The whole world is bankrupt and yet we continue to support this war in Afghanistan? Here in US we have record number of people on food stamps, on welfare, homeless, unemployed and on and on and yet we are trying to build Afghanistan? Our own kids are going to bed without any food in their stomach and we still refuse to end this money pit of a war.

It's too late. Yes, we shouldn't of been there to begin with but we must finish what we started.

It sounds horrible and probably is but I would salt their opium fields before I left.

Can we spread freedom and democracy through leading by example instead of making examples? I firmly believe people want freedom, so it is up to them, yet they need to see the model in action not a military action.

Drones don't disrupt the residents of Afghanistan? Do you not get out much or read the news? The president is, on a monthly basis, condemning our use of drones for their civilian casualties.

This war is a waste of lives and money. Our leaders are just too proud to admit that it is a failure.

conditioned cattle think war is a solution. conditioned cattle attack those that desire peace. conditioned cattle will never break out of the current mold of human behaviour. they are trainable, quiet, conforming and self-policing. and they feel patriotic during all this.

well patriots, make way for those that defend your nation so you may have a peaceful picnic with your children. those claiming to do so in the news are pulling the exact opposite way. on purpose. i know, i know... too much. you're numb and can't tell. well, some can. stop debating them.

beachole dot wordpress

if you want peace, prepare for war - ancient Roman wisdom

It wasn't a failure until this Administration took over and what is this line of bull that we have to keep spening money so Karzai and co. can stand up to the Taliban. Wasn't our fearless leader just allowing secret negotiations with the Taliban? I am so tired of this back door sneaking and spin BS. November can't come soon enough. I expect any day Obama will issue one of his executive orders (aka king proclamations) that we can't have an election in November. That won't fly for a second.

These wars are a good dramatic distracting lure away from even more injustice at home, which is also killing thousands.

Who would dare compare the horrors of war against financial white crime horrors?

I'm conflicted about this war. It seems like we're dumping $$ down a cesspool, because as soon as the US is out of there, the Taliban will come back. If the locals there have bought in to the islamic rhetoric, getting them to return to supporting terrorism should be relatively easy. The problem I see is that we, as a nation... and particularly our Pretender President, will not admit the we are at war with Islam.

F Karzi, he wanted us out a few weeks ago. Maybe he realized that a rope and a bridge are in his future when we leave. One giant $hithole and we should pack it up now..............

.....did anyone bother to ask what their world view is for the USofA, post 2014? We're in a huge pit and they keep asking for more! there's nothing left...they cannot squeeze blood out of stone!

The Russians weren't able to win in Afghanistan and we can't either. We should bring all our men and women home and let them fend for themselves and we need to do the same here in our own country. I have to say though, I cringe, when I hear our leaders having anything to do with NATO. Obama is trying to turn more and more of our freedoms over to NATO. Think about this....what do you think would happen to our country if NATO had any say in what we do? NATO has members from countries who are lead by dictators, by communists or both and by countries that sponsor terrorism against the U.S. Many of them hate us and want to see us fall and Obama is trying to turn over our freedoms to these people? If this ever happens America's citizens are going to pay a hefty price. It will definitely never be a government 'by the people' anymore.

If we can't defeat the Taliban after 10 years, how can we expect Afghanistan to do it when they're on their own? They wont. Just GTFO.

My vision for a post 2014 afghanistan and pakistan is a glass parking lot.

I don't think we need help with that.

Remember, Afghanistan is another "Muslim country" - one obama is sure to keep supporting. Besides, word has it from a good friend stationed there is US troops will remain until at least 2024.

On the other story of the day, The Taliban has struck a deal with the Afghani Military leaders to share the booty from attacking and stealing from the US military. What future? Get to hell out and stay out of foreign lands.

To maintain hope in these dark times it is necessary to take actions, preferably with others. Establish active hope in your community despite the negative karma likely in Afghanistan. When we can be at peace within ourselves, it becomes natural to find understanding and peace with others, as these folks try to do http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2CZZ0vhS8U

stop giving our money to people that hate us.hell just stop giving our money away period.mind our own business.

Which "war", ladies and gentlemen? This is an occupation, an invasion. Look up in a dictionary what the definition of war is. Besides, don't ask the whole world for help to reconstruct Afghanistan. If you destroy that nation while "serving", you have to reconstruct it yourselves. Ask for some help to the thousands of defense contractors who became billionaries in the whole business.

wmg-21, maybe the French are smarter than us and finally realize it's time to cut their losses. We should immediately pull out and cut our loses as well.

Obama told reporters that the two-day summit would focus on Afghanistan's move to peace and stability after a decade of war.

Falling on deaf ears, especially since the Taliban and the Afghanistan military are now brothers sharing the booty. Let's wait and see who is the last man standing after the U.S. and NATO pull out.

Yeah, "Thanks Americans, for your hard earned taxpayer dollars. That will certainly help in my retirement."...Karzai.

Hello folks, there will be one business the U.S. won’t leave behind and that is the very lucrative opium business. Is it any surprise our soldiers get hooked on a drug they use to escape from the atrocities they are engaged in every day. If you are naïve enough to think that the drug trade is in the hands of nefarious drug dealers and not the governments of the world you are brain washed. Since the British East India Trading Company in the 1600's the India Afghanistan area has always been the largest suppliers of Opium which has carried on today and is a multi-billion dollar business. Britain has historically controlled the opium business and now the U.S. is smack dab in the middle of it. In 2000 the Taliban had taken over and created a law that stopped the growing of poppies all the while storing vast quantities of Opium in warehouses to increase the price. Well that didn't sit well with the powers who previously controlled the opium trade. In 2001 we went to war with Afghanistan and we will be hard pressed to give back these enormous profits back to the control of the Taliban. If America was anti-drug we would have destroyed the poppy fields, we haven't! You can easily find the videos on YouTube where American soldiers are carrying bags of fertilizer for the poppy fields and guarding them.

Here is a short snippet of an article on the” war on drugs”:

The “War On Drugs” Is A $2.5 Trillion Racket: How Big Banks, Private Military Companies And The Prison Industry Cash In

News // Jul 11 2011

By David DeGraw – AmpedStatus Report

For a further understanding of how the War on Drugs is deeply intertwined with the War on Terror, the invasion and occupation of Afghanistan has led to an explosive increase in drug trade profits:

Afghanistan as a Drug War

“From a modest 185 tons at the start of American intervention in 2001, Afghanistan now produced 8,200 tons of opium, a remarkable 53 percent of the country’s GDP and 93 percent of global heroin supply.

In this way, Afghanistan became the world’s first true ‘narco-state.’ If a cocaine traffic that provided just 3 percent of Colombia’s GDP could bring in its wake endless violence and powerful cartels capable of corrupting that country’s government, then we can only imagine the consequences of Afghanistan’s dependence on opium for more than 50 percent of its entire economy.

At a drug conference in Kabul this month, the head of Russia’s Federal Narcotics Service estimated the value of Afghanistan’s current opium crop at $65 billion. Only $500 million of that vast sum goes to Afghanistan’s farmers, $300 million to the Taliban guerrillas, and the $64 billion balance ‘to the drug mafia,’ leaving ample funds to corrupt the Karzai government in a nation whose total GDP is only $10 billion.”

Fair enough, JoeCal. I think we, as a country, historically, have seen our "Nation Building" attempts fail often enough that we would just call it quits on the whole failed concept. It's worked once, and only once, all the times we've tried it: South Korea. And while that may be a rather stellar example of how things might turn out, we've seen it fail (spectacularly) every other time-- from Vietnam to the banana republics in S. America that we supported to Afghanistan and Iraq. We're not good at building other countries-- the people there resent our intrusion (go figure). Nation building is a failed world policy. We need to stop pretending that it works.

Nell, you had better educate yourself, because you are not unlike most Americans and know little to nothing about the history or facts concerning Afghanistan. The American CIA armed and trained Osama bin Laden and the mujahadeen to drive the Russians out of Afghanistan, because the Russians wanted to control the opium flow, which is worth billions if not trillions of dollars. At that time Afghanistan produced 60% of the world's opium. It now produces 90%. I guess the CIA is doing a better job than the Russians with crop cultivation. If you don't know what opium is used for, let me enlighten you. It is used to make heroin.

Also, you should know that Afghanistan has a huge mineral reserve of lithium and has often been referred to by mineralologists as the new Saudi Arabia of the Middle East. In case you don't know, lithium is used in batteries, specifically for hybrid and electric vehicles, which will only increase in production in the future.

This war in Afghanistan was never about freedom and helping the Afghan people. That is just another lie that many Americans have swallowed hook, line, and sinker. This war is all about drugs and mineral wealth, which if you don't understand what that means, in a word, it means MONEY! Your grandiose philosophies are no different than most braindead and unread Americans. Maybe if you tried reading and doing a little research, you would no longer be considered one of the sheeples. It has gotten to the point in this country the American sheeples will accept anything the government says as truth, and the propaganda is inundated with lies. Try to remember that Jesus Christ was the greatest man who ever lived, and his own people killed him, simply because he told them the Truth, and they viewed it as a threat to their materialistic wealth. That's what happens when someone tells the Truth, because as the old saying goes, "The Truth Hurts", and who knows what would happen if an attempt were made to eradicate the liars. Then we would have very few, if any, politicians left to govern. One day, the Creator of it all will blot it out of existence and start over. If you don't know what that means, try reading the Bible, specially the book of Revelation and maybe you will finally realize what the Truth actually is.

I have a friend who is stationed where Obama made his "suprise visit"... they said that he was there ONLY for primetime television in America, and promptly left the moment his speech ended. He did not stay for a memorial service for the soldiers they lost that week that was scheduled for 30 mins later... I'm sorry, where am I supposed to believe that Obama gives two sh*ts about our men and women over there?

Releasing known terrorists and "negotiating" with a terrorist organization is completely stupid. They have no honor, and sure as hell have NONE of my trust... Why would we ever think that they would "keep their word?"

ONCE AGAIN THE 92% OF US CITIZENS THAT HAVE NEVER SERVED IN THE US MILITARY OR HAVE NEVER BEEN HERE (AFGHANISTAN) POST BULLSH!T.

Nell-413737 - I believe we had to go to Afghanistan because of terrorism.

That was true as demanded by Senator Charles Wilson, to get the USSR 40th Army Occupation out of Afghanistan.

That was true weeks after the 9/11 2001 Attacks, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arxKhJIjIiY

What is NOT true is the term "terrorism", as the real term must be Fundamentalist Islam, as in Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists, etc. all supported by the Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran.

Nell-413737 - But, the technology has changed and we can use drones effectively without disrupting lives of our soldiers and the residents of Afghanistan.

That is NOT true, and only true in the propaganda commericals of the manufacturers of the MQs (aka "Drones") and the USAF. Positive Target identification and Terminal Guidance still requires "Boots on the Ground", same reason some of my Teams are redeployed from here (Afghanistan) and currently at Redacted.

Nell-413737 - I think we probably should keep our commitment and must continue to help them...but we are spending $2B a week on a war we cannot win...Just sayin'

False, not true again. We are NOT spending $2 Billion a Week on a War we cannot win. President Obama's Political Appointees are spending $2 Billion a Week on Nation Building of Afghanistan, a United Nations Mission. This money is NOT accessable by the US Military nor the Afghans.

Like I mentioned before the money is being spent by President Obama's Political Appointees and nothing is being built nor done as to why President Karzai demanded that General McChrystal Investigate President Obama's Political Appointees. President Karzai was concerned because President Obama's Political Appointees told him that electricity would be restored to Kabul, so he mentioned this to the Afghan People during his Election, and after this was NOT done, President Karzai started to lose the support of the Afghan People.

President Obama's Political Appointees after finding out they were being investigated started to scream to the News Media "Karzai Corrupt" to deflect the blame; then they started to do things to get General McChrystal Relieved of Command to stop his Investigations. After President Obama made a Deal with General McChrystal to get his Letter of Resignation, General Petraeus continued General McChrystal's Investigations, General Petraeus gave President Karzai the Investigation Report without informing President Obama and SOS Clinton (as he like General McChrystal also believed that they were involved).

The Results: President Karzai demands that President Obama's Political Appointees account for every dime spent by them or get out of his Country. President Obama's Political Appointee Holbrooke "Strains his Heart" and dies on the operating table at Pakistan. President Obama's Political Appointee Eikenberry tenders his Letter of Resignation to President Obama. General McChrystal as one of the few US Military Generals trained and experienced in Asymmetric Warfare gone (US Army Special Forces, previously Commander JSOC, Commander JSOC TF Iraq (Locating Capture of President Hussein as to why he provided input into Operation Neptune (Locating, Capture, or last resort termination of Osama Bin Laden) as tasked by Admiral McRaven (USN SEAL, Commander JSOC). General Petraeus gets a Deal from President Obama to become the Director of the President's Executive Intelligence Agency, the CIA, for President Obama to get his Letter of Resignation (for not informing President Obama and SOS Clinton about the Investigations of their Political Appointees).

I really don't see any of you b!tching about the $1 Billion per year spent to operate the US Embassy at Iraq, and the $1 Billion per year spent to operate the US Embassy at Pakistan. Or the $1 Billion spent to build each of these US Department of State Disneyland Resorts and Spas. Or the 16,000 minus the 1,500 US Embassy Personnel that are conducting Combat Patrols "outside the wire" to keep the snipers, mortars, rockets out of range of the 104 acres of the US Embassy Compound at Iraq (the so called, "All Combat Troops withdrawn from Iraq" - President Obama).

midnight-3200349 - Which "war", ladies and gentlemen? This is an occupation, an invasion. Look up in a dictionary what the definition of war is.

False, your obsolete definition of war is what was true for WWII Conventional Warfare, 1907 Hague Convention, and 1949 Geneva Convention, it is from these and previous Conventions of Civilians to make War Civilized where the term Conventional Warfare comes from. Examples: Of Conventional Warfare of the 1907 Hague Convention, Military running out of WWI trenches into machinegun fires as "Honorable and Obeying the 1907 Hague Convention Rules". Korean War and Vietnam War, running up hills against machinegun fires to seize and hold ground as to obey the 1949 Geneva Convention Rules.

Go look up the definition of Asymmetric War.

midnight-3200349 - Besides, don't ask the whole world for help to reconstruct Afghanistan. If you destroy that nation while "serving", you have to reconstruct it yourselves.

Since you were NOT here (Afghanistan) after the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban took over; then massacred the US Ally 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen, massacred any or suspected Collaborators to the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers; then they destroyed anything that was "Non Islamic", "Modern", "Western", etc., that is WHY Afghanistan was turned from a 20th Century "Little America" as built up by the US from 1950s to 1979 into the Stone Ages the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban destroyed everything and massacred anyone that was not Fundamentalist Islamic.

midnight-3200349 - Ask for some help to the thousands of defense contractors who became billionaries in the whole business.

LOL. Typical US Public that lack cognitive reasoning skills. US Defense Contractors hire US Civilians, it is these US Civilians that ultimately are overpaid and expensive getting a "Fair and Living Wage". With President Obama's current Reduction In Forces of the US Military, there will be xxx,xxx US Civilians that previously provided support to the RIF'ed US Military Personnel thrown on Unemployment PLUS the almost one Million US Civilians thrown on Unemployment as stated by President Obama and Secretary of Defense Leon Penetta as to what will happen if there is a 10% Cut to the US Military Defense Budget.

Like I stated before the real solution is what Candidate Obama stated during the 2008-2009 Presidential Debates to Solve the repeated deployments of the 1% of US Citizens currently serving in the US Military. Candidate Obama Solution was the Selective Service and or Mandatory Compulsory US Military Service to FORCE the 92% of US Citizens that Refuse to "Do their Fair Share" and Serve in the US Military (paid below minimum wages).

By doing this the expensive US Defense Contractors providing Support to the US Military can be replaced by below minimum wage US Military Personnel, this is how the US Military was before the US Defense Contractors (US Civilians).

Karzai is a lying crook. The real shame is that he is the best the US could find. Neither he nor any of the scumbag opium growers are deserving of any other country's blood and treasure. They are disgusting, vile, paganists. If there is anything more I can write about this piece of manure of a country that I can say, feel free to add to my comment.

NATO did promote peace, helping the west win over Soviet Union in the Cold War, but NATO has also provoked unnecessary wars - so the record is mixed.

Wars have played important roles in economic recovery - WWI and WWII for the United States to emerge as the most powerful nation, but unfortunately the US has been hooked up on this habit of war-mongering and war economy ever since - now it is a bad habit that is hard to drop.

Help all of the people of Afghanistan and Pakistan, Iraq and Iran and turn that entire part of ther world to Glass ! The sad part about what I am saying is the fact that I am not prejudice, I know there is good and bad in everyone even myself, I can be a pure scum bag, I have no problem with anyone's religion or race or lack thereof, But why should all of our innocent men and women be sent over there to fight for something that can be easily dealt with, of course innocent men and women will get caught up in the aftermath but they will all go to where they want to go anyway, just faster , the others do it to themselves anyway the only difference is , they try to take Americans along for the ride. all of those billions of American dollars can be put to better use within our own country , I am so sick and tired of seeing our men and women being killed or being sent to prison for mental issues suffered from fighting a war that has lasted for far too long for absolutely nothing , what the hell is our goal over there ? to bring peace to that part of the world ? MY ASS!! that will never , ever , ever happen, it is far too corrupt to ever turn around . . . you know it , I know it and everyone else knows it, what does Afghanistan offer the rest of the world,even a peaceful Afghanistan? More opium? I think we could all live without that, what does Iraq and Iran offer the rest of the world except threats of more violence and threats of Killing Americans the second they get a chance? Someone dig up Ronald Reagan !

**A note about the author**

He's lost faith in the Justice system, the government, Any President after John F Kennedy except for Reagan and he is sick and tired of the world standing idly by as we lose our innocent men and women for no reason at all because in the end nothing will change ! at a minimum just get the hell out of there and close our God forsaken borders to everyone , we don't need to travel out of our own country anyway ! that is his story and he's stickin to it !

Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah....you guys sure are long winded on this site....do you fee better now?

No no no, pull out now, take equipment home with us, no more money. They're in talks with the Taliban. Let them get funds from their allies because they sure aren't ours.

Hello COYOTEHUNTER, welcome aboard. On this site we try to learn and when we can, help inform. If your willing to be part of the solution welcome aboard, if not, have a nice day anyway! Freedom of speech is our constitutional right, I might not agree with everyone, but I will fight to the death for their right to say it.

Patriot Chic

I have a friend who is stationed where Obama made his "suprise visit"... am I supposed to believe that Obama gives two sh*ts about our men and women over there?

Hello patriot chick,

The only thing of substance Obama did with his "Surprise Visit" was to make the ignorant announcement that we have now committed to continuing in that s#!t hole afghanistan for an additional 10 YEARS AFTER THE 2014 "PULL OUT DATE" !

That traitor Obama promised in 2007 that ending the war was his first order of business if elected.

.

"Midnight" #1.22, is correct in calling this an occupation/invasion instead of a "war". And our president just committed us to 10 MORE YEARS OF THIS IGORNORANT, USELESS OCCUPATION.

Remember history and know the people. Afghanistan has never been conquered and it is 100% corrupt. As bad or worse than Mexico. It will not change.

Karzai is the head of the mob while the mob leaders let him.

Get all the U.S. troops out of Afghanistan now, all the equipment and let them to their own resources.

Anything else is just going to mean more coffins and a waste of money.

if you want peace, prepare for war - ancient Roman wisdom

Yeah, and that worked out great for them when they overextended their military and their Empire collapsed.

Here's a clue: preparation is not waging war...it's having redundancy in DEFENSE (as opposed to offense and occupation overseas).

"War is Peace, Slavery is Freedom, Ignorance is Strength, Interventions are Humanitarian, and Pepper Spray is a Vegetable...Orwell 2012!"

This is how you sound. Like a George Orwell novel. Only in Orwellian times would you quote a failed Empire on defensive strategy when that was one of three major reasons that Empire collapsed! Only in Orwellian times would every law have the opposite name of what it really is (examples: PATRIOT Act was the most unpatriotic law ever; Affordable Care Act is making everything cost more for most people, if not outright limiting access via companies refusing to provide insurance anymore; and National Defense Authorization Act which funds offense and occupation, not defense, and attempts to detain Americans indefinately without trial if the President says so - the latter looks to be losing in court as we speak, thank God.) Only in Orwellian times would the Ryan Plan (which cuts nothing and increases spending year-to-year, albeit slower than other plans) be called "Draconian CUTS". It cuts not one thing! Only in Orwellian times would ending a war or two, and reducing spending therefore, be called CUTS to the military (as if that spending was understood to be perpetual)...even as their budget next year is larger than this year (again, it's albeit slower increases than the original plans)!!!

We're a bunch of sheep...well most of us.

Danny shaw, you must have missed obama and companies intent to use drones domestically. Perhaps not armed for death and destruction but the door has been opened. Big brother WILL be watching!

tantosh: Despite the counter productive Iraqi wars and Afghanistan, many are jumping on Syria and Iran.

Iraqi wars and high oil price manipulations gave the current situtation in the US, PIIGS.

Will anyone with a little sense impose sanctions on Iranian oil and manipulate oil prices higher?

Shaking hands with his cartel buddy how quaint..

Afghanistan and Pakistan are beautiful countries, they would be even more beautiful without the ignorant and barbaric people that inhabit them........ Bring our people back to the civilized world NOW.

BigAl, not all the people in Afghanistan and Pakistan are bad. The problem is in Afghanistan you have a tribal mentality that has been in place for over a thousand years, if not longer. You can't expect democracy to work in places like that. Most people there don't care about politics--they just want to feed their families. But, you have you fanatics that make life difficult for those regular Afghan people and for the U.S. and other Western soldiers. I agree with you that we should bring all our troops home from that part of the world. Possibly if we did that there would be less young men flocking to join the fanatics in Al Qaeda and the Taliban to fight the infidels (as they put it) and things would settle down.

Obama and Karzai don't need a meeting to know what Afghanistan will look like a year after we leave. I'll be happy to tell them: It will look exactly as it does today, except without Obama or Karzai in it.

Obama made the Taliban legitimate by recognizing them, now they are an accepted entity, now we have to bargain with them, they found their way to Americas pocket! we have been sucked into their game and they make the rules, we should just walk away and let them play all by themselves. that country is just using us and loving every dollar of it while our nation is falling apart.

Obama spends way to much time visiting their opium fields... what I want to know is when do we surrender to the Taliban?

That is just crazy talk!

Does it take 11 years to "chart path out"?

In the first place, where was the need for path in?

Probably it will take another 22 years to understand that Saudis and Pakis are the worst backstabbing allies!

Sorry but personally I have no sympathy for most of your viewpoints.We don't know anything now that we couldn't have seen coming long ago.We saw what happened in Vietnam.We saw what happened to the Russians in Afghanistan.This is the country called the "Graveyard of Empires".It got that name for a reason and if any of you had cracked a history book you'd know what that reason was.You complain up a storm now but how many of you dissented BEFORE we went to Afghanistan?What I saw was a handfull of protestors being mocked and marginalized and accused of treason by the majority.What really gets me is that,even as we scream about leaving Afghanistan people are already agitating for war with Iran.Are you people insane?

Pigotry - To NATO: You start the job, you better finish it on a high note. You own it now.

FYI, NATO is the US, based on Funding, US Military Installations, US Military Personnel, US Military Equipment; that is why the Ultimate Commander of NATO is SACEUR (Supreme Allied Commander Europe) a US Military General or Admiral.

standingwave - We saw what happened in Vietnam.We saw what happened to the Russians in Afghanistan.

Yes, those that participated saw exactly what happened, the US Politicians stuck their no US Military experienced noses into everything and f**ked up Wins into a Losses. As a participant of Senator "Charlie Wilson's" War against the USSR 40th Army Occupation as Operation Cyclone, and later on weeks after the 9/11 2001 Attacks, I experienced what the US Politicians did. Just like previously being a LRRP/Ranger at Vietnam, the US Politicians turned Wins into Losses.

standingwave - What really gets me is that,even as we scream about leaving Afghanistan people are already agitating for war with Iran.Are you people insane?

No, we are not insane, you just lack cognitive reasoning skills. So people know how the Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran are the ones supporting most of the Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists Worldwide, unlike President Obama and his March 2009 Policy.

To NATO: You start the job, you better finish it on a high note. You own it now.

How many people need to die (men, women, and children) for you to save face?

Pigotry, Do you have any idea who puts in the most $ and troops to NATO? The USA thats who. Nato is a huge money pit that makes the leaches of society rich. Hell they don't care how long we stay in the middle east it's not their kids in harms way. The whole thing makes me sick.

Afghanistan is a future failed state. When NATO pulls out it will carve itself into tribal regions but overall it will become a failed state, like Somalia.

Afghanistan used to be a well-governed monarchy back in the 50s and 60s - Kabul, the country's cosmopolitan capital, was called the "Paris of Central Asia." In this untold story: there were stability, tourists, and...miniskirts then.

I don't know what hit them?

"Future" failed state?? That @!$%#e hole has been a failure for the last 2 generations. The only reason for the civilized world to not nuke it out of existence is spinal ineptitude.

So exactly how does two military occupations and a civil war make a country civilized?This country hasn't had one second of peace for the last 30 years.Doesn't exactly encourage a bumper crop of liberal arts majors,does it?

Pigotry - Afghanistan used to be a well-governed monarchy back in the 50s and 60s - Kabul, the country's cosmopolitan capital, was called the "Paris of Central Asia." In this untold story: there were stability, tourists, and...miniskirts then.

I don't know what hit them?

The Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban is what hit them as Fully Supported by the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran during the 1990s after the US Abandoned US Ally 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen.

Just like the Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists of Al Sheebah destroyed all the United Nations Mission Somalia I and United Nations Mission Somalia II modernization (irrigation, modern farming, etc.) to end the Cycles of Drought and Famine at Somalia;

as Fundamentalist Islam does NOT tolerate "Modernization", "Western", "No Islamic", and also uses Starvation as a Weapon (Somalia, also like the Fundamentalist Islamic Arabic Omani Muslims at the Sudan).

actually communism took over first in the 1970s, then Soviet invasion (79-89).

But my point about Afghan history of prosperity in the 50s and 60s is that Afghanistan has a chance to revive its past glories - its prospect won't be that bleak - as many of you have described as a failed state with tribalism. Actually a post-Taliban Afghan ambassador to the US once said Afghanistan is not as tribalist as the US - he argued that he has seen a lot of tribalism in the US - you know all the problems with race, wealth gap, etc. For example, those who beat up Rodney King had been exonerated by an 'all white jury' before being found guilty by a second jury. So tribalism, according to Afghan ambassador, should not be such a problem just his country.

Pigotry,

Having been here (Afghanistan) multiple times living with the locals on years of consecutive tours since the 1980s (Operation Cyclone), people in the US are brainwashed into believing that "Tribalism" bullsh!t.

At the US "Popular Opinion" (emotive non factual emotive opinions of non participants) not Facts (from Firsthand Experience) are important.

As far as "Communism" taking over at Afghanistan during the 1970s, that is true and false as during the 1970s as for the Afghans the US Democracy and USSR Communism was just like the US Demoncraps and US Repugnants as Political Parties. With the US and USSR still building up Afghanistan trying to get the Afghans to Ally themselves to either the US or USSR. After years of this "Peaceful" Competition of building up the 20th Century Nation of Afghanistan, the Pro USSR Afghans and the USSR final decided that Armed Occupation was the only means to stop spending all the money, as the Pro US Afghans started to gain Political Power, so the Pro USSR Afghans demanded the USSR get involved Militarily, then in 1979 the USSR 40th Army came into Afghanistan. What the Pro USSR Afghans did NOT know was that the USSR 40th Army was going to conduct Total Conventional Warfare (Carpet Bombing, Chemical Weapons, etc.) as regardless of if you were a Pro USSR Afghan or Pro US Afghan you got massacred by the USSR. This is why most of the Pro USSR Afghans fled into the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran; and the Pro US Afghans fled into the mountains of Northeastern Afghanistan and the Afghan Refugee Camps at Pakistan. The Pro US Afghans were those we trained during Operation Cyclone to defeat the USSR 40th Army Occupation. After the USSR 40th Army Occupation was defeated (US Military Asymmetric Warfare versus USSR Conventional Warfare), the US Abandoned the US Ally 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen, and refused to help them establish a government or anything else. The Pro USSR Afghans returned from years of living at the Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran and became Fundamentalist Islamic also; after they returned from the Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran they became the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban and started the massacres of the US Ally Pro US Afghan Muhajeen (including their families, relatives, in laws, friends, etc.), any suspected collaborators to the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers; destroyed anything that was "Modern", "Western", "Non Islamic" then the lights literally went out at Afghanistan after the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban destroyed the Electric Power Plants. After all of this the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban started going after the "Unbelievers" (Political undesirables, homosexuals, Taoists, Buddhists, etc.). Grabbing Buddhist monks and pouring gas on them, saying you going to do it anyway, then lighting them up; then dynamiting the Great Buddhas.

Basically, after we defeated the USSR during Operation Cyclone. The USSR still got Afghanistan thru their Ally the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran, since the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran was providing Full Support to the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban.

Many do not know that many of these Pro USSR Afghans as a Duty of a Guest to the Host of Islamic Sanctuary also fought in the Iran Iraq Wars, so that when they returned to Afghanistan they were already Combat Hardened, Experienced and Proven as the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban. The only reason why I know this obscure Fact is from Firsthand experience, as prior to being rotated to Afghanistan to Operation Cyclone we were the US Military Training Teams to US Ally Iraq during the Iran Iraq Wars.

Many of the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces, and US Public during those times kept saying "Peacetime US Military" (just like now most do not know all the Facts, since they were/are not participants). We had US Military Personnel Management Officers telling us that we could not wear our earned Combat Qualification Badges, Combat Service Stripes, etc. (Points for promotions, impressive for a young US Military Officer to have been in Actual Combat during a "Peacetime" US Military).

Afghanistan used to be a well-governed monarchy back in the 50s and 60s

What a bunch of nonsense. They have never had any stable centralized government. That country doesn't even exist! England made that place up, drew some lines on maps, and called it a country during their Empire. The propaganda that they EVER had a stable centralized government is a joke. Sure, you can support them with money and arms for 10-20 years...but then it collapses again. Tyranny by proxy is not a stable central government. Admit it, they don't need a central govt, don't want one, and will eventually topple this one too. They want tribal society...and it's their society, so let them!

Basically, after we defeated the USSR during Operation Cyclone. The USSR still got Afghanistan thru their Ally the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran, since the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran was providing Full Support to the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban.

The ISI created the Taliban in Pakistan, not Iran. They are a native Pakistani group who has been in Afghanistan so many generations now, they are considered domestic (although they have clearly foreign origins). Where did the ISI get the money to create the Taliban?

The CIA.

Before Islam came to Afghan and Paki regions, those areas had rich civilizations.

Sunni Saudi promoted radicalism have taken over most of the Muslim nations.

As extremism, especially Islamic one, has no limits, terrorism also came along with it.

Examine Egypt, Turkey and other nations.

As long as Saudi Arabia and Pakistan on are on world map, there will be no ends to Islamic extremism. Incidently these two nations are kept alive on map by the US.

Saddam would have been a better ruler and taken out most of the fountainheads of Sunni Islamic extremism out of the maps!

Oil prices would not have jumped so high!

Just look at how the "bad guys" dances that have started on Iran and Syria.

Not many can match the Saudis, oil companies, Jewish extremist, bankers and other manipulators in deciding our future. They have well entrenched lobbyists.

Pigotry - Afghanistan has had a reputation as the 'graveyard of empires' - From Alexander the Great, to the Romans, to the British (late 19th to 20th century), to the Russians (1979-89).

Just hope that this time it is different.

Not going to be different as most people still believe in Conventional Warfare, especially the Politicians. Historically, Asymmetric Warfare DEFEATS Conventional Warfare. As to what the North Vietnamese and Viet Cong as Asymmetric Warfare, Insurgency, did to the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces at Vietnam. And what we did to the Russians (1979-1989) USSR 40th Army Conventional Warfare Forces as Operation Cyclone (US Military Asymmetric Warfare, Insurgency). And what we did to the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government weeks after the 9/11 2001 Attacks, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arxKhJIjIiY

(we had already won Afghanistan after significant losses of friends and buddies known for decades, then the US Politicians got involved by slapping US Civilian Law Enforcement Rules, US No Assassination Policy, Conventional Warfare Rules, Rules of Engagement, etc. on us. And then sent in the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces to get killed unnecessarily during an Asymmetric War).

3% of the US Military are US Military Asymmetric Warfare (aka Special Warfare), 97% of the US Military are Conventional Warfare Forces. It is the US Politicians that demand this, as the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces rely heavily on US Military Equipment manufacturered by US Civilians at US States as US Civilian Jobs, US Manufacturering, and Local City State Taxes (Government Income), these US Military Conventional Warfare Forces are Trained just enough to get the job done and once the job is done then thrown on Unemployment like trash; as the 3% US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces rely more on Experience, extensive Training, and Long Term Retentions of US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces Personnel.

Please take your head out of whereever it is. We did "have it done in 2002" but ended our effectiveness when we got soonkered into Iraq. At the present time, both Afghan and the USA would be much better off if we withdrew in 2012.

Bob...Couldn't agree more. I have no idea why we are constantly being barraged by politicos reaffirming our committment to Afghanistan--What committment? They ended any alliance when their soldiers started killing our soldiers and they have aligned themselves with the Taliban to share the loot from the NATO trucks they attack. This is ludicrous! Why is it that they are so committed to this failed "training" system? I honestly do not understand what we are going to benefit from any alliance with Afghanistan....It is time to leave and our leaders just will not hear us...or is it a case of being ignored?

This is why there is a "need to know" rule.

Ask Obama, he knows now.

He knows why he could not close Guantanamo detention, he also knows why we must stay in Afghanistan.

Some of you people REALLY think that a person (president) who can only last at most 8 years in office runs the country?

Wake up.

Bob Ramos-2498381 - We did "have it done in 2002" but ended our effectiveness when we got soonkered into Iraq.

Yes, WE (NOT YOU) "have it done in 2002". Then we chased the Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists, etc. along the Old Silk Road into Northern Iraq. We were killing them while they were fleeing with extreme prejudice.

Then the US Politicians demanded we stop, so that we do not violate other Nations Soverignty (Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran, Iraq, Tajikistan, etc.). So we stopped. To over come this President Bush demanded the US Law, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution so that we could go into Northern Iraq and finish the job (Kill off the Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists that escaped us at Afghanistan).

The US Military starts to protest the US No Assassination Policy since we could not Terminate Osama Bin Laden, in 2006 President Bush by Executive Order to circumvent the objections of US Congress Amends the US No Assassination Policy.

President Bush with minimal US Military Experience leaves all US Military matters to the US Military and US Intelligence Agencies Experts (along with Ultimate Blame, Responsibility, Accountability for any Failures). The US Military and US Intelligence Agencies come up with a Plan, Operation Hotel California.

Immediately after the ink dried on US Law, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution, we (survivors) attached to the CIA's SAD/SOG are redeployed from Afghanistan to Northern Iraq augmented by the US Army 10th Special Forces Group. During intensive battles with the Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists that reorganized got stronger rearmed etc. as Ansar Al Islam, as Fully Supported by Russian Federation Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Republic of Iran; we lost significant numbers of mission critical personnel. Then the US Politicians got involved again telling us that we could not and would not pursue the escaping Ansar Al Islam into Turkey, Syria, Iran, etc. as this would violate those Nations Sovereignty.

So we start the other Missions of Operation Hotel California: Seize the Iraqis Chemical Weapons Facility at Sargat. Create a Strategic Feint so that the Iraqis Military believe that the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces will come thru US Ally Turkey, so that the Iraqis Military Command deploys their Main Iraqis Military Forces North of Baghdad. Seize and Secure the Northern Iraqis Oil Fields with the Kurdistanis that we trained. Destroy the Iraqis Military and Iraqis Political C4I, so that the Iraqis could not coordinate a defense against the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces from Kuwait and Saudi Arabia to accomplish US Law H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" using US Military Force authorized by US Law 2002 Iraqi War Resolution.

So once again the US Public cannot seem to use cognitive reasoning skills to see how Afghanistan and Iraq were NOT separate but interrelated. Of course it is also true that this was not explained to the US Public nor the US Miltiary Conventional Warfare Forces.

You using a cell phone?

denko- your language level of expertise is annoying.

Here genius, let me spell out an exit strategy:

Just march home.

Some of you drones make excuses for anything this government of tyranny and murder does. DemoCrips = RepubliBloods = mentally ill.

And for ten years our soldiers will be picked off by IEDs, Afghan soldiers, and the Taliban. They will be leaving sacrificial lambs, not soldiers. Soldiers are allowed to fight and defend themselves. How sad is that for our young brave people? There is no reasonable rationale to support one more of our soldiers dying in that rock pit of violence.

They certainly have invited us to leave often enough...It's just that they want more than $4B per year to pay off the Taliban and pay for the troops that are committed to killing their "trainers." And we benefit how, by our continued "committment to Afghanistan?"

Yeah, and we would be in a tug-of war with China over Afghanistan, too. Then you know the Taliban would be trying to get control which would only serve to escalate the war.

They estimate the value of the deposits of veins of iron, copper, cobalt, gold, and yes, the lithium, to be around a trillion dollars.

This will never be won, Afghanistan is a big hopeless rat hole full of ignorant barbarians and all of our troops have died in vain for the enrichment of the MIC.

Crispy, I ask you what job is there to finish? we won't turn these barbarians into Americans, we won't even bring them into the 21 century. As soon as we leave, life there will go back to the Taliban days, their goats will have more rights than woman. The only way to finish the job would be to kill all males older then 5 as suggested before so they could start over with new ideas of equality. we all know, that won't happen, so we should leave, sooner then later..The only thing we have accomplished there is that they are way richer barbarians now, because while they love their stone age lives, they also like American Dollars.

Crisby B - Finish what we started? I thought we did that when we killed Bin Laden. We need to get out NOW! That frigging backwater country is not worth one, not a single one, American life. We have problems here at home the military could assist with, like protecting OUR borders, not some other countries. You're just a war monger. And yes, I served in the military. After 22 year in the Marine Corps and two tours in Vietnam, I think I can provide my opinion of this no-win situation we're in.

Right, after 10 years of war just walk away. Forget what our people fought and died for. Cut and run. You are a total fool!

freedomfrys...they fought and died for nothing. The first 2 months was about defending us from terrorism, the next 10 years was about drug money, puppet states being set up, and politicians saving face. It's already by far the longest war in U.S. history.

How many women and children (not to mention our troops) have to die so the CIA can sell drugs, set up a puppet state, and you and the tyrants in office can save face?

Your nationalism is not patriotism. Nationalism and statism are mental illnesses.