Israel's ultra-Orthodox community confronts child sex abuse with new book

TEL AVIV – The ultra-Orthodox community in Israel, known as Haredim, has a closed and secluded way of life. They look at the secular population with a degree of suspicion and try to manage their own affairs. To that end, rabbis try to deal with cases of violence and sexual misconduct internally – without alerting outside authorities.

That cultural mentality makes it even harder to tackle sensitive subjects like the sexual abuse of children.

Now, for the first time, a book published in Hebrew tackles the growing problem of sexual abuse among children in the ultra-religious community, trying to break the silence in the closed community.

Paul Goldman / NBC News

The cover of Ella Bargai's book that aims to educate ultra-Orthodox Israeli Jews about the dangers of child sex abuse,

“Our main goal was to create a dialogue between children and their parents,” Ella Bargai, a secular Jew working at the Intercultural Center for Human Sexuality and Sexual Life near Jerusalem, told NBC News. She joined forces with Nitai Melamed, an Orthodox rabbi, to write a book called, “A Better Safe than Sorry Book.”


Since the Orthodox community is so closed, there are no reliable statistics on the depth of the problem in Israel. In New York’s ultra-Orthodox Jewish community, the crimes – and the effort to cover them up by prominent members of the community – gained widespread media attention and public condemnation, leading to several arrests this summer.

The book is unique for the Israeli Orthodox community because it encourages both religious children and their parents the importance of talking about the issue. The book’s central message to children is the crucial fact that nobody has the right to touch your private body parts.

Bargai said the main obstacle religious kids have is the fact they just don’t have the vocabulary needed to describe the bad things people can do to them.  For example, Orthodox children are not taught the Hebrew words for sexual organs.

"There is a huge anguish and pain trying to describe sexual abuse to a parent. With the book we try to break this taboo of not talking," Bargai said.

The book is based on American author Sol Gordon's “A Better Safe Than Sorry Book: A Family Guide for Sexual Assault Prevention,” published in 1996.

Paul Goldman / NBC News

A page from the Israel book educating ultra-Orthodox children and parents about sex abuse.

The Israeli version represents a breakthrough because the authors worked closely with religious leaders who understand the importance of establishing a dialogue that can combat sexual abuse.  It is being distributed by religious teachers to parents and their kids in Israel and they are encouraged to read it together.

Its drawings show religious characters in the modest dress they are familiar with – men have beards and sidelocks, while women have their heads covered. There is even a cuddly lamb that Orthodox children can relate to because the lamb is a kosher animal.

On one page a religious man offers candy to a girl who is warned that this kind of behavior is dangerous and that she should be cautious.

"Children are curious," said Bargai, "and the information we provide will help them to protect themselves."

In the book there is an illustration of a girl with the warning caption: "Nobody has any right to touch your body's private areas and you are not supposed to touch those areas on anyone else."

Paul Goldman / NBC News

A page from the new book in Israel aimed at educating children about the dangers of sex abuse.

So far, the book has been well-received in Israel; it sold out of its first printing soon after its publication and will be reissued soon. The book is also available in English.

More world stories from NBC News:

Follow World News from NBCNews.com on Twitter and Facebook

 

Discuss this post

Now, for the first time, a book published in Hebrew tackles the growing problem of sexual abuse among children in the ultra-religious community, trying to break the silence in the closed community.

Firstly let me say I suspect that the problem has always been there.

Secondly this is good first step but more needs to be done but the fact that it's being distributed by religious teachers is a hopeful sign.

  • 9 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:32 PM EDT

for years they have had the problem in NYC in the Hasidic Jewish community. They told everyone this is a private matter and don't get involved. They never did a thing and get away with it. I am wondering why?

  • 6 votes
#1.1 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 2:47 AM EDT

I think the book is a good first step, I live part-time in Brooklyn's Borough Park neighborhood, the Hasidic Jews are VERY closed to outsiders - you won't get a smile, you will not get a reply if you say "Hi," and when I tried to help an elderly gentleman with a very heavy door, he brushed me off - It was in that community where a man abducted a child last year - it was the first day that child (8) was allowed to walk home from summer camp. He became lost and asked a Hasidic man for directions, I'm not sure if the child was molested (don't think so) - but the man ended up killing the child.

About 6 weeks ago, I was there, it was in the news that the man plead guilty and the family would not have to go through a gut-wrenching trial. That part of the story I did bring up with a women - she said "We don't speak of those things, not the man and not the boy."

There are plenty of people in the neighborhood who are not Jewish, but the boy was probably told that if he asked a community member (easily distinguished by hair and attire), he would be OK - the dangerous people are the ones who are not Hasidic. I talked in more general terms to the women - and I have to say, I do not know how the boy's mother could possibly cope with the loss of her son in that community. Once Shiva is over, she is not supposed to talk about her grief, her loss, her son - a happy story about him - nothing. I can't imagine her pain and then the pain that she has to deal with all her loss, alone, everyday.

Having a close-knit community is good in many ways, but not so closed that secrets of child abuse etc... are only discussed by the men, prayed on and nothing more happens. I'll look for this book but if it's not in Hebrew, it will not be read in this community. The children do not speak English until they are older (8 or so)- that is also a problem - the police (who you rarely see there) are not Hebrew speakers. I thought the story said it was in Hebrew, but the picture is not...I hope the book dispels the myth that all others who live in the community but who are not Jewish are to be shunned, I hope the book tells the child to scream when in danger - a child screaming will have 30 adults (from every race and creed) on the scene in a second to help the child.

When NBC ran the story of this child - many commented that they would never let an 8 year old walk home alone (it was only a few blocks) - this is a very safe neighborhood, children are always out playing (under watchful eyes) - no matter what city/town or state, you don't expect a child abduction and death, but it happens, unfortunately. I hope this book will save a child from anyone who wishes to do them harm!

  • 1 vote
#1.2 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:22 AM EDT
Reply

that is an awesome thing to do.

  • 6 votes
Reply#2 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 2:32 PM EDT

The Ultra Orthodox community in Israel, and hopefully in the United States, is one step closer to coming into the 21st Century.

It is highly admirable they now acknowledge that Child Sexual Abuse could be a part of their Community. I sincerely hope they also "open" up to other subjects, that might be very private amongst themselves, for fear they will be shamed.

We can only be Free if people are willing to learn, and educate themselves/ourselves..

Child Sexual Abuse is in ALL communities, in all walks of life, rich, poor, middle class, homeless. We as parents, relatives and friends must make this subject one that is not, thrown under the carpet, secretive.. Imagine the child's torture from this, and future mental good health.

It is utterly important. Don't be a spouse, or partner that is an Enabler to this subject. It happens all the time.

  • 11 votes
#2.1 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:16 PM EDT

that is an awesome thing to do.

Now only if we can get people to put such a book next to every Bible in the pews of Catholic Churches!

  • 9 votes
#2.2 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:35 AM EDT

ChrisWanker Your slam against the Catholic Church is unwarranted. It is true, of course, that Catholic priests have been guilty of these offenses just like---BUT NOT IN GREATER NUMBERS---others outside the Catholic Church have been. It is also true that, in the past, The Catholic Church officials have too often covered up these offenses rather than deal with them properly. HOWEVER, in recent years the CC has tried very hard to investigate and properly deal with these offenses, including, but not limitined to, reporting offenders to the proper civil authorities and disrobing offenders and changing the procedures in accepting and educating potential priests in order to eliminate, if possible, and certainly reduce unacceptable candidates to the priesthood. Has The Catholic Church been perfect in all its' actions. Of course not! Have You been succeessful in all Your actions??????

  • 4 votes
#2.3 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:14 AM EDT

Matilda Tuscany,

In a Tony Stark voice, "Uh, yeah... Don't believe any of it."

  • 1 vote
#2.4 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:14 AM EDT

no offense intended, but, i've never seen anything but hymnal in the pews of a catholic church.

and i've always wondered about that. seems strange not to see the "book" in its proper place.

    #2.5 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:00 AM EDT

    Jim - It's because the Catholic Church is a very tradition bound institution, that's slow to change and slow to adopt new practices (part of its strength but also part of its weakness). Its roots go back to a period when books like a Bible were tremendously expensive and a family was lucky to own a single copy, much less enough of them to line a pew.

    Further, large parts of a Mass were conducted in Latin, something the congregation could understand in a religious context, but likely couldn't read, if they were literate at all.

    Hence the Priest or Deacon conducts the reading for the group, from the single Altar copy of the Bible. Until the 20th Century, it was very much an oral tradition. This is mirrored in most of the older religious traditions that predate cheap printing and higher literacy rates.

    The Hymnals are relatively new additions as literacy rose and the congregations sang religious songs less frequently outside of services and began to need help with the words.

    Other Christian denominations, that arose in later eras, don't have this tradition, and read along from Church copies or personal Bibles they have brought with them. Catholics today likely have Bibles at home of course, but they still go to Church expecting the readings to be a communal experience done by the Pastor or his assistant.

    Hope that helps.

      #2.6 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 9:26 AM EDT
      Reply

      This is a good start; Isrealis now realize they got problems and they have to admit it...

      Next, besides uncovering perverts, isreal needs to uncover and treat thiefs, cheats, swindlers..

      Next, teach every isreali citizen that they are normal human beings, they are not superior to anybody, in fact, perhaps they are inferior in some qualities....

      Next, teach everybody that they need to respect other races, nations, religions with whom they may have disagreements..

      Next, teach every isreali citizen that they need to compromise to resolve issues with other people.. If they insist they cannot be wrong, they might get whacked in the head so hard, they would not know what hit them...

      • 9 votes
      #3 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:17 PM EDT

      Abdallah

      This is about a serious issue and you want to turn it into Israeli bashing!

      Grow up!

      • 11 votes
      #3.1 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 3:25 PM EDT

      Of course its serious...

      If isrealis admit that they are not perfect and discuss/prosecute these issues, so many children would not have suffered abuse..

      • 6 votes
      #3.2 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 4:05 PM EDT

      If isrealis admit that they are not perfect and discuss/prosecute these issues, so many children would not have suffered abuse..

      Are you reading the same article or one printed on the insides of your eyelids that only you can see?

      • 9 votes
      #3.3 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 5:54 PM EDT

      They look at the secular population with a degree of suspicion and try to manage their own affairs. To that end, rabbis try to deal with cases of violence and sexual misconduct internally – without alerting outside authorities.

      That cultural mentality makes it even harder to tackle sensitive subjects like the sexual abuse of children.

      "Secular" isrealis do not see orthos as different creatures; They are very much part of isreali society... Any problem orthos have is all isreali's problem..

      Remember, it was an ortho jew who assasinated Yitzhak rabin, who is one of very very few jews who had world's respect because of his integrity, honesty and dignity, none of which current clowns in isreali cabinet possess).

      What is your point?

      • 6 votes
      #3.4 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:32 PM EDT

      abdallah -

      The Catholics are addressing the child abuse issue, The Jews are now addressing same, when are the radical muslim going to address the rape, child molestation and torture issues?

      • 11 votes
      #3.5 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:53 PM EDT

      farideh,

      It may not be completely true, but it is much much much less than the occurences in catholic church and ortho jews or in judaism in general..

      One reason is that it is severly punished in muslim societies, not only in judicial system, but off the courts as well.

      • 3 votes
      #3.6 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:19 PM EDT

      Abdallah

      Remember, it was an ortho jew who assasinated Yitzhak rabin, who is one of very very few jews who had world's respect because of his integrity, honesty and dignity, none of which current clowns in isreali cabinet possess).

      Rabin's assassination has nothing to do will the article, your constant digression simply displays your desire to vilify Israelis in general.

      • 7 votes
      #3.7 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:23 PM EDT

      The Catholics are addressing the child abuse issue, The Jews are now addressing same, when are the radical muslim going to address the rape, child molestation and torture issues?

      Considering the Muslim Prophet married and had sex with a nine year old

      • 6 votes
      #3.8 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:26 PM EDT

      Arab meeting tackles child abuse

      By Dale Gavlak
      BBC News, Amman

      A conference aimed at preventing child abuse in the Arab world has been taking place in Amman, Jordan.

      It is the first meeting to gather professionals from 18 Arab countries who are trying to tackle violence against children head on.

      They want to draw public attention to an often hidden yet pervasive problem.

      The silence surrounding abuse exists on many levels, participants argued, and it must be broken if covert violence against children is to be stopped.

      Child protection specialists said the fact that there were no fixed statistics on abuse in the Arab world was shocking, particularly because they know it is widespread.

      The number of reported cases is very low, they argued, and that belies the truth about what is really going on.

      Gert Kapelari, a delegate for the United Nations children's agency Unicef, said a survey among school children in eight Arab countries showed that the numbers were staggering.

      "Where we asked children to what extent they have been victims of abuse or other forms of violence, what comes out of the preliminary findings are really shocking," he said.

      "We have to conclude that more than half of the children are, in one way or another, victims of violence and even sometimes of severe abuse," Mr Kapelari added.

      http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3487806.stm

      FYI

      • 8 votes
      #3.9 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:35 PM EDT

      mess,

      Violence against children and/or abuse is really non-sexual nature, such as slapping a kid is considered a punishment in muslim society for the good of the kid...

      So, you need to differentiate between "abuse" as in church molestation and slapping, hitting a child for punishment are totally diffferent things.

      • 4 votes
      #3.10 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:40 PM EDT

      Read the entire article

      Dr Hani Jahshan, who works at Jordan's Family Protection Unit, said he saw 560 reported cases of physical and sexual abuse among children in the country last year.

      http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3487806.stm

      Or there's this

      The hypocrisy of child abuse in many Muslim countries

      Child marriage and pederasty are tolerated in Muslim societies where homosexuality is strictly condemned

      http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/apr/25/middle-east-child-abuse-pederasty

      or this

      Fatima is 26 years old, born and raised within a strict Islamic family in the United Arab Emirates. When she was 15 years old, she was raped by her stepfather. The sexual abuse continued for the next four years.

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/documentaries/2009/03/090326_outlook_islamabuseconf.shtml

      Or this

      While talking to The Express Tribune, Rutgers World Population Foundation (WFP) Country Head Qadeer Baig described child abuse as an “epidemic in our society”.

      “Recent statistics claiming that only five children a day are sexually abused show that the crime is highly under-reported,” he said.

      Baig quoted an estimate that 25 per cent of children are abused, while up to 50 per cent of disabled children fall victim to such abuse in the country.

      http://tribune.com.pk/story/342190/child-sexual-abuse-for-some-children-home-is-the-most-dangerous-place/

      • 6 votes
      #3.11 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:54 PM EDT

      Teach them that many Muslims are crazy and they will not stop with hatred until every infidel is killed.

      Tell them not to touch a Muslim's left hand

      Tell them that Mohammed had a 9 yo bride

      Tell them that Muslims, 22% of the world population have won 10 Nobel prizes and that Jews, with .2% of the world population have won 185 Nobel prizes.

      Tell them that the pro-Muslim Abdallah Abdallah is using TCP/IP (invented by a Jew) to spread his hate on the internet

      • 6 votes
      #3.12 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 5:30 AM EDT

      Abdallah Abdallah

      Orthodox Jews ARE a part of Israel society, like radical terrorist killers are part of yours

      .

      You seem so interested in fixing the Jews when it is the MUSLIMS that are causing all the problems. Jews don't shove their religion down people's throats. They don't kill women for driving or showing an ankle. Muslims cause a lot of problems and few solutions. Why don't you spend time fixing YOUR Muslim situations and learn to get along.

      • 7 votes
      #3.13 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:21 AM EDT

      mess,where do you get your facts? seriously??? You sound ignorant...

      • 1 vote
      #3.14 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:02 AM EDT

      Ok, save the goats!

      • 1 vote
      #3.15 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:06 AM EDT

      Abdallah ....... Please to inform me where I can find the latest film of a Jewish husband executing his wife, to the cheers of a hundred Jewish onlookers, for the heineous crime of the wife of being the victim of a brutal rape. I am waiting, waiting,waiting.......... and I suspect I will still be waiting when we meet at the bridge.

      • 4 votes
      #3.16 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:34 AM EDT

      Tell them that Muslims, 22% of the world population have won 10 Nobel prizes and that Jews, with .2% of the world population have won 185 Nobel prizes.

      jews with 0.2% of world population accounts for 25% of financial crimes (Fraud, ponzi schemes etc), and 10% of massacres (killing women and children in refugeee camps)...

      • 2 votes
      #3.17 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:45 AM EDT

      You seem so interested in fixing the Jews when it is the MUSLIMS that are causing all the problems

      Not true..

      Muslims you see on tv seem wild, protesting in the streets.. mullahs imposing strict rules in afghanistan who look like from stone ages etc etc does not look good at all.

      But it is the isrealis with evil approach to everything, citing the holocost , massacring at will...

      Just think about it:

      No arab, muslim guerillas, protests, anti western attitude until 1948...All middle aest was our friend and they looked up to us..

      When we started supporting isrealis, arabs did not like it.. The more we supported isreal, the more beliggerant isreal has become and started to act like brats...

      • 1 vote
      #3.18 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:29 PM EDT

      Abdallah Abdallah, western psychology generally categorizes abuse into three categories: emotional, physical, and sexual. No, not everyone that is a victim of one is a victim of the other two. It is more likely that if one of these types of abuse occurs, the other two are indicated.

      • 2 votes
      #3.19 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 12:37 PM EDT

      Abdallah:

      You have run out of subjects, excuses for the Israeli's.

      It is obvious, you are a Anti Semite. Admit it. Nothing will ever come across as positive re: Israel, and it's total population of which there are Arabs, Christians, Atheists, and other secular religions.

      There is no winning a discussion with an obtuse person.

      • 3 votes
      #3.20 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 3:03 PM EDT

      march

      if it makes you feel any better, I do like Seinfeld show a lot.

      And do not call anybody who criticizes isreal an anti semi. Thats getting old....There are lots wrong with isreal, and its too bad you do not like to hear them..

      Just like the media over here in US; You hardly ever hear isreal did something wrong....

        #3.21 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:45 PM EDT

        Abdallah

        A. Jews have not committed 10% of the worlds massacres, unless your definition of a massacre is very different than mine

        B. Isrial, while having committed many crimes against the palistinians, has been surrounded by arabs who have been DELIBERATLY ATTACKING CIVILIANS since bofore the country even gained independance in 1948 (see Hebron Massacre, 1929) (they also had anti weastern attitude stemming first fro feelsing of turkish superiority under the ottomans and than late due to resentment over he impeialistic policies of the west in the region). The deaths caused by the Israili's pale in comparison, and therefore, I find it hard to give the palistinians much sympathy at this point.

        C. Since Isrial isn't really hun vy very devout Jews, you are probably not an antisemite

        D. This entire conversation has nothing to do with the artical.

        • 1 vote
        #3.22 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 12:52 AM EDT

        Sam

        mess,where do you get your facts? seriously??? You sound ignorant...

        The links are in the posts.

        Rather than simple insult fellow posters why don't you try and debate the topic at hand

          #3.23 - Sun Sep 23, 2012 2:33 PM EDT
          Reply

          "growing problem of sexual abuse among children in the ultra-religious community"

          • 2 votes
          Reply#4 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 6:05 PM EDT

          Abdallah, I would not be the first to cast stones. Mahmoud Ahmadinejad denies there are even gays is his country and I hate to think of what AIDS is doing on the down low in the entire Middle East. Child safety is critical, but, we cannot have a safe and engaging world for adults or children without acknowledging some basics of the human condition. And I am not making being gay and child abuse equal. Just facets of human sexuality behavior that need to be understood .

          • 5 votes
          Reply#5 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:09 PM EDT

          It's Israel bashing that's all.

          • 5 votes
          #5.1 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:22 PM EDT

          Mahmoud Ahmadinejad denies there are

          I really doubt there are gays in iran or in other arab countires...

          if there are any, they need balls to come out in to open... Those places are not exactly San Franciisco or West Hollywood atmosphere...

          • 1 vote
          #5.2 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:35 PM EDT

          I really doubt there are gays in iran or in other arab countires...

          If there are no Gays why do they need so many laws against them?

          Iran's persecution of gay community revealed

          Lifestyles of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people exposes them to horrific punishment, study finds

          http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/may/17/iran-persecution-gay-community-revealed

          Iran executes three men on homosexuality charges

          Convicts were sentenced to death 'for acts against the Sharia law and bad deeds'

          http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/sep/07/iran-executes-men-homosexuality-charges

          Sure there aren't.

          • 4 votes
          #5.3 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 7:44 PM EDT

          Are you gay? (Not that anything wrong with it)

          • 1 vote
          #5.4 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:11 PM EDT

          Are you gay? (Not that anything wrong with it)

          If you truly believe there's nothing wrong with it why would it be important?

          • 4 votes
          #5.5 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 8:31 PM EDT

          Mess

          I believe that was a Seinfeld reference. aka humor?

          • 2 votes
          #5.6 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:02 AM EDT

          Abdallah Abdallah - there are no gay Muslims....I guess not, your people kill them all

          • 2 votes
          #5.7 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:19 AM EDT
          Reply

          It would be helpful if people of every culture would realize that we are really no different from each other-----!!

          • 3 votes
          Reply#6 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 9:18 PM EDT

          the problem is that most child sexual abuse occurs at the hands of family members or extended family members, more likely in the multi-generational households many in the religious israeli community live in. how do kids overcome this? i coudn't and it turns out i still bear scars 50 years later. thank fully, i am not an abuser.

          • 6 votes
          Reply#7 - Wed Sep 19, 2012 10:16 PM EDT

          Does the book explain the mutilation to a baby's sex organ by a rabbi?

          • 2 votes
          Reply#8 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:01 AM EDT

          I see you don't know anything about Judaism or circumcision. The circumcision is not done by a rabbi but by a mohel who is trained how to do this. Also better read up on the newest findings on how much it costs the US each year to treat diseases of un-circumcised people. Also it is the Muslims who mutilate a girl's clitoris so she can't enjoy intercourse.

          • 5 votes
          #8.1 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:19 AM EDT

          Now that is going to get the god nuts to defend, LOL they all bait and switch.

          • 1 vote
          #8.2 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:01 AM EDT

          Grossman - the rabbi officiates the mutilation & the father is suppose to do the dirty work. The mohel is a paid scapegoat who is employed by the rabbi & the father to commit the crime against the helpless victim.

            #8.3 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 4:29 PM EDT

            Baby boys are circumcised in the U.S. of all religions or none at all.It is a health issue.

            • 1 vote
            #8.4 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 7:45 PM EDT

            Hey "bobs ur uncle", hate much? Your saints changed the rules of Judaism so they get more converts from among the pagans in Judea. I mean, what adult male would want to endure the ceremony of conversion. So change the rules. Get your facts right. But, I'm sure that's beyond you. Hate-on Bob!! But you can't touch me. Thought negates hate.

              #8.5 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:21 AM EDT
              Reply

              Just like all religions on this earth, they ALL have this problem because it has been the perfect hiding place for child abusers. Without help, these kids then just go on repeating the abuse.

              Is it any wonder that with the over population of this planet that it is such a problem. It is like shooting fish in a barrel.

              So many to abuse and the leaders of theses religions have know about the problem from the beginning but so much easier to hide it under the rug than admit to it and deal with it.

              • 1 vote
              Reply#9 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:39 AM EDT

              I agree that religious community has too often been a facade for child abuse. But over population in and of itself is not a cause of abuse. It is the economic conditions that often surround over population which cause abusive situations.

              • 1 vote
              #9.1 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:38 PM EDT
              Reply

              See folks, the Catholic church doesn't have a monopoly on this area. :)

              • 2 votes
              Reply#10 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:48 AM EDT

              Abdallah , here is a little dose of reality for you:

              http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1559788,00.html

              HIV infections in the Arab world, for the perfect chaste people of the Muslim world.

              • 3 votes
              Reply#11 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:02 AM EDT

              ultra-orthodox Jews exhibit the same behavior as the taliban and osama bin-gone. They make up they own rules and state that they are the real followers of their own religion. Scarry....

              • 2 votes
              Reply#12 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:04 AM EDT

              Yea, and they all think their god is on their side, ha ha ha ha. Silly god folk!

              • 1 vote
              #12.1 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:00 AM EDT

              'Sam' - you forgot M. Bachman and her legions of religious extremists. Oh right, the religious right, tea-baggers, etc., aren't interested in Christian Sharia. This is not bigoted "Christian bashing". I'm just tired of Bachman and her cohort telling me my family and its values are "un-american". Sam, look in the mirror and you'll see the scarry one. And turn off FOX.

                #12.2 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 8:29 AM EDT
                Reply

                Studies have shown that male-dominated societies where the woman is no more than a breeding machine tend to be homosexual and pedophilic. The men hang out together and party together without women which either leads to or is caused by a tendency to homosexuality. Because they have no commonality with women, they also are attracted to children. Societies where women are equal to men have a greater ability to fight child sex abuse for a variety of reasons. Children have respect for the mother because the father respects her and they will confide in her if there is abuse.

                • 4 votes
                Reply#13 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:05 AM EDT

                In American Indian societies, there was the "lady man" who dressed in a ceremonial dress and performed for men only in the men-only tent. A dress of this kind is on exhibit in the Montclair Art Museum, New Jersey, if you don't believe it. Many male-dominated societies had men-only meetings. Who knows why? It was very hush-hush.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#14 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:10 AM EDT

                Could not find their way around a real "woman" probably, hence the large goat herds. LOL

                • 3 votes
                #14.1 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:59 AM EDT

                Ginga this is the problem with taking a little bit of information out of context. Firstly not all Native American societies were male centric. There were some including some Inuit where women were in charge, carried the family name and were wisdom leaders ( though it is true that the men were often "war leaders") For your American ideals think of it like the Congress would be all female and the military was all men and the president could be either male or female.

                There have always been "two spirit people" in Native communities....what we would call gay , transgender, androgynous...some of these two spirit people were considered sacred. They had lived many lives and were given the privileged by the Great Spirit of having two in one. These two spirit people were often accepted into the ceremonies of both women and men .

                Native peoples didn't have the anti-gay doctrine/dogma like judeo christian muslim communities. The society was very open and a married couple was honored---it would have been almost impossible for sexual abuse to happen . I am not saying there wasn't sexual abuse in later native communities ( especially on the reservations after alcohol had been introduced) I am saying read and understand before you speak the history of a people.

                • 1 vote
                #14.2 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:23 AM EDT
                Reply

                It's really up to the woman to change any bad conditions. No Italian man would ever abuse his child because he knows his wife and his mother would kill him.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#15 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:19 AM EDT

                More silly god people hidding from the real world so as to keep their "faith". Twisted as it may be. Join the other extreme types and marry a goat.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#16 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:57 AM EDT

                Same stuff as in FLDS.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#17 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:47 AM EDT

                Disavowing normal adult sexuality results in perverse sexual actions in priests, monks, and orthodox groups. A woman was shot for adultery in Afghanistan whereas, in fact, it was a squabble between two Al Qaeda men who both had sex with this woman. We cannot deny our normal human functions without our actions becoming subverted. Mom and dad need to have normal,equal adult relations so that their adult intentions are not directed toward their children.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#18 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:56 AM EDT

                The book is a good first step. I haven't read it, but the article mentions a part where a man is offering candy to a child. I hope that it also covers the even more sensitive problem that it is often those who a child trusts the most who commits the crime - a rabbi, a youth group leader, a teacher. A difficult balancing act. You don't want kids to be scared of adults and want them to build relationships with adults other than parents, but still.....my kids were very lucky. Great scout leaders, teachers, librarians all around and everywhere we have lived. It is too painful to think about a child's trust being abused!

                • 2 votes
                Reply#19 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 10:12 AM EDT

                Suppose that the problem is as psychologists suggest, that pedaphiles are responding to a feeling of lacking or imbalance in power? A small child makes a good target, as they are smaller, weaker, easier to manipulate, and more trusting. It is not hard to feel powerful against a child.

                Do any of you know someone who feels that they are powerless? In any pecking order, they are always at the bottom. Someone that is constantly picked on or bullied? Whose wife or mother is immasculating in their treatment of him, or openly derogatory of him?

                It is true that this problem is not new....no problem really is, as we don't have cases of "Space Herpes" or "Intergalactic Venereal Disease" yet. There has always been spousal abuse, there has always been child abuse, there has always been homosexuality, there has always been impotence, there has always been anger, hate, jealousy, fear, hunger, pain, sickness, strife. How we deal with these issues are what make up the character of a society or civilization. The Romans dealt with unwanted children by simply throwing unwanted newborns onto trash heaps out on the streets. The Celts, on the other hand, held every family responsible for its elderly, disabled and unwanted. The penalties for theft, for murder, or rape, have been varied. It is important that we keep in mind the societies that we are discussing, and how we want our society to be. Not just what we would like to see on a day by day basis, but in the future, when others look at our books, and movies, and newspapers, how do we want our society to be seen? As a primitive, savage, dark group based on violence or hate?

                Just a few thoughts....have a great day.

                • 2 votes
                Reply#20 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 11:19 AM EDT

                And modern America still does not have clear-cut penalties for theft, murder or rape. These vary from state to state and appeal processes are often successful. Though the most likely to be punished for good is the thief. But that is because property connotes a higher value than people in this society.

                  #20.1 - Thu Sep 20, 2012 1:52 PM EDT
                  Reply

                  when children are denied thier right to scientific knowledge, such as the names of thier sex organs, because of religious superstition, they will always be in danger. this applies to any ancient religion used by ignorant parents. If you are a parent and you are not hung up on some crazy religion just sit down and tell your kid the facts of life and tell them that they can come to you with any problem with no SHAME.

                    Reply#21 - Fri Sep 21, 2012 10:17 AM EDT
                    You're in Easy Mode. If you prefer, you can use XHTML Mode instead.
                    As a new user, you may notice a few temporary content restrictions. Click here for more info.