We got out of their country a couple months ago. This is what we left them with.

Ahhhhh......we are already out sharriannie-

Why do some of you get out of bed everyday? How do you fake it through life?

Soooooooo, mission accomplished eh folks????????????

Pfffffffffffft.

These people have been fighting and killing all their lives. That is all they know and if they wanted to change they would change. It is a shame that we had to think for a minute that we could make a difference and a shame that we had to lose so many of our sons, brothers and fathers for such a senseless cause.

Well, here's hoping tensions do not boil over into open civil-war. But I am not optimistic.

This is precisely what I feared would happen 9 years ago when Bush led us to invade a country which no serious threat to us, and to remove their stable, albeit brutal government. Iraq is not naturally one political entity, but at least three.

Shiites and Sunnis seem to hate each other with a degree of rancor not seen amongst Christians since the religious wars of the 17th century.

Yes, I realize our soldiers left Iraq, I guess what I am trying to say...they are not going to change, they are just going to keep killing one another. It seems to be what they do, I'm just sick of it.

sharriannie-try & ignore the insulting posters. It's a major problem within this country-people just want to shoot their mouth off and hurl invective. Posting insults from behind a computer screen is far easier than having to think and discuss an issue, for many.

Actually, the Americans tapped out, due to economic, and political instability. Like a muscle bound fighter, with bad cardio.

Just wait and see what happens if they dont tapp out in Afgahnistan. What happened to the Soviets?

We should give each side a suitecase nuke and let them do eachouther in problem solved we dont need thier oil

How much more do we need to know about Islam inducing mental illness when muslims continue blowing each other up over a stupid GAWD DAMN BOOK!

Good thing we went in there and cleaned that country up. LOL

Updated at 7:13 a.m. ET: BAGHDAD -- A rapid series of attacks across a wide swath of Iraq killed at least 60 people Thursday, targeting mostly security forces in what appeared to be another strike by al-Qaida militants bent on destabilizing the country.

Who couldnt have seen this coming? We went in there trying to defeat a culture, an ideology, instead of defeating an enemy. We influenced nothing. The next faction of barbarians will take this country over and these people can get busy terrorizing and killing each other...like they are meant to do. Just think if we put the kind of effort we did into Iraq, ME, and put it into securing our borders. I argue we would be a whole hell of a lot better off as a country.

They should hang Dubya & Cheney in effigy and we should do it in reality ...

We have been drawing down in Iraq and they have and attack, so what? This doesn't mean all hell is going to break out, or that what was accomplished will be lost. It was one series of attacks, we'll see how the new Iraq government, police force, and people respond. You people are such doom and gloomers. Iraq's economy and country has been doing real well and my guess is most of the people will want to keep it that way and fight back the few idiots who are sure to still be around.

cheetah-822547

Why do some of you get out of bed everyday? How do you fake it through life?

I spoke to a woman a few days ago who thought Santorum was still a U.S. senator, and she lives in Pennsylvania so she should know better. Santorum was booted out 6 years ago. DUH.

Maybe some people should stay home on November 6 and let those who are in touch with reality do the voting.

can we get a refund?

If you don't know what you are getting into, then you don't know where you are going to.

This is exactly what Bush, Sr with 1991 Iraqi war and Bush, Gr in 2003 did.

They did not know the history of Iraq and Islam.

They simply danced as directed by Saudis, oil companies and their lobbyists.

Of course, Israel started the WMDs and dangers all around business as is being done in Iran.

Now see the net results for yourself!

Jonathan, your history lesson is pathetic!

If you don't know what you are getting into, then you don't know where you are going to. How do you know they didn't know what they were getting into?

This is exactly what Bush, Sr with 1991 Iraqi war and Bush, Gr in 2003. Bush Sr. had a COMPLETELY different situation then Bush Jr. and handled it completely different. Bush Sr. had twice as many troops and a completely different strategy, not to mention Iraq had invaded a neighboring country.

They did not know the history of Iraq and Islam. Do you know the history? Please explain!

They simply danced as directed by Saudis, oil companies and their lobbyists. This is stupid, if we did whatever the Saudis told us to do we wouldn't be such friends with Israel would we. If it's all about oil why don't we dance to Canada's drum since they supply us with the majority of our oil. Or maybe we should invade Alaska and drill there.

Of course, Israel starts the WMDs and dangers all around business as is being done in Iran. Israel starts it????? What are you talking about? Did Israel tell us to prevent further 9/11's you need to invade Iraq? Did Israel start the wars in 1948? Or how about the six day war in 1967? Did Israel come out and say it would destroy it's enemies, or was that Iran? Iran says it wants to get a nuclear weapon to destroy Israel and America, THEY SAY IT! The fact you don't listen doesn't make less true.

madMarinedad 1.19 No Sir. There is no money back guarantee. There is no return of life and no return of limb. As to the $$ that we dropped there they have no intention of paying us back. The ones who have come out with the big bucks are the arms dealers and the oil companies. Was it worth it sir? It appears so as they are cranking up for more in Syria and the big one in Iran. The cry will be, as it always is the Marines in first.

The majority of countries that make up the "Middle East", the lands around the southern and eastern shores of the Mediterranean Sea — notably Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria — as well as Iran, Iraq, and the countries of the Arabian Peninsula. Afghanistan, Libya, Turkey, and The Sudan, have been at war for centuries. They are countries connected through "Tribal Affiliations, and the tribes have been at war with other tribes since the beginning. Israel, the newest of the Middle Eastern countries, has been fighting other Middle Eastern countries for its very survival since its creation. The point being, the U.S. and other Western Nations are trying to stop what has become a way of life for these tribal countries. Let them fight their own battles, like they have always done, and they will survive those countries that interfere in their internal struggles. The Middle Eastern need leaders like Assad and Mubarak, who may be unacceptable to Western Nations, to keep tribal peace.

This kind of thing happened the entire time we were there why should it change now?

Let the Iraqies handle it. That is what their people wanted.

Practice makes perfect. I guess they didn't take the lessons in democracy to heart!

Hey, don't kick sharianne. Most women do not waste much of their time or thought on things that are unimprotant to them. Ask yourself this fellows, "In the long run, is this crap going to make much difference?"

You people make it sound like every other Iraqi is walking around with an AK-47 looking for someone to shoot. I would bet big money at least 90% of all Iraqis simply want to live and let live. It only takes a handful of fanatics and manipulators to set off bombs.

The best Iraq can do is clean up the mess and wait these hateful lunatics out. Eventually they'll get tired of dying for nothing and move on, but it will take several years of this.

Balance Da Budget: You are such a troll! Always trying to derail feeds and insert your ISLAMA-PHOBIA into every stream you go to. Ridiculous, if you think the Quran is bringing on mental illness and teling people to kill. Have yo even read it? It reads like the Christian Bible. Stop inserting your paranoia into all the feeds..........You seem to bounce from one seed to the next and always saying something derogatory about the Quran or Muslims.........Get off your trip man!

I am getting so sick of these crazy people, why don't we just get the hell out of their country and let them do theirselves in. Thats all they know killings,killings and more killlings.

Were you saying that when Cheney/Bush illegally invaded Iraq?

Speaking of, didn't Cheney/Bush damn near guarantee democracy, a terrorist free, stable Iraq, after they illegally invaded, and murdered Saddam? They did say "democracy rules."

America should have never gone there in the first place.

We did pull our troops out- just like they demanded. And the second we did, the Shi'ites (Iranian supported) put out an arrest warrant for the Sunni Iraqi VP (Saddam's religion) and all hell broke loose. Those we trained to maintain the security are being murdered, and the whole country is going to hell in a hand basket.

Iran (Shi'ite) is continuing to pull strings and create violence, as they are pulling strings to keep Assad in Syria in place, and promoting Taliban support in A-stan and P-stan. That, or these people just cannot live semi-peacefully without a strong iron fist keeping them in check.... in either case, Saddam was not a valid target- he had no WMDs (the evidence of was faulty and proven fraudulent before Jr went in) and the REAL target should have been Iran/A-stan (though finishing in A-stan first should have been Priority 1- and it should have been STARTED with enough troops and equipment, instead of listening to the Idiot of Defense Rummsfield). I just wish I could say and believe that Iran is the source problem and that its removal would solve a number of problems, but the truth is worse- the real problem is the Immams of Islam have become greedy power hungry warmongers. They are brainwashing their people with a "Death to all non-Xxx" mentality (where Xxx is their version of Islam, not even limiting it to those who aren't Muslim). We can't get rid of those people, they get upset. These are the same people who flew off the handle and didn't have a problem with Insurgents defacing their holiest book, but got really pissed when the US disposed of the defaced holy book. They don't mind Insurgents hiding among their civilians, but they get really pissed when the US kills them, then they claim they were just civilians. These are the same people who shout "Death to America" while they wear Harley-Davidson jackets. They are walking hypocrisies.

As a vet of the Iraq War, this is what as known as "blow-back." Gen. Powell (as Sec. of State) warned President George W. Bush that if "you go in and break the country apart, then you will own it!" Well, guess what? We decimated the country for years, created more enemies through the unnecessary slaughter of tens of thousands of their peoples (mostly civilian, women, children, etc), opened the doors to Iran and terrorist of any ilk, and we expect something different??? It was bad enough to invade to begin with, then we re-elected Bush to continue the insanity??? Frankly, I am ashamed of what we, as a country, have done. The conditions over there are horrendous. They are lucky to have electricity a few hours a day, their infrastructure is still in shambles, their so-called government is corrupt (much like ours, I guess we were successful in giving them a government that represents those with big money!) and Iran is their closest ally. No one, I mean NO ONE, should be surprised that what we have done has laid the groundwork for endless civil war and unrest there. The worst is yet to come....especially since we have the LARGEST embassy in the world sitting smack dab in their capital city!!! Can you say Roman Empire II?

I can rest better at night now knowing that things in Iraq are much better and stabilized .. O wait !!

It's so evident that we accomplished so much there in what 10 yrs or so...LOL...

@Kornfed

Thank you for a small dose of sanity.

Just you wait: The GOP idiots running for POTUS will pounce on this like a rabid dog, despite the fact it was GWB who initially contracted the 2012 withdrawal. Instead, they would have us believe, it would be best to just STAY THERE, without changing a damn thing, thanks to their backward superstitious approach to just about everything, and let more American soldiers die in the name of "never surrender".

Every nation is entitled to have their own Civil War to see who's going to reign supreme.

If Al Qaeda wants to help the Sunni Minority fight the Shi'ite Majority, so be it.

Al Qaeda in Iraq didnt even exist before we invaded, and disposed of Saddam and his Sunni Rule.

So if you want someone to blame for this new reality, and you supported the invasion in 2003 (I didnt) then look in the mirror and give yourself full credit.

Considering the rhetoric from some conservatives about exercising their 2nd amendment rights to get the govt they want (threat of civil war)...we arent far behind these "barbarians" in how we handle our differences.

Democracy is difficult when the nation is split in 2 and wants to go in completely opposite directions.

I think America knows this fully well.

Iraq is now free to kill each other. Total success of operation "Iraqi Freedom"!

AG99-"You people make it sound like every other Iraqi is walking around with an AK-47 looking for someone to shoot. I would bet big money at least 90% of all Iraqis simply want to live and let live. It only takes a handful of fanatics and manipulators to set off bombs."

thank you for pointing this out!!

This is sooooo true, I know this from very personal experience. The ones I know are the sweetest people, wouldn't hurt a fly, and respect the religions of others.

They are lucky to have electricity a few hours a day, their infrastructure is still in shambles - Their infrastructure has been $h!t for decades! Remember the Sanctions put on them by the world community??? They have never had unlimited electricity, there may have been times in the past where the electricity was better but those things will be fixed with time. ,

their so-called government is corrupt - Like the Government they had before was any less Corrupt? They may be corrupt, but they don't mass murder their enemies like before with Saddam and the Bathist. (much like ours, I guess we were successful in giving them a government that represents those with big money!) and Iran is their closest ally.

No one, I mean NO ONE, should be surprised that what we have done has laid the groundwork for endless civil war and unrest there. What civil war, what unrest? One cordinated attack means civil war and unrest? Chicago and New Orleans has gang wars and killings everyday, are we in a civil war as well?? Why don't you compare the murder rate of Baghdad to New Orleans and see what you get.

Given that Baghdad is a city of about six million that makes for a murder rate of about 48 per 100,000 people.

Cape Town is about the same size as Caracas but nearer to Baghdad's murder rate with 62 violent deaths per 100,000 people. New Orleans, with an estimated post-Katrina population of just over 300,000, is tiny in size compared to its rivals. But the number of murders is huge; figures vary, but even the low estimate puts the city on a par with Cape Town.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1894566,00.html#ixzz1nE1iXvmP

"they should hang w and cheney"

post 1.16

wow, what you said is a federal offense. reported to newsvine.

Yep, winning the hearts and minds around the world....

LogicReguired In your post #1.17 you were mistaken about the 6 Day War. Israel started that one. The war in 1948 and the Yom Kippur War were started by Israel's Arab neighbors.

This is exactly what Bush, Sr with 1991 Iraqi war and Bush, Gr in 2003 did.

They did not know the history of Iraq and Islam.

They simply danced as directed by Saudis, oil companies and their lobbyists.

Jonathan - As usual, your reasoning leaves a bit to be desired. The two Iraq Wars, meaning the one in 1991, and the one 2003, could not have been more different.

The first war was in response to a direct attack on one of the major oil producers in the world. Its goal was clear, to drive the Iraqi forces out of Kuwait and restore the previous government. We did it. We left. It was all over in the same year.

The second war was started in the mistaken belief that we could remake the Middle East's political culture, one nation at a time. It may have started in 2003, but we only just finished extricating ourselves, 9 years later, and the full extent of the repercussions may not be known for years to come.

We did not engage in the 1991 war solely in response to the Saudis, or to the oil lobbiests. We did so because we, and the rest of the industrialized world are dependent on cheap oil, and Kuwait is one of the biggest producers of this valuable resource.

Iraq consists of many different religions,including Christians,Jews and Muslims, and they were living in relative peace,under a brutal dictator named Saddam Hussein...who managed to keep the lid on all this sectarian violence. Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, most of the 9/11 attackers were from Saudi Arabia, and unlike Iran,Iraq had no WMD, and no nuclear program.......but George W. Bush attacked them, it ripped apart Iraqi society,unleashing power grabs by many differing groups after Bush collapsed their government....we are at blame for this tragedy, which resulted in 4500 American deaths, about 120,000 Iraqui deaths, and the flight of most of their Jews and Christians...and the aftermath is all this violence...Bush should be tried at the Hague for War Crimes.

liam, did you know bill clinton put sanctions on sadaam hussein in 1993 that lead to the deaths of 1 million iraqis from 1993-2000 ?

let your hatred of bush go. bush ended sanctions, clinton however is guilty, by definition, of genocide....with the blessing of democrats in the 90s, including joe biden.

joe biden swears, to this day, sadaam was making wmds. why dont you try joe biden and bill clinton for genocide ?

LogicReguired, dman and others: If one reads history written from right to left then everything looks upside down.

1. In the current Iraqi region, no foreign forces could do occupation for more than two years. Even Chenghiz Khan and his forces were driven out badly.

2. In 1991, where was the need to send the US forces to such a region and save the most ungrateful, beastly and bigoted rulers of Kuwait, Saudi Arabia and others?

3. Saudi Arabia needed the US forces to save them but did not permit Bible. Can there be a bigger instance of sell out in the history? Here it was done for Saudi Arabian monsters, oil companies and their lobbyists.

4. Afghanistan is another most tough area to fight with history similar to Iraq.

5. Only George Bush, Jr could open two fronts at the same time to lose badly in Iraq and about to be humiliated more badly in Afghanistan because of the primarily backstabbing ally, Pakistan. Here ally is Pakistan!! Only dumbest could take Pakis as allies though it was well-known since 2001 that they were backstabbing the US and NATO forces.

6. Saudis, oil companies and their lobbyists are making many politicians in the US, Britain and European nations to act as their puppets for their dirty work.

7. By twisting the history, realities as they like and some act as lobbyists for the beastly Islamic Sunni religious Nazis, Saudis and Pakis, oil companies and Israel! These were very noticeable before Iraqi wars. Some of then vanish from the scene to build their next Salaffi and Wahhabi mosques.

It is interesting to see how people can twist issues, facts and realities to their convenience.

9/11 was due to Saudis, Pakis and UAE.

Some of the very Muslims who twist history, facts and realities also shamelessly declare: 9/11 was a Zionist conspiracy!

Jokes about oil prices.

Oil prices which were hardly $30 a barrel before 1991 shot up to $140 a barrel. With Iran new dramas conducted by the Saudis for the Saudis may even reach $200.00 a barrel.

Talk about cheap oil prices! Only some in Islamic hell holes can call them cheap!

Since 2003, future traders, rating agencies, Wall Street and oil companies and their lobbyists transferred, five trillion dollars from oil importing countries to oil exporting nations.

We have the Sunni Islamic religious Nazi beasts' Saudi Salafi and Wahhabi mosques all over the world in return in our streets. Can there be more ungrateful beasts ever in the history of mankind?

US spent, since 2001, on Iraq and Afghan wars three trillion dollars.

In Iraq and Afghan wars 6300 soldiers killed and 40000 injured.

Jonathan - One could make a career correcting your mistakes and misstatements.

1. In the current Iraqi region, no foreign forces could do occupation for more than two years. Even Chenghiz Khan and his forces were driven out badly.

1. The Mongols never ruled all of Iraq, but did control the northern half under the Ilkhanate between 1256 and 1335 AD.
2. Many foreign invaders have ruled all of this region, including the Persians (550–330 BCE & 224–651 AD), the Parthians (247 BC–224 AD), and the Ottoman Empire, from 1535 until the end of WWI.

As to the rest of your "points", the night would not be long enough for me to sift through them all. Suffice it to say that if you think we were in Kuwait in 1991 solely to benefit the Saudis, you should consider our dependence on oil, and just how far your car would run without it.

Afghanistan in 2001, Iraq in 1991 and Iraq in 2003 were each completely different situations.

1. Afghanistan - if we didn't react to the 9/11 attacks, we should have just disbanded our military and resign ourselves to what follows.
2. Iraq in 1991 - Again, if you allow a known trouble-maker, such as Saddam to seize control of yet more of the world's oil reserves, then you need your head examined.
3. Iraq in 2003 - Here, like the proverbial blind squirrel stumbling upon an acorn, you seem to have actually gotten something right. This war was a God-awful mistake. I've never defended it or understood how anybody could have thought it was a good idea.

I wonder sometimes what skewed view of the world allows people to reach conclusions such as yours. Then I read your first point regarding Iraq again [no foreign forces could do occupation for more than two years.] and I realize, it is because you pay absolutely no attention to the facts - they are such a distraction!

Saddam Hussein was ruthless,however he maintained internal peace in Iraq, excepting in Kurdish areas, AND Saddam kept Al Quaeda OUT of Iraq...remember,most of the 9/11 attackers were Saudis........George W. Bush destabilized the middle East with his unjustified invasion of Iraq,.......General Colin Powell warned Bush...."if you go in, you'll break it, then you own it !"........Thats the appalling legacy that George W. Bush will forever be known for.....results: 4550 American dead, 30,000 wounded, 120,000 dead Iraqis, continual sectarian war in Iraq, Higher oil prices,Al Quaeda now in Iraq.....and over a Trillion dollars in cost to the US Taxpayer and our economy.

actually we killed 1 million iraqis with sanctions according to the un.

from 1993-2000 an estimated 1 million died as a direct result of sanctions against the sadaam regime.

the left does not like to hear that, they want to blame bush.

the middle east was run by ruthless dictators....while the world stood by and did little. that was before 9/11. now...democracy has been brought to a people who some say didnt deserve freedom.

actually we killed 1 million iraqis with sanctions according to the un.

Well, keck, I have some estimates this high. I've also seen far lower figures. It should also noted, that Saddam refused U.N. offers to allow the limited export of oil to pay for the essential needs of his people.

I've also seen death estimate from the Iraq War that were as high as 1 million deaths, due direct fighting, collateral damage, sectarian violence and such.

The left [and most rational people] only blame Bush for his decision to lead our nation into the quagmire which Iraq, and for having done so in a sloppy and haphazard manner. Iraq had no intrinsic part to play in the war on terror, and despite your citing of 9/11 as some sort Casus belli for the invasion. It was not involved in the 9/11 attacks and Al Qaeda was only active there after our invasion.

8 years and 1 trillion dollars later we have finally extricated ourselves, and while I hope democracy takes root there, it is just as possible that the country will fragment or revert to rule by yet another brutal dictator.

I guess the myth that Iraq War was in some manner a good idea will persist in the minds of conservatives for years to come. But for some on the right, to be a conservative apparently means to conserve mental energy.

One pillar of an economy is political stability and they had that - something George DA Bush couldn't see.

I sometimes wonder if they wouldn't be generally better off with Saddam still in charge, he hated al-quada.

Really, if you had to ask THAT question, then you probably already know the answer.

Have any of you seen this country or been to Iraq in the last year or two? If you had, you would realize what a stupid statement keeping Saddam is. Iraq is doing great, yes there has been some attacks but the stories you don't see are that the country has gotten much better at intelligence gathering and will probably respond to this. The Iraq economy is better then it has been in decades.

Unfortunately you are probably spot on, as the Brits would say but maybe LogicReguired is one of those that would have us stay another 10 years to make democracy "really" work.

Too bad Saddam decided to make those weapons of mass deception..................errr destruction..............err Bush only found the first ones and not the second and killed a lot of our troops in the process of making Halliburton richer..........good job Cheney.

The reasons we are over there are plain and simple; it is a rats nest that breeds terrorists.

We tried to flush out all of the rats but they kept breeding and for every one terrorist we killed, two more sprung up in their place.

What a bunch of whack jobs they will NEVER know peace. NEVER!

Let’s defend our borders and leave them to their own devices.

Saddam's continuation would have been better for Iraqis and us.

Just count the huge expenses and soldiers killed, injured and families shattered in the US due to 1991 and 2003 Iraqi wars.

After all the sophisticated military and police training to Iraqis, see the massive decentralized bombings.

Now wait for the bloody sectarian civil wars and formation of Shiastan, Sunnistan and Kurdistan.

Good news is that there will Shiastan right on the head of most barbaric, beastly, feudal, bigoted and seventh century mindset monsters of Sunni Saudi Arabia (fountainhead of 80 percent of Islamic radical and terrorism problem along with Pakistan).

Shiites will be a right match for these Sunnis.

Shiites should march into the Saudi Arabia as soon as possible with Paki nukes.

We should never have gotten rid of Saddam, he was the counter weight to Iran. McCrystal should resign, you pathetic small man. Everything you said would happen hasn't happened and it never will.

No more occupying middle eastern countries. Listening Obama? Then why are we still in Afghanistan? It won't make one bit of difference if we left today or two years from now. The same thing is going to happen to that country when we leave. The hatred between Muslim factions trumps anything we do. The Sunni / Shia hatred and blood letting will never stop, and us thinking that we can make a difference is beyond pathetic. We never learn a damn thing.

Sadamm was a dictator. He knew how to rule the people with brutal force. I do not agree with his tactics but may be only method of control. America is too naive thinking can change a culture of people and maintain order.

And not to mention the cost of war and loss of lives. If you are dumb enough to fight, go knock yourself out. I do not give a hoot.

Unfortunately you are probably spot on, as the Brits would say but maybe LogicReguired is one of those that would have us stay another 10 years to make democracy "really" work.

I am not, nor have I ever been for nation building. With that being said the country is doing much better and if our media would show the pictures and videos of daily life in Iraq I think many Americans would be amazed at how much is going on there. I'm not for staying, and I'm glad we are leaving, I'm just much more optimistic about Iraq's outcome then everyone else. Was it worth it? Ask me in ten years.

Sadamm was a dictator. He knew how to rule the people with brutal force.

We should never have gotten rid of Saddam,

Saddam's continuation would have been better for Iraqis and us.

Saddam TORTURED and MURDERED MILLIONS of people, mostly his own!!!! They are still finding mass graves, and the videos of people being tortured. He gased his own people, women and children killed by toxic gas and you think the people were better off?? To think getting rid of him was bad, or that Iraqis were better off with him is ridiculous! Maybe we shouldn't of got rid of the Bathist party and just got rid of him, but him going is a good thing. He may have been a counter to Iran, but he was a swine, and got what he deserved. The people of Iraq CELEBRATED when he was first removed.

Jonathan, you, sir, are an ... uninformed troll.

Shiites should march into the Saudi Arabia as soon as possible with Paki nukes.

Pakistan is 80% Sunni, and "Paki nukes" would not be landing on Saudi Arabia as it is seen as holy, being the seat of Mecca, the holiest site in Muslim theology.

Its people like you that are the reason behind the sectarian violence seen in countries across the Middle East. Seems like your attitued of "Go Shiites! Kick some Sunni butt!" comes right out of Iranian playbook for how they want to see the Middle East turn out. Just look at what they did in Iraq over the past 10 years. By arming Shiite militias and insurgents (aka terrorists) they are responsible for more of the violence in Iraq than the US ever will be accountable for. Hell, they even had Revolutionary Guard right in the thick of it, fighting a proxy war with the US.

The Sunnis and the Shiites need to learn to coexist, or there will never be peace in the Middle East, no matter how many troops the International Community (read MOSTLY United States) puts on the ground there. ... Yeah, right. Like that's ever going to happen.

@LogicRequired.......you are a LIAR!!! All one has to do is listen and see the reports coming out of Iraq. The country is a MESS. On what info (FOX NEWS perhaps?) are you basing your BS statements? Outside of their oil (which we now supervise) they HAVE NO ECONOMY. Come clean, this is really Cheney isn't it? You still trying to "justify" your lies for invading Iraq?

@Brad-727901

Actually I do real research and find news out of the middle east to get my facts, you are the one who bases your opinion on talking points from the Huffington Post, and others. Iraq is has problems but is peaceful most of the time and is starting to thrive. They may derail and fall back into war and dicators, but they may succeed. You can take your Fox News Nonsense and shove it! Your the tool of ignorance who knows nothing about life in Iraq.

Here's some headlines FROM middle east Newspapers...

Iraq's GDP is forecast grow at least 9.4 percent per year on average between 2012 and 2016,-Al Bawaba

Is now the time to invest in Iraq? - Arabian Business

Iraq's Economy Wakes Up

Investment and products from abroad begin flowing—along with oil - Bloomberg Businessweek

Circus comes to town in Iraq -- after 40 year gap

I'm not saying it's paradise over there, I'm simply saying they MAY be on the road to a changed country that is far better then before.

http://aliveinbaghdad.org/2009/01/19/pastry-shops-thriving-in-iraq/

@LogicRequired....uh...oil makes up over 80% of their "economy." Spin this all you want. Bloomberg Businessweek? LOL. Think they might have an agenda? Good one. Actually, I have veteran friends who have been there and tell quite a different tail than you. As recently as a few weeks ago, Richard Engel, who knows Iraq better than any western alive, says quite categorically that Iraq is in dismal shape. http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/middle_east/promise-of-iraqs-economy-remains-unfulfilled/2012/01/05/gIQAyZd5jP_story.html

Let us keep these in mind on Syria and Iran too!

Only OUR government expects us to be the police of the world, and this will go on until God decides to exterminate the infestation, just as he did in Sodom and Gommorah. Since Russia and China voted against the UN resolution to provide military support to the revolutionists in Syria, the US government has now sold the American people on the fact that the US should supply arms to the rebels simply for self-defense purposes, just like they did with the falsified MI6 report that Colin Powell presented to the UN(and ultimately resigned because of the deception) in order to justify the invasion of Iraq. If they were sincerely interested in protecting the rebels, maybe they should try disarming the Syrian forces and negotiating a peaceful resolution, because that is precisely what the US government has been trying to do to US citizens for years, and they may ultimately accomplish their goals by passing legislation like the Patriot Act and NDAA, which has been compared by numerous political experts to the same strategy used by the Third Reich. They just imfatuate, indoctrinate, and ultimately eliminate the rights and freedoms of the individual, and they do it all in the name of protecting and caring for you.

The last time Iraq was stable was when Saddam was in power. It was predicted by thousands that Iraq would end up in civil war, and yet it is the "terrorists" that are blamed, not the Sunnis, Shiites, or Kurds(I guess the news media wants to make it sound more dramatic)that are fighting for control of "their" own country. Iraq has huge oil reserves, oil makes money, and all the factions want the money. Maybe they will ultimately decide to split the country into three countries and resolve the conflicts, but money provides the ultimate control, and those who control the money ultimately control the people.

Iran is attempting to acquire nuclear warheads, and if this government, or any government, thinks they can stop the proliferation of nuclear arms, they are only deceiving themselves and the people they govern. The only way to "stop" nuclear weapon proliferation is to "destroy" all of those weapons which are now in existence, and that is just about as unrealistic as thinking you can stop nuclear proliferation. Eventually, some government will decide to attack Iran and eliminate the "terrorist" threat, just like Iraq, because it is now very easy to label anyone a "domestic" or "international" terrorist, and once that is accomplished, anything is fair game. Just do it in the name of "peace" but accomplish it as an act of "war". ROCK ON!

So many American lives lost in Iraq and so much of our money spent there and so much of our times and resources wasted in the Iraq war. We need to pull our troops out of all these rag-head countries and let the idiots fight it out themselves. The small hand full of people grateful for our efforts aren't worth the price we are paying. Civil war is something their country has to fight, not us. WE have a war here in America trying to secure our borders and from our corrupt government.

It's enough for me...I don't give a F&@K !

I would like to see Bush Jr. & Cheney (and Rumsfeld) dumped INTO Iraq-it would be a fitting end for what those fools did.

People really drank the kool aid when Bush #2 said that Saddam had nukes. He knew there weren't any. It was just an excuse for our war profiteers to go in there and fill their pockets. Tell me the GOP was really interested in getting Bin Laden. They had over 7 years to get him and Obama gets him in 3. Why?, because the GOP likes to use fear to stay in power. No Bin Laden, less fear. At this point they can't say the USA would be safer with a GOP president. It's a real travesty, what Bush started, over a trillion US dollars and countless lives. The Bush #2 administration was nothing but a bunch of war criminals and should get the same fate Saddam got. They left our future generations with a mess that will never be cleaned up. Of course the greedy jerks that started all of this are some of the 1% with all the money, their families won't ever suffer for it, but the rest of us will. I don't know how these people can live with themselves.

Quite comfortably, thanks for asking. While i agree that the intelligence that was coming out at the beginning was cloudy at best, hind sight is always 20/20 so to now make blanket statements that our former President and vice president respectively, should be hung for their actions just shows a stupid crazy typical liberal statement. You sit there and bash Bush but you speak nothing of the democratic senators and congressmen who also approved military action based on the very same information that Bush had. So it's all Bush's fault and no one elses?. You sound like a pair of clown shoes with these tired, often stated retorts that your liberal buddies keep feeding you to spout off with. First off, stop denigrating a former President of the US. You don't like people bashing your savior, stop bashing mine. As many stated earlier regarding saddam being the right person to control his people, There wasn't any one man i would have preferred to GW Bush to lead us during our recovery from 911. Iraq was a mistake that we will hopefully learn from in the future. I doubt it. This country makes mistakes daily. Voting for a candidate based solely on race(mistake), Bailing out banks and continuing tax breaks and subsidies for rich industries, Unlimited unemployement or extensions that never seem to end on the tax payers dime. Free health care and retirement for federal employees. The list goes on and on.

First of all Mr. Dom, I form my own opinions on what I think and I don't think of Obama or anybody else on this planet as my savior. Yes, there were alot of Democrats who supported invading Iraq and I'm sure they were more concerned about supporting the false intelligence they recieved and I might add, getting re-elected. In fact I'm sure they didn't want to look unpatriotic, considering that 911 had recently happened. I don't look at anything I stated as stupid or crazy. Let's not forget that Clinton was almost impeached for lying about a BJ. How crazy is that? Even Nixon had to resign. The Bush #2 administration did alot to hurt our country with this false war. All the death and destruction. A trillion bucks and still counting. I did'nt believe Iraq still had WMDS when Bush was pushing this, so my opinion has nothing to do with hindsight. I don't base my votes on race or gender and to imply that makes me wonder who's wearing the clown shoes. I too, could go on and on.

Would be an interesting study to interview people of their religion (if you call it that) to know what they saw in a near death experience compared to other religions. So sad that they believe killing people is the answer to their prayers. Much like any other religion no one really knows what happens after death, it's all speculation with no real proof. I'm sure if one of their kind tried to convince them other wise that it's not what they believe it to be, that person would be shot.

How would you know what Heaven is like? Have you been there and back? Or do you just believe what some religious "authority" tells you, just like the Muslims that you criticize?

Organized uncompromising and extreme religion kills. This is why the Iraq war and America putting their footprint and attacking Hussein was the biggest mistake on planet earth. THIS is what we have wrought. Why? Religious fanaticism and it is inbred in the culture. You cannot mold people into democracies who have rigid ideologies. Sometimes a king or even a tyrant is needed to herd the cats as much as I personally abhor that. Democracy is not for everyone. Heck we have our own intractable Congress and to me Republicans sound LIKE the factions of Islam which will not compromise.

Not ONLY did we destabilized Iraq we destabilized the whole region .. a tinderbox of horrific violence has followed with Pakistan really HAVING nukes. Oh sure just what we need an insertion of more US forces in Iran...are they kidding us???? NUTS just plain NUTS.

The religion they hold dear is very similar to the judeo-christian religion but many people don't bother to see the similarities (islam, is in fact a plagiarism of the judeo-christian religion with some of their own ancient texts thrown in for good measure). Christianity took a long time to move from its ideals of violence to its more peaceful ideals (brought about by the enlightenment). We can only hope that islam moves from its own dark age to an age of enlightenment, but until they allow their people to be educated, this will not happen, so unfortunately, we have to watch them do exactly what christianity did for hundreds of years. The only difference is the technology available to them to help them kill each other.

I have to Agree with Mike-2130882, The Islamic Religion does promote Retribution, the religion also specifies that your either with them or against them there is no middle ground. So if you dont believe what they believe then you are considered the enemy & death is the only option. It's a Shame all the innocent people who just want to survive & thrive in those parts of the world have to deal with that kind of Hatred, Negativity and most of all Evilness, Plus since most of them are so poor they could never get out of the country. I am so Thankful I was NOT born into that Ignorance & Evilness. The saddest part is, is that they teach their children to hate. That must be so EXHAUSTING to have a HATE FILLED heart for an Entire Lifetime. I know it's not PC to say what Im about to say but, Leaving them to destroy themselves is not the answer since they are FILLED with HATE and once they Killed everyone around them then they will look for others to kill as we saw on 911 when it came to our shores. The World should take the time to remove every single peaseful human in that area that wants to live a life free of hate & then NUKE the rest of them. I am NOT religeous, nor am I Athiest. I am SPIRITUAL, Those who use their religion to promote their hate are really controlled by SATAN. JESUS tried to teach HUMANITY, KINDNESS, UNDERSTANDING, COMPASSION, ACCEPTANCE and above all LOVE, thats why the Jewish Priest had the Romans Kill JESUS because it's easier to control the masses with Fear. Unfortunetly RELIGION has KILLED more INNOCENT Humans on this Planet than anything else. SATAN gives his decipals instant gradification thats how he sucks you in.

i entirely believe that, this is exactly what america wanted. keeping its enemies busy slaughtering each other.

i realised this when the usa allowed 4000 tons of high explosives to be unguarded. and looted.

this equates to an awful lot of suicide vests, car bombs and IEDs.

Agree, its different than liberating Europe, which we did a hell of a job at. The so called "military strategist" do not learn from history, they do not study the enemy and evaluate how they will react. It reminds me of how the English soldiers came here and were just appalled and overwhelmed by our war tactics, and then went on to loose and hmmmm we started our own country and fought a bloody civil war and here we are. I guess the lesson is...leave them alone for about 200 years and maybe they will grow up into a country, right now their just a bunch of animals running around with guns.

I totally agree when you say this is what we wanted. The American War/Money machine cannot keep the gravy train cash going without a purpose. This is why we immediately jump on Iran as soon as we get out of Iraq. The Pentagon is dying to bomb Iran. Think of all the money they would get for new bombs and, yes, most of it wouldn't even get out of the Capitol.

Take a look at the state of the nation. God withdrew his blessing long ago-- and rightly so.

Do you really think God loves one child over another? God promised never to leave his children nor withdraw his blessing.

If God exists Jedd-316114...Where's the proof besides a history book that has been edited how many times?

God bless America

That's what the Iraqi's say every day.

God bless kittens too!

Jedd-

Do you really think God loves one child over another?

Here's a thought: grow up, become an adult, stop with the daddy-in-the-sky nonsense and take responsibility for yourself.

Howmanyfingers and Cassie321 why did Einstein, Dirac, and many other scientists believe in God? Why do the Jewish people believe in God, other then the power it gives them over other humans? Maybe because of how the universe works, all the little pieces parts, and how they fit together. As smart as we are, we are just now finally getting to the point of understanding the universe. It is that complex, from the smallest to the largest the scale, it all works in harmony. If not for that background framework we could not exist.

Where do you put your ultimate creation? If you put them in a room with walls, would we not ask why is there a wall here? Why can we not go through the wall? What is the wall made out of? What is on the other side of the wall? Instead our pie in the sky God put us in a place where it is almost impossible to reach a wall or edge in our universe (our room, prison, etc.).

I bet the two of you could not build a computer from the common easy to assemble parts we have today. I bet the two of you cannot even write a simple program in basic, Pascal, or C. I bet the two of you could not make a hardware adder from nothing more then switches. I bet the two of you did not take or pass a physics class. Yet here the two of you are on your computers that someone else designed and built, acting like you know everything...lol.

I guess the U.S.A. never had a civil war now did we? So much for knowing history too, huh? At least we agree on taking some responsibility for ourselves, ignorance is bliss.

Howmanyfingers and Cassie321 why did Einstein, Dirac, and many other scientists believe in God?

Because they were/are scared of death.

I bet the two of you could not build a computer from the common easy to assemble parts we have today.

Funny you should say that. One of my hobbies used to be building computers on my kitchen table and selling them to local small businesses. And gee, that was back when modems had to be installed separately with DIP switches set by hand. Much more complicated than today.

Wrong again, huh?

Einstein did NOT believe in any of man's "god" myths. Hitler was a staunch christian and lifelong catholic, however.

There is too much money to be made from enforcing anti-drug laws and running private prisons to shut down that border. Also the slave labor from Mexico is a boon for business owners, so ditto. As for the wars overseas, they were never about freedom or national security, they were about oil, and profits from oil.

That's all we need is another SHOOT FROM THE HIP Comander-in-Chief. Wait until the debate on National Security and President Obama will have any of these wanna-be President throwing in the towel. I have to ask, WHAT DO THEY GOT? Obama/Biden 2012

What do you mean they were not there before Bush? They have been there for generations that country has been at war with itself forever

FYI Jack "Know-nothing"

The call to war was actually voted on by congress and the senate (majority democrat at the time). Also, dems were rattling sabers just as viciously as everyone else. Your short minded memory only proves how biased you are when it comes to truth. The vote on the war was also brought forth by information supplied by the UN and other foriegn intell (Germany, France, Russia, ect). Seriously, the "balme Bush" BS is really childish at this point.

What do you mean they were not there before Bush? They have been there for generations that country has been at war with itself forever

Guess again. Iraq was a very stable country and as close as you can get in the Middle East to secular. Women dressed as they pleased, were educated, held important jobs and government positions. Saddam did not tolerate religious extremism and he most certainly did not tolerate anyone undermining his despotic rule with terrorism.

Wake up Ak Sabin!! Your the one with the short memory!! You had George Bush and Chenny pulling in every favor they could to start this war. They lied to the U.N., lied to congress, and lied to the American people about the intelligence. They outed a CIA operative that knew there were no WMD's. They amassed a staff of "yes men" to spread the rumors and they brain washed them so bad that Condi and Rumpsfeld still believe they had WMDs. They spent billions and amassed the Army before going to congress for the vote. They also managed an AMAZING accounting trick!! They money spent did not show up on the books for years, almost until the end of their terms....hmmmm. Their was no way it was not going to happen, and that one my friend lies squarely on Bush and Chenny. To deny that fact, republicain or democrat, only opens the door for it to happen again.

Cassie321:

YOU WROTE: "Saddam did not tolerate religious extremism and he most certainly did not tolerate anyone undermining his despotic rule with terrorism."

MY RESPONSE: You are grossly misinformed! Saddam Hussein, himself, was an extremist AND a terrorist AND a weapon of mass destruction all rolled into one!

Here’s proof: Saddam Hussein became president of Iraq on July 16, 1979, and was deposed in April of 2003. Over that twenty-four year period, Saddam Hussein killed an estimated 800,000 Iraqi civilians, was responsible for the deaths of 400,000 Iraqi military personnel and over 700,000 Iranians and Kuwaitis. AND HE GASSED THE KURDS!

Utilizing ONLY THE IRAQI CIVILIAN NUMBERS, this is an average of approximately 2,800 Iraqi citizens killed by Saddam Hussein per month. And there were no indications that such killings would stop while he was in power. However, the United States toppled Saddam Hussein almost 102 months ago as of now.

So, if Saddam had remained in power for those 102 months, more than 285,600 ADDITIONAL Iraqi civilians would have died at his hands – children starved in prisons, whole villages gassed into oblivion, dissidents fed through industrial shredders, women strangled after visits to rape rooms, all to be eventually reunited in remote mass graves.

And you suggest that Saddam Hussein was harmless to both us and the region? And he didn’t use terrorism as his guiding principle? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh!

MMC(SS):

YOU WROTE: "Wake up...You had George Bush and Chenny pulling in every favor they could to start this war. They lied to the U.N., lied to congress, and lied to the American people about the intelligence. They outed a CIA operative that knew there were no WMD's. They amassed a staff of "yes men" to spread the rumors and they brain washed them so bad that Condi and Rumpsfeld still believe they had WMDs."

MY RESPONSE: The WMD capacity of Iraq was a known threat all through the 80's and early 90's. We know, for a fact, that Saddam's government manufactured, stockpiled and even used WMDs (they gassed the Kurds during the Iran/Iraq war circa 1989 or so).

Saddam continued to impress upon his regional neighbors that his WMD program was still active through the 90's and up until the US invasion. It was only after his government was toppled that it was revealed that his WMD program had been largely defunded and the manufacturing plants either re-purposed or left derelict. That was why he kept misleading Hans Blix (who, for his part, was in no way convinced the WMD program was still active). But Saddam wanted there to be some ambiguity as to what his country's actual capabilities were - he even said as much in his final interviews before his own countrymen hanged him. He said that the threat of WMDs was the only thing keeping Iran in check. He was terrified of his neighbor and wanted to avoid another war with them, so he threatened them with non-existent WMD stockpiles. Many of the worlds' intelligence experts believed the misinformation propagated by Saddam himself. This was not a hobgoblin of their invention. It was Saddam's - and, for that matter, I just want to point out that the US found stockpiles of chemical weapons, but they had all passed their shelf-life and had degenerated into more or less harmless compounds.

Check this out:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/07/01/AR2009070104217.html

and here's some excerpts from the wiki regarding Iraq's program:

On May 2, 2004, a shell containing mustard gas was found in the middle of a street west of Baghdad. The Iraq Survey Group investigation reported that it had been previously "stored improperly", and thus the gas was "ineffective" as a useful chemical agent. Officials from the Defense Department commented that they were not certain if use was to be made of the device as a bomb.

Cassie321 and MMC(SS):

Let me get this straight: Even though we knew for certain that Saddam Hussein ONCE POSSESSED AND USED WMD against the Iranians AND against his own people, and even though various intelligence services around the world (UK, Canada, Australia, Egypt, and Jordan, for example) concluded that Saddam STILL stockpiled WMD, and even though the head of the CIA (George Tenet) answered “It’s a slam-dunk” when asked if Saddam still had WMD, and even though those intelligence services are manned by professional intelligence analysts working Iraq full-time (and the president isn’t even trained as an intelligence analyst), and even though 29 powerful Democrats are on record warning of the danger Saddam posed to the U.S.A., and even though the Bush-haters continually carp that Bush is dumb, you still feel that President Bush should have been smart enough to trump all the information/advice he was getting at the time because he somehow should have known better than all those trained professionals/specialists? And you really think that would have been a reasonable reaction for President Bush to take? Because if you do, then I can only conclude that YOU are more twisted than you think George Bush is.

I can easily imagine the outrage that would have ensued from Democrats if George Bush had overruled the intelligence professionals/specialists and came to his own conclusion that the intelligence was bogus, and then we got hit by WMD traced back to Iraq. The Democrats would have railed that George Bush completely ignored the advice of a plethora of professionals/specialists and because of his stupidity, the U.S.A. had to suffer the consequences of a mass loss of life. He would have been impeached, and I would have supported that impeachment.

Rhonda--

And you suggest that Saddam Hussein was harmless to both us and the region? And he didn't use terrorism as his guiding principle? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh!

No, no. Of course not. I said he was a despot. He and his sons were animals to be shot in the street.

However... the Kurds don't count. Of course they count as people, but they were at war with Saddam and Saddam won through despicable actions. It's a brutal place with a brutal culture.

As for how many Iraqi's Saddam put to death each month, I don't think anyone knows. But I suspect it was a lot. The question is, how many were innocent? I still suspect quite a lot.

But many, if not most, people lived a fairly decent life. They had utilities, universities, jobs. Now most live in total chaos and hell. How is that an improvement?

As for George Bush, he should have been hanged the day after Saddam. He is a traitor to the United States who gave safe passage to the bin Laden family after 911 and prevented our military from going after the man who masterminded war on our country, and actually kissed and held hands with the prince of the country responsible. He's a traitor. He needs to be tried and executed according to our law.

Cassie321:

YOU WROTE: "As for George Bush, he should have been hanged the day after Saddam. He is a traitor to the United States who gave safe passage to the bin Laden family after 911 and prevented our military from going after the man who masterminded war on our country, and actually kissed and held hands with the prince of the country responsible. He's a traitor. He needs to be tried and executed according to our law."

MY RESPONSE: Don't you think that's a bit EXTREME? Bill Clinton let Osama Bin Laden go, too, when the Sudanese offered to hand him over to us for NOTHING in return. Instead, Bill Clinton was too busy having a sexual daliance with an intern young enough to be his daughter. So, shouldn't Bill Clinton be hanged, too, according to your "reasoning"?

The conclusion I've reached from everything I've read about our reasons for invading Iraq follows: the Bush administration and just about every other intelligence organization expressing an opinion (friend and foe alike) truly believed that Saddam Hussein had WMD. He even proved it with poison gas attacks against his own people and against Iranian troops.

So, given Saddam's hatred of the US (which humiliated him in Desert Storm), his tendency to stockpile and use WMD, and his affiliation with terrorism (he was paying$10,000 to each family of Hamas suicide bombers), I believe the Bush administration feared that Saddam would provide terrorists with a chemical, biological, radiological, or at least some type of dirty bomb for an attack against a major US city. I can't prove that with documentation, but the snippets of evidenceI just described logically point in that direction.

I do believe that securing our source of oil from that region had some relevance to our invasion, but not much when compared to the fear of being hit by WMD on our home turf. And if I'm correct in my assessment, I think George Bush did the right thing at that time in that place, given everything we knew and realistically feared in the context of the 9/11 attack, which was still a fresh memory.

In addition, even though the Iraqis signed a peace agreement after Desert Storm, they kept shooting at our aircraft and tried to assassinate former President Bush (the elder). President Clinton (in office at the time) even said the "Iraqi attack against President Bush was an ATTACK AGAINST OUR COUNTRY AND AGAINST ALL AMERICANS."

So, let me ask you this: would you say that WWII really ended if the Japanese tried to kill a former president and kept shooting at our airplanes shortly after they surrendered? It seems to me that Desert Storm never actually ended. And the Iraqi's continued to defy about 17 UN resolutions to boot.

The US saved a lot of lives by ridding the world of Saddam Hussein (see my earlier comment), whether that was our primary intent or not. The fact is that George Bush freed more Muslims (especially women) than any other world leader in recent memory. And that's a good thing. The Muslims in Iraq and Afghanistan now have the opportunity for the first time in generations to embrace a Democratic style of government. Whether or not they choose to do so is on them, not us. As the old saying goes, "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink it."

Most of the personal attacks I've read about George W. Bush are based upon mindless hatred, hysteria, and ignorance. He wasn't perfect (nobody is), but he also wasn't as bad as some people claim.

Honestly, I just don't feel like debating it with you. I would end up spending an hour for no purpose. I too have many reasons for my position on the subject, and we aren't going to change each other's mind.

Best wishes to you.

Cassie321:

I agree that you and I have many reasons for our opposing views about Iraq, Saddam Hussein, and George Bush. However, the views you've posted so far, apparently are rooted in gross misinformation about Iraq and Saddam Hussein coupled with an irrational hatred of George Bush. In other words, your posted comments are the words of an extremist.

You wrote about Saddam Hussein with mild wording while simultaneously suggesting that George Bush should be quickly hanged for treason. Fortunately, the Iraqi people know better than you do - they hanged Saddam Hussein for premeditated crimes against his own people, i.e. treason. Do you think they hanged the wrong person?

Cassie321:

I'm trying to help you out here by listing several quotes made by high-ranking Democrat leaders, who voiced their opinion about Saddam Hussein and his behavior prior to our invasion. Maybe you've never seen these quotes before, so they should be educational:

"Saddam's goal ... is to achieve the lifting of U.N. sanctions while retaining and enhancing Iraq's weapons of mass destruction programs. We cannot, we must not and we will not let him succeed." -- Madeline Albright, 1998

"Iraq made commitments after the Gulf War to completely dismantle all weapons of mass destruction, and unfortunately, Iraq has not lived up to its agreement." -- Barbara Boxer, November 8, 2002

"The community of nations may see more and more of the very kind of threat Iraq poses now: a rogue state with weapons of mass destruction, ready to use them or provide them to terrorists. If we fail to respond today, Saddam and all those who would follow in his footsteps will be emboldened tomorrow." -- Bill Clinton in 1998

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including Al Qaeda members, though there is apparently no evidence of his involvement in the terrible events of September 11, 2001. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons. Should he succeed in that endeavor, he could alter the political and security landscape of the Middle East, which as we know all too well affects American security." -- Hillary Clinton, October 10, 2002

"Iraq is not the only nation in the world to possess weapons of mass destruction, but it is the only nation with a leader who has used them against his own people." -- Tom Daschle in 1998

"Iraq does pose a serious threat to the stability of the Persian Gulf and we should organize an international coalition to eliminate his access to weapons of mass destruction. Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to completely deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power." -- Al Gore, 2002

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction." -- Ted Kennedy, September 27, 2002

"There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein's regime is a serious danger, that he is a tyrant, and that his pursuit of lethal weapons of mass destruction cannot be tolerated. He must be disarmed." -- Ted Kennedy, Sept 27, 2002

"As a member of the House Intelligence Committee, I am keenly aware that the proliferation of chemical and biological weapons is an issue of grave importance to all nations. Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process." -- Nancy Pelosi, December 16, 1998

OR, HOW ABOUT THESE DIRE WARNINGS AND CALLS FOR ACTION?

We urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs." Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others Oct. 9, 1998.

"There is no doubt that Saddam Hussein has reinvigorated his weapons programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of an illicit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the United States and our allies."
Letter to President Bush, Signed by Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL,) and others, Dec, 5, 2001.

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of delivering them."
Sen. Carl Levin (d, MI), Sept. 19, 2002.

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002.

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force, if necessary, to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002.

So, what was president George W. Bush supposed to do?..Ignore all of the above "sage advice" he was getting from the Democrat leadership? And you want to hang him for treason? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh!

Innocent Women and Children too?

there is no innocents in that country. if you look at it the women and children were also involved in suicide bombings just because they knew Americans wouldn't shoot them when they came to areas of interest

When Saddam was removed the factions that have hated each other started killing each other. Saddam was removed because we removed him. Libs do care that people from other countries don't kill each other but libs care more about protecting the lives of our troops than wasting them in a useless, pointless, and stupid misadventure. What is happening now is proof enough. Not too bright are you. But then again, you only parrot slogans fed to you by you puppet masters.

The fact most democrats in congress voted in favor of the war despite most ordinary liberals opposing it just goes to show how un-representative our representative government is.

US101, so Bush and Cheney were libs???? I don't get it, and frankly neither do you. The day Americans throw those the labels way (lib, repub, dem, etc) and vote for a person and not a party,is the day we will retake our government. Intelligent people, like yourself, that are fooled into believing that one party is better than the other is how we ended up in this mess. " I vote Republican because my dad did" or "Republicans are fiscal Conservatives" or "democrats are socialists", its crap, its all crap, it stopped being true 25 years ago!!!!. The party's have not had a platforms or even governed by what their "base" would want them to do in just about that long. Use your head, researchyour candidate, vote for a person not a party, and keep voting them out until someone stands up and proposes real legislation for ethics reform in congress, campaign reform, and tax reform. Some say "you can't legislate morality", well I think we can. I think that if we can hold a 18 year old kid to a "higher standard", just because he volunteered to put his life on the line for this country, we surely should be allowed to do the same with the people that are educated, hold a "public office", vote to send our kids to war, and get paid hundreds of thousands while using their office to make millions. If any of the young dedicated men and woman I trained would have done any of the things that our congressmen and woman do on a daily basis, they would be hanging out in a small town in Kansas breaking rocks for the rest of their lives and be called "traitors" or a "discrace the uniform".

I challenge that George Jr. thinks.. Cheney has a pre-programed list for Georgie to listen to in order to make it thru the day.