Not there.

"If other things we hear about them are true, like sucking each other's blood or worshipping the devil, that is not accepted in our society." WTF?

It's about the fifth century over there.

Those darn westerners ....

DEVIL WORSHIP GONE WRONG It is presumed that the stoners are Shiites,but deciphering language the word Brigades and Mujadideen are used by Sunnis- especially by Saudi Arabian wahhabi/salafist imams. Stoning and beheading are the trademarks of Wahhabists. Saudi Arabia after almost 20 years reopened just lately its embassy in Baghdad and in Iranian papers;and Asian papers it was out of the ordinary and why? Al Arabiiya is like Al Jazeera- exaggeration and biased reporting can cause illiterate people to believe anythin, what they see on TV and hear on radio. Gothic clothing-rings on ears,tongues and noses with black kohl on eyes,black lipstick and nail polish and the hair styles- where did they get their garb-. The stoning,beating,killings is unacceptable and since Iraq is in UN and has signed on Human Rights- it is about time for the Iraqi g'ment to step upto the plate.

A little like dragging someone behind a truck because they were black (recent) or beating someone to death because they were gay (also recent). We have our share of the illiterate, violent, and hateful in our society. We also have our share of those with societal influence that encourage such activity.

Holt Crap! Is this really the 21st century??

I don't know, seems that even in America we have crazies fighting Satan.

http://educate-yourself.org/ps/satanismamericatoday14jul01.shtml

AHHH Don't the militants know how emo kids work? You tell them to just act like everyone else and they do the exact opposite. O.O If you wanted them to go back to being your version of "normal" you should have started dressing "emo" yourselves. That would've made them stop. :)

These are the people we spent a fortune and sacrificed thousands of American lives "liberating." They go around killing teenagers because of the way they dress in the name of their perverted view of Islam. Even their top religious leaders are speaking out against these killings, but that is not likely to stop them. These fanatics see it as their duty to go out and kill anyone who does not follow their rules about how you should live. If the government of Iraq really wanted to put a stop to this they would start arresting these Mujahideen and charging them with murder. Unfortunately, the government is scared of these religious nuts and the unrest that would result from taking any action against them, so these killings will likely continue. Even as the government and religious leaders publicly condemns these killings, behind the scenes they are just as happy to see this counterculture crushed. This is because this liberal minded counterculture represents a threat to their rule. These young kids who are embracing this freedom to express themselves are not going to go along with a society whose rules are based on a backwards, repressive interpretation of Islam. If their ranks are allowed to grow it would represent a serious threat to the current government. This is why despite the public condemnations of these killings, no real action will be taken to put a stop to them.

John-541517 actually, in the 5th century they were doing better, at that time they were not Muslims yet, but we got rid off secular Saddam.

@ jim.....not near enough

@John-541517 The 5th century was more civilized than these savages.

If the world was full of Emos, there probably wouldn't be any wars, so that makes people who love peace -- emos -- right? Jesus, in 00 girl jeans -- just couldn't resist the temptation -- sorry....

AMEN to all on this blog who raise the insanity of what the f*ck the U.S. thought it was doing in Iraq! Up until now, all the neo-cons and their supporters liked to claim that Saddam was a bad guy, killed his own people, etc. and therefore we had to get rid of him. Too bad he wasn't a clear and present danger to the U.S. or its allies; those old standards for committing the U.S. to war just didn't work anymore.

So what do we have now? The direct result of our actions is the rise of the Shiites to control of Iraq, along with the regional influence of Shiite Iran. Prior to that, both were kept in check by Sunni Iraq. This situation was in the U.S. and the West's best interests, not to mention Saudi Arabia.

I think it just goes to prove that every time we get involved in ME affairs we wind up screwing it up somehow.

Those kid dress weird but women wearing head to toe bee keeper outfits that make them look like little black cousin its is gods will? Glad our religious nuts stick mostly to god said no electricity and horse good car bad insanity. Marx was right about one thing. Religion is truly the opiate of the masses.

Yes this is the twenty first century. But the twenty first century to one person looks a lot different than the twenty first century to another person. The world isn't the same. Lifestyles arent the same.

Well, that ain't nothing. We get a hell of a lot more stoned to death every day in the US.

Although, generally by choice ... poor though it may be.

They got their stupid. We got ours.

Stoning teenagers to death is definitely not cool!!!!

This is what happens when religious zealotry runs amok. Certain regions/countries on this planet need dictators in order to function. Tragic. Makes one wonder what's going to happen to Iraq when Muqtaddah al Sadr's Mahdi gang take over and take over they will AFTER the civil war. The the west will have Iran AND Iraq to deal with.

The Gorilla cult of Islam is on a killing rampage again. Do they enjoy the screams of their beloved children?

Their own Interior Minister calling for a crack down on kids acting like kids. This is what happens when religion gets a strangle hold on a civilization. All you Evangelicals out there should pay close attention to this story because this is what you've been pushing so hard to get in America ......... RELIGIOUS INTOLERANCE AND BIGOTRY.

I wonder if our embassy in Iraq is aware of this and, if so, what if anything they are doing about it. Shouldn't they at least be filing some sort of complaint against the Iraqi government for human rights violations or something? We spent millions of dollars to build the world's largest embassy there. What are they doing?

"Those who believe absurdities will commit atrocities."

Everyone likes to set the blame totally on Bush and Cheney, but plenty of Democrats voted to send our troops there, both times.
I was not in favor of the second invasion. I favored the first because Kuwait had been invaded and occupied. One of my co-workers at the time, was from there and had family still there. He was grateful we freed his country. The second action was internal and we shouldn't have gone in, just as we didn't belong in Egypt, Syria, Libya or any other country experiencing "Arab Spring" unrest.

Just to remind you self-righteous Libs out there, here is what the Senators and Congresspeople you support said about Iraq:

2002- Nancy Pelosi, Representative(D/CA): "Saddam Hussein certainly has chemical and biological weapons. There's no question about that."

2002- Jay Rockefeller, Senator(D-WV): "There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years. We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress that Saddam Hussein has been able to make in the development of weapons of mass destruction."

2002- Joe Biden, Senator(D-DE): "We know he continues to attempt to gain access to additional capability, including nuclear capability.There is a real debate on how far off that is; whether it's a matter of years or whether it's a matter of less than that.And so, there's much we don't know."

2002- Harry Reid, Senator(D-NV): "Saddam Hussein, in effect, has thumbed his nose at the world community and I think that the president(Bush) is approaching this in the right fashion."

2002- Hillary Clinton, Senator(D-NY), when asked, "Do you believe we could have disarmament without regime (Saddam Hussein) change?", answered, "I doubt it. I can support the president. I can support an action against Saddam Hussein because I think it's in the long term interest of our national security."

2003- John Edwards,Senator(D-NC): "Serving on the intelligence commity,and seeing, day after day and week after week briefings on Saddam's weapons of mass destruction and his plans on using those weapons. He can not be allowed to have nuclear weapons.It's just that simple."

These are the words of your political heroes that you claim were against invading Iraq and removing Hussein. How conveniently you all forget. I listened to most of these Pols speak in favor of the invasion. It's like I learned in Kindergarten. When you point a finger at someone, remember that you have four pointing back at you.

I can't wait to see the mullahs choke when the saggy-pants-asscrack look catches on.

Just more of muslims being muslims. Stoning of kids just because they don't like their haircuts or approve of the way they're dressed. On the sign post ahead. Welcome to Iraq, you are now in the 6th century.

Your timeline is a bit off, STexan. Bush was still president and things began to deteriorate. Remember TARP? Your fellow Texan initiated the bailouts and Obama just continued the same policy. You know why? Because it was the correct decision.

I misunderstood your post STexan. However, things are deteriorating in Iraq because we are no longer there. This was to be expected. I'm pretty sure exactly 0 Americans would want us to still be in there, so the fact that things have deteriorated in Iraq cannot be blamed on Obama. Us getting out of there was the right thing to do. If you disagree, I have a song for you: "One, is the loneliest number..."

What are you all yelping about? We're the ones who caused this. Saddam Hussein would have never tolerated this crap. People dressed as they pleased, including women.

Iraq's interior ministry drew attention to the "emo" subculture last month, labeling it "Satanism"

I'm sure things like this really make Iraq veterans feel their time was well-spent

People being governed and policed by a Theocratic system of laws and beliefs and no appeal available.

Thanks to our Founding Father's and the US Constitution with our VERY FIRST Amendment in The BILL OF RIGHTS.....Freedom of Religion, Freedom of Speech....FREEDOM.

Secular government...it has been good enough for the last 200 + years....it is still the best today.

Damn stoners.

The "religion of peace" at it again.

Thank you Dan-299885 for helping point out what I am sure all the people you mentioned hope we will quickly forget; to listen Peolsi, Reid, etc, etc now you would think they were all against it and Bush did it all alone despite their unflagging efforts to stand in his way.

Of course, we must remember that one of the qualifications for being a politicians is that you must be able to talk out of both sides of your mouth at the same time and say totally different things - regardless of them being utterly inconsistent with each other - to totally different constituencies.

PLUS be well gifted at reversing one's firm position on a multiplicity of issues (i.e. the Democrats won't take PAC money) at the drop of a hat when it appears one is going ot lose you votes or prove unprofitable as in the case of our current President.

Violent, reactionary Intolerance is indicative of an absence of a cosmopolitan education. But I'm sure they're opposed to anyone getting a higher education, as well. If their tribesmen and followers knew better, these religious radicals would lose their power base, and they know it.

... I should also add that my argument also applies to the intolerant, religious right-wing in the U.S.

What a difference a secular, college education can make, to motivate people to engage in constructive, rewarding acts to improve their world, and by doing so, improve the perception others have of your culture or society.

(...Of course, if this Rennaissance-Era concept sounds too "liberal" for your tastes, perhaps the world of Europe's "Dark Ages," will be more to your liking).

Hey Dan -

GWB and Dick Cheney lied to congress about the evidence of Biologic/Chemical weapons just like they lied to the UN, the Country and the World.

So, if some politicians vote for something, like sending troops to Iraq, because the people that hold the intelligence blatantly and purposefully lie whose fault it it?

Need to know anything else to figure out the Iranian leaders are evil? Or their so called religion of peace and understanding?

Of course this was in the country we freed supposedly. But my point is the whole friggin place is crazy.

Dan-299885

Everyone likes to set the blame totally on Bush and Cheney, but plenty of Democrats voted to send our troops there, both times.

Still trying to sell that? Even Dick Armey was quoted as saying, "I deserved better than to be bull@!$%#ted by VP Cheney." We all know that Congress voted based on "yellow cake lies."

After

Dead and disabled US service members, 60K dead civilians, a theocracy, religious violence, suicide bombers, bombed out infrastructure with 6-8 hours of electricity, and over 70% of Iraqis say they were better off under Sadam.

Before

No fly zone, oil for food program, no religious violence tolerated, and a buffer that kept Iran in place.

Bush's legacy- destroyed a country in 8 years. With 2 wars he cut taxes that the US hadn't seen since Truman was President and paved the way for "Citizens United" SCOTUS standing by appointed sock puppets to the SCOTUS. All but eliminated the Middle Class and accelerated the end of an empire.

and the sad part......most everything they wear is made in China....

Everyone likes to set the blame totally on Bush and Cheney, but plenty of Democrats voted to send our troops there, both times.

Bush could have always said no to invading Iraq. The last I checked the buck was supposed to stop with him.

We sent our young men and women there to free them from tyranny...... all we accomplished was freeing hundreds of new tyrants to lash out at whoever they want to. The only good part is as long as they fight each other they will hopefully leave the rest of us alone.

Yes, we have groups here that are just as twisted; we have (allegedly 1200) militias, a multitude of gangs, motorcycle gangs and the KKK, the ONLY difference is we don't praise them .......we expect the people who commit murders HERE to be caught and locked away.

hope those people in iraq... don't blame the people of the united states...for the war crimes committed by our government...we just vote them into office they do what they want to...oh well...

Quit whinningnow, better do some research. The national Security commission, Congress and others had the same info as Bush. That it was flawed, no one knew until after the fact. Everyone knew Saddam had WMD - he used them on the Kurds. Where did they go? Try Syria. he knew we were going to visit him, so.... .Pelosi, reid, and the vast majority of Congress voted to go. A few did not. In WWI and WWII, we fought an enemy in uniforms. In Korea, Vietnam, we fought an enemy that lookied like our allies. In Iraq, and Afghanistan, we fight an enemy thet we cannot see, or is hiding in Mosques, Hospitals, and people's homes. Idiot politicians should never attempt to run a war. If you want to know what our military is going to do next, just watch the news. The embedded reporters tell every thing thy hear or see. Including troopovements, and locations. how do you fight a war like that? Watch and read the news,the Muslims do.

I'm more worry about some of these Christians that running for Office.

wonder why we never have anyone... from over there comment...on the vine...wish they would...

wolfpack2000,

Of course you do. Christians are known for stoning teenagers to death.

You don't like religion. I get it. But not giving reasons why you worry about the Christians coming to get you out of bed and taking you out for stoning makes your statement weak. Try again with facts. Then tell me how American Christians take folks out to a public place and kill them by stoning.

Go back at least 100 years and find one case. I dare you.

And this what American Service-men and Women fought and died for?

More of that warm Muslim Community outreach I suppose.

Dear Iraqi teens:

The world outside your own country is better.

BETTER.

Your country, your leaders, the way your religion is twisted to evil ends is WRONG and BACKWARDS.

Stand up and fight. You can do better than this.

Well, that ain't nothing. We get a hell of a lot more stoned to death every day in the US.

Although, generally by choice ... poor though it may be.

They got their stupid. We got ours.

torngenes... Torn Genes?? right! Got it!! Absolutely!!

and the sad part......most everything they wear is made in China....

madmilker

Now that's funny; but I suspect many Viner's won't Get It.

Take any loads of books and assemble all brains, still none of the theories will work with religious mad people, especially Islamic ones.

If most of the Sunnis are 100 percent untreatably mad, Shiites are at least 80 percent.

Keep a mile away from a Muslim nation, especially ME ones.

Inside the US and and other non-Muslim nations keep away from these mad people as far as possible.

This is why islam should be classified as an organization and not a religion. It has no problem killing ANYONE it finds undesirable and not worthy of membership. No free, independent thinking person could ever keep in good standing in a religion such as islam. Stoning kids to death in the name of islam over the clothes they wear is in no way a religion or close to god. The U.S. should ban the islamic religion/organization.

The following sounds exactly what a devout followers of god would say and do to someone.

"We strongly warn you, to all the obscene males and females, if you will not leave this filthy work within four days the punishment of God will descend upon you at the hand of the Mujahideen," the leaflet said.

Another leaflet in Sadr City bore 20 names. "We are the Brigades of Anger. We warn you, if you do not get back to sanity and the right path, you will be killed," it said.

Maybe it's time that Christian faiths such as catholics, baptists, etc.. stand together as one and protest this terror organization. Where are all the supposedly peace loving muslims at while this murder is happening? Why aren't they out there protesting and speaking up against these acts? Burn a quran and the muslim population is up in arms. Kill a muslim because he/she wears tight jeans and you hear nothing. The silence of these peaceful people is total endorsment.

The article mentioned nothing about the parents' response to having their children stoned to death.

I wonder; do the parents think their children should be killed for wearing 'unacceptable' clothing? Do such killings restore any sort of 'honor' to the families of the dead? Do other areas of the 'conservative' Muslim world agree with the reasoning behind these killings?

Just how sick IS this portion of Iraqi society?

will lets go back to all the blacks being hang in the south in the early 20th century upto the 1940's! By rightwing nuts, religous bigots know as the KKK all white christians and that isn't even a 100 years!!!

@Touchdownandplay

That's easy.....first, the stoning of these kids are just a few and nothing more but our very own GEORGE W BUSH jr had people killed by the hundred of thousands. He called these people as evil doer and he try to convinced the entire World with a lie about the WEAPON OF MASS DESTRUCTION so we can go to WAR against Iraq.

Now, that's what Christian in controll do with his POWER.

I don't think I will ever understand the barbaric and neolithic mindset that would stone anybody to death, especially children and teenagers!

This is what happens when fundamentalist religion has the political control to enforse its beliefs. Saddam was a political SOB but he was also very secular because he knew that giving either the Shiia or Sunni political power would servely weaken his control over the state. When we removed Saddam in 2003 the i in Iran took joined with their Shiite brothers and sisters in much of Iraq and now you are seeing the result of their violanet fundamentalist religious laws. If we invade Iran in an attempt to limit their weapons the situation will only get worse.

These very acts were predicated by many of us in the anti-war movement but we were ignored or called trailors in 2002-03.

Electing Santorum will allow fundamentalist Christians to take control of the US and we will witness similar actions when they try to enforce their religious laws with the help of the state.It is bad enough that fundamentalist religions exist but giving them the political power to enforce their views is a recipe for a bloody disaster

looks like they...need to listen to this...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pn0ZInu1czY&feature=related

Hell the EMO chicks are adorable. leave em be. No different than each generation...damned beatniks...damned rock and rollers...damned Beatles fans, ....damned hippies, ....damned stoners,... damned disco freaks,.... damned Urban cowboys, etc etc......

To the clown who said everyone else also had the same flawed info for starting Iraq war......as Bush/Cheney.....Hello.......Bush/Cheney/ Rumsfeldt, and cronies FED them the info........The lies........It is a fact!

In reality this is nothing more than Rightwing Religious Nutbaggery .... Middle Eastern Style. If these crackpots get control of this country....we can look forward to similar incidences happening here.

So the Animals killing other Animals in USA for their new Jordans are right wing nut bags?

Same result different path. It is all about controlling others.

blaise - kkk/christian comment - that wasn't being done in the name of any religion. That was a period of ethnic crimes, like sunni on shiite. Iraqi on Kurd.

A previous poster had it right though.....
COMING SOON TO A THEATER NEAR YOU: IF YOU LIKED IRAQ, YOU'LL LOVE IRAN!!! You know the repubs will do it... and if something really BAD (nuclear) happens in Arabia... sooner than that.

wolfpack2000

sorry bud. You need your head checked.

What is to say that this is not serial murderer at work mascarading as some religious zealot, amping up others to get them to lynch the children in this area?

It is so easy these days to say that all these sort of stoning and beating death is the work of the usual righteousness impaired rather than simply the work of murderers who enjoy torturing their victims first.

Or perhaps this is just a Spanish? style Inquisition (I forget which, there have been so many through the ages all over the world) or the Iraqi Inquisititon.... instead of the rack or the wheel you get the brick and bat deal.... Hmmmm

On the other hand we have had our moments of uncivilized intolerant behaviour too... with the lynchings and the cross burning etc including the beatings to death and dragging behind the vehicle of people who are not like, behave like us or share our particular beliefs. We also have the old run of the mill serial murderers and even with canibalism thrown in for good measure. Even the let me take you all with me type too a la Jim Jones and other cult thing.

These days we call it hate crimes and when caught the person or persons after being convicted is usually sentenced to the equally uncivilized death by needle or zzzzapping. Unfortunately the downside with the death penalty is that sometimes innocent people are killed in the name of us, the citizens of which ever State, under the 2 wrongs make a right theory.

Thing though.. if these youngsters are aware that that dress/music is forbidden, why court death for some thing as nonsensical as a style of dress or even music. One could understand if one was fighting for peace, the vote, equality, education for all, to stop beheadings, stonings etc.... but if one is to die for something, at least die for something more meaningful than 1980s style music and pointy hair from the West imo. (perhaps they should have listened to reggae like Bob Marley and the like, soul, a bit of blues and a tad of jazz, although I did like ' little red corvette' by Prince)

What a waste of potential. Who knows what these teenagers could have grown up to be? Or what good they may have brought to the world. Hope their parents did not agree with this 'punishment' as an example to others, murders.

'Stiff necked fools, you think you are cool, to deny me for my simplicity'.... Ah the late but great Bob Marley....

It's democracy islam style in action, specially when a shallow narrow minded interior minister started the the whole thing. There is no such thing as freedom of expression in muslim states,is not allowed period. no competition with islam the stanic verses cult. The illiterate imams/ clerics has direct contact with their so called allah and dispense their personal opinion under pretext/disguise of their so called allah spoke to them

Touchdownplay,

Does it matter if it's stoning or beatings or being drug behind a ruck or a lynching? Death is death and there are plenty of cases of Christians killing people who are different than themselves. And if they themselves don't do the act, they certainly condone it. (Just for clarification, this is not to say all Christians are like this. This is in response to the assertion that Christians don't "stone" people. ) The method doesn't matter. Terror and killing are one in the same.

rossj503

Just for you I will explain, there are very may evil people in this world that we all share. There are some who tell you they will provide for you as long as you obey. I don't wish to obey. I wish to make my own way and not have to rely on others to feed me. I also care not is you want to hurt yourself for whatever reason you want. I do have a problem with the folks who want everyone else to have the GOVERNMENT take what I make and give it to someone who can work and pay their own way give it to them.

Simple.

I do not have a problem with folks who need a hand up getting it.

I do have a problem with people who make a living off of the compassion of others and figure that is the moral way of screwing their neighbors.

By the way. Tomorrow I am coming over for dinner. I expect it will cost me nothing.

Ya, WT heck.

I need the address.

@Touchdownplay

Holy $hit....that's your response???

How about the comment by Blaise2933064 above my last post???

What no reponse to that???? yeah i thought so....Now go stick your head in a hole and hide by pretending nothing had happened.

Hear that children of Iraq, this is what freedom tastes like... Operation Iraqi Freedom Success!!!

plain bob - wonder why we never have anyone... from over there comment...on the vine...wish they would...

Because like in my case having been involved with Iraq since the US Military Training Teams to US Ally Iraq during the Iran Iraq Wars. As well as still every so often catching the diplomatic flight from here (Afghanistan) to Iraq.

As soon as we post something the first thing that happens is the name calling, then the collapsing of posts, then wrongful bias complaints to the Newsvine moderators. So then we just shrug our shoulders and laugh because you refuse to learn from our mistakes, so that in less than 3 months after most of the "Middle East" Qualified (Languages Farsi, Arabic and Culture Islam) go on President Obama's Forced Retirements as part of this Reduction In Forces of the US Military, or like the rest of us "Too Old" and going back on Retirement again.

Geturheadoutofurazz! - AMEN to all on this blog who raise the insanity of what the f*ck the U.S. thought it was doing in Iraq!

FYI, Newsvine is NOT a Blog to fling emotive non factual opinions around. Newsvine is a Forum to discuss Facts with the stated purpose of "Get Smarter Here".

mimi jacques - DEVIL WORSHIP GONE WRONG It is presumed that the stoners are Shiites,but deciphering language the word Brigades and Mujadideen are used by Sunnis- especially by Saudi Arabian wahhabi/salafist imams. Stoning and beheading are the trademarks of Wahhabists.

Nice failed attempt to Deflect the Blame. Saudi Arabia, Sunnis, "Moderate", "Modern" Interpretation of the Holy Koran (Quran), Shiites, Shia (deriviative Sharia (as in Sharia Laws), Fundamentalist Interpretation of the Holy Koran (Quran). It is the Interpretation of the Holy Koran that has kept the Sunnis and Shia killing each other for Centuries.

And do not say that I am wrong as to implement US Law H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998", we were sent in blind into Iraq to hire hundreds of thousands of Shia Iraqis as assassins and insurgents to Overthrow President Hussein and the Iraqis Government using the differences and hatred between the Sunnis and Shia. As the majority of the Shia at Iraq generations ago came from Fundamentalist Islamic Iran as to why I could communicate with them since my first Middle East Language to become "Middle East" Qualified was Farsi, as to communicate with them in Arabic was to only make them think that you are one of their oppressors, the same thing with communicating with the Kurdistanis (their form of Farsi).

So: durt_bagg, lolfattynerdswhoknew, sandtrich, Quit whining now, don_draper, bicfj, et al. Nice FAILED attempt at Bush Bashing from those that were non participants (we do like to know if we are going to follow IllegalOrders to cover our arses). And NO the US President cannot refuse to enforce a Fully Funded and approved US Congressional Law.

You want to keep deflecting the blame about Weapons of Mass Destruction from "I did not have sex with that woman" to Bush without reading the 1998 State of the Union Address (when Bush was NOT President):

Together we must also confront the new hazards of chemical and biological weapons, and the outlaw states, terrorists and organized criminals seeking to acquire them. Saddam Hussein has spent the better part of this decade, and much of his nation's wealth, not on providing for the Iraqi people, but on developing nuclear, chemical and biological weapons and the missiles to deliver them. The United Nations weapons inspectors have done a truly remarkable job, finding and destroying more of Iraq's arsenal than was destroyed during the entire gulf war. Now, Saddam Hussein wants to stop them from completing their mission. I know I speak for everyone in this chamber, Republicans and Democrats, when I say to Saddam Hussein, "You cannot defy the will of the world", and when I say to him, "You have used weapons of mass destruction before; we are determined to deny you the capacity to use them again.

And as demanded he got US Law H.R.4655, "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998", Justification Section 2 "Findings" Weapons of Mass Destruction, based on you previous Newsvine Posts I know that you will not even do the research into what I experienced Firsthand (had to do at Iraq) so :

SEC. 2. FINDINGS.

The Congress makes the following findings:

(1) On September 22, 1980, Iraq invaded Iran, starting an 8 year war in which Iraq employed chemical weapons against Iranian troops and ballistic missiles against Iranian cities.

(2) In February 1988, Iraq forcibly relocated Kurdish civilians from their home villages in the Anfal campaign, killing an estimated 50,000 to 180,000 Kurds.

(3) On March 16, 1988, Iraq used chemical weapons against Iraqi Kurdish civilian opponents in the town of Halabja, killing an estimated 5,000 Kurds and causing numerous birth defects that affect the town today.

(4) On August 2, 1990, Iraq invaded and began a 7 month occupation of Kuwait, killing and committing numerous abuses against Kuwaiti civilians, and setting Kuwait's oil wells ablaze upon retreat.

(5) Hostilities in Operation Desert Storm ended on February 28, 1991, and Iraq subsequently accepted the ceasefire conditions specified in United Nations Security Council Resolution 687 (April 3, 1991) requiring Iraq, among other things, to disclose fully and permit the dismantlement of its weapons of mass destruction programs and submit to long-term monitoring and verification of such dismantlement.

(6) In April 1993, Iraq orchestrated a failed plot to assassinate former President George Bush during his April 14-16, 1993, visit to Kuwait.

(7) In October 1994, Iraq moved 80,000 troops to areas near the border with Kuwait, posing an imminent threat of a renewed invasion of or attack against Kuwait.

(8) On August 31, 1996, Iraq suppressed many of its opponents by helping one Kurdish faction capture Irbil, the seat of the Kurdish regional government.

(9) Since March 1996, Iraq has systematically sought to deny weapons inspectors from the United Nations Special Commission on Iraq (UNSCOM) access to key facilities and documents, has on several occasions endangered the safe operation of UNSCOM helicopters transporting UNSCOM personnel in Iraq, and has persisted in a pattern of deception and concealment regarding the history of its weapons of mass destruction programs.

(10) On August 5, 1998, Iraq ceased all cooperation with UNSCOM, and subsequently threatened to end long-term monitoring activities by the International Atomic Energy Agency and UNSCOM.

(11) On August 14, 1998, President Clinton signed Public Law 105-235, which declared that `theGovernment of Iraq is in materialand unacceptable breach of its international obligations' and urged the President `totake appropriate action, in accordance with the Constitution and relevant laws of the United States, to bring Iraq into compliance with its international obligations.'.

(12) On May 1, 1998, President Clinton signed Public Law 105-174, which made $5,000,000 available for assistance to the Iraqi democratic opposition for such activities as organization, training, communication and dissemination of information, developing and implementing agreements among opposition groups, compiling information to support the indictment of Iraqi officials for war crimes, and for related purposes.

After the hundreds of thousands of ShiaIraqis Assassins and Insurgents failed to Overthrow President Hussein and the Iraqis Government because they were turning each other in for rewards, they were captured, tried and executed as traitors, then thrown in mass graves. President Clinton then spun this to "Dictator Massacring His Own People". Then President Clinton orders US Military Operation Desert Fox, with his belief as Commander In Chief that the US Military must NOT target the Iraqis Government so that there will still be Iraqis Government Officials to negotiate Peace, so under his Direct Orders, the US Military Targets the Urban Poor Areas of Baghdad, with us on the ground just outside of Baghdad (trained in Islam (College Level)) stating our opposition to killing the Poor of Islam (a big no no), so Operation Desert Fox results in the "Islamic World" declaring that the US is the Great Satan.

Mark Stephens-4334123 - The national Security commission, Congress and others had the same info as Bush.

Too bad President Clinton Gutted the US Intelligence Agencies with the result like during H.R.4655 us going into Iraq blind with no intelligence asset link ups. Because of the President Clinton Gutting of the US Intelligence Agencies the US was essentially blind throughout the World and had to rely on non credible non verifiable information from "potentially hostile" Nations like Jordan and Pakistan. In many of these Nations the former US Intelligence assets ended up either outed or turned (into Enemy Counter Intelligence) just so that they could live and get some form of income to support their families (your day job is a cover that you do not spend much time doing or making money from). And due to the President Clinton Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces of the US Military most of the previous US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces (what you can Special) were no longer around to conduct Special Reconnaissance to independently verify information. References, the US Congressional 9/11 Investigations, US Congressional 9/11 Commission (Findings and Recommendations), US Congressional Intelligence Committee, US Intelligence "Community".

noiwontyesiwill - Thanks to our Founding Father's and the US Constitution with our VERY FIRST Amendment in The BILL OF RIGHTS.....Freedom of Religion, Freedom of Speech....FREEDOM.

With extreme sarcasm sure those that defend the US Constitution do not have those US Constitutional Rights. According to those that say the same thing about Freedom of Speech, then when it turns into Freedom of Speech against their Politicial Party then it is a Violation of the UCMJ, but it was perfectly legal as Freedom of Speech when it was US Military against the other Political Party (President as Dubya, Shrub, or even in uniform with Code Pink, and death threats.).

sandtrich - Bush's legacy- destroyed a country in 8 years.

How about this sandtrich YOU explain the significance of the Glass Steagall Acts in relation to Current Events. And before you explain this everyone else on Newsvine read this link first:

The Current Global Economic Crisis

http://david393071.newsvine.com/_news/2011/02/22/6107088-the-current-global-economic-crisis

don_draper - However, things are deteriorating in Iraq because we are no longer there. This was to be expected. I'm pretty sure exactly 0 Americans would want us to still be in there, so the fact that things have deteriorated in Iraq cannot be blamed on Obama. Us getting out of there was the right thing to do. If you disagree, I have a song for you: "One, is the loneliest number..."

Ok, let's start a the beginning of your post, first sentence:

don_draper - However, things are deteriorating in Iraq because we are no longer there.

Why are we no longer there? It is because the Iraqis do not want the US at Iraq anymore. Why is that? Because Fundamentalist Islamic Iran flat out told their Allies the Shia at Iraq and Kurdistanis at Iraq to not negotiate with the US anymore; regardless of how many times SOS Clinton, and President Obama asked the Shia controlled Iraqis Government.

don_draper - This was to be expected.

Nope. Not according to SOS Clinton and President Obama after their negotiations for the US Military to remain at Iraq failed.

don_draper - I'm pretty sure exactly 0 Americans would want us to still be in there, so the fact that things have deteriorated in Iraq cannot be blamed on Obama.

How about this, you go research the events that occurred with Fundamentalist Islamic Iran after President Obama's 2009 Improved Relations with Iran Policy, that allowed Iran to do anything without US Interventions. example: Fundamentalist Islamic Iran negotiates with their Iraqis Allies the Shia and the Kurdistanis to award the Iraqis Northern and Southern Iraqis Oil Field Contracts to Fundamentalist Islamic Iranian Allies the Chinese and Russian Federation. That's right all the Demoncraps that claimed the greedy US (Bush) went into Iraq for the Oil, well President Obama lost all that High Grade In expensive Sweet Crude Oil that could have paid for the US Military Liberation of Iraq for Decades (I previously talked about the Canadians, Mexicans, Saudi Arabians, Kuwaitis, etc. and Oil Laundrying of Iraqis Oil, and now some of the truth is coming out pertaining to the Canadians (Keystone Pipeline)).

By the way that "0 Americans" also reflects just how many US Civilians really know what happened or is going on at Iraq:

Iraq:

http://david393071.newsvine.com/_news/2011/10/17/8369272-iraq

So once again decades of our work (at the cost of deaths of many of our peers and subordinates) during our 20, 30 or more years of our US Military Careers flushed down the toilet by US Politicians that will not give a sh!t after they leave Political Office.

And the rest of what happened as a RESULT of President Obama's 2009 Improved Relatons with Iran Policy:

Iran 2009 to 2012 Strait of Hormuz

http://david393071.newsvine.com/_news/2012/01/03/9928679-iran-2009-to-2012-strait-of-hormuz

And to prove just how serious President Obama was about his 2009 Improved Relations with Iran Policy, previously listed as a Achievement of President Obama by the Democratic National Committee, he gave General McChrystal a Letter of Reprimand just after he arrived here (Afghanistan) because we showed General McChrystal all the captured weapons, military equipment, islamic jihadists, funding, munitions as supplied to Al Quada, the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Hamas Foreign Fighters, Pakistanis Taliban, Army of Islam Pakistan, etc. by Fundamentalist Islamic Iran; so General McChrystal said so to the News Media, and then President Obama chewed his arse out in front of all of us during a video conference after General McChrystal stated that Fundamentalist Islamic Iran was supplying all of this to the Islamic Jihadists at Afghanistan, followed by a Letter of Reprimand stating that this was against President Obama's 2009 Improved Relations with Iran Policy.

Like I said before we are glad we are going back on Retirement after decades of our decades of work was destroyed in months. So all this will be on Generation X and Generation Y to DEAL WITH. LOL.

don_draper - Us getting out of there was the right thing to do. If you disagree, I have a song for you: "One, is the loneliest number..."

You better start to practice singing that before you go singing that to President Obama and SOS Clinton. First announcement to the US Public, "Withdrawal of US Military Combat Units" (not stated but actually done, US Military Combat Units replaced by US Military "Non Combat Units" trained as Combat Units). Second announcement All US Military withdrawn from Iraq (16,000 minus 1,500 US Embassy at Iraq Staff equals ?, with mission to protect the 104 Acres of US Embassy Compound at Iraq by conducting Combat Patrols to keep snipers, mortars, and Rockets out of range of the US Embassy compound).

SING IT don_draper - One, is the loneliest number

Mickey-1983943 - We spent millions of dollars to build the world's largest embassy there. What are they doing?

Oh, by the way it cost about $1 Billion to build that US Embassy at Iraq, and costs $1 Billion each year to operate; just like the one at Pakistan. And what are they doing, Surf and Turf, Catered Banquets, think their own Disneyland Resort and Spa. Those that actually do work, are NOT the US Embassy Staff, but are attached to the US Embassy (example: My very young Brother In Law, a US Military Officer, attached to the US Embassy that recently returned Stateside after conducting Combat Missions to protect the US Embassy Compound Iraq. He returned Stateside before I could visit him by catching a diplomatic courier flight from here (Afghanistan); so instead I got to eat at Burger King across the street from the US Embassy, and a nickel and dime tour of the US Embassy while discussing the Kurdistanis, then caught another diplomatic courier flight back here.).

I, like so many of you, are wondering; just what, exactly, IS "emo".
Well, if you were wondering, wonder no more.

Definition of "emo"

http://hottest-styles.blogspot.com/2008/05/emo-definitionstylehow-to-look-emopics.html

What I don't understand about barbaric events like this is why hasn't some people get up to date with the world. We've got the means to travel all around the world, TV to show what's going on in the world, cell phones and the internet to help us keep in touch with the rest of world and, yet, we still have folks who believe in the most idiotic supersticions.

How can people be so freaking clueless to believe you're "satanic" because of what you wear, or the music you listen to???

And this is not only affecting Iraq but look at how many in Asia like to cage bears for life while they suck their bile for who knows what reason, or how they keep killing tigers to used their parts because it's suppose to make men more manly.

Even the US has its share of wackos like Santorum saying crazy s**t like how contraceptives are "dangerous" to society.

When, oh when, are we going to get with it and educate ourselves so we're not susceptible to irrational beliefs? This is freaking 2012, man!

It really sucks to see how many people refuse to overcome their fears and prejudice just to show how they've got their own "identity". Gimme a freaking break!

Scientific research has proven that women using contraceptives are 50% more likely to have blood clots and something else.

Please keep feeding us the propaganda of the peaceful religion of Islam and maybe, just maybe a few non-muslim idiots will believe it, but that's highly unlikely.

When is the world going to wake up and eliminate this scourge of humanity from the face of the earth?

It is time to cut ties with Iraq, Pakistan, Afghanistan. Libya, and the rest of those crazy uncivilized countries. They claim to be Muslim countries but what they are practicing is not a religion but war lords and crazy zealots with a nut case interpretation of an old religion. Murder is murder where ever you are. We have spent too much trying to help those countries and at some point you have to realize what a lost cause is. Pull out and let them kill each other inside their own borders. If they threaten anyone out side their borders just go in and bomb them back to the stone age/ Maybe if they start again they might understand their own religion.

All this and more in the name of Religion!

OR

Americas Next Top Model competition.

Coming soon to your local town center, as Tea Party activists and evangelical christians unite to form the "real" conservative Republican Party.

No imrightnotyou

All this is in the name of Islam. And brought to you by the administration successful only in grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory and freeing this kind of behavior in Iraq, Egypt and Libya and anywhere else their nose was stuck.

Some of the replies here crack me up.

From the article: Another leaflet in Sadr City bore 20 names. "We are the Brigades of Anger. We warn you, if you do not get back to sanity and the right path, you will be killed," it said.

This doesn't sound too much different than mainstream christianity in the US, and all the hate-mongering they spew.

Touchdown,

What in the world does my comment about stoning and death have to do with handouts and me cooking you dinner? They have nothing to do well one another?

Let's not blame this on religion. We have the WBC and the KKK here fighting for "Christian" values. They have wahabists. Everybody has their version of crazy. It doesn't help that the situation in Iraq is anything but stable.

@ caseyjane

So true. Human condition sucks. It is just the way they are. I guess there are some who truly follow their religion to do these things. However, most just interpret them to fit with themselves or their culture.

L O L

I guess it's official now, everyone hates emo.

Oh how I wish somebody here would pitch a few rocks at our thugs with their pants hanging off their azzes,
jack azzes with their caps on crooked or backwards and wiggers......

true, note my response above. I'm metal and old school. They wanna f*ck with Satanists they'd be meeting him soon enough.

Damn right, its the perfect music to listen to while freeing the @!$%# out of people ;)

Yeah! But in Baghdad of all places! :/

Begin the airlift of Glen Danzig and Henry Rollins!

Most countries in the Middle East have histories that go back hundreds of years before America was even a twinkling in Britain's eye, with Iraq being one of them. We can bomb, raid, invade, and whatever else we want, but the people there are never going to accept our way of life because all they have ever known is a man in a palace telling them what to do. Obviously it's what they want and to some extent it's worked out for them because they've managed to remain virtually unchanged for eons which is what most conservative Muslims want. You can't blame Bush, Obama, or anyone else for the willful ignorance of a whole nation.

It's disgusting that they practice primitive beliefs such as forcing burqas on their women and stoning kids to death for wearing weird clothing but that's how it is over there, how it's always been and probably always will be. I'm wondering why the teens would risk wearing such things in a conservative psycho nation in the first place...really, how many Hot Topics are there in the Middle East anyway???

Kayla

oil oil

and

OIL

Which we will not get any of, when all these places go to war and start nuking each other. It's only a matter of time til they have the technology to do so...so it's still a waste of our time and money. Look how high gas is now, I say leave them alone and if they kill each other off, so be it. We have our own oil we just refuse to use it.

I, like so many of you, are wondering; just what, exactly, IS "emo".
Well, if you were wondering, wonder no more.

Definition of "emo"

http://hottest-styles.blogspot.com/2008/05/emo-definitionstylehow-to-look-emopics.html

Things like this did not happen under saddam and women could dress like europeans. I will tell you why the us wanted saddam dead.... Because... he had decided to sell his country's oil and get paid with other currencies, other than the dollar, this is why he was killed, people ! The usa has imposed that all oil has to be paid with dollars and that all around the world. And many poor countries that do not have armies cannot defend themselves this is why the usa has such a big army so it can control the whole world, especially poor countries.

And the usa impose their corrupt rules on all poor countries that have precious natural resources and if the head of their government does not obey, they will send killers after them, killers like CIA or blackwater. If that does not work, they will send the army like they did with Saddam !

Under Saddam, there was peace even if Saddam was a tyran, but was he really ??? The trouble is, americans believe eveything their medias tell them and that is a huge problem !

Educate yourselves and maybe the corruption starting corruption in your own country will stop !

Bush screwed up. Cheney and the rest of his handlers should have known better, but Bush with his C average from college and his brain damage from all his hard drinking thought with God on his side he could do what the Russkies could not do: win in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Well, now. Look how wrong he was. See what it's cost us in lives and dollars. My nephew who survived three tours of duty in Iraq, he will never be the same. My friend who lost her stepson in Iraq, her family will never be the same. Her daughter will be in therapy for a long time. She is now an only child. She'll miss her brother until she dies.

Bush will judged by history. He made a foolish decision based on bad intel. His judgment will be harsh if there is any justice in the world. Too much has been paid for his foolishness.

We are still paying for Bush's mistakes. Some of us will pay for them all our lives.

Could you Imagine the Riots that we would have if they started to "Stone to Death" all of the Black teens and

"the Boyz in Da Hood" for wearing those Badass baggy pants with their arses hanging out and their crotches

down on the Ground ? ? Holy Shiite !!!

We are out of Iraq. Did you miss that memo? Agree with you on Afghanistan though.

We still have advisors, etc. I mean totally out.

The Chinese will end up "owning" the Middle East, and they won't have to fire a shot.

Too late, boys and girls. Now they are HERE in good old USA. If things continue to take their course, Shia law will be part of our culture. I just love religions who continue to say they are a religion of love.

SHARIA law will never be a part of American culture. This country would implode before that will ever happen.

Religion is the most evil force on this planet.

Most never left

Jensen, China can have the entire mideast, nobody in their right mind will touch those crazies with a 10ft pole. But the Chinese are much smarter than the Russians and us; they just watch everyone else's mistakes and take notes. USSR went caput after 5 years of occupying Afghanistan. Bush dived right in after because he does not read history or the news.

oh the irony of it all. saddam loved american culture---great fan of elvis and broadway musicals. women in iraq wore western styles and various religions practiced under his rule. shiites would not dare to defy his banning of their religious practices such as self flagellation. saddam knew how to govern religious fanatics. after all this misery and waste of human lives and us treasure we've come to this. let's admit it----iraq was better off with saddam and we scewed up.

Actually, I would like to see China invade and conquer the Middle East. They would not put up with the BS the American Army was forced to put up with and since we expect the Chinese to wipe out all dissidence anyway, there would be very little public outcry.

When I lived in LA I was listening to a report on KFWB (a local all-new station) concerning our invasion of Iraq. The network's correspondent in Iraq dared to say life in that country was better under Sadam. She was instantly cut off the air.

Well....at least the Chinese aren't afriad to burn every single Quran and not apologise for it but instead laugh about it.

let's admit it----iraq was better off with saddam and we scewed up.

Granny22

Howard Stern said that at least 10 years ago. At the time; I did not fully agree with it, but I do now.

Sometimes it takes a Monster to control other Monsters.

We should lengthenedour walls of our Embassy just incase some A$$ holes with long arms start throwing stones at our female ambassadors for wearing skirt suits.

I, like so many of you, are wondering; just what, exactly, IS "emo".
Well, if you were wondering, wonder no more.

Definition of "emo"

http://hottest-styles.blogspot.com/2008/05/emo-definitionstylehow-to-look-emopics.html

"organized religion"??

Afraid you might leave a disaster of brown and yellow in your drawers if you mentioned (gulp) Islam?

RummyTub

Sorry Rummy, but you just might wish to educate yourself. While Islam is the oppressive flavor of the moment, this is about organized religion and ignorant populations. Not even 100 years ago there were morals police here. They would measure women's exposed skin at the beach, censor our media, sterilize those they felt were unworthy & put you in jail for not observing the sabbath or using contraception. If you really made them mad they would lynch you.

We have only recently gotten their jackboot off of our throats and are still struggling with them and their attempts to impose their morality and world view upon us. Don't fool yourself into thinking we are superior to these people. We are just farther along the road and if enough people here forget it, we will be back under the jackboot faster than you can believe. After all, fighting for freedom we have to win all the battles, they only have to win one to drag us back.

Well said. Unfortunately the religious extremists in the USA are holding on like a pit bull. I sadly believe there is no hope to open the eyes of most people. Generations of brain washing are almost impossible to repair.

Thanks for your post.

Americans are cluelessly uninformed how less than a hundred years ago, people were thrown in jail in the U.S. of A. for just DISCUSSING how to prevent pregnancy. Doctors and nurses were legally prohibited from discussing this "indecency".

All the while, mothers were dying by the thousands from the horrible physical effects of having too many children, inablity to get medical care, or attempting self-inflicted abortions because they did not have enough food to feed the mass of children they already had. (And yes, it was CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICANS who pushed for these type of laws. )

It took the courage of one woman- Margaret Sanger- to stand up for this nonsense. Courage she got from watching women die, leaving children motherless. She was jailed and had to leave the country more than once. But, common sense prevailed and she began the first clinic in the birth control clinic in our nation. (This organization later became known as "Planned Parenthood".

Now, of course the "American Talibans" want again to push their own ideology on the rest of us.

Religion and politics do not mix.

He's a witch! BURN HIM!!

Don't fool yourself into thinking we are superior to these people.

Oh, really? So when's the last time you knew someone to be killed due to sexual orientation, religious choice or what the wore (FFS!) by a religious group AND their actions were backed by the government? That's the kind of thing that is growing in the middle east.

And don't tell me what happened 100-some years ago. No one who had any doings then are alive today. Guilt shouldn't be waved over the decedents of the guilty any more than power and authority should be passed on from generation to generation by matters involving blood lines. That kind of crap simply doesn't work in my book.

Wow - you're really missing how the GOP targets gays and supports groups that encourage hatred towards them? How the GOP is systematically trying to eliminate reproductive services for poor women? Of course, that will result in unwanted pregnancies, deaths in childbirth, etc., but I guess you're not counting them.

Then we have the big numbers - the half a million or more civilians in Iraq who died when we invaded and disrupted medical, food, and clean water services. A large part of the rationale for that invasion, as said openly by many on the right wing in the military, was to bring the American way of life, including our superior Christian beliefs, to the Middle East.

Our numbers, from phony wars and the destruction of services to the needy, are just as large or larger. They just don't make the front page as often.

very true, nutgrape. The USA is hardly 100% tolerant by any means, and we haven't even been this "tolerant" for very long. I'm sure there's plenty of people here who think that goth kids worship satan. Everyone talks about the good old days- makes me shudder to think what it must have been like to live back then. Back when you could be thrown in jail based on a bunch of hearsay, or personal beefs with the cops, or just not looking like or fitting in with the rest of society. Kinda the feeling I get at the end of Easy Rider. It was like that back then, and it's still like that in some places.

Some of these Cristian groups here in the US are no different than these Islam who still walking with their knuckles. I still remembering seeing these religious nuts with the look in their faces outside Rock concerts shouting and threatening rockers.

nutgrape has just won the thread.

Keep a wary eye on the 'Christians' in the US. What they would impose, should they gain power, would be little different than this.

What a bunch of haters. Is that all that is left to you once you have set yourself free from "God" and "religion"? Must be...so sad to make judgements about "Christians" without any facts.

Who operates most of the charities in the world? Not atheist, agnostics, or human secularist? They are to busy being high minded haters to make a real difference by showing love and compassion.

Let me see...you follow Darwin over Jesus Christ. Darwin's way is survival of the fittest...kill or be killed...the strong deserve to live...the weak deserve to die. Kind of sounds like Iraq. Jesus Christ compelled his followers to love their neighbors as themselves. Quite a contrast in social structure.

Our laws say it is wrong to murder(thou shalt not murder) sounds like society is better with Jesus Christ's wisdom than Darwin's (kill or be killed).

Lets talk about religion for a minute:

I seek the greater good for all my fellow citizens. My opinion
about what that greater good is challenged by compelling arguments and
consideration. I am not swayed in my opinion hateful speech and name calling.
In fact I reject such conversation as counterproductive. Christianity is not
about force it is about following Jesus Christ and his example. In all recorded
history Jesus never ran for public office, formed an army, or killed anyone. He
did heal people, raise the dead, and give us a clear picture of God the Father
(If you have seen me you have seen the Father). He was never afraid to tell the
truth in love. He was never afraid to confront the religious leadership who
traveled great distances and developed followers who "became twice the
children of hell". They became that way by accepting human theory in place
of the clear teaching of Jesus Christ. When Christianity separates from
Christ's teachings and example it is no longer Christianity. Then it becomes a
religion wholly other than God inspired and becomes selfish, self serving, and
persecutes those who do not believe as the group believes. This is not
Christianity but evil masquerading as Christianity. This condition results in
the Dark Ages, Crusades, and other atrocities committed under the name of some
god but not the God. Do not be mislead by those who point in that direction.

Just a thought...please consider the slim possibility you could be wrong about God and His followers.

Your premise is faulty: ..."society is better with Jesus Christ's wisdom than Darwin's (kill or be killed)".

The non-religious don't "follow teachings" like this - an agnostic does not substitute the teachings of Jesus with those of another person, like Darwin, or anyone else. An agnostic may totally agree with the teachings of Jesus - but take little stock in the mysticism that surrounds the gigantic fairy tale that is called "the bible". In fact, most good people follow a similar path that Jesus followed - to love humanity, Golden Rule stuff, etc., but not believe in a "sacred birth", nor similar "tales". Of course, there are vast numbers of non-christian good people as well all over the immense populations that are in Asia - probably they would agree with Gandhi - about loving Christ, but not Christians (the hypocrites, of course - true Christians are not self-serving pompous jack @sses).

Some of these religious charities are nothing but an advertisement for the church by pushing your silly christian belief on the needy.

I gave a to charities but i wanted nothing in return or expecting anyone else to convert to my beliefs.

All "prophets" are false.

When their so-called followers are mostly war mongers, hiding behind fantasies for validation while killing and raping in the name of some gad, it`s time to get treated.

Suffering delusions is a mental illness and is treatable.

Step 1 is admitting you have a problem.

Ever heard of the OSI, they are the CIA of the Mormons, their missions were to perform clandestine missions for the benefit of the Mormon church. Their Benefactors? Our tax dollars. Say what you will about the back dated people of Iraq and their intollerence of the west. But U.S. has the highest crime rate in the world. Based on some research I did on the Department of Justice during 2010, I saw that African American males have a chance of going to prison 60% of the time. I say many of their people are brain washed, just as many of our people are.

Islamic fanatics are no different than Christian fanatics..
Religion is truly the bane of mankind.
And east coast:
WTF do you mean by "100 years ago"?
If you are talking about atrocities committed right here in our own country, you don't have to go back even half that long.

NotSoSure: "Our laws say it is wrong to murder(thou shalt not murder) sounds like society is better with Jesus Christ's wisdom than Darwin's (kill or be killed)."

Actually, if we were TRULY to follow the wisdom of Jesus, we would be following his commandment: THOU SHALT NOT KILL. (no "murder" or "war" or "capital punishment" distinctions).

THOU SHALT NOT KILL -- PERIOD.

THOU SHALT NOT KILL -- PERIOD.

......unless it is not a human. We will define what "human" is. Sorry if you don't fit the definition.

/sarcasm

The basic message of most religions is to teach people how to live good, productive, happy lives. The second ANYONE is willing to murder someone else over their beliefs is the day they become a cult member. True religious convictions teach peace and harmony, not hate and murder. Religion in itself is not bad. Idiots who want to say they are Christian, Muslim, blah blah without taking the time to understand it using logic and reason are the problem. All religious texts were written by MAN about God, not the other way around and should not be taken so literally. Especially when it comes to killing people for stupid crap such as wearing emo clothes.

Focus on what's the same for all religions and you should have a general understanding of what kind of life your God would want you to live, be a good person, don't murder, etc.

I think TeaTarded is being sarcastic in their comments.

Religion is brainwashing the masses in Iraq and Iran, so that they can CONTROL them. And stoning kids to death for being "emo"? That is barbaric, twisted, and insane.

Yes, and we obviously have learned nothing!

WE or our politicians. Both, but we had believed everything that our government told us, unfortunately our country has strayed far from what the founders envisioned for us.

We can always borrow our money back from China to pay for policing the world!

I didn't believe one word they said, but what did it matter. We represent our government. Our government does not represent us.

The people never asked for help as far as we know. The invasion of Iraq was all on Bush's administration based on known false information, the American People where lied to. It is a shame & black mark on the USA because of all the lives lost (our troops & civilians) because of ego, arrogance, oil & mostly greed. It is not the Place of the United States or Europene coutries to force other cultures into what we consider best for the world.

If our government really want to help oppressed people there are countries where people are crying & even begging for help to stop their governments/dictators from bombing & killing innocent people such a Syria.

Our definition of democracy is very different from theirs. Ours includes a written constitution with the freedom of speech, religion and separation of church and state. Theirs is only election. Their majority istrying to avoid separation of church (mosque) and state. When a nation tries to force democracy down another country, the result usually is the opposite. Intolerance becomes extra intolerance.

Jack-1522032: How can you condemn this behavior and promote it at the the same time?

xvet

Who really give a sh!t about the innocent Iraqis who died.

Wow!...sometimes there are just no words. And you are an American citizen who votes? Scary!!

@Jack

YEAH!! F the constitution!!! Stone those Muslims!! Just because those nations chooses to live by their Sharia and dumb down their standard does not mean we should too.

Monstrous behavior from a monstrous group. I am disgusted by this brutality. The moderate Muslims need to rise up enmasse. Mr. Narwash of Free Muslims, are you listening?? All it takes for evil to triumph is that good men do nothing.

Spoken like a true terrorist. :)

Wexy - Letting ignorant, incompetent, fools die is Darwinism not terrorism.

Spoken like a true idiot. :)

Is our "humanity" more humane? Trying to save children everywhere around the world without a corresponding attempt to educate them at the same time is a population disaster in the making. We have already stretched resources to the breaking point.

How is education funding doing in your neck of the woods? Not every patient can be saved.

Feed a million starving people in Africa and five years later you have three million to feed.

@Plantagenet

yes lets do that, lets stop finding a cure for those with AIDS. Lets change our mottos: forget Semper Fi and call it, "All men left behind."

Strange response.

My initial post was not concerning sick and injured people but those who refuse to be saved from the ailments of their own cultures and minds.

As for your mention of Semper Fi and leaving folks behind, I did a stretch in the Corps and later Armored Cav. 19-k so don't try to lecture me about duty.

Who were we "defending" them from? You've swallowed the public-relations "we've helped and saved these poor good people" message far too much. We went in and killed tens of thousands of them and demolished what traces of civilization they had scraped together... and this behavior is exactly why we should have finished the job and turned the whole place into a parking lot.

Yeah, if we had done nothing, Saddam (Iraq's Stalin) would have continued his reign of torture and murder - which accounted for hundred's of thousands of deaths. Kurd's, Iranian's, Kuwaiti's, Shiite's, etc, were all victim to his terror. It's proven that he wiped out whole Kurdish villages with chemical weapons. He was a danger, yet a lot of the folks here ignore this to blame oil and politicians. (I am not saying that politicians and oil companies do not have their agenda's, by no means). However, America is a land of immigrants from all over. We have our issues and yet we have always pulled together to become better. The world is a much smaller place and with terrorism and weapons of mass destruction, any tyrant with the money and power can reach out and touch their enemies. We must stop it before hundreds of dead become thousand become millions. Hopefully that was done in Iraq. Iraq will take many years to get it's act together and recover from Saddam and the wars that ousted him. It will hopefully get better the way America has and still needs to. Remember America has also had moments of shame - racism, slavery, religious persecution, etc. The American's who have given their lives in Iraq and Afghanistan to fight tyranny are noble, while the cowards who sit here and spit poison deserve the next Stalin, Hitler, Hussein, Assad, Gaddafi, Kony.

Georghai, so they are back at it again. We lost thousands and thousands of lives and for no reason except it made a certain someone feel big at the time he declared war.

the cowards who sit here and spit poison (are you talking to me), will always condemn war (Yep you re talking to me). We, the United States of America killed, not only our own but tens of thousands of Iraqis, including children, but you are probably against abortions.

I was against the war with Iraq then, still against the war we had with Iraq. Think we should get out of Afghanistan, and we better not start a war with Iran because of Israel.

We need to stay out of wars, especially with these Islamic countries.

Georghai your right Hussain did do that and we did exactly what we did in WWII. Get there when all the genocide is already done!!! Sure we police the whole world, but we do it in a way in which we police our own state. That being too late. We let the crime happen and then wait a long time as the police arrives, and then do something about it like take a report or start an investigation, and it gets solved when it is already too late. The rape in progress already raped, the one being stabbed alread stabbed, etc I hope you get the picture. We got there 20 years too late.

Blame the Chinese /s

I believe they Invented Paper-making, the Printing-press, and some form of ink.

But really; it only comes down to Ignorance; and ones willingness to believe Absurdities in the first place.

You are over dramatizing in order to draw parallels between something that has happened and something that didn't happen. Two and two does not equal five.

Actually Scott has a point.

Both religions' extremist have the same end goal in mind, the only differences are the means of attainment.

yo Plantagenet,

if you add one it does

What is really idiodic is comparing murder with free speech. Hard to tell the difference, eh?

Religion is always a convenient excuse to kill off the opposition.

Listen to the right wing rhetoric in the US where people like Santorum compare gay relationships to bestiality, where the move is on to deny women their reproductive rights, the preaching of the need to run the US by the Bible. They are a Christian Taliban and if you think some of them wouldn't like to stone to death people they think of as "evil" you're hiding your head in the sand. It's not a comparison of murder to free speech. Murder has been done in our own country in the name of religion. Gay Americans are denied rights, bashed and murdered by the Bible's true believers. We may not be stoning teenagers to death, but the Christian Taliban is on the same continuum as radical Islam.

RRuin, You're really trying to equate not having the government foot the bill for contraception with the murder of teenagers for what they wear? Wow. Just wow. I really don't understand where the disconnect in logic happened at for most people but it's just amazing to see it.

And these are the same people like to claim that they're smarter than everyone else!!!

No one asked for the government to pay for their contraception. That is a lie made up by Rush, and promoted by his mindless followers.

What Sandra Fluke was asking from Congress was for the government to mandate that insurance companies stop taking women's hard earned money and not give them the promised health coverage. Insurance companies are denying coverage for contraceptives that were prescribed by a doctor for health reasons, like preventing ovarian cysts.

If insurance companies cover Viagra for men when prescribed by a doctor for health reasons, it's only fair to cover women's health needs too. After all they paid for the coverage, this is not the government's money this is money paid by private citizens to insurance companies. No Tax Dollars Involved.

Um, my PBM is no longer covering a medication they covered last year that is a maintenance drug. Where do my claims about "a war on men" come in? What political party do you want me to blame?

This has been going on for as long as there has been prescription coverage and it's certainly nothing new and has nothing to do with politics.

I think the ghost of Matthew Sheppard would like a word with you.

east coast - so you are saying your HMO (or Medicare) is refusing to pay for your blood pressure meds. Or are they trying to get you to switch to another one, perhaps a generic?
Hard to believe they'd just up and quit totally - but if so, save all the paperwork and phone call documentation for your widow's lawyer, so he can sue the pants off the HMO for playing doctor and killing you.

East Coast: "Um, my PBM is no longer covering a medication they covered last year that is a maintenance drug. Where do my claims about "a war on men" come in? What political party do you want me to blame?"

THANK YOU! It's NOT just a "War on Women"--it's a war on HUMANS. We need to stick together. No need to blame any political party. Let's stick together and force insurance to stop their WAR ON US ALL!

Don't let politicians divide and conquer us! PLEASE!

Same thing with Gaddafi. Gaddafi cracked down hard on Al Queda and any organized murderous thugs that were not his own, that is the only way you can govern and control stone-aged people who do nothing with their lives but try to fulfill the desire to make everyone else follow their backwards blood-thirsty beliefs.

Saddam should have controlled his whacked out sons - they were committing atrocities to the point where it got the World's attention, and sh!t rolls downhill.

The "ruling family biz" concept, established in the ME and Northern Africa, really ruined the party - for themselves.

Which is why the Israeli government is going to stop them. But, someday they will probably succeed in developing a bomb, and then there will be a nuclear confligration in the middle east. I hope will be dead by then.

actually you are not a minority, ther are millions of lizards in America.

Correct, putting the religious extremist in control set Iraq back 70 years. Definately a waste of lives and money......Bring our troops in the middle east home, NOW.

Iraq didn't cost trillions. Try to get within an order of magnitude if you're going to try to discuss numbers.

Google it. I think the Iraq war was $100 million a year give or take. 9 years, 900 million give or take a million. So with untold costs, costs of lives, yes it was over at least a trillion.

Oh, to have held stock in Blackwater.

If someone gave me Blackwater (or Xe as they call themselves now) stock for free today, I'd burn it. I want nothing whatsoever to do with those murdering bastards, or their bloody money.

This is the gentle islamic Muslim religion Obama keeps talking about.

drink koolaid much, Storm? Get back to your Rush and Faux News.

God is only an excuse, when humans kill humans it is most usually done for sport.

"Go team"!

Whenever an apologist tries to tell you that religion doesn't cause any real harm, remember this article.

Religion is usually an excuse.

The communists didn't need religion to murder the millions they knocked off.

There doing this because of there belief system (aka, there religion). Calling religion an excuse in a case like this is just plain ignorance in the face of reason. The Nazi party was also founded on religious beliefs so yes, they actually did need religion to become what they did. As an example; if this wasn't true then why were they targeting Jews (a religion)? If they weren't doing it on religious grounds then what did it matter if they were Jewish or not?

Much like the Nazi's they are doing this because they see our culture as a stain upon the world there imaginary friend created.

Who brought up the Nazis?

I mentioned communists. Nazis aren't communists and they scapegoated the Jews because as a group they generally live apart from the whole and are successful. Just look at all the anti Jew paranoia in the world today, hovering around money and power rather than religion.

When a society needs to rally the troops it will use whatever works in order to do that.

Plantagenet,

You are trying to reason with people who lack comprehension. You have stated the truth evil needs no reason and can create any reason to sell its purpose.

Religion: still the greatest hoax humanity every inflicted upon itself.

Followed by: "of course I'll still love you in the morning."

"Whenever an apologist tries to tell you that religion doesn't cause any real harm"

Thats funny seeing as hypocrites don't only exist in religion.

Ask those that are against gay marriage

or ask some normal people...that have been forced to squeal like a pig...

So, Ray, you think we should invade Iraq and clean out these people? Excuse me, this is where I came in.

Go back to Iraq yay, what the hell were doing all this time?

If this article doesn't fill your stoning quota you should try the old testament.

That should do it.

yo Huh?What?,

that was then, this is now, huh? what is the time frame difference?

I know, the entire bible was written back when people didn't know about germs, atoms or even round planets.

So I agree Ron .... stoning people , zombies returning from the dead , talking snakes and magical fruit really doesn't make any sense these days.

Although I really dig the zombie movies !

"So I agree Ron .... stoning people , zombies returning from the dead , talking snakes and magical fruit really doesn't make any sense these days."

Neither does being pointlessly bound to hopelessness because of a technicality. There is a difference between logic and reason.

Hopelessness? Hopefully you don't mean agnostics.

The definitions of logic and reason are different, but it would be pretty hard to have one without the other.

Cassandra, actually you just hit the nail on the head. And no, it was not about agnostics. In fact, if one day if i did not believe in God, with reason, I would have to be agnostic. It's harder to discredit someone who admits they don't know than it is to discredit someone who claims to somehow "know" something that is unknown.

No, that was Muhammed...