waste of US lives and money, just like Iraq. Busch, Cheney and the rest of the neocon chickenhawks should be tried for getting our country in these stupid wars.
In 1839, the British, concerned by "terrorist/bandit" incursions from Afghanistan, invaded the country, deposed Shah Dost Mohammed and installed their own man, Shah Shuja, a corrupt incompetent with no real base of support in the country (it's worth comparing him and Hamid Karzai, tho' the comparison is hardly comforting). A bit over 2 years later, after sustaining absurd costs and losing numerous lives, and with the country riven by sectarian revolt, the British attempted to extricate themselves. Out of an army of over 15,000, exactly one man got out alive. And Dost Mohammed returned to power. Google "First Afghan War" for the details.
Approximately 40 years later, when a similar situation broke out, the British mounted a punitive expedition, went in, killed the unfriendly tribes' soldiery, burned their crops and villages and confiscated their weapons and then left (a pattern later repeated whenever Afghanistan thereafter "acted up" and wryly referred to as "smash and dash") . Then, in order to keep control without the need to deploy British soldiers, the Brits gave guns and money to the friendly tribes so that they could keep the unfriendly tribes too occupied to bother the British Raj. Google "Second Afghan War" for the details. Afghanistan remained largely quiescent under that practice, requiring only an occasional "spanking" when they got out of line. Google such things as the "Malakand Field Force", etc.
Our initial incursion into Afghanistan very much resembled the pattern of the Second Afghan War. Had we then armed and supported the Uzbek and Tajiks of the Northern Alliance (who had helped us topple the Taliban) and allowed them to keep the hostile Pushtun tribe (from which the Taliban was recruited) in check, we'd be in good shape (at a fraction of the cost in both dollars and casualties). Instead, we decided to replicate the failure of the First Afghan War, going so far as to alienate our best allies over there by actually installing a corrupt and incompetent Pushtun (Karzai) in power and supporting him despite his hostility toward our friends and his playing footsies with the Taliban enemy.
SO, frankly, I'm all FOR dividing Afghanistan up - heck, it always has been "divided up". It's not (and never has been) a real country - it's a geographical expression for an area inhabited by a number of mutually antagonistic tribesmen (Pushtun, Uzbek, Tajik, and Hezzara are the main four) who will never be "civilized" in the way we interpret the term. Those tribes are generally happy if they are allowed to murder each other and we are simply getting in their way by staying there. What we should have done, once the Taliban was out of the way, was to arm the Northern Alliance and let them keep the Taliban at bay, while we left a much smaller force to hunt down the Arabs and Al Qaeda types who had attacked us on 9/11.
So, far from "insulting" our sacrifice, this proposal to subdivide Afghanistan seems to me to be not only an historically valid approach to the problem, but also the best option for extricating ourselves from a situation we should never have gotten into (and wouldn't have if anyone in our government knew an ounce of history and ethnology).
Right on the money. Spent some time in that part of the world, didn't you? It shows.
As for your last sentence, no one in the US knows history anymore. I'm waiting for the government to replicate the conditions that led to the Civil War out of pure, unadulterated ignorance.
Oldefarte, why do you mess up this blog with all the facts? This was designed for the retarded masses. It is refreshing to see that we have few smart people in AMERICA. 99% are sheep heading for slaughter house. Russians came in to clean this mess up, and we recruited our old friend (OSAMA BIN LADEN) and his SHARIA @!$%# heads to defeat the RUSSIANS at any cost, even if it lead to our own demise down the road. Down the road has arrived!!!!!
I too agree that the division of Afghanistan might be, in the short and long term, a much more viable solution. Just as we are trying to cobble together Iraq from three distinct and historical different groups we are attempting to force a long term "coalition" of the unwilling in Afghanistan. I for one think instead of dividing it into two separate countries we just tell Pakistan to "come and get" the South West Pashtun region under full sovereignty of Pakistan and let them decide how buddy buddy to then be with all the factions involved.
The same concept is true for the area north and straddling the Hindu Kush. Tajikistan would indeed provide a great "reverse merger" framework to uniting that region. As the Tajiks and Uzbeks straddle each others borders in such a way that Tajikistan is the most likely of Northern Afghanistan's neighbors to provide such a framework then let it be so. It could not be any worse, and in fact provide a much more balanced and dynamic economy for the all the combined countries mentioned than to continue to support the "united farce" that is the current Afghanistan.
Come on, we can't go into the future without a few wars & skirmishes: How else would we be happy?
The article stated that the American tax payer has given billions of dollars over the last decade to support and aid a united Afghanistan!!! REALLY !!!!! IT SURE AS HELL WASN'T BECAUSE WE THE TAX PAYER WANTED TO!!! If we the tax payer had our way, you Afgans would either figure it out yourselves, and be left to your own government to figure it out for you! You can revert back to tradeing sheep and goats for currency for all I care. Those billions of dollars could have helped A LOT of people right here at home! What is wrong with our government? They would rather send billions of dollars to anywhere except where it belongs and is truely needed. With our economy still down, unemployment rates still at an unacceptable level, infrastructure rotting down, foreclosures still not settled down, bankruptcy rates rising, and the list could go on and on, yet our government in all of their idiotic thinking is using OUR hard earned money on BULL**** like this!!!! God help us. The best thing that could happen is a natural disaster earthquake open a hole in the ground and swallow the white house and hopefully the president and every democrat and republican congressman are all gathered in it trying to think of ways to screw it's people at the time it happens!! We could easily move our capital to somewhere else. Sorry for the rant, but that comment struck a freakin raw nerve with me.
I think your rant is warranted and on the money.
I totally agree with your rant. Let's face it. Afghanis, etc. etc. just want our money. They don't want our "help," i.e. our young men and woomen in uniform getting killed. They are like brats wanting only as much allowancethose stupid parents can cough up to keep the kiddies from whining at them. Let Afghanis take care of themselves in their own little tribal ways. As long as Al Quaedia doesn't get a base in there, let 'em be. If they don't l ike their country they can migrate elsewhere. Of course we will then have even more unemployment in America when these voluntary soldiers end up jobless (i.e. without a country to invade and occpy), but maybe then Congress will do what it is supposed to do and help get some civilian jobs here so people can live in peace anad relative p rosperity. No envy for those rich bastards like Mitt Romney, may he rot in hell.
ELH-602027
Hell with our infrastructure and rebuild AMERICA, Helliburton (Dick Cheney's ) company is very good at stealing our money(tax payers) in the overseas country building. They might have to go to jail or pay some of that money back if the crime is comitted on our shores. When overseas they can steal with impunity and just say... come on what's few hundred billion among friends!!!!! Actually by now Bush and Cheney should be standing trial for WAR CRIMES against humainity in the HAGUE . Oh gee wiz, I forgot we are not a signatory to GENEVA Convention, we only use it to beat other small countries with a GENEVA stick.
American soldier's sacrifice dishonored? No. Not because of an Afghan partition.
The dishonor began when the previous administration launched these fiascos based on lies and fraud. A double slap to our soldiers is the hundreds upon hundreds of billions in profit by "private contractors.
The triple slap to our veterans is the only accomplishments by the administration that perpetuated this "money pit" is the creation of $100 Oil, the tripling of health insurance rates, and the tripling of the cost of candy bars. And of course, the Patriot Act. Now we must have a passport to visit Canada for Gawd sakes.
American soldiers are no patriots fighters in this war, are simple mercenaries ($$$ and legal papers) and in that conditions dishonor don't apply...
The US ultimate goal and objective is to destroy the Muslim culture. Since the beginning of the 19th century westerners have been invading Muslim land and dividing it among the factions. Set them against each other and steal their resources by installing puppets and dictators to serve their interests at the detrement of the local population. But the tide is turning and more and more people are waking up to the scam..Egypt is a viable example.
Give it a break, starter. For over 450 years, Muslim armies conquered Christian lands (Syria, Palestine, Turkey, Egypt - where Coptic Christians are still being persecuted, the entire North African littoral, and even Spain, Sicily, and Southern France). Finally, in the late 11th C., Christianity struck back with the Crusades, which briefly pushed back this Muslim aggression. By the end of the 13th C., however, Islam was again on the march, conquering yet additional Christian lands - Greece, the entirety of the Balkans, Hungary, and even besieging Vienna twice. That was finally stopped at the second siege of Vienna in the late 1680's, tho' Muslim raiders continued their deprecations, especially into what is now Russia and the Ukraine, for at least another century (indeed, the Barbary Pirates were still pursuing their religious wars into the 19th C., until the Americans stepped in and stopped them). This European/Christian "attack" on Islam is a work of historical revisionism. European colonialism, even at its height in the 19th C., didn't even remotely recover the lands which Islam had stolen originally and, by the mid 20th C., even that had ended. So, out of Islam's 1,400 year history, Islam has been the aggressor for all but 350 years (and that is being charitable toward Islam), yet you try to paint this as a "war on Islam"? And, of course, Christianity is not the only victim of Muslim aggression - ask where the Zoroastrians (and Nestorian Christians) of Persia are now? Ask how it is that Islam managed to steal vast chunks of Hindu/Buddhist India. I don't think Islam has much room to complain - but you sure have a lot of history to learn.
Speaking as an American, which you obviiously are not, I think y ou Muslims think too much of yourselves. I serously don't think westerners ordinarily give one rat's ass @!$%# about "Muslims." except when you people choose to try to kill Americans for not being Muslim. Then, yes, we have to pay attention. So go do something constructive, l ike helping your fellow poor, wretched and deprived fellow Muslims in one o fthose hellholes where tribes live as they have for thousands of y ears, immune froom any thought or civilization developed since 2,000. Good luck to you and keep your stupid ideas to yourself.
It was the Turkic, Hun and Mongols that invaded europe between 500-1800AD not the Arabs. they just adopted their religion after conquering them. Arabs attempted to conquer Greece before the Roman days under the persian empire. After the fall of the Ottoman empire the Brittish and Allied powers divided and gave back the Land to the Arabs with the remaining Turkic people shrinking down and forming the republic of Turkey.
The thing that not being said honestly is we support Afghanistan's democratic government that we try to shape in our image , time and time again it the same story , we want them to have a government that we are comfortable with which means one we can control . we support leaders that favor us even if they are a minority , we have supported dictators and monarchs that terrorize their own people with support from the CIAs and MI6s of the world.
And the thing is it always ends the same way , look at Iraq , its making a steady slide into another civil war that we wasted thousands of US lives just to delay , with Afganistans history for the past hundred yrs what in the hell did the clowns in DC think they were going to change . Just a Forest Gump moment , stupid is as stupid does
We aren't going to change a thing. Just postpone the inevitable. I agree. If we went in and turned the whole middle east into a nuclear wasteland and there were only 2 muslims left in the whole entire world, they wouldn't unite. They would be throwing radioactive rocks at each other trying to make the other 1 accept their brand of religion.
I can't say it enough time's, Get Us The HELL OUT of there. Let those people live in their Cave's in peace. If the Taliban want's that country let them have it. Who Care's????????
Who cares? The corporations who want Afghanistan's rare earth metals care. And as we all know 'corporations are people, my friend', so obviously, the people want us to be there.
Very good point. And when and if Mitness (Or Willard, if you pefer) Romney gets elected President just guess what those ever lovin' corporations will get to do? No doubt we'll find a way tolet themenrich themselves and their investors with Afghanistan's precious metals. I think we need to follow not only the $ but also follow the source of natural resources that a country has in figuring out where next the greedhead "corporations" will set their sights and "allow" us American youth to spend out lives and health and the taxpayers to fund yet another fruitless war on the people in some godforsaken dculture with enviable natural resources that they can't do anything with and don't know how to. Great insight.
I just love you conspiratorial types. Metals are commodities...bought and sold on the open market to the highest bidder. Fighting a war has nothing to do with increasing the likelihood for doing a deal. That's the way things worked 100 years ago, but not now.
Exactly what successful businesses have you two started and run? Other than the garbage you apparently read on the internet and/or get from MSNBC, what makes you think that you know anything at all about the way companies operate?
There is more oil in Russia and natural resources in Australia but it cost to much to buy their resources cause their economy and Value of their $ means it cost to much to buy. So it is better to secure resources in a country that has a poor $ and economy which means it will be 20 times cheaper buy by the tonne.
Our goal was to eliminate or at least neutralize Al Qaida in Afghanistan....we never committed to one Afghanistan and installing a Democracy. Just wait.....the 1st time Afghanistan holds elections (real one's) and someone gets elected as President that the US establishment doesn't approve of.....then we'll say democracy isn't right for Afghanistan and we'll install an autocrat.
If the Afghanistan people have their wish....they will NOT be one nation....they are a tribal nation and history is full of examples of outsiders trying to make them something they are NOT. The US failed to learn the lessons of the Soviets....and now we're repeating the same stupid mistakes.
Get Ambassador Crockett out of there....Obama made another bad decision keeping a Bush hanger on (Crockett is CIA operative and a failure).
Simply another idiotic attempt by the US at nation building....... let's have another go at building a nation in our image and likeness. What arrogant bull$hit!!
Bring our young men and women home NOW and let the Afghans reach their own conclusions all by themselves. After all, they will hate us no matter what tack we take.
Why not divide up Afghanistan? It sounds like a good political solution. Let the Muslim crazies have a small portion of Afghanistan for their very own, let the other Muslims who do not want sharia live elsewhere. Sounds democratic to me and a bit like the U.S.. What is the alternative? Endless killing and suffering. Is that how we honor our fallen?
Good luck with that one. You must have been indulging some of Aghanistan's primary export.
Afghanistan is that part of the United Global States of America?
I like the quote of ambassador Crocker " free and independent media plays a vital role in any democracy". What was he smoking ? If you got such a media there, ambassador, bring it to the U.S. , fast, we need it before election.
I hear those poppy-seeds are a killer if you can't handle them, have you saying, and doing $#!+ you'll never remember. Let's wait and see if he changes his story tomorrow....LOL