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Subscribe to RSSShahzad Akbar, an anti-drone lawyer in Islamabad, talks about his view of America and its policies.
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan – When attorney Shahzad Akbar began filing lawsuits against the Pakistan government on behalf of drone strike victims in 2010, some of his close friends started calling him "Taliban lawyer."
"But now, two years later, they don't do that anymore," he said.
In many ways the effects of the nearly nine-year U.S. program of targeted drone missile strikes in Pakistan were largely hidden from the rest of the world for many years. The strikes have been conducted in Pakistan's rugged and remote tribal region bordering Afghanistan – an area nearly impossible for outsiders to visit and from which it is incredibly difficult to extract reliable and timely information.
But Akbar's work through his Foundation for Fundamental Rights has raised awareness of the strikes among the general Pakistani population – at the same time anti-American sentiment from a failing alliance with the U.S. is on the rise. He said his mission is to seek justice on behalf of innocent civilians killed in the drone attacks.
"The situation on the ground is not what the U.S. government says, that they're only targeting militants," said Akbar. "The situation on the ground is that a huge number of civilians are being killed."
Part of the problem, according to Akbar, is that until recently, most Pakistanis didn't know or didn't care about the drone strikes. But public political anger, denouncing the strikes as a violation of Pakistan's sovereignty, has helped draw attention to the issue over the last few years.
Today, drones have become a political touchstone, regularly decried as part of politician's campaign speeches, prominently featured in fiery protest rallies, and sitting squarely at the center of a diplomatic war of words between the U.S. and Pakistan.
Collateral damage
Akbar's legal challenges come as a recent poll shows considerable opposition in countries around the world to the U.S. drone campaign. The Pew Research Center study found that more than half of those polled in 17 of 20 countries disapprove of the use of drone strikes to target extremists. However, Americans see things very differently and largely support their use, with only 38 percent disapproving.
Though public perception may help him to gain traction, Akbar said his cases are based on the evidence he's gathering from strike locations in coordination with communities in North Waziristan, the tribal agency in which the overwhelming majority of strikes have occurred. That cache of evidence includes everything from family testimonies and images of the identifiable bodies and body parts recovered from the attack sites, to actual fragments of the Hellfire missiles fired from the remotely-piloted drones.
"I believe in very simple principles that were taught to us by the West," said Akbar. "That everyone is presumed innocent unless proven guilty. So anyone who is killed in drone strikes, unless and until his guilt is established in some independent forum – that person is innocent."
Noor Behram, a journalist in North Waziristan, Pakistan, describes his views of the United States.
According to the London-based Bureau of Investigative Journalism, a not-for-profit organization basing its study on reports from government officials, media reports, and academic sources, anywhere between 2,486 and 3,188 people have been killed in 332 U.S. drones strikes inside Pakistan since 2004. The fact that the report is based on wide-ranging and conflicting reports, speaks to the difficulty of establishing hard facts in this part of the world. Similarly, the same report also estimated that the number of civilians killed in those strikes ranges from 482 to 832.
According to another study done by the New America Foundation, a non-profit public policy institute in Washington, D.C., a total of 43 men identified as "militant leaders" were killed in those strikes.
A major point of controversy is who counts as a “civilian” versus a “combatant.” The Obama administration defines all military-age males in a strike zone as “combatants,” unless there is explicit posthumous evidence proving them innocent, according to a report in the New York Times.
Pakistanis who live in those strike zones dispute that definition, and claim innocent women and children are being killed as well. But the administration’s broad definition does help explain how they could reach a very low, civilian casualty count as a result of drone attacks.
U.S. officials, who – for the first time – publicly admitted using drones in April of this year, have said the strikes are "targeted...against specific al-Qaida terrorists" and are carried out "in full accordance with the law, and in order to prevent terrorist attacks on the United States and save American lives."
But Akbar argues that the identities of many killed are unknown, that nearby children are often killed by flying shrapnel, and that any "collateral damage" deaths are simply impossible to justify – even when a "high-value" terrorist is killed as a result.
"The problem is that no one cares if ‘nobody’ is killed, and by ‘nobody,’ I mean a person who is nobody. A person who is probably just living in that area, has no money, no education, no representation," said Akbar. "The point here is that if we are successful in killing one or two people who we really want to kill, and in order to do that we kill 40 people – who cares? And this is a sad kind of attitude we have from the American government and unfortunately from my own government."
‘Can’t help but be angry…’
In order to represent the families of civilian drone strikes victims in court, Akbar first had to win their trust, which has been an uphill battle in communities that see themselves are separate and distinct from the rest of country. Many in the targeted areas are under-represented and under-funded on the national level, and feel more kinship to their fellow ethnic tribesmen across the border in Afghanistan than with the Pakistani population east of their northwest territory.
"When we started working in Waziristan in 2010, that was the seventh year of the drone strikes," said Akbar. "People had no trust in their own countrymen. They said, ‘You have not looked after us, you haven't really cared what was happening here, so why would we now talk to you and give you evidence of what's really happening here?’"
NBC News speaks with citizens from around the globe, asking the question, 'What Does America Mean to You?'
So Akbar partnered with Noor Behram, a soft-spoken journalist and father of six, born and raised in North Waziristan, who had witnessed and documented multiple drone strikes in his own area, and was wondering why no one in the rest of the world seemed to care.
"When you live in an area where there is war, where there is suffering, where there are drone attacks, where there's not proper reporting about what's going on…. Even if you're a professional, you can't help but become angry at what you see,” said Behram. “You start to wonder how you can take the voices you hear and carry them to the rest of the world."
Behram established a notification system based on walkie-talkies and a trusted network of sources across the region where curfews and rough terrain can make it difficult to travel quickly from one area to another. When the attacks occur nearby, as many do to his home in Miramshah, he says he is often the first one with a camera at the site. Entire buildings are reduced to rubble heaps. Residual fires burn in nearby homes or businesses. Crowds gather to dig through the wreckage for survivors and gather body parts.
The frequency with which the strikes are carried out, Behram said, has his community on edge.
"People are very worried, very tense all the time," he said. "When the missile is fired from the plane, there is a loud explosion. When it hits the ground, it makes a terrifying noise. The people below, they just start running. Pieces of missile, they fly everywhere, very far, into other people's houses."
Despite experiencing strikes so close to his home that he and his family have been forced to flee in the middle of the night, Behram said he harbors no anger towards the American people – it's their policies, he says, that should be reviewed.
"I think, even if they said, 'we've killed 100 terrorists,' and just one child was also killed…If you, at that time, you see that child's body, you talk to his mother and father – I think, for me, this is a very serious thing,” he said. “That one child, sitting in his house, could be killed like this.”
Behram patiently documents what he sees, sometimes spending hours with reluctant family members to convince them to share their testimony for the lawsuits being filed.
"I tell them there are people who want to help you. If you want help, then I can talk to them for you," Behram said. "Because if you don't talk to them or let them help you, I don't know what will happen next."
‘I want to give them their rights’
Working together, Akbar and Behram have gathered evidence for 13 petitions filed in Islamabad and Peshawar courts, most of which are filed against the government of Pakistan. In total, the lawsuits represent 71 families who have lost 100 family members in U.S. drone strikes in Pakistan.
Despite the fact that he can only legally file suit within Pakistan, Akbar said three of the cases do involve criminal litigation against current and former U.S. officials, including an alleged former CIA station chief and a former CIA legal counsel. But taking on a U.S. administration loathe to even acknowledge the classified program, much less engage legally on the matter, means that those lawsuits are largely intended to send a message at this stage – that he, and the people he represents, hold both Pakistani and U.S. officials responsible for the deaths of their family members.
"I want justice for these people so they feel that they're part of the system," said Behram. "Because on the one side we ask them to behave and fall in line….and on the other side, we don't give them any rights. I want to give them their rights."
This story is part of a series by msnbc.com and NBC News "What the World Thinks of US". The series aims to check the pulse on current perceptions of America's global stature during the election year and ahead of our annual Independence Day. Share your thoughts about this story and our series on Twitter using #AmericaMeans
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Leave a Comment:
Stop hiding the cowardly islamic terrorist!!! If they continue to kill women and children then we should make them out nucular test area!! the world would be so much better off by killing all of those who seek to enslave the world!!
But for now we only have drones!!
Did it ever occure to you muslum cowards that after 1000 years of killing off anybody who was not part of your tribe that Islam might not be the way?
Indigo-Rage, great letter, wish it would be mailed out to every middle east and Asian and African country there is.
you wont see this headline on abc,cbs,or nbc (driver reaching for coffee cup causes a 10 car pile up on str102))))) now they are trying to blame the fires on a burnning cig.how many drunk drivers murders has there been gov. will sell you theor it will be the reason for sorrow
booze and put you in jail for drinking it
Those who knowingly harbor murders shall become victims themselves. If you do not wish to be visited by the souless killer in the sky, stay well away from those who commit evil while to hiding amongst innocents. You give them shelter, the devil in the sky will also take your life.
IF the tribal leaders want to end the drone strikes STOP harboring terrorists. The people who hide and shelter this scum are just as guilty as the scum. If your letting someone stay in your house whose a murdere
The Obama administration defines all military-age males in a strike zone as “combatants,” unless there is explicit posthumous evidence proving them innocent
Isn't this the same way that was once used to determine if someone was a witch? If they dies they were found innocent.
For most Americans Pakistan means and stands for a country that-
harbors terrorists
gives money to terrorist groups
allows terrorists to stay in their country un persecuted
lies consistently to the USA
takes money from the USA and uses it to help fund terrorists and their organizations
does not deserve any money the USA gives to it
The irony is, Pakistan is a sovereign nation.
Yet, when Obama invades Pakistan, the liberals are quite OK with it, they even pat themselves on the back.
Of course, had Bush done the same thing, the liberal media and their willing toadies would be in a frenzy.
Just a part of the double-standard that is liberalism.
Liberals want you to be subject to screening to ride a plane, apply for credit or check into a hotel.
But, they don't want you to be verified that you can legally vote.
Ever wonder why? The answer is simple:
Liberals cannot win elections without cheating!
Pakistan isn't "for" america; they just want our money. And they want to have their country's sovernty. They harbor our enemy and supply materials that kill Americans and Aftganistan people. They kept Osama close to protect him. They in-prison Americas supporters, charging them with High-treason. They support our enemies.
Drones, and the deaths of thier citizens, need to happen to protect the Afgans and our soldiers.
Well there you go. They have something to complain about. How do you like us now?
First of all look who is complaining. Talk about politics. The manipulaters of truth and hatred. The civilizans probably don't have to much of a clue about what's going on and why we are doing what we are doing. The tribal leaders and terrorist organizations have them all snowed and they live in fear unless they allow these bad people have their way. The government is in on it and part of it probably because they to are fearful and corrupt. The only way the government figures keep their positions there is cave in and let the religious and radials have their wa with them. The whole Pakistan thing is so screwed up. They are lucky it's only The United States who is the dominic force there right now because if it were some other country who knows what they would do in order to accomplish the mission of ridding the world of terrorist.
I'll say one thing about this. This is the good news they complain about the drone attacks. It seems this tactic has gotten to the nerve of the terrorist. These terrorist are pretty clever and ruthless and they try to sway the people in Pakistan and make them believe because civilian deaths do occur because of us that we are the bad people. We are not worse than the terrorist.
The Pakistani government should get it's head out of it's ass and tell the civilians there that the is a war going on. There are terrorist living amonst them. Terrorist who have and continue to cause death and harm to other innocent civilians in other countries. The government should tell it's people that they too are persueing the terrorist and that anyone who is close to the terrorist when found by the military forces who are fighting them are at immediate risk and may get killed as the militarys persue them and try to capture or kill them. The government should ask it's civilians for help and information about who the known terrorist are and better try to pertect the ones who come forward with help and information. The Pakistani's have much to fear and worry about right now. The United States isn't going away.
To look at it from an objective standpoint, I'm not surprised at all that the Pakistani people are upset with robots flying into their country and dropping explosives. And Obama's definition of "combatant" is stupidly lenient, as if adult men were inherently expendable. I would definitely favor a more honest accounting of the civilian casualties from this administration, as Obama promised us transparency and honesty from his presidency, and he's been very, very late in getting to that.
On the other hand, these Pakistani regions are where the terrorists are. There's no getting around that fact. The "sovereign nation" argument fails when you don't really control the sections of the country being bombed. If we didn't use the drones (or other methods of indirect attack with impunity, such as manned air strikes or artillery), then our only choices are to send in ground forces, or just leave the Taliban alone. Can't say I like either of those options much.
The attacks on our towers has left us scarred and deformed, but I assure you our resolve has never been stronger. The war is over. The terrorist have been defeated, and al qaeda has been foiled. We stand on the threshold of a new beginning. In order to ensure our security and continuing stability, America will be reorganized into the first Galactic Empire, for a safe and secure society, which I assure you will last for ten thousand years. An Empire that will continue to be ruled by this august body and a sovereign ruler chosen for life. An Empire ruled by the majority, ruled by a new constitution!
What a propaganda piece this news story and the video of "What they think of us" is! Stock comments like:
1. the Afghani saying America keeps people in poverty while people stroll behind him, some of the women with their face or hair exposed, unlike in the burqas the Taliban and traditional Afghan society. Traditionally, women were married age 9-13 to men their grandfathers' age and then kept ignorant, barefoot, pregnant. We keep people in poverty, huh? WE BUILT SCHOOLS THEY BURNED DOWN.
2. the fat and sassy Palestinian physician talking about apartheid with the requisite "Wall Shot" behind him. Does he even know the meaning of apartheid? Does he mean 20% of Israel being non-Jewish Arabs and 0% of "Palestine" being Jewish? Next it will be "genocide" with the population 10 times what it was when Israel was founded. Note no mention of the fact that Egypt has a border with Gaza but the Egyptians HATE the Palestinians.
3. Pakistani daring to say anything against America. Also fat and sassy. Excuse me, fatter!
4. That turban guy from Waziristan was pretty cool.
If Amreeka is so horrible, how come they still pour across our borders and demand our cash?
That is about to be the case in the US. With congress approving 30 thousand drones to be launched in the US around the clock, the Pakistani deal does not seem like a big deal.
killing civillians is what america does best. Soldiers are to wussy to actually fight the guys with guns so they kill an unarmed person and call it a day
"killing civillians is what america does best. Soldiers are to wussy to actually fight the guys with guns so they kill an unarmed person and call it a day"
I am assuming you are Pakistani because of the way you respond. That's ok. But to say "Soldiers are to wussy to actually fight the guys with guns so they kill an unarmed person and call it a day" is stupid. There is what is called casualties of war, or in this case terrorist fighting. It's a shame but it happens when countries fight war or terrorists. If you stop harboring them we wouldn't be killing innocent people. If soldiers are too wussy, how did we go into your damn country and killed the biggest terrorist/coward/wuss of all time? BECAUSE WE ARE BAD ASSES! WE CAN! WE PAY YOU BIG BUCKS FOR YOUR COUNTRY AND YOU CANT DO @!$%# ABOUT TERRORISM.
I'm glad it means "Drones" to them. It should. They are the most corrupt, inept country in that part of the world. We give them millions/billions for what? As long as they are still in bed with the terrorists/taliban then i say "F**K them all.
there was a burglary in my neighborhood not too long ago. Since the burglar lived amongst me then i guess that means i harbor criminals and deserve to be blown up. It makes perfect sense to me
Pretty ignorant post. If you lived with the burglar and shielded him from the police and supplied him with guns and food and getaway cars, yeah, not only would you deserve punishment in a court of law, if he was also a murderer, you'd deserve the death penalty.
Next!
I do understand the outrage in the deaths of women and children. These jihaddists that hide with women and children are responsible for their deaths. Its very sad that the men of pakistan are Cowards and dont fight these jihaddist that attract missles upon the innocent.
People in the USA think of Pakistanis as corrupt, money-grubbing, uneducated, misled, hateful radical Muslim terrorists. So there. If they don't like the drones, they should go clean out the terrorists themselves.
Now why not discuss a little bit about thegreat Nation called india See what see in the fallowing links
you tube Every Indian must see this Video...Most watched Indian viral !!!
you tube What i learned from my
visit to India
You tube this This is India
India Water Crisis - Environmental
Action Project
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India Water Crisis - Environmental
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you tube Varanasi
holy town ( dead human body in
ganga)oct.092
you tube Hindu Cremation An Experiment with an animal first
you tube Slum
tour in Mumbai (India)
You tube
Calcutta, India slum - Sealdah
Did I miss something? Did India attack us? Lots of poor countries but only the Islamic ones are painting targets on our soil.
In the name of monitoring polluters, Big Government is already using Drones to spy on Americans.
With laser precision weapons, it is feasible to assassinate any vocal disloyal American citizen at home just as were the several assassinations of vocal disloyal American citizens living abroad.
In America's War of Global Terrorism, Americans enjoying Constitutional guaranteed liberties are over.
The Pakistanis think of drones when they think of Americans...finally, we are getting the message to the Taliban, Al-Qaeda and their supporters...these folks shouldn't relax...not even for one moment...besides, it's time for them to read their Koran and thank Allah for this day...that they haven't been bombed by a drone, for this one minute...probably a good idea for each of them not to gather in groups of two or more...hey, if they really want to be with Allah; then, they should thank the Americans for using their drones to help move them closer to Allah...
The tribal leaders need to hand over the terrorists for prosecution if they do not like the drone strikes, or let us go in and take them but they do not they fight any atempt to apprehend these murderers so thus drone strikes are the only option we have.
For many Pakistanis, 'USA' means 'drones'?
Good. Let them hate us, so long as they fear us. It's much better than having their terrorists attacking us here on our soil.
Pakistan simply needs to send up a fighter jet to shoot down a couple of drones. Then none will return. Neither will more money from the US.