Condolences to the family and friends of our two fallen warriors.

Our thoughts and prayers are with you.

The price of war always goes beyond victory or defeat.

Maybe our government don't want to admit it FAILED again just like all the WARS since world War II, if you can't stand the heat get the HELL out of the Kitchen, Wars are not won by someone with a Bible in one hand and some crazy azz laws in the Other, did you every hear NICE guy's finish LAST !!!!!!!!!!!!

Our leaders are fools.

That's a useless response, care to be more specific? :)

In this country's existence, we've never been 12 years at war--4 years being the record. During times of war, tax dollars are needed the most--so, they reduced them to 35%. On top of that, the GOP has collectively signed a pledge with Grover Norquist, to neither ever vote to raise taxes or close any tax loopholes. They took the jobs and expect America's youth, out of desperation in the job market or access to an affordable education, to enlist in the US military. The wars will continue as we no longer know what to do. If the economy is stagnant now, end the wars, pull the plugs on those massive cost-plus defense contracts and watch this economy to a grinding financial halt and total chaos.

Unless

You stop the wars and bring the troops home and immediately start rebuilding the infrastructure. Raise the top marginal tax rates to the pre-Bush Era when the economy prospered and we weren't at war with the world. The Roman Empire tried to exist long term on war---and they disappeared from the map. The other similarities were getting people to accept sub standard conditions in life--by the promise of eternal life and income disparity, as we have now. Further, the trade imbalance was out of control--as our is

Twice

Our leaders are fools.

It's not our leaders who are attacking our troops. Perhaps you should look into the mirror to see the fool. The Americans are there for one reason only and that's to address the terrorist problem coming from the region. There is no other reason, but it's compelling enough for me. We are there to protect our civilians, monumental architecture, and transportation infrastructure. Go Bush, Go Obama!

We naively think that we can go and build schools and roads and try to turn thing around by example. But when a murderous ideology prevails among the locals, it will become necessary to match murder with murder. The Taliban lost the war, and now they use terror tactics. Instead of acquiessing to authority, and building an economy they use hit and run tactics and hide among civilians. They use women, children and mosques as shelters. They know that Americans respect the rules of engagement, and they exploit it with dirty tactics.

The Taliban suffer from brain rabies. It's from either heroine addiction or religious addiction, perhaps both. Americans need to think a little harder about the poignant cure for such dangerous, corrupting diseases.

Mike that's so true, who in their right mind would fight with one hand tied behind their back, if I get into a fight it's anything goes. Screw rules and religion, thats why it's called WAR !!!!!!!!!

Jeff-1592116

Our leaders are fools.

That's a useless response, care to be more specific? :)

_________________________________________

Most of us understood it perfectly....Sorry if it went over some heads...

@Jeff--Read between the line--and it was one! But it said what needed to be said. Our leaders are fools BECAUSE we shouldn't be there in the first place. We are done with that part of the world. The reasons for being their are DONE.

I truly believe:

Afghanis hate our guts. Each and every one of them would slit our throats if they could.

Afghanis would eat their own children if they could catch them. (Those they can't eat, they've been known to hang, poison, murder, pour acid on, etc. Check out what the Taliban does to women and little girls who go to school. I'm not making it up.)

Afghanis have NO respect for human life--whatsoever. They have killed or tried to kill every group that has ever tried to help them. They are in perpetual war.

I personally think a wall should be build around the whole bunch--Pakistan, Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, and all the other 'stans, and let them have at one another. They'd kill each other off in less than a hundred years--at least we can hope so. They LIKE killing. They enjoy it, why else would they continue?

None is our friend. None will do anything to improve their lot in life. All will complain about how bad they have it. Their governments are failures. And the US is the laughingstock of the world for trying to give them a chance to improve. Sweeping generalizations? I don't think so.

We stay in Afghanistan for ONE reason: Our leaders are fools.

Thank you very much for your sacrifice while conducting the Foreign Internal Defense (FID) Mission. Condolences to the Families.

Twice - Our leaders are fools.

What "leaders". Actual Critical Leadership is only Trained and Experienced in the US Military. Examples from Basic Leadership 101, "Share the Hardships", "Lead by Example" (aka Lead from the Front), etc. and I am not just saying slogans, I am saying some of us actually live these.

Mike in Delray - Where have the radical anti-war lefties been since Jan.20, 2009

You have to ask, they were funded by the Demoncraptic National Committee. What I find really hypocritical is that they did all the name calling, condoned the US Military Personnel to do the same, etc.. And now when the News Media says "Mr. Obama" these same Democraps get all indignant saying that it is "President Obama", demand that US Military Personnel be tried for Treason for stating anything against President Obama, etc..

The real ignorance is that Iraq was the First Legal War since WWII. As ever since the US Law 1973 War Powers Resolution that limits the US President's War Powers, it takes both Houses (House of Representatives, US Senate) of US Congress to Declare War.

This was Done for Iraq as demanded by Demoncrap President Clinton with his House of Representatives US Law (H.R.) 4655 "Iraqi Liberation Act of 1998" with his 1998 State of the Union Address, justification Weapons of Mass Destruction; that became US Military Operation Desert Fox (that later became 2003 to 2011 US Military Operation Iraqis Freedom with US Congressional Appropriations and Repugnant President Bush (43) US Senate US Law 2002 Iraqi War Resolution with US Congressional Appropriations. (Without the US Congressional Appropriations the US President can use that as an excuse not to obey the US Congressional Laws).

To make Iraq 100% Legal Internationally (International Laws), Iraq became a United Nations (UN) Nation Building Mission (same with Afghanistan).

After leaving Afghanistan less than a month ago we are scheduled to return before the end of this year to continue our Foreign Internal Defense (FID), Humanitarian Assistance, Special Reconaissance, Special Surveillance, Targeting and Target Damage Assessment, US Military Asymmetric Mountain Warfare, Counter Insurgency, Counter Terrorist, etc. Missions for years of consecutive tours while living with the locals (again).

President Obama has committed us to remain decades after the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces depart in 2014. The US Military Conventional Warfare Forces provide our required Logistics support as well as for our Emergency Exfiltrations (pull our arses out of the fire). Because of President Obama as Commander In Chief Ordered Reduction In Forces (RIF) of the US Military of 90,000 these US Military Personnel that previously and will support us when we return to Afghanistan will no longer be in the US Military.

No matter how much I hate my job, from experience since Operation Cyclone, we know what will happen if we abandon our US Allies at Afghanistan again (repeat the same mistakes and expect a different result); the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban will massacred all Pro US Afghans again just like they massacred the 20,000 to 50,000 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen that we trained and lead to defeat the USSR 40th Army Occupation.

You stop the wars and bring the troops home and immediately start rebuilding the infrastructure. Raise the top marginal tax rates to the pre-Bush Era when the economy prospered and we weren't at war with the world. The Roman Empire tried to exist long term on war---and they disappeared from the map. The other similarities were getting people to accept sub standard conditions in life--by the promise of eternal life and income disparity, as we have now. Further, the trade imbalance was out of control--as our is

There's not a SINGLE word with which I disagree with you here, but we all know it will fall on deaf ears in Washington. The bozos there prefer to keep the meat grinder churning to save face, than to admit- for ONCE- that "bombing, occupying, invading and rebuilding" hasn't been working. THAT won't change. And don't delude yourself into thinking it's just the Republicans who are desperate to maintain the status quo. We've got Democrats, not the least of which is Billary, who are pushing for involvement in Syria and Iran. Not saying the Republicans aren't at fault for this fiasco - they are- but the Democrats are MUCH bigger war mongers than they let on.

its all evil

@Mike in Delray

@ Jim Spence

Maybe the 'liberals' haven't had a lot to say because Bush was the one that got us into this mess. I assume you think that whoever takes the job over is instantly responsible for the last idiots mess. By hearing the right wing rhetoric it makes sense. Obama is to blame for the economy now. Though he had nothing to do with unchaining Wall Street and the Banks to hand out shotty investments and sub-prime loans. Remember George and Condi's 'we want every American in a home' nonsense. Well congratz on all that.Sure Obama has been a complete disappointment to those that voted for him. But bottom line is that voting for him helped keep that wacko Palin from being 1 step from President.

It's about time that people figure out all this 'left' and 'right' is doing nothing but continuing to divide this country to the point that nothing will EVER get done for the good of the people as a whole.

It's a shame about the loss of soldiers lives. We got Bin Laden. Why are we wasting all the money on the Afgan war again? Let them go back to killing each other. They have only been doing it for 3000 years now.Anyone really think we are going to change that??

Whatever the Nobama Plan to bail out of there sure sucks. We never had anything like this..Our Boys are sitting ducks,

I don't mean this as political, it could be any President, but there needs to be some changes in the Exit Stategy, because this is getting out of hand

a former US Army Sp4

No one is screaming from the hilltops...

Where did you get your doctorate in warfare and the extraction of a large number of troops from a War Zone? You must prepare the logistical and strategic exodus so as not to leave the enemy with a further chanced to inflict harm in the area as you leave.'

For those that are not aware, we are leaving and that plan is in place. Some people are the Monday Morning/Arm Chair Q'back that loves to complain about how it should be in the field and have never played a down in their life.

Some bitch, while others do.

Maybe the 'liberals' haven't had a lot to say because Bush was the one that got us into this mess.

I do find it disingenuous for Republicans to be complaining and saying it's Obama's fault. Typical Republican Revisionism.

Obama IS pulling the troops out and Republicans are complaining about that too. Just ask McCain and screw what Republicans say. They're a bunch of do-nothing wankers who got us in this mess to begin with.

Isn't religion wonderful?

One would think humankind would have learned a lesson by now. How many more people must be murdered and tortured in its name?

No matter the religion, it is all the same.

Get our troops out of Afghanistan now! Haven't we done enough damage and lost two wars already while wasting 7,200 lives for nothing!

Where have the radical anti-war lefties been since Jan.20, 2009 ....They were front page headlines throughout the Bush Presidency.....staging big protests to end the war ???

Mike, if you cannot understand the difference in rationale behind our involvement in Iraq vs. Afghanistan, than none of this will make sense.

But suffice it to say that I was against the war in Iraq because a) Saddam was in no way involved in the 9/11 attacks or any ongoing plots against the United States, b) given the deep ethnic and religious divisions in this country, I knew that our involvement was bound to be a messy, protracted affair, and c) there really was no strong evidence that Saddam had an ongoing WMD program in 2003.

I supported the original invasion of Afghanistan for the obvious reasons involving Al Qaeda, Osama bin Laden and the 9/11 attacks. I also supported Obama's promised emphasis on this war, as with bin Laden yet alive, the task was clearly undone.

It is a simple as that, and I imagine many other Americans feel this way.

Yes, as this recent spate of killings shows, it is time to leave, as quickly as possible.

But nations, unlike individuals, cannot simply pack up and abandon a commitment in the wink of an eye. Baring catastrophic changes, we should follow our established schedule for withdrawal, accelerating it whenever possible.

btw: have you ever considered if matters might be different if Bush had maintained the primary focus to the U.S. military in Afghanistan in 2003? Would Osama bin Laden have been found and killed in 2005, instead of in 2011. Would the Karzai government be long since place on stable footing? Would Pakistan and the U.S. be in constant conflict regarding U.S. drone operations in their territory?

Actions have consequences. IN 2003, George W. Bush led us into Iraq, and Afghanistan was basically forgotten. Today we are paying the price of that neglect.

NOW... maybe we'll wake up & get the hell OUT !.....( ohhh wait.... I must be dreaming again...) WTF will it take:

• Trust...? {NOPE}
• Better Intel...? {NOPE}
• Gov'mnt Intervention...? {NOPE}.. ** Slaps Forehead, (Makes the "L" on forehead with right thumb & index finger)
• MORE Troops.....? AHhhhh HELL NO... !!!

  Bring them ALL home..... enough of being the World's Police..... it's a cost that's a bit too high.. & it'll never get any cheaper ( I'm NOT talking about $$ either)

<S> to ALL our troops !

BJohn, Bush new how to fight this war with much less casualties. Obama said in 2007 while campaigning he was against the war i n Iraq,but the war in Afghanistan was right and just. It is now his war not President Bush's war. Why can't liberals man up to the truth. Liberals are pansies and any of us that served and were deployed to a war zone would rather do it with a Republican Commander in Chief.

The Republicons and Democraps are all the same. It makes me laugh seeing the partisan politics blaming one or the other for what happened. In case you are wondering why we are still in Afghanistan and Iraq, take a look at a world map. Both border Iran (Iraq on the East, Afghanistan on the West). Iran is surrounded by the US on the South, North, and in Pakistan as well.

It's only a matter of time before the War on Iran begins as soon as the one on Syria is over. And what country has been dying for the US to attack Iran and has the strongest 'lobbying' (I call it bribery group) in the US? It's all there if you read your history folks.

To WIN a conflict you have to be MORE brutal than your enemy.War is not pretty,war is not like a video game,where you hit replay if you get killed.We signed onto the geneva convention,.....our adversaries since WWII,did not.We have to answer to half-assed,American lawyers for EVERYTHING..they do not.Unfortunatly,we are HUMAN,they are not...They have leaders,we do not.....The muzzies have no 6 o'clock news to answer to....Our ROE is a damned joke,;'shall not engage,unless fired upon...'...yeah,that'll show em...give us a news,and cell phone blackout in that area,and we'll see who wins......Time to come home if we aren;t ALLOWED to fight-to-win.....We did notice,that when we use THIER tactics against them,it scares the @!$%# out of them...(they didn't like the balaclava black masks we used...until some idiot CO.banned them...but then the Army brought them back....) ..when some of our guys do something that really hits a nerve with the subhumans,..and it has the desired effect,....it works........but then some idiot pulls out a camera phone,and we're off to the courthouse......For all you never-served couch generals,,....this is the CLEANEST, most PG rated war we have EVER fought(attended)......because we are not allowed to inflict any REAL damage............U.S. Army Disabled Veteran

Correction to previous post: Iraq to the West and Afghanistan to the East. The US is taking out the weaker countries to surround the big fish. War on Terror, Saddam's WMDs, all smoke and mirrors. The end goal has been to take out Iran, and they had to surround it first for an all out assault.

The Sanctions are an act of War, to strangle a country and weaken it before an attack. That is what happened to Iraq, that is what is happening to Iran.

For the call to more brutal I doubt we can do that as the Afghans have been fighting this war for more than 180 years and were up against the Soviets and they lost too!

Twice

Our leaders are fools.

Obama's no fool. He's smart enough to stay in Afghanistan long enough to not look like a wimp before the election. Sucks to be the GI's that have to pay the price, though.

I say let the Afgans be on their own and bring our troops home. 116 men have committed suicide since the beginning of the year serving over there and this has been a constant with our young men in service. We have our own invasion going on here in America and our troops should be here protecting their OWN country. Obama is giving amnesty to illegals who were brought here "through no fault of their own", and don't tell me it's only a two year gig, what he is doing is opening the door for total amnesty including these illegals family members. Obama has put Muslim brotherhood members in high positions in our Homeland Security department. Haven't you wondered why the Islamist terrorist have slid under the radar since he was elected? The word isn't even used anymore and the only religions being attacked now are Catholics and Christians. Obama hates America and I am also going to say that he is a Muslim, not a Christian. Americans are being lead like sheep because Obama is as charismatic as Hitler and Stalin were. All of them are narcissists. Wake up America!!!!!!!!

See the movie 2016 Obama's America, it will explain a lot. You can't change the facts that he hung around with radical communists and if you think the ideology fell on deaf Obama ears you are sadly mistaken.

Romney/Ryan 2012

It's pretty damn bad when you have to worry more about being shot by the people your there to help, than you do being shot by the Taliban! We need to end this pointless war now!!!!

sandtrich

In this country's existence, we've never been 12 years at war--4 years being the record. During times of war, tax dollars are needed the most--so, they reduced them to 35%.

Technically Vietnam was a 20 year war (1955-1975). It’s amazing how the Libbies always discount this massacre that LBJ orchestrated. This was an undeclared war. It was NOT U.N. sanctioned. In fact it was in violation of both the Geneva Agreements AND the U.N. Charter and the U.S. was the cause of the war.

The complaint that Iraq and Afghanistan have cost us nearly $1.3 Trillion by the Congressional Research Service along with over 6,300 deaths and 42,000 injuries is staggering. Of course it's a simple boogieman of the anti-MIC crowd, and with respects to proposed outcomes it’s probably justified.

Now, when you compare this to Vietnam it pales in comparison. So I'm sure all the Bush/Cheney haters must have the same disdain for JFK and LBJ, right? Just a few comparisons for the uninformed.

Vietnam cost us 58,209 lives and over 211,000 wounded. The costs do not include post war additional injuries in both cases. The economic cost of Vietnam is even more staggering. In 1975 dollars it cost us $531 BILLION. Adjusted for inflation its cost increases to $3.53 Trillion in 2010 dollars. Once again post war injury costs are not calculated in these numbers for both wars.

As far as funding is concerned, remember, in the late 60’s LBJ created the “unified budget” to disguise the real cost of the Vietnam War. This was also done to fund his Great Society “War on Poverty", which has turned out to be an abysmal failure by the way, and the NASA space race.

The 1967 Commission on Federal Budget Concepts adopted the unified budget concept. Putting surpluses from Social Security overwithholdings “on budget”, adding them to the general operating budget, so they could be used to pay for other programs would give the “appearance” of a balanced budget. Thus was created the practice of using Social Security “Trust Funds” surpluses, or Intragovernmental Holdings, to hide the size of the overall deficit.

This has been used ever since by every president. Most famously by Clinton to give the appearance of a “surplus”.

Who cares what standing President we have, lets get the @!$%# out of there!

Enough bloodshed and treasure have been wasted, occupation doesn't work, never has, never will!

Two quotes I think are completely relevant..

"Everything that can be accomplished with a gun has been accomplished" -Mark Bowden, Author

"Revolutions is best fought by Patriots, not Foreign Armys" -Thomas Jefferson

@brian869346 "Liberals are pansies and any of us that served and were deployed to a war zone would rather do it with a Republican Commander in Chief."

Ahh so the 8 years I spent in the USMC means I am a pansy?? Dooo tell. >.>

But as a rule the Armed Forces do like Republican Presidents more. They like to spend more money than Democrats do on the military. So is that being a pansy or just making sure you have a job? Was part of the reason I left.

War was never meant to be waged by politicians or limited in any way.... war is meant to be WON by killing or capturing the enemy.

Anything less is pointless

1. Lazy minds label entire groups based on the words or deeds of individuals. We all deserve recognition, but condemnation or acceptance should have nothing to do with your politics since no rational mind could ever wholly support either parties ideaology.

2. War has always been with us. War is evil. It is the equivalent of a street fight between individuals. When it is over one person is beaten but the second the victor raises their arms in celebration the vanquished may rise and stab them in the heart. Nothing is EVER settled through violence.

3. Iraq was wrong, Bush and Cheney ought to be tried as war criminals for the horror their lies created. Millions of people dead, maimed or mourning!!! That some of my tax dollars funded that evil action makes me sick at heart.

4. Afghanistan was righteous for about two weeks. By the end of the first few days the training camp was turned to dust and the Taliban leadership was on the run. We should have pulled back and watched to see whether they regrouped and let the rest of the world know that they are subject to the same kind of action if they allow such groups safe haven within their borders.

5. Religion is used as a tool to purify evil. Evil is EVIL and religion cannot wash away the horrific things done in it's name.

6. Anyone who believes the upcoming election will change anything is deluded. The economy will collapse under the weight of a national debt that is quickly approaching 16 trillion dollars. The gutting of social services, the continued push for reduced taxes on corporations and wealthy in the face of continued military action around the globe if PROOF positive who is really running the show and it isn't the people we vote for. Elected officials ARE on a never ending election cycle treadmill. They ARE lobbied (bribed). They DO perform for the money offered.

Morning rant over, let the haters begin their response.

Bjohn2731 - Maybe the 'liberals' haven't had a lot to say because Bush was the one that got us into this mess.

Jeff-1592116 - They're a bunch of do-nothing wankers who got us in this mess to begin with.

Nope. Afghanistan is a continuation of what was not allowed to be finished by US Congress as "Charlie Wilson's War" (Senator Charles Wilson, Democrat, Texas) aka Operation Cyclone; as instead of US Congress appropriating money to assist our US Allies the 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen to rebuild 1950s to 1979 "Little America" 20th Century US Ally Afghanistan after the defeat of the USSR 40th Army, the US Abandoned them to get massacred by the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban fully supported by the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran.

Then there was our (US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces attached to the CIA's SAD/SOG) involvement as the "Vengence Force" after the 9/11 2001 Attacks. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arxKhJIjIiY

Bjohn2731 - We got Bin Laden. Why are we wasting all the money on the Afgan war again?

SHOWS JUST HOW MUCH YOU DO NOT KNOW. The Mission to Terminate Osama Bin Laden was added AFTER President Bush (43) in 2006 Amended the US No Assassination Policy (see 2006 Harvard International Review Article, US No Assassination Policy On the Offensive).

The US No Assassination Policy was President Clinton's excuse for not allowing us (US Military Teams attached to the CIA's SAD/SOG shadowing OBL) to terminate Osama Bin Laden after he was released by the US Ally Saudi Government after President Clinton refused the US Ally Saudi Government's Offered Extradiction for the 1993 First World Trade Center Bombing, as President Clinton also refused to give the US Ally Saudi Government the Evidence of OBL's Involvement in the 1993 First World Trade Center Bombing, so the US Ally Saudi Government did not have sufficient Evidence to even detain OBL.

Bjohn2731, ***NOW HEAR THIS***..., Jeff-1592116,

go post your partisan Demoncrap non factual baloney emotive opinions on a personal blog. Newsvine "Get Smarter Here".

You cannot fool people that know how to use a computer and google (search).

And you darn sure cannot fool someone that has been involved with the Afghanistan since Operation Cyclone (till less than a month ago).

***NOW HEAR THIS***...,

This is NOT some Football Game, those Sports Teams get to go home and get drunk if they lose; if we fail we come home in flag draped metal coffins. And FYI most Sports are based on training and practice for Conventional Warfare; NOT Asymmetric Warfare (as to what Afghanistan, Iraq, and all Wars, Conflicts after the Defeat of the USSR (aka Cold War, 1945 to 1990) are). FYI, 1% of US Military are Asymmetric Warfare; only 1% of US Citizens are currently Serving in the US Military. The methods to withdraw (Retrograde) from a Asymmetric War are NOT the same as a Conventional War, it is the Majority as Conventional Warfare US Politicians and Generals (no idea nor training and experience with Asymmetric Warfare) that determine how the US Military will Retrograde from Afghanistan.

Bjohn2731 - Let them go back to killing each other. They have only been doing it for 3000 years now.Anyone really think we are going to change that??

Once again you are speaking from not doing the research or not having any firsthand experience (at Afghanistan).

From the 1950s till 1979 (USSR 40th Army Occupation) the US built up US Ally Afghanistan into a 20th Century "Little America". During the USSR 40th Army Occupation the USSR Military Personnel enjoyed this US Standard of Living. After the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban massacred the 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen they destroyed everything that was "Non Islamic", "Modern", "Western" of the 20th Century "Little America" Afghanistan. 1990, the lights literally went out at Afghanistan after the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban destroyed the Electric Power Plants.

one time their fault, two times my fault....three times!...the brass better get their heads out of their a$$es....

I'm so sick and tired of our crooked politicians promoting these stupid wars that only benefit the military industrial complex. We are being so brainwashed into believing that there is ANY REASON for us to still waste money and lives on ventures producing ABSOLUTELY NO BENEFIT to us.

Get a rope and string 'em up! We're there giving these people a shot at democracy, and they do things like this to our people. Time for a hangin' party!

ZMan - we should first hang our own politicians for continuing the insanity of these wars. Especially those neocon Republicans who started them, promising a 'cakewalk'...

@David457776

Yes we have all seen "Charlie Wilsons War". Thank you for stating the obvious. When I said they have been killing each other for 3000 years I meant it. How many tribal wars, Invading armies (Alexander the Great etc.) have fought over Afgan lands?

p.s. I fought in Iraq. How many lives of my brothers and sisters were lost over nothing? How much money did it cost? Where is the justification for going to war with Iraq? Answer that googleman. Call me what you like. Spew whatever facts you can google. Yes Bush was the one that signed the agreement for withdrawl. Question is why are certain Republicant's up in arms about it? Because wars make money...for some.

@Max^108...It's very easy to blame Republicans for starting the war in Afghanistan, but very lame not to recognize that Obama and the Democrats have done very little to end it. So typical!

about that

Romney/Ryan 2012 for real Americans

So you are saying that if you are not for Willard/Eddie you are not a "real" American?

That is exactly what the Conservatives are trying to do in this country... do away with the middle class and exclude all others from social reform and security.

YES, you're right!!!! Conservatives want dirty air, polluted water, nuclear waste in your childrens bedroom, ruin the middle class, not feed poor children and push all the grandmas over a cliff.

ROTFLMAO!!!!!

You Liberals just keep making yourselves more insignificant than you already are. Only in your pathetic indoctrinated minds can you believe the Barrack Hussein, DNC and Debbie Whatsername Slutz propaganda. Don’t you even feel a little ridiculous to believe these irrational statements? Obviously not, because you have had any self-esteem stripped from yourselves in order to support your century long intrusion by Progressivism that has created most of the problems we face today.

You cling to your vaunted entitlements and social programs. The same ones that even our actuaries and government auditors admit are collapsing or dysfunctional. Your boy-toy LBJ changed government accounting practices to allow Social Security surpluses to be used in the general budget, today we have over $29 TRILLION in Unfunded Liabilities because of that little magic-trick. Our criminal government cant’ even find $100 billion in cost cutting, let alone that massive amount of money. The only option for those hoping to retire in the next 30 years is to work much longer or get less than they put in. Yet you Libbies don’t think any of your sacrosanct programs need to be reformed.

Government auditors spent the past five years examining all federal programs and found that 22 percent of them–costing taxpayers a total of $123 billion annually–fail to show any positive impact on the populations they serve. Do you Libbies understand what this means? This means our OWN GOVERNMENT is telling us it is wasting nearly 25% of OUR hard earned tax dollars. Of course your typical response is,,,denial. You have been so brainwashed into believing government is here to benefit you it has become undeniable.

Anyone who dares argue that government is consuming any chance we have of recovering our economy is demonized as wanting to do all those things that I mentioned above. Real Americans laugh at you. Your little cabal of Liberal entitlement worshippers refuse to admit you are no longer capable of maintaining your own existence so you submit to the “Life of Julia” your masters demand of you. Your obvious envy and self-pity is difficult for many of us to watch. I guarantee you at some point in your life you dreamed of being rich yet you demonize the very people who have achieved that. I doubt you have ever read a “Get Middle-Class Quick” book, but I’ll wager you’ve looked at a few “Get Rich Quick” books. I bet you even bought a Power-Ball lottery ticket recently.

You vilify the rich, yet you demand they pay for your failing entitlements and social programs. Your hypocrisy is nauseating. The top 20% of taxpayers pay 94% of all taxes yet this isn’t enough for you. Yes, they have more wealth also but you never consider it’s because they worked harder and saved their money better than you do. It’s always some sinister act , luck or attempt to eliminate the middle class. You Libbies need to stop, take a deep breath and realize how foolish your arguments are. I am by no means wealthy but I, just as I’m sure you do, aspire to be some day. If I achieve it, great. If I don’t, at least I can say I tried.

Greed isn’t someone wanting to keep more of what they earn, its people demanding a greater share of money that someone else has earned.

I'll vote for anyone who will try to improve my standard of living ...without destroying someone else’s!

Romney/Ryan for real Americans

Mike

Since our liberal President started his apologetics tour in Berlin, throw our country under the bus, we are not more an exeptional country , we are one among others, to the extent that Obama receives its orders the UN... Our Commander in Chief whose opinions like most Liberals is attack of our armed forces, this leading from the behind. It is well known that liberal students at Harvard like he was , and many other universities in our country most opposed to recruit students for the Army on college campuses and oppose recruit offices in its cities, because do not share their values. Afghanistan is the Obama war and we have more casualties in 3 years than 8 years with Bush. Obama is a failure, decided change the rules of engagement of our soldiers leaving at the mercy of the enemy. We now have Russian submarines very close to our coast and Obama not saying a word, the Russians who feared earlier our army when Reagan was President, we are now the paper tiger. Obama offered the Russians renounce nuclear weapons in Eastern Europe in his second term and the closure of our facilities in Poland to weaken our defense capability. Need a real Commander in Chief, not a community organizer.

R&R 2012

Highway Star - I said 'hang politicians responsible for continuing these wars' - which means both parties. Both parties have totally sold out to US military industrial complex and the blood of our young men and women dying in these stupid wars is on their hands.

ZMan,

You should say we are forcing Democracy down their throats. To many it is a form of corruption and crooks. Sort of like Wall Street! What if they don't want democracy due to tribal traditions etc.?

All these conservatives that now are against the war..... Where were they when Bush started this whole mess? 8 YEARS! of failures! Obama at least killed Bin Laden! yeah the same Bin Laden who was friends with the conservatives, the one that bomb us in 9-11. Obama is wrapping up the other failed operation in Iraq. The US is the laughing stock of the world, they all know we can't even win a war against third world countries, not even with the support of all the industrialized nations.

I wish George and Dick would be sent to prison for crimes against humanity. I don't know how they live with themselves. Time to bring them all home AND HELP THEM. I read another article that July had more suicides of military personnel. BRING THEM HOME AND HELP THEM. We should be ashamed of ourselves for treating these men and women the way that we have. And I hope Dubya and Dick can't sleep at night for putting our men and women in harms way because of GREED.

Mike in Delray,

"Where have the radical anti-war lefties been since Jan.20, 2009 ....They were front page headlines throughout the Bush Presidency.....staging big protests to end the war ???"

I have not seen what I would call a big anti-war protest since the 1960's. Those were the days.

Bjohn2731

@ Jim Spence

I assume you think that whoever takes the job over is instantly responsible for the last idiots mess.

If he’s not, then who is?

Look, Barrack Hussein campaigned on ALL these issues. As much as you Libbies want to make excuses for him it’s not working. A true leader doesn’t complain, he leads. The era of “Bush did it” is long over. When you want to be president and a world leader you don’t keep looking for excuses, you perform. Everyone with a brain saw this collapse coming as early as 2005, if Barrack Hussein didn’t he shouldn’t have run for office. We have been in Afghanistan long before he decided to run for president, if he didn’t think he could handle it he shouldn’t have run.

We all knew the most urgent problem was to address the economy, NOT spend 2 years creating another unsustainable government entitlement. This was done purely based on an ideology, not out of necessity. Obamacare is so convoluted and dysfunctional even the same Democrats that voted for it and Obama can’t explain what it is, even now after we passed it and have time to see what’s in it. This will consume 1/5 of our GDP and no one understands what it will do in 10 years, let alone 20 or 30 years.

Any day now our National Debt will surpass $16 trillion dollars with no relief in sight. By the end of the year we will have burned through the $2.4 Trillion we just increased the debt ceiling by last August. This is horrifying. No attempt has been made by our government to stop this economy destroying spending. Barrack Husseins only solution is to tax the rich and generate $85 billion a year in added revenue. This will pay for 8.5 days of spending. Then what? Who do you think will need to be taxed next?

The second after Barrack Hussein took his hand off the Bible after taking his Oath he became responsible. He has failed since. It’s time for a real change. We can’t wait any longer as our apprentice president learns on the job.

Romney/Ryan for real Americans

Step right up and place your bets on the following:

The US has lost almost 2,000 soldiers lives in Afghanistan- a monumental moment by all prevous war reporting. Will the media pick up this awful statistic and push it (to end the war)??

My bet- no. It's an election cycle and bad press for the current administration. They can't promote anti-war when the noted as anti-war party controls the government and is limping slowly towards an exit strategy.

Sure, the President presented a "timeline" for exiting Afghanistan- which really empowered the Talliban (as noted in many recent articles) to be ready to take over the newly upgraded infrustructure and bases, but the current anti-war presidency has turned into kill lists, drone strikes, military actions in Africa, a lack of military strenth/support for the places we already are to get the job done, add soggy noodle foreign policy and here we are.

Please visit www.dishonorabledisclosure.com today, watch the short documentary for free, and share it with your friends. It's critical to America's national security that you hear what these secret heroes have to say and share this message with everyone you know.

I wish George and Dick would be sent to prison for crimes against humanity.

Diver

The war in Iraq was approve by congress , lead by Bush our Commander in chief with a multinational Army. Citizens in Iraq celebrate the end of the Hussein days of tyranny, however enemies of democracy in ME sabotage the effort of Iraqis people to leave in peace , who proudly show their finger tinted in indelible ink after their first democratic election. Bush spark the flame of a new democracy in ME.

For a real proud of American exeptionalism Commander in Chief

R&R 2012

Regarding our leaders being fools. Is it really our leaders or the multitude of fools that would elect them over and over?

Some people use the story of soldiers losing their lives trying to make the world safer from extremist and partisan loyalist fools use it to promote their party and attack other Americans with different political views. JEFF said our leaders are fools....he should then join the Taliban. Part of what makes America great is we are the UNITED states of America. During difficult times, when we should come together we blame each other, point fingers, name call and insult fellow Americans, because they belong to a different political party. I wonder if the Taliban has this type of division among their ranks. No they are more UNITED than the UNITED states...Shame on all who insult fellow Americans, especially our elected officials...Sore losers.

The price of EMPIRE. "Jim", grow up and take your partisan politics somewhere else, we don't need fools like yourself filling up this discussion with child like nonsense.

Oskar - Multinational?

Thats a bit of a Stretch, Great Britain sent around 30 thousands troops, but no other Country ever committed more then 2000 troops. The USA Committed 162000 troops..

I think we should realize by now that Gen. Petreus' quixotic philosophy that we could overcome 2,000 years of tribal rule by introducing them to democracy has been and will continue to be fruitless.

Bring the troops home and let Karzai do what he can do with the outlying areas of Afghanistan.

Go big or go home. That's the real choice.

What I'm about to say, I've said many times before in other threads, and I still believe it to be true: We are not fighting people; we are fighting animals. They are not cowed or controlled; they are wounded and dangerous. Aghanis are people, and they deserve better than what they've gotten out of life so far. The Taliban and their supporters are animals that savage their own, and they should be put down like animals before they can savage others. There is no reasoning with them. There is no connection to be made. They may look human, but they are not human beings. Human beings have empathy for others, consider the consequences of their actions, and make rational decisions.

Unfortunately, we live in an "enlightened" society, and we are human beings, and we are unwilling/unable to take the deplorable actions necessary to put down these animals for good. We choose to see the Taliban as fellow human beings even when they are not. I fear that the only way to "win" in Afghanistan would be to commit atrocities on a near-genocidal scale -- to take and set aside in protected areas their goods, their women, their children, and the few men who have proven to be good and trustworthy, and basically slaughter the rest wholesale. I wish it were not so. I do not advocate such awful actions. It is repellent and distasteful to even consider, but I fear that it may be truth, as ugly as it is. If America truly were an imperium, as our enemies accuse us of being, that is exactly what we would do, and we would likely claim the land as part of our nation to boot. Again, I do not advocate such horrible actions, this is merely supposition. If the Russians did not have their own internal problems as a country and did not have the United States to confound them, I believe that is what they would have done over two decades ago when they were there.

As things stand, America will be in Afghanistan for 2 more years, according to current timetables, and -- barring a major shift in strategy -- very little will change. Many more of these animals will die at our hands, and in return they will manage to take a few of our good soldiers with them. In the end, we will withdraw, and over time, the rats will breed and swarm back in to take over their old nests. Karzai and his cronies will either flee with all the money they can carry or they will have their heads paraded on pikes for all to see. The new government will likely be another Islamist theocracy even more radical than Iran's -- perhaps they too will someday start working on nuclear technology, and we can piss away our time and energy trying to cow them with sanctions and political pressure like we do now with their neighbor. Maybe, if we're lucky, the leaders of these nations will evolve enough to have the humanity to NOT nuke us or anyone else by the time they acquire the means to do so.

I'm not holding my breath.

"Jim", grow up and take your partisan politics somewhere else, we don't need fools like yourself filling up this discussion with child like nonsense.

Childlike nonsense? Really? Everything I have read in his last two posts looked like a mature adult making a logical argument about problems we are facing in this country. And your only response is to call him a fool? I will now discount everything you have to say in the future.

JimSpence: Great posts, and spot on!

Islandmanxx - We are the self annointed policemen of the world!

Nope, the United Nations did that (appointed the US Military as their United Nations Military B!tches).

Islandmanxx - FACT: Military young men in secret Nevada desert military complexes pilot death drones

Nope. RQ and MQ (Drone) Bases at Pakistan until the US got kicked out due to pressure from the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran. Now the RQ and MQ (Drone) Bases are located at Redacted. How long do you think it would take to fly a RQ or MQ from Nevada to Afghanistan.

So much for your "FACT".

You want to gripe about the US Military Defense Industrial Complex, how about telling President Obama and Secretary of Defense Leon Penetta to go ahead and cut their Budget by 10% since they are lying that would put almost a Million US Civilians out of work. The ONLY people that have ever benefitted from the US Military Defense Industrial Complex are the US Civilians (Jobs) and US Politicians, while the US Military ends up with bullsh!t contract disputes, contract delays, etc. for the US Civilians to drag out the contracts for decades (US Civilians have jobs for decades). And because instead of being allowed to buy from other Nations the US Military must pay a Fair and Living Wage of overpaid expensive US Civilians, so the $300 hammers, and expensive USAF Toilet Seats. "US Military Must Buy Only US Products, Goods, and Services" (there are rare US Congressional exemptions).

To get the US out of the 1929-1939 Great Depression, President FDR: a. Nationalized all US Industry and US Businesses (start of the current US Military Defense Industrial Complex) to manufacturer "War Materials"., b. Suspended All US Labor Union Activities ("Legit Business of Italian Organized Crime", as suspected Sympathizers and Supporters of Facist Mussolini and Chancellor Hitler)., c. Sales of "War Materials" manufacturered by his Nationalized US Industry and US Businesses to England, Russia, China, France, etc. getting the US out of the Great Depression 1939 before US Entry into WWII 1941; as according to President FDR's Presidential Papers he knew that US Consumerism would NEVER get the US out of the Great Depression., d. Further take away the source of income for the US Sympathizers and Supporters of Mussolini and Chancellor Hitler, the removal of the US Insurance Corporations (owned by "Italian Organized Crime") from the Medical Profession with his Universal Health Care For All US Citizens (Managed by US Surgeon General, a US Military Officer), start of the US Medical "Co ops", US Military Programs for the Training of Doctors Nurses Medical Professionals as the US Military Medical Service Corps becoming US Military Reserve Officers (released to Civilian Private Medical Practice, due to a surplus of Medical Professionals).

You want to talk about "US Infrastructure" go research what the US Army Corps of Engineers is responsible for as Funded by the US Military Defense Budget. When US Congress attempted to play the Blame Game during the US Congressional Katrina Hearings, the US Military Officers of the US Army Corps of Engineers produced the US Military Defense Budget Cuts (many of the same US Congress that were at the Hearing) demanded by the same members of US Congress. These US Military Defense Budget Cuts resulted in the US Army Corps of Engineers not having the funds for the Levee upgrades, retrofits, new Levees, modifications, etc. needed as determined in writing to US Congress (US Congressional Defense Appropriations Committee) by the US Army Corps of Engineers prior to Katrina.

Bjohn2731,

My information does NOT come from google, and comes from Firsthand Experience. The other Newsvine posters can go google search.

In the case of Iraq, I was with the US Military Training Teams to US Ally Iraq during the Iran Iraq Wars and most of the crap until recently. And we were constantly bounced (ping pong balled) between many Islamic Nations, like Operation Cyclone (Afghanistan), Operation Gothic Serpent (Somalia), Operation Hotel California (Iraq), etc. we finally return to CONUS a few weeks ago.

And unlike the US Military Conventional Warfare Forces we MUST know the REAL Reasons why were are at those Nations while living with the Locals for sometimes years of consecutive tours.

I think we're done here now. Let's move along.

Charles the Hammerhead

The terrorist problem began when outside forces entered their country. The British, the Soviets, the Americans. They have all killed some of their people and we cannot expect them to love us.

The reason for these wars by the USA and others since WW2 is because we and they are continuing to build an empire that will eventually go the way of all empires.

The Japanese empire got whacked and the Nazi attempt at empire got taken down just like the Roman and the Greek empires, etc. etc. etc.

We do not have a defense department, as we should, it is all about offense.

What feeds all that crap is that some people get very rich because of the wars as they stand aside and watch others die for them. Then .... as an added insult full of irony, we do not properly take care of our wounded and the families of the dead.

You want to start a war, I expect you to lead the charge, otherwise shut the f*ck up is what I say to the likes of Dick Cheney and those like him.

....German Army was brutal in WW1 and WW2....Same goes for Japanese Army in WW2.....Anyone wanna know why we won both of those wars ???.....Because America and her allies were more brutal and fierce than the enemy

Not even close to being right. World War I and World War II were already well under way when we entered. Both wars had set piece objectives; in World War I, us and the Western Allies outlasted them, and in World War II, it was the capture of Berlin and the threat of abdication of Hirohito.

What was our objective in Vietnam? Search and destroy beat the VC and NVA mercilessly, but we never had a set-piece objective until the end of the war (winning the hearts and minds). What's our objective in Afghanistan? Just hold out until the Taliban stops shooting and killing people? Until their "democracy" is stable? What was our objective in Iran?

The problem is that warfare has changed, and we have to realize that we cannot keep invading countries just to prevent terrorism. It only breeds more hatred of our country and our people, and makes us MORE susceptible to attacks. But I digress, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan had little to do with our security, and more to do with lining peoples' pockets. These "wars" were a joke, and our service members are paying for it.

If people were really supportive of our military, they'd be marching on Washington daily until we hold the people who got us into this mess, and who are keeping us in it, accountable. That goes for Hillary Clinton, Obama, Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and all the other cronies.

@Sighber. You sir, are the only one here whom I have ever seen make logical sense. All this stuff about Republican Party vs Democratic Party, one is evil or the other is evil; it's all crap. Most elections come down to voting for whomever is the least worst. Most of the pontificating on these comment boards is BS and boy is there a lot on this one today.

1. This was "W"'s war. Why didn't he conduct this war instead of attacking Iraq? Why didn't he win and instead leave another mess (one of many)?
2. As we can clearly see, "any idiot can start a war". Once our nations prestige is put on the line, its not as easy to get out (no plan, no brain) - thanks "w"!
3. The Bush doctrine - we are living that now. Democracy for all! How is that working out?
4. Ink stained fingers in Iraq! Woopteedo! Does anyone feel now that they have their democracy(Middle Eastern style) that this going to work out? I sure hope so!
5. To all you idiots that say we aren't conducting these wars like we did in Germany and Japan. Duh, no @!$%#e, Sheila! That's because we were at war not only with their governments and armies but also with their citizens. That's not we have or had with Afghanistan and Iraq. We invaded to remove their governments and their armies but we were not at war with their citizens, only their terrorist. Understand nitwits!

So much ignorance my fellow Americans. But I don't necessarily blame you entirely, I blame our education system, and the political party party-line bullsht.

Do any of you understand world history? Or even KNOW world history? Do any of you understand HOW the Taliban came to be? Or just how intertwined all of this mess is? I can explain it for you having served 9 tours in the Middle East.

We need to go back to the 60s and the Shah of Iran, who was pro-west. Iran and the US were buddies back then. But the problem with the Shah was he was a bit of an extremist. A real tyrrant. We supported Iran and the pro-western ideals they held. It wasn't until the Iranian Revolution that things started to unravel. During the uprising in Iran, the shah had 2 choices to make, either quell the rebellion with force or step down and go into exile. He chose to go into exile. However, this wasn't good enough. The new Ayatolla wanted the Shah to face trial and execution back in Iran. The Shah came to the US for medical treatment and was granted Assylum by Jimminy "Peanut Farmer" Carter. As a result, the Iranians stormed the US Embassy, taking hostages and starting a standoff that lasted 444 days. There was a botched rescue attempt in which choppers couldn't operate in the sand swept lands of Iran, suffering mechanical problems and the special ops troops sent there for the rescue had to withdrawl.

Let's not forget, during this time we were engaged in something called the Cold War with Russia, a remnant from WW2 and the conquering of Germany. Russia invades Afghanistan, using commandos from "commercial" aircraft. As a result, the United States supports the Mujahadeen, sending money, weapons, and supplies to the "freedom fighters led by Osama Bin Laden" through Pakistan and the ISI (the Pakistani Intelligence Service). The proxy US/Russian War results in the Russian Speedy Withdrawl from Afghanistan creating a power vacuum. This power vacuum people is what caused an internal turf war between various tribes and provences inside Afghanistan (better known as WARLORDING). As a result, the Taliban (an alliance of various warlords) comes into power and begins the new age of Afghanistan. Following the retreat of the Russians, the US cuts the money, weapons, and other "covert" support to the Mujahadeen, leaving what will become Al Qada high and dry.

When Ronald Reagan was elected, the hostages were released from the Embassy in Iran. But make no mistake, we were still beyond pissed about the whole affair. Iraq begins an invasion/war with Iran under Saddam Hussein. This is our opportunity to provide a little payback to the Iranians, and we support IRAQ with money, chemical munitions, technical advisors, and yes, technology to wage our Proxy War with Iran. Now, after the Iran Iraq war, Saddam Hussein turns his eyes to Kuwait, another PRO WESTERN country. The United States chooses to free (liberate) Kuwait. And thus begins Operation Desert Shield, Desert Storm.

Flash forward now to the current state of affairs. Pakistan has NEVER cut ties with the Haqqani Network, the same group we funneled material support through for our Proxy war with Russia. But, we now have 2 key players in the Middle East that we have "betrayed" in their eyes. One of those key players (Iraq) benefitted from chemical weapons technology via, Uncle Sugar. Thus the WMD program.

The current state of Afghanistan, should we leave TODAY as many of you advocate, would be a repeat of the Soviet power vaccum. Unlike the Soviet Union, we are not leaving without having a semblence of an operational government in place. We are NOT going to abandon tuck tailed like the Russians did, which in turn would and could possibly create another creation of another "rogue element" type government. We "sort of" learned our lesson in regards to just "walking away" like we did with the Mujahadeen, and providing the material support for unstable leaders like we did with The Shah, and Iraq.

Now, let's look at the Idiocy that comes out of our current administration. And I can fully understand the FOOLS comment. Changing the "rules of engagement" to show "nice nice", is beyond assinine. Waiting until you are fired upon to engage the enemy is ludacrous. The military has 3 basic functions; wage war, kill people, and break sht. They are NOT proxy ambassadors, nor should they be. They are there for 1 reason and 1 reason only - to beat, defeat, and destroy the enemy. The assinine idiocy of "winning the hearts and minds" is a fool's errand. A lesson that apparently we HAVE NOT YET LEARNED. The green on blue attacks are really no different than what we had in Viet Nam. But we aren't smart enough to say, "look we are trying to help you people rebuild, BUT, we aren't going to turn our back on you either." Case in point, the Pannetta Visit to Camp Leatherneck, IN A COMBAT ZONE, where they made the Marines DISARM to attend the Rent A Crowd bullsht. YOU NEVER disarm combat troops in a combat zone. And if you read this story, you should surmise that our troops are NOT ALOUD TO CARRY LOADED GUNS in a COMBAT ZONE. That is a policy, driven by the UPPER ECHELONS, from the POTUS to the SECDEF, to the JCOS, to the JOC, and down to the local units. That is how these rules of engagement work. It comes from an inept, ignorant, and FOOLISH, Politician who has NO CLUE WHATSOEVER about the role of the US Military.

Personally I think if we had a SEC DEF that was worth a sht, instead of some Yes Man Lap Dog, and the Politicians would stop sticking their noses in Military Operations and creating assinine policies that hamstring our security efforts for OUR TROOPS, there would be a whole lot less of incidents like this. It is just my take as I am a disabled combat vet.

Bin Laden is dead. Accordingly, our mission in Afghanistan is complete and we should leave. However, it seems our idiot leaders have embarked on another mission of nation building and attempting to bring democracy to a country where it isn't wanted.

This can only end up with the Taliban once again being in control but this time they will be armed with the best ordinance our taxpayer dollars could supply.

What are some American lives when we're playing our political games, they reason? I think most will agree that our presence in this crap hole of a country was warranted only until Bin Laden was captured or killed. This one is all on Obama.

I thought their guns were already fully loaded. It's not like they're in Disneyland. Yet still the deaths will continue till we GTFO.

No Binkie, unfortunately they are NOT loaded. The rationale as stated during the debacle of the Pannetta Visit to Camp Leatherneck was, we want to show the Afghani's we trust them. There are a number of articles concerning this assinine "huggery feelery" stupidity coming from the white house that goes to show how INEPT this guy is.

For 1, in a combat zone, or any potential threat area, the US MILITARY is taught, trained, and engrained with doctrine NOT TO BE MORE THAN AN ARMS LENGTH AWAY FROM THEIR LOADED WEAPONS. Additionally, the Military is taught to DENY, DELAY, and DEFEND key terrain from an enemy seeking to capture and utilize this terrain against friendly forces. This means if you see "the bad guy" going toward things like hilltops, buildings, land features, etc that provides a terrain advantage in which to assault from, you are supposed to remove the threat (kill) the enemy - engage them with sufficient firepower that is to Deny, Delay, and Defend that territory.

Under the inept, big earred buffoon, our soldiers are NOT allowed to actively engage the enemy UNTIL they are fired on. Thus if you see 10 insurgents moving with Machine Guns, Grenade Launchers etc into a building that provides them cover, concealment, and a fortification from which to fire on friendlies, OUR TROOPS ARE NOT, I repeat ARE NOT allowed to engage. Now how assinine is that. They can not actively open fire until they are fired upon. But the Dooflickit in DC doesn't get the fact that by then, it is too late. So now, not only are you sitting ducks, you loose time by now having to LOAD your weapon UNDER FIRE, before being able to defend yourself.

And considering how our warriors are NOT prior to today allowed to have loaded weapons IN THE COMBAT ZONE, it is no wonder why we have seen the spike in the green on blue fatalities thanks to some failed MORON's policy on military personnel security. Perhaps if Dumbo took time away from his golf game, strapped on a pair of boots and went on a patrol in Afghanistan and had to follow his assinine engagement policy, he would realize how damned foolish it is. But that won't happen. Certainly can't have the commander in chief commanding troops from the front line now can we. Instead they hang out in the rear, sucking down caviar, back slapping each other during their $25k a plate campaign fund raising dinners and spewing how they feel the pain of the country. Funny thing is, and what these other corrupt POSs don't get, is that $25k is a year's salary for most of the people they are supposed to represent, and almost 2 yrs worth of salary for many of the guys that are on the front lines, dying as a result of their stupidity...

Will,

I don't know where this information comes from, but having been stationed in Afghanistan (Bagram AF) for many months, I can tell you personally that all military personnel carry loaded firearms at all times while in theater. You can't even get into the chow hall without your (loaded) firearm. This is nothing new. As you point out, it is basic military doctrine. Also, perimeter breaches are met with armed response, I can assure you. A warning may be issued, but lethal force is quickly employed. They don't f- around.

Will the Watcher - Was it a brain wound? Sure sounds partisan on your part and bitter and kind of whiny and hauty and condecending. You know Jimminy and Dumbo? You explained the part after Carter very well. Chemical weapons provided by Ron (the living vegetable) Raygun and Bushelhead I (both dunderheads and inept). Bushelhead II and Dirt Cheney weren't they just marvelous and masterful and liars extraordinaire! Just wanted to point that out, you armchair bloviator! I served in Viet Nam pal and that war also produced lots of wounded soldiers. Thanks for sharing!

Could of, would of, should of, will get you every time. We never learn from history whether it is old or recent. Common sense tells us that occupation is never successful in Islamic nations. They're your best friend one day and executioner the next. But most of all, Afghanistan is infamous for going turncoat on their benefactors/occupiers, just ask the Russians and British who ran out of there.

Their loyalty is to them and them only. They are opportunist and parasites at best and murders at worst. I would never trust these people in my presence because of that simple fact. Yet, the U.S. and NATO commanders' gave that trust, whether willingly or begrudgingly to these animals, at the risk to those men and women whose lives they were entrusted with. To say the consequences were deadly is the understatement of the century.

I remember when they were teaching the women how to read and write. How they bragged and boasted that this was history in the making against a tradition that forbids such learning to women for over a thousand years. My gut instinct told me that this was not going to last; they will be back and you will pay dearly for violating their caveman laws. All we did was teach them how to get killed by the Taliban for learning.

We are damned anyway you look at it. If we leave, Al Quida will be back in full force and plotting more attacks on us. If we stay, someone's mother, father, brother, sister, cousin, aunt, uncle or friend will continue to come home in a body bag, sooner or later, and for what? For first thought, son of a beech! We're screwed no matter how you look at it.

Let's not forget that we are in Afghanistan to prevent another 9/11. We need to fight the war there, so we do not have to do it in your streets. Support the troops, CIA, FBI in getting all those religious fanatics. Most of the fanatics where brought up to be hater of you, and they are trained to kill you, so do not buried your head in the sand. Think carefully prior to calling it quit. Not all Muslims are fanatics, but those that are need to be neutralize by our government, before they kill you and your family.

Will,

I don't know where this information comes from, but having been stationed in Afghanistan (Bagram AF) for many months, I can tell you personally that all military personnel carry loaded firearms at all times while in theater.

Thank-you, critical citizen, for that rejoinder. Will's somewhat meandering posts seem to mix fact with fantasy, and demonstrate that it is not enough to know history; one must also understand it.

Agreed. Wish it were that simple.

Send the bill to UNOCAL.

That cat box isn't worth one more American death. It never was. Bomb any Taliban strongholds and leave. Anytime we become aware of a Taliban group, more missiles and drones. But time for the soldiers to come home. NOW.

Totally agree.

VirginiaDemocrat78...."Agreed. Wish it were that simple."

It is that simple....Round-the-clock C-130 transport flights....move hardware to Israel, they're gonna need it, anything that can't be moved , destroy in place, all the while flying our troops the hell out of there as each unit moves or blows up its "stuff"....Protect the US from inside the US.

Agreed. Wish it were that simple.

Obama is Commander in Chief, is he not? He can sign an executive order to withdraw ALL of our troops out of that cesspool IMMEDIATELY, if he wanted to.

Doesn't get much simpler than that.

Obama is Commander in Chief, is he not?

President Obama has ordered the U.S. military to withdraw 10,000 troops from Afghanistan by the end of the year and pull out another 23,000 by the summer of 2012, part of what he called "the beginning, but not the end, of our effort to wind down this war."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-obama-orders-start-us-troop-withdrawal-afghanistan/story?id=13908291#.UC4qobqwWEY

No, it ISN'T that simple and it's not solely a US decision, it's an operation with NATO. You don't think there are agreements in place? Strategic plans in place. They ARE working toward getting out.

They aren't in a position to just bail and leave our allies who are training Afghans and providing equipment, troops, support. Though it would be nice if it WERE that simple. No one wants to see this drag on and most with any sense didn't want it to begin in the first damn place. But Congress was already bought during the last president's term...oil contracts are signed and now they have to keep the Taliban OUT of Afghanistan so that they aren't insurging themselves and interrupting our prescious oil supply.

How many of you were at Afghanistan after we abandoned our US Ally the 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen after Operation Cyclone.

After the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban with the full support of the USSR Backed Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic or Iran massacred 20,000 to 50,000 of our US Ally 1980s Pro US Afghan Muhajeen. Then they massacred any Collaborators to the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers. Then the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban started to destroy anything that was "Non Islamic", "Modern", "Western" of the 20th Century Afghanistan as built up by the US from the 1950s to 1979.

The trees at the Afghan Cities were full of Afghans that were beaten then hung by the neck, it was illegal to cut the rotting bodies down from the trees; that was about the time we (US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces attached to the CIA's SAD/SOG as previous participants of Operation Cyclone) exfiltrated into Pakistan (rotated to US Ally Iraq just before the end of the Iran Iraq Wars; and eventually returned back to US Military Installations at Germany to the so called "Peacetime" US Military).

Mrs C.-464296....(#2.8)..."No, it ISN'T that simple and it's not solely a US decision, it's an operation with NATO."

Without the United States Military, Munitions, and Money....NATO ceases to exist. Only Great Britain would be able to stand on its own Military capabilities...We remain committed to NATO just for the bases we maintain in Europe....and we are paying through the nose for them....Why, you may ask ???

Because Putin may have taken off his KGB uniform for a Business Suit, but he never "left" the KGB...Now that he has become "President " again, he will start to flex Soviet muscle and influence (ie--Syria and Iran)....Putin's Presidency's will continue like this for the foreseeable future...Two terms ON, one term with a Placeholder, then Two more terms ON....Anyone that thinks the Soviet Union is defunct is just kidding themselves.

Mike, for once I agree with something you said. Up to the part about aiding Israel anyway and detroying the place. Every army that has found itself in Afghanistan since the time of Alexander ( and maybe before) has found the area not to be worth the effort and many times it was at the expense of a great many lives. It is also worth mentioning that Islam had not yet been invented for a few of those ill-considered invasions.

Hummmmmmmmmmm ... Some need to get your stories straight ....

The Taliban didn't even come into existence until at the earliest 1991 ... And started as a de facto police force for excellent reasons ... read the historical evidence before you mistake the facts ..

As ugy as it is we just can't bail...thats what the french do, we are a couple notch's above them...We just have to have rules of engagement changed, no more ASSuming they are friendlies, handle everyone as an enemy, it doesn't go far for detente' but it will be a ittle safer...I read this crap about making local police forces and nationa police forces...duh...read a little military history boys, we tried that in vietnam, i worked TRYING to train local boys and farmers to be a militia type force...I was numba 10, and dinky dow for thinking that would work....we ended up shooting half of what we trained when vc turned them in tet offensive....crazy that we don't have any brass that remember that....

Hello ; Jeff-1592116

Obama is Commander in Chief, is he not?

President Obama has ordered the U.S. military to withdraw 10,000 troops from Afghanistan by the end of the year and pull out another 23,000 by the summer of 2012, part of what he called "the beginning, but not the end, of our effort to wind down this war."

__________________________________________________________

Barack Obama Promise to End War

"I will promise you this, that if we have not gotten our troops out by the
time I am president, it is the first thing I will do. I will get our troops home.We will bring an end to this war. You can take that to the bank. "

- Barack Obama Campaign Promise - October 27, 2007

_____________________________________________________

Really !?! What bank would that be Barack???????

Obama won the Nobel Peace Prize and turned around and doubled troop strength in Afghanistan.

Obama is a liar and this is blood on his hands.

Past time to stop loosing precious lives FOR NOTHING and end this ignorant war funded with borrowed money .

Thomas Blue - It never was. Bomb any Taliban strongholds and leave.

There you go, repeat the same mistakes and expect a different result. The USSR 40th Army with more aircraft, bombs, armored and mechanized divisions, use of chemical weapons, etc. during their "Total Conventional War" failed. As Asymmetric Warfare Historically Defeats Conventional Warfare.

Thomas Blue - Anytime we become aware of a Taliban group, more missiles and drones.

As stated by someone with NO Experience. The missiles, MQs (armed Drones), Airstrikes, etc. require "Boots on the Ground" for Targeting and Target Damage Assessments (one of our missions while at the Northeastern areas of Afghanistan a few weeks ago).

Thomas Blue - But time for the soldiers to come home. NOW.

And be thrown on Unemployment, as to what is currently happening to the 90,000 US Military Personnel being RIF'ed (Reduction In Force) as Ordered by President Obama as Commander In Chief.

As President Obama's Policy, "US Military will not be used to secure US Borders", as stated April 2009 to Mexican President and August 2009 to Canadian Prime Minister.

Mike in Delray - Only Great Britain would be able to stand on its own Military capabilities...

Nope. During Libya, (not so Great) Great Britain ran out of bombs, and had to rely on US Military (USAF) Refueling Aircraft (and US Fuel).

Mike in Delray - It is that simple....Round-the-clock C-130 transport flights

How many Cargo C-130s do you think the USAF has, do you know the cargo capacity (your post indicates you have no idea). After the "Cold War" President Clinton as Commander In Chief Ordered his Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces (RIF) of the US Military, at this time the USAF downgraded their previous USAF Airlift Capabilities of the USAF Military Airlift Command (MAC), later renamed to AMC; this involved the elimination of the majority of the USAF Airlift Capabilities starting with the C-141 "Starlifters". This required the USAF to the Contract Expensive US Civilian Commerical Airlines (what is done now to move US Military Personnel). Because the USAF no longer has the previous "Cold War" Era Airlift Capabilites due to President Clinton's Ordered US Military Defense Budget Cuts, as previously the USAF was required to be able to transport equipment (armor, mech, helicopters, etc.), weapons, ammunition, personnel, materials (food, water, repair parts, etc.), etc. to Europe from CONUS to augment the US European Military Forces in the event of a USSR and Warsaw Pact Attack; so now most of the US Military Equipment must be transported by Surface Vessels (US Civilian Cargo Ships), as to why Pakistan is so important to supplying landlocked Afghanistan.

"Mike" why is it always about Israel? Are you one of those "end-timer buy bull thumpers" praying for the end?

CLOSE THE FED. Obviously you are not a supporter of our elected commander in chief. It's okay because our country is great because everyone gets an opinion. Just remember, however, the republicans begged for troop surges and criticized the presidents draw down and the General in charge also begged for a surge. This was all lead by John McCain. Promises can only be kept if there is support from congress and military leaders otherwise adjustments must be made. It is easy for you to Monday morning quarterback because you have never had the job of president, so for many it seems easy. I see so many expert military strategist, expert economist, expert foreign diplomats and experts on the country at large. All of the people who call the president names and say he is such a failure and they could do a better job, my question is why are you bagging groceries, washing cars, cleaning toilets, sitting at a cubicle shuffling papers, is you are so smart? It's easy to criticize the chef when you don't even know what a fork is.

karl-917535 - Just remember, however, the republicans begged for troop surges and criticized the presidents draw down and the General in charge also begged for a surge.

Wrong, General McKiernan asked for a US Military Surge to accomplish his (General McKiernan War Plan to Win Afghanistan), and President Obama Refused and then Fired General McKiernan. Then President Obama took General McKiernan's War Plan and calls it the Obama War Plan to Win Afghanistan. Due to the Fact that President Obama has NO US Military Experience he does not realize that without General McKiernan's Commander's Intent (not written in General McKiernan's War Plan), General McKiernan as taken by President Obama as Obama's War Plan to Win Afghanistan is worthless.

After President Obama nominating his Democrat General McChrystal (US Army Special Forces) to Command Afghanistan, General McChrystal requests more US Military Asymmetric Warfare Forces (aka Special Warfare) and President Obama as Commander In Chief refuses, and during video conferences basically tells General McChrystal to shut up (in front of all his subordinates).

So sure, karl-917535, blame President Obama's incompetence (cannot listen to his own US Military experts that he appointed) on the Repugnants.

You want me to also tell you about why President Obama had to make a special deal with General Petraeus and the then Director of the CIA Leon Penetta. Why regardless of President Obama's numerous requests to remain Secretary of Defense, Secretary of Defense Gates tendered his Letter of Resignation.

Bottomline RESULTS of President Obama's Actions (or Inactions): More Unnecessary Deaths of US Military Personnel. Asymmetric War is NOT static, doing things in a timely manner (making decisions) means the difference between life or death.

mike christain ...(#2.16)..'"Mike" why is it always about Israel?"

Say What ??.....This is the first time in a long time I even mentioned Israel....go look at my Newsvine page.....

I said Israel because :

A.) They are our only real Ally in the region

B.) They are consantly, increasingly being threatened ( now by the Muslim Brotherhood running Egypt"

C.) We sell them Military Hardware

D.) It's cheaper to transport it there than bring it home. ( I don't know how old you are but I remember the Fall of Saigon, when every helicopter that brought the remaining troops and the refugees from the U.S.Embassy landed on an aircraft carrier, sailors pushed the helicopters overboard into the sea. There was no room for them.)

E.) That 2 faced stab us in the back Hamid Karsai doesn't even deserve a field toilet left behind intact.

Who is the pathetic idiotic CO that make that stupid dumb rule? Is probably at Karzay's insistence that US and NATO troops must unload their weapon and coward Afghans can only the ones to have loaded guns anywhere. Have yet to hear inept, corrupt Karzay open his a.s.s, doubt very much he will unless his own people get killed.

Very creative! I can see it! It's "Green" too! Nuclear & solar!

Sure the Chinese and Russian Federation are not going to get involved if you do that.

The Chinese using the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran pressured the US Ally Afghan Government into negotiating the High Tech Mineral Rights of Afghanistan with the Chinese (China Metalurgical Group).

The Russian Federation and Chinese are currently using the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran as their "Proxy Fighter"; the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran is using the Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists as their "Proxy Fighters" as trained by their Iranian Special Forces, Quds, at the Fundamentalist Islamic Autonomous Kurdistanis Region of Northern Iraq.

It has been the longtime Strategic Goal of the USSR (now Russian Federation) and Chinese to get the US and US Allies out of their Backyards (Strategic Resources) of the Middle East, Asia, Africa, Eastern Europe, etc.. And now due to President Obama's March 2009 Foreign Policy they are doing exactly that (Defeat of US Allies Worldwide).

Jeff, noting says "conservative" like bigoted ignorance.

Advocating genocide, are we? Congratulations, you are literally as bad as the people killing our troops over there.

No, the time to get out was the day aftter we got bin Laden...period...there is NO more reason to be there

My proposal for all future wars is to put ALL politicians from the countries who want to fight in a cage and let them at it...why should we, the people suffer...it's the politicians who gain from wars

I agree, leave this cesspool of human waste and while we are at it, stop all aid to that part of the world, let them drown in their own waste

Jeff, the term "blue" refers to friendly forces - however, to allow your thoughts, it may be construed as "green". Usually, the term "red" forces are known to represent the enemy. In this case, the green may be used to represent the enemy, or wolf in sheep's clothing definition.

Who really cares about what colors they use for names. Petty jargon.

heroin is the reason somebody is a world supplier that needs US there we need to leave immediatly.after we leave the poppies will still be there.

You do KNOW that neither the Afghan people, NOR the Taliban attacked us on 9/11, don't you? Why would you say something sooooo incredibly stupid

Not just B-52's, B-2's and B-1's, cruise missles for at least a week.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" - George Santayana

Quite evident that you were not involved with Operation Cyclone. As the USSR 40th Army with more Aircraft, Bombs, Military Personnel, Armor, Mech, etc. as drawn from their over 101 Divisions at Eastern Europe conducted Total Conventional Warfare including Chemical Warfare, Carpet Bombing, leveling towns and massacring all the inhabitants, etc. only created more hatred (Fighters seeking Fundamentalist Islamic Revenge).

In this case currently you do that and you will have over 1.5 Billion Fundmentalist Islamic Believers Worldwide (including living at the US) as Fully Funded (Trillions USDs per year) thru Manditory Islamic Tithes seeking Fundamentalist Islamic Revenge (that does not go away for Centuries until the Revenge is done, as a Fundamentalist Islamic Death Penalty Fatawa).

Same sh!t happened during President Clinton's 1998 Operation Desert Fox, bombing and cruise missile attacks of the urban poor areas of Baghdad; resulting in the Islamic Nations Hatred of the US and US Allies, as the Fundamentalist Islamic Nations started to name the US "the Great Satan" and further reinforcing Osama Bin Laden's justifications for the creation of his Fundamentalist Islamic Anti US and Anti US Ally Saudi Arabian Government Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadist Worldwide Franchise of Al Quada.

Keep on thinking Conventional Warfare Strategic Goals, Strategies and Tactics and you will automatically lose due to the Asymmetric Warfare Strategic Goals.

In Kabul there are the most supporters for the USA in Afghanistan. The rest of that country, not so much. So bombing Kabul would be seriously very idiotic.

Secondly, a bomb, hellfire, or even assaults are very costly. Afghans have nothing of worth. They couldnt care less.

To.David """ a

Ahh no..."the Great Satan" goes back to Operation Ajax in 1953 .. and hw bush leaving US troops in the muslim holy land in 91 ...and we won't even talk about reaguns dealing with the Iranian mullahs in the 80 '

dothejit - But we can not change two thousand years of a culture in ten years.

Afghanistan was built up as a "Little America" of the 20th Century by the US from the 1950s till 1979.

My heart goes out to the military and their families, BUT please don't lay that nonsense on me...they did NOT protect this country OR me from anything...the Afghanis are incapable of threatening us...in any way

Excuse me...

Hey Atarax, what exactly does that mean?

I think he means how many American lives have been uselessly spent on that part of the world. And how many more our politicians are willing to spend for the insanity of being there.

well said zapper!!! this reminds me of vietnam you can look it up every american solder was out of vietnam in five days i was there and seen it happen, our men and women are dieing for nothing!!! mean while back home two dumb @ $$'s who have spent over $500 million dollars to try and be the next president of the United States and i won't vote for either one a sad day for all Americans! My God when will all of this Madness end ??????

2097 is close to the amount of troops we have lost and the 87903 is close to the amount of troops we have there..................

atarax is a hethen scum troll and has nothing to add to any article except hate and discontent of all Americans. Mark his comments, NO VALUE!

This really works for the right doesn't it. I bet the GOP is doing a happy dance when these stories become news. Your facts are messed up, but that doesn't matter. You don't know WHAT was arranged diplomatically or strategically and you don't even acknowledge that over 100K HAVE been brought home since this president's been involved.

Mrs C.-464296,

Results matter not empty Political Words.

Example (Think about this): President Obama's August 2009 Rules of Engagement as, "Cannot shoot until shot". You shoot first, then you will have the hundreds of Lawyers sent here by President Obama prosecuting you while you are detained at the Bagram AFB Detention Facility. This is why the Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists shoot at you with the biggest weapons first so that you are dead and cannot return fires.

Then there is also President Obama's "Rule of Law", as must prove "Beyond a Reasonable Doubt" that it was that particular individual Islamic Jihadist and not another that shot at you (Gun shot residue tests, DNA, etc.) or you cannot do anything after they throw their weapon away after shooting at you (cannot even detain them and must release them).

Those are RESULTS (unnecessary Deaths of US Military). I have seen and experienced the differences (Bush Policies, Obama Policies) from being at Afghanistan since 2001 until a few weeks ago.

The Republicscum party does want them out of there. They want them available in case Romney-the draft dodger- gets elected, so they'll be able to fight in the wars that HE has planned. Why do you think his JEW Adelson went with him to Isreal, and donated his $100 million dollars to Romneys campaign? Because Romney promised him we would attack Iran for them. Romney will be worse than Bush EVER was. Of course HE wouldn't fight for HIS country that he SUPPOSEDLY loves, but HE WILL send your sons and daughters to die, just not HIS.

People, People this isn't about partisan politics or that the president hates Americans, that is extremist views. The reason we went over there in the 1st place is because they came over here and blew up 2 buildings in NYC and the Pentagon. We may be over there and some of our sons and daughters have gotten killed unfortunately, but there have been no major attacks on US soil by the Taliban. The only attacks here are by crazed American citizens shooting up movie theaters and schools. So we can attack each other and our elected officials but then the Taliban wins. What makes us great is we are the UNITED States of America....UNITED. I don't agree with some of the views of people commenting, but do I think they hate America? of course not, we just have different views.. and that's okay.

David,

My daughter was stationed at Bahgram and I hear much the same from her. Politicians calling the shots rather than the commanders with military experience. Hamstring the troops while granting rights to illegal enemy combatants. Our politicians have no clue what it takes to achieve victory.

Thank you for your service; and also for your insight .

That's not exactly true and no one in military or gov't is going to lay out the whole strategic or tactical plan to the public.

Phillynona - The goal of Afganistan was to find Osama Bin Laden.

No it was NOT a Goal until after President Bush in 2006 Amended the US No Assassination Policy.

The Goals were: a. Overthrow the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government that provided Fundamentalist Islamic Sanctuary to Osama Bin Laden, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, and the Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadist Training Camps., b. Reestablish the previous form of Democracy as US Ally Afghanistan previously had from the 1950s to 1979., c. UN Mission, Nation Building.

I was involved with this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arxKhJIjIiY. Teams linked up with the Northern Alliance, our Teams went into the Afghan Cities to fight the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government's Militias (Army), after overthrowing the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government those of us that survived the intense urban fighting chased the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada and Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadist to the Southern Old Silk Road and were exterminating them with extreme prejudice (for the 9/11 2001 Attacks) as they were fleeing to Northern Iraq given Fundamentalist Islamic Sanctuary by the Fundamentalist Islamic Kurdistanis of PKK, HPG, KGK. The US Politicians ordered us to stop chasing them as not to violate the Soverign Nations of Tajikistan, Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran, Islamic Nation of Iraq.

To allow us to finish the job (elimination of the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists, etc. that escaped us at Afghanistan) President Bush (43) pushes for US Law, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution so that we can conduct 2002-2003 Operation Hotel California. During this pause, the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists from Afghanistan rearmed, regrouped, got stronger (augmented by Fundamentalist Islamic Jihadists from other Nations like Hama Foreign Fighters, Libyan Islamic Fighting Group, Al Quada Syria, AQIM, AQAP, etc.) and became Fundamentalist Islamic Ansar Al Islam with the full support of the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran.

In 2002 we went into Northern Iraq augmented by the US Army 10th Special Forces Group due to our previous attritions that almost made us non mission capable. We then linked up with the Non Fundamentalist Islamic Kurdistanis "Pesh" that hated the Fundamentalist Islamic Kurdistanis PKK, HPG, KGK; and then the intensive fighting began as our Asymmetric Warfare Skills versus their Fundamentalist Islamic Asymmetric Warfare Skills as trained by the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran's Special Forces, Quds.

Just before Ansar Al Islam was defeated by us and the Kurdistanis Pesh, the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran granted the Fundamentalist Islamic Ansar Al Islam Fundamentalist Islamic Sanctuary. So they escaped us again and later many returned back to Afghanistan and the Northwestern Region of Pakistan (not controlled by US Ally Pakistanis Military).

After the above to accomplish President Clinton's US Law, H.R. "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998", justification Section 2 "Findings" Weapons of Mass Destruction; we attack and seize the Iraqis Chemical Weapons Facility at Sargat. Then seize and secure the Northern Iraqis Oil Fields with the Pro US Kurdistanis Pesh. To create an Operational Feint, to make the Iraqis Military and Govenment believe that the main US Military Liberation Forces (US Law, Declared War, 2002 Iraqi War Resolution) would come thru US Ally Turkey we attacked the Iraqis Armored and Mechanized Divisons deployed North of Baghdad, destroying Five (5) Iraqis Full Strength Divisions, causing the Iraqis Military Command to redeploy the majority of their Iraqis Military Forces North of Baghdad away from the Main US Military Liberation Forces that would come from US Allies Kuwait and Saudi Arabia in 2003.

In 2004 those of us that survived the above, are given time to rest, assess new team members, retrain the teams with the new team members before being redeployed back to Afghanistan to conduct US Military Asymmetric Mountain (above 6.000 feet) Warfare.

Agree. Wrote years ago and a few times since: we need to get out. They hate us because we've dropped bombs on weddings a few times and killed numbers of people celebrating a couple trying to start a life together. One of our sargeants wen't crazy last year and shot a dozen children in their beds. Our officers then insult the village leaders by showing up with a suitcase full of cash and offer it to them in exchange for the mistakes. Our leaders align themselves with the Karzai brothers, one a currupt politician, the other a narco trafficker. But above all, we need to get out because these people have been killing each other, family v family, village v village, clan v clan, sect v sect since prehistory. The only time they ever had an absence of violence (not peace, mind you) is when a strongman gained the upper hand and suppressed the others for a time. They even kill members of their own family for such things as "looking" at someone from a group they hate. Hate is what they do. Got no time to dig wells or latrines - let the yankees do that. Got no time to build a school or roads or hospitals - let the yankees do that. Got plenty of time to get a gun and shoot they guy from the next village for herding some goats a little too far down the valley. We need to get out because these folks are not worth the thousands of killed and wounded Americans or the trillion dollars we wasted there.

Amen Brother. Just pull all Americans in Afghanistan back and line up those high altitude bombers to blast Afghanistan back into the stone age.