Shot dead, dragged through the streets: The fate of an alleged spy in Gaza

Suhaib Salem / Reuters

Palestinian gunmen ride motorcycles as they drag the body of a man, who was suspected of working for Israel, in Gaza City, Tuesday.

GAZA - Six Palestinians suspected of giving information to Israel during its airstrike campaign have been killed in the Gaza Strip.

One of them was dragged after his death through the streets behind a convoy of motorcycles, as some people appeared to celebrate in scenes that a leading Hamas figure described as "completely unacceptable."

Citing an unidentified security source, Hamas' al-Aqsa radio station said the six men were shot dead on Tuesday after being "caught red-handed" working for Israel.

"They possessed hi-tech equipment and filming equipment to take footage of positions," al-Aqsa radio station said.

However, on Wednesday Hamas' deputy leader Moussa Abu Marzouk condemned what he called the "unlawful" killings, Reuters reported.

Explosion hits bus in Tel Aviv as deadly Gaza crisis rages

In comments posted on his Facebook page on Wednesday, Abu Marzouk urged the Islamist Hamas administration ruling Gaza to ensure that no one takes the law into their own hands.

"Punishing collaborators and especially those involved in the killing of our leaders must only be carried out in accordance with the law and through the legal procedures," he said.

"The way those collaborators were killed and the images after their death were completely unacceptable," he added.

"Those who did it should be punished and it must not be repeated," said the Hamas official, who is currently in Cairo.

Americans caught in chaos of Gaza conflict

Photographs showed one of the bodies, partially clothed, being dragged through the streets of Gaza behind a motorcycle as others rode in convoy alongside.

At least one body was beaten, kicked and trampled, Reuters reported.

Israeli security officials acknowledge they rely on a network of Palestinian informants to identify targets, The Associated Press said. 

'We are very scared': Egyptians fear being mired in Gaza-Israel crisis

The New York Times reported that another man, named as Ashraf Ouaida, was killed by masked gunmen Friday because he was suspected of collaborating with Israel.

He was shot several times and his body was left with a sign round his neck accusing him of helping Israel kill 15 Palestinian leaders and beneath a billboard featuring a Hamas fighter holding a rocket, the newspaper said.

Reuters and The Associated Press contributed to this report.

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Jump to discussion page: 1 2 3

Why don't you show a picture of the bodies that these animals are dragging. This picture looks like a couple of bikers out for a holiday. You certainly don't hesitate to graphically show pictures of alleged (and often staged) victims including babies and children. This is another example of the biased reporting that always seems directed against Israel.

  • 25 votes
#1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:50 AM EST

I don't necessarily think it is biased reporting. Honestly, I don't want to see the body dragged through the streets.

To know it happened, though, shows why Isreal should just keep bombing away. This is the population you are dealing with here. Open fire.

  • 23 votes
#1.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:52 AM EST

Umm....they are showing the body. Just click on the image.

  • 14 votes
#1.2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:02 PM EST
Comment author avatarbones-2099328Expand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

fox ran this story 24 hrs ago . nbc was to busy yesterday [ and today] prasing hillery.

  • 13 votes
#1.3 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:04 PM EST

YOu are preaching to the deaf and blind on this site. Yesterday the bloggers were blaming Israel. You are wastaing your breath.

  • 8 votes
#1.4 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:06 PM EST

Uncivilized people! Animals! They deserve what they got coming!

  • 22 votes
#1.5 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:09 PM EST

Click on the slideshow, it is only one picture, and will show you what you are so eager to see....

  • 6 votes
#1.6 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:09 PM EST

Hamas school boys, great slop job militarily, a complete embarrassment and failure. Hamas is paranoid and steaming mad that almost half of the causalities so far are their fanatic terrorist brothers. Now they are unleashing their anger on the Gaza hostages.

I was watching a clip where a large group of Palestinians were crowded around the carnage of a bomb, little kids looking at wreckage and pools of blood. Then a bomb went off in the distance and they scattered like mad and some guy pushed a little 5 year old to the ground! Cowards!

  • 13 votes
#1.7 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:23 PM EST

Heya.....Obama administration: YOU cannot reason with TERRORISTS.

Got it ??????

  • 17 votes
#1.9 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:11 PM EST

Looks as if the victim was beheaded . . . and some folks wonder why negotiating with Hamas is a waste of time?

  • 12 votes
#1.10 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:14 PM EST

Staged pictures ? I don't think so. Just imagined if the journalist were allowed in the West Bank and Gaza. I've seen some very graphic and violent pictures/videos online that are leaked out.

  • 6 votes
#1.11 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:22 PM EST

Now this is why they should be taken off the face of the earth...ANIMALS!

  • 8 votes
#1.12 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:59 PM EST

Filthy nasty monsters,and they want us to feel sorry for them,pathetic,If the terrorists break this cease fire I hope Israel iraticate's the scum of the Earth,Humas is being treated as if they have a right to demand anything,We and our Allies don't bargain with terrorists,I guess the world is worried about hurting terrorists feelings now,we must be PC.BTW - Israel and Hamas had a contract ready 24hrs before today,but Obama wanted to make sure Hillary was there to get some credit,however 11 people died in A Bus terrorist blast that Hamas is super happy about...sick just sick all around.

  • 9 votes
#1.13 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:08 PM EST
Comment author avatardavid-475776Expand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

Just don't listen, coming to President Obama's United Somalia of America (President Obama's "Leveling the Playing Field" bring the US Standard of Living down, instead of the much harder increasing everyone else's Standard of Living (demanding and enforcing Nations spend their Wealth on their own people, instead of Terrorism).

Fundamentalist Islam declared WAR on all of you (non Fundmentalist Islamic Believers) long ago, with the Fundamentalist Islamic Interpretation of the Holy Koran as Law; as the 109 Suras of the 114 Suras of the Holy Koran (Quran) Calls to All Islamic Believers to War Against the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers (that includes you Athesists, Buddhists, Taoists, Islamic Heretics (Sunnis Moderate Interpretation of Holy Koran), etc.).

By current Islamic Laws pertaining to the the 109 Suras of the 114 Suras of the Holy Koran (Quran) Calls to All Islamic Believers to War Against the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers (that includes you Athesists, Buddhists, Taoists, etc.); it is ILLEGAL to Collaborate with the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers (anyone that is not Fundamentalist Islam, including the Moderate Liberal Interpretation of the Holy Koran (Quran) of the Sunnis as Islamic Heresy), this is a Death Penalty Crime to be carried out by anyone, so that the Collaborators "Dwell in that Firey Place" (Sura 2 thru Sura 2.217, Sura 8 thru 9.123 of the Holy Koran as Fundamentalist Islamic Law).

So from their perspective they only did what was "Legal" and pardoned by Fundamentalist Islamic Law of the Holy Koran (Quran) Sura 8.17 "So you did not slay them, but it was Allah Who slew them, and you did not smite when you smote (the enemy), but it was Allah Who smote, and that He might confer upon the believers a good gift from Himself; surely Allah is (All) Hearing, Knowing." (just so that all the Fundamentalists don't get pissed at me add: Praise Be onto Allah and his Prophet Mohammad).

These Actions have the current Legal Precedent acknowledged by President Obama's Overthrow of US Ally President Gaddaffi the Collaborator to the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers as: To get the President Bush US and UN Sanctions and Embargoes lifted so he would ship Libyan Oil to the US European Allies President Gaddaffi: Collaborated with the CIA. President Gaddaffi had his Libyan Military hunting the Islamic Jihadists at Libya. Stopped his pursuit of Nuclear Power. Turned over his Chemical Weapons to the US. Transfer of US Islamic Jihadists Prisoners from Guantanamo to President Gaddaffi's Prisons (including later President Obama's). Human Rights and Libyan Citizen's Rights as praised by the UN and UA (African Union). With President Obama supporting the "Libyan Rebels" that went to Libya to kill President Gaddaffi the Collaborator to the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers; the "Libyan Rebels" consisting of the Fundamentalist Holy Warriors of Islam of Al Quada Saudi Arabia (AQ), Al Quada Islamic Maghreb (AQIM), Al Quada Syria (AQS), Al Quada Yemen (AQY), Hezbollah, Al Quada Arabian Peninsula (AQAP), the Libyan Islamic Fighting Group (LIFG), etc. as trained by the Quds Special Forces of the Fundamentalist Islamic Shia Republic of Iran at the Fundamentalist Islamic Autonomous Kurdistanis Region of Northern Iraq, Syria, Southern Turkey, and Northwestern Iran to Overthrow the Established Governments of US Allies.

  • 9 votes
#1.14 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:18 PM EST

Just another example of peace, love, fairness and compassion courtesy of Islam.

  • 8 votes
#1.15 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:20 PM EST

So sad but to bad for those six

If you play with fire you might get burned. sorry get killed.

Do i feel sory for anybody on both sides? I don't think so. Despite all the posturing from Israel and the Palestinians neither one want peace. It is just right know that Israel hold the upper hand with the unconditional backing from the USA. On top of that the genrous gifts of Billions of dollars and free weapons from the american tax payer.

APAIC is the tail there that is wagging the dog

  • 1 vote
#1.16 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:21 PM EST
Comment author avatarRalphHExpand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

Glad to see they got the collaborators, who are traitors to their own people. We should have done the same thing to Jonathan Pollard, Zionist traitor to the US, responsible for many deaths.

Speaking of enjoying killing, look how many Palestinians have been killed by Israel, using missiles. The Israelis killed 1400 in operation "Cast Lead". The Palestinians have absolutely no way with which to defend themselves and the Israeli keep bombing them.

  • 3 votes
#1.17 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:32 PM EST

Most of you guys don't get.

Peace for the Palestinians will only come AFTER America and the other Arab countries have thrown the last living Palestinian under the bus.

The Arab countries and the US government are among the biggest hippocrites in the world

  • 3 votes
#1.18 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:47 PM EST

Garbage rockin? "The Elders Of Zion" is a fraud. Proven time and time again. However, no one supposes that verses of the Quran are not.

  • 3 votes
#1.20 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:48 PM EST

Ralph H - How many US deaths because of the spy J. Pollard? Sympathy for the victims of Palestinian statehood, but not for the cowards that make Mosques,Hospitals, and Kindergartens into Armories.

  • 9 votes
#1.21 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:02 PM EST

So these young motorcycle thugs are Judge, Jury and Executioner?? Is this "islamic justice" working???? Face it, "islamic justice" is an oxymoron......like throwing acid on your own daughter and beating her to death because the poor girl flirted with a boy, all of 16.....Here is where Israel has got it RIGHT, "sharia law is a LIE. Don't allow these sand slugs to immigrate here.

  • 10 votes
#1.22 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:17 PM EST

and Israel has to make peace with this scum? No respect for human life what so ever - where's the rest of the pics of them taking turns stepping on the dead bodies and taking videos on their cell phones? Pure savage trash, nothing left to say.

  • 11 votes
#1.23 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:48 PM EST

As the world turns..you folks weren't expecting something different in that neck of the woods were you? We all know the world by now and what's what.

Its funny the Miss America pageant had its 91st contest this year.. the winner is always asked what do you wish for..WORLD PEACE... be their answer for 91 years now.

Might be a good idea to wish for..half the worlds peace.

    #1.24 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 1:34 AM EST

    Talk about biased reporting and actions.

    You see: media can't write much about what Sunni Saudis (critical "oil" sources and strategic ally like Turkey) and their hating and killing machines like Hamas, Salaffi, al Qaida, MB and others do!

    Oil companies, their lobbyists and money splashing agents will be offended if media, human rights groups, UN and its partisan agencies go by truth and realities.

    Where are the UN and its agencies, human rights groups like Amnesty International, Human Right Watch and so on in Gaza?

    They including media were dead when it came to genocides of Christians and minorities in Darfur, Sudan, Pakistan, Bangladesh; Shiites in Bahrain, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and other places; Sufis in Pakistan, Mali and other places; and tribes like Kurds, Baloochs, Hazaras and others!

    At least, we know about the US that Jewish lobby controls the US foreign policies and actions.

    But what about big talking and dancing Britain, France, Germany and some other European nations?

    Do they dance only as directed by Sunni Saudis, Kuwaitis, Qataris, UAE and other Sunni Arab League rulers?

    • 2 votes
    #1.25 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:51 AM EST
    Reply
    Comment author avatarRobert Fostervia Facebook

    At least it wasn't the other way around

      Reply#2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:51 AM EST

      The Israelis should target everyone in this picture.

      • 9 votes
      #2.2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:33 PM EST

      ha...AEB...they will. Unlike those in the U.S., they have the stomach and means for it. Go send in Clinton to reason this out...the same one responsible for deaths in Benghazi. Classic strategy.

      • 6 votes
      #2.3 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:02 PM EST

      As I recall,the French (and other) resistance groups executed collaborators by the hundreds,caught working for the Nazis. And there are thousands of pictures on the web showing a huge crowd of Italians in Milan.Screaming,and cheering, as Mussolini his mistress and other of his supporters bodies,were kicked,spit on,and strung up,head down,in the main square after being shot. So while I disapprove of the killing in Gaza. It doesn't shock me at all.

      • 5 votes
      #2.4 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:07 PM EST

      Uncle Bob 512,

      Hint this is the year 2012, not 1939 thru 1945.

      Oh, yeah, I forgot you believe in "Democracy"; as to what the Founding Fathers described as, "Democracy is Mob Rule" (Lynch Mobs, Court of Public Opinion (not facts)); While establishing a Representative (as opposed to Democracy) Constitutional Republic of America and the means to prevent a "Democracy" (Mob Rule) by establishing the Electoral College, as "the average Citizen is too ignorant to determine the Highest Offices of the Land, President and Vice President" (Of course they did not know about "Redistricting", "Gerrymandering", "All State's Electoral Votes, instead of actually representing all the people", etc., that makes the Electoral College obsolete). Other proof the Pledge of Allegiance (US Citizen's Oath of Allegiance) to the Republic of America.

      Also negate the "Harsh and Brutal" Methods of the Black Shirts of Fascist Mussolini and the Brown Shirts of Chancellor Hitler "Reigh of Terror" as later adopted by the US Labor Unions as "Union Tactics" (arson, sabotage, murder, rapes, assaults, beatings, fire bombings, death threats, bribery, blackmail, etc.).

      • 6 votes
      #2.5 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 6:36 PM EST

      Hint this is the year 2012, not 1939 thru 1945.

      What do you mean, david ? That human nature is better now than it was in 1941, or 1945 ?

        #2.6 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:42 PM EST

        All the dragging business are monopoly of the followers of Islamic cult!

        Since the birth of Islam, followers of Islamic cult have done only stealing, looting, raping, kidnapping, killing in different styles including dragging, genocides, telling lies, giving spins and excuses, breaking truces, pacts, words, and when they all don't work do: singing and dancing about loove and peece (Sufism).

        You watch Ramadan season. Fast in the day time and pray as big saints. Right in the same night have big feasts. If stolen animals are used in feasts, then that is special and it is a fitting Ramadan fast breaking feast!!

        What a cult/religion!

        • 2 votes
        #2.7 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 5:59 AM EST

        Jonathan,

        I thought they broke their Ramadan fast with the bodies and blood of kidnapped jewish and christian babies stuffed into a sheep stomach with cous-cous?

        • 1 vote
        #2.8 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:47 PM EST

        Ixor Kleb: The followers of Islamic cult can do anything. They have broken all records established in history in barbarism, beastly actions, and religious madness!

        If they don't get Jewish and Christian babies, they will use other infidels (for Sunnis, Shiites, Sufis are infidels) babies!

          #2.9 - Fri Nov 23, 2012 3:31 AM EST
          Reply

          These people are barbarians with no concept of justice or value for human life. Do not be fooled, this is not a political strife but a clash of ideologies and cultures.

          • 14 votes
          Reply#3 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:51 AM EST

          No different than southerners who like to drag blacks behind pickup trucks every now and then. There's not even a war going on down there, imagine the savagery once they get thier second civil war going.

          • 10 votes
          #3.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:26 PM EST

          GrantSherman,

          You really should get out from under the rock you call a home or at least pull your head out of rectal defilade. Read history and you will find that the activity of which you speak was not uncommon north of the Mason-Dixon Line or west of the Mississippi...and not just with blacks, but also a great number of non-WASP reds, whites, and yellows.

          And when the South does rise again, I hope you're the first one that runs out of our natural gas!

          Up yours....

          And, oh, BTW, have a Happy Thanksgiving!

          • 6 votes
          #3.3 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:57 PM EST

          It is clash of religions!

          Jews of Israel are a bit special as they are quite powerful and they have money and good lobby!

          All neighbors of Muslims including nations have been going through similar or worst periods.

          Hat off to Israel for managing and coming out heroically in most of the battles with most bigoted barbaric beasts!

          It is going to be worse for Jews and Christians with MB and Salaffi taking control in Egypt.

          Islamist Erdogan and his party have already started dancing to the tunes set by the seventh century, highly corrupt, despotic, barbaric and beastly bigoted Sunni Saudi, Qatari, UAE, Kuwaiti and other Sunni Arab League rulers.

            #3.4 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:07 AM EST
            Reply

            Surely these people understand we are a civilized society and this isn't a "PC" type thing to do.......

            • 3 votes
            Reply#4 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:54 AM EST

            People are still bilnd to the atrocities of the muslims.

            They will blame Israel just like they did yesterday.

            Suspected spy and they kill at random. THese are the people Israel is killling.

            • 16 votes
            Reply#5 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:05 PM EST

            Uhm, it's not random when a 'suspected spy' is killed. Not saying it's right, but it surely isn't random. What it is is counter-productive. If they want the sympathy of the West then this isn't the way to go about it. They need to learn that destruction of lives and/or property will result in a negative imagine, no matter how people feel about Israel.

            • 4 votes
            #5.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:55 PM EST

            _Paladin - Suspected spy and they kill at random. THese are the people Israel is killling.

            Nice failed attempt (including the uneducated that voted for your uneducated post). The Israelis are using Reconnaissance Drones (RQs, then Airstrikes against known targets) and Armed Drones (MQs) and catching them in the act of launching rockets, transporting rockets, setting up rocket launchers, etc..

            Also if and when they get smart enough to figure out how to make smokeless trailed rockets without the smoke trail leading right back to where the rockets were launched from, then the Israelis will have a big problem and your uneducated post will be valid.

            And being obedient Fundamentalist Islamic Believers the "innocent" Palestinian civilians are adhering to current Fundamentalist Islamic Laws, by providing the Holy Warriors of Islam with Mandatory Islamic Sanctuary to conduct their Mandatory War Against the Christians, Jews, Unbelievers, in accordance with their Fundamentalist Islamic Interpretation of the Holy Koran (Quran) as Law. This is even against President Obama's (No) Material Support to Terrorist Organizations Law as Ruled Constitutional by the US Supreme Court 2010.

            • 2 votes
            #5.2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:18 PM EST

            As far as I am concerned both adult governments should be exterminated. Kiss my a$$ about the Israel's you slaughtered our men on a defenseless ship in 73 a US ship and you are an occupying force, you lost your moral authority as for Hammas, like I said I wish every adult every religious leader on both sides would get the most horrible painful cancer and die. You ignorant a$$holes saying kill them all, if your jewish geez now the shoe is on the other foot huh. Both sides slaughter children, most of you gutless wonders are young punks that have no children, if you do take a look at them, imagine them in a refugee camp, open sewers bombs going off shaprnel ripping scars on them, fingers, toes, hands legs being torn off, faces disfigured. A pox on both of your religions, Israel, you are making terrorrists faster than you can kill them, if one of those little kids was mine, or brother or sister I would spend the rest of my life trying to make you hurt like I would if I lost a child, and for you Palestinians you are nothing but puppets sacrificing your own people, and when you do your filthy terrorrists acts you have people calling for your extermination and if it was my daughter or son on a bus you gutless wonders blew up, you are not really men and someday you will go to far and maybe you will be exterminated cause the world just can't afford you anymore.

            • 1 vote
            #5.3 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:05 PM EST

            Paladin - One of the greatest atricities ever committed was when Larry Silverstein allowed the Twin Towers to be rigged with nano thermite, so they could be brought down in controlled demolitions, along with Bldg 7, which was not even hit by a plane. Here is a video of Bldg 7 falling and Silverstein saying "Pull It", which is the term used by professionals to pull down a building.

            Imagine who was behind the cold blooded act of pulling the Twin Towers, while our NY firefighters and response teams were searching the building. The chief suspects are the 5 dancing Israelis. See link.

            http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5A3dW_gUwOg

              #5.4 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:26 AM EST

              Dan, I hear a pesky mosquito buzzing. Is that you?

              • 1 vote
              #5.5 - Fri Nov 23, 2012 4:39 PM EST
              Reply

              I don't really understand why Hamas would condemn these killings when they praised the attack on a civilian bus in Tel Aviv this morning. They don't seem very organized and if they want their borders opened up and to become part of the international community you can't do things like praise the bombing of a full civilian bus.

              • 13 votes
              Reply#6 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:08 PM EST

              They aren't condemning anything, they are just voicing what they know the civilized world expects of them. I'm sure they are cheering in private.

              • 3 votes
              #6.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:54 PM EST
              Reply

              We are much too savage a species to be the descendants of any God

              • 6 votes
              Reply#7 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:09 PM EST

              God squashed many enemies. He destroyed sinful cities and sinful people. God is a loving Father that demands our obedience and respect, just as our earthly fathers demand our obedience and respect. If we purposely go against our earthly fathers we are punished, why would it be any different with our Heavenly Father. They protect us from our enemies, in the name of love.

              • 3 votes
              #7.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:45 PM EST

              Yeah sure, god will kill you in the name of love. What a bastard!

              • 3 votes
              #7.2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 5:27 PM EST
              Reply

              This is just another reason why people need to realize how great it is to live in america!!

              • 10 votes
              Reply#8 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:21 PM EST

              when did palistinian body street surfing become too graphic to show in the news? and whats with the lack of helmets?

              • 3 votes
              Reply#9 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:26 PM EST

              How about that. Nobody on this site stuck up for the cowards

              • 10 votes
              Reply#10 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:28 PM EST

              Riverman give them time, they are waiting for the talking points to be sent over from Iran

              • 6 votes
              #10.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:54 PM EST
              Reply

              People in Somalia must be thinking with nostalgia back to when they did the same thing to would-be American invader troops in Mogadishu.

              • 3 votes
              Reply#11 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:32 PM EST

              Sees Thru Gloss - People in Somalia must be thinking with nostalgia back to when they did the same thing to would-be American invader troops in Mogadishu.

              That was President Clinton's volunteering the US Military for UN Mission Somalia II as Operation Continue Hope, UN Humanitarian Assistance Mission. Due to President Clinton's Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces of the US Military, we (NOT YOU) had to rely on the Pakistanis Military for Military Support!!!! The Pakistanis Military refused to leave their secure locations and they usually did not even have enough fuel for their vehicles.

              It was President Clinton's Belief that the US Military and US Intelligence of the "Cold War" was no longer necessary, so he Gutted or Cut to the Bone, both of them resulting in the US being Blind and Deaf to the Events leading to the 9/11 2001 Attacks; as well as President Clinton not being able to accomplish the Overthrow of President Hussein in accordance with President Clinton's US Law, H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" Justification Section 2 Weapons of Mass Destruction, Section 3 Overthrow of President Hussein (aka Regime Change); with US Congressional Appropriations. President Clinton's Failed Attempt, 1998 Operation Desert Fox, that resulted in the Islamic World condeming the US as the Great Satan.

              Because President Clinton Cut the US Military to the Bone, it took President Bush almost One Year to reconstruct the US Military to accomplish 2003 Operation Iraqis Freedom in accordance with President Clinton's US Law, H.R.4655 "Iraqis Liberation Act of 1998" Justification Section 2 Weapons of Mass Destruction, Section 3 Overthrow of President Hussein (aka Regime Change); with US Congressional Appropriations; with us conducting US Military Asymmetric Warfare attached to the CIA's SAD/SOG since 2002Operation Hotel California without the support of the US Military that President Bush was rebuilding after the President Clinton Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces of the US Military. Including President Bush begging the States Governors to Federally Activate their State's Militias (aka National Guard), with many of the US Military previously Deactivated Units Military Equipment turned over to State's National Guard in disrepair, lack of maintenance funds, and or completely non mission capable. Many of the previously RIF'ed US Military of President Clinton's Cut to the Bone RIF's of the US Military refused to be Recalled to Active Duty; so volunteers (post 9/11 2001 Attacks) with no Combat Experience filled the positions of those previous Combat Experienced President Clinton ordered RIF'ed US Military.

              Bottomline: We (NOT YOU) augmented by the US Army 10th Special Forces Group were fighting for our lives (Companies, 300) against full strength Iraqis Armor and Mechanized Infantry Divisions waiting for President Bush to fix President Clinton's F**ked up RIF (by Mobilization, Recalls, Stop Loss, etc.) to accomplish President Clinton's US Law as 2003 Operation Iraqis Freedom.

              And what has President Obama as Commander In Chief Ordered. The Same Cut to the Bone Reduction In Forces like President Clinton.

              President Obama is Repeating the Same President Clinton Mistakes and Expect Different Results - Definition of Insanity.

              • 5 votes
              #11.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:57 PM EST

              David - Your claim - "Because President Clinton Cut the US Military to the Bone" is patently ridiculous, as are most of the propaganda you spread. The US has and had after some cuts made by Clinton, the most powerful military in the world, with a budget exceeding that of all the military budgets of the rest of the world combined.

              The war in Iraq was for a 42 inch oil pipeline from Iraq to Haifa in Israel. Read about it here.

              Once the Pentagon's choice to lead the "new" Iraq, Chalabi
              promised to reopen an old British-built pipeline from Kirkuk in northern Iraq
              to the Israeli port of Haifa. The plan impressed Richard Perle, Douglas Feith
              and other conservatives influencing Bush administration policy toward Iraq in
              the lead-up to last year's war.

              The idea also drew enthusiastic response from Israel.

              "The pipeline would be a dream," Yosef Paritzky, Israel's minister
              of infrastructures, said as reported by Salon.com. "We'd have an
              additional source of supply, and could even export some of the crude through
              Haifa. But we'd need a treaty with Iraq . . . to build the pipeline."

              Once Chalabi assumed a position of influence in the new Iraqi government,
              Israel would get its treaty, the neoconservatives were assured. The pipeline
              was by no means the only reason for going to war, but it could well have been
              one reason.

              http://www.jweekly.com/article/full/19725/iraq-to-haifa-oil-pipeline-could-spur-economic-rebirth/

              The war in Iraq was never about anything except greed for Iraqi oil, to remove the leader who opposed a pipeline to Israel and install a leader who would be friendly to Israel.

              Must you refer to asymetric warfare and bashing Clinton, on every post? Never once have you responded to my posts regarding gas and oil pipelines to benefit Israel, even though I cite Israeli news sources.

              Here is another link, showing the war in Afghanistan was for a gas pipleline for Israel.

              www.rense.com/general15/game.htm

                #11.2 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:38 AM EST

                Ralph, personally, I'd rather listen to David's views on asymmetrical warfare any day than listening to the constant hate mongering and Israel bashing we hear from you. Your hatred of Israel as a nation is well known on the vine. As much as I know how much you hate to hear it, not all the problems in the Middle East can be laid at Israel's feet! You really should learn to deal with and accept that. I sincerely cannot ever recall hearing you respond to any subject where you did not make a negative comment about or blame Israel for something. Israel is not perfect and they screw up plenty and I do not care much myself for the Israeli government. I am the first to admit that, but here again they can't be blamed for everything!

                • 1 vote
                #11.3 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 6:09 PM EST
                Reply

                War is not a parlor game. It's ugly and needless.

                • 4 votes
                Reply#12 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:32 PM EST

                True that it's ugly, untrue that it's needless in cases such as WWII.

                • 2 votes
                #12.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:46 PM EST

                @ riverboy

                Point for you.

                • 2 votes
                #12.2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:02 PM EST

                Respectfully, I disagree. This is the reason (dragged through the streets) mankind goes to war. And war is hell

                • 1 vote
                #12.3 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:02 PM EST

                point to you as well VA-Gent

                  #12.4 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:27 PM EST

                  This just in from the Sultan Knish:

                  Posted: 21 Nov 2012 08:26 PM PST

                  For the last hundred years the best and brightest of the civilized world have been engaged in the business of peace. In the days before the Nobel Peace Prize became a joke, it was expected that scientific progress would lead to moral progress. Nations would accept international laws and everyone would get together to replace wars with international conferences.


                  Instead technological progress just gave us better ways to kill each other. There have been few innovations in the moral technology of global harmony since Immanuel Kant's "Perpetual Peace" laid out a plan to grant world citizenship to all refugees and outlaw all armies, invasions and atrocities with the whole shebang would be overseen by a League of Nations.

                  That was in 1795 and Kant's plan was at least more reasonable than anything we have two-hundred years later today because it at least set out to limit membership in this body to free republics. If we had done that with the United Nations, it could conceivably have become something resembling a humane organization. Instead it's a place where the dictators of the world stop by to give speeches about human rights for a show that's funnier than anything you could find eight blocks away at the Broadway Comedy Club.

                  Since the League of Nations folded, the warring peoples of the world have added the atom bomb, the suicide bomber, the jet plane, the remotely guided missile, the rape squad, the IED, the child soldier and the stealth fighter to their arsenals. And the humanitarians have murdered a few billion trees printing out more useless treaties, conventions and condemnations; more dead trees than accounted for by every piece of human literature written until the 19th Century.

                  There is no moral technology to prevent war. Or rather war is the moral technology, that when properly applied, ensures peace.

                  The humanitarians had gone down a dead end by trying to create perpetual peace by outlawing war, but the peace-shouters who wear their inverted Mercedes Logo don't really want peace, some of them reflexively hate war for sentimental reasons, but their leaders and most committed activists don't hate war, they hate the people who win the wars.

                  The plan for perpetual peace is really a plan for perpetual war. It necessitates that the civilized nations who heed its call amass overwhelming quantities of firepower as deterrents against war, which they will pledge to never use because if the threat of destroying the world isn't enough, their bluff will be called and they will fold. And if they don't fold, then the world will be destroyed because the humanitarians said that peace was better than war.

                  It also necessitates that the actual wars that they fight be as limited as possible by applying precision technology to kill only actual armed enemy combatants while minimizing collateral damage. And that humanitarian objective also necessitates that the other side reply with a counter-objective of making it as hard as possible to kill them without also killing civilians.

                  The humanitarian impulse makes the anti-humanitarian impulse inevitable. The more precisely we try to kill terrorists, the more ingeniously the terrorists blend into the civilian population and employ human shields. The more we try not to kill civilians, the more civilians we are forced to kill. That is the equal and opposite reaction of the humanitarian formula.

                  In Afghanistan, the Rules of Engagement were overhauled to minimize Afghan civilian casualties. This was so successful that not only did the casualty rate for American soldiers dramatically increase because they were not allowed to fire unless they were being fired at, but the number of Afghan civilian casualties killed by American forces also fell dramatically. It was a great triumph. But sadly the number of Afghan civilians killed by the Taliban increased dramatically and more than made up for the shortfall.

                  When the Taliban have won the war, the number of civilian casualties will be tremendous once Obama pulls the troops out and the cheerful bearded boys march into Kabul and start killing every woman who can read. But it was still a better thing than the unacceptable levels of civilian casualties under Bush. It was a better thing that the Taliban have free reign to kill as many Afghans as they want than that American soldiers should have been able to fight the Taliban without the humanitarian handcuffs.

                  Because sometimes you have to destroy the village to save the village, and that is true whether it's American planes bombing a terrorist hideout or humanitarians letting the Taliban take the village and kill every tenth woman in it.

                  And yet for all this monumental effort, for all the soldiers dead because they weren't sure if the man planting an IED in the road was a terrorist or just a decent upstanding poppy farmer checking the soil composition, for all the Afghan civilians killed by the moral technology of inaction, your unfriendly neighborhood peace-shouter is about as satisfied as a cannibal at a vegan banquet. Give him, her or it five valuable minutes of your time and it will begin shrieking about drone strikes, kill lists and the murderous rampage of a technology that is as far from Shock and Awe as you could possibly imagine without going completely Gandhi. If anything it hates drone strikes more than it hates Hiroshima. Mass killing justifies its smug contempt for the machinery of war, but anything that smacks of an attempt to moralize warfare challenges its principles and urges it on to greater displays of outrage.


                  Israel, in the name of peace, turned over the lives of millions of people to the control of a terrorist organization which taught their children to believe that their highest purpose in life was to die while killing Israelis.

                  The Oslo Accords turned stone-throwers into shooters and suicide bombers. It allowed the kind of people that most of Israel's Muslim neighbors had locked up and thrown away the key to, inside the country and gave them charge of the economy and the youth. Every peace dove, every peace song, every peace agreement, made the rivers of blood that followed not only inevitable, but mandatory.

                  For decades, every time that Israel was on the verge of finishing off the terrorists, there came a call for a ceasefire or a peace agreement. The call was heeded and the violence continued because all the peace agreements and ceasefires were just prolonged unfinished wars. They were a game of baseball that never ended because no home run was ever scored. Instead the New York Yankees were being forced to play the Martyrs of Muslimtown for thirty years with the umpire stepping in every time the hometown team was on the verge of winning the game. Each peace agreement did not mean peace, it meant that the Muslimtown Martyrs would have another few years to go on killing and being killed.

                  Peace meant that the war would never end. Instead of perpetual peace, it made for perpetual war.

                  In 1992 Israel deported 400 Hamas terrorists. It didn't kill them, lock them up or bake them into a pie. All it did was kick them out of a country they didn't recognize and closed the door behind them. That deportation became the leading human rights cause of the day. The UN issued a unanimous resolution condemning the deportation. The Red Cross brought them blankets. Newsweek accused Israel of "Deporting the Hope for Peace."

                  And so Israel took the 400 Hamas terrorists, the hope for peace, back. Over the next 20 years they shed rivers of blood and rivers of blood were shed because of them. There was never any peace with them and they made peace impossible.

                  But the humanitarians had gotten their way, as they always got their way, and their way was the blown up bus and the shattered cafeteria, the burning building and the suicide bomber making his way through a crowded mall, the child's mother lovingly tying on his martyr costume complete with Alfred Nobel's great invention, the jet plane releasing its cargo of bombs and the television screaming for war. But all these were far better than that 400 Hamas terrorists should sniffle into their Red Cross supplied cups of dark coffee on the hills of Lebanon.

                  To those who croon to that old Lennon song, peace is always better than war, and good intentions lead to good results. The only way forward is to keep extending your hand to the enemy and doing it over and over again no matter how much effort the doctors have to put into stitching it back together again after the last handshake.

                  Peace is still better than war. It is better that Israel and Hamas fight escalating mini-wars every 3 years than that Israel finish off Hamas once and for all. That price wasn't worth paying 20 years ago when all it meant was that 400 terrorists would have been forced to get jobs slinging Halal hash in Lebanese Hashish joints. It certainly isn't worth it today.

                  A flock of peace doves wings to Israel with proposals for engaging Hamas. But it's Israel that is supposed to figure out a way to live with its explosive bride. All the proposals call for some gradual process by which Hamas will be courted, engaged and weaned off terror to become an upstanding member of the international community. And that's all well and good if you have soy for brains.


                  Hamas is not interested in being engaged. Its goal is the destruction of Israel. This isn't posturing, it's not sullen resentment over being blockaded by Israel or outrage over the latest round of fighting. This is the essential ideology of Hamas, derived from the core Islamic principles over the proper role of non-Muslims in the Muslim world. It is not interested in a two-state solution, job creation programs or any of the meaningless shiny toys that diplomats wave when they arrive in the region. Its goal is to make Islam supreme over all other systems by destroying a non-Muslim state in what it considers to be Muslim territory.

                  Perpetual peace was not made for such conflicts. Peace was made for reasonable people who are willing to give and take. It was not made for those who only take.

                  Peacemaking is not a policy, it is a religion that we are all obligated to believe in. It is an immoral moral principle that ends in war. Peacemaking in the World War II cost more lives than Hitler could have ever taken on his own. Peacemaking in the War on Terror has cost a hundred times more lives than the terrorists could have ever taken on their own.

                  The business of peace is the industry of death. Behind the peace sign is a field of flowers with a grave for every one. Behind the peace agreement and the ceasefire is another war that will be worse than the last.
                  Daniel Greenfield is a New York City based writer

                  • 1 vote
                  #12.5 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:51 PM EST
                  Reply

                  Is this enough proof yet, that we need to crush the backs of Radical Islamic States?

                  It's coming this time anyhow, to ignore the pot boiling over in ALL of the middle east is to lie. There will be an epic multi nation war in the region within the year. Obliterate the aberrant states.

                  • 7 votes
                  Reply#13 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:41 PM EST

                  But we are not suppose to be angry with these people. We are to welcome them into our contry with open arms.

                  • 4 votes
                  Reply#14 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:49 PM EST

                  They are dragging one of their own who they suspected of spying for the enemy. Not something I would advocate, but I'm not angry with them for doing it, I could care less. (and truth be told, neither could you) I doubt seriously if they were to come to this country (I know of no indication that any one is advocating for them to, but I digress) they would start grabbing random people and dragging them down the street. So your fake outrage is for nothing.

                  • 4 votes
                  #14.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:04 PM EST

                  Cappy...wrong. We have some nice parting gifts. Did you not see the breakup of the terror cell just this week?

                  • 1 vote
                  #14.2 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:06 PM EST
                  Reply

                  There r no words to describe this mindless, souless complete lack of being civilized. Little wonder the Jews r afraid of them. i hope they stay over there.

                  • 4 votes
                  Reply#15 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:50 PM EST

                  True peace is when everyone is dead and no one is left to fight. This is what happens when you let people believe in whatever they want to believe in. Religion and holy places have ruined us as a species. I think we should nuke them all (Israelite's, Muslims... still all the same bull@!$%# my god, your god, whatever if there is a god he doesn't give a @!$%# about some @!$%# hole and its dirty retarded people) and turn it into a walmart parking lot. Nothing left to bitch about then.

                  • 2 votes
                  Reply#16 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:54 PM EST

                  Palestine people launch attacks and provoke the Jews all the time.. but its ok if the muslims hate christians and jews ... at any cost... of lives . because they call it martyrism... not sure if thats bs too.

                  but Americans dont know whats going on , until they are over there first hand.

                  because the media in America is guided by the GOP usually.

                  now, People are tired of War every where. but the radical fanatics and extremist who dont want change or to lose their control over the people and the money, are fighting with tools of war propaganda and use fake scenarios of attacks..

                  Israel has been under attack , in my mind because i seen the muslim arab extremist attack the rest of the people who are non muslims... and call them infidels..

                  so its time that we set the record straight and return fire and fight extremism with extremism at full speed, and send a clear message we the people of the world will not tolerate violent radical political agendas mixed with religious motives and agendas.

                  Iran.... needs to stopped as to its oppressors of its own govt. and let their people re new their govt.

                  that would be sovereignty at its finest liberty.

                  • 8 votes
                  Reply#17 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:04 PM EST

                  This is WHAT the Middle-East and their version of Islam offers the world.

                  • 8 votes
                  Reply#18 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:07 PM EST

                  Clearly, this proves Hamas isn't a terrorist "organization" but a criminal "gang". Like Crips killing snitches or mafiosos taking out their own turncoat wiseguys, these fighters against occupation are little more than thugs.

                  • 7 votes
                  Reply#20 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:20 PM EST

                  Hamas is a Muslim group with the intention of Making Islam the supreme religion...

                  • 5 votes
                  #20.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:00 PM EST
                  Reply

                  Palestinians like to scream about their poverty...apparently there is no shortage of nice clothes, motorcycles or guns...

                  • 13 votes
                  Reply#21 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:52 PM EST

                  why exactly are we to have any pity for the people of gaza? their leaders are animals and the people themselves thrive on roman type spectacles.

                  • 9 votes
                  Reply#22 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:15 PM EST

                  Islam making a true difference...one body at a time...

                  • 8 votes
                  Reply#23 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:32 PM EST

                  I hope the Isreal's bomb the crap out of Hamas ;tell the American to say out 'they had to send Hilary Clinton ;what in the hell i she going to do ;the President should be there;but no he is friends with the Muslins .I am sick of the isreals getting smaked down ;they are loveing people 'but the Muslins an other story .Kill them all b4 they kill all of us to .

                  • 6 votes
                  Reply#24 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:56 PM EST

                  You are so right Susan!! Pray for the safety of Israel!

                  • 7 votes
                  #24.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:28 PM EST

                  rockin moroccan

                  Spoken like a true hate-mongering bodydraggin' muslim. Are you?

                  • 3 votes
                  #24.3 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 12:59 PM EST
                  Reply

                  It won't be long before this is happening in the US. The remarks made by many on this site against Christians and the complete intolerance of their way of life is quickly becoming a problem. The hatred spewed against Christians in this country is reason for concern. I hope Israel can stand strong!!! I am just sorry that our president is not more interested in keeping our sister nation and their people safe. Mr. President, protect our long time ally!

                  • 7 votes
                  Reply#25 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 3:25 PM EST

                  Princess Leah, you are right on!

                  Unfortunately our President is not a Christian..........oh those on the left will say that he is, and he may attend "church" for a photo op, but in reality he is not really an American. He has deep Muslim sympathies.......though he may not be a Muslim per se, he sure acts and looks like one.

                  Plus, when the Israeli prime minister Netanayhu was over here Obama never met with him!! Actions speak louder than words. Our President-elect sucks bigtime! The stupid dumbasses that voted for him will sell us all down the river for a nickel.

                  Obama is not to be trusted. Israel, get ready to fire back at these animals Hamas! Open FIRE!!!!

                  • 5 votes
                  #25.1 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:41 PM EST

                  romancaesar

                  I see the worship of the GOD Mars is still going strong.

                    #25.2 - Thu Nov 22, 2012 8:37 AM EST
                    Reply

                    Really!!!! Look at the faces of those riding the motorcycles, the glee in killing, without a trial and the celebration of death......a civilized society.....really!!!!!! No wonder they target civilians, hide behind their own women and children, and rejoice in the death of others. .......If they truly think there eternity is filled with virgins waiting for them, I think and hope they are in for quite a surprise!

                    • 11 votes
                    Reply#26 - Wed Nov 21, 2012 4:02 PM EST
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