'Bad manners' but 'not rape': UK politician's defense of Julian Assange sparks storm

Goodnight with George Galloway

George Galloway talks about the Julian Assange case during one of his regular video podcasts.

LONDON -- As U.S. Congressman Todd Akin fights for his political life over his "legitimate rape" comments, a high-profile British politician has ignited a storm on the other side of the Atlantic over the definition of rape.

George Galloway, a member of the U.K. parliament and former leader of the left-wing Respect Party, waded into the debate around the allegations faced by WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange.


During a 31-minute podcast, Galloway discussed the claims made by two Swedish woman against Assange in graphic detail, claiming that his alleged behavior was at worst "bad manners" but "not rape."

The colorful Galloway -- who has been dubbed "Gorgeous George" by some U.K. tabloids  -- is no stranger to controversy. He grabbed headlines around the world after he shook hands with Iraqi dictator Saddam Hussein in 1994 and praised him for his "strength, courage and indefatigability." He also appeared as a contestant on "Celebrity Big Brother" -- where he famously pretended to be a cat.

Ina / INA via AP, file

Iraqi President Saddam Hussein receives visiting MP George Galloway on Aug. 8, 2002, in Baghdad.

This week's "Goodnight with George Galloway" video podcast put him back in the spotlight.    

"Some people believe that when you go to bed with somebody, take off your clothes, and have sex with them and then fall asleep, you're already in the sex game with them," Galloway said, gesticulating emphatically. "It might be really bad manners not to have tapped her on the shoulder and said: 'Do you mind if I do it again?' It might be really sordid and bad sexual etiquette, but whatever else it is, it is not rape or you bankrupt the term rape of all meaning."

Cue gasps all around.

May 17, 2005: British lawmaker George Galloway rejects a Senate subcommittee's claim that Saddam Hussein awarded him lucrative allocations under the U.N. oil-for-food program.

His comments provoked a furious response on Twitter and were blasted by women's groups and newspaper columnists.

Writing in the Daily Telegraph, British broadcaster and journalist Christina Odone said that Galloway "should be punished at the ballot box" for his views. "When it comes to rape, misogyny is rife in politics," she added.

Assange in balcony appeal to Obama: Release leak suspect Bradley Manning

Scotsman columnist Emma Cowing wrote that Galloway's comments were "about men redefining serious crimes against women to suit a political agenda."

"Rape victims have a history of being ignored and accused of lying," she added. "They have a history of feeling terrified of speaking out in case they are not believed, or are ridiculed, or have to face their attacker and relive the crime. This is why so many rape victims never report their crimes and why so many find it difficult to speak out in court."

Telegraph assistant comment editor Tom Chivers wrote that "the situation Galloway has just described is absolutely, 100 per cent, no-ifs-or-buts definitely rape."

He added: "Listen, George: it is possible to think that WikiLeaks have done some good things without believing that Assange can do no wrong, or that all attempts to make him face trial are some sort of grand conspiracy."

From the Ecuadorian embassy in London, Julian Assange asked the U.S. to "renounce its witch hunt against WikiLeaks." NBC's Duncan Golestani reports.

Galloway is not the first British politician to get himself into hot water over the issue of rape.

A year ago, U.K. Justice Secretary Kenneth Clarke kicked off a similar controversy when he differentiated date rape from "serious rape."  Calls for his resignation came in fast, but the storm settled after he clarified the comments.

'Both have acted like fools'
It remains to be seen if the same will be true in the U.S. for Rep. Todd Akin. 

Missouri Senate candidate Todd Akin, who launched a firestorm of controversy after his use of the phrase "legitimate rape" and then ignited further criticism with his comments Tuesday, has said he's going to stay in the race. NBC's Andrea Mitchell reports.

An editorial in the left-leaning Guardian newspaper compared Akin and Galloway. "They have three things in common. Both are men. Both encourage rape deniers. And both have acted like fools."

NYT: Akin controversy may endanger GOP chances in the fall

The messages about rape from the highest echelons of political life come just after the 20th anniversary of legislation that made marital rape in the U.K. a crime. 

Victoria Derbyshire, the British radio host who took Clarke to task on his views a year ago made one point that resonates as the debate rages on both sides of the Atlantic this week.

"With respect," she told him in a flat tone, "rape is rape."

On Tuesday, the 58-year-old Galloway sought to clarify his comments and released a statement.

"No never means yes and non-consensual sex is rape. There's no doubt about it and that has always been my position," he said.

"Julian Assange, let's be clear, has always denied the allegations. And this has all the hallmarks of a set-up. I don't believe, from what we know, that the Director of Public Prosecutions would sanction a prosecution in Britain. What occurred is not rape as most people understand it."

May 17, 2005: British lawmaker George Galloway defends his opposition to the U.S.-led Iraq war.

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Was Galloway in the room? If not, I'm curious about where he gets his information.

    Reply#27 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:03 AM EDT

    As a Sexual Offender Therapist for many years a couple of things are clear to me. First of all; the women are accusing this narcissistic rapist of rape! Rape is the penetration of the vagina to any extent without consent. In both cases Assange clearly did not have consent: ergo, Rape. Secondly, a review of his history makes it clear that he doesn't like to be told no. It is a characteristic of his to violate boundaries. It fits with the dynamic of rape. Rape is not about sexual gratification; it is about power and control. Assange is a power rapist. While the one case is more eggregious than the other both cases are about him taking illigetimate power and controlling the women. Guilty, Guilty Guilty.

    He atttempts to blame the victims, claim he is a victim, and try to distract from the issues; just like a rapist. I don't care what they do with him but the soldier who gave him classified documents; he should continue to occupy a 4 by 9 cell for a very long time. And assange should be told" Obama does not care what he thinks!"

    • 3 votes
    Reply#28 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:07 AM EDT

    Okay, if Mr. Assange is first accused of rape, and then the issue is dropped, and then re-opened by an ambitious federal prosecutor who wants to make an example out of him only because of who he is, then what do you call that? I would call that bullying and vigilante justice.

    I wouldn't expect Mr. Assange to know or understand the sexual mores of Sweden after only 3 days of being there. Hell, he even considered wanting to become a Swedish resident because of their so-called "tolerant" and "open" society.

    Scandinavian society is extremely good at bullying, and very good at hiding behind the "goody-two-shoes" image they have of themselves. And don't even question the word of a single mother in Scandinavia since that topic is close to being sacrosant.

    • 1 vote
    #28.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:01 AM EDT

    Well what would you call the rape of students the Florida female teacher was convicted of? Sorry your definition of rape does not hold. Oh that is right, she was so pretty, that she did not go to jail.

    • 1 vote
    #28.2 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:24 AM EDT

    Well, she should have, since it was statutory rape at the very least. However, because this teacher was treated too leniently is no reason to not investigate Assange for these rape charges.

    • 1 vote
    #28.3 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 11:53 AM EDT
    Reply

    This is pure sophistry on Assange's part. Yes, he should have asked her if she minded. But he didn't even offer her the opportunity to consent; therefore, it's rape. Period.

    • 2 votes
    Reply#29 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:18 AM EDT

    Even in supposedly "liberal" Sweden it's not even clear on what the definition of what rape actually is.

    This is a country that smugly likes to present itself as a shining example for womens rights issues. Stieg Larsson did name one of his books "The man who Hated Women" for a reason!

    • 1 vote
    #29.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:48 AM EDT

    If you had sex witht he woman earlier in the night and she slept in your bed it seems to me that consent is implied.

    • 1 vote
    #29.2 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 10:02 AM EDT

    You are wrong, Matthew Coons. If a woman is asleep, she cannot give her consent to sex. Sex without consent is rape.

    • 1 vote
    #29.3 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 11:55 AM EDT

    You're wrong, DRK-1183578. I don't know if what happened in this case was rape - it depends on exactly what happened. But her being asleep does not automatically make it rape.

    There's implied consent. In this case, she had spent the night with him, after having sex during the evening. Her behaviour makes it reasonable for the man to assume she consents, unless she makes it clear she does not.

      #29.4 - Thu Aug 23, 2012 6:18 AM EDT

      She had made it clear that she did not want to have sex without a condom. When she woke up, he was on top of her, having sex without a condom. That counts as rape as far as I'm concerned -- whether it counts as such under Swedish law is, of course, up to the Swedes.

      Using your logic of implied consent, no wife could ever complain about marital rape -- after all, if she's married, she must have consented to sex whenever her husband wants it. Happily, the law on that has changed and marital rape is now a crime. Ask yourself why that might be.

        #29.5 - Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:45 PM EDT
        Reply

        You'd think that some men would know better than to comment on what makes a rape. Sadly, they don't.

        That aside, I believe that the alleged rape charges against Assange had been investigated and dropped by the Swedish police at one time. Once the Wikileaks dump of U.S. files occurred, the charges were mysteriously (or, not so mysteriously) resurrected. Assange is right to stay put. He has no possible chance of being treated fairly - by Sweden or by the U.S.

        • 3 votes
        Reply#30 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:22 AM EDT

        "Rape is when you have sex without consent. Waking up and finding someone having their way with you is not consent."

        Hell, if that is the case, then my wife has been "raping" me for YEARS! Should I, if I get mad at her, accuse her of raping me?? Puleeese...If you are going to make an accusation of rape, in that circumstance, then do it right there and then, don't wait until they do something to make you mad so you can "get even" with them...

        • 3 votes
        Reply#31 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:28 AM EDT

        This guy is sick and needs some psychiatric evaluation.

        • 1 vote
        Reply#32 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:37 AM EDT

        What's this: A woman actually defending Geeorge Galloway?!

        1) I'm seriously not impressed with the Swedish federal prosecutor, Marianne Ry. The only reason she decided to intervene in this case was because Sweden has high rape accusation and low conviction rate. She took it upon herself to re-open Julian Assange's case even though it had been established that no rape law had been broken. And now she's trying to bully Assange into doing something that he wasn't legally required to do even under Swedish law. He could very easily give a statement from London and be done with it. They have done this with people accused of TERRORISM, so they can easily afford to do it for sexual chicanery.

        2) Albeit the timing of Mr. Galloway's comments were in poor taste, I absolutely agree with him. I am fed up with the "DefCon1" level of outrage by (mostly white) women whenever politicians like him (or Re. Akin, for that matter) make comments about rape that upset their sensibilities. It really doesnt matter at the end of the day because the same people will continue to support them, no matter what they say. A lot of the critics of Mr. Galloway or Mr. Akin have very little to say when the victim is colored, but they lose it when the perpetrator is (gasp!) a MUSLIM!

        3) I actually consider myself a liberal and a feminist, but I'm extremely dismayed with how the conversation of rape or sexual behavior is being hijacked by people wit one sole agenda. In Scandinavia in general, womens issues are always at the front burner, even at the expense of men and boys. I wouldn't expect Mr. Assange to know about or understand how dominating Scandinavian women can be. Men here are too afraid to touch the issue because they know it's an election loser. I used to be one of those who believed that the USA should emulate Scandinavian society, and now I'm seeing that would be a HUGE mistake.

        • 3 votes
        Reply#33 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:38 AM EDT

        I guess I have been raped a million times by Women then - I can't tell you how many times I have woke up with a woman on top of me already Riding without having asked me for Consent. Should I be taking these Women to Court for having Raped me?

        • 3 votes
        Reply#34 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:38 AM EDT

        Yup, my wife does that to me quite a bit, I guess I should charge her with rape as well....

        • 1 vote
        #34.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:42 AM EDT
        Reply

        If a man wakes up and finds a woman's Tongue in his AzzHohle, is it Rape?

          Reply#35 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:47 AM EDT

          Change your title - nothing civil about you. Quit dreaming - you are just a sleaze.

            #35.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:01 PM EDT
            Reply

            During the years I was a private investigator and detective and long before innocence projects began demonstrating the truth, I made a practice of interviewing women who successfully charged men with rape, the interview always taking place at least two years after the conviction. Twenty-three of twenty-five women who testified that they had been forceably raped changed their story in a manner that would in all probability have meant refusal by a prosecutor to do so. One woman, however, I will never forget. Successful in sending to jail four young men (one of who was physically incapable of sex), she told me, "Maybe they didn't know it was rape." When I asked how that was possible, she replied archly, "That's up to the woman, isn't it?"

            One thing is a lead-pipe cinch bet, that no one will ever ask what the factual truth is concerning Congressman Akins ill-considered statement (we won't even, as a matter of fact, ever hear ALL of his remarks that time).

            • 2 votes
            Reply#36 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:48 AM EDT

            For those who joke that their wifes have been raping them because they wake up with their wife on top, just remember, and this is no joke, when your wife wakes up with you on top she can claim rape because she didn't give consent and there are laws on the books where a wife can charge her husband with rape. So either wake her up and ask her or don't pi$$ her off to where she will ever want to charge you with rape.

            • 1 vote
            Reply#37 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:54 AM EDT

            If a Man Wakes Her up and asks for Consent to Bang her, and she says yeah, will He still go to Prison if She, the next Day, tells the Sherriff that she was talking in her sleep and was Not Fully awake when she Consented?

            • 3 votes
            Reply#38 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:59 AM EDT

            You may need to worry about that civility, I mean sleaze. If you asked for her consent to "bang her", she may eventually know what and who you are and tell authorities you raped her.

              #38.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 12:03 PM EDT
              Reply

              Which degree of rape are we talking about? Maybe Galloway can use the "phone a friend" and call Todd Akin for expert advice...

              • 2 votes
              Reply#39 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:13 AM EDT

              Amazing how Assange is being completely tried and convicted in the public media by governments. Even more amazing is those who pass judgement based entirely on one word: rape.

              Any day you 'trust' ANY government - is the day you will be morally and ethically raped. There isn't a single example of a government that doesn't lie, doesn't twist, doesn't cheat or steal or kill. Government has no ethics nor morals and has become the personification of every ill and malady known to man.

              But now the machine has become the proverbial 'to big to fail' as it feeds on and supports itself on the backs of every man, woman, and child. It has become a complete social psychopath when it decidedly sets out to destroy or eliminate anyone who would expose the men and women behind the curtain. There is no transparency just as there is no integrity. It's all cash and promises fueled by greed and power.

              Assange pulled back their curtains. He exposed the innards of the monsters. In retaliation, the US and the UK will see him eliminated - one way or the other. How is it that this one man threatens them so??

              • 4 votes
              Reply#40 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:17 AM EDT

              Mark440

              I don't believe I've read any better description of the situation than what you've written. Bravo to you for your words!

                #40.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 10:05 AM EDT
                Reply

                If Assange divulged classified material, he should be apprehended and tried for espionage. If convicted he should be punished. His actions may have endangered US lives. EOS.

                  Reply#41 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:21 AM EDT

                  How is writing a memo that some official's hair color is ugly rate being "classified"?? And, there are other "lives" on this planet than just those in the US.

                    #41.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:52 AM EDT
                    Reply

                    You can't fix stupid !!!

                      Reply#42 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:30 AM EDT

                      I would like to see the Brits let Julian Assaunge go to Ecuador taking full advantage of the political asylum offered by the Ecuadorian government. I doubt that @!$%# would be there two months before someone found him with a slug in his head.

                      • 1 vote
                      Reply#44 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:45 AM EDT

                      ...and probably done by a non-Equadorian.

                      • 1 vote
                      #44.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:53 AM EDT
                      Reply

                      The court of jurisdiction in the case is in another country and waiting to hear the defendant. The court is even willing to provide transport and has issued warrants.

                      Put this discussion in the proper venue.

                      • 1 vote
                      Reply#45 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:48 AM EDT

                      One thing struck me as I read all the comments. If you think what Assange did in releasing seceret documents was a good thing, you will defend him; if you think what he did with the documents was the wrong thing, you will condemn him.

                      I doubt that anyone here has all the facts, hence I doubt that anyone here can make a definitive statement about the validity of the Swedish request to interview him. Sadly, this is more of a political statement for most.

                      • 1 vote
                      Reply#46 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:49 AM EDT

                      Well, as to the original charge, I can see her point. If her birth control needs refreshing before it works; if it must be reapplied or even if she just makes sure the condom is in place, a girl needs warning.

                      Doesn't anybody train dudes in how birth control works, much less how the female body works? I mean it is implied here, that this wasn't procreation, it was recreation, so therefore one if not both of them have to have some sort of birth control going on.

                      You can't just ASSUME her birth control is the pill, but you can assume they were not out to conceive. OR was he just going to let her deal with all that willy nilly as @!$%#s often do.

                      • 1 vote
                      Reply#47 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:49 AM EDT

                      Yeah, the only safe sex is anal and oral. Otherwise wear a condom.

                        #47.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:55 AM EDT

                        Tom -

                        In an effort to correct your dangerous ignorance and perhaps save your life:

                        The risks and transmission probabilities of sexually transmitted diseases are summarized by act in the table below.

                        Performing oral sex on a man

                        Throat chlamydia

                        Throat gonorrhea (25–30%)

                        Herpes (rare)

                        HPV

                        Syphilis (1%)

                        With anal to oral practices:

                        Hepatitis A

                        Shigella

                        Hepatitis B (low risk)

                        HIV (very low risk; 0.01%)

                        Hepatitis C (unknown)

                        Performing oral sex on a woman

                        Herpes

                        Throat gonorrhea

                        Throat chlamydia

                        HPV

                        Receiving oral sex—man

                        Chlamydia

                        Gonorrhea

                        Non-gonococcal urethritis

                        Herpes

                        Syphilis (1%)

                        HPV

                        Receiving oral sex—woman

                        Herpes

                        HPV

                        Vaginal thrush

                        Bacterial Vaginosis

                        Gonorrhea

                        Vaginal sex—man

                        Chlamydia (30–50%)

                        Crabs

                        Scabies

                        Gonorrhea (22%)

                        Hepatitis B

                        Herpes (0.07% for HSV-2)

                        HIV (0.05%)

                        HPV (at least 5%)

                        Non-gonococcal urethritis

                        Syphilis

                        Trichomoniasis

                        Hepatitis C

                        Vaginal sex—woman

                        Chlamydia (30–50%)

                        Crabs

                        Scabies

                        Gonorrhea (47%)

                        Hepatitis B (50–70%)

                        Herpes

                        HIV (0.1%)

                        HPV (high; at least 5%)

                        Syphilis

                        Trichomoniasis

                        Hepatitis C

                        Anal sex—insertive

                        Chlamydia

                        Crabs

                        Scabies (40%)

                        Gonorrhea

                        Hepatitis B

                        Herpes

                        HIV (0.62%)

                        HPV

                        Non-gonococcal urethritis

                        Syphilis (14%)

                        Hepatitis C

                        Anal sex—receptive

                        Chlamydia

                        Crabs

                        Scabies

                        Gonorrhea

                        Hepatitis B

                        Herpes

                        HIV (1.7%)

                        HPV

                        Syphilis (1.4%)

                        Hepatitis C

                        Anilingus

                        Amebiasis

                        Cryptosporidiosis (1%)

                        Giardiasis

                        Hepatitis A (1%)

                        Shigellosis (1%)

                        HPV (1%)

                        For the rest of you: Stay Away From Tom.

                        • 2 votes
                        #47.2 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 11:30 AM EDT
                        Reply

                        All men are guilty of rape. The fact that they have a penis makes them guilty by default. The fact that men have two balls and women don't, ultimately contributes to keeping women down! Girl power! Girl power! Girl power!

                          Reply#48 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:51 AM EDT

                          Well this guy is just about a nut job... he would fit right in with the liberal left in this country! He admires Castro and Saddam Hussein... is anti-capitalist... believes in wealth redistribution and class warfare... believes in conspiracies... revises the truth to suit his political agenda. Yup. He would fit right in...

                          • 1 vote
                          Reply#49 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:53 AM EDT

                          with the GOP.

                            #49.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:56 AM EDT
                            Reply

                            What struck me odd is the statement that "rape is rape". Rape is not rape and you are an idiot if you believe that. An 18 year old college male having consensual sex with his female college instructor is considered rape because she is in a position of authority over him but that is not the same as some hobo pushing a librarian into a back alley and ripping off her panties bending her over a dumpster and sodomizing her. A bit gory but I was just trying to make a point. Rape is not rape all the time. To say it is, is ridiculous. You already had sex with the dude and you know what happened, the same thing that happens every single time a man wants to have sex with a woman while she is trying to sleep. She said go ahead and do whatever but I am going to sleep and am not participating which normally occurs in a marriage but I guess it could happen in a one night stand as well. He did and she thought she could get some money out of it. The mistake on his part was not kicking her ass out and making her go home and sleep at her house or leaving and going home himself whatever the case was, not sure whose house they were at.

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#50 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:53 AM EDT

                            "Rape victims have a history of being ignored and accused of lying," she added. "They have a history of feeling terrified of speaking out in case they are not believed, or are ridiculed, or have to face their attacker and relive the crime. This is why so many rape victims never report their crimes and why so many find it difficult to speak out in court."

                            While I may agree, court proceedings are set up to make it hard to convict for a reason. Many rape clames are true, but are very hard to be proven. Many rape claims are made up, because it is so easy to use against someone. Even if you don't get a conviction, the stigma will always be attached to that person.

                            Yes, I have seen it made up. Two girls within two or three weeks of each other the last semester I was at college. One had consented, but changed her story after her father found out. One had made the whole thing up. Didn't matter, the first guy was arrested and sat in jail for a few days until she was disproven and he released. Second one thankfully was brought to court for filing false report, even though charges were dropped.

                            What about DSK last summer? Why no outpouring for the head of a major monetary institute who was tabbed to be the next French president? Is it possible that liberal little guys are the only ones that can be falsely accused, while big names are obviously guilty from the start? He did what was right, stuck around for trial, didn't try to run to the Ecuadorians, and guess what? Charges dropped when proven false.

                            Finally, maybe I don't understand extradition law, but why was it Assange feels any safer in the UK than Sweden from being extradited to the US?

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#51 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 9:57 AM EDT

                            Baldman --- You are off your meds !!!

                              #51.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 2:27 PM EDT

                              DSK wasn't a threat to the USA (and just about every other government). Assange is. What better way to discredit him completely than blowing up a rape story? At the same time, if they get a successful conviction, he'll be properly silenced. Add to that, all the weird details:- the women only lodged their complaints long after the alledged rapes; there seems to be a CIA tie-in with at least one of them; the prosecutor dropped the case and then re-opened it (perhaps under political pressure); the Swedes' refusal to interview him on British soil, etc.

                              I am not sure why the Swedes are more likely to extradite him than the UK, but for one thing, UK law forbids extradition if there is any possibility of capital punishment, as in the case of treason/espionage in the USA.

                                #51.2 - Thu Aug 23, 2012 6:35 AM EDT
                                Reply

                                So he had sex with the woman and later had sex with her while she was sleeping. I must agree with George here, if she wasn't available she should have left the room. Having sex with him and sleeping in the same bed seems that she is giving implied consent. Are we to the point where we need a notarized consent form before we have sex?

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#52 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 10:00 AM EDT

                                We are dealing with Sweden's laws here. Apparently having sex without a condom without consent is rape. Regardless of what people feel about this or their personal opinions, the only standard to use here is the legal Swedish one.

                                • 3 votes
                                #52.1 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 10:12 AM EDT

                                Neal, we have a lack of people willing to understand personal responsibility.

                                Matthew, when you visit another country, you are subject to their laws, even if you are ignorant of them. Not the law where you came from, now the laws in some other country you visited, not just the laws you know about, and certainly not just the laws you agree with. You are subject to the laws of the country you are in, all of them, period. If you don't like Sweden's laws, don't go there and break them.

                                • 1 vote
                                #52.2 - Wed Aug 22, 2012 10:46 AM EDT
                                Reply
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