Greece's government has approved another round of deep cuts to spending, wages and pensions, which sparked fierce clashes between police and protestors. ITV's James Mates reports.
Updated at 5:25 p.m. ET
ATHENS — Greek police fired teargas and water cannons at protesters hurling firebombs outside parliament on Wednesday in one of the biggest rallies in months against the cuts the country needed to secure aid and avert bankruptcy.
A majority of lawmakers passed the unpopular austerity and labor reform bill, even as the rally attended by about 100,000 disintegrated into violence, with protesters and riot police fighting running battles in Syntagma Square.
Earlier, chaos reigned inside the assembly, where the session was briefly interrupted when parliamentary workers went on strike to protest a clause that would have cut their salaries. In a humiliating about-face, the government was forced to cancel the measure to allow the session to resume.
Outside, loud booms rang out as protesters hurled firebombs and rocks at police, who responded with teargas, stun grenades and water cannons — the first time they had been used in an anti-austerity protest. Billowing smoke and small fires could be seen on a street next to parliament.
The violence erupted as a handful of protesters tried to break through a barricade to enter parliament, where Prime Minister Antonis Samaras is expected to scrape a win for the belt-tightening measures despite opposition from within his coalition.
CNBC's Michelle Caruso-Cabrera reports that new austerity measures being voted on in Greece are causing a market selloff as rioters hit the streets.
Earlier in the evening, Greeks outside the parliament in a downpour held flags and banners saying, "It's them or us!" and "End this disaster!"
Protesters — some chanting "Fight! They're drinking our blood" — packed the square and side streets in one of the largest rallies seen in months.
Some held aloft huge Italian, Portuguese and Spanish flags in solidarity with other nations enduring austerity.
"These measures are killing us little by little and lawmakers in there don't give a damn," said Maria Aliferopoulou, a 52-year-old mother of two living on 1,000 euros a month.
"They are rich, they have everything and we have nothing and are fighting for crumbs, for survival."
Public transport was halted, schools, banks and government offices were shut and garbage piled up on streets on the second day of a two-day national strike against the cuts.
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Backed by the leftist opposition, unions say the measures will hit the poor and spare the wealthy, while deepening a five-year recession that has wiped out a fifth of the country's output and driven unemployment to a record 25 percent.
The cuts and tax hikes expected to be worth 13.5 billion euros are required to unlock a loan tranche of more than 31 billion euros ($40 billion) from the European Union and International Monetary Fund bailout.

Dimitri Messinis / AP
A riot police officer is engulfed by petrol bomb flames thrown by protesters in front of the parliament during clashes in Athens, Wednesday Nov. 7, 2012.
The vote is the biggest test for Samaras's government since it came to power in June. A 'yes' will give Athens cash to shore up its ailing banks and pay off debt due later this month.
EU Economic and Monetary Affairs Commissioner Olli Rehn called on the Greek parliament to do its part in securing its next tranche of bailout aid by passing the measures.
But protesters outside said they were on the brink.
"You live in constant fear and uncertainty. You never know what's waiting for you around the corner," said Panos Goutsis, 58, who works in a small corner shop in Athens.
"How many times will they tell us these are the last measures? We're sick of hearing it."
Greeks have been angered by the relaxed approach consecutive governments have taken towards catching tax cheats, with many saying officials have dragged their feet on investigations to protect a wealthy elite.
Following the publication last month of a list of more than 2,000 wealthy Greeks with Swiss bank accounts, the Swiss government said on Wednesday it was hoping to clinch a swift deal with Athens on taxing secret holdings.
The austerity measures being debated in parliament are accompanied by steps to make it easier for businesses to hire and fire workers.
PhotoBlog: Striking Greeks clash with police
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Now that the election is over, welcome to the real world, America!
Funny, but in case no one has told you, this is a world of our design.
We are the worlds overlords, and while the mobs may be distracted at the moment, do NOT be surprised if we face similar tribulations here.
Coming soon to a state/country near you...
Mark my words....20 trillion and climbing by 2016 easily...
America voted for 4 more years of the same...expect the exact same.
Victor: Of course gas will have to be more expensive. How else will big oil make their money if we make more efficient cars?
Steve972 if we could mine our own natural resources gas prices would not be a problem. BO turned down and eliminated access to the oil/and energy we have. I hope your prepared.....conservatives are.
I hope everyone is getting for those kind of riots here in the states soon. It will be only a matter of times. Soon obuma will be making a better secret deal for russia. He will start selling more and more of resources to china making it harder for us to heat our houses, gas our cars and feed our families. Welcome to the new hope and change. Foward over the cliff.
The same old tired rhetoric on gas/fuel. While oil and gas companies make record profits - and starting in 2011 the US #1 export was FUEL - still wanting to flog the "gubbermint". FYI - this is a capitalist country, we cannot "tell" them what to charge, NOR can we "tell" them what to charge. Try it, and see just how LOUD they scream.
bush is having a nice day...it's all good... no weapon of mass destruction...for those people in iraq to blow us up with today...and barry gon'a spend us out of debt for four more years...please send more green cards and off shore more jobs...put us all on government assistance...with low wages...sounds like the plan...you know times are bad when poor kim k. can't afford undies...LOL...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4lMxjW3HzU
This is what will happen when the money runs out for all the government workers and their pensions along with all the people living off of the working people.. It is predicted Obamacare will put 10% of small businesses out of business and taxes will take care of another 10% in the following year.. Once the tax base is crippled and there are few upper middle class people to take money from the government will come after all those who stashed food and fuel so they can redistribute the wealth.. They will make prepared people that are not begging the government for a meal out to be criminals and evil because they are not under the governments control.. Obama has said it many times that he is doing things under the radar to push his agenda forward.. Socialism 101 and as soon as he has liberal justices in the box they will start reinterpreting the Constitution and bill of rights.. Basic necessities will become expensive soon along with ammo.. The taxes on things that the Obamacare panel think are unhealthy will get a federal tax added to them.. Things like booze, gas, junk food, fast food,sodas, sugar,smokes,red meat, bug spray,cars and the list will go on and on.. We are screwed, $6,000 a year for health insurance or big brother will fine you.. Can't pay that fine, he will take your possessions and sell them..
Our corporate pool insurance for 4 healthy persons is - $17,000 a year. With a $5k annual deductible, which we met once in 7 years. Cry me a river - for $6k, I'll take it. Flush the HMOs, give me basic care from a one payer non-profit system. The well to do will, like always, have access to more and better healthcare - but give me basic care for $6k a year - PLEASE. Right now an HMO doctor visit costs me $178 a pop. We don't go often.
get your money for nothing and checks for free...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAD6Obi7Cag
Greece is just lucky that Germany is sensible and was able to bail them out. Greece is our future in the USA. Here's some examples. In Germany, the wealthy pay significantly more percentage wise in income taxes than the poor. In the USA, the middle class and the poor pay significantly more percentage wise in income than the wealthy. In Germany, the CEO's of a corporation make around 10 times what the average paid employees of the company makes. In the USA, the CEO's of a corporation make around 300 times what the average employees of the company makes. In Germany, health care for everyone is paid for by the government. In the USA, the people who have the ability to pay for their own health care because they are so wealthy, they get for free courtesy of the US tax payers and their companies. The people who make the least amount of money have to pay for their own health care. Germany is at the forefront of various alternate power technologies. The USA is so far behind because our government supports the greedy oil corporations who push to subdue alternate energy solutions. The wealthy in Germany strive to make life better for all in their countries. The wealthy in the USA strive to do as little as possible and horde their wealth for themselves and try to pay as little as possible to their employees.
Better get ready for the same here, people, if Bozobama ever tries the same crap he did during the first two years, as now he has no reelection concerns. He'll be trying to play the little dictator just like 2009-2010, and we WILL NOT allow that crap.
Well 4 times $6k is $24k so so far your deal is better.. You could find non HMO plans for less if you could join a wellness co-op.. All the side taxes for unhealthy things will drive people nuts..
Pretty soon money will be nothing and checks will be free...........
Coming soon to a community near you.
Oh, I'm sorry, OWS is already here!
Greece, (as well as the US), needs to look no further than Iceland for the answer. Nobody hears much about those folks anymore, do they? I wonder why? (sarcasm) Maybe it has to due with the fact they told the IMF where to go and what to do.
08/27/11: A story missing from our media: Iceland's on-going revolution
04/16/12: ICELAND FORCES DEBT FORGIVENESS: TOTAL US MEDIA BLACKOUT
I wonder who will bail us out when this happens in America?
China?
WHY DO I HAVE TO HOLD A GUN TO YOU HEAD TO GET YOU TO PAY YOUR F***ING TAXES? If that is what it takes then we will do it. What is so hard or painful about it when you already have more then others? Why can you not be happy that you have more then others by a large margin? I believe that is borderline addiction/hoarding is in not? That is what is happening over there, rich people do not want to pay their taxes, and people are having to hold a gun to their head since they will say and do anything to stay in money/power. If you did not push for unfair deals, if you did not lie, cheat, steal, etc. we would not have to hold a gun to your head. How else are we supposed to stop you since you are to stupid to realize the harm you are causing?
From 1940-1982 we had a 90%-70% top tax rate and the country did just fine. Ever since we dropped the tax rate from 90% down to 70% worker's wages have went stagnant. Ever since we dropped the top tax rate from 70% in 1982 small businesses have been on the decline. Our debt has skyrocketed since 1982 too and you morons try to blame Obama for our economy when you have been f***ing it up for over 30 years now. Only morons would think otherwise.
You will not let him raise taxes or even let the Bush tax cuts expire. They have not changed yet, WTF are the jobs? Why you are still shipping them to China? There are plenty of hard working Hispanic people that are willing to do the jobs that others are not willing to do all for less money too. Just to have a chance, an opportunity, they actually want to be a part of this country too, to be citizens of it.
You tried to paint him the enemy over the past four years and that has now backfired. Try gridlock for two more years and your party will be no more. STFU and pay your taxes already. People are starving and you a$$es are still worried about a whole 4% tax increase. The only reason this country will turn into Greece IS BECUASE OF YOUR GREEDY NON-TAX PAYING A$$ES. Pay your taxes or else I will do what ever it takes, even if that means holding a gun to your head. Why is it ok for you to bully and push around others, but not me? Do as I say not as I do?
TheKhanKubla
WHAT A DUMB STATEMENT.....40% of those in the US pay NO TAX AND get Federal assistance......good grief
Ok, post the Correct Answers to these Questions Below:
What did President Obama spend $2.1 Trillion on that was previously not Budgeted for that requires cuts to the previously Budgeted for Programs, Projects, Agencies; including cuts to the Benefits and Entitlements of the "47%", as stated in President Obama's Proposal to US Congress.
What US Laws were eliminated that made Illegal the Causes of previous Depressions. And who elminated those US Laws. And what were the Results of the elmination of those US Laws.
YOU HAVE 60 MINUTES TO POST THE CORRECT ANSWERS BELOW
TheKhanKubla,
When did you live at Germany and for how many Years.
Shows just how much you DO NOT KNOW.
Hillary/Warren2016,
Read post # 9.7 about "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share". Also calculate how much each of the 312.8 Million US Citizens would have to pay.
Calculate the amount that the "Rich" would have to pay.
You also need to change your screen name, SOS Clinton stated that she is withdrawing from Public Office permanently after President Obama threw her under the bus (Libya).
Think of this US Ambassadors are Presidential Appointees with Direct Access to the President. The SOS normally goes to the President for US Military or the President's Own Executive Intelligence Agency, the CIA, for any support.
No matter how many of us wanted 2008 Presidential Candidate Hillary Clinton instead of Candidate Obama; since being longtime supporters of the Equal Rights Amendment (a chance to get that passed, with President Hillary Clinton), won't happen now or later (2016).
President Obama's History of throwing people under the bus "It's only a bump in the Road", General McKiernan, General McChrystal, Secretary of Defense Gates, Official "Whitehouse" confirmation of CIA Operative at Pakistan (Hunt for OBL), Official "Whitehouse" confirmation of Pakistanis Doctor as CIA Asset (currently 33 years Sentence in Pakistani Prison)(Hunt for OBL), US Ambassador Eikenberry (LTG, Ret), etc..
Hillary/Warren2016 . . I am too old to work and have no intention of paying taxes on the Government Checks that I receive!!!
Please be sure to PAY YOUR TAXES because I have needs My President is going to make sure that You pay to take care of me!!! You don't want me rioting in the street do you??
:- )
If the NEOCON Norquistians think that they will be able to cut their way to prosperity, look at what happens in Greece.
There have to be cuts, including Defense, but targeting the old and disabled (SS, Medicare, Medicaid) is NOT the way to go. You can also "broaden the base" by making more types of income subject to SS tax and medicare tax. When do you think was the last time Mitt Romney or the Koch brothers paid SS tax (if ever) ?
...this is what we can look forward to now...and I can't wait...fiscal cliff...bring it on...I really don't care...
I am with you Walt. It is going to happen no matter what now. Wait until the those dependent on the government become desperate. Maybe they will roast Chris Matthews?
When they become desperate, you better have protection...lots more broke people here in the USA then people realize.
I stocked up on guns & ammo several years ago when the Brutha Hussein was elected the first time. I have worked very hard for what I have. I will give lead away for free.
Amen Kevin
There are truly two America's those of us that will be prepared to protect our families and those that will lay in the streets bloodied raped and murdered.
Obuma's speech this morning should have went "Hurry Hurry step right up and get you welfare and food stamps hurry hurry " If it comes to this in the U.S. I hope gas stations take Obuma stamps ! I bet not they will be as worthless as him !
Militia types will be dealt with on a case by case basis. Greece has a terrible tax cheat problem, everyone knows this. If those in the US try to do the same (cheat - Caymen Island/Swiss accounts), full accountability under the law.
As long as you have prepared it is just to wait for the high inflation brought on by Barry and his 3 trillion bucks he printed to hit the streets.. I figure the barter rate for a case of spaghettios will be an ounce of gold.. That loan on your house can be paid off with used toilet paper and while millions of people are running around in the streets fighting over a MRE you just have to stay alert,locked and loaded.. Bring on the cliff, the mobs will tear him to pieces like hoards of zombies..
My allegiance is with the mobs
Nothing would better serve Greece, our nation and western society more than images of the Greek people burning their corrupt government down being broadcast live on CNN.
Perhaps if some of their "political elite" were to be seen being beaten to death by angry rioting citizens, our ruling class might take note and choose to behave more responsibly, lest they face the same fate.
The battle is, and always has been about the distribution of wealth, and those who choose to resist political thievery by only peaceful means may well be damning themselves and their children to a life of poverty and subservience.
Perhaps we could call it the European Spring?
Alas I susepct it would end as the Prauge Spring did.
Nay............the OBAMA SPRING.
RIGHT ON !!!
More like Bonehead Boehner Spring. Or Bitch McConnell Spring. They'd deserve to be strung up.
a little corruption...does a politician good...
So if some large impersonal Bureaucracy controls the distribution of wealth is that going to empower the average person?
The difference, William, between Greece and the U.S. is that we have the 2nd amendment. There's a reason why that is in the Constitution and also a reason why it is the 2nd, right behind freedom of speech, religion, and assembly and not a higher number. I'm sure the framers had a reason for the order that they put the Bill of Rights in.
It's progressing that way in Greece. No confrontational deaths yet, which is the point where I think we can say the revolution is on.
Anilof: Your silly little AR15 is no match for armored cars and police/ NG with heavy machineguns. LOL. You have no rights as long as your trillions in increasingly deflated paper money is printed and debt bonds bought by the same entity- the Federal Reserve. Get educated. The US exported its skilled labor jobs/ economy for stockholders' payouts- like Willard Mitt's.
Fast and Furrious - all about getting enough people killed in Mexico so the president of Mexico would complain to the Un to spur the UN to have the US sign a treaty to impose gun control on the US via treaty.
It makes no difference the level of initial UN treaty control. It will be sold as only very limited control. However, whatever the initial control, it will be incrementally increased to reach the intended goal. The objective is to get the guns out of the hands of the citizenry via treaty because it cannot be done via legislation (too costly politically for the liberals) and doing so would require a consituttional amendment. Meanwhile, the other ongoing plan is to pack the supreme court with enough liberals to revisit the 2nd Amendment. Both avenues are actively being pursued to the same end.
The fact that the constitution cannot be amended by UN treaty while remaining true to the constitution does not seem to be an obstacle to Hillary Clinton and president Obama and Eric Holder and the rest of the usual suspects.
So what does the government think is coming that is making our leaders try such desparate measures to get the guns out of the hands of the people? Most likely the answer to this question is economic collapse.
People need to step back and use a little critical thinking. Homeland security is buying guns and ammo. Local police departments around the country have been turned into paramilitary units complete with skin heads and military grade weapons and various swat teams, amored cars, and now even drones armed with lethal force. All of this is being done at great expense in a time of deficit spending, so we are borrowing money to arm our government. No one is asking why. You should ask why. All of this is leading to a common point. Demand to know why.
WOW, you gun nuts really think you have something going. If it ever came to riots in the streets, your favorite Republicon government officials would be the first to use the US Army to fire on peaceful US Citizens (remember Kent State - Nixon's little domestic war.)
Believe me, you do not want it to get to the point where Greece is right now. The US Military would not hesitate in the least in firing on armed terrorists (f/k/a Tea Party specialists.)
When our meltdown comes next year we will make this look like a Birthday Sparkler
People are pulling all their money out of the Stock Market today here in the US. With the Fiscal Cliff coming up & all, the Obama voters will be rioting because the Romney voters are going to run out of money. Never worry about tomorrow when you can get free $hit today. I have getting older, have Cancer & a job. I have tryed to work through all of it but hey what the heck. Let's all stop work. As long as we have enough money for ink & paper & the printing presses still work, hell we are rich, right? We can just print more money when we run low.
Sorry to hear about the cancer. Got a sister-in-law battling lymphoma right now.
Funny thing is, they are pulling money out of stocks and putting it into US Treasuries.
What does THAT tell you ?
Imagine if the rioters got their hands on rocket launchers,automatics and explosives. Something makes me think things are going to be getting a lot more serious.
here in america, very real possibility.
There is a rumor that the sale of pitchforks is up!
My household is well armed, and if REAL citizens are called upon to assist police/authorities - we're good shots too.
happytimes: how are you at dodging tank rounds, drone strikes and cannon fire ?
with obamas wonderful economic policies that will be happening here soon.
yes, obama's future for america. bring it on .
Coming soon to the United States fire bombs and riots.
We now have HALF of America Yes Romney's 47% who NEED tax payer funded programs to survive. Many of these people have fallen into this trap for generations. They do not have anyone going back to granny in their family that has ever worked.
How can we as a society continue to feed, cloth, house and medically treat millions of Americans and non Americans when we are spending more than we make?
One day a reality check will occur we will face hyper inflation and their checks and snap cards won't buy enough to survive and when that happens the dependent masses will take to the street seeking "social justice".
Obama, Rachel Maddow, Al Sharpton etc etc will quickly beat feet and people will suffer.
Not "the rich" "not the 1% ers" they have the money to get out of Dodge but the liberal urban yuppie will know what Louie the 14th felt like.
As for protecting yourselves remember it was you Mr or Ms Urban Liberal that screamed about gun control so good luck trying to keep them from invading your house with your baseball bat.
Dude, the day those Bush tax cuts finally expire, we are going to see what damage they really caused. Once those tax cuts are gone, our budget will magically balance. Good luck in Canada... social medicine, VAT, provincial tax, fed tax, etc. They got it right and soon so will we. Our problems will be resolved this year.
You seem to forget the analysis of the 47% -> folks on Social Security, military and those who make less than the minimum to pay taxes. The freeloader argument resurfaces . . . so does the ignorance.
Oh Janet so wrong
you could take 100% of the incomes of ALL millionaires and Billionaires in the US and it would pay for 1 day of Obama deficit
ONE DAY
Janet I suspect you are an Urban Liberal yuppie suffering from white guilty
good luck with that
observing2
I lived in the Greenview Apartments a "housing project"
I got out by working my butt off
2 weeks ago I ran into an old friend from the neighborhood at my nephews football game, Clarence is a Freeloader he lives the "big life on $600 a month and food stamps" what is Clarence gonna do when his snap card buys him a gallon of milk for the month?
He is going to your house looking to see what is in your fridge.
Not mine cause I beat his ass back then and sure in the hell will beat him down again
Two in the chest and one in the head..works for me.
clarence will live as long as he steals from his own neighborhood, then goes to the urban yuppies, then he will make a mistake and venture to the rural area, his As...will be shot before he can blink....yeah we do not call 911 in the country.
You REALLY NEED to wake up.
President Obama has two options, "kick the can down the road", OR, as he stated in his President's Proposal to US Congress, "Across the Board Cuts" to all previously Budgeted for Programs (like Medicare), Projects (like the US Defense Budget for the US Army Corps of Engineer Infrastructure Programs within the US, like the Levees at New Orleans, New Jersey; Dredging; Bridges; Water Reservoirs; etc.), Agencies (like FEMA, current Sandy; the US Intelligence Agencies like Clinton Gutted resulting in the US being Blind and Deaf to the events leading to the 9/11 2001 Attacks), President Obama as Commander In Chief Ordered current Reduction In Forces of the US Military of 90,000 US Military to be thrown on Unemployment further straining the Veteran's Affairs (Administration) (VA also chopped) plus 108, 000 US Civilians directly employed by the US Military thrown on Unemployment, and according to President Obama, 2012, "A 10% Defense Budget Cut will result in a Million (US) Civilians becoming Unemployed".
And yes, just wait till the "47%" find out that President Obama's Proposal to US Congress stated a chop to their Entitlements and Benefits.
I keep saying President Obama's US on The Road To Greece for a reason. Identical Actions, mean Identical Results.
You want to praise the Canadians, that modelled themselves after the British Government, Programs, etc.. You might want go look carefully at what is happening (again) at England.
The expiration of the Bush Tax Cuts for everyone (rich, middle class, poor), as extended by President Obama will NOT pay for President Obama spending $2.1 Trillion that was not previously Budgeted for.
If you even think "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share" works, that automatically negates any "Tax Breaks", "Tax Incentives", etc. for Businesses. Translation the "Rich" Foreign and US Business Investors leave the US, then the US Businesses leave and take the US Jobs with them. As stated by President Obama, 2012, State of the Union Address the 35% US Taxes are one of the Highest in the World (Note: Most Nations are 25% or lower)(the US Taxes of 35% do NOT include the Taxes added to the 35% from the Local, Cities, States). Do you see now how what President Obama says and does is self defeating, with adverse results for the US Citizens.
Historical Precedents of "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share":
The Rich Founding Fathers refuse to pay the British "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share" of British Stamp Act Taxes.
US During the Great Depression, "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share", the Rich leave the US, and or start shipping their earned money to overseas banks.
Chancellor Hitler comes to power, "Jews Own Everything", "Loyal Germans must take Germany back from the Jews".
1970s British "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share". British Icon Business leave England to Ireland, India, etc.. Even The Beatles leave England. The British start taxing everyone including the "Royals" (below the Queen's own), so the previous Castles start turning into ruins, to save these the "Lower Royals" start turning these into "Tourist" (traps). They then start taxing the "Upper Middle Class" as the "Rich". Most British Icon Businesses are either Nationalized or sold to Foreign Nations. More British become unemployed "On the Dole", the British Pubs walls outside have black marks from rubber soles of shoes, as those "On the Dole" have no place to go and do not have enough money to go into the Pubs; those "On the Dole" start to outnumber those paying the constantly increasing British Taxes, the British Government starts chopping the amounts paided to those "On the Dole".
2008, Candidate Obama stated, "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share", the US and Foreign Rich Business Investors flee the US, and start investing in Mexico (again), Vietnam, India, China, etc.. This only adds to the "Credit Crisis" part of the $60 Trillion to $100 Trillion Global Economic Crisis, that President Obama has no idea how to fix because he does not even know what the Cause(s) is/are; so the US Government must loan money to US Businesses. US Corporations start to flee the US, including moving their Headquarters to Zug Switzerland. The "Rich" already knew that Candidate Obama will become US President in 2008. After leaving the Rich Business Investors leave the US, many Retail Stores start filing Bankruptcy, like CompUSA (Closure), Sears Holdings (Reorganization), K Mart (Reorganization), Circuit City (Closure), etc.. Then Democratic Party Controlled US Congress and Candidate Obama's Buddy "Mr.Corporate America" sees what is happening to the "Too Big To Fail" and push their 2008 Troubled Asset Relief Program to get the Electoral College Votes for Candidate Obama.
Greece is giving out more in Social Programs, Benefits, and Entitlements than they are taking in as Taxes. They start borrowing money (just the US borrowing money from China, to pay for necessary things like Sesame Street, LOL.). They attempt their "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share", except the "Rich" have already fled, so now the Middle Class are the "Rich". Previously, one of the steady incomes for many Greeks were from the US Military Installations at Greece.
2012, French start their "Tax the Rich", "Rich Pay Their Fair Share"; the Rich flee France. Some of the Rich also abandoned their "Mansions" and stop all Mortgage payments; creating a French "Mortgage Crisis". One of the few incomes that the French still have is from the Germans buying electricity from them, French Nuclear Power Plants. However, unlike the Germans the French must rely on Libyan and Middle East Oil (due to President Obama's Policies lost to the Chinese and Russian Federation).
Janet75cm you really need to research everything instead of relying on someone else's non factual opinions as political sound bites.
http://money.msn.com/investing/11-things-wrong-with-congress
The above are brief descriptions of my Scientific Causative Timeline also using the Interrelated Systems Management Approach (as previously only taught to US Military Project Managers as MS or PhD.) to create a Predictive Timeline Model.
add to post #9.7.
Janet75cm,
Almost forgot. What do you think the almost hundred thousand US Labor Union Workers that maintain the USN CVNs (US Navy Aircraft Carriers) are going to do after they find out that President Obama did not exactly tell the whole truth in his 2012 State of the Union Address, promising that he would not decrease the number of USN Aircraft Carrier Strike Groups from 11 to 10. What President Obama as Commander In Chief did NOT mention was that December 2012, the USN Aircraft Carrier CVN-65 USS Enterprise is going to be Decommissioned and Scraped, long before CVN -80 replaces CVN-65, translation they will be LAID OFF until 2015 (if CVN-80 passes the Sea Trials).
As a Flip Flop, President Obama in April 2009 ordered his US Defense Budget Cuts of the USAF (F-22, that directly put 95,000 US Civilians on Unemployment, the DOD figure including indirect employment is higher (F-22 parts manufacturers, suppliers, warehousing and transportation)) and USN (one USN Aircraft Carrier Strike Group), until the hundred thousand US Labor Union Workers threatened to drive from Virginia and Strike on the Steps of the Whitehouse.
David, what were you sayin'?
Nothing that concerns you, my posts #9.7 and #9.8 above addressed to Janet75cm
Everyone just take a breadth and calm down. Sure some Greeks are pissed, but those are freeloaders. These people have 90+ days a year paid vacation, and retire at 55. Now, they must come to reality and it is hard. We in American are nowhere near this condition. In fact, some are entertaining Social Security at 70, and lost collective bargaining rights. At this point, even Japan has pulled out of our market because our currency is now weaker. That will improve our auto sales globally. At the end of the day, our economy will rebound much quicker. Greece will need to start working for a living like the rest of us. We already know that, or at least we should...
america has the same freeloaders.
Janet, you know not whereof you speak.
Janet I grew up in the projects
I busted my butt to get out
almost EVERYONE is still there
and now they have grand babies
not just kids grand kids that we are feeding
START DRUG TESTING FOR SSI SSD and SNAP
AND STOP INCREASING THE AWARDS FOR HAVING MORE KIDS
AND NADA POR LOS ILLEGALS
It will be a hard pill to swallow when the givers tell the takers there is no more to give. But, someone will come to our rescue. And there's a pony hiding somewhere - can't you smell it.
Well, the odor of BS is pretty strong.
Rachel Madcow (disease), and what comes out of either end of a Jackarse (Symbol of the Demoncraps).
folks, buy your guns and ammo now, things here in america are gonna get tight.
Snipers should be on duty to surgically remove anyone tossing cocktails...the crowd soon figures out that it ain't a good idea.
the thing is the EU dont believe in guns, cop over there only carry batons and a shield. good luck with that.
This is how Pennsylvania Avenue will look after 4 more years of liberal policies that dismiss any personal responsibility. Our credit rating will be downgraded again and our currency worth even less. This will cause a rise in the cost of commodities and the poor will be poorer and the rich will be richer. Until our government realizes that there is a select few in this country that really need assistance we will never be able to cover the checks that are written.
With most of the attitudes being posted, the dire situations will surely occur. Sit back on your dead butts, do nothing but criticize and rabble rouse. That only seems to be what you're good at. Trolls du Jour
observing I never sat on my ass
I got OUT OF THE PROJECTS
NO ONE HELPED ME
YOU HAVE TOO WANT TO DO IT
Victor - I worked in schools as a part-timer, with little kids with some problems, not terrible (I'm not qualified for that), just needing someone to talk to and show some caring. And volunteering and helping teens in high school - so it is hard to believe that no one helped you. Yes, you have to want to do it, but someone has to give you hope that "it" can be done, escape from what ever the situation is that landed a kid in the "projects". Education and support services are crucial, and even with my kids grown - I'm still volunteering - and voted for the school tax prop, which thankfully passed last night.
There are a lot of kids of all ethnic backgrounds that need a hand up - they are our future - and I'll be there for them. Not only is it the "Christian thing" to do, but my civic duty as well, for America's future.
happytimesarehearagain,
Victor-1304988 is more correct than wrong.
A long time ago after I Retired from the US Military, my second US Civilian Career was Teaching at Inner City Schools (before Metal Detectors). Being a new Teacher, that is what I got assigned to a Inner City Combat Zone School.
It was NORMAL for the other children to do beat downs on my "Urkels" because they were making the others look bad. The Parents of the other children would even scream at the Parents of my students for making them look like bad Parents.
Even their own Families and Relatives would berate them routinely.
As Role Models in most cases they saw how their Parents worked the (Public Assistance) system. Collecting Public Assistance feeding their children cereal or a bag of potato chips, while selling their food purchases on the "black market" for cash to buy drugs, booze and cigarettes. Jobs paid in cash as unreported income to stay within the limits to still get Public Assistance. Same crap that the current over 23 Million Illegal Aliens at the US are doing, except they send the cash "home", so that when they return "home" they can live like Kings and Queens (lower cost of living, and evaded their own Nation's Taxes).
Then there were the Gangs, as either join or you don't survive. Gang initiation usually being a violent criminal act like random Murder, Rape then murder, Armed Assault, etc., so that if you decide to quit you will be ratted out anonymously to the Police or usually dead; same crap that the Illegal Alien Gangs at SOCAL (Southern California) do.
Eventually, the altruistic reasons for most Teachers disappeared and only became Job Security. I watched this happen before being Recalled back to Active Duty in the Special Category (that destroyed my US Civilian Teaching Career; but, did allow as part of our US Military Asymmetric Warfare, Humanitarian Assistance Mission, teach Afghan children).
The days of the 1967 movie, To Sir, with Love, are gone.
David, I don't doubt you saw some bad stuff. To walk away and do nothing is not the answer, or it will be the end of the US.
Close down the failing schools and disperse the poor. Some of those kids are mentally ill from the trauma of their existence. San Diego has a high school just for those needing services (not that it will help, but something has to be done, if only to protect the kids at the "normal" schools). The school I was at yesterday, almost inner city, has mostly nice kids - just no one to raise the bar. Unless someone comes into their life and bothers. You can't give up, or they will for sure.
Work with k-3. By 3rd grade, the ones who are giving up - you can see it in their eyes. Gives me the chills.
add to post #15.3:
To Sir With Love:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbjMVpK_utU&feature=related
Note: After Retiring from the US Military, many of my peers and subordinates (Family by choice, not accident of birth) after Retiring became US Law Enforcement, Firefighters, EMTs/EMS, etc. to continue to Serve the US Citizens. New York City was hiring the most US Military Veterans.
Then 9/11 2001 Attacks occurred and most of us on Retirement that were not killed at New York City came back on Active Duty. In October of 2001 we went into Afghanistan to Overthrow the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Government. OBL was NOT the Mission until after President Bush Amended the US No Assassination Policy in 2006.
Because of previous President Clinton Gutting of the US Intelligence Agencies, there were no local Afghan Intelligence Assets to link up with, so we gathered the Afghans hiding from the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban in the mountains; they became the Northern Alliance.
And because of President Clinton's Cut to the Bone Reductions In Forces of the US Military and Defense Budget Cuts, many others that were previously RIF'ed refused to return to Active Duty, and we were poorly equipped and blind to what was happening all over Afghanistan (no local intelligence assets).
We formed into two groups; group one with the Northern Alliance would attack the Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada Training Camps and Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, group two with most of us from previous experience from Operation Cyclone would go into the Afghan Cities to fight the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban Militia (underestimated due to no local intelligence assets, as actually an Army fully supported by the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran). During the fierce Urban Warfare we were almost wiped out at Qala 'I' Janghi, Mazar 'I' Sharif, etc. after running out of ammunition, grenades, etc. including using enemy weapons from those we killed. It was down to bayonets (that do not run out of bullets). Most of us believed this was going to be Mo(gadishu) again of President Clinton's UN Mission Somalia II, what you know as the Battle for Mogadishu, aka Blackhawk Down, except no place to run to. At the last moments after surviving Redacted % dead, group one on horseback with the Northern Alliance arrived literally as Cavalry to the Rescue, reinforced us and together we drove the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Islamic Jihadists out of Afghanistan on the Old Silk Road to Northern Iraq, and also into Pakistan.
Group one (larger numbers than implied below):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arxKhJIjIiY
The big mistake was that Afghanistan was a UN Mission since December 2001, so NATO appointed Gentleman British General McColl as the Commander of Afghanistan, with no knowledge of Asymmetric War Afghanistan, and only British Conventional Warfare. So all our gains we paid in our blood were lost while we were at Northern Iraq conducting 2001 Operation Viking Hammer, eliminating the Fundamentalist Islamic Taliban, Fundamentalist Islamic Al Quada, Islamic Jihadists, that escaped us at Afghanistan to Northern Iraq and combined with the Fundamentalist Islamic Kurdistanis became Ansar Al Islam. The Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran gave Ansar Al Islam Islamic Sanctuary, so they escaped us again, and most went back into Afghanistan and British General McColl did not really attempt to stop them, same with those that returned to Afghanistan from Pakistan.
Instead of returning home, survivors from the above, we are augmented with the US Army 10th Special Forces Group. Our Mission is changed to Accomplish President Clinton's US Law, H.R. 4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" Justification, Section 2 Weapons of Mass Destruction, Section 3 US Policy the Overthrow of President Hussein, with US Congressional Appropriations as 2002 Operation Hotel California and later becoming 2003 Operation Iraqis Freedom after President Bush took one year to mobilize the US Military after President Clinton's RIFs and Defense Budget Cuts, with manyUS Military Units previously being Deactivated and their equipment turned over to States National Guard.
So like I stated before happytimesarehearagain, the Teachers today lack altruistic motives for being Teachers as a Civic Duty, including demanding more money during the current Depression (not Recession, since the US Laws that made Illegal the Causes of previous Depressions were eliminated). US Military paid below minimum wages, doing the above and later on till a few months ago we were Teaching Afghans (Men, Women, Children) at the schools we helped them build, as part of our US Military Asymmetric Warfare, Humanitarian Assistance Mission.
I did not read trolling, you know what I read in a majority these post? This is what I read as a summation of most of the post here above mine....
"John Galt has left and he is NOT coming back....."
Sadly to say as being 50 in America and being born here, I would have to agree.... We are now B status locally, national and globally.
Travel the world and you will see I am correct. We are B if not C in education, science and technology. Infrastructure crumbling national, vacant buildings nationwide...Enjoy the ride down... it may be shorter and more painful then you expect. That will be called hyper-inflation when the FIAT american dollar goes belly up... by the way...you can eat money.
You call it trolling, I call it civil discourse and the foundation of our constitution and the most patriotic duty I have. I will speak freely and openly. Trolling my ass......
When it become 50 + 1% of people that want hand-outs it's over...we are close.
I wonder what they are fighting over - Wake up you Obama lovers. It's coming to America and coming soon.
You can never get out of debt when you have to borrow a loan to pay the last loan. It is never ending. So even with the austerity measures Greece will be in debt and stay in debt.
As for us, even if every company and every individual with any money or assets gave our last dime, the 14 trillion debt still wouldn't be paid off. People would have to work for free and give up bennies for years. That is an awful big number.
work for free.i can see that.that can become a reality.take loans,give most to the banks,the rest to defense,companies struggle to keep up,cut workers wages and benefits,take another loan,give most to banks the rest to defense,companies lay off workers cut pay ,no benefits, take another loan......
It is NOT "close" to 50% getting a handout. The 47% included lower income seniors and "working poor". Only about 20% of that "group" are on welfare, and about 20% of them are actually "chronic poor".
Job training and child care assistance would go a LONG way to ease poverty - you know, all those babies that got born, and need help - which falls on the deaf ears of the "x-tians".
This is what happens when you let Bankster Thugs like the Rothchilds and the Rockefellers
control (The Bilberberg Group, Who meet once a year in secret). That is all the
EU was created to, do is to steal the wealth. And countries like Greece didn't
stand a chance once they joined and gave away their soverenty. (HUM, Didn't the
EU just win the Nobel Peace Prize).
Don't think the US is any different? We have signed on to the same type of fraud. Its call the
Federal Reserve Act of 1913. Sooner or later this WILL be happening in our
country.
The funny thing is, most of you ran out and made an UN-Educated Vote for either Berry O
or Ole Mittens. Heck, Most of you didn’t even realize that there were 4 people
on the ballot. Some of you used 2 dimensional thinking with the though of “a
vote for anyone else is a waste of a vote”. You threw down a vote for 2 people that were
owned by the SAME Global Bankster Mob, which in reality is a waste of a vote
because it is a vote for a different face with the same policies. You see, an educated person finds out what a candidate is TRULY about and can there for make an educated decision.
Oh I know, CNN and Fox told you and they don't lie, Again owned by the Global Elite that run
all. THE BILDERBERG GROUP!! If you don't believe it, then keep living like a
brained washed Sheeple.
In the mean time I keep bracing for the impact!!!!
This is true
we are doomed by a freaking law that Woodrow Wilson signed
and to all you blind liberals General Electric has it's hand up puppet Obama's butt making his lips move
yep, and lets not forget Ole' Mittens is controlled by the same elitest!
LOL LOL punjig !! Like let's not forget "mittens" ain't president !!
@Bensgpa
Let me try to put it on a way a person with a low IQ can understand.
I'll Type real slow for you!
Obama and Romney were backed by the same Globalist. So, you see, it does not matter who
got elected. The policies would have been push all the same!
There is a Right Wing and a Left Wing. No one ever looks at the Head of the Bird that makes all of the decisions.
Got It?
If you still have questions, you're out of luck. I can't draw and post pictures here for you!
Once again...Romney going back to making money, Odumbo is the prez.
Are you sure this wasn't a story of a not so in the future Amerika?? The gimme population now effectively outnumber the payers.... Will the last company in America please turn out the lights?
Well looks like today we are back too the real world once again.
Wall Street seems to be unleashing its contempt for this re-elected president as well as looking at what has been happening over in the failing take over of the EURO ZONE nations.
I wonder when they will start the war against Iran?
I wonder when the Fed will begin too print more debt, and start that huge economic fear mongering machine once again even though it is not really needed since the economy is going into a bad down turn, and has been ever since 2007.
The dawning of a new America is upon us.....ahem! ya right.
Enjoy your hell-fare because that is all you will soon have, and perhaps not even that very soon.
Like I said before this election it will not matter who wins because the world is going to sh-it either way.
Later
Well Said Freemannogod, Well Said!!
The Sheeple have NO Idea WTF is happening or is going to happen!
And neither do you punjig.
No matter which candidate won last night we would receive more of the same. With each election we lose more of our rights, more troops will be sent to die in unjust wars, more innocent people abroad will be killed as our country spirals into unrecoverable debt. This was all by design controlled by the big banking cartels that rule our world. We are the slaves of today's modern world. They want to bankrupt us, make us sick, make us stupid and make us fight each other over race, religion and partisan politics. Divide and conquer is their motto and they are doing a damn good job of it. When are people going to realize that we are subject to the whims of central banks and big money. They are killing small business, they want us to rely completely on government and their power is derived from our helplessness. We need to wake up and realize that the world is not what they are selling us. We are sovereign beings who deserve to be treated as such. I will not sit by idly and forge the chains of servitude my children and grand children will bear. Give me liberty or give me death!
You've been reading Gary Allen.
@Nox Illuminata
I am glad that everyday I come here to read post. And more and more people are starting to wake up to what is going on.
You, my friend, are 100% right and took the words right out of my mouth. We need to keep up the fight and wake others from there slumber. Most have stockholm syndrome and are unwilling to admit they are slaves that have been defeated.
^Lone wolf alert.
Happytimes stop being juvenile. To say that I am a lone wolf is off-base, irresponsible and senile. I am not threatening anyone. I am simply trying to wake people up to the reality in which we live. If you cannot see that we live in a world built up by fraud and lies then you are just another mindless zombie supporting a self destructive cycle.
Oh well, I'm so contrite now...not. That was actually for punjig, but you doth protest too much - and are falling back on zombies, lol, so might I suggest 2 aspirin, turn off Faux News, and open an Econ book.
Thankful dear ol' Dad taught us how to use guns, sheesh. Maybe you are both lone wolf nuts.
"parliamentary workers went on strike to protest a clause that would have cut their salaries" but the law makers themselves don't take a cut...so Republican. Look to Greece America we could be heading the same way.
so Republican, really? Just like I don't see the fat cats on the right taking any cuts, I don't see the fat cats on the left taking any either.
That's what happens when we hire the fox to watch the hen house.
They'll just keep taking and taking and taking and giving nothing back but a bucketful of arrogance.
Ironic isn't it. We voted for "Forward" and one of the models for this great experiment we live in is showing us a snapshot of where "Forward" takes us.
Coming to a State near you...
So, this is the deal:
Screw your citizens, destroy your economy, plummet your workers into joblessness and poverty...so that you can lend MORE money from the very people that facilitated your descent into this stupid mess in the first place.
I get it now: the wealthy get to keep what they have, but the poor have to pay for the cesspit mess the wealthy stole the country into.
Can you say "revolution"?
This is the future for America under obamanomics...
You should not say that. President Obama's "Anyone stating a radical change to (US) Government is a Homegrown Domestic Terrorist", Definition from President Obama's January 21, 2009 Patriot Acts (Plural US Laws) that eliminated Constitutional Rights. During a staged news media event, January 22, 2009, President Obama signing into US Laws his Patriot Acts, 04:38 minutes of 11:55 minutes:
Naomi Wolf:'Obama can lock any US citizen up without trial'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLSeD19m3UE
To close a loop hole, President Obama signed his 2012 NDAA, US Military Indefinite Detentions of US Citizens:
Obama Signs NDAA, ACLU Disgusted
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4IeuE16LLDY
History: A while back some of us realized what was happening, when US Congress (both Houses, US Senate and House of Representatives) attempted to sneak one by the US Citizens with US Laws, US Senate S.1959 and US House of Representatives H.R.1955; also known as the 1984 George Orwell Thought Crimes Laws, in that the thought written or verbal is the crime as well as the action.
Spirit 1984:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75m7SeGvEWc
Many of us started to post all over the internet, including youtube.com what was happening. Due to Public Outrage, S.1959 and H.R.1955 were defeated. Most of us were celebrating, then went back to our routines and believed this would never happen again. These were included in President Obama's January 21, 2009 Patriot Acts along with US Monitoring and Censorship of All US Communications; Expanded Presidential Powers; Preemptive Detentions of US Citizens; US Military Use of Deadly Force Against US Citizens (including Summary Executions of US Military*); US Military Tribunals renamed US Military Commissions (watch entire first link above); (No) Material Support of Terrorist Organizations (including Legal Representation, as "Expert Advise", 2010 US Supreme Court Ruling, currently being fought by ACLU); No warrant cooperation of US Communications providers (Internet Service Providers must give information based on IP Addresses of customers); Classified Sections; relationship to the US Insurrection Act and US NORTHCOM; Classified Sections; Domestic Surveillance; lots of etc..
* Some of us know the pecking order of who Summarily Executes whom for disobeying an Order to Use Deadly Force Against US Citizens. As unlike the 1990s Poll of the US Military, most US Military back then would refuse that Order, as now we know that even after we are Summarily Executed, our Families, Relatives, etc. will be Indefinitely Detained and subjected to Extraordinary Interrogations as suspected co conspirators to our "Treason".
By Reelecting President Obama all of you basically told the US Courts that you approve of the above.
Go watch the 2012 TV Series "Revolution" to see the kind of crap we routinely get stuck in (without public knowledge).
Silent Running:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddi2TBnzdPo
And do not count on the US Military as the 1% of US Citizens currently Serving (see above Summary Executions). As the then Speaker for All Demoncraps, Speaker of the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi, "Anyone returning from the Wars is a Potential Homegrown Domestic Terrorist" (Guilty until proven innocent). Again by Reelecting President Obama you also validated that Policy.
Errata to post#25.2.
Change to 2012 TV Series "Last Resort".
Add to "Domestic Surveillance":
Feds' electronic snooping of Americans up sharply, says ACLU
http://www.nbcnews.com/technology/technolog/feds-electronic-snooping-americans-sharply-says-aclu-6170914