ja we're going to pay for this using drones over other countries what is gonna stop the ruskies or china from launching drones from Venezuela or Cuba and hitting strategic American targets?? obama has circumvented every international law in the book we're gonna get it stuck in our duffs on this one..

China and Russia rarely help anyone but themselves ....

u1022....We have had Pakistan permission to launch drones from Paky air bases during the Bush admin but it hit the fan because it was supposed to be secret. They didnt want this publicized to the radical groups.....But, radical democrat members of our intel commitees went to the media on that and we have had an adverse situation with Pakistan ever since. I suspect that they still dont mind too much that we kill these radicals, but they certainly dont want this ugly publicity about it that our idiots in government seem determined to do....to our own detriment....

sotired....You want due process for middle east terrorists??? Are you a lawyer who needs more clients?? Obama just feels that putting numbers on the board means that he is a hero leader and he is winning....He feels no need for any details of who is getting killed.... We, the public, have no idea who was killed....That is another of the Obama secrets...He just released it as good war news, he feels no further responsibility to us....

Well, isn't president Obama a lawyer? Here's the lawyer's oath:

I solemnly swear (or affirm) I will support the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of [...];

I will maintain the respect due to courts of justice and judicial officers;

I will not counsel or maintain any suit or proceeding which shall appear to me to be unjust, nor any defense except such as I believe to be honestly debatable under the law of the land;

I will employ for the purpose of maintaining the causes confided to me such means only as are consistent with truth and honor, and will never seek to mislead the judge or jury by an artifice or false statement of fact or law;

I will maintain the confidence and preserve inviolate the secrets of my client, and will accept no compensation in connection with a client's business except from the client or with the client's knowledge and approval;

I will abstain from all offensive personality, and advance no fact prejudicial to the honor or reputation of a party or witness, unless required by the justice of the cause with which I am charged;

I will never reject, from any consideration personal to myself, the cause of the defenseless or oppressed, or delay any person's cause for lucre or malice.

So help me God.

Among those 'suspected' might very well have been civilians.

The Constitution of the United States only applies to American civilians you idiot.

Cute pic, Amanda, but you flubbed up. He wasn't quoting the constitution. He was quoting the oath lawyers take. Is that in the Constitution? If so, it must be sandwiched between the Goodness and Welfare Clause and the Santa Clause.

Hmm amanda, I thought it applies to the united states government?

Amanda

You might be wrong. Even foreigners are protected, having rights of life, liberty, and property, but due process may be truncated. Anyway, that wasn't my point. I try to keep my posts short because most people's attention span is only about two sentences...

J.A-522495

You think they just fly around and see something and take a shot.

My guess is they have been watching these people for weeks. Checking to see who they make contact with . Getting to know them like a good friend and then when they all show up in one spot BOOM BOOM time to move on to the next batch.

The more the president kills the safer I feel.

mj899: You might be an insecure savage placing such triviality on the price of life.

Why all these hair splitting?

Do the Islamic militants follow any law?

Against Islamic religious Nazi militant beasts everything is fair and do carpet bombings of all the Paki militant areas instead of drone strikes.

It's funny to read you sympathizers for the terrorists attack the President now and screaming about how he is breaking International Laws but when you terrorist sympathizers held the Presidents position, you had no problem about actually breaking humanitarian laws and screaming that you had every right to randomly kill terrorists and or torture the terrorists or what you now call civilians and do so with what you called pride. Really reading the majority of you sympathizers posts simply makes me feel that the Patriot's Act and the enhanced NDAA laws are actually needed.

TRUSTVERIFY: You said that attacking a sovereign nation opens your nation up to the same thing. Uhhhhhh . . . YES! Which is why we're bombing the living daylights out of the countries that harbored the dudes who attacked OUR COUNTRY.

Wake up. No, better yet, go back to sleep.

Hello folks, while the elite (1%ers) have us playing the Democrat Republican blame game, they have us in fear, divided, and distracted while they have their way with us stealing our jobs, money, civil liberties and security .

While we play the Republican Democrat blame game the “greatest military in the history of the world” is bringing in another countries military to assist with local terrorists? The Russian military will be training with our troops in Colorado Springs starting on May 24th, how many of you knew that (look it up)? Remember the movie Red Dawn? This has National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA) written all over it. While we play the Republican Democrat blame game, foreign troops will be on our soil carrying weapons involved in military exercises with designed war games to practice quelling, arresting , detaining and killing “American terrorists” or whatever definition the government ascribes a terrorist as.

Joint U.S.-Russian anti-terror exercise stokes fears of martial law

Russian airborne troops are set to train how to target terrorists in America as part of a joint anti-terror drill with the United States which will take place in Fort Carson, Colorado at the end of next month.

“Airborne troops from Russia and the United States would hold joint anti-terror drills in the U.S. state of Colorado between May 24 and 31,” reports the Xinhua news agency, citing Russian Defense Ministry Col. Alexander Kucherenko. The story was also reported by Russian news outlet RIA Novosti.

The Russian soldiers will also be given access to U.S. special service weapons at Fort Carson.

“This announcement comes at a time when Russia actually has troops working in cooperation with China,” points out Business Insider’s Eloise Lee, making reference to one of the largest ever Russian-Sino naval drills currently underway in the Yellow Sea.

More modern fears revolve around global UN peacekeeping troops being used to quell unrest inside America, foreign troops would be used to carry out gun confiscations and incarcerate American citizens during a time of martial law an issue touched upon by Henry Kissinger during the 1991 Bilderberg meeting when he stated, “Today Americans would be outraged if U.N. troops entered Los Angeles to restore order; tomorrow they will be grateful.”

While we play the Democrat Republican blame game we have disintegrated to the point of allowing a cold war enemy to come on to our soil to work with our military in quelling civil unrest. The NDAA Act can detain United States citizens as enemy combatants. We have sacrificed our liberty for perceived safety and security while we play the Republican Democrat blame game.

Ah, but if it was a republican president killing American enemies, every conservative from Maine to California would be skipping down the street saying, "Woohoo! My president killed some more!"

I'm personally loving the drone attacks. From Libya to Pakistan, it saves the death of an American somewhere.

People are getting any jab they can on the president over deaths by drones. Where was the outcry when Bush killed 4000+ Americans on a vendetta?

Fact is, the article states "militants". That says enough for me.

The USA is a Nation founded on LAWS and the US Constitution...

The US Agencies are VIOLATING these and EOs under the direction of the POTUS...

The Countries who are having their sovereignty VIOLATED should take the offenders to the Hague and let the World Court decide the punishment...

IMO - Until ACCOUNTABILITY is placed on their use, the indiscriminate KILLING will continue...

The use by the US Military in declared combat zones, may save lives. Though there have been US Troops killed by these drones. The latest incident - The people on the ground were indicating the WRONG area was targeted, and the technical adviser (who was over-seeing the operation), was questioning the target. But the drone operator fired anyway, killing a US Marine & Medic...

The question I have. - The US Media/Government holds the foot soldiers ACCOUNTABLE... WHY NOT the people behind the armed drones or the Pilots that have KILLED innocents & children???

Sinaloa cartel, a more traditional drug-trafficking organization widely considered the most powerful, and Los Zetas, founded by former soldiers and considered the most violent as it expands into extortion, kidnapping and other rackets in regions far off the drug route map. A third, the Gulf Cartel, remains well armed and rises to attack from time to time.

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/news/international/countriesandterritories/mexico/drug_trafficking/index.html

In what era would I care about something on the opposite side of the planet.

DOU44

you have no clue or you are a militant being watched by a drone Get ready to bed over and kiss you a s s good by

It would be very interesting to know all the reason why they were Wacked. Look at all the others that were not.

Lusitania,

Research the current Military stand-off in the South China Sea/Spratly Islands...

Both the Philippines & Tawain are asking for & receiving US Military assistance...

This is to combat the Chinese land/resource grab...

If you think this will not effect you and other US Tax Payers. You better think again...

For the latest news see - http://interceder.net/topic/china-philippines-spratly

How old is the human race? We are still fighting like clever Neanderthals, because our stones can go farther and be guided from afar. I am with you on the political party opposition as being a defensive direction the elites have been practicing for centuries. It's so not a new practice, but it still has the same effect it did in the past. Does anyone remember the battles/wars of the catholics vs. protestants, an daughter her father claimed to be illegitmate sat on the throne successfully because she was winning against the catholics. The crusades were useful for the royalty of england to rob the families and people of the noblemen while they were away at war. Just an example, I don't want to stray from the point here.

In the state that political parties are and the direction they are going in, I find myself opposed at both sides what's right for America. George Washington understood the long term affect of war and sought to have America practice isolationism for a reason. Rome once overreached and their subjects learned their tactics, because they are human and by nature we live and learn. Anyways, look what happened to them. Now I'm not saying lets close everything off and end up like Sparta, but you don't see China attacking Japan. These guys are all about honor...Nanking?

History dictates the future because nothing is new, maybe technology, but then again how technologically advanced were we humans in the past to be able to talk to god or gather information(bible/word of God) that is still practiced today as christianity? I mean we have rockets, battleships, iphone, and drones and yet God isn't speaking to us is he? So are we advanced or regressed is the point I'm getting at.

On what planet is it ok to use our laws and policies as an okay to attack(unmanned) with our tech weapons and kill their soldiers in an attempt to take out who we think our enemies are in a whole different country with their own laws and policies? Everyone is taught the golden rule and its not phooey. We will scream for justice if Pakistan learned our tech and sent in drones to take out the guys who okayed this action and 24 innocent soldiers in the process. I mean we would have declared war, I'm not wrong because...history, remember Pearl Harbor. There is no justice for 9/11 if our actions we bring the entire country into a war we cannot protect ourselves from. I mean unless there is a drone defense in place, but even then wrong is wrong. We were attacked a couple of times in a matter of years and here we attack a couple times in a matter of a month. The line is being pushed hard and the worst thing that could happen is that we are seen as irresponsible with our weapons and then we would be like the german nazis vs. the jews, Russia, UK, France(not saying the French would do anything hehehe)and so on. When the world turns against us and it will happen...Napoleon's fate is to be expected. The only thing that's preventing that from happening is the terrorists attacked these countries as well. But when we cross the line they are going to be afraid that our laws will enable us to attack them as well...NOT A ROCKET SCIENTIST but you got to see where this train will lead.

But no one really cares because we lost our income, homes, and they are trying to take away our guns, rights over our bodies, and freedom of speech away. I going to stray a bit because I don't get how Nelly can say how he would have sex with Mrs. Clinton but Nugent gets balled because he said he would go to jail if Mr. Obama was reelected. I didn't hear him say for what crime, but I may be wrong on that. Freedom of speech allows us to say how stupid/black/white/racist/wrong any elite is and it be okay. I'm a dem, and at the risk of catching flack for this, I'll let you know that I'm also black. A republican buddy of mine once said to me you can't be intolerant against intolerance, because then you are what you are opposed to. Meaning tolerance is a fantasy, and even Jesus taught to turn the other cheek/love thy neighbor...tolerance of each other. Instead with the elections and a half black guy in office alot of people have shown an ugly side that scares me. It scares me not because I'm weak, but because our govt is playing us and hardly anyone wants to acknowlegde it until it's a crisis that directly affects them and then its the Pres fault. Anyone involved in politics will tell you that our govt system prevents our govt from being controlled by 1 man. The constituition really laid that on thick. Clinton, Bush, and Obama were not on the field or on the base even saying do this and do that. The Pres gives an okay on something serious like ohh we found the person responsible for attacking us, do we go in sir. FDR was asked do we drop the bombs sir?

But a routine attack no. No the Pres doesn't get consulted. For those who say this wasn't routine, last time I checked this weapon was used in a recruitment ad and they clearly stated we practice the drones all the time. My husband saw first hand them being used in Iraq. This attack has been rountine for a very long time, it's just now there was a mess up and innocent Pakistani soldiers were killed in the process. So Pakistan contacted our media with the story and it wasn't covered up. I like to think there are still a very honest journalists out there who care about the truth and not the whole propaganda stew.

By our own laws, we must respect that these soldiers were innocent until proven guilty. As far a russians here for training. Yea that worked out great when we trained what is now the Taliban to help defend themselves from Russia. Now they just really want to attack us with the weapons tech we hooked them up with. So let's train Russia instead how to take a terrorist out in America, because we don't know how to do it maybe. Or train to take an American(survivalist beware) out in America because our soldiers will not turn their guns on their mom, dad, brother, or sister. Our govt can not afford to get their hands dirty again, Ruby Ridge anyone??

TrustVerify, nice to hear some sense to our future in the comments from someone. But there are way to few of you and Ron Paul and way to many screaming hate against each other instead of at the real cause. Our govt hasn't feared the people since I have no idea. I do know that the govt is suppose to though, but alas here we sit fearing our govt and everyone else just doesn't care I guess.

MJ....I dont have a problem with our people killing the enemy...or even the suspected enemy...I hope it was effective against someone who has or would do us damage....But there is nothing to tell us that. Why have the article at all if that is all the info?....All the news is doing is stirring up the pot with the statement that we killed six or eight people in a foreign land. There is a proper proven way to do those things and going for the publicity is not the proper way...You can bet that if it is in the news on a regular basis that someone reading that news is going to be trying to figure out were the home base is for those drones...The less that we tell them the better. And, what good does it do for us to brag about it?? Election year, maybe??? I think it is a pretty safe bet that the military doesnt go to the press with stuff like this if the administration has not OK'd it....

Hello folks, by attacking a sovereign country over and over again we are opening our country to the same treatment.

Lets see the first country that tries to run drone strikes on US soil. The only smoking hole you'll see is where that country used to exist.

"Why is every little incident released to the media??"

Seriously, did you even read the article. The second sentence (that would be the one between the first sentence and the third sentence) reads, "A Pakistani security official on condition of anonymity told NBC News the drone had fired four missiles and struck a compound in the forest-covered Dre Nishtar area of Shawal valley, a remote part of North Waziristan."

You might not be aware, but the United States government does not have control over what anonymous Pakistani officials tell reporters.

Chris from Yucaipa,

A Mexico drone crashed in TX a few years ago... see http://www.kvia.com/news/26167525/detail.html

Drones are old technology, the US Marines were flying them during the 1980's...

Two years ago, prior & after shelling a South Korea island, North Korea drones were reported flying over the area... see http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/north-korea-flew-drone-over-sea-border/story-e6frfku0-1225906402847

I see, the body count has been upgraded from 6 to 8. That certainly makes it more newsworthy, but not more honorable in the least. I see a lot of trigger-happy posters here, but this incident will draw international criticism. We are NOT at war with Pakistan, on whose soil this keeps happening.

Look on the bright side - another 8 have gone to reap the benefits of those 72 virgins...

Well, whoopie s--t! sotired, For all practical purposes, we are at war with Pakistan. An American still breathing will bring international criticism. What's your point?

An American still breathing will bring international criticism.

Maybe in the ME, but there are other countries that are allied with us. And it's not like we can afford yet another war.

Hello folks, can you see the irony of all the warmongers on this blog who out rightly support the illegal preemptive strikes of our military on sovereign nations at the behest of our government? While these warmonger sheeple support the atrocities abroad their same government is bringing in to the United States Russian Paramilitary troops to conduct war games to suppress dissent in their sovereign country.

First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.

Martin Niemöller (1892–1984)

I have to agree with many of you , this whole drone business just doesn't seem right , I mean shouldn't we either be defending ourselves from an active attack to just outright kill a group of people , or have indisputable proof that we have the right people before killing them at the very least ? It seems like it's gotten way out of hand as of late , yeah I know we have gotten a lot of "terrorists" but this just doesn't seem like the right way to go about it to me .

Adwaup....They are trying to kill us and we are trying to kill them....and you suggest that our part in that is not honorable.....Would you think that we would be honorable if we did not participate and that they did all the killing??? I am sure that would work out well....Would you think it would be fair(and honorable) for you or your family to the the targets of terrorism while we are demonstrating our tactic of being 100% pure and honorable???

J.A. , I understand what your saying and I am glad to eliminate an enemy with no losses on our side to do so , but something about this just really feels like a step in the wrong direction to me , everything we do is a step in some kind of direction but it just feels wrong .

Maybe if I felt the targets were verified militants but all I see is a claim that they were no real proof for most of the strikes I've seen was presented . And it also bothers me that we are doing to citizens in other countries things we could never do here , do our laws not go beyond our borders when talking about our military and how it conducts itself ?

You know I hate terrorism with a passion and sometimes have what I would consider irrational thought of "we should just wipe em all out and let their god sort em out" but I also know that wouldn't be right either . Personally I'm at a loss of what a real working solution is to the whole problem with Islam but I usually go with my gut and it says these strikes are getting out of hand and if we don't control them better we will someday be seeing them here in our own country .

Tolstoy 2....I dont put much faith in quoting an anonomous Pakistani official. There is nothing proven there that doesnt have some part speculation and purpose behind it. He knows that a drone fired four missles....and he saw them all??? This Pakistani is just speculating and the media is at fault for using random quotes from such a person. But, you know of course that the media has no problem with not actually supporting our side of things.....

Adwaup. I understand what you are saying, but war has never been fair....or always won by the good guys. Remember the saying that all is fair in love and war. The laws governing the workings inside a country have never been the laws of war. War has been with us throughout human history and it has pretty much been that they will kill us or we will kill them....It is a little dif from shoplifting......I would hope that we would have pretty good knowledge of who we kill and why before we just kill people at random....I have to believe that our country does that less than any other country out there and we have to trust our military until it is proven otherwise. Yes, our soldiers minds can become somewhat jaded by what has been seen and done in war and they can over-react at times. But, it is difficult for me to believe that we have a program to randomly kill people without cause....We cannot give them a defense team and prepare for trial before we act on a war basis...no country can or will do that.

What are you going to do, Pakistan? Ask us for more money?

We are paying for keeping Saudi Arabia and Pakistan on world map.

There should have been no 1991 Iraqi war for saving Saudi Arabia from Saddam.

Pakistan would have been out of map in their internal battles or in battles against India.

u1022575 --- We paid the price already...on 9-11!

Yo ron, those six could be the ones who try to land a jet in times square. Forget the cost. It's cheaper to spend the money on drones than to risk any american lives. Period. Wake up.

Well Ron that's way cheaper than putting 165,000 (peak number)boots on the ground like W did. Especially considering that country DID NOT ATTACK US!!!

Yo dawg; I'd say its more likely these 'suspects' had no such viable plot and now their family members want that kind of revenge. I'd also say that this repeated scenario exacerbates any real effort to protect "american lives".

Half of NATO forces deaths in Afghanistan since 2001 are due to backstabbing Paki allies.

Instead of putting a single soldier on the ground, just do carpet bombings to eliminate mad Paki Islamic militants.

We have already wasted too huge monies on Paki curses on earth since 47.

bigdaddydawg: You stated they could be which is the same as might or possibly. The truth is an unknown. You condone murder of those when no evidence is presented? It is quite cowardly to murder people using robots without trial.

I agree. GTFO. We're accomplishing nothing.

Agreed! This news is excellent. We shouldn't be putting the lives of our servicemen/women in danger if we can mop up these cowards who hide in women's burkahs using drones. A bit expensive, yes, but I'm willing to pay for it even if my taxes have to go up a bit.

You seem to be a savage unfit to live in a civil society.

Just dead 'suspects' killed by remote control from some person a thousand miles away that really have no knowledge of their targets; just taking orders. You guys and anyone involved need to do some soul searching.

Expensive? Hardly! It's dirt cheap! Let's say we killed 300,000 Iraqis in Bush's war. (A number that international organizations say is in the neighborhood, but the Bush administration said is way too high) For the sake of the economics, let's say that's close. So when the final bill comes in on the Iraq war, it will have cost about a trillion dollars. So if we spent a trillion on 300,000 enemy combatants, that is $3.33 million for each. Now if you accept that the number is far lower and maybe not all those killed were enemy combatants, the cost for each just gets higher still.

At less that $20k per militant enemy, that's a bargain price! When you think about Iraq and the costs, we could have literally bought off every man, woman and child in the country for $30,000 apiece in "buy off" costs and we'd have spent less money. So for less than $20k to kill someone you are highly confident is a bad guy, is a price that even a conservative could love.

Agree New Day. With the debt we are leaving our kids osama hurt us more than 9/11 in my opinion. What does it take to kill an American? .28 cents? Keep em' flying.

Wrong! Six really evil fumb duckers get their wished-for face-to-face with Allah.

Translation: 6 people about whom we know absolutely nothing but who the government (which has never ever ever lied. Ever.) claims were militants. Maybe they were. Maybe they won't. All that I can be sure of is that I have no idea whatsoever and neither does anyone else here.

Translation: We must be PC and call them "suspected terrorists" not just terrorists, since none have been convicted in an American court. That is the way it has always been since the Roman days, hasn't it?

And he is doing it without a flight suit and "Mission Accomplished" banner hanging on a aircraft carrier.

The 9 year anniversary of Bush's embarassing county fair jet ride- hey y'all, watch this- and cod-piece victory speech was a few days ago.

Everytime I see some post bout this "mission accomplished" ruse I feel inclined to respond. I was there on USS Abraham Lincoln when the President landed and addressed us for OUR "Mission Accomplished". Meaning the crew of the USS Abraham Lincoln and the embarked Air Wing had accomplished their mission, nothing more, nothing less.

Look we were on our way home after 6 months deployed, got the call to go back to the Gulf in response to 9-11 and we finally were again on our way home after 10 months gone from family and friends to respond to the call of duty our nation needed.

When you understand the whole context of what really happened at that moment, you will be pissed at yourselves for believing that any president of ours would proclaim that the War in Iraq was over at at that time (Mission Accomplished).

We of the crew made that banner and put it up as a sign that we accomplished our mission. GWB didn't even know we were going to do it, or any of his people had anything to do with it. GET IT???

Moreover, you should be more pissed and ashamed at yourselves for believing what you read and saw from MSNBC and the left wing nut job reporters after the fact.

This one got twisted beyond belief. I am not a Bush supporter, I think he's a real Moron and did us wrong in many ways. But having been there at that time, I will never accuse him of proclaiming the war in Iraq as "mission accomplished" for that one emotional moment he was with the crew and the airwing thanking us for accomplishing OUR mission. Nothing more, nothing less.

Does that make sense? Or is that too factual to comprehend. Put your emotions aside and base opinions on facts, not emotions and what you read and hear third hand from the left media.

Also, what moron would believe that a War is a mission???

"Missions" are parts of Wars and there are THOUSANDS of "missions" in every War.

Again for anyone to believe that a President would equate one mission with an entire War is absurd.

When you look at the facts there were still 3 aircraft carriers on station dropping bombs and over 300,000 troops on the ground conducting lethal ops on the enemy when that moment occurred.

How the hell can your mind work that way that you even consider he meant the War was over?

Bottom Line Up Front (BLUF)- The USS Abraham Lincoln crew and AirWing was called upon to perform a mission and did it with great success and sacrifice. "Mission Accomplished" GET IT???

FUDOG, thanks for your posts. Any thinking person knows what you posted, is correct, but that leaves out the Obamatites, I suppose. I think the flight suit would be a requirement for flying on that plane, for safety reasons, am I right?.

Fudog130,

Thanks for the post and the explanation...

The only way to fight the AGENDA of most Media outlets and others.

1. Is to remind the people/readers of the TRUTH, by statements from those who were there...

2. Point out the inaccurate statements with, viable references to PROOF they are incorrect...

3. Ask the questions that point out the deceptions and demand answers. This requires your knowing the subject matter, unlike the average REPORTERS...

4. And keep doing it, because when you stop doing it. They will continue and keep building on the deception and lies...

Don't hold your breath. The US corp-gov't fascists have printing presses to issue unlimited amounts of war debt paper, and they have weapons bases all around the world. US Afghanistan policy was conceived in the early 1980s.

Tell-A-band? I thought it was supose a be I'll-kick-yah!

Let Pres.Obama RUN the DEPT. of Defense,,,,,,,,,,, thumbs up

-------------------

But please put someone in charge of the ecomony,, stop the f-in spending

I totally agree! Obama rocks! Lots better than Rollover Romney! If Romney is elected he promises every American not part of the 1% free lube - because his Wallstreet buddies, and the rest of the world will be in line to roll us over, and screw us all nice and hard, so we're gonna need it.

Oh, no. You're one of those folks who tries the old 1% rhetoric? I'd hoped for better from you.

Don't you understand that the bottom 50% of our population in terms of income only pays 4% of our total taxes? The top 50% pays the other 96%. And the top 25% pays 83% of the taxes! The whole "Rich living off the poor" mantra just won't fly.

It's a shame there isn't a bit more brain inside that pretty head.

War is in our nature, it is inevitable. Would you prefer a president who is afraid to fight? Or one who is willing to fight, and put his reputation on the line to win?

You can hate on Obama all you want, I prefer to back a winner.

You might be a closet savage and are unaware of your condition.

I'm totally aware of my condition and I'm far to savage to hide it in a closet. That doesn't make me wrong.

You tell'em Tiger. ;)

Tell me what Amanda- that you are admitting you have the morality of a thug? Okay. Your pettiness does make your points seem less intelligent because you lack empathy. You can't devalue human life without showing yourself to be a hypocrit. Your army- in an unwinnable plight- is killing far outside its borders to prop up a US gov't puppet, and it is unaccountable to the same world legal bodies that your gov't demands others obey or be subject to.

You, DOU44 should wake up. We are all savages, it's the nature of the beast, and unless you're from another planet you are one of us. Unless you have a valid argument on the subject at hand, you should pipe down and let the adults talk. Stop name-calling, it's so savage and unwarranted. Remember opinions are like a$$h0les, everybody has one.

Well, Arafat, the terrorist, got a Nobel Peace prize. That tells us a lot about the integrity of the Oslo socialist.

HAHA! That reminds me of Cary Grant in Destination Tokyo. He's the commander of a submarine during WWII and he tells his men "I've heard that the Japanese are happy to die for their emperor. Well we're about to make a lot of Japs very happy."

Wow, that's moronically amusing- if you're 88 and live in Crawford, TX.

@cubsfan Are you a pedophile or something?? You keep following amanda plumley and her avatar is a kid, but she can't say anything without you commenting on her comments. Just saying its alil weird and creepy and makes you look like you are on a sex offenders list, unless you guys are on the same computer commenting one after the other...the first one seems more than likely the truth tho

Amanda, dearest, you probably also advocate giving the President total credit for killing bin Laden, but the plain fact of the matter is that this stuff is not the President's deal. This was a military gig. If you like it, tell the Joint Chiefs of Staff; tell the CIA; tell the black-ops people; tell the dudes who extracted the information using the enhanced interrogation the President opposes so much. Don't bother lauding the one guy who had the least part in the whole deal. He flies around the world telling everyone what a mistake it is that we're fighting this war, but then he wants the credit when something good happens over there. If he gets credit for every time a soldier does something right over there, does he get credit whenever a soldier does something wrong? I don't hear liberals trying to blame him for the 17-person massacre. That was the soldier's fault. And I agree with that. But this thing is the same sort of deal, Love. You can't give him the credit for something he played no part in. If you can give credit to anyone, even if they weren't involved, then I want some credit too. I did as much as he did.

Doesn't matter who was behind it, if it all went up in smoke and backfired it would have all been squarely on president Obama's shoulders. In America's eyes and the international community. It comes down to the fact that HE had to ok the order for it to go on. He deserves credit for doing something Romney and many other presidents wouldn't have had the guts to do.

Tell the joint chiefs of staff, and the CIA and the black-ops team.... whats wrong you don't know their names? Exactly... Their names weren't in the public eye, or the worlds eye, Obama's was.

I've heard that comeback before, Beautiful. But think it through. If it all blew up in his face, and all us evil Conservatives tried to blame him for it, what would you be saying? You'd be saying "STOP IT! IT'S NOT HIS FAULT! BLAME THE CIA! BLAME THE MILITARY!" If he wouldn't have deserved the blame, he shouldn't have deserved the credit.

Conversely, if he DESERVES the credit, then he WOULD HAVE deserved the blame.

Which way do you prefer it, Sugar?

Let me ask you this, do you believe Lincoln actually "freed the slaves" or was it the armies who did the fighting and dieing during the civil war? But Lincoln still gets credit. History is full of leaders who get credit for having their name on a project. It's a very simply concept to understand. Sorry that it seems to be over your head.

Think of the military campaign of Julius Caesar, Alexander the great, Napoleon Bonaparte, even Adolf Hitler, all these huge names in history were technically nothing at all without their military forces. But were credited with all the achievements, good or bad, it's the leader who's name is in the public eye that is held accountable, and that history remembers.

Awww, don't get condescending, Gorgeous. ♥

Yes, Lincoln freed the slaves. Sigh . . . C'mon, I've got to take you back to history class.

HOW did Lincoln free the slaves? By signing a piece of legislation called the Emancipation Proclamation. Remember? He signed a bill freeing them. Obama didn't sign a bill killing bin Laden. And as for winning the Civil War, I'd only give Lincoln SOME credit for that. I credit him for picking the generals and setting up the strategies, just like I credit Bush for setting up the strategies that led to bin Laden's death.

You still haven't answered my question. Would you have blamed Obama if the mission had failed?

Sigh. You posted again while I was typing that last post.

Yes, Bonaparte gets credit for running roughshod over Europe because he RAN THE WHOLE SHOW. So did Hitler and Julius Caesar. Obama has not run this show. The CIA has. All he's done is say "Yeah, shoot him" when they told him we found bin Laden. And Romney said in 2007 that bin Laden needed to die, so please don't tell me that Romney wouldn't have performed EXACTLY like Obama did . . . because he would have. ♥

Amanda- The US does not have enough soldiers to win in Afghanistan. There are about 90,000 regulars there now plus mercenaries. Afghanistan has a population of 30 million, and it is larger than France. Sorry, but there is no US victory. The US needed 1.5 million ground soldiers to hold the rugged countryside and rural areas, and unless Congress reinstates the mandatory draft of 18-45 year olds to raise the numbers needed- LOL- it is not going to happen.

Blob warfare couldn't win a war on insurgency anyway, unmanned drones controlled by small teams can and will. It took time for our strategy to adjust to the war they're fighting, but lately they're doing it the smart and correct way. Small elite teams is what this war needed from the start, and practically every soldier I know that has been on the ground there agrees with that.

And Cubsfan continues to nitpick over random facts while completely missing the point. It doesn't matter who you give credit to or for what, history remembers the person who's in the spot light, and who's name is associated with the movement. In this case, it was Obama. You might as well say Obama pulled the trigger himself, because he said go ahead with it and took the risk of things going wrong.

Nitpick over random facts? I think who exactly was in office during key stages of the initial search programs for bin Laden is a bit more than a random fact. And with how much liberals have said Romney never would have given the order, the fact that he said he'd give it in 2007 is certainly relevant. And you STILL haven't answered my question.

One more time, Love. Would you have blamed the President if it had gone wrong?

Why does such a cute girl have to be a liberal?

I bet Romney says he wouldn't let Wallstreet screw America over if he's elected too.

I wouldn't need to blame him if it failed, the rest of the world would have crucified him for it, like they do with everything bad that happens. But who I think should get the credit is irrelevant. It's about who actually gets the credit.

Do you even know the names of the other people involved? Most people will say no, because they didn't get credit.

Sighhhhhhhhh. Yes, they would have crucified him for it, Dear, and you would have jumped to his defense. You would have tracked down all those nameless people who don't get the credit, and you would have told us all to blame them. Which is the entire point. You keep trying to skirt the issue, Honey, but it's very simple. Liberals believe Obama is entitled to the credit if it goes right, but not entitled to the guilt if it goes wrong.

I wonder if we'll still bicker like this after we're married.

That isn't true at all, I personally believe all wars should be settled with our leaders fighting to the death themselves and it should be televised for everyone to watch. Then we would be ensured strong leaders and wars would be a lot less frequent. And for the record I would still vote for Obama...

Accountability should be squarely on the leaders shoulders and they should be willing to die for what they believe in and would send others to die for.

LOL.

All wars should be settled with our leaders fighting to the death themselves and it should be televised for everyone to watch.

I love this girl! Confirm my friend request, Miss Diplomat. :-)

Amanda, you are obviously not a student of military history. The battle from the air did not win WWII. The battle from the air did not win in Korea. The battle from the air did not win in Vietnam. The battle from the air did not win in Iraq. The air battle can soften up targets, create chaos amongst troops and may even win a battle or two, but the only thing that has ever won a war is boots on the ground. I don't know what soldiers you have been talking to, but I spent 35 years in the military and I never met any of them, with the exception of a few pilots. For what it's worth, we don't need 1.5 million troops either. I would say that 155,000 troops, including special forces and aviation units, would do the job in about 18 months.

Cubs and Amanda, y'all need to dig into your American history a bit more. The Emancipation Proclamation did not free all the slaves. It only emancipated the slaves in 10 states that were still in rebellion. Slave holding border states that were part of the Union were exempted, as were Tenn. which was mostly under Union control, as well as counties in Virginia that were under Union control and in the process of forming West Virginia. There were also some counties around the Tidewater area that were exempted, again because they were under Union control. Slavery did not become completely illegal until December of 1865, when the 13th Amendment outlawed both slavery and involuntary-servitude EXCEPT as a punishment for committing a crime.

"Doesn't matter who was behind it, if it all went up in smoke and backfired it would have all been squarely on president Obama's shoulders. In America's eyes and the international community. It comes down to the fact that HE had to ok the order for it to go on. He deserves credit for doing something Romney and many other presidents wouldn't have had the guts to do."

A ridiculous argument. Let's assume that Obama sends SEALs to raid a compound in Pakistan. Obama isn't there but a few families are and the SEALs shoot nine or ten people and make a hasty escape. What happens next? Do you think Obama gets on national television and interrupts regularly scheduled program to announce, "Hey, we thought we had OBL, but it turns out we were wrong and we killed some innocent folks?" No, that would never happen. There are two possibilities: 1) No one ever hears a word about it; 2) We get a vague report about "suspected militants" being killed and everyone forgets about it.

*Obama isn't there should of course be *Osama isn't there. It was a typo, so don't read anything into it.

but in the "minds" of the rightwingnutters "Obama, Osama...iceberg Goldberg...what's the DIFFERENCE?"

Oliver North warned Congress? And they didn't take the word of a convicted felon? Shocking!

Viewer Ready This Star Chamber you speak of has also been identified by other names. Some call them the Illuminati others call them The Elite and so on. I would however question that they have America's interests in mind. I think they place their interests well above the American people best interests. Look at the bank oil industry wall street NAFTA and other corporations or governmental branches actions that have stripped Americans of their assets. The global companies have global interest and therefore are not necessarily going to make decisions based on Americas best interests. Sorry but I have to disagree on this one. Lets hope I am wrong though and you are right.

It's people like you that drive up the cost of aluminum foil.

rb LOL now that was orginal.

tin is too expensive and pound for pound aluminium works just as well anyway... (8^))

If the Saudis choke up the oil supply, it's only because we let them. Did you know that professional oil companies estimate that there is four times as much oil at the Four Corners than in all the Middle East?

(The Four Corners is where the four states meet at one point over on the western side of the US, btw.)

Hey Jonathan hope you and yours are doing well. It is not just the Saudis pulling the string on oil prices. American oil companies which are subsidiaries of the original Standard Oil company have created one crisis after another to jack the price up. You know well that the Saudis have financial interests in the US weapons machine thereby also benefiting from the manufacture of weapons.

During the forties, a Studebaker automobile was converted to a vapor combustion engine. It was getting 149 mpg. This Studebaker car was comparable to a Hummer in weight. Standard Oil bought the patent and shelved it. This is only one example of what I mean when I say that this crisis has been created and maintained by the elite in the world. They don't give a damn about how many die. It would not surprise me if they consider this the best birth control in the world. Certainly after Reagan came into the picture birth control distribution to developing third world countries was stopped and no president since then reinstated it but they sure have invested in war and that has not been successful in curbing the numbers. This archaic growth model has to be stopped before peace and stability can be achieved.

yo cubbie - and the drilling and extraction COST IS? Anybody remember that BP in the GULF had a raging GUSHER that they were ready and willing to CAP and SIT ON - so much for "national interest" and the price of FUEL, eh? And we would have never KNOWN without the SPILL...

oh, and fight - where's the DATA - mere CONJECTURE won't fly. using every trick known and regenerative power, the Otto cycle (that's "spark ignition engine" in layman's terms) has NEVER been able to achieve more than 35% theoretical efficiency. The ONLY way they could have derived that kind of fuel efficiency was DOWNHILL WITH A TAIL WIND - the most significant losses are in the EXHAUST and RADIATOR - both "wasted heat sources".

The Studebaker was not theory it was an actual running car that got 149 mpg. The man who invented it sold the patent but kept the car. Funny how these stories get buried. Huge corporations fund Universities and if you think that they don't have influence over the type of information that is disseminated then your in a group of people who would rather follow propaganda than to lead America into a clean future.