there will be a war. Israel will NEVER let Iran become nuclear. And thats a fact. I just hope they do it on their own for the most part and let us just give a little help if necesarry. We are fighting enough people and this one will be closer to having countries like China and Russia not entering but trying to blame the US. It will be messy. But Israel needs to do the heavy lifting. they are our ally. We equiped them. Sold them the weapons, and will continue to. But they have had to sit all our wars out for the same reasons I hope if they do it they somehow manage to doit quick and maybe have a coup in iran happen where the younger generation wants change. But they are delusional in thinking it will only last a month and they acn do it with less then 500-1000 casualties from Israel

freemannogog

You have it backwards, Israel has only ever goe after military and terrorist targets in the Palestine region, you forget that Arafat, the creator of the PLO blew up many planes in the in the 70, this was his MO and this is still the theme of the Palestinian government. They still missile schools and target civilians, the only reason Israel built a wall built to keep them out was to stop the weekly suicide bombers occurring in the open markets. This plan worked so now Palestine has resorted to missiles, all Israel has ever done done is defend itself and they will to the end.

Zionist regime is NOT Israel. Ahmedinejad is making a distinction between the regime (the government) and the people. But the western media takes words and changes it's meaning. Ahmedinejad is saying the regime must go. He is not saying Jews must die or anything like that. An Israeli government that respects human rights will be fine. But the Zionist regime regularly violates human rights and disobeys UN resoulutions with the protection it gets from the United States. The Zionist regime is a dark part of our history. Why do we support them? Because they own us. Yes, you have owners. You are owned people.

To understand why Iran has a problem with Israel is easy . Israels claim to its homeland is in the Bible and sees it as a right . Problem is Israel only has about 10% of what God promised .

So for its neighbours that is a threat of attack as God promised the jews everything from Suez to Tehran and north to Turkey. And just about every Israeli leader from 48 forward has promised the Jews that they will have what God has promised .

And with Israel have 200+ plus nukes and openly stating the are going to attack

seemssoobvious

Except for the fact that modern Israel is content to wait for God to deliver it to them. They have never just up and invaded any country out of the purpose taking land. But when Egypt planned on "Pushing" Israel into the Sea" in a coordinated attack against Israel, they defended themselves and drove back the invaders taking land at that point, that's where it ended. In 2 major offenses against Israel since the 60s, Egypt even stated God must have been on Israel's side as the battle very decisive and Israels military was much smaller than its enemies.

Seems to me that Iran is trying to provoke an attack. That way they can claim their weapons are justified for self-defense. The question is, will we take the bait.

i think the entire middle east has to learn a way to get moderate. This goes for Iran as well as Israel.

This mini clone of Hitler and the clones of the ss nazi storm troopers of the rev guard and the pervertede clerics of the perverted Islamic revolution in Iran will meet the same fate as the nazis.Dead in their bunkers and their islamic revolution finished off just as the nazi revolution was-They are of the same cloth and will meet the same fate..But it will take much less time to finsh offf the beasts in Iran.This monster regime in Iran will bring huge destruction to their country but they will be finished offf quickly!

@Rick,

What ever happened to the old saying "sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me"? Come on Iran

Didn't Hitler annunciate alot of "sticks and stones" during the 1930's?

Some people learned alot from the past so as to try not to repeat it!

Iran is not Nazi Germany, a country whose military at the time was second to none. Iran doesn't have the missiles, planes or navy that Germany possessed, so the comparison is patently stupid. Iran has not attacked another country in more than 100 years, unlike Israel.

Israel is much more like Nazi Germany, in that Israel wants to start more wars in order to expand its land and water holdings. Israel has invaded and occupied Lebanon and attacked all of it's neighbors at one time or another. Zionists were responcible for planning and selling the Iraq war.

Here are some quotes from Israeli leaders regarding the 1967 war, which plainly show Israel was the aggressor and knewe Egypt posed no threat.

“The former Commander of the Air
Force, General Ezer Weitzman, regarded as a hawk, stated that there was ‘no
threat of destruction’ but that the attack on Egypt, Jordan and Syria was
nevertheless justified so that Israel could ‘exist according the scale, spirit,
and quality she now embodies.’...Menahem Begin had the following remarks to
make: ‘In June 1967, we again had a choice. The Egyptian Army concentrations in the Sinai approaches do not prove that Nasser was really about to attack us. We must be honest with ourselves. We decided to attack him.’“ Noam Chomsky,
“The Fateful Triangle.”

Was
the 1967 war defensive? — continued

“I do not think Nasser wanted war.
The two divisions he sent to The Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it.” Yitzhak Rabin, Israel’s Chief of Staff in 1967, in Le Monde, 2/28/68

Moshe Dayan posthumously speaks out on the Golan Heights

“Moshe Dayan, the celebrated
commander who, as Defense Minister in 1967, gave the order to conquer the
Golan...[said] many of the firefights with the Syrians were deliberately
provoked by Israel, and the kibbutz residents who pressed the Government to
take the Golan Heights did so less for security than for the farmland...[Dayan
stated] ‘They didn’t even try to hide their greed for the land...We would send
a tractor to plow some area where it wasn’t possible to do anything, in the demilitarized
area, and knew in advance that the Syrians would start to shoot. If they didn’t
shoot, we would tell the tractor to advance further, until in the end the
Syrians would get annoyed and shoot.

And then we would use artillery and
later the air force also, and that’s how it was...The Syrians, on the fourth
day of the war, were not a threat to us.’” The New York Times, May 11, 1997

The
history of Israeli expansionism

“The acceptance of partition does
not commit us to renounce Transjordan; one does not demand from anybody to give up his vision. We shall accept a state in the boundaries fixed today. But the
boundaries of Zionist aspirations are the concern of the Jewish people and no
external factor will be able to limit them.” David Ben-Gurion, in 1936,
quoted in Noam Chomsky, “The Fateful Triangle.”

Hi Ralpf.

Israel is much more like Nazi Germany

No, it's not. (LOL)

The claim that the Jews, or Zionists, are the new Nazi's, is a common claim
found on inner-net chat rooms.

It's a slander and a false charge, by some, with a possible irrational antipathy toward Israel. Because the comparison does not relate with, or is not supported by any factual observations, and has no independent verification that's supported by reality.

Israel has not invaded any western European nation, has no African colonies,
operates no death camps.

Has not now, nor ever had a deal with Russia to divide Poland.

Has no power sharing treaties or agreements with totalitarian Asian nations

and is not aggressively sinking internationally registered Ships, steaming
across the North Atlantic conducting free trade.

Israel never participated in night bombing raids over London.

Has yet to invaded Russia, the Ukraine or any Baltic nations, has not annexed Norway as a Quisling state.

Has stolen no works of art from French Museums.

Israel does not murder homosexuals or Gypsies as state policy. So excuse me, if I do not view the comparison as anything more than an expression of hate, bigotry and intolerance.

Why does newsvine let you continually plagiarise those false quote you use all the time and never link to? That violates the CoH

Hi Ralphy boy!

Here's something else Rabin said:

"We view the permanent solution in the framework of State of Israel which will include most of the area of the Land of Israel as it was under the rule of the British Mandate, and alongside it a Palestinian entity which will be a home to most of the Palestinian residents living in the Gaza Strip and the West Bank.
We would like this to be an entity which is less than a state, and which will independently run the lives of the Palestinians under its authority. The borders of the State of Israel, during the permanent solution, will be beyond the lines which existed before the Six Day War. We will not return to the 4 June 1967 lines."

-Yitzhak Rabin Speech in Knesset, October 5, 1995

Hiya Ralphie boy!

Was the 1967 war defensive?

Well, let's hear it from Nasser and friends.

Here's a snippet:

"Our aim is the full restoration of the rights of the Palestinian people. In other words, we aim at the destruction of the State of Israel. The immediate aim: perfection of Arab military might. The national aim: the eradication of Israel." – President Nasser of Egypt, November 18, 1965

"Brothers, it is our duty to prepare for the final battle in Palestine." – Nasser, Palestine Day, 1967

"Our basic objective will be the destruction of Israel. The Arab people want to fight . . . The mining of Sharm el Sheikh is a confrontation with Israel. Adopting this measure obligates us to be ready to embark on a general war with Israel." – Nasser, May 27, 1967

"We will not accept any ... coexistence with Israel. ... Today the issue is not the establishment of peace between the Arab states and Israel .... The war with Israel is in effect since 1948." – Nasser, May 28, 1967

"The armies of Egypt, Jordan, Syria and Lebanon are poised on the borders of Israel . . . . to face the challenge, while standing behind us are the armies of Iraq, Algeria, Kuwait, Sudan and the whole Arab nation. This act will astound the world. Today they will know that the Arabs are arranged for battle, the critical hour has arrived. We have reached the stage of serious action and not declarations." – Nasser, May, 30, 1967 after signing a defense pact with Jordan's King Hussein

"We are now ready to confront Israel .... The issue now at hand is not the Gulf of Aqaba, the Straits of Tiran, or the withdrawal of UNEF, but the ... aggression which took place in Palestine ... with the collaboration of Britain and the United States." – Nasser, June 2, 1967

"Under terms of the military agreement signed with Jordan, Jordanian artillery co-ordinated with the forces of Egypt and Syria is in a position to cut Israel in two at Kalkilya, where Israeli territory between the Jordan armistice line and the Mediterranean Sea is only twelve kilometers wide ... ." – El Akhbar newspaper, Cairo, May 31, 1967

http://www.sixdaywar.org/content/threats.asp

As my teens would say, Ralphie got owned!

@kpr37

How do you explain this - how can you say that Israel is not killing Palestinian CHILDREN?

Coinciding with International Children's Day on 1 June, figures released by the Palestinian Ministry of Information show that 1,456 Palestinian children have been shot dead by Israelis since the Aqsa Uprising started in late 2000. The ministry pointed out that all Palestinian children are still subjected to constant abuse and attacks by Israeli occupation forces and illegal Jewish settlers across the occupied Palestinian territories. Dozens have been arrested by Israel in a campaign of harassment in the occupied West Bank.

Children in Palestine make up 52 per cent of the population. As well as almost 1,500 being killed since 2000, around 5,000 children have been injured and 215 are being held in Israeli prisons; 175 have been arrested since the beginning of 2012.

In 2010, around 1,000 Palestinian children aged between 15-17 were arrested by the Israeli occupation forces, 500 of them in occupied Jerusalem. Most of the charges brought revolved around accusations of "throwing stones" at illegal settlers' vehicles.

http://www.middleeastmonitor.com/news/middle-east/3817-1456-palestinian-children-shot-dead-by-israel-since-2000

Do you need proof? Pictures of dead Palestinian Children?

http://www.rohama.org/en/news/7085

What about the massacre that Israel tried to hide:

Between 27 December 2008 and 18 January 2009, the Israeli military carried out an attack on the Gaza Strip named Operation Cast Lead. The magnitude of the harm to the population was unprecedented: 1,385 Palestinians were killed, 762 of whom did not take part in the hostilities. Of these, 318 were minors under age 18. More than 5,300 Palestinians were wounded, of them over 350 seriously so.

The above is from an ISRAELI NEWS AGENCY

http://www.btselem.org/gaza_strip/20091227_a_year_to_castlead_operation

You want to talk about Iran instead?

If you look at Iran's history, you will find that it has NOT STARTED a war since 1804 - quite a feat for a Persian country surrounded by Arab countries (and all the US bases that we have in the ME).

When you have the ex-Chief of the Israeli Mossad openly stating that Netanyahu is "crazed" and only wants to war with Iran for personal reasons (and against the advice of Israeli Military Generals), you have to wonder why the US would even bother to consider getting into this "war-vendetta."

Iran's oil is thick crude, it is very expensive to refine, which is why Iran only refines 2% of its oil for use inside the country, and sells the rest as heavy crude. Nuclear power would be an asset to the country. Would they be able to manufacture the enriched uranium for a weapon, probably - but their problem is delivery. Even the International Atomic Energy Agency says that Iran does not have any missiles that could deliver a nuclear payload and they are years away from having that technology.

If Israel decides to to go nuclear on Iran they will be signing their own death sentence - not because Iran will strike back but because Iran has one of the largest fresh water reservoirs in the Middle East. Israel has virtually drained the once vast reservoir under Gaza (the Palestinians have been under water restrictions for years, while the Israeli's used what they wanted). The desalination plants are not enough - so Iran sells water to its neighbors, if that water becomes lethal - Israel will be poisoned by its own bomb.

So who looks crazier in the region - Iran -who as had many US-Israeli drone strikes to its nuclear power plants that they are trying to build and now suffers under the US and EU sanctions (Iran has not RETALIATED FOR THIS BARBARIC TREATMENT) OR - Israel - who beats a war drum for US Military Servicemen and Servicewomen to fight for them? I say the Israeli government looks crazier and the US should not get drawn into this - ever.

Black - Israel is more than capable of beating the hell out of Iran. Keep in mind though, IRAN has used chemical munitions (remember the Iran Iraq war) and is likely to do so again. Lest we forget, the rhetoric coming from Iran for eons about the complete and total destruction of Israel. That rhetoric mind you is not repeated by Israel, only that they WILL NOT ALLOW Iran to ever acquire the means to do so.

Iran's leadership has brought the suffering they are experiencing upon themselves. Even after liberating France twice, so we impose embargoes, sanctions, and the like whenever we have a disagreement with France, or Germany, or Japan, or any other country? No we do not, and it has nothing to do with oil or anything other than those countries behaving in a manner that is less than civilized. To have a country and a leadership calling for the extermination of a people is UNACCEPTABLE by ANYONE's STANDARDS. Maybe IF Iran wasn't so hell bent on genocide, other countries wouldn't so much care about "pursuing nuclear technology for peaceful purposes." But we know THEY can't be trusted, and their history shows they can't be trusted...

Rhetoric? Do you speak Farsi? Anything Iran says is misinterpreted to make the country look like an enemy - it's far easier to sell people on a war if you make Iran look like bomb zealots....

Rhetoric is NOT the same as starting a war. If someone calls me a name, I don't kill them, and I assume that you don't either - it's all sticks and stones. The Iran-Iraq war was not started by Iran, again, they haven't started a war since 1804, yet the US has been at war or pursuing a "police action" (polite way of saying - we're killing people) for all but 30 years of it's existence. (I cannot take credit for that research, another poster did, but if you want me to look it up, and give a link, I can)

Actually, Iraq used chemical weapons during the Iran-Iraq war - the UN could not verify that Iran used them.

http://www.iranchamber.com/history/articles/chemical_warfare_iran_iraq_war.php

For the sake of argument, Iraq's chemical weapons came from the US, that was when we were friends with Saddam Hussein (I'm old enough to remember), IF Iran used them, they would have gotten the chemical weapons from the (then) Soviets - the Iran-Iraq war was the bold print, the shadow war was between the US and the Soviets.

Assuming you don't speak Farsi or a Persian dialect, what about Israel saying that Iran NEVER said that it wanted to "wipe Israel off the map?"

In a reminder that Persian rhetoric is not always easy for English-speakers to interpret, a senior Israeli official has acknowledged that Iran’s president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, never actually said that Israel “must be wiped off the map.”

Link below to the New York Times article:

http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/17/israeli-minister-agrees-ahmadinejad-never-said-israel-must-be-wiped-off-the-map/

Exactly how has Iran behaved badly? They invited the International Atomic Energy Agency to Iran over 3 times this year already...how many more times do they have to do that? Have they started a war in 200 years? NO! Has the US used drone to strike Iran this year? YES - did Iran strike back - NO

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/global/2011/12/fallen-us-drone-nearly-led-covert-strike-iran/45857/

The United States' use of cyberweapons against Iran threatens to undermine the critical and sensitive ongoing negotiations over Iran's nuclear program. Building trust is a significant component of these negotiations, and the use of cyberweapons may break down that trust and leave us vulnerable to similar attacks.

Our increasing reliance on cyberweapons and unmanned drones should concern Congress. Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution makes clear that only Congress has the power to declare war. No administration should be permitted to assert high-tech exceptions to the U.S. Constitution.

Link: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rep-dennis-kucinich/cyberweapons-iran_b_1574901.html

Now Iran suffers under sanctions? Are Americans suffering over ANYTHING that Iran has done - NO.... so the bullying award goes to the US & Israel!

Iranian government sure gets mistranslated a lot. This argument gets repeated about a new remark every month or so.

No, Iran is not using drone attacks, they just have Hamas and Hezbollah do suicide bombings on their behalf.

No, they have not been starting wars, they had others do it for them.

As for the inspectors, they only need to do it ones, but make it believable, and so far they haven't.

Although, got to love it when some try to paint Iranian government as helpless little lambs.

Boy do Khomeini and Ahmadinejad look harmless.

Exactly how has Iran behaved badly?

Iran sends freighters laden with arms to terror groups.

Iran manufactures the IEDs that blow up American soldiers.

Iran sponsors state terrorism.

Iran is building nukes to obliterate Israel.

Too little, too late. The U.N. is a complete waste of time and should be dissolved.

That is definitely one point that we can agree on. ☺

The UN is and always was a joke. What part of getting your rear kicked does the Palestinians / Muslims not understand? When you lose a war you don't get to set ANY terms or any conditions. I'm sick to death over this Islamic rhetoric about how great the middle east is. They are pathetic barbarians, who are their scourge of this planet. Their mostly third world for a reason. Keep half your population, females, in degradation and bondage and you see what you get, third world status. They live in indoctrination, with their rears in the air 5 times a day, 7 days a week. That's not religion that's called brainwashing.

Iran, Isreal doesn't fool around like America does. They will not be worried about being politically correct while eviscerating you.

Iran taking like they have The A Bomb.

There should be one and only one treaty. Call it the UN treaty. If a country or the residents of a country attack another country, then all other countries will join together to bomb the attacking country into oblivion. That would force sponsors of terror and other places where terrorists might hide to police their own backyards and play nice to insure their own survival.

They are allies. Many Americans are Jewish. And you dont watch an ally who does many of your "that bad guy had a car accident" jobs for us get destroyed. Like I said. I hope they do the heavy lifting. But you dont watch an ally get destroyed and do nothing. I hope they can do it themselves. But I sense more of a little anti Israeli sentiment in you. I think you have a bit more then just Israeli's you dont care much for. When we were in Iraq we used s much ammo at first we were getting it from Israel. They do what they can with what they can but its not in our best interest for them to get involved usually cause it will make more countries gt involved in whatever we are doing. As far as land stealing. Thats debatable on what they should give backk. But when you gain territory cause you won a war against people trying to destroy you, and now have strategic territory that was once used to try and destroy you. I dont know if thats land stealing. But they need to figure out a way to give some back so that the palistinaians can live as well. But when they blow themslves up at nightclubs its a hard thing to give up

Not one single drop of American blood should be shed for the rigue terrorist state of Israel - they have committed more war crimes that you can count and like to claim they are the "superior" people or whatever. They crave Iranian oil and the US has too many jews that will support them - but I just hope the Russians and Chinese will not bend over to Israel like the US - they are our only hope to prevent another war. What wretched people the Israelis are - how evil!

tw1sted, you might not realize this, but many Americans are Muslim, too. Perhaps not more than the 2% who are Jewish. And there might not be as many Muslim Americans in media, government, AIPAC lobbying, etc., but if no Americans were Muslim, and no Americans were Jewish, I wager we'd be minding our own business right about now. It would be quite easy, with so many fewer American lives lost.

Curious, tw1sted, what do you think the Israelis will gain from a war? They won't be fighting over resources, nor dominance of the Middle East (they'd never get it simply because they are considered a Jewish state in a Muslim region), nor a stronger reputation in the world... so what, then? There's only one reason that I can think of that Israel would want to go to war, and that's survival. Tiny little state being constantly threatened by a nearby country that might be developing nuclear weapons? If I were in their shoes, I'd consider a pre-emptive strike to be my only option if the sanctions don't work. Because if Iran gets the first punch, there might not be an Israel to fight back.

Noryc

I never said I didnt understand why.

But I sense more of a little anti Israeli sentiment in you. I think you have a bit more then just Israeli's you dont care much for.

See, it's statements like this that frost my a$$. Why the f*ck is it that whenever you express one here that Israel should fight its own damn battles, and Israel and Iran should duke it out themselves, and that all the American people want is to be left alone, and that we're sick and damn tired of fighting other countries' wars you're labeled an Anti-Israeli or an Anti-Semite???

For too damn long we've been propping up a country carved out by lunkhead leaders after World War 2, which the Palestinians never asked for, the rest of the Middle East never asked for, and Post War American citizens never asked for. Israel wants to fight? Fine. Let their young men die, NOT ours. Sorry, I'm NOT buying the pooooooor perpetual "Israeldamsel in Distress" bullsh1t any more.

Adolf...I mean Irene, needs to put down her swastika and crawl back into whatever filthy hole she came out of.

I see many left wing liberal traitors and Muslims writing nonsense about Israel on this board.

FYI: The Israelis are our only true ally in the region. We will always back them 1000% no matter what. We the people will throw any Politician or Administration that does not back Israel out of office. Guaranteed. Muslims and left wing liberal traitors can go to hell if they don't like it.

Americans who care more about Israel than America should move to Israel, surrender their US citizenship and become Israeli.

Americans who care more about Israel than America should move to Israel, surrender their US citizenship and become Israeli.

Exactly. They should also feel free to enlist their kids to fight Iran on the front lines. Leave mine the f*ck alone. We've fought ENOUGH pointless, asinine quagmires in which our fine troops have died for NOTHING.

NO MORE U.S. involvement in other countries' wars. PERIOD.

mike, - if you want to defend israel, get on a plane, go over to israel, join there army and by all means defend them, I sure as hell would not send 1 american soldier over there to do Israels job, im sure the jews would not help or pick up the tab when a war does happen with Iran, How many jews helped with Iraq = 0. How much money did they pitch in = 0. A true ally would not abandon there friend on the battlefield, and Israel sat at home watching us Burn and die.

TIDubai

Americans who care more about Israel than America should move to Israel, surrender their US citizenship and become Israeli.

People who live in Dubai should tend to their own backyard.

How many jews [sic] helped with Iraq = 0

And you really don't know the true answer as to why this is?

Twisted, see number 9. And my apologies for not hitting the "reply link", I thought I did, but I guess at the time my comments box was sitting right under the reply dohickie and I probably overlooked it.

Sauve .... when the shooting starts, join the Israeli army.... lets see how tough you are then.... my guess is your just a big mouth with a computer as long as someone else does the fighting and dying.

Yeah, I'd notice. Iran is 100 miles from here and I am much more afraid of Israel than I am of Iran. But I am guessing you have never even been to the Mid East.

I am much more afraid of Israel than I am of Iran.

Is that because when Israel is destroyed by Iran the violence will be taking place relatively far from you, and you're worried that Israel might mess things up in your little Gulf paradise by striking first?

Or is it because you think the Iranians aren't so bad after all, and once Israel is gone you won't have to worry anymore?

TIDubai, I've been to the middle east and it's a friggin desert dude. Only Israel and your country have transformed it to much else. Your afraid of Israel? My friend you'd better be afraid of the Muslim nutcases that surround your paradise because believe me they'd take that from you in a New York minute if they could, and put sharia law into place given the chance. You live in a wealthy area of the middle east, they'd overrun you in a second if those Islamic nutcases could. You best be beholding to the USA, because one day you might need us to save yourself from the very religion you surround yourself with.

Firstly, I am American. I was born in the US and moved here a decade ago when I could no longer buy health insurance in the USA (pre-existing condition).

Iran and Israel are both run by religious warmongers. The real peaceful places (UAE, Qatar, Oman, Jordan) want nothing to do with these nutcases. Iran is not going to attack anybody, though they talk a big game. Israel will attack Iran and turn the whole region into a mess. There is no much Iranian, Saudi and yes, Israeli money here that Dubai has become a bit like Switzerland... no no I am not afraid of anyone attacking the UAE... and while I roll my eyes at Iran's actions, I do fear what Israel will do.

mischief9, I ve been to Iraq and there is no way Im going to any middle east chit hole, as for my mouth Im going to consider where that came from and laugh. Why should we fight them when we can let them take out each other once the dictators are gone? Religious freedom at the middle Easts finest.

We support or installed most of the dictators.

(Our emerging human world has actually been under covert biocybernetic warfare attack for thousands of years now by these outside offensive totalitarian ETs, who repeatedly masqueraded as Divinity toward mankind in the process of covertly installing all three of these corrupt ET installed terminal religious belief systems known as the Abrahamic religions. These ETs have been covertly plotting the eventual destruction of our entire emerging human world, so they can use their eminent domain rights of military intervention in our sector of the Milky Way galaxy to eventually steal and annex our extremely valuable celestial real estate, and ultimately render the entire human race extinct on this precious planet one day (very soon).) - RC

RickCarter,

In response to your posts 8.0 and 8.1 above,

I'm assuming you mean well-----but------please do a reality check!

Thankyou!

Ah, Dave, where's your sense of humor?

Ah! The human race needs to be recyled so in 50 million years another will come upon this earth and start again...Hopefully right this time:

Huh????

I understand. But its not 1967. And these are countries that will randomly shoot tons of rockets at Israeli cities and can cause a lot of blood. But do me a favor. Hit reply to me cause I almost didnt see you reply to me ;)

And yes they are trained. But the US fighter pilots are the best in the world. Israel has good fighters and a great military and air force. But when I was in Afghanistan I loved my Air Force buddies on more then one occasion. We have truly the best of the best and it why some of the best Israeli pilots come to the US for extra training

...... Will the Watcher.... with that kind of goofy logic, i guess the United States was silly giving back captured land in Germany, Japan , Korea ect, ect .... after the fighting is over, ..... Fact.... the land that is now Israel was given to them by Great Britain after WW2 ... now, how the hell do you justify Britain giving someone elses land to create a country ????? You can't..... end of story

Israel is an ancient Kingdom that was resurrected as a democratic homeland for Jews. The re-creation of Israel was not the only thing that changed on the world map, post WWII.

For one instance, what's your opinion regarding the Partition of 1947, Mischief???

not to mention 6 million of there people were wiped away and needed a place somewhere. They were given a small sliver and no one was forced out of those areas when it was given

Twisted...... thats bull@!$%# and you know it....of course people were forced out silly ass.

Will the Watcher,

That was a truely excellent post in #9.0 above!

You've really stated the facts (except it was a 6 day war, not a 7 day war in 1967) as they are in the Middle East!

I take it you are from Israel?

No, Irene, I'm from the U.S.A. and the only citisenship I have is the U.S.A.

I'm not happy with all of Israels moves RECENTLY, but youre an idiot IRENE

Irene I see Israelis blowing themselves up in Palestinian restaurants, weddings, busses ect on a consistent basis. When it keeps happening you hit back. They sure are not angels by any means. But they are the terrorists here eh?

I think we should cut more from education in America!

Oh and Irene. Name another country constantly threatening to wipe another off the map? And saying that a different country can't exist anymore?

And when the younger educated Iranians want a change for more democracy they are crushed and killed. How quick you forget the Iran mini revolution just a couple dozen months back

Hey twisted, when Israel admits they murdered US citizens and called US soldiers liars then we can talk, until then, you are a tool for the anti-christ

Sad that we still have Nazi's in the USofA @!$%#ing blight that needs to be eradicated like a tumor.

This story just proves the hate and desperation of that @!$%# hole they call Iran 8) Israel does not need USA's help they can handle that dump just fine.

Irene and others consider this. In 1776, our country fought a war of independence. We won. We took ALL the land that at the time belonged to the British Crown. It wasn't given to us, we took it. In 1803, we bought more land from France, called the Louisiana Purchase. We explored it, we conquered the wild, we moved west. In 1898, we went to war with Spain, as a result, we took control of Cuba, Puerto Rico, the Philippines Islands, Guam, and other islands. And least we forget in 1845, the United States Annexes a patch of land called Texas, and thus in 1846 begins the Mexican-American War. As a result, the US now takes California territory and eventually within a year purchases a swatch of land from Mexico called Arizona. NOW, in any of OUR HISTORY, did we GIVE BACK any land we conquered?

So if we use the same BUFFOONISH MENTALITY our current leadership has, and applied it to OURSELVES, we should go back to our pre 1776 boundaries, or even our 1803 boundaries. That would solve alot of problems now wouldn't it. No California, No Arizona, No Nevada or Utah. I wonder what the Dems would do without all those electoral votes coming from California...

The bottom line is, Israel is no different and doing things NO DIFFERENT than what we did. In fact, Israel ISN'T and DIDN'T do what they are doing to conquer land and expand like WE DID. They are just trying to exist on that patch of land granted to them by the 1947 UN partition plan, which would have divided Palestine into separate Jewish and Arab states, with Jerusalem under UN administration. On May 14, 1948, soon after the British quit Palestine, the State of Israel was proclaimed and was immediately invaded by armies from neighboring Arab states, which rejected the UN partition plan. This conflict, Israel's War of Independence (the 6 Day War), was concluded by armistice agreements between Israel, Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria in 1949 and resulted in a 50% increase in Israeli territory.

NOTICE, Israel was quite content with the little chunk of land granted. It wasn't until they were backed into a corner that they CONQUERED AND TOOK the land they have today. So let's just consider our own Imperialistic and Expansionist HISTORY before we start spewing uneducated rhetoric toward a country that wanted to live in peace, but had to FIGHT for their survival.

I misspoke the 6 day war as the Israel War of Independence. That actually occurred in 1967 and is very similar to our War of 1812, in which Great Britain attempted to reclaim the land they lost in 1776, and as we know resulted in the sound defeat of Britain, just like the sound defeat the Arab States suffered at the hands of the Israelis.

But I think you folks get the point. We need to look at our OWN history and understand that when you have a country that has basically been at war since it's inception, they can't trust anyone. In that regard, they are a hell of a lot smarter than we are, since we seem to think with our liberal, tree hugging, kumbaya foolishness that we are somehow the champions of morality...

Will the Watcher- You forgot to mention that the Israeli's conducted a sneak attack in order to destroy Egypt's air force while it was still on the ground to win the 6 day war. It sure made victory a hell of a lot easier.

You also forgot to mention Israel's victory over the USS Liberty, a communications ship with only one gun, in international waters. The Israelis used Mirage fighters and torpedo boats in it's attempt to sink the ship of their greatest ally. Lucky for the US the incompetant, teacherous fools failed. They were only able to kill 34 Americans and wound 172, but the ship did not sink.

Stop all aid to Israel!

Irene read up on the Anglo-Iranian Oil Co. dispute since you have no clue what you're talking about. Not to mention the coup d'état occurred over 60 years ago and Iran has since made billions from their oil so why should USA offer any sympathy or guilt. It's time for the people of Iran to take responsibility for their current situation since they welcomed the perverted Ayatollah back to Iran.

RalphH

Will the Watcher- You forgot to mention that the Israeli's conducted a sneak attack in order to destroy Egypt's air force while it was still on the ground to win the 6 day war. It sure made victory a hell of a lot easier.

You also forgot to mention Israel's victory over the USS Liberty, a communications ship with only one gun, in international waters. The Israelis used Mirage fighters and torpedo boats in it's attempt to sink the ship of their greatest ally. Lucky for the US the incompetant, teacherous fools failed. They were only able to kill 34 Americans and wound 172, but the ship did not sink.

The destruction of the entire Egyptian air force while it was still on the ground seems pretty smart to me and doesn't sound like incompetance at all!

The attack on the Liberty(which was within an active war zone) was found to have been an accident, regardless of what your propaganda websites claim, RalphH!

Ralph, I did mention it earlier in a previous post, which you apparently missed. In 1967, Israeli Intelligence gathered information concerning an imminent invasion. In response, Israel launched an attack North and South, to disrupt and indeed defeat the planned invasion. In doing so, they captured the Sinai from Egypt, the Golan Heights from Syria. Following the 6 day war, Egypt acknowledged Israel's right to exist and signed a treaty. In return, Egypt was given back the land captured in the Sinai and the agreement of mutual demilitarization along that border has existed. (And by demilitarization, I mean there was an agreement that troop levels would be maintained at a certain level as to be a "defensive posture" only).

Now, you can talk all you want about how Israel was the bully, but you seem to forget, the facts of history reconcile what I have said. Furthermore, Israel DID NOT participate in the Iraq war at OUR BEQUEST. You also seem to forget during the liberation of Kuwait, Saddam Hussein fired a number of SCUD missiles into Israel in order to draw them into the war and elicit sympathy and aid from other muslim countries. AT OUR BEHEST, ISRAEL DID NOT RETALIATE, which would have been THEIR RIGHT TO DO SO. Instead, we provided them Patriot Batteries and attacked Scud and Mobile Scud launchers and sites preventing a further escalation involving Israel.

Israel is not a stupid nation. And they know if they act there will be a reprecussion. But when they are faced with rhetoric coming from a country threatening them to be wiped off the map, I sure as hell believe they have a right to self defense, even if that self defense is preemptive. To put it another way, if your neighbor threatens to burn your house down, you sure as hell aint going to wait for the smell of gasoline and the sight of a match to defend your house. If someone is standing in front of you with their hand in their coat pocket and is threatening to stab you, you sure as hell aren't going to wait to see the blade before taking some action to protect yourself.

As far as the USS Liberty goes,

The USS Liberty incident was an attack on a United States Navy technical research ship, USS Liberty, by Israeli Air Force jet fighter aircraft and Israeli Navy torpedo boats, on June 8, 1967, during the Six-Day War.^[2] The combined air and sea attack killed 34 crew members (naval officers, seamen, two Marines, and one civilian), wounded 170 crew members, and severely damaged the ship At the time, the ship was in international waters north of the Sinai Peninsula, about 25.5 nmi (29.3 mi; 47.2 km) northwest from the Egyptian city of Arish.^[1][4]

Both the Israeli and U.S. governments conducted inquiries and issued reports that concluded the attack was a mistake due to Israeli confusion about the identity of the USS Liberty, though others, including many of the ship's survivors that could be located four decades later, have rejected these conclusions and maintain that the attack was deliberate.^[ In May 1968, the Israeli government paid US$3,323,500 (US$22.2 million in 2012) as full payment to the families of the 34 men killed in the attack. In March 1969, Israel paid a further $3,566,457 in compensation to the men who had been wounded. On 18 December 1980, it agreed to pay $6 million as settlement for the final U.S. bill of $17,132,709 for material damage to the Liberty itself plus 13 years' interest. -Wikipedia

In my estimation chief, they paid restitution. These figures have been confirmed. Likewise, LBJ (D) was the president then. If you have a beef about how the incident was handled, that incident happened 45 years ago, and there have been more than 1 president elected since then who could have raised hell about it, but didn't. Don't blame the Israeli's for OUR INACTION. Put the blame where it belongs, in the lap of Lydon Baines Johnson (D) for not responding to an attack on us when the incident occurred. If I use your same mentality, the kid that stole my pencil box in 3rd grade (and that was only 35 years ago), I should go find him and beat the hell out of him for his indescretion after all this time... How utterly assinine...

Will The Watcher, your an excellent writer and thanks for putting out the truth concerning Israel. Nice posts! Irene, go get in your SS uniform and see what happens. Your beyond pathetic, you hatemonger.

Till one of them gives a bad weapon to one of our great friends over there and they happily use it on us

Out of curiosity, tw1sted, why aren't the Muslim countries our friends? Why only Israel? There are wars taking place in Africa, but nobody blames America for them.

Do themath

many are our friends. the ones that are not usually blowing themselves up against innocent people. even Saudi Arabia has given Israel rights to its air space. None of the other countries in the ME want Iran with nukes either. And the reason many hate America is cause they are born into hate and that the Koran is the give all live all of life. And since we dont follow it they dont like us. it is pretty simple. many Muslims simply hate non Muslims. depends on the country. I would beg to say its split. For each Iran their is a Kuwait. For each Iraq their is a U.A.E.

Twisted doesn;t realize that Israel must be considered an enemy when push comes to shove, they've proven it time and time again.

BTW,

A "big thankyou" goes out to the Soviets-----Oops!---I mean the Russians, China, Iran, Hezbollah, Hamas, North Korea, Syria and Pakistan for making all of this possible!

Israel is the aggressor here and I hope someday they get their dues - for they are the most hated country in the world.

Irene,

Objective, aren't you?

the most hated country in the world.

Really Irene is that why just in July alone, 70,000 Americans and 30,000 Russians vacationed in Israel?

@MISCHIEF9,

... maybe when we have foreign forces over running us

The idea is to not have foreign forces over running us-----that's why we're involved in the world-----so as to not repeat the mistakes of the 1930's all over again!

We hove plenty "foreign" people over running us... and they seem to be coming out in "force" as of late.

You can ask the Indians what happens when you do not protect your borders... an earlier History but one we have not learned even after "writing the book" on the subject.

@Deadaim92,

Aren't you over simplifying things a little bit?

While all you war-lovin cowboys are yelling for Israel to attack Iran - maybe you should look at your map and see how the countries are positioned. And if you still want Israel to go warmongoring again, maybe you should take stock of those who would disagree - like China and Russia - do you really want a war that will involve all the major powers? Israel is fanatical - it cannot get along with anyone who has resources it wants. The US should not get involved in covering their a88 again, ever.

Israel is fanatical - it cannot get along with anyone who has resources it wants.

Irene,

Could the rockets being fired from Gaza into civilian areas within Israel have anything to do with it?

Baldman, I assume you are volunteering for the Israeli army, right?

Dave- no one has died from a rocket attack since george W bush was in office, any rockets that are fired end up hiting desert, fields, areas that have zero presence.

Dave- no one has died from a rocket attack since george W bush was in office

Well, Israel has done much to save their people, who climb into bomb shelters when the sirens go off.

And they go off a lot:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2012

Plus the IDF has the successful "Iron Dome" system.

It's not for want of trying to kill Jews, is it?

Now, if only the Iranean people were allowed to have a voice when they go to the voting booths!

---and neither will Israel they are in the same situation.

It sounds like they already understand, as they are burning American flags.

Xin Loi or Sorry About That, perhaps we have some time in the RVN during the 70s? However, if what may happen in Iran, it would be hard to rub 2 rocks together as all that sand may well become their GDP - Glass!

deb,

Iran likes to fart around during our president election.

Iran has been "making trouble" in between our elections as well.

BTW, the Jewish community has Synagogues, not Churches and they do get to vote for their representative in the Iranean parliment,but it's just one person out of many and that person has to be "officially approved" in order to run for election at all.

take what belong to someone elese and claim it as your own an even today the isrealians are still taking what belongs to the palestinanes and claiming it for themselves

Nina,

The Jewish people have been in that land for thousands of years with Jerusalem as their capital!

So that would make the Palestinians and other Muslims squatters with the same capital that have been there as long as the Jewish people?

Dave - those jews must of followed a money trail into europe since before WWII, israel was Palestine,

israel was Palestine,

The place named "Israel" predates the very word "Palestine".

The word "Palestine" is a Roman word. Israel was around long before Rome.

Where do the people who call themselves “Palestinians” really come from; this, from the Palestinians themselves.

The link below is to a clip from an interview on Egyptian TV with Fathi Hamad, the Minister of the Interior of the Hamas government in the Gaza Strip.

It is very brief and I would appreciate it if you would take the time to watch it and then to forward it to all your contacts.

Corrupt Language Breeds Bad History and Bad Policy
Bruce Thornton - Advancingafreesociety.org - May 22, 2011

"...the false history and its false vocabulary are now taken for reality and made the basis of policy."

As the history of communism and fascism both illustrate, modern political tyranny has relied on fabricated history to legitimize its claims and actions, and such history in turn relies on the debasement of language. Nowhere is this axiom more evident than in the conflict between Israel and the Arabs––so much so that, as Obama’s recent remarks about Israel show, the false history and its false vocabulary are now taken for reality and made the basis of policy.

Start with the use of “borders” to describe what is in fact the armistice line marking the farthest advance of the five Arab armies that invaded Israel in 1948. That line is not an international “border” in the strict sense of a line dividing one sovereign state from another. The territory in question was never a state. Once a state is established, then the international border will be settled by negotiations. As Israeli ambassador Dore Gold points out, U.N. resolution 242, as well as later agreements such as the 1993 Oslo Accords, preserves this “flexibility for creating new borders.”

Then there’s “occupation,” used to describe the Israeli presence in the West Bank, itself a misleading term that obscures the historical fact that this region is Judea and Samaria, the heartland of the ancient Jewish state. Aside from that, using “occupation” to describe Israel’s control over a disputed territory whose final status will be determined by negotiation evokes misleading analogies with historical events like the Nazi occupation of France during World War II, or the Soviet occupation of the Eastern bloc during the Cold War. But that analogy is false: Germany and Russia invaded and then occupied sovereign nations defined by international borders. Israel ended up in the West Bank territories as the result of a defensive war against aggressors. Israel’s continuing control is a defensive necessity, just as after World War I the traditional launching pad for German aggression against France, the Rhineland, was demilitarized and subject to Allied military control. Indeed, the Allied decision to evacuate their forces from the Rhineland was one of many mistakes that led to World War II. Given that central Israel is only 9 miles wide from the Mediterranean to the West Bank, it is understandable that it is cautious about losing control over the traditional Arab launching pad for invasion.

“Palestinian homeland” is another particularly loaded and historically false phrase. “Palestine” was the name of a multi-ethnic Roman, Byzantine, Arab, and Ottoman province, not a people. The name itself reflects Rome’s attempt to alter historical reality with language. After the destruction of Israel as a political entity and the scattering of its people in the 2nd Century A.D., the Romans renamed the territory “Palestine” after the Philistines, a people that once lived in the region but had been absorbed into other groups for centuries. Thus the Romans subjected the Jews to a collective damnatio memoriae, the practice of erasing all public mention or record of an enemy to the Roman state––exactly what the Arabs have been trying to do to Israel for the last 60 years by denying its historical ties to the land.

Likewise, just as the Romans named the land after a people that no longer existed, so too calling the current Arab inhabitants “Palestinians” perpetuates a similar historical fraud. What constitute a people are a shared language, culture, customs, traditions, and history distinct enough to set them apart from others. By these criteria, there is no such thing as “Palestinians.” The average Arab living in Israel or the West Bank is no more significantly distinct from one living in Syria, Jordan, or Egypt than a resident from California is significantly distinct from a resident of Arizona or Nevada. Whatever differences that do exist do not trump the more important similarities, and reflect rather the refusal of surrounding Arab nations to integrate their Arab brothers into their own countries, instead constructing a Palestinian identity based on victimhood, humiliation, and failure.

That’s why before 1967, no one talked about “Palestinians” as a distinct people deserving a homeland, and the Jordanians did not create a Palestinian state when they controlled the West Bank. That notion of a “Palestinian state” arose after the Arab defeats in the 1967 Six Day War and the 1973 Yom Kippur War. Once those debacles made it clear the Arabs could not destroy Israel by force, the tactic shifted to making the issue one of national self-determination as a way of chipping away at Israel’s territorial integrity and international support.

Finally, the claim that the territory inhabited by Israel is the traditional “homeland” of those whom we call Palestinians is false. The majority of Arabs who have lived or are living in Israel and the West Bank are there as the descendants of conquerors, colonizers, and immigrants. Many of them came after Zionists began in the 19th Century to develop a mostly desolate, neglected land and to create economic opportunities. History and archaeology tell us that the territory comprising Israel and the West Bank is the traditional homeland of the Jewish people, not a mythical Palestinian people.

The misleading and false language used to describe the conflict between Israel and the countries that have tried to destroy it obscures the actual causes of Arab hatred of Israel, which in turn creates bad policies pursuing false solutions. A Palestinian state will not bring peace to the region, for the simple reason that a critical mass of Arabs does not want Israel to exist.

Anyone know why I'm unable to upload a link? I tried to copy and paste to the above posting but unable to do so.

Another blogger once posted the following and unfortunately I cannot quote his/her name:

"Palestinian" referred to the jews of the region prior to Israel's war of indepndence (e.g., the Palestinian Philharmonic; The Plaestinian Post - members of which were jews). It was only after 1948 that the arabs of the region referred to themselves as "Palestinian."

"It must not be forgotten that the Arab Higher Committee encouraged the refugees to flee their homes in Jaffa,
Haifa, and Jerusalem, and that certain leaders make political capital out of
their miserable situation…." – RADIO BROADCAST BY NEAR EAST ARABIC RADIO – April
3, 1948.

Did you know that there were Jewish appeals to ask the Arabs as
neighbors to stay and not flee, ensuring that they would protect and not hurt them? This appeal was issued by the Jewish Haifa Workers Council in 1948:

"Do not fear, do not destroy your homes with your own
hands, do not bring upon yourself this tragedy by unnecessary evacuation and
self imposed burdens….In this city, yours and ours, Haifa, the gates are open
for work, and life and peace for you and your families. " (THE JEWISH HAIFA
WORKERS COUNCIL issued 1948)

Consequently, almost 450,000 Arabs fled and thus was
created the tragedy. On April 17^th, 1950, the Arab National Committee of Haifa
wrote a memo to Arab governments saying:

"The Removal of the Arab
inhabitants was voluntary and was carried out at our request… the Arab
delegation proudly asked for the evacuation of the Arabs and their removal to
the neighboring Arab countries"

This is a direct answer to the alleged claims that Jews caused the refugee crisis. It shows how the majority of Arabs are liars, who assassinate in order to steal land and will by any means and at all costs lie and kill to impose their politics and religion on others, especially the very Jews who were helping those Arabs whose descendants today are attempting to wipe out Israel.

Excellent posts, Basil.