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Yara Borgal / NBC News
Around 100 people demonstrated against a war with Iran in Tel Aviv on Thursday.
TEL AVIV, Israel -- A persistent group of anti-war protesters gathered in front Israel's Ministry of Defense in Central Tel Aviv on Thursday, chanting "We don't want another war!" and warning the government against striking Iran's nuclear facilities.
Around 100 demonstrators carried signs declaring "No War" and "Don't bomb, talk!" Some lay on the ground and wrapped themselves in white sheets to simulate war casualties.
The demonstration, along with parallel actions in Haifa and Jerusalem, marked the latest in a string of growing anti-war protests that has revealed a deep unease many in Israel feel about a strike on Iran, despite Tehran's pursuit of nuclear technology.
According to reports, Iran has installed many more uranium enrichment machines in an underground bunker, potentially paving the way for a significant expansion of work the West fears is ultimately aimed at making nuclear bombs.
NYT: UN chief heading to Iran despite US objections
While Tehran insists its nuclear program has peaceful aims, Israel sees the the work as a serious threat to its very existence. Israel has said it would take unilateral military action against Iran if the international community fails to stop any development of nuclear weapons. It is also widely assumed that Israel has nuclear weapons although it has never openly admitted to it.
New Iranian missiles have been put on display in Tehran - an exhibition that appears to be a warning to Israel. President Ahmadinejad says the short range missiles are meant for defense, not attack. But in Israel people are watching warily. NBC's John Ray reports.
According to insiders, the United States and other Western countries have told Israel that there is still time for diplomacy, and have urged the government of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to give sanctions and diplomatic pressure time to work.
Most oppose airstrikes
The protesters on Thursday said they were not blind to the threat Iran posed, but said violence was not the way to diffuse tensions.
"A military attack will not annihilate the Iranian nuclear problem. It will only delay it," Sharon Dolev, the director of the Israeli Disarmament Movement and one of the protest organizers, told NBC News.
Another protester, Naor Kapulnik, said he believes the nuclear problem in the Middle East originated in Israel.
"This is a war Israel has been planning for years to maintain their monopoly on nuclear weapons in the Middle East," he said. "They say that this is the way to protect and bring security to the Israeli Jewish citizens but I think that this is the exact opposite since Israel were the first to get nuclear weapons in the Middle East."
Kapulnik, Dolev and other protesters are not alone: According to the latest poll released by the independent think tank, Israel Democracy Institute, over 60 percent of Jewish Israelis oppose a strike on Iran.
Ex-Israeli intel chief speaks out on Iran strikes
The demonstrators also said they did not believe defense ministry estimates of the number of civilians who would be killed if war does break out. Officials have said that in the case of a war with Iran and Lebanese Shiite militia Hezbollah, some 200 Israeli civilians would die. If Syria joined forces with its regional allies, fatalities could rise to 300, according to the defense ministry.
"This is a very ridiculous thing to say. This is just one example of how they view the price of the war," Kapulnik, the demonstrator, said.
"Who will suffer the price? It's not going to (Defense Minister Ehud Barak); it will be the ordinary people walking on the streets. One civilian dead is one too many," he added.
'Determined to attack Iran'
Nevertheless, some members of the political establishment appear intent on a violent confrontation with Iran.
Netanyahu "is determined to attack Iran before the U.S. presidential elections in November," Alon Ben David, the military correspondent for Israel's Channel 10 News, told NBC News.
Not only that, President Obama would have no choice but to back the Israeli strike, he said.
According to an Israeli TV news channel, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu aims to strike Iran's nuclear facilities in the fall before the U.S. election, which would send oil soaring. Walter Zimmermann, United-ICAP, and John Kilduff, Again Capital, weigh in.
Dov Khenin, a member of Israel's Knesset for the Hadash party and a fixture of social justice and anti-war rallies in Tel Aviv, participated in the demonstration.
Israeli rhetoric on Iran strike heats up
"I am here to protest against all the threats and ideas that a preemptive strike on Iran can be seen as some sort of solution to the problems we have here in the Middle East," he said. "Such a strike will cause a devastating regional war that can create havoc both here in Israel and the region around us."
Other prominent figures inside the Israeli establishment have expressed their opposition to an Israeli strike on Iran's nuclear facilities, including President Shimon Peres, former Director of Mossad Meir Dagan and opposition leader Shaul Mofaz.
But despite the voices calling for caution on many levels of Israeli society, it is the government that will vote on the strike -- and according to journalist Ben David, Natanyahu it has an "almost guaranteed" majority there.
Yara Borgal / NBC News
Some of the protesters in Tel Aviv lay on the ground and wrapped themselves in white sheets to simulate war casualties.
Netanyahu's government recently persuaded Foreign Minister Avigdor Lieberman, who previously objected to attacking Iran, to support such a move. Netanyahu also reportedly dispatched a senior official to update Rabbi Ovadia Yosef, the elderly spiritual leader of the Shas ulta-orthodox coalition party, on the Iranian nuclear program in an attempt to win over Shas ministers' support for an attack.
On Friday Israel's Haaretz newspaper reported that Israel's security cabinet -- the body within the government responsible for diplomatic negotiations and decisions in times of crisis -- is currently split evenly six to six on whether to bomb Iran. According to the paper, Netanyahu would almost certainly be able to garner a majority in support of such a move.
Despite these behind-the-scenes moves, Dolev and other protesters insisted on having their voices heard.
"There are other options that (the government) should put on the table if they are sincere. The option is talks," she said.
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Leave a Comment:
My heart goes out to these brave people. Israel and US are the biggest warmongers in the world.
Max....you really need to get a clue on Middle East politics.
Israel is a country of 12 million surrounded by Muslim countries of 100 million who want nothing more than to see Israel annihilated. Israel has been a nuclear nation for several decades and if they were the REAL warmongers then they would have been the 2nd nation in the history of the world to use nuclear weapons against its enemies. Iran's leadership, with its beaty-eyed president Armadinnerjacket at the forefront, has offered nothing in the way of progressive diplomacy and has done nothing except hiss and saber rattle.
DSP- CAPT/USNR
If Willard Romney tells Israel to strike Iran, they do it. Simple. He has already said he is cool with them starting another war. That is all he can do unless and until he gets into office. At that point, expect us to join into the bombing, and include North Korea, and maybe Cuba if we have any leftover missles.
Mitt's kids will be safely somewhere recruiting more cult members, so they will never be in harm's way. Willard selected France instead of Vietnam as the place where he wanted to go. Not that he didn't WANT to go fight. Of course he wanted to risk his life and maybe get his legs blown off. But his Church called, and told him to go to France, so he did. Brave man.
Oilman - we all see what we want to see. I see Israel who started several brutal military actions in the last 10 years or so, killing thousands of innocent people, and US which started 2 major and totally pointless wars in that time period which killed hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians. And how many wars did Iran start in the lat 30 years? None. GW Bush, gunning for war with Iraq at all cost, was a lot more detrimental to world peace than Ahmedinajad. Together with Cheney they are war criminals in my book, responsible for death of half a million Iraqi civilians.
Max - Bravo for saying the right thing.
Iran is being made into an existential threat when they hardly are a threat. N Korea actually is in open defiance on Nukes. But they are not made out into an existential threat. Why? Because they don't have oil. These israeli protesters are not just brave but wise as well since they can see through this even as they are going through threat of violence or actual violence every day.
Israel desperately needs to elect a new PM and Congress.
Having spoken to many Israelis, and an Iranian I might add, none of the want war, and most don't hold animosity towards each other. They all want peace. But like always, the Government of these two nations are so disconnected form reality and so extreme that one wonders how they even got there in the first place.
And where are you sitting, Tracy? Tel Aviv?
Tracy, there is a ton of blame to go around. The question is, does Israel escalate or work toward a more permanent peaceful solution?
Apparently 60% of Israelis think peaceful solutions are the answer.
Also note, MAD principles still apply. Iran having a nuke, while bad, is a whole lot less bad than a war at this stage. Iran already has enough rockets to obliterate most of Israel. They don't because of the retaliation. A nuke would not change the equation.
Very erudite OilmanMD, yet as history bears out, everything is always the fault of the Jews. The facts you point out are irrelevant to many as its only Jews, and pity the poor arabs who never got beyond the 15th century. When Iran nukes Israel none of these people here will be heard from.
NEVER AGAIN!
Max the biggest war monger in the world is IRAN . They ´ve committted terrorist attacks on 6 continents.Much of the world is arming themselves and soon many of these countries will take the war to Iran and bring down the Islamic terrorist nation!!
It takes two sides to talk and you can only talk for so long while they kill your people. Obama needs to learn this too. He needs to quit geting Americans killed while apologising for them killing us.
Tracy Warner 766
Let's see
1. Thermonuclear exchange
2. 100 mile corridor
Conclusion: probably better increase the size of that corridor considerably. Perhaps you should seek the advice of folks who have dealt with nukes before. I think you underestimate their impact.
OilmanMD......you said:
Perhaps you meant to say: "beady-eyed".
It is difficult to believe a captain ( equivalent to an Army colonel ) in the U.S. Navy could make such errors. It is even less believable that a Medical Doctor would make such mistakes. Maybe you live in Maryland.
In any case, why must you folks so frequently pretend to be things you are not? Is it because you are not taken seriously lest you embellish your resume?
BTW----Can you say why the Iranian students felt justified in taking American hostages in 1979? This will reveal the "depth" of your "knowledge".
First things first just who is mouthing off and trying to pick a fight, who stood in front of the UN assembly and made a hour long speech on their desire to wipe Israel off the map, who constantly makes the comments that they will destroy them, people only see what they want to see, personally though I don't want war I also don't want to see a country (government) like Iran to poses nuclear weapons or the materials to make them. they don't need the bomb or a delivery system, all they need is a small amount of radio active waste smuggle it into a foreign country and toss it into a water reservoirby the time someone figures out the problem its to late and the city is ruined by contamination, they could radiate a entire city render it and the area of drainage un inhabitable for years, can you imagine if even half of NYC was evacuated because of radio active water supply the damage that that would do even though there would be no actual destruction, that is what we are up against and that is certainly something that Iran'sgovernment is capable of doing and will do they threaten everyone with western ideas or open freedom, they have terrorist active in 1/3 of the world they support everything that we oppose like AlQuida, MBH, and Assad, Blame Israel all you want but the problem is Irans leaders and they are not going to change till something terrable happens and the free world steps in and dismantels their opressive system, its not the Iranian people at fault its just one group of radicals that are holding the rest of the country as some sort of victim to these extremist and the real spooky thing is that our government has been supporting some of these people and letting them take power all over the ME. If Iran is not dealt with today it will be to late, they are a growing power and they want and promised a Jihad, and the threats have been directed directly at the US since 1979. I would think that after 34 years of this crap you people could open your eyes, or is it that many of you are so young that you have just recently become aware of this mess, better wake up we should have kicked their a$$es when they attacked us back in 1979, that would have saved lives in the long run but we did not have a leader at the time, and we are doing the same thing now waiting till its a bigger problem, the hesitation will cost us. so stop blaming Israel its Iran that is picking the fight, once they have nukes they will start dictating, and one of the reasons they pick on Israel is to get at the US. and it wont be long before you start seeing those dirty bombs in use on populated areas contaminating water, air and food and displacing people by the hundreds of thousands, that's the way they will attack.
They don't want to talk...Iran wants to wipe you off the face of the earth! No matter how you slice it, you will STILL be wrapped in a white sheet! So do you lie down and just let them? NO! You fight for your right to exist! THOUSANDS of Jews have already died for YOUR rights...don't let it be in vain!
Welcome to the world of endless war. (Oh, by the way, Max, I'm not sure I can agree with you that invading Afghanistan was pointless. Personally, what I would have done there is circle Taliban headquarters with non-armed Cruise missiles, each with the following written on it in Arabic: 24 Hours. Bin Laden. Or get yourself way underground. Then we could leave them to their own devices.)
If anybody here remembers the old game of wrapping your hand around the neck of a baseball bat, and then the next guy puts his hand above yours, and the winner is the one who puts his hand on the bat handle? Well, trying to figure out who is most to blame for the state of affairs in the Middle East is like playing that game, except there's no end to the bat handle.
Frankly, I don't think Iran will use nuclear weapons against Israel. It would mean the end of the Persian civilization, and Ahmadinejad has to know that.
But the problem is, Iran having nuclear weapons would alter the balance of power in the region and that's what Israel is afraid of. The question is, are they willing to open up a sh*tstorm to preserve the balance of power?
And yes, I agree that the Israeli government's estimates of civilian casualties are simply ridiculous. To keep them that low, they have to have virtually everyone in bunkers before the first airstrike, and keep them there until after the last one.
How do you have an economy under those circumstances? If it drags on, as it likely would, for four or six weeks, how do you get food?
I think we're doing the right thing with Iran, slowly strangling them if they won't come to the table. I think we should tell Israel something similar. Of course, we'll defend you and continue sending you millions of dollars in aid.
Unless you strike first.
Well, Max, if Iranians dared to protest against their government's constant provocations toward Israel, then I would be impressed by their bravery...and sincerely mourn their imprisonment or execution.
So you aren't impressed by the bravery and good citizenship of those Israelis who have taken to the streets to make a civil public statement against Israel conducting a strike/war on Iran? Why not?!
Cassandra- I doubt you would hear about it. The people of Iran will jump at the chance for a less oppressive regime. You remember Ahmadinejad's "re-election"? It was widely accepted that the Builders party had fixed the election.
Angela,
I think Cassandra is drawing a contrast between how Iranian forces would handle protesters versus how Israeli forces would handle (jewish israeli) protesters. While I think it is noble that these protesters have taken to the streets, I can't help but wonder: Would they be against this war if the US fought it on their behalf? If not, than that shows that they are just concerned about themselves, not about the other sides civilian casualties.
I wonder where the protest will move to if Tel Aviv becomes a smoking hole in the desert.
Yeah, They are protesting becuz they know it is gonna be very bad not only for THEM but for the US and the whole world for that matter. The US and Israel have been putting this war off with Persia/Iran for a long time now. Iran is doing nothing wrong at all. If Pakistan has a nuclear program why not Iran? Strange isnt it?
Hey Cassandra, Iran has never provoked Israel. In fact here is Netanyahu in 1992, calling for the US to take action against Iran and claiming Iran is 3-5 years from a nuclear weapon. When has Iran ever said they want to make a first strike against Israel? They have said they will not be the first to strike and would only respond to a strike from Israel.
By the way, the 3-5 year time period has long been up, where is the nuclear weapon?
Here is a quote from trhe article:
Netanyahu "is determined to attack Iran before the U.S. presidential elections in November," Alon Ben David, the military correspondent for Israel's Channel 10 News, told NBC News.
Not only that, President Obama would have no choice but to back the Israeli strike, he said.
My question is why must Obama back an Israeli strike? Screw Israel. If they get themselves over their heads, let them lose. If they start the war, it is up to them to finish the war. The US has no responcibility to bail them out or help in any way. Israel, has already cost the US far too much. They were responcible for 9/11, the assasination of JFK, the attack on the Liberty and now they expect us to help them. What is in it for the US? Nothing but a big bill to add to our debt.
'1992:'Israeli parliamentarian Benjamin Netanyahu tells his
colleagues that Iran is 3 to 5 years from being able to produce a nuclear
weapon – and that the threat had to be "uprooted by an international front
headed by the US".
Right, Ralph...and Ahmadinejad calling Israel a "cancerous tumor" was a call to brotherhood.
Israel was responsible for 9/11? Where the hell did that come from?
Like InOtherNews said...I was contrasting freedom of speech in Israel, which seems to be virtually complete, with the same freedom in Iran, which is non-existent.
I said 2 years ago, Netanyahu was bad for Israel. He, like some in the US Military Industrial Complex is a born and bred war monger. Most older Americans watched for years as Anwar Sadat tried to bring Israel and some of its neighbors to peace agreements. Israel's warmongers don't want any agreement. That's history over the past 4 decades. Every time a US president attempted to bring the Israelis and any one of their neighbors to the table...it ended the same way...Israel demanding the other side move first. I thought agreements are ALL about compromises. Apparently not in the Israeli leadership view.
Netanyahu will long regret his push for a pre-emptive strike on Iran. Sadly, the beautiful country of Israel will get the worst of their warmongering leadership's decisions. Netanyahu also knows that if he pulls a pre-emptive strike before the US elections, the power of his strike will put this President in the position of either taking Israel's side or refusing to put any more US funding into an Israel/Iran war. Either way, Israel takes the biggest hit.
There are allot of people making post on this subject that don't have the faintest clue about what they are talking about, no clue at all.
Common sense would tell me that IRAN has no option in the matter. They have been openly threatened by Israel and need to respond preemptively. Those that underestimate Irans military strength are sorely misguided. How many weapons did the US provide them in the eighties? Does one think that if the US does get involved that China and the NEW president Putin will stand by idlely?
Remember the USS Liberty the only time America was attacked and did nothing. The attackers: ISRAEL!
Haven't they already had talks? And what was the outcome? I think it's pretty dumb to openly express that they are considering bombing Iran - they are taking a chance that Iran will jump the gun, and start a little bombing of their own.
Willard has already given his blessing. No sense waiting for Afghanistan and Iraq to wind down. Get another one going so we can have 15 continuous years of Republican started wars.
Iran is a threat to the whole world.Saudia Arabia and other Muslim and Arab countries want the head of the serpent which is Iran to be cut off.The attack on Iran will be by many countries.Most of the world will cheer when the ayatollahs and their Islamic revolution bite the dust!
Come on Bill, with 2 US Battle Groups just off shore, Israel can get as froggy as they want. "I'm a dinner jacket" may have a big mouth but his superiors aren't THAT crazy.
Twit Tracy? Really?
Not only do you have a limited amount of common sense as demonstrated by your previous 100 mile corridor comment, you have no actual knowledge to compensate. I get the impression that leaves simply acting as a mouth piece for FOX news.
1. You do not just stop a war in a day and go home. Armies don't work that way. Even if we weren't concerned with stabilizing an indigenous defense force we would still have to defend our own staged withdrawal to a secure extraction point. You know nothing!
2. Please show me where the man in the white house is either inept or a liar. No FOX BS. a reliable source. If you would like an example of a lying president...I give you the Iraq war.
You have a nice day.
Tracy...YOU are the liar. You can't prove a single one of those twerpy right wing accusations you call this President in a court of law and that's the only way to prove this president has lied about anything. I'm sooooo fed up with the Tea Party Twerps and their bully agenda straight out of the Koch Bircher Bible.
You call THIS president a liar? When Bush and Cheney lied about Iraq? How dare you? Who are these right wing anarchists hot to create a Civil War in hopes DogPatch USA will reinvent democracy into a Confederacy? Let me guess what state Tracy lives in....TX? GA? WI? FL? OK? KS? MS? LA? TN? KY? IA? Add any of the right wing fruit and nut states to this list...and you get backward people who have lived in corn fields polluted with more oil slime than all of the Middle East.
Post again Tracy when you can prove your posts in a court of law.
hey ewent, im from wisconsin and am an avid obama supporter, and far from a right wing nut. you have short hair, are you a rug muncher? easy on the assumptions or you sound as uneducated as tracy. visit wisco before you trash talk it you mutt
Common sense, dont bother with ewent. I have a feeling she is a troll who never has anything on topic to say and just tries to stir people up.
And considering all the promises he broke and his lies about working across the board and more transparency, yeah, Id say we have a liar in office.
israel is a threat to the whole world. Peace loving people around the world want the head of the serpent which is israel to be cut off.The removal of nittyahoo and replace his zionist warmongering government with a more moderate and rational one will be cheered by the rest of the world!
Tel Aviv is like a different Country from the rest of Israel. I wonder if perhaps in the future there will be distinct boundaries
Iran's leader is two straws short of the soda glass. Everyone knows that. The Iranian people are not Israel's enemy...their leaders are. The Iranian Testosteronies are just as bad as the Israeli Testosteronies. Both like to show butt and strutt around in their war dance routines. The world is sick of them and their wars. The US cannot afford to help Israel this time around. We cannot lose what little is left of our economy so Netty can play Mr. Hot Shot War Monger.
Israeli leadership knows why it wants Jerusalem and not Tel Aviv as its capital. Jerusalem is a direct hit on several religions. So..Netty wants to scoop it up and grab grab grab it rather than using common sense and admitting it's a Christian and Muslim bone of contention. No Old Testament wisdom in that.
ewent, wake up, These people have been at this for years, who do you think gets control of the office a person. Everyone in the black community doens't think the white community inslaved them just their leaders do, what. This is a religious war nothing more nothing less, we want to call it something different but it is not. You can cover cat pop with cat litter but it is cat pop covered in cat litter that is all it will ever be. you can not make it dog pop. This in the end is only going to come out one way and one way only, they want war, they will have it. Our religion is the only and right religion, remember there is only one GOD his name is???????????????????????
...
It is evident from these photos that hundreds of thousands of protesters are involved.
Iran can now breathe a little easier.
...
Tracy Warner...Bush isn't president anymore. Enough with the "MY way or the highway BS." President Obama will win by a landslide...crawl back into that anarchist hole with the rest of the neurotics of the right. Those pissypants tantrums of the Tea Party twerps isn't phasing a single member of the older generation.
So let's see some more of those tantrums so we can certify what a bunch of big babies right wingers really are...never grew out of their pampers from the looks of it.
That's why a majority of the elderly are conservative in this country huh ewent. Get ready to cry when Obama looses for failing the economy and his destructive acts.
If Mr.Netanyahu orders a "strike" on Iran, a lot of "innocent"people will suffer and die. Wrong move!
...
Exactly how Neville Chamberlain viewed things.
...
Art wins by TKO (i.e., Godwin's Law)....
nothing new here-1200374 Chamberlain didn't have hundreds of nukes, neither was a close friend of the only superpower, at the time the power was evenly distributed.
Art...That's what I'm afraid of too...All that hard work turning Israel into a beautiful place and one that could be a goldmine for tourism along with the rest of the Middle Eastern countries tourists won't go near...Sad. They work a lifetime to build Israel into the country it is today and one warmonger decides it "his way or the highway." What on earth can Netanyahu be thinking?
My prediction is they will strike before the election. They can't count on Romney to win and they'll figure Obama will have to support them or lose the Jewish vote and their many supporters. If Obama wins he'd be in his final term and wouldn't have to worry it.
Yes and we have a tough choice to make here as well. If Mitt wins, there is a good chance that Israel will take his previous statements as permission and strike Iran. I just don't see how this would not become a regional conflict. Considering the sanctions that are in place and the fact that the U.N is going there, they would be justified in striking back at Israel and if they do, then all bets are off. Its going to be a crazy election, that's for sure.
If Willard wins, anyone with teenage boys should join the LDS church as soon as possible. You will be able to send them to France like Willard did instead of going to war.
Just ignore the freaky stuff like the magic underwear, multiple levels of heaven, polygamy, and the other weird sheet that comes with being part of this cult. They are nice people, and they even let blacks become members now (although not allowed to hold higher office).
I don't think Romney CAN win. You have to remind yourselves who the GOP is pitching their line of bull to...the younger, more impressionable generations. Romney and the GOP are duping these kids big time. They are creating a false sense of security that the minute Romney takes office, debt will be wiped out, the deficit disappears, jobs will come back to the US in droves and salaries will be what they were when Clinton was president. Not not not not going to happen.
The proof is what the GOP did for these past 4 years....NOTHING. What bills did they pass to create jobs or get their cronies in the Corporate Welfare state to hire?
It's a pathetic attempt by the richest 1% to continue to live off the Gravy Train the Middle Class is providing for the next 10 generations and all they have to do is strut around, boss everyone around and put rose colored glasses on the dumbest asses of DogPatch and the younger generation.
There are enough Baby Boomers who do have huge investments in this country...Not not not going to let a bunch of Eddie Munster (Ryan) twerps flush the country down the toilet.
And more conflicts in the region, will not end well for any of the parties. The leaders, in all countries, should lead and stop the rhetoric
Unfortunately, the rhetoric is leading in the eyes of most politicians.
If Israel is waiting for the concurrence of Obama it will never come. Romney may be more receptive to helping Israel defend itself against countries that want to annihilate it.
Yes! Mitt is not afraid of war!!!! You Iranian heathens will fry in a Mormon sanctioned atomic hell!!! Yay for the Republicans!
American casualties will be limited to non-Mormon kids, who were going to hell anyway.
Why didn't we the US attack the Soviet Union back in the cold war days when Khrushchev said " we will bury you" do you really think another un-winable protracted war along with a huge surge in global terrorism is what we need now? I fail to see how this constitutes rational thinking. You people always seem to forget that Israel is militarily way more powerful than Iran, so now we bomb people for mouthing off, Iran has no way to back up any of its bellicose and insane rhetoric militarily and even if they have a bomb, they wouldn't dare use it for the same reason we and the USSR have never bombed each other (MAD) ..........Think people!
Go away Tracy, Starderup makes a great point. Keep burying your head in the sand.
very dumb comments from very common man...
The mere thought of an Israeli/Iran battle makes my head hurt and heart ache. I don't know really know enough about Iran's nuclear advancements but I would hope that if they are trying to prove they have the same scientific capabilities as other nations do, that perhaps it is time to negotiate with them a co-energy alliance in order to ensure and promise their nuclear advancements truly are in the name of energy security and nothing more.
I definitely do not 100% trust Iran on anything they say, but I'd feel much more inclined to see a benefit of a co-alliance with them on nuclear energy development than just puffing up our military might and encouraging Israel to strike. If Israel's sovereignty and security is truly, truly 100% verifiably in danger, then they have to do what they have to do. But the proof better be there. i don't want mere speculation fueling this potential war between these two.
Iran is trying to build a nuclear weapons, they have threatened Israel's existence and these lovely citizens want to try and establish peaceful dialog hoping that nothing bad will happen?
I'm going to go with "Things that are not a good idea" for $500 Alex!!
dw1...Is turning Israel and more than half the Middle East and Asia into a decimation of nuclear wasteland what you think is a better idea? Your way and there is no Israel, no Iran, No Middle East, people evacuating from lack of food and water contaminated by radiation...Facts don't bother you do they? How many more Chernobils do you think this planet can handle?
People who invest in war, invest in death. People who invest in peace, invest in life. Take your pick.
Ewent, do you think it's better to invest in "peace" and "life?" What would your moral basis be for that?
"Obama would have no choice but to back an Israeli strike"?! What?! Since when is US foreign policy dictated, even mandated, by a foreign power hell bent on still another war? Time to declare our independence (from Zionism).
Israel never has and never will need our help in a war. They are more than capable of taking care of themselves. We restrained Israel against Iraq and we are trying to do the same against Iran. The mistake they made against Lebanon will not be made twice and if and when they attack Iran it will swift, calculated and achieve the desired results the State of Israel intended to achieve.
Our foreign policy does not require foreign powers to dictate warfare. We've been able to accomplish that entirely ourselves, with the Military Industrial Political Complex leading the charge.
If a strike happened before the elections, Obama would assist because he would lose if he did not. That is also why a strike would happen before the elections, as after the elections there is less pressure to provide direct support regardless of who wins.
Tracy Warner...Is that what Israeli said when they decimated Lebanon twice? And is that what they said when Israeli borders with each of their neighboring wars extended those borders?
How about get a clue? I guess it takes a brain to have a clue. And as we all know, right wing minds are narrower than a peahole.
ewent, the Israelis extended their borders when they were used as a base to attack them three times.
People like this are like the drunk who loses his keys in a dark alley and then searches for them under a streetlamp. Why are they complaining to Netanyahu about the possibility of a war when it's Admadinnerjacket who is threatening to wipe everyone in Israel - these protesters included! - off the map? The Jews have already paid a heinous price once for failing to listen to a genocidal maniac who continually threatened to kill them all; I do not think they are eager to risk paying such a price again, and who can blame them!?!?
I blame them for the Palestinian holocaust, the war in Iraq, the war in Afghanistan, apartheid in Israel, ad nauseum.
So clearly Japan and China should attack one another. And North and South Korea. And India and Pakistan. And Ethiopia and any of its neighbors. Etc.
I'm sorry, but political saber rattling does not mean war is required. Iran with a bomb would not cause any destabilizationin the region for the exact same reason the US and USSR never went to war.
mtrose...the Jews are not the only victims of genocide. Not to diminish their suffering in any way. But, how concerned were we with the millions who died in Serbia? Or under the Pol Phot Regime? Khymer Rouge?
It is never worth turning a beautiful place like Israel into a nuclear garbage dump and vaporize millions of their own innocent people just so Netanyanu can show ass to his Middle East neighbors. The Iranian people are just as fed up with their leaders as the Syrians.
But, Israel cannot possibly hope to take on Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, Turkey, Egypt and the rest of the Middle Eastern countries who will take the side of Iran..up to an including Russia and China. Is it worth it?
mtrose...the Jews are not the only victims of genocide. Not to diminish their suffering in any way. But, how concerned where you with the millions who died in Serbia? Or under the Pol Phot Regime? Khymer Rouge?
It is never worth turning a beautiful place like Israel into a nuclear garbage dump and vaporize millions of their own innocent people just so Netanyanu can show ass to his Middle East neighbors. The Iranian people are just as fed up with their leaders as the Syrians.
But, Israel cannot possibly hope to take on Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, Turkey, Egypt and the rest of the Middle Eastern countries who will take the side of Iran..up to and including Russia and China. Is it worth it?
Ewent, you asked 'is it worth it?" Maybe yes, maybe no. You seemed to be making moral judgments all over the place. Again what is your moral foundation for your thoughts and assumptions?
Obama wouldn't have to back your bombing, @!$%#. He's probably condemn you and break all ties. Or, as I'd prefer, bomb you.
Hey, "ThatDudeWiththeBifocals" why don't you take your glasses and shove em up your ass.
The one thing you had right is that Obama doesn't have to back anything. Israel will do whatever it wants. The Israeli army has more going on everywhere in the world than any other army can even dream of. They will do whatever they want, however they want, and they will succeed immensely. You can't compare the American war with Iraq to this. That is just comparing apples and a 2 week old moldy orange. Israel will get in there, take care of business, and go back to their lives which will as a result be much more peaceful.
Maybe move yourself to Iran and then threaten to bomb Israel. See how that goes for you when you aren't sitting comfortably behind your computer screen half naked trying to molest little girls online in America you pervert.
More going on in the world everywhere? Can you site references? Some news articles of the great achievements? Your just a zealot and an idiot. Baseless claims are the foundation of religous war mongers.
1) Read "Son of Hamas"
2)
3) Do you really think the IDF, or any army for that matter, would publicly disclose their top secret missions around the world?
4) Anything else you dumbass?
5) Baseless anti semetic, racist, uneducated dumb asses like you are the foundation of the worsening economy and overall negatives in the world.
**2) look up: Israel seen.com
That Dude...Wow...The Bircher Koch billionaires must really be scraping the bottom of the "jerk barrel" today. What's their going salary for President bashing these days?
ewent, if you are suggesting that the Koch Brothers are Jewish, you are wrong. They are of Dutch descent and live in Kansas.
"All I know is, I finally get to kill somebody."
-Psycho (from Stripes)
The world would be a better place without Israel.
I really wish after WWII we had simply moved all Jews to the US rather than Israel. Israelis are an educated and industrious people. We would have benefited, and the middle east would be a very different (and more peaceful) place.
Oh well, it didn't happen that way. So instead of advocating for Israel to bomb X country, or the destruction of Israel, why don't we work on some sort of lasting peace efforts. The heated rhetoric is counter productive.
And a much better place without you.
Herb1938...What's with the burrs up right wing asses these days? Is this the face you project for our younger generations? Little wonder they are so snarky, pouty, petulant and pull tantrums to get attention. Look who is giving them the best example of how to breed hate?
In my view, all the most hateful right wingers out there should be put on a remote island so they can cannabilize each other and get the hell out of this country so the rest of us can have some peace and quiet. If all the right wing aholes know is bitching, bullying and hate...their cancer needs some serious surgery.
That's right, ewent...the left wing is so right to support the feudal Arabs against the socialist Israelis. And a lot of the hate that we see on this site is coming from so-called leftists like you.
Not wanting Israel to start world war 3 isn't supporting Arabs. Calls for peace are considered hate speech in your world?
The Republicans only hope of a victory is in fact the establishment of another war for the Republican machine that benefits from war by producing the implements of war don't go out of business. They are worried right now due to the fact the Iraq is winding down and the withdrawal of Afghanistan is in the works. The absence of war hurts the Republican cause. For them there is no profit motive in peace anywhere.
Seems to me if the US joins in any more wars that do not directly involve conflict on US soil we only hasten our economic demise.
Enough is enough!
It will be the governments of the West that start the nuclear conflagration in the Middle East. It will be the common men of the world that suffer the consequences.
We are given a superficial view of Iran and Isreal. First Ahmadinejad is not the true power in Iran, he is more of a figurehead than not. His power is limited. The real power in Iran is the religious council backed by the religious militias. Anything Ahmadinejad says is primarily bluff intended primarily for internal consumption. Only the religious council decides whether to attack another country and they are not so crazy as to really bomb Isreal.
The real reason for developing nuclear weapons is not Isreal but protection from India. China, and especially Pakistan. Remember the Islamic world is divided between the Shiite branch of Islam (primarily Iran and Iraq) and Sunni Islam (most other Islamic countries). Iran has more to fear from Sunni Islamic countries than from Isreal.
Iran would not launch a nuclear attack on Isreal because Isreal would counterattack and have itself destroyed. Both North Korea and Pakistan are more real world threats than Iran.
If Isreal and/or the United States bombs Iran, conventional warheads are unlikely to penetrate the hardened bunkers built by Iran. We might possibly be talking about using nuclear warheads to penetrate the bunkers. Unless it goes perfect and explodes underground, we are talking about potentially hundreds of millions of people dying of radiation exposure in Iran, Iraq, Pakinstan, India, etc..., depending which way the winds blow. Be prepared for $10/gallon gasoline and worldwide economic depression.
They might as well do it now because if they don't they will get wiped out.
What would you do if your next door neighbors said I am going to kill you and your children as soon as I save up enough money to buy a gun? Why does Iran want to destroy Israel? They don't even have Oil. They do have a democracy and a free society though. Is that what they hate? THINK ABOUT IT!
Iran has not stated they want to kill Israelis. Many Jews are living live happily in Iran, which shows the Iranians have nothing against Jews. Iran does not like the war mongering leadership of Israel, because of their land stealing ways.
Israel has nothing that Iran wants, whereras, Iran has oil, gas , water and other natural resources, all things Israel wants. The Persian have been living on the same land for many centuries, whereas most Jews left the ME more than a thousand years ago, forfeiting their claim to any of the Arab land on which Israel now sits.
Iran would have nothing to gain by attacking Israel, even if they won handily, which they would not, as Israel is far more well armed, thanks to America.
Israel wants to remain the big dog in the ME, so they can continue to steal more and more Arab land and water. They consider Iran a threat to their dominance and want to strike while they still think they have American support.
We are sick and tired of fighting wars for Israel and cannot afford to support the Israeli parasites any longer. Here is the real reason for the war in iraq, planned and sold by Zionists.
Once the Pentagon's choice to lead the "new" Iraq, Chalabi
promised to reopen an old British-built pipeline from Kirkuk in northern Iraq
to the Israeli port of Haifa. The plan impressed Richard Perle, Douglas Feith
and other conservatives influencing Bush administration policy toward Iraq in
the lead-up to last year's war.
The idea also drew enthusiastic response from Israel.
"The pipeline would be a dream," Yosef Paritzky, Israel's minister
of infrastructures, said as reported by Salon.com. "We'd have an
additional source of supply, and could even export some of the crude through
Haifa. But we'd need a treaty with Iraq . . . to build the pipeline."
Once Chalabi assumed a position of influence in the new Iraqi government,
Israel would get its treaty, the neoconservatives were assured.
http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/19725/iraq-to-haifa-oil-pipeline-could-spur-economic-rebirth/
Right, Ralph. Ahmadinejad said that Israel was a "cancerous tumor" because of a misunderstanding...he MEANT to say that he wanted to invite them to visit and "can they come sooner?" (Sarcasm).
Gee Cassandra, read this. I hereby call Israel a cancerous tumor. Does that mean I will attack Israel?
To Wolfbaby - Yes, Israel was complicit in 9/11. They had infiltrated the hi jackers, were living nearby and knew the timetable. They also protected the hi jackers, with the aid of some in our own government. The planes did not take down the WTCs, nano-thermite explosives did. All 3 buildings were owned by the same Jew, Silverstein and had been recently insured for billions. Bldg 7 was not even hit, yet fell into it's own footprint in 6.5 seconds. The 2 towers fell in the same manner.
5 Israelis were caught filming themselves and celebrating, with the falling towers in the background. They said they were there to film the event. At least 2 of them were with the Mossad and were trained in demolition. They worked for a moving company, whose owner fled to Israel the day after the towers fell. Here are some links from which you can learn.
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5A3dW_gUwOg
British Newman -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgABDdU7yD8&feature=related
If conventional arms are used, I hope the situation could remain regional. We did sell them some of our bunker busters. On the other hand, if one atom is split, I'm afraid it would quickly become an international war with China and Russia getting into the mix. Turn out the lights, the party is over...
Best comment I've read so far.
The CIA, the Mossad, and MI-6, have all concurred that Iran is NOT building nukes. Nor is there any evidence that they intend to do so which would be up to the Ayatolah. Ahmedinejad doesn't control anything except the Parliament. He cannot speak for the Ayatollah. Just a lot of media hype when nothing is really going on.
I voted for Obama because he promised us he would get us out of the Middle Eastern War.He didn't and the gutless Congress failed miserably to halt the appropriations to the corrupt regimes across the Middle East.
Is there any reason for the US to expand the conflict in the Middle East with the threat of further intervention?Does anyone think China or Russia needs to send troops into this region when they simply use diplomacy to get their goals and attract the US.
Re-establish relations with Venezuela when Chavez dies,re-establish relations with Cuba when Castro croaks,and get out the Middle East altogether. Let them put pipelines through Jordan,Syria,and Israel and bypass the damn Iranians.
mtrose123, Well said. It is Iran that is the problem and always has been the the source of threats of war.
Israel has a right to defend itself, even if that means taking a pre-emptive strike. You pacifists appearantly failed your history courses. Every time Israel has negotiated with its enemy neighbors it has given up substantial amounts if its territory for a " guarantee of peace". Where has that gotten them?
Moreover, Jehovah, their God has promised to protect them, if they will seek his face. I know you scoffers will scoff at this, but that is also part of Biblical history. How else do you explain 10 mil Jews surviving against 100 mil. Arabs who frequently vow to destroy them?
Fincon...And I seem to recall a passage in the Old Testament where the Jews broke their covenant with Yahweh and their punishment was banishment to Egypt as slaves. Using the Bible to prove one culture is "chosen" no longer works. There are as many fine, talented, educated Jews in the US as in Israel. What would we do without their contributions to science, education, the arts and even the government? Some of our very best politicians like Senator Schumer have spent their lives helping others.