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Subscribe to RSSAs German Chancellor, Angela Merkel, made her first trip to Greece since 2007, she was greeted by angry demonstrators in the country's capital city. Greeks came out in droves to protest the visit, as many Greeks believe Germany to be a central player behind the austerity measures taken by the debt-stricken country. CNBC's Carolin Roth reports.
Tens of thousands of angry Greek protesters filled the streets of Athens on Tuesday to greet German Chancellor Angela Merkel, who offered sympathy but no promise of further aid on her first visit since the euro crisis erupted three years ago.
As police fired tear gas and stun grenades to halt angry crowds chanting anti-austerity slogans and waving swastika flags, Merkel's host, Prime Minister Antonis Samaras, welcomed her as a "friend."
Blamed by many Greeks for imposing draconian budget cuts in exchange for aid, Merkel reaffirmed Berlin's commitment to keep the debt-crippled Greek state inside Europe's single currency.
"I have come here today in full knowledge that the period Greece is living through right now is an extremely difficult one for the Greeks and many people are suffering," Merkel said during a joint news conference with Samaras just a few hundred yards from the mayhem on Syntagma Square, outside parliament.
"Precisely for that reason I want to say that much of the path is already behind us," she added, offering a public display of support to Samaras's three-month-old government on her first visit to Greece since 2007.
Reuters
Police try to disperse protesters reacting to the visit of Germany's Chancellor Angela Merkel in Athens on Oct. 9.
She tried to reassure her hosts that their reforms would eventually pay off, but also made clear that Greece, which has seen its unemployment rate surge to nearly 25 percent and economic output shrink by a fifth, would not solve its problems overnight.
Angela Merkel greeted warmly by prime minister, but not by Greeks
Samaras promised to implement economic reforms necessary to restore confidence: "The Greek people are bleeding but are determined to stay in the euro," he said.
"All of those who made bets that Greece would fail... will lose," Samaras added, according to Spiegel.
On the other side of the parliament building, tens of thousands of demonstrators defied a ban and gathered to voice their displeasure with the German leader, whom many blame for forcing painful cuts on Greece in exchange for two European Union/International Monetary Fund bailout packages worth more than 200 billion euros ($260 billion).
Greek police fired teargas and stun grenades when protesters tried to break through a barrier to reach the cordoned-off area where Merkel and Samaras were meeting. Some demonstrators pelted police with rocks, bottles, paint bombs and sticks.
Four people dressed in World War II-era German military uniforms and riding on a small jeep, waved black-white-and-red swastika flags and stuck their hands out in the Hitler salute. Some protesters carrying banners bearing slogans such as, "No to the Fourth Reich," the BBC reported.
Other banners read "Merkel out, Greece is not your colony" and "This is not a European Union, it's slavery."
Reuters
Police try to disperse protesters reacting to the visit of Germany's Chancellor Angela Merkel in Athens on Oct. 9.
Some 6,000 police officers were deployed, including anti-terrorist units and rooftop snipers, to provide security during the six-hour visit. German sites in the Greek capital, including the embassy and the Goethe Institute, were under special protection. This security operation was one of Athens' biggest in a decade, the BBC reported.
Among the peaceful protesters, teacher Christina Vassilopoulou, 37, told AFP that despite having a doctorate, she only makes 900 euros (about $1,160) a month.
"We have children that go hungry and most of the parents are unemployed," she told the AFP news agency, the BBC said.
Constantine Spiliagopoulos, a lawyer who was also taking part in the protests said Merkel was "one of the main reasons that Greece's low income and the working classes of Greece are under attack," according to the BBC.
"That is why we must make our presence felt, we must shout against these polices and show that we will do everything so that they do not continue," she added.
Constantinos Siathas was more hopeful, telling The Associated Press: "I think most people, at least those who think and don't act based on feelings or utopian ideas, are pleased and are expecting a lot from Mrs. Merkel's visit."
Yiannis Bournos, a spokesperson for the leftist Syriza party, criticized Merkel's visit, telling the BBC that Greeks were "frustrated and enraged because they clearly understand that Mrs. Merkel's visit is just a theater play for the political support of a collapsing coalition."
Aid money "urgently needed"
After steering clear of Greece for the past five years, Merkel decided to visit now for several reasons.
She was keen to show support for Samaras, a fellow conservative, as he struggles to impose more cuts on a society fraying at the edges after five years of recession.
Yannis Behrakis / Reuters
Demonstrators, dressed as Nazis, wave a swastika flag as they ride in an open-top car in Syntagma Square in Athens to protest against the visit of Germany's Chancellor Angela Merkel, Oct. 9, 2012.
With a year to go until Germany holds a parliamentary election, Merkel also hoped to neutralize opposition criticism at home that she has neglected Greece and contributed to its woes by insisting on crushing budget cuts.
After her government flirted earlier this year with the idea of allowing Greece to exit the eurozone, she now appears determined to keep it in, at least until the German election is out of the way.
IMF: Global economic slowdown is getting worse, US must avoid 'fiscal cliff'
Greece is in talks with its "troika" of lenders - the European Union, European Central Bank and International Monetary Fund - on the next tranche of a 130 billion euro ($170 billion) loan package, its second bailout since 2010.
Without the 31.5 billion euro tranche, Greece says it will run out of money by the end of November.
The European commissioner for economic and monetary affairs, Olli Rehn, said Tuesday that Greece's creditors would not allow the country to go bankrupt, according to the German publication Spiegel. As European Union finance ministers met on Tuesday, Rehn said the next aid package would be granted "at the latest by November."
Merkel said the aid payment was "urgently needed" but stopped short of promising that the funds would flow.
"The troika report will come when it is ready. Being thorough is more important than being quick," Merkel said.
"We are working hard on this, but we must resolve all the problems," she added. "I think we'll see light at the end of the tunnel."
"This is an effort that should be seen through, because otherwise it would make the circumstances even more dramatic later on," she added, according to Spiegel.
Ties between Germany and Greece run deep. Thousands of Greeks came to Germany after World War II as "guest workers" to help rebuild the shattered country and more than 300,000 Greeks currently reside there.
But the relationship is clouded by atrocities Greeks suffered at the hands of the Nazis. Samaras' own great grandmother killed herself after she watched Nazi tanks rolling down the streets of Athens and the swastika flying over the Acropolis.
Greek President Karolos Papoulias, whom Merkel also met on Tuesday, fought against the Germans as a teenager, before fleeing to escape persecution by the Greek military dictatorship and finding refuge in Germany.
The crisis has revived long-dormant animosities, with Greek protesters burning effigies of Merkel in Nazi gear and German media playing up images of lazy Greeks keen for German cash.
Relations hit a post-war low early this year when Merkel's finance minister, Wolfgang Schaeuble, likened Athens to a "bottomless pit" and proposed imposing a European "Sparkommissar" on Greece to control its finances.
"The average German voter is irritated at the thought of dispatching more taxes or savings to feckless southerners, yet is desperate for the respect and goodwill to Germany that comes from public displays of magnanimity," said David Marsh, chairman of think tank OMFIF.
"When Merkel flies to Athens, she's showing she's in charge, and she cares."
Reuters contributed to this report.
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Leave a Comment:
If NBC, (National Barack Channel) is able to keep obama in office, which is highly unlikely, this will be happening in the USA.
So let me get this straight...Germany gives Greece money in
exchange for Greece agreeing to live within its means by cutting spending...and
these protestors are upset because Germany won't just give them free money??? This
is the ultimate entitlement mentality and an example of where socialism leads
to. Help someone out and they turn on you the minute you expect them to become
fiscally responsible.
THIS IS NOTHING COMPARED TO WHAT I AM GOING TO DO IF anyone tries to TOUCH my Social Security, Medicaid or other Services!!!
OBAMA/BIDEN 2012 . . TOGETHER WE CAN DO THIS . . YOU Paying for ME!!!!
Hands, you are such a fake poster. And so obvious.
Whatever. You extremist Republicans are as boring as the extremist Democrats. Thankfully, nobody who only votes for one party has any say in this election. Because your mouth foaming cancels each other out.
I'm happy to avoid the non-thinking people who call themselves for only one party or the other, these days. The problem isn't the leadership. It is the non-thinking voter who likes to pretend they are the majority.
Derek, didn't your mother teach you any manners?!!
Will you just be a Nice Young Man and Get Back to work please . . I HAVE NEEDS!!!!!
OBAMA/BIDEN 2012!!!
Well said, Derek.
This one I don't get. Germany is keeping Greece from sinking and they protest Merkel. This will not play well in Germany.
Hello BeesKnees, let me help you get it straight. Greece doesn't have a printing press, Germany does. Between the ECB, Troika, ESM, EFTS they can monetise economies and governments which they are doing now. All the large major banks are insolvent and bankrupt including Germany's.
Why is it ok to bail out the banks but not the economies or the people?
You said:
"This is the ultimate entitlement mentality and an example of where socialism leads
to."
Do you know who the biggest recipients of social welfare in the history of the world is? I didn't think so! They are your Free Market, Capitalist banks. Remember the bailouts? The taxpayers have bailed them out to the tune of tens of trillions of dollars. If it weren't for the bailouts, anybody with anything in your stock market would have lost everything.
Get off your high horse and educate yourself before you spout the ignorant sheeple mentality.
Let me ask you a simple question, do you know how money is created or who is authorized to create it? If you did you wouldn't post such ignorant statements.
Take a picture because this WILL be the U.S. if we don't get control of our debt and our entitlement program spending...............
HandsOff, you better hit the gym and get a gig with some cam site...things are going to get worse granny!
looks like a group of 35-45 year old retirees realizing that they actually have 20+ more years to work before retiring....no more frolicking in Mykonos
The US national debt per citizen ($51, 379) is much higher than Greece. The only reason they are failing is because their currency is not the world reserve. As soon as the Dollar gets dumped by the world (for being worthless) we will see much worse than simple demonstrations.
If Romney wins , you will see the Obama/OWS taking over the streets like Greeks. They already practice in the streets of Oakland and San Francisco.
TrustVerify: Before you get off YOUR high horse don't use the bailout of banks as an excuse - many of us conservatives did not WANT banks bailed out. They took the "bad gamble" and they, and their stock holders, should pay the price. And I would suggest the stock market, and the economy, would be stronger now because of it if the banks had NOT been "bailed out".
Secondly, you clearly don't understand monetary systems either especially regarding Greece and Germany. Germany does NOT have a printing press either. Germany saved their money being conservative while Greece spent all their money plus borrowed more. I don't want to get too detailed but they both use the EURO as their currency along with 21 other countries - and that is where the problem is. There are multiple countries using the same currency but each country does NOT have the ability to print money.
So Germany realizes if Greece collapses it will affect THEIR currency so they are basically forced to lend Greece money to protect THEIR currency. However, they told Greece they would not lend the money without severe austerity which Greece was forced to accept. But now the people revolt. I say "fine", kick out Greece from the Euro, and let them wilt on the vine.
And that is the similarity to the U.S. except the U.S. CAN print its own money which it is currently doing, devaluing the dollar at the same time, so commodities (like agriculture, oil, etc.) are increasing in price. You don't think gas prices have doubled over the last 4 years due to just a supply/demand change - do you? No, we have made our dollar weaker so these items now cost more U.S. dollars globally. And printing money is always the LAST thing to occur before an economy collapses.
Me, personally, I have been stocking up on survival food and ammunition as well as purchasing pure silver and copper for barter over the last several years. I HOPE it doesn't go to that but I am preparing for it if this country doesn't wake up soon. We are on the verge of financial collapse and if Obama is reelected I have no doubt we WILL financially collapse within 3 years. Nobody will lend us any money, we will print more and more money, and our dollar will significantly devalue to the point those even IN the United States won't want it. Again, I hope I am wrong (and if Romney is elected I hope he can turn around the otherwise inevitable) but if I am right I am prepared. Are you?
BeesKnees,
Do you understand that Germany is as socialist as Greece, if not more ? It looks like socialist Germany's economy is in pretty good shape...
Yo, To all you Freaky Greeks "Get A Job"!
Your Utopian, Socialist Government really worked out for you guys?!
OPA!!
The Greeks should welcome Merkel...like the Indians welcomed General Custer!
Wow, and entire country full of OWS wannabe's. No WONDER they don't get anything done.
Handsoffmymediscam, I think you're really a republican. Where is your shotgun by the way?
Maybe if they raise the price of Gyros, they will overcome this problem with the euros. zing!
This is the direct result of relying on cradle to grave care for many decades, and people having to be weened off of it. Like my friends dad used to say when we were young and he asked for more money, his dad would say "the sugar t**ties exhausted boy" lol.
Those who always say "this is coming to America" when these articles come out are ignorant. We are based on what you put in,is what you get back, you know work hard for a living. I create my own economy, as many others do, I do not rely on others to do it for me.
ProBusiness,
I have been bringing these points up for a while on the vine. The problem is that we have a majority of the population in the united states that resides in an urban environment. It is great that rural dwellers can store necessities, run generators, grow gardens, etc... However, rural people tend to be more conservative. This is where the irony comes in. The urbanites are liberal and are creating/voting policy that will ultimately lead to their own demise. When power goes out in New York for a day it is mass panic but in Wyoming, it is just another day. Be careful what you wish for liberals....
Peter B.
Thank you for that thinking comment.
The extreme right in this country doesn't understand that Germany IS a successful country with ten times the amount of "social" programs we have. I laugh when they call Obama a communist without any clue what that means.
On the flip side the extreme left doesn't understand economics all that well either.
Merkel's vision of "One EuroNations Fiscal Union" and "One EuroNations Political Union" is GOING DOWN IN FLAMES.
Just wait and see what happens when the Greek protests escalates to the European shores !!!!
Wait a minute.....conspiracy theory.....The "New World Order" pushed by the United Nations is also going to go DOWN IN FLAMES.
ProBusiness: Take a picture because this WILL be the U.S. if we don't get control of our debt and our entitlement
program spending...............
------------------
The total proposed 2013 spend is 3,803 TRILLION. The top 3 in order:
Department of Health and Human Services including Medicare and Medicaid
940.9
Social Security Administration
882.7
Department of Defense including Overseas Contingency Operations
672.9
TOTAL TOP 3: $2,497 TRILLION or ~66% of the total spend
------------------------
As a business leader I can clearly see what needs to be cut- how is another story but when people begin complaining about welfare (which DOES need to be overhauled but still represents a smaller % of the total spend) and PBS then IT'S clear that it's a deflection and misdirection strategy.
cgtrav,
Obama is not a communist, he is a socialist. You know that and support his socialist policies. The United States and Germany are not equal. You cannot compare an aircraft carrier to a canoe. The US has 54Million people on food stamps plus providing social services to 10+Million illegal immigrants. You cannot simply give away the bank and expect to remain solvent.
ALAN . . I'M A MEAN OLD GRANNY TRAINED IN THE MARTIAL ARTS!! And if Neccessary I could take 10 of those little Greek policemen with my PIPEWRENCH if they get in the way of My Services!!!!
THEY SHOULD HAVE JUST PUT ALL OF THE BUSINESSPEOPLE IN JAIL in Greece long ago . .or in Workcamps like in North Korea so that THEY HAD TO PAY THEIR TAXES!! All the people who can produce or Do Things should be harnessed like Farm Animals to Support Me!!!!
BIDEN/OBAMA 2012 . . . KEEP THE DREAM (And ME) ALIVE!!!!
WakeUpPeople,
"Department of Health and Human Services including Medicare and Medicaid
940.9
Social Security Administration"
I don't think you can classify Medicare and Social Security as "entitlements" since people pay into those all their working lives. It is not as if they are getting something for nothing. The word "entitlement" as applied to Medicare and Social Security is purely a Republican invention designed to prejudice people against them since Republicans have never liked those programs to begin with.
To Pro-Buisness... you do realize Obama isn't the one responsible for printing money right?
That lies with the Federal Reserve Chief, and the Secretary of the Treasury.
Point fingers at those who are responsible, not the president.
OBAMA/BIDEN 2012
@wakeuppeople;
Really? Does this mean the lines at the OG will be shorter on Friday night, because rigt now I am waiting at least 1/2 an hour.
Greece is an example of what happens when socialists run out of other people's money to spend. It became so easy to get by off the state without working that more and more people in Greece opted for the easy life instead of working for a living. It is also a symptom of a system where you could retire with agenerous state paid pension at the ripe old age of 55. This resulted in the tax base disappearing and the money to support all those social programs disappeared with it. When you make it easy to live as a welfare case you take away the motivation to work for a living. If Obama has his way this is what will happen here. The only way to get us out of the mess we are in is to cut spending and raise taxes. The longer we wait the worse the medicine will be. Do we really want to end up like France where they have just instituted a 75% tax rate on all income over $1 million. Do you really think that anyone should be forced to give up that much of their income to support others who do not want to earn a living, but instead want to live of the government!?!? There was a time when people were responsible for themselves and the only charity was private charity. We need to get back to a place where people are more self reliant and look less to the nanny state to take care of them.
**25% of Greek Debt is from Medical Entitlements . . . the rest from their other Entitlements since they have virtually nothing by way of military . . .
. . . just a minute . . I think Trust Verify is coming . .
Is Germany going to fall too???
Hello folks, Germany's Debt to GDP ratio is 139.8%.
The constant and consistent belief that Germany is a bullet-proofed save all is foolish at best. Germany lives in the same economic malaise roach motel as the rest of the EU, they simply rented the penthouse suite! Pushing them to build up more debt to push additional debt on over-indebted nations who clearly can’t pay back their current debt is quite foolish. Recession and depression looms everywhere.
According to Zerohedge:
Germany
German Gross Domestic Product (GDP): $3.2 trillion
Official German Sovereign Debt: $2.618 trillion
Percentage of Liabilities at the European Union: 27%
Percentage of Liabilities at the ECB 18.94%
Germany’s Percentage of the ECB Debt ($4 trillion) $757.6 billion
German annual cost for the EU budget $46.36 billion
German Guarantees for the Stabilization Funds $280.6 billion
German Guarantees for the Macro Financial Assistance Fund $211.14 billion
German Target-2 Liabilities $656 billion
German Guarantee for the EIB Debt $157.29 billion
Sovereign Guarantee for KFW $588 billion
Total German Sovereign Debt & Guarantees $5.315 trillion
Official debt to GDP Ratio 81.8%
Actual German Debt to GDP Ratio 139.8%
Does that look like a healthy countries balance sheet?
Mickey: Absolutely Medicare and Social Security are entitlements!! We may have been "lied" to for years about where our money was going for these but as of right now there is NO money that has been accumulated for these AND we are all told we are "entitled".
What I find interesting is Bernie Maddoff was sent to prison for life for the SAME thing our government has done to us over decades regarding both Medicare and specifically Social Security. Although I have paid tens of thousands into both over the years there is NOTHING in those accounts as we speak. More money is being paid out each year than going in AND our government has borrowed from the trust fund every dollar that was in there.
In other words we are broke and everyone believes they are "entitled" to Medicare and Social Security even though there is no financial way to fully fund these programs. An "entitlement" doesn't mean they are "getting something for nothing" it means the government says they owe it to you - but we now know they have no way of following through with their promise.
What about the MILLIONS of illegal immigrants that are LITERALLY getting something for nothing? There are a lot of people who have not contributed "all their working lives".
ProBusiness,
"An "entitlement" doesn't mean they are "getting something for nothing" it means the government says they owe it to you - but we now know they have no way of following through with their promise."
If that is the case, then what do you suggest we do about it? Should we have us a nice revolution and overthrow the government for stealing our money and making promises they cannot keep? That might be an effective solution to the problem.
AMusicalImpulse: Did I SAY anywhere Obama is printing money? No, I did not. I said that when a country cannot borrow the money they print it. In our country the money supply is controlled by the Federal Reserve. But I don't give a tiny rat's behind WHO prints it - I just worry that it IS being printed.
But WHY is it being printed? Because of our uncontrollable spending and THAT is Obama's fault. We currently have fiat money that allows printing of money and THAT is the danger. I don't know if going to the gold standard is the right thing to do but what IS the right thing to do is not borrow money we have no ability to pay back. Now the world lenders are getting skittish about lending the U.S. more money and if THAT occurs our goose is cooked.
So we MUST get control of our debt and deficit and need to do it on OUR terms before the world markets FORCE us to. When THAT happens then our streets will look like these riots in Greece.
That's pretty funny HandsOffMyMedicare!!
These Greeks want their free stuff and they consider Merkel to be the one depriving them. Coming soon to a country near you, just re-elect Obama.
ProBusiness
You had me until you placed your hope in Romney. He has no solution to this problem either. We need an across-the-board 43% reduction in government spending now. Yes, it will hurt for a little while, but not nearly as bad as it will if we reach the point you are talking about.
Gary Johnson 2012
$59Trillion in total US debt plus $121Trillion in unfunded liabilities..... Obviously borrowing and making promises is not working. Such a trend for a nation is suicidal. Revolution is inevitable, how that revolution occurs is up to the American people.
Another 4 years of Obama and we'll wish we were Greece.
Mickey: The solution is simple: We can only spend what we have. The government needs to quit lying to people and promising "entitlements" we cannot afford. It won't be fun. It won't be enjoyable. But it WILL make our country stronger.
Think of it this way: A husband makes $50,000 a year but the wife spends $60,000 a year and the two kids each expect $2500 each year for "allowance". The family cannot afford it. So the husband cracks down and limits the wife and takes away the kids allowance. Of course they ALL scream but the husband explains that it will hurt a little now but will put them in a much better position several years from now. The alternative, to appease the wife and kids, means certain bankruptcy 5 years down the road and losing everything they have.
Same in our country. No a revolt won't help. But our government needs to be an "adult" and explain the money is just not there and to pretend it is for another couple years simply leads to bankruptcy. Obama and crew deny there is a problem while Romney and Ryan are the "adults" in the room. Being honest with the people. Telling us it won't be "fun" but is necessary to make us strong again.
We have two choices: Stay on the current path of unsustainable debt that WILL lead to an ultimate collapse OR be adult about it and actually FIX the problem of spending more than we have. And, yes, it may affect Big Bird but we have to do what is necessary - or watch our own economic collapse.
Thank you Wake Up Now! Our debt level is absurd.
sorry folks hate to point out but we are screwed regardless of who you elect....
This election is critical. The failed economic policies of the repubs and dems have got us to this point. With a vote for Romney or Obama we are voting to try the same thing over and over again and expecting different results this time. We need a balanced budget now.
Spot on, again, Pro Business. It is a delight to read your well thought out & educated posts!
Dingle: Just so you know I like Gary Johnson too. But Gary Johnson can't win and a vote FOR Gary Johnson becomes a vote FOR Barack Obama. I like Romney, and think he will do a "decent" job, but he is not perfect either. However, the REAL choice is between Romney and Obama - and Obama is an actual danger to this country so between the two I must pick Romney. I would hope you would think about your vote in that manner and pick Romney. Then in four years if Romney is not fixing like we want then hopefully a Gary Johnson type candidate might have a better shot. But the choice is clear at this point: Romney or Obama.
And, although it would "hurt", I too am in agreement for a 43% cut in spending. How I would do it is this: Break up our tax revenue in bundles of $1 Million. Take a look at the FIRST $1 Million and find out where THAT million should be spent as if that was the ONLY money available. We put it towards the MOST important item. Then do the same for the next million. Then the next million. When we are out of money we are out of money. That way we are spending our money on the most important functions of government.
ProBusiness,
"Obama and crew deny there is a problem while Romney and Ryan are the "adults" in the room."
You are either naive or you are on Romney's payroll. I'm sure Romney will be just as happy as anyone else to steal your money. Watch what they do rather than just listening to what they say. And even in terms of just what he says, Romney has been all over the place. That's how he got a reputation for flip-flopping to begin with. One time he is a "fierce conservative"; another time he is a "moderate". He is whatever the audience he is addressing wants him to be just so he can get into the White House. If there is anything that can truthfully be said about him, it is that no one knows just what the hell he really stands for or even if he stands for anything at all.
Pro Business, I agree except Romney I can guarnatee, would not reduce the debt with any significance. Obama and Romney are the same except Romeny wants to spend a little less, with a little less taxes. With Romney he would add only $9,000 on the credit card, versus $10,000 for Obama.
Greece needs to round up these little brats of entiltement and make them clean up the city after their little hissy fit.
Four people dressed in World War II-era German military uniforms and riding on a small jeep, waved black-white-and-red swastika flags and stuck their hands out in the Hitler salute. Some protesters carrying banners bearing slogans such as, "No to the Fourth Reich,"
Classic.
Probusiness:
Romney and Ryan are the "adults" in the room. Being honest with the people. Telling us it won't be "fun" but is necessary to make us strong again.
Romney and Ryan are just as fiscally irresponsible as Obama. Gary Johnson is the only viable fiscally responsible candidate.
However, the REAL choice is between Romney and Obama - and Obama is an actual danger to this country so between the two I must pick Romney.
No that is what the media presents as the real choice. It is a false dichotomy. If people stopped viewing the republicans and democrats as the only 'real choices' then we wouldn't have this stupid two party system that likes to spend, spend, spend.
"Do you understand that Germany is as socialist as Greece"
Germany is actually a pretty Capitalistic country. They believe in Free Marketing and Private Enterprise. Angela Merkel is a Capitalist. The main reason Germans are doing so well right now is because they don't consume more than what they produce. Consuming/Spending can lead to massive debt. Merkel has some great ideas, but no one in Europe, and not even our own president, wants to listen to her. If they actually did listen to Angela Merkel, they would have to quit giving out free stuff.
Greece needs to round up these little brats of entiltement and make them clean up the city after their little hissy fit.
The people that should be round up are the Greek politicians and the banks that helped lead to this whole crisis to begin with. The rich always cause the problems but its the little guy who has to pick up the tab and gets the blame.
Mickey: But the difference is Romney is a businessman and businessmen don't spend money needlessly (or at least those that DO spend money needlessly don't succeed). And Romney has a history of success.
Don't get me wrong: I am not saying Romney is perfect. I actually did not vote for him in the primaries because he was not conservative enough for me - but this election has two choices: Obama and Romney so a choice must be made. Obama has four years of failure in his history and Romney has decades of success. Will Romney be "the solution"? Goodness I hope so.
But that is what makes this country great and every four years we the people get to decide. I saw Obama for what he was but the people decided to "give him a chance". Well Obama blew it. The "chance" he had led to failed policies and now we the people have the ability to give Romney "a chance". I hope he does what I think he can do - but if not then we look at a replacement in four more years whether that is a Republican, Democrat, Libertarian, or someone else.
But our choice is between two candidates for this upcoming election: Obama or Romney and who we think can do a better job. Then in four years we decide whether they have done well enough to KEEP their job another four years or are replaced.
Random pennsylvanian, you do know capitalism and socialism are not mutually exclusive, right?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_capitalism
Remember the old saying " Beware of Greeks bearing gifts" ???.....The Trojan Horse thing.....
Now it's "Beware of Greeks biting the hand that's feeding them"
You don't like Merkel and the EU's Offer....FINE....go broke an STFU...
P.S.....We have enough Greek Diners in America....so, stay where you are ......
Alan: I don't disagree and Romney/Ryan will not initiate the type of austerity you and I might prefer. It sounds like you and I are both the "rip the band-aid off quickly" type of thinking but that type of person can't win an election. So we must settle. But I DO hope that the Romney/Ryan would add significantly less than the $9000 on the "card" in your example. Maybe Obama adds $10,000 but Romney only adds $5,000? But the next year $4,000 then $3,000 then $1,000?
Again, I understand Romney is not perfect but between the two candidates that have a chance Romney is the much better choice.
And for all you Gary Johnson supporters I tend to agree with you and like Gary Johnson myself. But he CAN'T WIN!! I am on board with another party gaining power over the next four to eight years whether that is the Libertarian Party or the Tea Party. But those types of parties need to get a hold at the city and state levels first then gain power from there. There is no way Gary Johnson can win a national election - PLEASE recognize that!! Heck, I'll help support your city and state candidates and in four or eight years they might have a viable shot and I would be glad to consider.
But in less than four weeks a vote FOR Gary Johnson is a vote FOR Obama - that's reality. Let's get the best viable person THIS time around (in Romney) and I am on board building a grass roots support for another party too.
ProBusiness
The man with the solution is Gary Johnson, and the country needs people like you to start rejecting the two party system. A system in which one candidate enthusiastically embraces the tenets of socialism and the other who only reluctantly embraces the tenets of socialism. I really don't want another term for Obama, but Romney reeks or Bush's style of conservatism: unfunded wars and unfunded expansions to Medicare. In the debate Romney and Obama actually argued over which candidate would give more to seniors!
One of the first things on a Gary Johnson presidential agenda would be to cut Medicare by 43% and block grant it over to the states. We can't afford Medicare under Obama or Romney.
ProBusiness,
"Obama has four years of failure in his history and Romney has decades of success."
Decades of experience in business? Yes. Decades of experience in running this country? No. I think the United States of America is just a tad bit more than just a business and that Romney's business experience will actually do him little good as president.
This is awesome. The purse strings come to visit and these lowlifes riot. Nice touch with the Nazi stuff. These people are despicable. Let Greece pound sand. All they have to offer is olives, feta cheese, maybe yogurt, and tourism. Don't think they're getting many tourists now or in the future with displays like this.
A vote for Johnson is a vote for Johnson. A vote for Romney is a vote the status quo.
Gary Johnson can win, but it's not going to be done playing by the rules of the political establishment.
Dingle: As noted in a previous post I am a "rip the band-aid off quickly" kind of person and sounds like you are too. But we BOTH know that ANY candidate who proposes a 43% cut to Medicare might as well go home. Not that I SUPPORT that kind of reckless spending but they can't get the necessary votes to win. I also agree we can't afford Medicare but the program was destined to fail at the time it was created - when the government is put in charge of a program it is destined to fail because government CANNOT be efficient.
We see it in Medicare and Social Security. Both programs should have been privatized from the beginning putting the PEOPLE in charge of their programs - not government. The great economist Milton Friedman said it best when he said "if you put the federal government in charge of the Sahara Desert within 5 years there would be a shortage of sand".
But we have two viable choices: Obama and Romney. And with those two choices I must pick Romney. Gary Johnson can't win and if that vote does NOT go to Romney then, in effect, it is a vote FOR Obama. Maybe Gary Johnson in 2016 but he can't win 2012.
Mickey: Romney has had just as much experience in government as Obama WISHED he had AND add to that a history in business makes Romney much more qualified to be president. Why? He understands government and how to work with both parties (Obama missed that class at Harvard) but, more importantly, Romney understands business. And the ONLY way to grow our economy is to grow the private sector which are businesses.
Obama couldn't run a lemonade stand and Obama wouldn't know the difference between an Income Statement and a Opening Statement. But Romney understands what businesses need to grow and what government policies make it harder to run a business. Make it easier for businesses to open and run then the economy grows. When the economy grows EVERYBODY benefits. Romney is the much better candidate.
"Blamed by many Greeks for imposing draconian budget cuts in exchange for aid, Merkel reaffirmed Berlin's commitment to keep the debt-crippled Greek state inside Europe's single currency."
The sheer gall of these people. Merkel and the Germans provide multiple bailouts to Greece, to help them out of a situation they (and their elected officials) got themselves into, and the citizenry show up to protest in anger at Merkel? Where's the gratitude for preventing things from being worse than they already are?
Mickey,
I think you're right. But I also believe running a business for decades is much closer to running a country than a couple of year of community organizing experience. If you read the "Federalist Papers" the Founders believed that business leaders would make the best leaders of the republic. One of the things I really like about Romney is he's self-made man who has enough money and can't be bought.
This would be like a parent giving a child allowance, but only if they also do their chores. Then that child throws a huge fit and say it's unfair and their parents are bullies for demanding this stuff.
Sven: and let me add when you have run a business you understand the dangers of spending more than you make so unsustainable debt is the guarantee of business failure. And Romney understands our current path of unsustainable debt with lead to our country's failure so I see him as being very frugal. And when he is asked to spend money I can see him responding with "do we REALLY need it?" and "so what are we going to cut to get this money?".
ProBusiness
I just wish more people considered the inevitible result of borrowing and printing almost half of what we spend. Then it wouldn't be so hard to convince people "rip off the band-aid." Keep up the good fight :)
Go ahead Greece bite the hand that feeds you! So typical of socialist/entitlement thinking! All of a sudden OWS protests jump to mind, with the: "it's not what I don't do, it's what those that really do, must give to me!" attitude.
Your choice of deity (or not) Bless Obama!
I would like to ask a serious question. You do know that if every country and every person paid off their debts, there would be NO money, right? Since ALL money is created out of debt, if it all gets paid off, we're all broke. Wake up, people!
trust2112,
No, wealth is created by exploiting natural resources and personal ingenuity. A miner, digs up gold and creates wealth. An artist, paints a picture and creates wealth. So by your false logic, everyone should just take out a loan for $10Million and be set for the rest of their lives. You encourage wealth creation by writing IOU's.... Hell is a place where there is no logic, you my friend, are in hell.
Trust: Actually if we were on the gold standard what you are suggesting is, in a roundabout way, not incorrect. There would be a finite amount of money but the velocity would increase. That means the money "changes hands" faster. I fix your roof you give me money. Same day I have my air conditioner and I pay them with the money you paid me. Then the air conditioner repairman pays the grocery store for their food. Even though the money supply stayed the same more was produced and all three of us benefited even though no additional money was used.
However, that can stifle growth because although inflation does not occur (and CANNOT occur if the money supply stays constant) interest rates would rise and the pressure on increased demand for use of money occurs. That is where the Federal Reserve is SUPPOSED to step in.
If the Federal Reserve was credible their job is to grow the money supply at the SAME rate as economic growth. If they do that inflation is minimal (if at all) AND interest rates stay "reasonable". The problem is our Federal Reserve has lost all credibility. Now they expand money supply to artificially keep interest rates low to try and spur economic growth. Not necessarily a bad thing as a temporary fix AND in relative degrees of reasonableness. But our Federal Reserve is now printing money to artificially keep interest rates low AND and the expense of devaluing our currency and ultimately creating what will be runaway inflation. This is the scary part.............
Mr. ProBusiness . . . I'm not an economist like you two young men . . But if the Federal Reserve can effectively increase the money supply by buying Mortgage-backed Securities (thereby trying to stimulate the housing industry), then couldn't they also buy some type of Govt. backed securitized Student Loan debt (new invention) and wouldn't that be Social Policy??
And with such a more Benevolent Brother Ben perhaps they could buy up some type of Social Security fund products (if they are created) and maybe something else to inflate the Money supply to pay My Medical bills?? Doesn't this border on functioning like another branch of Government to form Social policy??
Excuse Me for asking . . But it's my job TO FIND MORE RESOURCES FOR ME!! (and Brother Ben appears to be amenable to this, wouldn't we start looking more like Greece despite the reserve currency distinction?)
...this is what happens when you run out of government cheese...4 more years of Oblowmo would probable do it...
I disagree with your comment - this is what happens when educated people ask questions of who, what, why and when. Learn to read and you too would ask who caused the financial crisis; why are you using my tax dollars to help a bunch of rich people who might have to find a job and when did the 1%ers decide that they should have all of the world's money regardless to who it hurt.
I understand the part about why we helped the financial market during the meltdown - because a lot of taxpayers retirement funds and savings would have been lost; but I don't understand the lust for money at any cost.
Sunshine, this has nothing to do with the 1% crowd. This is
Germany, a socialist country, giving money to another socialist country to help
them out of trouble, and then having their people all upset when they are
expected to live within their means in exchange for such free gift.
Recently, while I was working in the flower beds in the front yard, my neighbors stopped to chat as they returned home from walking their dog. During our friendly conversation, I asked their little girl what she wanted to be when she grows up. She said she wanted to be President some day.
Both of her parents, liberal Democrats, were standing there, so I asked her, “If you were President what would be the first thing you would do?” She replied… “I’d give food and houses to all the homeless people.”
Her parents beamed with pride!
“Wow…what a worthy goal!” I said. “But you don’t have to wait until you’re President to do that!” I told her.
“What do you mean?” she replied.
So I told her, “You can come over to my house and mow the lawn, pull weeds, and trim my hedge, and I’ll pay you $50. Then you can go over to the grocery store where the homeless guy hangs out and give him the $50 to use toward food and a new house.”
She thought that over for a few seconds, then she looked me straight in the eye and asked, “Why doesn’t the homeless guy come over and do the work, and you can just pay him the $50?”
I said, “Welcome to the Libertarian Party.” Her parents aren’t speaking to me anymore.
BUT WHAT ABOUT WHEN SHE IS OLD AND SICK LIKE ME?? You going to throw an Old Nana out in the street??
BIDEN/OBAMA 2012 . . . KEEP THE DREAM ALIVE . . YOU PAYING for ME!!!!
vglance--love that!
Jay Carney was coming into work and drove past a little boy with a few young puppies and a sign that said "Democrat Puppies Free to Good Home".
Jay gets to work and tells Obama who realizes this would be a GREAT photo op!! So the next day Obama, and his state media, go to this house and see a little boy out front with some puppies.
Obama jumps out of his limousine and the media quickly snaps pictures and sets up video when Obama notices the sign says "Republican Puppies Free to Good Home".
Obama says to the little boy "I thought yesterday your sign said Democrat Puppies?"
The boy answered "Yes sir, but since then they opened their eyes"
BeesKnees you are clueless! How is money created? Can we ever pay it back? Don't know do you? If you did you would realize that debt to the Federal Reserve is systematically impossible to pay back therefore you are a debt slave and eventually will be foreclosed upon by them in the future. The Fed through their IMF use a nicer term, they call it privatization. It's not if it's when!
While the Germans broke their @$$es working, the Greeks were partying and spending the money that they didn't have when the Government decided to reduce the expenses , they themselves destroyed its economy declaring strike and stopping the little production they had.
There is a lot of that Greek attitude here in the United States: Millions of people who like socialized Medicare and their Social Security but do not want to pay for it.
On the other side of that coin are those who prefer the "you're on your own" style of social disorder.
Mark B, Those people collecting Medicare and Social Security PAID FOR IT WITH THEIR TAXES. I think most people are thinking more along the lines of WELFARE (and all the freebies that come with that) or the freebies the illegals are sucking down from the public troth, both of which groups paid nothing towards, yet take BILLIONS from the taxpayers...
All our freebies, but most especially welfare, ought to be abolished, out right. Starting with 'earned income tax refunds'...
Wisconsin public tv had a show on last night about Janesville, WI where Paul Ryan running for VP lives. It was about the effect on families when GM closed the plant.
It was suggested by a democrat that the reason GM failed in Janesville was because too many middle class people could not buy cars. This is myth. The reason was the product was inferior and had been for years due to poor management and an indifferent union. The foreign car companies here in the US are doing just fine.
Next this democrat woman who worked for GM as did her husband now collecting disability explained to the children what republicans were all about. She said they want people to pull themselves up by the bootstraps and fix their problems. She said many cannot do that PERIOD. I am thinking of the many vets that come up after war with limbs missing that somehow compete in sport events and have gone on to be very successful. How about the Martinez that became an actor and won DWTS.
But the big fight is that resources used to entice businesses to come to our state the dems want instead to be given to those that can't get up and do for themselves. The problem is each state is in competition today and for the foreseeable future since jobs are scarce. I see ads everyday here in WI for MI, NY, MD, etc. trying to lure business from our state. EVERY DAY. A company trying to decide where to locate will choose the state or country where they get the best deal. We do the same as consumers.
The issue is too many today do not seem to be able to take care of themselves, including now it seems young women that feel buying birth control is too costly and should be paid for with taxpayer money. That cost per month is less than 20.00. How many sodas is that? How many cigs is that? How many bags for chips is that?
theboys . . . I don't know about you but I AM READY TO COMPETE BASED ON MY DISABILITIES!!! (and I'm a strong competitor)
I have 2 bad knees, high blood pressure and my husband is diabetic with severe depression. WE HAVE EXPECTED THESE SERVICES OUR WHOLE LIFE AND NO ONE IS GOING TO TAKE THEM AWAY FROM US!!!! Joe Biden and Barak Obama UNDERSTAND THIS!!
BIDEN/OBAMA . . .TOGETHER WE CAN DO THIS . . YOU PAYING for ME!!!!
Good post Sunshine: you seem to grasp more of the whole situation than just one small part that beccomes "the excuse" for this global takeover...not by war, but by starving us all out economically. Kind of like sanctions against Iran. All this is exactly what Occupy is about. Make the Banks pay back what they stole. Make Wall Street and Goldman Sachs pay the world back. This is bigger than most people know and as dangerous as Nuclear War. Most Americans don't have a clue...living on our isolated island of imagination spun by controlled Media. Not saying I understand it all but just enough to see whose trying to dominate and all the Publics around the world suffering.
@ HandsOffMyMedicare!! - you've got the satire thing down pat. Funny stuff. Love that avatar as well.
Autersity benefits the rich/superrich people or the (1%ers). The working class work to pay the rich to stay rich, I agree with the protesters-enough is enough. Power to the people!
Why should Germans be on the hook if Greece was loose with it's benifits?
Give me a break Sun59shine and go get a job!
Yeah know what your talking about before you comment please or you sound like the OWS tards.... German government and business models are ultra conservative and prefer austerity to deal with matters..... And what has that gotten them? Its made them the #1 country in the EU as far as employment and GDP.... So much so they are keeping the rest of the EU together with their monies......
Now stfu and go back to school....
AUSTERITY - Europe tried it too late to offset decades of reckless spending! The US doesn't need to follow this path but must have new Leadership....Romeny/Ryan!
Not sure what color the sky is in your world, Sunshine, but you are entitled to your thoughts and I support your freedom of speech.
Sunshine you need to educate yourself (if possible). The government owned the businesses, people were either working for the government or had a small business. Most never paid any taxes and you could retire at 50 with full benefits. The problem is without the revenue Greece borrowed to keep people on the dole (sound familiar yet?) and keep in power. The well has run dry and they are going to the EU to borrow $$$. In exchange for that $$$ they must tighten the belt (cut spending) and the people don't like the fact that they will have to work and pay the taxes they've been avoiding. It is the mentality of the "let the government take care of me" but the government doesn't have the revenue (government doesn't have $$$ they get revenue from the TAXPAYERS) to support the graf they started. I don't see the government starving -- do you? So get off the 1% diatribe about the rich, take a look at Washington -- don't see many "poor" politicians do you? They are living lavishly off the TAXPAYERS hard work all the while feeding you the BS about those nasty rich people and evil corps. You know, the very ones that BO hates while going to a $20k a plate fundraiser. Do you see the hypocrisy yet?
Austerity in this case simply means reasonable methods had been delayed so long the ONLY solution is drastic cuts. This is like a family who makes $50,000 a year spends $70,000 a year for 10 years. They could have cut their unsustainable ways 10 years ago and it would not have been significantly affected. But now they owe $250,000 and they go to the bank for yet another loan. But THIS time it is a little different - the bank says "No".
Now what? There is now NO way to spend $70,000 a year when making $50,000 with no way to borrow the difference so DRASTIC cuts must be made. Not by choice but because the "bank" said "No" to more loans. This family would have no choice and Greece has no choice.
But this is the scary part because what does the U.S. do when they have about $2.3 Trillion to spend each year but currently spending $3.7 Trillion a year and the world "banks" (aka "those willing to buy U.S. Treasury Bonds) decide they do not want to buy U.S. Treasury Bonds anymore? Guess what - already occurring. Otherwise why would the Fed be printing money like they are? That devalues the dollar and down the road we citizens will realize the U.S. dollar is becoming worthless and no longer want to use it IN the United States. THAT is when the U.S. economy collapses.
I see us 3 years away from the U.S. economy collapsing if Obama is reelected.
West Gerrmany planned for decades on how they would absorb East Germany. They discussed how many of East Germany's citizens were completely used to government subsidies for every facet of their lives - and the East Germans were panicked as to how they would readjust to the lifestyle of West Germany - the transition was painful but successful - Germany must have thought they could do this for Greece - no dice -
Stronghorse, you don't know what you are talking about. The problems in Europe were not caused by reckless Socialist govt spending as the Republicans would have you believe. European governments are limited to 3% of GDP borrowing, by treaty. Bad private sector loans were the cause of the problem in southern Europe. Greece is the exception to the rule. So the Republican propaganda, that 'socialism doesn't work' is BS. What you call Socialism, works, if you stay within budget and are not brought to your knees by reckless institutions on Wall Street. Your Plutocratic brand of politics will fail aswell, if they don't stay within budget.
Austerity is working within a budget frame that is sustainable. Retirement at 55, free health care, generous vacation perks, none of these items can be continued during a time of austerity. If you have 5 bucks, you can't spend ten bucks, simple math. Just because the greeks are used to the Salad days when credit flowed and the costs incurred were just pushed forward, doesn't mean the day of reckoning would never come. The Greek people are just pissed off that the cows came home to roost while they are still alive. All the bitching is about is that they feel it is unfair that they are the generation that will be paying for past generations excesses. The same will be happening in America. All the people drawing down Social security who put maybe 1/4 of the money into the system is ridiculous. I don't give a crap about Cost of living or adjusting for today's inflation horse shat, if you put in 10K dollars, you get back out 10K plus maybe 10%. People are ending up drawing out 200% or more than what they put in and that is unsustainable.
Austerity applies only to the Public. Private Corps and Banks are making RECORD PROFITS. Bigger than any time in World History. Don't believe it? Google it. Record Profits! Yet we are forced into depression and austerity with NO JOBS provided for relief. Does this make any sense to sane,moral,fair-minded people? No of course not. It does make sense to those who want it all. And psychopaths who are not able to care about other humans anymore.
Let the 1% Practice Austerity!
Is that the thank you she gets for giving Greece hundreds of billions in bailout?
My thoughts exactly...though we do the same all the time. I say every country that gives us their undying support can get our aid; but every country that protests America or burns our flag doesn't get a bloody cent!
Current policy may work.
However I am for Greek , Italy , Portugal, Spain, Ireland exit from Euro. These countries can benefit with lower
valued currency that will allow it to export to first tier countries and grow economically. It will also make them freer and proud countries by accepting reality and grow.
Greeks are the 1st pioneers of Western civilization and were the forerunners to Roman economics, and now they are on the brink of collapse.
Really a sad state of affairs.
Unfortunately the Greeks need to look inwardly for the solutions to their problems and America needs to look at this example to understand why borrowing to fund social programs that create dependence is unsustainable.
Social programs were not what made them go broke. Thats republican propoganda. GOLDMAN SACHS broke them with phoney paper and derivatives. Banks and Wall street did the same scam to our counties and States and Morgage Companies helped with theft of properties...many blatantly illegal robo-signing. Hard Ball Economics and killer politics. Not Social Programs. Climb up the ladder of investigations alittle and you can widen your view. Its the only way to protect yourself and the future from propganda of the dominate scammers who feel entitled to rip off the Public. What did they call us..the ignorant muppets who hand us their wallets? I admit that is what we usually look like, but more and more are calling the bluff. All over the World.
Sun59shine,
All the benefits you are referring to were unsustainable pensions and entitlements for a society that works less than 40 hours a week and retires at 50.
You and all the progressives need to stop being brainwashed by your lying liberal news sources and learn the facts about how the world really works. You're an embarrassment not just to yourself, but you embarrass our country when you continue to vomit your painfully ignorant rhetoric.
You have to figure out why you find believing in these lies is appealing to you. Something is keeping you from facing reality. Maybe something in your past? Maybe how you were raised? Maybe the circles you hang out in?
All the benefits you are referring to were unsustainable pensions and entitlements for a society that works less than 40 hours a week and retires at 50.
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vglance,
They don't even need to go to Greece to see the after effects of that, heck come to my neck of the libtard woods....YUP CALIFORNIA...
Greece has nothing on us, we have those who retire early at 50 with 150% of their working wages, the welfare scum breeding like roaches and the illegals who contribute nothing positive to our society and breed even faster while collecting welfare for their anchors, as well, we now have a populace who far exceed the tax base in taking a check from the government rather than paying a check to the government...and the idiots voted Jerry Brown back in office as governor (boy, hasn't that been a treat <extreme sarcasm>).
Greece has nothing on us
San Jose, CA is suing a handful of Banks for phoney derivatives they "invested" our money in and disappeared making us nearly bankrupt. Goldman Sachs did it 100x worse to Greece. (by the way, Greece may have the morgages no one can find for half the illegal foreclosure..Spain may have them too..the same ones sold and resold over and over. Spain"We bought those bundles of morgages" Greece"No we paid for them..hand them over." Spain"We don't have them. Maybe the same ones got sold to Italy too?"
Most of those protesting Greeks don't have jobs, so they've had plenty of time to polish up their hooligan tactics.
Good for them!
So let me get this straight...Germany gives Greece money in
exchange for Greece agreeing to live within its means by cutting spending...and
these protestors are upset because Germany won't just give them free money??? This
is the ultimate entitlement mentality and an example of where socialism leads
to. Help someone out and they turn on you the minute you expect them to become
fiscally responsible.
...when did the Greeks get so pathetically stupid......
The problem with the Greek debt is that ordinary Greeks were living"too high on the hog" for many years, collecting unsupportably high Government pensions at ages much to young to retire from the workforce, all financed on borrowed money, mostly from German and French banks. The Greek Government "cooked the books" on what the future Greek GDP would be to support such loans being granted and now they have to pay the price for having lived beyond their means. This is really a societal problem which exists between Northern (Germany, France) and Southern European Countries (Greece, Spain, Italy) doing business together in the Eurozone. The basic phylosophy and level of honesty in doing business varies greatly between these two groups of Countries and in my opinion, is the root cause of the problem existing to begin with. The Greeks basically "hood-winked" the Germans and the French into lending them the money that they are now unable to re-pay.
FINALLY!! Someone who understands what is really going on & who really is to blame. The greek govt blatantly lied and made up numbers to get into the EU, and the ones responsible somehow slipped through the cracks. The rest of the countries are cleaning up their mess, basically handing them blank checks & this is how they are repaid. I am so sick of people in power getting slapped on the hand & not being held responsible for committing crimes while the little man has to break his back (while losing his job, home, family, money) to pick up the pieces. (This includes Bush & Cheney)
Greeks cheat on their taxes, don't repay their debt, too many of them want something for nothing (as in useless government jobs and retirement at early ages).... I wouldn't spend or invest 2 cents in Greece.
Greeks along with Citizens of many other Nations across Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East are fighting for survival against the oppression from Fascist Banksters and the corrupt governments who have sold out their populations in self-interest.
I can't understand why Americans sit on their hands, cower, and endure similar oppression and corruptness.
'Austerity', 'Shared Responsibility', and 'Patriotic Donations' are the catch-phrases of 'Socialists', 'Plutocrats', and 'Corporate Fascists'.
Wake up fellow Americans!
"Greeks along with Citizens of many other Nations across Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East are fighting for survival against the oppression from Fascist Banksters"
Anti-Fascist, Communist & Socialist fighters for Freedom, eh ?
Then why did a Neo-Nazi Political Party (i.e. Golden Dawn) do so well (22%) in the recent Greek elections ?
...well their souvlaki is good
Keep voting in the 1% Psycho RepubliKon Stooges and this is what they will do 2 America...
Vote for the 99%!!!
Vote Democrat!!!
The liberals did this to Greece. They gave handouts that they could not afford.
You keep right on believing that Gorilla. If the Dems/Repubs keep on spending the way they want to, this will be our country in a few years. We are on an unsustainable path. Spouting the party line and calling people names doesn't cut it.
Looks like the tide is turning against our Surrenderer-In-Chief.
Post-debate Polls:
Obama 45%
Romney 49%
Sorry gorilla but you've got your facts wrong. It's the liberals / socialists who put Europe where it is today. If there weren't so many government handouts and entitlements they (and WE) wouldn't be in such a mess. Have fun living in your fantasy world though.
Gorilla -- SERIOUSLY?????? This is exactly what we're doing now -- spending our way down the same path with the same ridiculous entitlement programs to keep people on the government dole so they can stay in power with their giveaways. When your workforce shrinks guess what? Government runs out of other peoples money. So you "entitlement" mental cases need to start taking responsibility and personal accountability because the taxpayer is sick of taking it on chin to support those that won't help themselves!
critical times hard to deal with, will be here.
These problems in Greece would be a bigger deal, but we are all distracted by our own greaseball in office.
This is the dawning of the age of Aquarius ! LOVE ehh !
Just wait until Obama or someone like him, decides to take over private pensions or other bank holdings. Think it can't happen? you might want to study the laws that Obama broke with GM, and the media hardly reported on it. Obama and his 1 percenter buddies would love to get their hands on that money.
800 lb., you really have a way with words. Were you educated in the public school system? Douchbag
This is the Greek's own fault for having such a crappy economy even before the collapse. When the only thing you export is olive oil, something that Italy will be glad to take over, you open your selves up to crap like this.
Greece,
Our records indicate that you are too stupid to stick to a budget. So let me put it to you simply: you need to make more money than you spend.
European Taxpayer
What is a matter with those Germans? They don't want to just give money to Greece? The Germans must be part of that 1% that we keep hearing about.
Goldman Sachs works out of Germany too. They are the ones who should be returning all they scammed Greece's Government for. Why do Governments let these guys do whatever they want including steal from these Governments as well as the public and then make the tax paying (most of these guys don't ever pay taxes) public pick up the tab. Make them give it back and regulate for the worlds protection.
They play a game called pin the debt of the liberal. The Bank is responsible for lending money to everyone equally in Merkles world. Unfortunately the banks do not have the same feelings. Strees test anyone ! Banks and companies invest where the most profit is to be made. Thus the poor get poorer as the bank makes their own rules.
You are witnessing the unavoidable logical conclusion of liberalism.
You're an ass. Don't conservatives want to cut cut cut and bring on austerity. Bring it on and see where you end up.
Someguy: The last federal budget surplus was under a liberal President, Clinton. Bush started two wars, never balanced the budget and the result was an economic meltdown. You don't have a @!$%#ing clue.
Let the 1% use austerity and stop scamming something for nothing.
and what has this president done for the economy?