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Subscribe to RSSAs Rock Center Special Correspondent Ted Koppel reports, the electoral system is very different in France, where the candidates disappear from TV in the run-up to voting.
Far-rightist Marine Le Pen threw France's presidential race wide open on Sunday by scoring nearly 20 percent in the first round -- votes that might determine the runoff between Socialist favorite Francois Hollande and conservative President Nicolas Sarkozy.
Hollande got 27.5 percent, compared to Sarkozy's 26.6 percent, and the two will meet in a head-to-head decider on May 6.
But Le Pen's record score of 20 percent was the sensation of the night, beating her father's 2002 result and outpolling hard leftist Jean-Luc Melenchon, in fourth place with 10 percent. Centrist Francois Bayrou finished fifth with nine percent.
Le Pen, who took over the anti-immigration National Front in early 2011, wants jobs reserved for French nationals at a time when jobless claims are at a 12-year high. She also advocates abandoning the euro currency and restoring monetary policy to Paris.
Her score reflected a surge in anti-establishment populist parties in many euro zone countries from Amsterdam to Athens as austerity and the debt crisis bite.
Voter surveys show about half of her supporters would back Sarkozy in a second round and perhaps one fifth would vote for Hollande, making her a potential kingmaker in the runoff.
Jean-Marie Le Pen's 16.9 percent score in the 2002 first round caused a political earthquake, knocking then Socialist Prime Minister Lionel Jospin out of the runoff and forcing left-wing voters to rally behind conservative Jacques Chirac.
Sarkozy, 57, has painted himself as the safest pair of hands to lead France and the euro zone in turbulent times, but Sunday's vote appeared to be a strong rejection of his flashy style as well as his economic record.
If Hollande wins on May 6, joining a small minority of left-wing governments in Europe, he has promised to lead a push for a bigger focus on growth in the euro zone, mainly by adding pro-growth clauses to a European budget discipline treaty.
The prospect of a renegotiation of the pact is causing some concern in financial markets, as is Hollande's focus on tax rises over austerity at a time when sluggish growth is threatening France's ability to meet deficit-cutting goals.
France's sickly growth, along with its stubbornly high unemployment, are major factors hampering Sarkozy's battle to win a second term, despite an energetic campaign against the blander but more popular Hollande.
Sarkozy would be the 11th euro zone leader to be swept out since the start of the bloc's debt crisis in late 2009 and the first French president to lose a re-election bid in more than 30 years. A deep dislike of a manner many see as arrogant and too informal has also driven many people to vote against him.
"France needs a radical change of direction, mainly on the economy," said Jean-Noel Harvet, a public sector worker voting earlier on Sunday in the northern town of Cambrai.
Hollande, 57, promises less drastic spending cuts than Sarkozy proposed and wants higher taxes on the wealthy to fund state-aided job creation, in particular a 75 percent upper tax rate on income above 1 million euros ($1.32 million).
He would be only France's second left-wing leader since the founding of the Fifth Republic in 1958, and its first since Francois Mitterrand, who beat incumbent Valery Giscard-d'Estaing in 1981 and ruled until 1995.
Hollande had called on his supporters to take nothing for granted, mindful of the fiasco for the left in 2002 when record abstention saw the Socialist Jospin pushed out in the first round by the elder Le Pen.
Turnout ended up at a healthy 70.6 percent three hours before polls closed, just below 73.9 percent recorded in the 2007, which was the highest in two decades.
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The socialists want A 75% tax rate on income over a million to create jobs! Why would any entrepreneur ever start/grow a business in France? So you can work for the State? Here's a little known secret, enterpreneurs create jobs...This is yet another socialist policy akin to turning off the lights and then complaining you can't see....
Ah yes, the Republican mantra in the US, they are not wealthy, they are 'job creators'. Which is utter nonsense. When the wealthy paid high taxes the states had great schools, hospitals and infrastructure and yet the wealthy were not deprived of anything. Now the wealthy are super wealthy and the infrastructure is old and the schools are some of the worst in the world. As for the 'job creator' aspect, sure some create jobs, in asian markets where they can exploit slave labor.
The thing about those 75% tax rates in the past is that there were so many loopholes and exceptions that nobody actually paid anywhere near 75%. It's a myth. Also, if you look at funding of public institutions in terms of inflation-adjusted dollars, they are getting more money now than before. The fact is that public institutions funded through expropriation suffer from entropy; they become less efficient over time.
Actually the other far left candidate that will probably come in 3rd or 4th wants to tax 100 percent over about 400,000 in income. So that makes 75 percent look cheap. They want to create government jobs with that extra revenue. So the socialists, just like our administration here in the US, believes that an economy flourishes with big government paid for by a small slice of workers.
It is the assumption that the rich will hang around to be taxed that much, or that the rich won't hide that money, or flat work only to that threshold. I can't speak for France, but there are other investments such as municipal bonds that aren't taxed. BTW, just here in the US about 500 billion of revenue is done by cash. So the higher the tax system, the more people resort to doing business in cash. Equally people barter for services.
The issue boils down to this. People do not want to pay high taxes if they think the money is being wasted. Many watch groups here in the US insist that at least 400 billion is wasted by the government every years. So those 17/muffins charged to our government doesn't instill confidence. The parties by government employees doesn't instill confidence. Over 1 billion is spent on presidential protection, but what really are we paying for? So how much is the tab being padded?
In my town, we were struggling with a budget, and so they decided to spend 80,000 to put up an digital sign. In order to see that sign, you must actually go by it. Frequently the sign doesn't work and the information on the sign of events is limited. Was this a good use of money?
A government job can ONLY be created by taxing citizens. A private sector job can be created without taxing anybody. Private industry hires when they can pay for that additional salary by increasing the top line. If they cannot justify that cost, they can't hire.
The highest individual tax rate was over 70% in the US in the 1950's falling slightly in the 60's, but still much, much higher than it is today. And the economy in those decades was booming. The wealthy "job creators" in the US only intend to create jobs in Asia, not in the US. This is clearly borne out by their performance in the past decade.
"Boitel plans to vote for tub-thumbing radical leftist Jean-Luc Melenchon, who wants an anti-capitalist revolution, and then Hollande in round two, reflecting a voter shift that is unsettling some financial analysts as feeble growth threatens deficit targets in Europe's No. 2 economy."
Some people never learn. It's big government spending and high taxes that CAUSE a weak economy and job losses and unsustainably high deficits, but I guess each generation needs to learn the 'hard way'.
Can someone try to explain how higher taxes on the very people that create investments/jobs helps make the economy 'grow'?
It's "unsettling some financial analysts" because they know that it could well drag France into the same boat with Greece, Spain and Italy.
I see "theboys" watches FOX News. The 17 dollar muffins were a myth. FOX took an obvious error in the invoice and blew it up to support their activist "journalism." I can't post the link, but you can look it up on PolitiFact.
That's not to say I agree with Hollande's solutions. Just like in the United States, the French are disenchanted with their crop of candidates and are voting for Hollande as "the lesser of two evils." My host-brother (I am currently studying in northern France) has relented that the French political system is becoming more and more à l'américaine and once-successful third parties are being squeezed out in favor of increasingly polarized center-left and center-right factions.
It's too bad Bayrou is only in fifth place. He's the only candidate who seems willing to compromise, which is what democracy is all about.
Was the $830,000 dollars spent partying by GSA in Vegas on a bogus "conference" a myth??
Was the $500,000 given to Solyndra who then turned around and declared bankruptcy a myth??
Is the first lady taking the 757 (with all the additional aircraft and vehicles) followed by the President taking Air Force One (747) headed to the SAME destination 4 hours later (again with all the additional aircraft and vehicles) a myth??
Is the 5 Trillion dollars of debt rang up by this administration in it's first term a myth??
America is waking up.
"the truth is a kold wind"
Swiis Tv/TV Suisse First Round winner- Francois Hollande,Socialist 27-29% of votes second Nicolas Sarkozy sitting President 25-26% of votes. If Hollande wins- it will be DeGaulle again- France out of NATo /out of Eurozone (c'est la vie) it will be modified g'ment increase in certain areas; no more strident Eurozone shrinking of g'ment. Rather Hollande than Le Pen.
Ryan, you are either a poor reader or like to spin the muffin story. This is from the AP.
The additional information showed that the muffins were actually part of a modified continental breakfast priced at $16.80 and consisting of items such as pastries, fruit, coffee, tea and juice.
So yes the muffins did cost $16 with a piece of fruit and coffee.
$16 dollars for a continental breakfast is still ridiculous and should be outraging many people... I could understand if it included a lot of meat and such, but for grain products?.. Come on!! I also saw the muffin story elsewhere and not on Fox News.
KevinT,
It's not that I'm a poor reader. It's that I read primary sources (the invoice) instead of relying on sensationalist press coverage. The cost included the entire event space and the full continental breakfast.
As I said, you can look it up pretty easily.
Zarkovski: i recently attended an investment seminar presented by a brokerage company in a local hotel conference room. One of the presenters, in a private conversation, remarked on the outrageous cost they were being billed by the hotel for the coffee, muffins, etc that they were providing for the attendees. This is not a case of government waste, but of profiteering by the venues that host such gatherings. They won't allow you contract with an outside caterer while using their conference room, so either you let your guests go hungry or pay their outrageous fees.
The usual "pundits" on line today... Whenever the right or far right achieve economic success for the majority of the people, then they can talk about their absurd and completely false mantra... Reaganomics is a complete fraud!
Mimi, Degaule was on the Right of the political spectrum. he was more nationalist, isolationist and autarcic than most. Hollande who is on the Left would not be that way.
coldwinblows: were the wars started by Bush not in the trillions of dollar?. wasn't the real estate scam implemented by Bush, and affecting every household in America, a way to take trillions in fair value mixed in with trillions of bubble value? people got "equity" out of rocks by refinancing 2, 3, 4 times: Bush government backed. How about gas doubling under Bush? how many trillions were siphoned there, and affecting each household? Solyndra and airplanes( which is for safety by the way) are less than peanuts compared to the Bush scam machine. the Bush administration sucked wealth out of every family in America. sure the wealthy and comfortable paid the same price for gas, but they were getting 10 x the income through tax cuts, real estate investments, defense stock value increase and more..... Solyndra: please. Sarkozy and other right wing leaders in Europe did the same things and the pyramid scam has broken down there as well. I'd expect Hollande to win because of these issues, as well as Obama getting re-elected in this country. they fooled all the people for some of the time(with their closed-eyes condoning to get the durn money, the poor even got bought out with extra tax return checks), but they cannot fool all the people all the time, and this time has come.
Robert757A is correct. I have helped plan events for my company at hotels and they do charge outrageous prices and only allow you to use their service. Normally the resort will have a minimum food price included in the bill. For example, we normally do two day conferences. During those conferences we must purchase 5000.00 worth of hotel food (bottled water, soft drinks, snacks, breakfast or lunch, etc.) And this is for 30 people and a couple of small conference rooms, not a few hundred people. A small bottled water or 12-oz can of soda around $4 or $5 per item. They do rake in the money thought. That's how all of those conference hotels look so nice and have such expensive decor.
Yes, entrepreneurs create jobs, but the percentage of people making over a million that are entrepreneurs is quite small. Most people making that much invest purely to maximize their own return with the least risk, in other words in investments that don't create jobs. Being entrepreneurial involves huge risk and a lot more real work than the majority of the wealthy want.
Allegro, this is why France has been stuck in a slow growth rut for so long and why the average worker there makes $10K less than here in the US, in terms of purchasing power parity.
Because. Chesty, who does little to honor the name he claims, French people get benefits from being French that are worth far more the $10K a year, starting with preschool education of a level unheard of in this country, (unless you're Romney), for free in France. And then there is ..... free health care ....
It's what happens in a society where all people contribute instead of those who take 95% of the income keeping more than that for themselves and contribute nothing back to the country that gave them the chance.
I'm talking about the men who died on Guadalcanal, and other places, serving under the real Chesty Puller, whom you dishoner. If you want to claim that name, I hope you can defend it.
Just so everyone knows, the Socialist Party of France isn't very "socialist" at all... at least not by the traditional American definition of "socialist".
In fact, Francois Hollande is actually in the "right-wing" faction of the Socialist Party. His political ideology could be roughly characterized as a mixture social democracy and social liberalism.
A 75% tax rate is not in the same universe as a conservative. I would say that it is extreme socialism.
Dear France,
America had a tax rate on the richest Americans of 90% before Reagan came along. After Ronnie drastically cut taxes for all Americans our tax revenues skyrocketed. In other words raising taxes will not guarantee an increase in tax revenues, but it guarantees to drive more money offshore and underground.
If you think lowering taxes resulting in higher revenues was a fluke you can also look at the recent Bush tax cuts during a recession that resulted in higher revenues than what we had under the Internet boom years under Clinton.
Think of the tax rate as you would of retail pricing. Sometimes a high price will result in higher profits per sale, but a lower price will result in more sales. It is the job of the manager to set prices where the store will make the most money. Higher prices generally only work when there is a lack of competition and or supply. Low prices work when there is ample supply and high demand. I would say that the French population is high demand so it is up to you to meet the demand with low taxes.
TBAustin,
If high tax rates equal socialism, every President before Ronald Reagan (including Nixon and Eisenhower) was a socialist. Obama's proposal of 30% doesn't even come close to pre-Reagan rates.
There's a difference between ideology and policy. Almost everything in America functions through the private sector (that includes Obamacare) so essentially, the most socialist institution in the United States right now is the postal service. Taxes have nothing to do with it.
The most socialist institutions in America are UNIONS!
You, uh...you don't know what socialism is, do you? Nice talking point, though.
I think you are lying mas098! I think that dog is putting crazy ideas in your head. Nice dog, anyway!
Correct Jon, the French socialism is not Communism like the Republicans like to tout over here to scare people. Actually French socialism is way close to the Ideal the Founding Fathers of America had in mind when the wrote the Constitution ( and the French and American intellectuals worked on it together). The Constitution is a true text for the advancement of societies. The Republican party of today is a travesty and an insult to this beautiful text.
The compromise made with Moynihan and Congress when tax rates were 90% under Reagan was to eliminate most loopholes. The plethora of deductions available substantially lowered the rate paid by high income taxpayers. Kind of like now the corporate tax rate may be high when compared with other countries but almost nobody pays a rate that high, they manipulate the tax code.
The highest income tax rate also does not apply to the first tens of thousands of dollars in income or capital gains or carried interest either. Nobody was paying 90% in income taxes then just like Romney and others don't pay the maximum income tax rate now.
As a country we need more revenue and less spending and more growth so I am all for reforming government across the board but not eliminating it by starving it of revenue. And at a time of a greatly expanding elderly population which even Reagan and the Republicans of the 80's saw coming there will not be consistent political will to cut spending by ten times as much as taxes increase, a solution every Republican Presidential candidate rejected. Two to one will be a stretch when the details of the cuts are understood by the active elderly voter.
What is the evidence that tax decreases will increase economic activity and hiring? Much less that tax decreases will replenish government coffers? The evidence shows a boom will but beware of the bust. And the idea that Republicans will pay the political price for drastically cutting spending is laughable after their behavior when GW Bush was elected and they controlled all branches of government. They only care about deficits because it's good politics in Euro Debt Crisis era. If they get power they will do nothing about them because they will cut taxes (especially for the rich) and keep spending just like they did under GWB. Your rebate check will be in the mail just in time for the midterm election and another around the next Presidential election day.
If Sarkozy was popular he'd probably win but if 20% of the far right supporters will not support him I predict the majority of the moderates and liberals will vote against Sarkozy and Hollande will prevail. My understanding of French politics is limited but I imagine the French Parliament will not be an easy place for Hollande to enact a leftist agenda.
France does not operate the European Central Bank and they have a high unemployment rate in a very stagnant European Zone economy. The most important thing European leaders like Sarkozy or Hollande need to do is generate economic growth while shoring up banks by reducing sovereign debt. Not an easy thing to do and an impossible one without more revenue. We, debt-ridden and under employed nations, all need to put people to work building something that will save our nations' money for the life of what we've built.
Austin, that's a fascinating anaylsis, but you should know better than to ask statists to think like businessmen. Hollande himself has admitted that the 75% tax probably won't raise much extra revenue. But hey, he "doesn't like the rich".
In addition to their income tax, the French also pay social charges on TOP of their tax (you'd think the charges could just come from the tax revenue, but such is life, eh?). According to several articles in The Economist, that places their total income contribution to over 90% of their income. Who would actually work for 1/10 of what they "earn"?
Allegroman: You said, "Here's a little known secret, enterpreneurs create jobs...This is yet another socialist policy akin to turning off the lights and then complaining you can't see.." I didn't understand your post. Please be more specific.
However, regarding "Brother Aimable Filipo, 98, a Trappist monk from the Mont des Cats Abbey, exits a voting booth with his ballot in hand during the first round of the 2012 French presidential elections Sunday in Godewaersvelde, northern France(,)" I loved the picture and enjoy the theatre as an example of MSNBC's "poetic license".
Read between the lines. This article makes the French political complaints/unrest sound a lot like what's happening in a place we all know and love...
It really doesn't matter who the FRENCH elect.
The E.U. and all of Europe are going down hard . They are only playing pin the tail on the donkey wright now. In other words they are looking for a new fall guy .
A requirement of joining the E.U. is that a nation's economy must be able to sustain itself in the open European market. The E.U. is suffering because its leaders were so excited about expanding the European Community that they ignored this requirement with Greece, and to a lesser extent with Italy, Ireland and Portugal.
Don't think this is going to put an end to Europe, though. The candidacies are still rolling in (Croatia will be joining up next summer, and everyone but Belarus and Switzerland is expressing their interest), and the current head of the European Council is extremely competent.
Europe isn't going to END, persay, but this could cause a rupture in the European project of greater integration.
Ironically, one of the better solutions to this problem would be a tighter fiscal union and European governance, effectively becoming a United States of Europe... but Germany, being the only one with a roaring economy, responsible finances, and well-run bureaucracy, doesn't want to have to put up with the rest of those losers. And I can't say I blame them.
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. Pay attention to the MEN behind the curtain-who will stop at nothing, even WWIII to attain more wealth and power.
Your challenge will fall on the deaf ears and narrow minds of all the useful idiots who support these "MEN": Republicans and Democrats in this country. Every country has these pawns for the rich and powerful. America just has more of them!
Ever since Sarkozy insulted the British Queen I have prayed for his downfall. He is just a lump of merde! I hope he falls flat on his face.
I heard this morning that, when the French voted for Sarkozy, they wanted Cary Grant. What they got was Joe Peschi in a bad mood.
Europe has a different system than the U.S. First, you have to look at the geography of the place. You have countries where even the biggest are about the size of Nevada or Texas, with populations nearly double that of California. They also, within their countries have a solid bloc of an ethnic majority. This does not exist in the United States. They also have a political spectrum which is on a far different axis than the United States.
If Hollande wins, which is likely, don't expect the rich to be taxed 75 percent of total income. Look for 75 percent taxable income with massive deductions for job creation, etc. Also, keep in mind nearly all of the utility systems and some of the heavy industry in France are in government hands. This is the case there whether it is the Gaullists (the right) or the Socialists (the left) are in power.
Ironically, relations with the U.S. are usually better with the Socialists in power. While the PCF (Communists) are quite Anti-American, the Socialists are not. I would guess if Lionel Jopsin were president instead of Chircac, France might have not been as critical of the US involvement in Iraq. (They still would not send troops, though) Main reason was the Gaullists had a lot of money tied up in Baghdad. If you look back to the 1960's the Gaullists had an outright negative outlook and actions to both the US and NATO.
As for "change" I would not expect too much. France has a system which keeps the poor, poor regardless of party label. It is also a highly centralized government, a 1,000 year-old legacy of the Ancien Regime. Their college entrance exam the baccalauréat, despite having a higher pass rate in recent years, is still a formidable barrier to social advancement.
I would put the "change" (which will be little) to more of their electoral cycle, which is about 15 to 20 years, more than anything else.
right on T R. you must the French or a social or history buff
Yes the French educational system is "free" but extremely selective and elitist. if you failed high school and the baccalaureat you mentioned it is possible to go back to university but after you study and pass the baccalaureate on your own(a week's worth of multi discipline exam), almost mission impossible. this level step makes high school look like kindergarten to Europeans, or at least to the French. the American university system is much more flexible with self pace, introductory classes, small classes and supportive faculty. in France they quickly weed you out of 1-200 people amphitheater and teachers paid by the governmental department of education, not a private institution, are not about to cheer-lead and support you. to sum it up if you make it you have been a salmon swimming up a formidable river.
And yet their universities churn out useless sociology majors by the thousand.
Still, that's a lot of interesting things I didn't know about France. Thanks, guys.
Is NBC trying to be clever with this " Curtains for Sarkozy" ? Cheap humor. and frivolous. And..by the way Sarkozy is the best man for the job.. .to control Islamic terrorism. which is a VERY big threat to France!
The man is an asshat with thuggish political skills, working for the elite. Il n'etait jamais tres chou.
Tetra, let me tell you a not-carefully-guarded secret: all successful politicians are! Being a thug and working for the elite is how you get the job, from Obama to Merkel to Kim Jong Un.
Krisinajensen
Need help packing so you can live in one of the thriving socialist utopias you so adore ?
You are beyond ignorant and continue to blame everyone but the politicians , the ones at fault for all your complaints !
Who elects those politicians? They are at fault, as well. America: love it or leave it? Sounds like a Fascist mantra.
The Frogs, always one jump ahead. With the rest of the EU trying to keep the entitlement countries of Greece, Spain and Italy afloat, the Frogs decided to elect the socialist party to help them aspire to greatness. A country that give the word useless a whole new meaning.
Ce sont tous des stupide commentaires!!
Appeler d`autres avis stupide ne vous rend pas plus intelligent!! ( calling other opinions stupid does not make you more intelligent )
Mais brumath a raison.
If it makes you feel better........
Bunch of typical socialist idiots. ..."vow to end the power of markets over national economies", indeed.
Kick out those muzlum parasites, quit strangling your economy with "taxes on the rich", get a clue.
Nothing ever happens til one man buys, for a good value, in his opinion; and another man sells, at a profit, in his opinion; neither man is coerced, or "mandated", to buy or sell.
Obamacare, anyone? Look at France.
Do they have the same Constitutional overrides we do to maintain national interest after their leaders were sunk into a position to take away what is most important from their respective citizens based on what is least important in their lives...
Still want to know what happened to the former head of the IMF and if he ever had a national interest underlay under him...
Tell 'em to print more euros, that's what the obamanator does.
They have! That's a big problem at the moment!
Tell them to start a war based on lies and have an economic policy which rewards the rich, just like that idiot "Lil" gw bush-league and that dick, Cheney!
Socialist-English online dictionary
Socialist: "have an economic policy which rewards the rich"
English: "cut all tax bracket rates, including eliminating income taxes for the poor"
Seems like one of the candidates platform is very similar to that of Berries' platform! Both have socialist leanings and are running on the same promises!
May the far-rightist Marine Le Pen determine the outcome of the presidential election in France. There will be a runoff between Sarkozy and Hollande, and the way the election tilts right now is very much to the right. France doesn't need any more hyper-leftist socialist rulers. Those are the very people who are ruining Europe, just like they did to Greece. And get socialist Obama outsted here, too.
Amos, the plundering of the economies has been realized mostly by excessive greed and by people who have capital to invest, mainly on the Right. How can you blame the masses who were all working when the economy had low employment numbers? do you think people would rather get $1,000 dollars of social handouts or jobs paying 2;3;4,0000 dollars per month? please answer me that question see, how you understand people.
Save the Environment: I believe in a free market capitalist system. Not a socialist system (Marxism anyone?) which has just about destroyed the economies of Europe and which is well on its way to do the same in the USA if Obama is not ousted. Please no more food stamp presidents and Obamacare presidents. Get Obama outta here!
Amos, you have not answered my question.
Socialism is not Marxism. Socialism is center left in France and America. Marxism is Stalin's extremist communism USSR, extreme Left. You are trying to tell me apples are oranges. The latest extremism I remember was Bush's Republican presidency. I was going to say extreme right, but in fact the ideology of the Republican party is Money. It values Money over people, how sick is that?. At least extreme right wing supremacist value white People.
Free market capitalism I believe in as well, but it doesn't mean you can abuse and exploit people in this country and all over the globe as you see fit, or as you see you can get away with. Look at the result of your imagination of Free Market Capitalism under Bush. It ruined this country and many countries of the world creating poverty, death and destruction by undermining people's social structure just to make more Money. Free market capitalism is not an excuse for greed, robbing people and screwing societies. Greed was identified by thinkers as a mortal sin 2,000 years ago for a reason.
Now focus and try to answer my simple question: Do you think people would rather get $1,000 dollars of social handouts or jobs paying 2; 3; 4,0000 dollars per month?
Socialism is extreme far left. Marxism isn't much different but if you want to split hairs (like far leftwingers do for various reasons, like shifting blame for mass-murders), they'd be just a little farther left.
The fact that the Marx lovers have been so successful in spreading their anti-growth collectivist poison in Europe, thanks in part to reactionary attitudes against the entrenched nobility, doesn't make them center left.
It just means the far left somehow conquered Europe 1930-1990 even as we were seeing their fellow travelers/genocidal maniacs murdering millions all over the globe during the Cold War.
socialism isn't extreme far left, that's communism.
Socialism is center left if you look at the political spectrum as a clock from 7 AM to 5 PM: communism is 7 to 9 AM, socialism is at between 9 to 11 AM, center is 11am, noon, to 1 pm , Right is 1 to 3 PM , and extreme right is 3 to 5 PM. Obama is at 11 AM, Hollande is at 10 AM, Sarkozy is at 1 PM while Romney is at 2 PM. Bush is at 3 PM. Hitler was at 5 PM.
I hope this helps.
Even the French are rejecting socialism. We need to do that here in November and vote out the Divider in Chief.
Dave: Hear, hear!
Bigger government, more fed jobs and only possibly by more taxes to pay the people. Private enterpize pays it's own way, government will never pay it's own way..not possible. We are over extended in government jobs now.
The USPS is prime example of a complete mess. Over pay over staffed over everthing. Unions Unions Unions are the culprit not the answer.
not over priced like UPS or Fedex
I mailed out last week. $6.45 2days USPS, $23.50 Fedex overnight. I planned a day ahead and paid USPS.
Private enterprise often doesn't want to pay to train their employees. What are you talking about? If private enterprise could they wouldn't pay salaries and people would work for food like slaves did, and I'm not talking FilletMignon here.
And how are people supposed to pay for products and services private enterprise produces if they don't get paid?. that's what we have going right now with China backed by private enterprise who produces products that they are expecting to sell on the American market to people who don't have money. how's that supposed to work when the balance of trade is out of wack and the Chinese are giving it deaf ear? And private enterprise doesn't seem to mind. I think Private enterprise lacks entrepreneurial skills or just plain math skills.
It is the same in France as here. Only they call is "mondialization" and we call it globalization. Whatever it is called in whatever language, it doesn't work. It only helps the countries in the Far East doing the exporting. Does anyone hear either Obama or Romney talking about it? No! No! and No again. They throw up smoke screens and talk about all kinds of third rate invented issues. And we are the stupid ones to let them get away with it., We need a third party candidate. Oh, well, maybe next time.
EXACTLY LIKE I TOLD U LIBTARDS IT WOULD GO DOWN! French people are sick and tired of the toilet that their liberal politicians have turned their country into with their immigration and give away programs. Sarkozy will crush the libtard, mark it down.
The crappy European multi-party system:
The next President of France may be the person who only had 27% support in the first round, and frequently presidents and PM's in the European Union in nations that don't have runoffs are elected with 37% or less support.
2/3 of the country doesn't like you...but you get to lead anyway.
yes but their Congress/parliament includes proportional representation of all parties, bringing better balance and variety socially than the Pepsi/Coke challenge.
Also, when reading these European politics stories, you have to know how to translate the terms that are used, from socialist-Marxist into English.
The description of the French woman Le Pen as "far right" means she's probably against illegal immigration and wants to limit legal immigration into the country.
Certainly, but Immigration issues are used as a cover for Racism and explaining social problems out of hatred on a foreign segment of the population, the Mexicans of America are the Arabs and blacks of France. in parallel to that the real goal is accumulation of wealth as well using hateful racist as tools to get their deeds done. Jean Marie Lepen is, or was if dead, an elitist preferring power and wealth to be in the hands of a few.
Gingrich reminds me of Lepen a lot as far as his eccentricity, his delusions of grandeur, and his fat ass looks.
The faulty multi-party system in Europe allows Hitlers to be elected into government and then seize power.
In elections where someone only backed by 30-38% can win power, the fringe has a much better shot. Hitler won the Chancellery with 37% in the last fair election, and then gradually took over the entire government.
This is much more difficult in a two-party system. Normally, the winner has to get to the high 40's to win, if not higher. Clintoon I believe was the lowest at 43%.
Well....! so many comments.... replete with misunderstandings,factual and historical errors and a dash of French bashing!