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Subscribe to RSSNew sea ice is finally starting to form again in the Arctic, scientists reported Wednesday, but not before reaching another record low last Sunday.
"We are now in uncharted territory," Mark Serreze, director of the National Snow and Ice Data Center, said in a statement announcing the record low of 1.32 million square miles -- nearly half the average extent from 1979 to 2010. The extent has been tracked by satellite since 1979.
"While we’ve long known that as the planet warms up, changes would be seen first and be most pronounced in the Arctic," he added, "few of us were prepared for how rapidly the changes would actually occur."
Many experts expect the Arctic to be free of sea ice in summer at some point between 2015 and 2050.
"Recent climate models suggest that ice-free conditions may happen before 2050," noted center scientist Julienne Stroeve. But she added the caveat that the recent sudden rate of decline "remains faster than many of the models are able to capture."
Serreze told NBC News he's figuring on 2030, calling it "a pretty aggressive estimate."
The sea ice extent numbers come after the center reported last month that the summer sea ice on Aug. 26 had broken the previous record low set in 2007 of 1.61 million square miles. On Aug. 26 the sea ice extent was 1.58 million square miles, it said.
"We're smashing a record that smashed a record," center scientist Walt Meier said.
In the 1980s, he said, summer sea ice would cover an area a bit smaller than the Lower 48 states. Now it is about half that.
A report from the National Snow and Ice Data Center shows the Arctic's melting ice is resulting in the lowest sea ice levels since satellites started tracking the measurements in 1979. NBC's Brian Williams reports.
The difference between this year's low and that of 2007 is 293,000 square miles, about the size of Texas, the center noted in its report.
Meanwhile, conditions favorable to new sea ice are taking longer to appear.
"The strong late season decline is indicative of how thin the ice cover is," Meier said. "Ice has to be quite thin to continue melting away as the sun goes down and fall approaches."
The thickness of the ice is also in decline.
"The core of the ice cap is the perennial ice, which normally survived the summer because it was so thick", Joey Comiso, a NASA scientist who uses satellites to study the ice, said in a statement. "But because it's been thinning year after year, it has now become vulnerable to melt."
Related: China eyes mineral treasure in warming Arctic
Related: Starving female polar bear challenges male in warming sign
NASA also noted that a strong August storm that formed off Alaska's coast and moved to the center of the Arctic Ocean had an impact on ice levels.
"The storm definitely seems to have played a role in this year's unusually large retreat of the ice", said NASA scientist Claire Parkinson. "But that exact same storm, had it occurred decades ago when the ice was thicker and more extensive, likely wouldn't have had as prominent an impact, because the ice wasn't as vulnerable then as it is now."
This year follows several of declining summer sea ice.
"The six lowest September ice extents have all been in the past six years," Serreze said. "I think that's quite remarkable."
The experts also noted that what happens in the Arctic doesn't stay there.
The warmer Arctic is adding increased heat and moisture into the climate system, said center scientist Ted Scambos. "This will gradually affect climate in the areas where we live," he said. "We have a less polar pole -- and so there will be more variations and extremes."
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
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We need to (re)elect representatives in government who take this crisis seriously and realize a moral obligation to do what we can as a nation to reverse this disturbing progression.
But here is the problem......we are not the primary cause. It is the development in Asia and the lax environmental standards there that are causing most of the mess. The more we regulate US companies and create more strict standards in the US, the more we push business/expansion overseas which actually makes the problem worse. It is a Catch 22.
So your suggestion is to deregulate American industry?
How about US corporations stop outsourcing everything just for the sake of continued record profits.
Krazy....We can choose to live in a fantasy world or accept reality. They don't outsource just for the sake of record profits. Their profit margin stays about the same and they pass most savings on to the consumer. Most of the increases in profits are coming from overseas sales anyways. Not to mention that the "record profits" are never adjusted for inflation. If we applied the same scenario to social security, they would receive record payments every year as well.
Maybe when all the ice is gone, ocean levels have risen, all the artic wildlife has gone extinct and mankind is on the verge of global extinction... the people who fought climate change are happy with their results and made a lot of money in the process to hand over to their kids a world that they can say they had a major hand in destroying!!!!
Maybe, but it is highly doubtful that any of that will happen. Besides, you are preaching to the wrong people. The problem is the people in China and the rest of industrial Asia that have little evironmental standards living in squalor polluting the earth.
China emits the most CO2, with the US second and the EU third. Then India, Russia, and Japan. After that, the amount each country contributes is way below the leaders.
The developed world contributes the most to climate change, with China fast outpacing us.
That is true, AG99, but of course we still emit the most per capita. But more importantly, the fact that other people do it to does not mean it is OK for us to do it.
Among large economies (excluding very small countries like Gibraltar where an extremely low population can skew per capital numbers), USA is the largest CO2 producer per capita at 18 metric tons per person per year. For comparison, the world average is about 4.5 metric tons per person. China emits under 6, and Inida 1.4. So, if we're taking CO2 emissions per person as a proxy for the effectiveness of a country's environmental policies (perhaps not wise, but just following the logic above and inserting the data), then perhaps it's not accurate to disparage China, or Asia as a whole, especially in comparison to the US.
Well, I feel better. We were the first to the mega-pollute party, so it's really these Industrial-Revolution-Come-Latelys that are to blame. Thank goodness we won't have to do anything, or pay the consequences for our inaction. Hey, what global climate change, anyway? Oops. Did I miss the memo updating our talking points?
@ PutAmericaFirst: China has already done more to reduce carbon emissions than we've done, even though they produce 1/3 the CO2 per person we do.
For the vast majority of this planets history there has been NO polar ice. Now, because there happens to be some ice when some hairless monkeys exist, there is cause for panic. It is more normal for NO polar ice. It is unusual when there is some. So perhaps we should panic like the monkeys we are when the ice expands.
Nice try. The current state of our global climate is not due to what is happening now, but to what has happened in the past.
Also, do just point the finger at Asia and say,'As long as they are not addressing the issue, why should we?', is no solution.
Yes, no solution which does not include the cooperation and participation of China, Japan, South Korea and other Asian nations, and of the remainder of the world.
No, one's thought process on the subject cannot stop there.
Hmm they neglect to say Antartic sea ice is setting records. Human caused global warming is BS. Its just another cycle of the earths constantly changing weather. Humans occupy so little of the earth its not funny. 29% of the earths surface is land and of that percentage humans occupy 1% of the available land. So humans occupy less then 1% of the earth. There is no way humans occuping less then 1% of the earth can do anything to affect the earth Some interesting reading
This global warming/climate change/ and various forms BS came from your favorite communist heros Marx and Engles. These two fools wanted to use something to deter capitalism read thier own manifesto..
Us as humans are egenrally egocentric, so its no surprise that most believe we alone are the only cause for global warming. But here's the thing, 200 years ago we were in a miniture Ice Age. And no we are not. Warming and cooling is a natural cycle that all organisms on the planet must live with and learn to adapt to.
So no, driving electric (powered by electric which still has pollution in it. electric) cars and regulating industry won't save every creature on the planet from nature. Might slow it slightly, but it isnt the game changer.
If this keeps up, North-West passage will be busier than the Panama Canal, and a whole lot cheaper. Make lemonade people. Adapt or join the woolly mammoths.
Why isn't somebody blaming Obama for this? I've grown so used to him being the cause of everything that goes wrong
Jim, you are embarassing yourself.
There's a great way republicans can help solve the problem of global warming and extinction to boot.
All republican politicians and candidates should be frozen, even if they don't want to be, and sent north. They'd be like tasty frozen treats for the polar bears. So we cool down the north pole, feed the bears, and eliminate a vexing domestic problem all in one fell swoop.
Whenever, someone decides to run for office as a republican, we just say to him "talk to the bears." He then goes up north and gently attempts to explain to the polar bears why they really aren't going extinct, and that “no there really is just as much ocean ice as before,” and that "come on, you polar bears are supposed to be skinny." Of course the republican will be restrained to prevent him from stealing the polar bears pension, and so that he fully listens to and considers the polar bears response. Of course dealing with polar bears can be dangerous, so to gain the bear’s trust the republican will be fully informed that that he should smear salmon oil on himself.
The last time the Earth was at this climate was 300 million years ago before the dinosaurs. Interestingly enough, the reason for the increase in the temperature back then was primarily the gradual rise is CO2 over millions of years. This has been PROVEN through a wide array of studies from ice cores, rock samples, fossils, etc. The human species has achieved the same rise in CO2 over the last 100 years that took nature millions of years to accomplish. Since its almost impossible for all you small minded humans to grasp the weight of this, generations to come are going to subject to an UNNATURAL climate change. The Earth will most certainly still be here so to be worried about the planet is futile. To think that we are advanced to survive a climate swing that will have an average temperature approx. 20 degress warmer than we are now.......priceless.
China produces about 4% more CO2 than the US does. But, China is also outpacing the U.S. on innovation, spending and development of green technologies by a margin of 2:1. The U.S. has been the biggest laggard of all major developed countries when it comes to CO2 controls and green technology.
Dear Crisp 8,
The fact that the per capita of these countries is so low is skewed by the fact that they are so overpopulated.
China, for instance. Do you remember, just before the Bejing Olympics, how the Chinese government restricted the use of automobiles, and shut down many factories, so the air could clear so the athletes and other visitors could breath? You see on the news all the Chinese people wearing face masks. That's not for germs!
Does anyone understand that all animals produce co2 and maybe our existence is part of the problem. As the population increases so does the co2, it's not just the burning of fuel. So maybe their is no answer to our problem? Or is there. It just came to me that we have been at war for over 10 years and on the edge of a major war with the ME. Maybe the elites answer is just that, kill us off in a major war, reduce the amount of energy and products we consume and our global warming will be solved. No, no, it's just is my imagination.
That CO2 is part of the normal cycle, Jackson. It doesn't increase the level of CO2 in our atmosphere, because it's recycled back into oxygen via plants.
The problem occurs when we dig up 300 million years' worth of safely-sequestered carbon in the form of fossil fuels, and burn it. That carbon isn't part of our current natural carbon cycle - and it makes all the difference in the world.
There is no such thing as science.
Because it wasn't mentioned in the Bible.
Just ask Galileo. He totally admitted his mistake and said the Sun revolves around the Earth after all!
Does it really matter WHO contributed the most? The Earth does not care.
Sorry Ryan but your data is flawed.. Sure the planet had a total ice over somewhere about 300 million years ago but there has been a 200,000 year reoccurring cycle of warm / cold for at least the past 10 million years.. The glacier that covered Northern Ohio receded 14 to 20 thousand years ago and seems to be continuing to recede back toward the pole.. The model predicts temps. rising for the next 8 to 10 thousand years then stabilizing at that high for another 20 thousand years then gradually declining for the next 100k years to a max low.. At this point the northern 1/3 of the United States will once again be under 1,000 feet of ice and the thaw cycle will start again.. Thought is that the solar output cycles in conjunction with geological forces affected by the Sun's magnetic field to produce these cycles.. So a 14 year solar sun spot cycle is like the ticking of a giant clock.. Are humans contributing?, Yes.. At what percentage compared to natural forces?, unknown but not at the rate the alarmists want us to believe.. Humans are silly and think they are the center of all that is........
Correction 600 million years not 300m
Oh my gosh. This is really not something to worry about. It is all going to be OK. Really.
We are all just going to evolve some gills behind our ears, and webed fingers and toes. And we will grow tomatos on really neato sail boats and fight the bad people on the jet skis.
No problem really. So we can all resume burning all the carbon based materials we can find, and live happily ever after.
There are a number of inaccuracies in that post, RR, but I'll just address one.
The Holocene Thermal Optimum ended 5,000 years ago. After that optimum, the planet was slowly cooling off, as orbital mechanics (the Milankovitch Cycle) drive us towards the next Ice Age.
Unfortunatly, we seem to have overridden that normal cycle by our insistence on injecting CO2 (a proven greenhouse gas) into the atmosphere at unprecedented rates. Instead of cooling slowly, we're now warming - rapidly.
@ Roadrunnero, my data is most certainly NOT flawed. Unless the top researchers in the world are wrong, then I do concede. Perhaps you shoud re-read what I wrote. I didnt mention an ice age at all. 300 million years ago was the last time this planet was at a similar climate as it was now. Temperature and atmosphere make-up. And without humans, gradually warmed and remained at a higher average temperature for about 200 million years. This is when large reptiles evolved into dinosaurs. then there was the end of the dinosaurs/ice age blah blah. what caused it? I'm sure there was but a few factors. however i digress from my point. While all the data you provided does look good, it does not refute my point. All you are trying to say is that the earth has been fluctuating since the end of the last ice age. While that is true under NATURAL cycles, HUMANS have released an UNNATURAL amount of CO2 into our atmosphere faster than nature would have. Like I said before. The EARTH was at this exact moment 300 million years ago. However, it took millions of years for the CO2 to build up in the atmosphere, not 100 years.
Been watching the Arctic sea ice for years now, and don't think the article presents the true impact of the situation. Yes, the ice area is down to 40- 50% from just 30 years ago, but the thickness is also down to about 50% as well, so the volume is down to just 20-25% in the the same period. Half the remaining ice near the pole this year is of unusually low concentration. The volume continues a very steady downward trend, and it appears that it will reach ZERO around 2015-2016. These quotes that ZERO will hold off till 2030-2050 are based on models that are proving to be consistently wrong. Global sea level rise estimates will soon be revised sharply upwards. The thermal inputs are in place, methane is pouring out at incredible rates, new data coming soon for this year - early estimates indicate methane is soon to double the effect of CO2, and positive feedback effects are rapidly making the situation worse and irreversible. Nobody is sure what will happen when the ice is gone, but a recent report stated that the loss of reflective surface alone will escalate our current warming problem by 20 years. Expect unusual to extreme swings in climate norms - some may have to relocate.
My personal prediction not based totally on good science yet is a major tidal wave event due to rapidly increasing geological stresses related to Greenland ice melt weight redistribution.
What to do:
Long-term benefits are still possible by large scale reductions of CO2 through conservation and real, new technology. But, for those alive now, only preparation and adaptation will be practical. Make plans to move away from low lying coastal areas, Consider water supplies in your choice of places to live. More irrigation systems for farming need to start now. Electrical distribution needs to improve to allow alternate energy transition. We will all have to lower our standard of living somewhat, so start budgeting and making wise purchasing choices and avoid debt.
If that model was correct we should have seen the higher temperatures by now but we have not.. Peak temps. and timing are variable but one thing is for sure we have not had our tropical cycle point yet.. Pick what ever model you want, there are about 100 of them with 30 different opinions.. And yes all those out of work grads. are sniffing for any grant they can get..
Big difference between ice age cycles and snowball earth cycles..
oj,
I can't disagree with a single thing you said. Excellent post.
James Taylor a Senior Fellow from the Heartland Institute reported on the record ice cap growth in Antarctica on Hannity and Colmes this week. The video from this very interesting segment is posted HERE.
James Taylor sent this link to The Cryosphere Today, a website run by the University of Illinois. The website shows images of the record ice cap growth this year in Antarctica.
The Cryosphere Today reported:
1. There is NOTHING the US can or will do unilaterally to mitigate global climate change...short of initiating a global thermonuclear war...
2. Any government that imposes draconian austerity measures to force US citizens into reducing their economic position will quickly be replaced by a more business (republican) oriented government bent on reversing the trend and eliminating the draconian austerity measures...the argument will be "Why should we suffer when China and India are continuing to burn fossile fuels at record rates?"
3. The whole "Blame America" mantra is sickening and indicative of mental illness; when one blames ones own culture for all the evils in the world, one suffers from paranoid delusions. Further...it is the sickos who keep trying to get us to burn our food (ethanol, etc....)
I don't know...the more "solutions" I hear coming from the greenie tree hugging mentally ill leftists...the more I shake my head....
We ain't gonna stop Global Climate Change....IT IS TOO LATE!
Next stop; regional wars for resources...like food and water...(as the US burns its corn.....)
Going back to the OP, it would be way better to (re) elect politicians who dont base government policy on dreamt up fairy tales from the environmentalists. Give us proof that its not just a cycle, then we'll listen to you.
Please delete this comment. It was a double post.
Will someone look up the population of polar bears for the last 100 years and then tell me that they are going away? How much CO2 does the human race put into the atmosphere compared to nature (natural fires, volcano eruptions, ect) We are not the cause. Climate changes. We do not control it. If we did then we could stop it. You cut off all the fossil fuels we use then nature will just replace that CO2 with other natural disaters.
If I had to pick, global warming sounds a lot better than another ice age. You want to talk about crop failures on a global scale during the Little Ice Age few hundred years ago? I'm very glad the Earth is warming, for whatever reason.
So Jim, tell me how it works with you. You just sit in the dark and make stuff up. Am I right?
Actually, all of the other natural causes are relatively constant. Plant decay and forest fires are not rapidly increasing; in fact they are not increasing at all. The last hundred years have not seen any steep rise in volcanism. The annual CO2 output of all of the Earth's volcanoes is approximately 1/100th the amount produced by human activity. The sun's brightness has actually been declining slightly since the 1950s, when the warming of our climate has become the most marked.
So, rgmoon, what has changed? What other change in the various determinants of the Earth's climate has changed?
We do not control it, because we do not control ourselves. We do cause it.
Logic. I guess that they no longer teach it in schools.
Good thing this global warming stuff is a fraud perpetrated by a bunch of anti-market lefties. Otherwise, I'd be concerned.
I remember a story my great great grandfather use to tell me about a town near the sea. It was a prospering town full of business people that worshipped money above all else. Well one day one of those people had a visit from a man who warned him of a coming flood that would surely wipe the entire town off the map if the greedy towns folk didn't change their way. The man went back to the town and tried to warn the people of the impending disaster, but they all laughed at him and said that if had rained before and it would rain again, this was just normal weather paterns. So Noah built himself and his family a great big boat and loaded it with every animal that the wingnuts hadn't poisoned with their genetically modified corn and they floated off to safety as the wingnuts all drowned.
The moral of the story is, when someone smarter than you tells you a flood is coming shut off Fox Noise and get on the frigging boat.
I also remember a story about people that gave away blankets full of small pox. Don't ever take someone's word for it. Find out the answers for yourself. The people calling for drastic changes because of climate change are just as greedy as the corporate raiders. Look at how Al Gore exploited it.
Oh my, your brain is all forked up. Lets follow the money shall we. Oh but first, the blankets with small pox thing, it wasn't just a story, it was the truth, now the bible is just a story, but what they did to my ancestors is a fact. Okay back to the money. While working for Royal Dutch Shell near the Pinedale Anticline I happened to be in a meeting with a number of geologists and some suit types. I asked one of the geologists point blank how much oil was left under the ground, he said they figure there was 4 trillion barrels of oil to begin with and that there was probably 2 trillion left, before he could finish his sentence one of the suits chimed in and said, "and we plan on drilling every drop, and nothing and no one is going to stop us." they all laughed and patted each other on the back. I whipped out my trusty calculator and did a bit of cyphering, lets see if the average future price of a barrel of oil is $150 (and that is a conservative estimate) that adds up to $300 trillion dollars. Now I am no rocket scientist but $300 trillion sounds like more than enough money to warrant lying and manipulating, and even murder, especially if you are a "greedy corporate raider" (you really need to cut that out because people just laugh at you when you say that about alternative energy, especially since we all associate oil men with "greedy corporate raiders". didn't you ever watch dallas?)
Listen putamericafirst (what ever that means), the head of Exxon came out and admitted that the use of oil and coal is causing global warming, he admitted it is real and admitted his product is the cause, didn't you get the memo? your new talking point is "man will adapt", anyway, the same people who profit from oil and coal, profit from windmills and solar farms, so the greedy corporate raiders are the same greedy corporate raiders that have always been here, if I remember right T. Boone Pickens is in the windmill business and his fortune was made where? remind me please? oh yeah thats right OIL!!
Please get a grip on reality, or find a new job because you truly suck as a propagandist (oh and the screen name is a dead give away)
WHAT PART OF HOTTEST MONTH EVER DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
According to NOAA July 2012 was the hottest month in the contiguous USA since recording began more than a century ago. The average temp was 77.6 degrees a full 3.3 degrees warmer than the 20th century norm. This spring was the warmest on record by 5.2 degrees
WHAT PART OF HOTTEST YEAR EVER DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
The warmest 12 month period ever recorded in the US the 14th consecutive year with above average temperatures
WHAT PART OF HOTTEST TEN YEARS EVER DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
The 10 hottest tears on record nine in the occurring since 2000
WHAT PART OF MELTING ICE CAPS DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
An enormous mass of ice, four times the size of Manhattan broke off from northern Greenland and slipped into the sea the biggest in 50 years. On July 8, 2012 40% of Greenland’s ice sheet’s surface had thawed –a typical summer. But four days later in an extreme melt event almost all the ice sheet had thawed an event that hasn’t occurred in at least 150 years.
The Arctic ice cap reaching a record low volume has lost as much as 40% of its area in summer in just 30 years.
WHAT PART OF EXTREME WEATHER DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
The deadly European heat wave of 2003, which led to thousands of deaths
The fiery Russian and Middle East heat wave of 2010, which led to thousands of deaths
The catastrophic droughts in Texas and Oklahoma in 2011resulting the largest fires in AZ. History
The fire season is now increased by 78 days.
Mega floods displacing millions around the world The number of weather disasters has tripled in the last 20
years
Record snowfall in 2010 followed by record rainfall and floods and then the worst drought in 50 years in 2012.
WHAT PART OF ESCALATING FOOD PRICES DUE TO EXTREME WEATHER DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
Floods, fires, drought taking food crops off the global market a 5.2 billion lose in TX in 2011
Drought this year on the Midwest the corn crop all but ruined while the USDA predicts a 3 to 5 percent increase on everything from cereal to steak, some economists believe price hikes will come closer to 10 percent.
WHAT PART OF ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
Hotter oceans are making corals pale and sick 95% of the world’s reefs are likely to be severely damaged
And so many others they can't possiable listed here
WHAT PART OF A MILITARY INTEL REPORT DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
Drought, floods and a lack of fresh water may cause significant global instability and conflict in the coming decades, as developing countries scramble to meet demand from exploding populations while dealing with the effects of climate change, U.S. intelligence agencies said in a report released March 2012.
An assessment reflecting the joint judgment of federal intelligence agencies says the risk of water issues causing wars in the next 10 years is minimal even as they create tensions within and between states and threaten to disrupt national and global food markets. But beyond 2022, it says the use of water as a weapon of war or a tool of terrorism will become more likely, particularly in South Asia, the Middle East and North Africa. (Nuclear armed Pakistan has already been destabilized by severe flooding caused by climate change)
WHAT PART OF SCIENCE DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
Global warming has been endorsed by EVERY National Academy of Science of every major country on the planet
Every Major Scientific Society related to the study of global warming 98% of Climate scientists throughout the world 3,000 of the best scientific experts in the world as “unequivocal” All the complex computer climate models show climate change
WHAT PART OF MATH DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
90million tons of heat trapping emissions dumped into the Earth’s atmosphere every 24 hours with 20% of the pollution still here 20,000 years from now
Global warming gases in the world’s atmosphere are rising with concentrations up 29% since the start of the Industrial era. Carbon Dioxide gases up 39%
No longer can the deniers point to a single weather event as having numerous causes by simple asking the question how likely is this to have occurred with the absence of global warming the new statistical research proves that statistically what’s happening is not random or normal but pure climate change
WHAT PART OF COVER UP DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?
The polluter and Ideologues finance pseudoscientists whose job is to manufacture doubt about is real and what is false.
Buying elected officials wholesale with bribes that the politicians have made legal and can now be made in secret Spending hundreds of millions of dollars on misleading advertisements Hiring 4 anti-climate lobbyists for every member of the US Senate and House of Representatives
The tobacco industry did the same thing and the deception went on for decades
The script was leaked in 1991 in an internal document the largest global polluters spelled out their strategy: “reposition global warming as theory rather than fact” so undermine the public’s respect for science and reason and leaked documents from the Heartland Institute The heart of the climate denial machine relies on huge corporate and foundation funding from U.S. businesses, including, Koch Industries, Altria (parent company of Philip Morris) RJR Tobacco and more,"
I await a rebuttal and not just some right wing nut rant or we can't do anything because China or some other country isn't doing anything
Let's see you back up your denials and rants with FACTS!
you're wasting your time witchking, the only thing putamericafirst (what ever that means) knows how to do is spew GOP talking points "al gore. blah blah blah, acorn, blah blah blah, black panthers blah blah blah", he has no way to rebutt you except with more talking points. I loved it the day the head of Exxon admitted that he knew global warming was real and that his product was to blame, the wingnuts were speechless, the only thing they could do was mummer al gore's name over and over. It was hilarious.
Excellent post, Witchking! And of course, China and India, and most of the emerging economies are polluting--which doesn't make it right! The argument of "everybody's doing it" is a childish one--when humans enter true adulthood, they leave that childish argument behind. True adults lead by example.
I love it.
The CEO of Exxon makes $35 million a year. A PhD climate researcher at NOAA begins at $49,000 per year - less than a public school teacher. Those greedy bastard scientists are just in it for the money.
Good lord.
You have no idea what you're talking about, putamericafirst (whatever that means). What happens in the Arctic doesn't stay in the Arctic - it's already affecting you.
Witchking - What part of 200,000 million years do you not understand? We are attempting to base our affect on the planet with a hair of a fraction of time that this planet has preportedly existed. Most of these records are based on less than the entire historical existence of the North America, which again, has been coming out of a miny ice age since around 1800. So we are relying on this small sample of time to prove that humans have enough force to change nature? 1 decade in 20. 1 year in 200. (PS: according to PSE&G, the average temp for the summer in my area FELL by more than 2 degrees. This is reflected in my vastly decreased energy bill for the summary too)
Let me know when you gain the ability to control wind and rain and climate. Good luck.
frstrm33-
Thanks for the confirmation. You prove my point exactly
200,000 Million years compared to changes taking place in decades.
What part of geological time do you not understand?
frstrm33
200,000 million years? That would be 200 billion years. What part of "the solar system is about 4.54 billion years old" do you not understand? Keep ranting...
Dear Witchking,
In your rant, you say that an iceberg calved that was so huge that it hadn't happened in 50 years. That means that it DID happen 50 YEARS AGO!
You also state that the extreme ice melt was an event that had not occurred in at least 150 years. That means that it DID happen at least 150 years ago!
So, here's my question to you: Just exactly WHO caused it to happen back then?!
Actually it is 200,000 years for the cycle and we are heading to the warm end peak in the next 20,000 years where all of Ohio will be sub tropical rain forest and swamp again.. Man may add an extra 1,000 or 2 ,000 years to the peak high but in the long run it is the proverbial drop in the bucket.. During the max temp end the carbon will be sequestered by the plants and over tine will become oil and coal again.. Will we be here to see it?, who knows.. We do know that Northern Ohio was under a glacier 20,000 years ago so it has been warming for a while..
Hey....don't worry...there will be a global conflagration that will lead to the deaths of billions of humans...the destruction of all sorts of resources and industries...and the elimination of numerous sources of food, including fish that will force the reduction of CO2 emissions....
Famine and disease alone will account for the majority of casualties as the world's economy implodes! Heck, we're already lining up to fight over Iranian oil!
Don't be so "gloom and doom", you AGW crackpots...
Oh, and by the way....stop burning our food!
Who told you environmental scientists are smarter than you? Them? Where is their scientific proof that we are causing it. Every prediction they have made have turned out to be false. Sorry, I choose to believe in facts and not environmental fairy tales.
And when all the fresh water melt enters the ocean, it will alter the ocean currents that bring
warmer water to the poles and we will then have another ice age. This has happened cyclically
hundreds, if not thousands, of times in the past. What is Al Gore going to do when that happens?
Sell reverse carbon credits?
Tom,
Do you want to see a total science-ignorant man, look at the mirror, please.
Thanks.
This will not trigger a new ice age.
It might cause a temporary cooling period in northern Europe if the Gulf Stream is disrupted.
Yes, great flood and ice age happened before, but that doesn't mean the inhabitants did not cause it. We still don't have one convincing theory for the extinction of Dinosaur, because we never looked into the posibility of the Dinosaur being the cause. How about this: the digestive methane and respiratory CO2 of the Dinosaur population accumulated over time caused global worming, which caused great flood. The flood killed the most non-avian animals and plants. The survival herbivor then died of starvation. Without plants to maintain the atomsphere, temperature droped very quickly into an ice age. In our case, we may be able to skip the great flood part due to the speed of deforestation. If we don't have enough forests to support the atomsphere we can head to the ice age directly.
John, did you go off your meds or are you just trying to be funny?!?
Usually when the earth is at its hottest, plant life is at its greatest and sucking carbon into the ground, where it turns into oil. This acts as a balance and starts to cool the planet, maintianing a cycle that takes hundreds of thousands of years. There was confirmation of evidence for a comet impact over Canada causing the last ice age called the Younger Dryas. This would display how sensitive the global climate is to minor or occasional perturbances. As the world was already cooling and impact sent reflective debris into the atmosphere and accellerated the process causing the climate to change drastically in a very short time. This is one of the best explinations for the disapearance for North American mega-fauna in my opinion, a link to the article can be found at sciencedaily.com. We are dealing with exactly the opposite situation which, unlike the younger Dryas event, has no precident, an accelleration of warming when the planet is already at its hottest. Never befor has our planet faced simultaneous heating and biodiversity loss, melting of the poles concurrent with loss of forest and spread of desert. We are so far from having to worry about another ice age we seriously have to worry if we have broken a fundamental life system by our premature release of ALL the sequestered carbon from the crust.
Tommy, put your head back in the sand.
Dear Doojohn,
I believe that it is generally accepted by the science community that the extinction of the dinosaurs was caused by an asteroid impact in the Yucatan.
You want someone to talk to down there dubster?
Baschnagel, the asteroid hit the earth after the extinction already happened, because when the earth had thick atmosphere asteroid would not hit it. Only after all the plants were killed in the flood and the earth lost its atmosphere, then it opened up for asteroid hit. If you want to have an idea how much methane a dinosaur could release, spend a day with a cow, then imagine the dinosaur was many times larger. And they were everywhere in large amount.
And antarctic sea ice has been above the 33 year average all year.
And was below that average most of last year. Meanwhile, Arctic sea ice has never once been above average since early 2003.
And the current excess in Antarctic sea ice is much less than one half of the deficit in Arctic sea ice.
And Antarctica is losing about 250 cubic kilometers of land-base ice each year.
And Greenland is losing about 250 cubic kilometers of land-based ice each year.
And the remaining glaciers in the world are losing about 250 cubic kilometers of ice each year.
But yeah, an extremely volatile value has been above average for a bit.
But yeah, an extremely volatile value has been below average for a bit. FTFY
Tom-518980
That is exactly true regarding ocean currents. But it is sad that you are turning this news against a man who has tried for years to make this a real issue of concern in the face of ignorant political opposition (which I suspect you supported for a very long time based on your criticism of Gore). Recognizing this as an important issue so long ago is called intellegence and vision - something that, at least in hindsight, should be praised. And now that you can't deny climate change (much like many die-hard Republicans are having are hard time doing since the data is unequivocal and had been for decades) you throw out this pathetic attempt at criticizing Gore and the left because you can't let go of your politics. Your brand of objectivity is screwing up the world.
You just admitted Gore was right about climate change btw.
Gore isn't close to right. Nearly all the models he used are proving him false. He was just another greedy Bast(#$#d trying to make a quick buck off people. It worked pretty well for him as he made hundreds of millions peddling his snake oil.
what snake oil ?...he only made a film to bring attention to a problem the big corporations were saying was a hoax so they could continue spewing out C02.
Gore, who was spending 20,000 a month on electricity while winning an oscar for telling us how we should reduce our footprint?
Well... at least he invented the internet so we could criticize him on it.
First of all, Gore donated 100% of the profits from that movie to global warming charities. Second, he outfitted his house with solar panels and other renewal energy sources to take his carbon footprint to zero.
But nice try.
What kind of moron actually believes that Gore has anything to do with climate predictions? Really? "all the models he used"? Seriously?
Gore did nothing but publicize (badly) what scientists have been saying for over 30 years... that CO2 is causing global warming which is changing the climate. You give him too much credit.
BTW, those scientists were absolutely right and their models are proving correct for the most part. Where they are not correct is that they have underestimated the impact of AGW.
Look at the science folks and stop arguing about a politician who really has nothing to do with real climate science.
Allen: Gore made a lot of of his Carbon Credit Trading in Chicago. Which interestingly enough, they closed down once a Democrat got into office. Seems like that might have been the time to double down if the idea was good???
Actually...they OVERESTIMATED the impact of global climate change....
They predicted the Arctic ice would be gone by now...and they keep pushing the year of the Arctic Ocean being free of ice back a decade....but no one seems to notice that....
They predicted all sorts of crap that hasn't panned out...yet...
It was predicted that the frequency and severity of tropical cyclones would INCREASE (which it hasn't).
The models are not even close to being accurate...
Nonetheless, the climate IS changing...it's just that many of us are like the proverbial frog in the pan of water (is it ME or is it getting hot in here?)
The alarmist's predictions have proven false; this does not mean that GW isn't happening.
It is because the alarmist's predictions have been proven false that the veracity of the data that climatologists use to prove GW is ignored. The Greenies have allowed the radical alarmists to run in the streets shouting "WOLF"!!!!...now...no one believes them....
You really want to understand the effects of climate change on the planet and on mankind? Read what the Pentagon, what the CIA, what the NSA have to say about it...
And it ain't pretty...
In a world where we cannot control ourselves we'll control global warming lol. How friggen stupid are lefties? Incredibly. Nowhere was it written that man would rule the earth forever. Time for humanity to go. Be kind of funny if those of us in our 50's were the last generation to enjoy a full life in America lol.
OK, Jeff?, ..this is the cliff's border, you first...and please be happy of your postumus Darwin award ...
Um AC, I believe Jeff was saying this would be a natural exit at the end of his lifespan, and all the youngsters will be left to figure out what to do to save themselves. Your response was right on target with a hundred others who said "you first" -- so not original.
Why have a military then, what did we win in WW2? You give up so easily when the game changes. I think you are afraid of life.
Tom, the antarctic sea ice levels do not mean what you apparently think they mean:
Reference articles did not post, for some reason.
They did not post because you are a new user so you're in the Newsvine "greenhouse." You won't be able to post links until you've been vetted.
After several years (7?), I still have problems with links disappearing, so it's not just a matter of being a new user. Maybe it has something to do with frequency of posting.
At any rate, you can post them with space between the double slash, e.g. http:/ /...
That allows anyone interested to access them with a tiny bit of effort.
Yes, the ice ages have recurred, but over much longer time scales, not the hyper-accelerated rate we now see. The data is clear. The U.S. is the only developed nation/government in the world that has an appreciable proportion of people who doubt the data. And certainly many nations are preparing for it in substantial ways. And you wonder why the world thinks we are dumb-asses. We are falling behind in education and it shows everywhere you turn, especially when you turn towards the anti-science pro-corporation GOP.
In 20 years you'll sing a different tune and claim you were always right.
On Cmash's point:
Der Cmash,
Currently, we don't really know what the exact trigger for an ice age is. However, there are scientists that theorise that there is a 'rubber-band snap' effect. This means that the climate goes in one direction (the rubber-band stretch, so to speak) and then 'snaps' into an ice age. If this theory is correct, that would account for your 'hyper-accelerated' rate.
Actually, we do - Milankovitch Cycles (small perturbations in the orbit of our planet). That's why Ice Ages occur with such amazing regularity.
Or it will be another scare the left has tried to instill to create another fake commodity (pollution credits). Scaring people into believing we were running out of space to dump our trash got us hooked with recycling, which has only given the government more money to throw at their friends. Oh, and that prediction was we would run out in 1995. A little late, dont you think.
And liberals call conservatives fear mongers. lol
WOW! A 33 year low! I'm impressed. Of course, need to make sure it is called a "record." I'm sure that we can figure out all we need to know about the Earth's millions (billions) of years based on keeping records for 33 years. And, of course, all those who believe the dire consequences have given up all their carbon producing habits! I guess that's why Al Gore is still flying around the world, taking tax deductions, preaching the evils of global warming.
Yeah, I'm with you, we should wait until the Manhattan, Florida Keys, and New Orlands are under 3 mts. of water, that would show them!! isn't it?.
Damn the politicians like Al Gore...LOL..
The physical evidence indicates this may be the smallest extent of ice in about 800,000 years.
The current ice volume is currently less than one fourth of what it was just 30 years ago. Doesn't that tell you ANYTHING?
ac: You'd think that with all that melting that they'd already be underwater. But, I suppose we are silly for not turning over every aspect of our lives to the lib politicians so they can use their vast wisdoms to save us from our selves.
Jim: It tells me....well, not much. It appears that they started looking at it during the period of catastrophic global cooling. Thanks to mankind, we were able to put a stop to that!
Witchrunner, fossil and sedimentary evidence shows that the surface waters of the north Pacific and north Atlantic have been continuously separated from each other by ice for virtually all of the past 800,000 years, with a short exception about 7,000 years ago and maybe a handful of others before that.
Since 2003, plankton, whales, etc. have begun to move freely back and forth through open NW and NE passages. Does that tell you anything?
AC: If all the northern ice just melted then why aren't the coastal cities under water now?
Global warming is a myth cause scientists are stupid. Scientists don't know nothing bout cycles and @!$%# that us smart people know about. It was cold today if global WARMING it should be WARM. People talking about whales? huh? what that with the economy? who stupid? Us or scientists?
Sarcasm...der
Vikings visited Kamchatka and the Aleutian Islands. I kind of doubt they walked there... We are at the lowest point in thirty three years of measuring this way. It's an impressive loss, but dollars to doughnuts it's happened before and probably will again. Do I think we need to reduce our industrial and agricultural flatulence? Absolutely! I just think doomsday predictions based on this particular data point add hysteria to what should be a much more rational and informed conversation.
The NW passage has not been open in at least 6,000 years. If the vikings reached Kamchatka (first I've ever heard that claim, btw), it was definitely not by sailing there.
American Indians arrived here by way of a land bridge during an ice age. How'd they do that?
LOL, love the invented viking bull@!$%#. Scientists are stupid. If I ever get sick, I'll see a witch doctor, just as you have done for your information. :)
From 9 days ago in the NY Times:
Shell Halts Arctic Drilling Right After It Began
Why? BECAUSE THERE IS STILL TOO MUCH SEA ICE!
suckers
h
Suckers, lol. I tell my neighbor: DON'T INJECT INSULIN! That is something from scientists. He could save money and not inject insulin. Scientists are making money off the diabetes scam!
huge sarcasm
In other news: humanity has reached record number of stupidity from evading natural selection... the good news: ice age is coming to wipe away most of the retarded population... see you in another 10000 years...
Idiocracy is happening.
I like money.....
It already happened... in 2000. Idiocracy (the movie) was a documentary.
It already happened... in 2000. Idiocracy (the movie) was the documentary.
There are still people who believe that the earth is flat, the moon landing was a fake, and that 9/11 was a government inside job. Let's just dismiss these boneheads and let them wallow in their own ignorance until they either die or come to their senses.
Lol you realize that is the only axiomatic definition of reason: We have decided everyone who is not reasonable does not function in our reality.
The lunatic fringe also believes that global warming is a gubmint conspiracy to take guns away from folks who can't pass the GED. And stuff like that.
Deniers have been claiming since the end of 2007 that Arctic ice was in recovery. Another denier talking point bits the dust.
It's just a cycle. Mini ice age, medieval warming, flat earth, big foot...it's all good. Don't take my guns away and them scientists stupid, etc...etc.....
ad nauseum
"... shattering record set just 3 weeks ago" The headline writer should be fired! The sea ice extent dropped below the previous record 3 weeks ago, but the record that is tracked is for the minimum value. We don't claim a new record minimum for every day that the metric goes down: there's only get one minima per year. The record that was "shattered" was from 5 years ago, not 3 weeks.
The point is that the record from 5 years ago was shattered 3 week ago. And then that new record was shattered again this week.
However you label the various stages of its progress, the melt this year has been astounding.
Scientists Lie! The earth is flat no one went to the moon, and yeah, it's ok to beat your wife. If you get disease Don't GO TO A DOCTOR. Doctors are scientists and lie! Beat your wife and read the bible or something. (sarcasm)
Jesus help us. Well, he tried to. @!$%#s
Gee - so what to do. We already moved all our industry to china so pick on them.
But how could this be happening? Haven't Karl Rove, Georgie Bush and innumerable morons told us that it can't be happening?
Anyway, isn't it ridiculous to think that a billion cars, a million factories, tens of thousands of power plants, billions of furnaces and cook fires, millions of air conditioners, etc. etc. etc., could possibly have anything to do with it?
Climate is ALWAYS changing. Scientists are not aware of this. Only Oily Industry and politicians are aware of this. Science is stupid
It seems that a lot of posters here think that climate change is all caused by human activity.
The climate is clearly changing. The Greenland ice cores show that the climate is always changing. So no argument there. The weak link in the doomsayers' arguments is the degree to which humans can be blamed for it.
The worth of any scientific theory (except maybe for string theory) is evaluated based on its ability to make testable predictions. In the last 30 years, average gas mileage has over doubled. Has there been any measurable effect? No. We brewed up an ocean of ethanol to burn in our cars. Has there been any measurable effect (aside from making food more expensive)? No. In 1995, Al Gore predicted that the North Polar Seas would be ice-free year around in 15 years. Has it happened? No. The French now produce over 80% of their electricity with nuclear power. Likewise no measurable effect on global warming.
With no ability to detect, measure or predict anthropogenic effects; it seems rather silly to cling fanatically to that particular mantra.
WOW, WHEW, I liked that scientific post. The same Al Gore that was mixed up in all that Tennessee Gate.Com stuff...........
You're ignoring numerous other factors, and misrepresenting the data. First, even string theory has to produce testable predictions (it has, and they were supported, hence calling it a "theory"). Secondly, changes in gas mileage and the use of ethanol as a fuel additive are not the preconditions for predictions about climate change. Despite those factors, global carbon emissions have not only continued to rise, but have accelerated over the last decade, in direct correlation to the concentration of greenhouse gasses in the atmosphere.
Additionally, before you can throw out a scientific theory, you have to be able to propose one that better fits the data. Thus, in order to reject human activity as a cause of climate change, you must be able to explain one of the following:
1) Where the carbon emitted by humans goes if not remaining in the atmosphere.
2) Assuming it is stored in the atmosphere, how those greenhouse gasses DO NOT increase the retention of thermal energy by the atmosphere.
3)Assuming they do increase thermal energy retention, how that could NOT alter the climate.
The fact is, none of those three ideas are in dispute. There has never been any evidence against any of those three ideas, and all of them are considered to be logical results of the basic laws of physics. It is flatly irrational to claim that humans are not impacting the climate by emitting greenhouse gasses.
hamjam - I never claimed "that humans are not impacting the climate by emitting greenhouse gasses." You are correct: there is bound to be some effect. My argument is with the unsupported contention that humans are responsible for all of it.
What testable predictions have string theorists come up with?
kannin, nobody, and I mean nobody, has ever claimed that humans are solely responsible. Where do you dig up this stuff?
Kannin, the effects of human and natural causes can be quantified. All the natural causes combined have a magnitude of less than 10% of the effect we're having. And the natural causes have effects that fluctuate above and below zero, whereas our effect via increased CO2 is relentless warming.
Here's a slightly dated chart showing the magnitudes of various natural and artificial forcings that are used to get a climate model that is reasonably accurate: http:/ /data.giss.nasa.gov/modelforce/
OK, y'all,
So here it is. All these posts, including my previous ones, argueing about the science of it all. Nobody coming up with any answers.
Well, here's one...It is an undisputable fact that the main greenhouse gas is CO2. What USES CO2? TREES!!!
The fact is, we need to STOP all the deforestation, and start PLANTING TREES as fast as our little fingers can plant them!!!
Who cares? I'm awaiting the rapture. Are you saved?
We need to mine and drill while the access exists. We will need the fuel whether it is to cool or to heat. Win / win.
Congratulations, you win this evening's blithering moron award.
I consumed many legumes yesterday and took a big dump today. Is that relevant?
Moron
Thank goodness! I hate snow and cold. I'm going to enjoy going swimming at the beaches in Alaska getting a nice tan. It's about time!
Solar flares unusually powerful this year.
March 7, 2012, July 6, 2012- The solar storm hit just after 12 midnight UK time, when an X1.1 solar flare fired out of the AR1515 sunspot. Another X1.4 solar flare from AR 1520 region of the Sun, second in the week, reached the earth on July 15 2012 with a geomagnetic storm of G1-G2 level. The U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) issues forecasts of this kind of activity, - Source Wikipedia.com
Gore got wacked trying to ride the 11 year Solar cycle of this kind of activity. The first time was the ozone Freon theory, second was the Inconvenient Truth thesis based on NASA retasking weather satellites to cause recorded temperatures in the atomsphere to be reconciled to the ocean surface temperatures. Comparisons wih old data cause erroroneous conclusion.
See Google Earth- no sign of ice on Polar cap. Compare to National Snow and Ice Data Center at
A 33 year low can be explained by an 11 year cycle? How? 33 is less than 11, thus, we should have seen ice coverage rise and fall cyclically over the last three decades, not take a nose dive.
George:" Google Earth doesn't display sea ice anywhere on the planet. Since this the season of minimum sea ice at the north pole, the Antarctic ice should be at a maximum, but there is no ice shown on the Antarctic Ocean either. Conclusion: Google Earth shows stable features like land masses, coastlines, islands etc, but not sea ice cover, unless there is an option I haven't found yet.
You mopes will never learn.....
Question: If man can melt the ice by what he does, how can he be so inept at creating some?
Answer: Man has nothing to do with it. Never did. Never will.
Nothing is static in our world. It can't be. That wouldn't be natural.
The only thing that is static is the dependable idiots who still want to believe that man can control the thermostat of the universe. Such a crock. It's all about money, huggers....nothing more.
Robert-
Slaining doesn't help grow brains--uselss.
Well--A fool returns to his folly as a dog returns to his vomit.
...and the Earth is only 6k years old... and evolution is a myth. Let me guess, because the Bible says so?
Even if man wasn't contributing to global climate change is it really a bad idea to ween ourselves off fossil fuels and reduce our carbon footprint anyway? Or should we just say screw it, drill baby drill,fill my pockets with money now, screw my children's children?
Huh? FIll your pockets with what? This is my one and only response to you.....
Carbon has no proven bearing on global warming......it's a theory, and it's unproven as of this minute.
Global warming is no different than Global cooling. The world is either going one way or the other. Period.
Man, in all his glory, has no ability to impart any kind of lasting difference on the rate of increase or decrease of the aforementioned phenomenon.
If you are really worried about your kids, I'd be far more concerned with the guy who is spending your kid's money faster than they will ever make it......Your and my current President. If you want to see something happen globally, remove Obama from the Office and watch the world breathe a sigh of relief and get back to work.
That is a very good idea for so many valid reasons. Unfortunately, our government will not allow cars like the 78.2 MPG Volkswagen Passat BlueMotion 1.6 TDI to be sold in the US. The US government has deemed the high gas mileage car a threat to its tax revenues, so it has banned the sale of extremely high gas mileage cars in the US."
Taking the government to task over its greed for fuel tax money will have far more positive effect than insisting on turning food into motor fuel.
Link to confirm this, Kannin? As far as I can tell, those are diesel engines, which do not sell well in the US. It doesn't sound like the US bans them, just that VW doesn't see the profit potential in launching the line here.
krazymop - I went back to the source I used for my post and found new information that contradicts the original report. There may be a few more back-and-forths on this issue, but for now allow me to withdraw my post. If you are interested in the latest, go to http://pesn.com/2012/05/01/9602085_VW_not_allowed_by_US_government_to_sell_high_mileage_cars_to_US_consumers/
My apologies if I passed on bad info. I try not to do that.
hehehe. Y'all make me laugh. the universe, huh? lol. We were discussing the EARTH. And yeah, our carbon output is changing the atmosphere....and never mind....Oh Mr. Spock
Time to beam us up.
I'm confused. If all these scenarios are due to 'global' warming, why then is only the Arctic region affected and not the Antarctic, the other pole? Splain dis to me Lucy!
Who really cares if our continent floods and weather and climate conditions destroy much of civilization as long as rich people get more tax cuts and voter suppression works.
The Arctic is sea ice surrounded by land; the Antarctic is predominately land ice surrounded by water. So the effects of global warming are different. But the Antarctic is losing ice, albeit not at the same rate as the Arctic. And that's the only good news. The Arctic melting won't raise sea levels because it's sea ice (melt an ice cube in a glass of water and see if the level changes!) But the Antarctic is land ice - when that melts sea level rise will be around several hundred feet. But it's okay, that won;t happen for several hundred years according to climate models. Oh, I just realized that even the most pessimistic climate model didn't predict the current rate of melting in the Arctic, so maybe the Antarctic will melt earlier than a few hundred years
Ricky, I talked to Lucy and she told me to splain it to you so pay attention:
It actually makes sense. See, warmer temperatures means more evaporation of ocean water. More evaporation means more precipitation. Now, over Antarctica, where temperatures are ALWAYS below freezing, even when the planet warms a few degrees, precipitation always falls as snow. Only there's more of it now that warming has caused more evaporation. And of course, the snow is eventually compressed into ice by the weight of subsequent snow on top of it. So the total ice mass over Antarctica is increasing due to global warming.
Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_is_antarctica_affected_by_global_warming#ixzz26xuglaux
Robert, Antarctica is losing about 250 cubic kilometers of land-based ice each year. (The sea ice there appears each year but then also largely disappears, so it doesn't have much of a permanent effect.)
Greenland is losing a comparable amount of land-based ice, as are all the other glaciers around the world when you combine them.
Worldwide, about 1,000 cubic kilometers of ice are melting each year. That's about double the rate of water flow in the Mississippi river.
So if you want a good visualization, imagine two rivers the size of the Mississippi pouring out of the world's reserves of ice and into the ocean.
Why don't you ask a climatologist to "splain" it to you? Do you realise that these scientists study all aspects of climate from ice cores to present atmosphere? Oh No! they don't know nothing!
I'm getting sick and tired of idiots questioning the years and years of study that scientists have undergone.....and you IDIOTS say.....well it's just this and that.
Go to hell. Oh, and tell that to your doctor. Doctors are scientists too. Did you know?
Somebody better get their reporting act together. It's poor reporting that leaves people to get the real truth on the internet. NBC I'm guessing is wrong!
So Mark Serreze states that an ice free Arctic by 2030 "... is pretty aggressive". You only need look at ice volume estimates and ice thickness (Polar Science Center website) to see that ice free by the summer of 2015 or 2016 is almost a certainty. But of course, all that does is open up the Arctic to oil and gas exploration, because that's all our society cares about. Global warming will only be taken seriously by the political institutions - and by seriously I mean given more credence than any other issue - when the general population suffers extended droughts, wildfires, tornadoes, hurricanes; all the extreme weather patterns that global warming is already causing and will cause to an even greater extent in the years to come.
Being a flaming liberal is just too easy..........you take a snapshot of the day and figure out how you can cry about it while trying to sound like you care. Tomorrow, you'll be back in your SUV buying crap at Walmart.
Comical...
There are people that care that mankind is so short sighted that fouling our environment becomes a secondary consideration to making a buck. If you look at the Grand Canyon perhaps you can conceive of the power of chipping away at something and in the same way flowing water eventually carved out that canyon we are chipping away at our atmosphere by putting crap into it. Nature's example of the power of chipping is a thing of beauty but man's has been anything but and it's far from comical.
I would say that some of you alarmists are the one's that are short sighted. Truth is, man hasn't been on this earth long enough to make a claim as to how or why things happen the way they do. Your frame of reference has got to go beyond a couple dozen years! That's what is comical.....you libs think you have everything all figured out....until you don't. Meanwhile, you wreak havoc on society by artificially manipulating markets and commerce by regulating things for reasons you cannot prove. It just FEELS like the right thing to do......Freaking morons! November is going to be a shocker for alot of you......I will guarantee that.
Do tell! Don't leave us as morons!
Oh, BTW, don't blame only the Liberals regarding the Wall Street corruption. Thank the Gingrich Congress (Republicans) who along with Clinton, took away all restrictions and regulations in our banking system.
You just proved my point......nobody mentioned Wall Street, Banks, Republicans or Democrats....yet you dwell on those old, worn out, Occupy-type creeds.
We were talking about the environment and our Presidential lack of leadership.
Once a liberal, Always a moron.
Thanks. Couldn't have said it better myself.
You don't pay my taxes and You should Never tell Anyone they are a Moron
The biggest issue is that we are now releasing large amounts of methane into the system...20 times the effect of CO2...I know some don't understand feed-back loops but It's like the gas pedal in your car...the harder you push the faster you go
It's already happening. It's happening to everyone. I don't know, maybe it's like the person who is diagnosed terminally ill and is in denial. This is hard to accept, but it's real.
hell with that. I'm gonna get me a big gas guzzler and dump my trash out the window as I speed along.
Heh, that would be fun. me me me and me.