netanyahu is a joke. anybody else in office will do much better things for israel. the issue is that people outside of israel dont realize the problem isnt israel, its the arabs. they dont want "land", they want the jews dead. with iran smuggling rockets into egypt who, in turn, smuggle them into gaza, things are always bad for israel. youve got the muslim brotherhood (which includes hamas and the presidents of egypt and iran) all working together to take out the jews simply for existing. until muslims can learn to embrace life and accept the jews, things will never change. for the record, muslims will never embrace life and accept jews.

Surprised he is willing to give the Palestine's the right to become Israeli citizens, always thought Settlers wanted the land but didnt want the people who owned it. Suspect it this actually occurred he would find a way to remove the Palestine's before any became citizens of Israel.

Theocracy is the most dangerous form of government.

square dude - there is an immigration law within israel which allows palestinians to obtain citizenship though many means. the 18-year-old palestinian kid who blew up the bus in tel aviv recently, was given israeli citizenship prior to that through one of the heritage laws in israel. israelis just want peace. palestinians just want israelis dead. theres a huge difference.

If Millionaire Naftali Bennett REALLY spoke bluntly about the
USS Liberty:

"Yes, we intentionally and in full knowledge attempted to
sink the USS Liberty and to kill every man on board.

Yes, we should admit it. We should proudly state that we will do
anything and everything to obtain what we want and everyone else be damned.

It is far better to be feared than to be trusted. In fact, trust in fear. That is why we have the Samson Option for our nuclear weapons. We will nuke every city in the Mideast even those with which we have never fought if it comes to that. And the world can eat our nuclear fallout and taste lingering death. Fear us.

The people in the United States are NOT our friends. Say it! They are fools and delusional children. We know what they believe. For their Savior Jesus Christ to return they must either convert us or have us die in another holocaust. Say it! That is truly what they believe as they smile at us and call us friends.

And their leaders are respected by no one! But they fear us and fall over one another to pamper us. So use the fools. Say it! We could spit in the faces of their leaders, manipulate them into Iraq, sink the USS Liberty, whatever we want, and their leaders would still grovel before us. Say it!"

george, israel provides electricity, food, water, gas, etc etc to palestine and gaza. im sorry to burst your anti-Semitic bubble, but israel doesnt want land... they want to live and thrive.

I dont mean any offense but rockmebritney you sound very educated on the subject maybe you should think about changing your name so as not to look like a pervert

J.P, I am one US citizen and tribal citizen who could care less about Israel. I find that country nothing but a group of assassins and exactly what they want the world to pat them on the back and say, "we are so sorry for the Holocaust." Well, we experienced the Holocaust long before your ilk did. Hitler based his Holocaust on the one that happened and is still denied to this day on this continent by the American government and Christian people. All of you Christians, either of Old or New Testament are fanatics that will destroy all of Mother Earth to satisfy your greed and insecurities.

That is why US should stop their support for Israel. Such support only emboldens the lunatic right, greedy for more Palestinian land and hell bent on ethnic cleansing.

And buried in that message is the rational for the ethnic cleansing of the occupied territories, "It's not good for the Arabs. It's not good for the Israelis." This is frightening. Americans sympathetic to the Israelis have been wondering why support for them has been waning? Your answer is before you.

They just keep digging deeper and deeper into the hole. Rule number one when stuck in a hole is to stop digging.

J.P. why are you bringing up the Liberty. The Liberty attack happened in 1967, five years before Bennett was born. That is like blaming a forty-something person in the U.S. for what happened at Kent State. You do know what happened at Kent State don't you?

Absolutly, give millions of arabs the right to vote in Isreali elections. How long do you think it will take until the arabs begin winning national office? Then what will you do, Isreal? When the newly arab dominated knesset votes to change the name of the nation to Palestine, what then?

If you do not give them their own state now, you will give them yours later. It's simple math.

MikeO76 asked:

"J.P. why are you bringing up the Liberty. The Liberty attack happened in 1967, five years before Bennett was born"

And your point is...?

The Holocaust was even way, way before that and I seem to recall that brought up quite often. And the ancient land of Israel was thousands of years ago (if at all) and that seems to come up quite readily.

Could it be that you are selective about what you want to open your ears to? Even a treachery that was perpetrated upon YOUR country. Why is that? Perhaps you are not American or perhaps a dual-loyalist.

And has the zionist state changed for the better since 1967? Hmmmm? No chance of manipulation or treachery from them any more. Is that your point? Hmmmm?

Tell us why you think they will no longer manipulate our congresspersons into attacking unnecessarily another Iraq? How confident are you that they wouldn't do ANOTHER false-flag to get us to get into a war with Iran?

The last thing that Israel needs is someone to the right of Netanyahu. There will eventually be a Palestinian state, and in many ways it already exists, just with the borders not yet clearly defined. The Palestinians already have self rule in Gaza and the West bank and are a state in everything but name, and with the recent UN vote even that has changed somewhat. The real issue is that the Palestinian leadership do not want an end to the conflict with Israel. So long as the conflict is there they can blame the Israelis for the poor living conditions and non-existent economy in Palestinian territories. If the conflict ends they realize that the people will start looking at them as the leaders and start blaming them for the horrible conditions the Palestinians live under. The Palestinian leadership is inept when it comes to actually trying to run a country and build up an economy. They need the conflict so that they can blame Israel and hang on to power. Once the conflict officially ends and they have to take responsibility, people will realize they are inept and throw them out of office.

The destruction of the USS Liberty and the killing of 34 American sailors and the wounding of 171 more will remain relevant until the Israeli government mans up, grows some balls, and admits to the knowing and willful destruction of an unarmed US ship in international waters. It would also help if the Israeli government actually paid reparations for the ship and the deaths and wounded (from their own money, not as a diversion of future military aid money.)

The problem with an incident like this is that it is like Manti Te-o's story. No one believer version 1, nor did they believe version 2. Maybe version 3 will be better. But as long as a believable version of the story is not out there, the issue remains oipen and relevant.

Dean Rusk, U.S. Secretary of State at the time of the incident, wrote: "I was never satisfied with the Israeli explanation. Their sustained attack to disable and sink Liberty precluded an assault by accident or some trigger-happy local commander. Through diplomatic channels we refused to accept their explanations. I didn't believe them then, and I don't believe them to this day. The attack was outrageous."

Personally, I was a young intelligence officer at the time. I had the opportunity to listen to the tapes of the IDF pilots and PT boat commanders as they cheerfully detailed their actions to sink the ship. My "favorite" part was when IDF HQ and a PT boat commander exchanged quips about the wisdom of shooting up the damage control parties or just their hoses. The cynical decision was to just shoot up the hoses because the ship was so badly damaged that it would sink in just a few munutes.

The reason the Liberty did not sink was that US Navy damage control is the best in the world. Plus, the Israelis, because they knew it was an intelligence ship, failed to follow normal ship-attack protocols (which call for shooting at the rear third of a ship in order to disable engines and steering) and concentrated almost all fire on the center of the ship --- exactly where the intelligence spaces were located.

The IDF turned "de de mau" and ran for cover when the IDF told them that aircraft from the Sixth Fleet were on the way. These are your brave IDF fighters --- couldn't even sink an unarmed converted WWII Victory Ship merchant vessel and running at the first sign of armed opposition.

This sort of action by a government is always relevant because it can, and will, be repeated.

JS in SD..... "Gaza and West Bank are a state in everything but name". You're kidding, right? Their land and resources stolen every day, harassed by settlers, homes bull dosed, olive trees destroyed, essential supplies denied entry by Israel, and on and on. You are living in a bubble, JS. What STATE would have to contend with this type of abuse?

@JSinSD,

I see where you are coming from, but I respectfully disagree with you. The thing I would point to is the people in Cuba. Because of sanctions imposed by the US in reaction to (or embarassment from) the Bay of Pigs Invasion failure, the country has been kept very poor and unable to conduct normal commerce. But the people in Cuba do not hate either their government or even the American people because of it. They blame the inept American government and those governments that support the US sanctions still. If the sanctions ended tomorrow, there would be no backlash against the Cuban political leadership, but rather a massive expansion of the Cuban tourist industry.

In the same way, there is no attachment by the Palestinians for war. After all it is their low-grade individual weapons against the IDF's American-made jets and tanks and bombs. The basic reason that the Palestinians continue to resist Israel is the 1967 UN Accords that give them borders that include water and riparian rights as well as the right of return. The Palestinians hated the 1967 Accords because it took so much from them. But it is the best deal on the table from anyone at this point and they have pointed to it as acceptable for 46 years. It has been US policy under both Republicans and Democrats since 1966 that the 1967 Accords is the best roadmap for peace in the region. And it remains US policy.

Doc holiday:

Moshe Dayan was a rock star

"All of you Christians, either of Old or New Testament are fanatics that will destroy all of Mother Earth to satisfy your greed and insecurities."

And thats the same kind of bigoted generalizations that early invading peoples used when they encountered natives in the new world, "theyre all barbarians, we are more advanced"

lumping everyone together because of a few is no better than ANY of the "reasons" holocausts were inflicted upon undeserving peoples.

Why is Israel one of the only countries in the world now that will arm all their citizens and have mandatory military time, and America is trying to disarm its citizens?? Curious.

WHy is their such strong apartheid, discrimination in Israel when Americas borders are being forced open? Curious?

Why is their such a strong sentiment of Israel to have American soldiers die for their wars and bully Iran?

Something is going on here that is different from all over the world...connect the dots.

JediUtahn: take a pill. No-one is trying to disarm citizens.

Jedi;

I think you're confusing Israel with most of Europe, Libya, Kuwait, and the like, who have ALL asked for G.I. BLOOD.

Israel has NEVER asked (nor received) American soldiers' lives.

But, hey - why let facts get in the way of a good "hate"?

Well I’ve already gave my thoughts on this so I won’t add much more, I will say going by the other posts I have read on this thread that the polarisation is back, and as such just want to pose a question for you. If the people here who effectively have no dog in this fight (to borrow a phrase) can become so polarised by this issue, how polarised must those be who do have a dog in this fight be?

The first World Zionist Congress met in 1897, with the founder, Theodore Herzl, stating that the State of Israel would be created in 50 years, in Palestine (those words may be found under the general declarations).

He wrote:
"Were I to sum up the Basel Congress in a word - which I shall guard against pronouncing publicly - it would be this: At Basel I founded the Jewish State.[2] If I said this out loud today l would be greeted by universal laughter. In five years perhaps, and certainly in fifty years, everyone will perceive it."

Fast forward 50 years, and there is Israel. It would be nice if everyone knew this bit of history before saying Israel was created because of the Holocaust.

Jedi,

Why is "there"...

Um, JP and Chris do some fact checking and learn some history. It was a case of mistaken identity (in 1967 we didn't exactly have GPS or cell phones). IDF pilots radioed to their command, who radioed the US Navy attache' in Tel Aviv, who confirmed that no US ship was supposed to be in those waters. Orders to withdraw were sent to USS Liberty, from US Navy, on the wrong frequency.

Two independent reviews, from IDF and the US Navy itself, found this to be an extremely unfortunate and preventable case of mistaken identity with error on both sides. The case is closed, and the case has no relevance on anything that is happening now. Anyone who uses the US Liberty to divert from the issue at hand is doing just that, diverting.

JP

The Liberty was a huge error made by Israel and even the US crew knew that once Israel realized the error they backed off. Otherwise they would have sunk the ship. If you don't know your history, the incident occurred in the middle of the 67 War, when tiny Israel was up against 5 larger nations who amassed their armies on the 3 fronts of Israel land. The US gave no support to Israel during that war. I am absolutely not justifying any attack on the Liberty and my country, only pointing out that it was Israel ALONE against 5 nations. Everyone was their enemy in the region. The Liberty was in neutral waters just outside of Israel, who again had NO ALLIES during that war. And Israel has investigated and apologized. If you have never been in a war, you should know that mistakes are made. Monday morning quarterbacks when it comes to military mistakes are just a nuisance. be there when hard decisions must be made. It is very different.

Back to this story. Israel just got rid of Lieberman, they don't need this hawkish, political hack, spouting off in the Knesset. Netanyahu has done a great job of balancing politics, Obama's lack of support and security in Israel. It is a difficult nation, with radical Orthodox settlers clamouring for more Palestinian land, and liberal Israelis wanting peace. Security has become strong in Israel. The big threat is Hamas, backed by Muslim Brotherhood lead Egypt. The Rafah crossing will now be an active weapons trading point. And rockets with greater capacity will be flying from Gaza. Netanyahu will do a great job protecting Israel.

MmmMmmBeer,

The USS Liberty sounds just as unfortunate as the Lavon Affair. Perhaps Lance Armstrong could make a career in the Israeli government living by the ethics of deny unless caught red handed, but even he would be considered too honest for such a post.

The Lavon Affair refers to a failed Israeli covert operation, code named Operation Susannah, conducted in Egypt in the Summer of 1954. As part of the false flag operation,^[1] a group of Egyptian Jews were recruited by Israeli military intelligence for plans to plant bombs inside Egyptian, American andBritish-owned targets. The attacks were to be blamed on the Muslim Brotherhood, Egyptian Communists, "unspecified malcontents" or "local nationalists" with the aim of creating a climate of sufficient violence and instability to induce the British government to retain its occupying troops in Egypt's Suez Canal zone.^[2] The operation caused no casualties, except for those members of the cell who committed suicide after being captured.

The operation ultimately became known as the Lavon Affair after the Israeli defense minister Pinhas Lavon was forced to resign as a consequence of the incident. Before Lavon's resignation, the incident had been euphemistically referred to in Israel as the "Unfortunate Affair" or "The Bad Business"(Hebrew: העסק הביש, HaEsek HaBish). After Israel publicly denied any involvement in the incident for 51 years, the surviving agents were officially honored in 2005 by being awarded certificates of appreciation by Israeli President Moshe Katzav.^[3]

sandmantruth

Ah Yes the Lavon Affair. Wasn't it between the time that Egypt and 5 other nations declared war on Israel in 1948 and the time when Egypt and 4 other nations amassed their armies on the border of all of Israel to attack again in 1967. Or was that just before the time Egypt expelled all Jews from Egypt (what was left). Oh. the Lavon affair was well before Egypt attacked Israel on the holiest day of the year in 1973. Oh those nasty Israelis should have never planted a bomb in their nice neighbor's back yard. Egypt was so friendly to them. How unjust of the Israelis.

I will tell you that the days of the Egypt?Israel treaty are over. yest, they existed because a dictator ruled Egypt while the majority of people hated Israel. Now that the Muslim Brotherhood runs Egypt, the same Brotherhood that created Hamas, Egypt will not be so nice to it's neighbors. Israel has already constructed a fence along the Egyptian border and they know Hams in Gaza is being armed through the Rafah crossing.

I hope the Israelis are prepared for more successful :Lavon" Affairs. They will need to. Especially as Syria becomes Islamist and Iran continues to supply Hamas and Hezbollah with more advanced weaponry.

sandmantruth. I am glad you have done your internet research on this failed op. Maybe you should spend some time understanding the complete time line. Events must be examined in relation to the entire set of circumstances.

Why is it that we, the USA, give dual citizenship to American born citizens, when they go off to the Israelis Army as soldiers for citizenship to fight for another country and then let them come back to the US? If a US citizen were to go off to Australia to join their Army for citizenship would they still have a citizenship in the US? Something to consider and reflect on.

FtBrgtrnd

I am not sure if you understand what a false flag operation is; in other words you are saying Israel should conduct more false flag operations against the US to frame their enemies to get the US to fight their enemies (sounds like what they are trying to do to Iran today).

Speaking of understanding a complete timelime of events, perhaps you should start with 19th century Zionism which led to the creation of the modern state of Israel rather than World War II.

We blindly support the land grabbing, racist and religious discrimination based state of Israel and then we wonder why Islamic fighters hate us and want to perpetrate acts of terrorism against us. We support a Jewish supremacist country but we would never dream of supporting a white supremacist country like Rhodesia or RSA once was. That is what happens when you allow one ethnic group dictate the US foreign policy.

Sandman, not only have you demonstrated no understanding of the current conflict, you also demonstrate no knowledge of history!

Yes, Operation Sussannah was launched in an attempt to maintain British military presence in the Suez Canal in 1954. That much you did correctly copy'n'paste from wikepedia. What you didn't mention, was that the false flag op was controversial at the time (Aman wanted to do it, Mossad did not) and that Egypt caught and tried several of the undercover Israeli soldiers. Two were hanged in Egypt in 1955. Two were acquitted. The ensuing investigation, which was reopened in 1960, was to determine who authorized the operation, not to cover up the state's involvement. This has been well known for nearly five decades.

Just another diversion from an armchair PhD. Let's get back on topic, which is the re-election taking place in 2013.

DocHolliday... I assume you're being sarcastic because Ronald Reagan certainly didn't "walk the talk" unless you mean getting tough with that powerhouse Grenada or after declaring that we would stay in Lebanon after the barracks bombing how he pulled the Marines out anyway a year or so later. Or maybe you mean how he sold arms to the worst possible enemy, Iran, to fund operations against the exaggerated threat of the naughty old commies in banana republics like Nicaragua. Yeah, Reagan was a badass. He was a complete idiot that for some reason Americans can't stop exaggerating the importance of.

StMiller

Reagan did very little, other than get the hostages released in Iran on Day 1, tame the spiraling inflation created under the Carter Administration, be a major player in the fall of Communism, restore America's standing as a strong nation he didn't do much.

Lar -Reagan had nothing to do with the release of those hostages. They were released on the last day of Carter's presidency before Reagan was even sworn in and his administration was not involved at all. Additionally, his role in the fall of communism is also insanely exaggerated. Find a single concrete thing he did to end communism? I would like to point out that communism is the type of government in control in the second largest economy in the world and the one that is on pace to become the largest economy. Just because the Soviet Union happened to collapse at the very end of Reagan's time in office does not mean that he had anything to do with it and certainly doesn't mean that communism has ended.

In regard to inflation. I would suggest that the Fed had much more to do with controlling that.

I hope that Israel becomes the world's greatest superpower . . . oh wait . . . they already have more military power than any other country . . . the steadfast loyalty of their countrymen who will defend and protect each other to the death . . . what Arab has ever protected another Arab except for profit?

We need Israel in ME.

Or else, hating and killing Islamic extremists will be going all around the world to hate and kill non-Muslims and if non-Muslims are not there Muslims themselves on the basis of sects/tribes!

Israel is partially keeping Islamic extremists busy.

"“Injecting an artificial Arab state within the land of Israel would bring 100 years of bloodshed and war that would never end. It’s not good for the Arabs. It’s not good for the Israelis,” he said."

Bennett is right. Israel belongs to Jews. There should be no place for Muslims, which originally belonged to Jews.

I disagree with the US Jewish lobby and some Jews in Israel on few issues.

Leave Syria and Iran for the Shiites and Sunnis to battle themselves. At least permit them to battle to their hearts content.

Meanwhile, clean up the Hamas and Fatah from their positions. Israel should do what the Islamists do.

Bomb, terrorize, bulldoze and kick and go on doing it often till all the Palestine areas are cleaned.

Palestinians need to have a state and they should have it in Saudi Arabia with Mecca as capital for Hamas and Medina for Fatah.

They can't have the same capital as they will battle themselves!!!

Then we all can join hands about those remaining in Syria, Iran, and other trouble spots.

Bomb, terrorize, bulldoze and kick and go on doing it often till all the Palestine areas are cleaned.

You're publicly advocating for terrorism. Consider yourself reported.

lol

do you not wonder why isreal is up to its neck with blood???

well jon you know why because you spelled out everything isreal does now and they are deeper in their own crapulance

Epinoia: In that case, not many will be left after all the "reportings."

Leave Israel to it's own devices. Cut off ALL aid and military assistance and we'll see how tough they really are.

secondbrother . . . you must be joking . . . Israel has been on its own since they left Egypt . . . as a people, they have succeeded better than any other and all without a country of their own for 2,000 years . . . now they just want a tiny piece of real estate and the whole damn world is horrified. What the hell is wrong with people who think the Jew has taken any thing and not given back 10,000 percent?

Who is "The Jew"? Every Jew is the same? Aside from being possibly offensive to Jewish people, broad generalizations are never accurate. And the notion that no nation has ever accomplished as much as another...if you juxtapose the word "Jew" with "Aryan" you get a VERY familiar arguement.

You bet.

Netanyahu does not appear to know the timings to strike. He did wrong moves on Iraq. He is repeating them on Syria and Iran. Is he guided or on pay roll of oil rich Sunni rulers of Saudi Arabia, Qatar, UAE, Kuwait and other Sunni Arab League nations.

Naftali Bennett appears to be better. First kick out all Palestinians.

Of course, keep Hezbollah, Iran and other enemies on the back of the mind.

Later clean as many of them as possible. Don't leave a single Hezbollah militant too. Here Lebanon Christians should join Jews of Israel.

Most people aren't as bloodthirsty as you. Just to clarify, by "you" I do not mean Jews, or even Israelis. I mean people who want to simply kill off people who disagree with you. We Lebanese have our disagreements with the Palestinians, but unlike people like you, we don't want to begin "cleaning" them all. How much better do you have to think you are to advocate wiping an entire race of people? That's horrible. And I promise you it won't work.

Seriously, this kind of stupid bull@!$%# is what got us into all the trouble in Iraq.

W - We need to go in and take out Saddam.

Adv - Uh, sir, what will we do then? The Sunnis won't want to leave power, and the Shiites are just itching to rebel. On top of that, both groups want to cleanse the Kurds out of the country. How are we going to handle all this?

W - What's a Sunni? I thought they were all Muslims.

-------------------------

Same @!$%#, different day.

15-20 billion a year is the approximation. Approx. $30,000 a year for every man, woman, and child. Kind of like the stimulus but every single year.

You have mixed up the countries. 20 billion a year is the total of what goes to Egypt, Pakistan and other Muslim states.

Israel only gets 3 billion a year, every cent of which has to come back to USA in form of weapons' purchase, as opposed to the money given to the Muslims, which is gone for good.

Why do you want to blame NBC or any media for the problems in Israel? The Media is just reporting the news. Now if your talking about so called analysts then you would have a point.

gudprsn, if NBC is "stupid media" why are you here reading and commenting? What does that say about you?

Hey, gudprsn? You are absolutely, unapologetically wrong in every way possible. I can tell you have trouble with history if you are somehow trying to relate the attacks of the Ottoman Empire (which is not Arab, and in fact is remembered with much hatred by Arabs because it oppressed the Middle East for quite some time) to the establishment of Israel. That is beyond incorrect, especially considering the fact that the Ottoman Empire had been attacking Europe since the 1400s, before there ever was a Zionist movement.

So point number 1: Turks are not Arabs. You should remember this.

Point number 2: The Torah could never have addressed ANYTHING in the Quran. Why? Because the Quran was written in the 630s AD. The Torah was written down in the 400s-600s BC, and was orally transmitted many years before that. That's a 1000-1200 year difference. You can see how it would be impossible to disprove anything in the Quran, right? If not, then I just can't reach you.

Yet some Muslims and pro-Muslims keep trying to bash Torah, forgetting that the first part of their beloved Quaran is that very same Torah.

Agreed with that. The Torah, Bible, and Quran have a great deal of similarities that should be recognized by people who proclaim one more right than another. There's nothing with having faith, of course, but respect should always exist between everyone involved.

Saudi Arabia is fabulously rich with a small native population. It proclaims itself as a paragon of Islamic virtues. It has about 9 million subjects and equal number of aliens who work from domestic maids to high paying skilled and administrative jobs. All SA has to do is to send its non Muslim work force home and give that places to fellow Arabs from Gaza and West Bank. After all these Arabs actually came from Arabian peninsula after Islamic conquest of Byzantine empire. Moreover, this will add Saudis' Islamic merit system as advocated by the Salafists and Wahhabis!

'Use this break to clean up all Palestinian areas and permit no Muslim within Israel either.'

That should just about complete the theft, right? When you mention Palestinian areas, you mean those areas that belong to the Palestinians right? Would that include all of what was called Palestine until the UN and the USA allowed the Zionists to steal land from the people who lived there for more than 1000 years?

And America should remove all right wing religious fanatics as well. Take their homes away and send them to Arizona so we can keep an eye on them. We could move all those Katrina mobile homes dubby built (you know, the ones made with materials that outgas deadly gas for decades) over to Arizona for them to live in.

Jonathan-1982062

looks as you learned this from 1939 germany.

why not expand in to the rest of the region. i mean Jews are the gods people!!??

BGL: Be glad that I am not in seventh century desert days or zero century cross waving days!

Hamas is not the problem. The real problem is the far right wing leadership of Israel, which continues to occupy land recognized by the international community as belonging to the Arabs. Hamas is merely fighting for land that is already theirs, while Israel, with it's supply of arms paid for by the American taxpayer, keeps taking more land and water resources.

. "It is the duty of Israeli leaders to explain to public opinion,
clearly and courageously, a certain number of facts that are forgotten with
time. The first of these is that there is no Zionism, colonialization or Jewish
State without the eviction of the Arabs and the expropriation of their
lands."

Yoram Bar Porath, Yediot Aahronot, of 14 July 1972.

Here is an example of mindset of the Zionists: “The acceptance of partition does
not commit us to renounce Transjordan; one does not demand from anybody to give
up his vision. We shall accept a state in the boundaries fixed today. But the
boundaries of Zionist aspirations are the concern of the Jewish people and no
external factor will be able to limit them.” David Ben-Gurion, in 1936,
quoted in Noam Chomsky, “The Fateful Triangle.”

“Under the UN Charter there can
lawfully be no territorial gains from war, even by a state acting in
self-defense. The response of other states to Israel’s occupation shows a
virtually unanimous opinion that even if Israel’s action was defensive, its
retention of the West Bank and Gaza Strip was not...The [UN] General Assembly
characterized Israel’s occupation of the West Bank and Gaza as a denial of self
determination and hence a ‘serious and increasing threat to international peace
and security.’ “ John Quigley, “Palestine and Israel: A Challenge to
Justice.”

So, what, we just tell everyone living to up and leave because you makes you feel better? What makes you think that people will just want to move to another country because people in Israel can't accept them? Even if you believe the conflict is entirely the fault of Hamas, you have to realize that every Palestinian is not a raving terrorist. What would you do with those people? They're not Saudis, or Jordanians, or Qataris. They're just not. All Arabs are not the same, and regardless of what you've been told, Palestinians are not exactly the same as other Arabs.

Would it be fair to expect all American Indians to up and move to Canada just because we want "America for Americans"? Or to ask every Hispanic, regardless of nationality to move Mexico just because they all speak Spanish? It's a ridiculous and racist notion.

No, they don't have to leave. All they need is to stop shooting, nothing more was ever asked of Palestinians.

Giving up your house isn't more to ask? Palestinians have been forced out of their homes by Israeli interests, regardless of their individual actions.

Being forcibly removed from your home sounds like the "Indian Removal Act" of 1832. Is history repeating itself? Has the World learned nothing?

Hmmm...

Hamas also wants to wipe Isreal off the map. Problematic.

The Palestinians have stopped shooting several times. Isreal built a wall. Have you ever seen where that wall goes? Go look in Google maps. Follow the wall, and watch yourself say "Oh Damn!". The Palestinians are pissed for good reason. Again, problematic.

Until both sides stop being jerks to the other, until Hamas stops trying to kill anyone Jewish, and Isreal moves it's stupid wall to something more resembling a straight line that both sides can live with, this will go on. Each side feeds the hatred of the other side. Each human killed is avenged as if they were the first and only one killed.

More importantly, each side believes that the land was given to them By God. Again, problematic.

Yes. And if they do Israel will become a pariah state and negate any claim the Jewish people had to Israel as a homeland. They will be damned by every country in the world. Any empathy for what the Jews suffered in WW II will be lost. They will be looked on as evil and heartless murderers. I don't believe this is the image Israel wants in the world. They are more rational than that...I hope.

Ron - Sad to say, I think you are wrong. Our bought and paid for Congress will just say that Israel has a right to defend themselves, even though theire is no real threat eminating from Iran.

These traitors keep sending Israel our tax dollars, even though the US is tapped out and in debt up to our ears. Meanwhile Israel's economy is flourishing.

See here: Israel's economy is
thriving in a global economic meltdown. The Jewish state's 2009-12 economic
growth of 14.7 percent leads all the advanced countries of the world, followed
by Australia with 10.7; Canada 4.8; United States 3.2; Germany 2.7; France 0.3;
European Union minus 1.5 percent.

The bastards use our money to expand their holdings, which is counterproductive to peace in the ME. Stop all aid to the Zionist parasites.

Its actually Not in Tahoe......or.....Nuts is Yahoo.....not sure. I prefer Master Manipulator Zionist

Iranian terrorist Ralph - Stop peddling ahmadinejad talking points. Your corrupt ayatollahs are stealing billions of people's money and sending it to their European bank accounts. STOP meddling in Lebanon, Syria, Gaza, Sudan, pakistan, Afghanistan, Iraq, Nigeria, Egypt in support of terrorism.

Boy you are a nut case!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I agree with you.

Netanyahu was one of the culprits responsbile for the Iraqi wars and the subsequent mess all around.

If Saddam was still there, Sunni Islamic extremist rulers of House of Saud, Kuwait, UAE, Qatar and some more Sunni Arab League nations would have been out of the map along with some nations.

Examine the mess all around due to Iraqi wars and high oil price manipulations using Iraqi wars as an excuse.

To weaken the No. 1 enemy, Sunni oil rich rulers, remove sanctions on Iranian oil. Let the oil prices crash.

I can't even get my own family to see that, but I keep trying.

Maybe that's because Israel is NOT a theocracy.

Were it a theocracy, churches and Mosques would not be allowed. Pork farms would not be allowed. Arab political parties would not be allowed.

You are confusing Israel with the Sharia states which surround her...but nice try.

Jeff,

You are deluded. It is theocracy under a veneer of democracy.

Every flavor of theocrazy is dangerous.

Maybe it's a not a theocracy, but it does require every citizen to recognize that Israel is a Jewish state. That's awfully close. And Jews and Jewish immigrants receive preferential treatment under Israeli law (we're not talking about racism or bias-the Law of Return specifically allows Jews more beneficial treatment than nonJews). And there is no civil union by law in Israel, or divorce. So you can see, Judaism plays a large role in the laws of Israel, and while most Israelis are Jewish, there are significant portions who are not, and it's not very fair to them.

THANK you, Ed.

You FACTUALLY refuted every fact in my post. <not !>

Yeah, Lebanese -

Tell us...WHY do you (and others) have a problem with Israel being a "Jewish" state, but NO problem with the 16 "Islamic" States in the region ?

I have a problem with any state that treats their citizens unfairly. Do not assume, my friend, because you know very little of my opinions.

Unashamed usurpation, huh ?

So, let's see:

Israel is declared a state in 1948 and is attacked. She wins land, and gives it back "for peace."

1956 - that SAME land is used as staging grounds against her for war #2. Israel captures it an gives it back "for peace", after which the U.N. puts "peacekeepers" at the borders.

Fast forward to May, 1967. The armies of Syria, Jordan, Egypt and Lebanon mass at Israels' borders claiming "war exercises". Israel is nervous.

2 days later, Nassar, King of Egypt gives the U.N. 24 hours for their "peace keepers" to get out or be killed. The U.N., claiming it is a "peacekeeping" force and not a "fighting" force, says "hasta Lavista to Israel and bugs out.

Israel preemptively strikes and wins back the SAME land.

Fast Forward, modern times:

The world orders Israel to give the SAME land back yet again, in exchange for.....Whats, exactly ?

Yeah - "unashamed usurpation."

The Egyptians had two divisions on the border that were completely and totally inadequate for offensive operations. The Israelis, who actually did not believe the Egyptians to be massing for attack, launches an aerial attack on the Egyptian Air Force and destroys them. How were they able to accomplish this? Because the Egyptians were unprepared for attacking Israel, that's why. Not only that, but Israel attacked the West Bank which was Jordanian at the time. So Israel attacked them without a declaration of war. We won't bother discussing the USS Liberty, because it's not something people like to talk about.

Does that ring any bells? If you know Pearl Harbor, it should. That 1967 War is long past, but let's not pretend that Israel was a poor, innocent victim.

And by the way, it was Israel that massed on Syria's borders. Yes, Israel. Not Syria or Jordan. The Arabs were so uncoordinated they couldn't fight their collective way out of a paper bag. King Hussein and President Nassar had bad relations because the Egyptians wouldn't support the Jordanians when Israel first attacked them. The Jordanians in turn didn't bother helping the Syrians when Israeli planes engaged Syrian planes in Jordanian airspace. And this was all pre-war. After this point, the Arabs predictably decided to attack Israel together. That's when the war actually started-so your claim of the Arabs launching a massive invasion of innocent little Israel is absolutely incorrect.

Welcome to History 101 as rewritten by Lebanese carolinian.

Fortunately, with the exception of Arab states' history books, no other country's history books agree with your fantasy.

I find it hard to believe that anyone who makes comments like that has ever passed a History 101 course himself.

But go ahead, look it up yourself. Israel preemptively struck the other states, not vice versa.

never!~!!!!!!

The moment Islamic extremist Sunni rulers of House of Saud, Qatar, Kuwait, UAE and some more are erazed from the map along with some nations like Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and some more.

Jews of Israel have got every right to get back what was snatched from them.

Agreed, Keith.

So, here's how it goes:

The U.S. drops military and economic support for Israel. (of course, the BILLION going to Egypt and the 1/2 BILLION still going to Hammas)

She is already outnumbered on the battlefield, and, with Syria and Iran Israel's enemies with better and better arms, ten years down the line, the armaments are closer to equal.

Israel is, once again, hit on all sides. She cant win a "conventional" war. She is faced with extinction or the use of "NON" conventional arms....

Feel like paying 20.00 a gallon ?

Jews and Muslims agree on one thing--that God had no son. If Jesus hadn't kept parking his donkey in the reserved spots, he'd have lived a lot longer.

Expel the Christians!

Ron, that's a nice thought. Unfortunately, the current Israeli population is in no mood to take risks for peace.

Their Religious Right making common cause with 500,000 immigrants from Russia and the other former Soviet Republics now in a second generation guarantee there will be only continued, mutual hostility toward the entire Moslem world.

Considering the fact those Hamas rockets you speak of have a 0.2% kill rate, your argument is rather weak. 26 Israelis have been by rockets since 2004. Of these, 21 were Jewish. Now, no death is acceptable on either side, Jewish or Palestinian...but so is using their deaths to advance a hateful agenda.

Hamas did their best to kill as many as possible. If they only killed 21, it was not for the lack of trying.

Israelis did their best to protect their citizens without killing too many on the other side, but Hamas also did their best to place their own civilians in as much danger is possible, just so you and yours could make these posts and help them by "using their deaths to advance a hateful agenda."

At some point Israelis had to give up trying to minimize the number of casualties on the other side and concentrate on minimizing the number of casualties on their own side, as any other country would do.

Azrancher - the evil people killemore than 1400 Palestinians in 2006. They killed more than a thousand Lebanese in the same year. The evil people are taking more Arab land and water each and every year. The evil people are the Zionists.

. "We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to
live here as slaves."

Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of
General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.

"We must use terror, assassination, intimidation, land confiscation, and
the cutting of all social services to rid the Galilee of its Arab
population."

Israel Koenig, "The Koenig Memorandum"

Evil is, as evil does. The Israels have been working hard to accomplish what Isarel Koenig declared in his memorandum. They have been using terror, assassination and land confiscation. See below:

“In violation of international law,
Israel has confiscated over 52 percent of the land in the West Bank and 30
percent of the Gaza Strip for military use or for settlement by Jewish
civilians...From 1967 to 1982, Israel’s military government demolished 1,338
Palestinian homes on the West Bank. Over this period, more than 300,000
Palestinians were detained without trial for various periods by Israeli
security forces. “Intifada: The Palestinian Uprising Against Israeli
Occupation,” ed. Lockman and Beinin.

Sunshine:

When you say "stolen land", please be more specific, would you ?

Are you talking about the 1948 borders, or the 1967 ?

I ask that because those of you who say that "if only Israel does..(x), (y) (z), there will be peace. Really ? Because everyone seems to be saying that - well, everyone except Hammas, Iran, Syria, etc.

Has there EVER been ONE "peace" proposal which had ANY provision for Israel's security ? Nope - not ONE, simply because the PLAYERS in the area, are still stuck on "Israel must die".

Based on the above, Israel could give back everything won in '67, and there would be no peace - just a few million Arabs yet CLOSER to Israel's civilian centers.

First of all Jeff, Israel started the war in 1967, be attacking the Egytian air force while it was still on the ground. Here are a few quotes from former leaders of Israel admitting there was no real threat from Egypt. They also adress the security issue.

"The thesis that the danger of genocide was hanging over us in June
1967 and that Israel was fighting for its physical existence is only bluff,
which was born and developed after the war."

“I do not think Nasser wanted war.
The two divisions he sent to The Sinai would not have been sufficient to launch
an offensive war. He knew it and we knew it.” Yitzhak Rabin, Israel’s Chief
of Staff in 1967, in Le Monde, 2/28/68

Israeli General Matityahu Peled, Ha'aretz, 19 March 1972.

“Moshe Dayan, the celebrated
commander who, as Defense Minister in 1967, gave the order to conquer the
Golan...[said] many of the firefights with the Syrians were deliberately
provoked by Israel, and the kibbutz residents who pressed the Government to take
the Golan Heights did so less for security than for the farmland...[Dayan
stated] ‘They didn’t even try to hide their greed for the land...We would send
a tractor to plow some area where it wasn’t possible to do anything, in the
demilitarized area, and knew in advance that the Syrians would start to shoot.
If they didn’t shoot, we would tell the tractor to advance further, until in
the end the Syrians would get annoyed and shoot.

And then we would use artillery and
later the air force also, and that’s how it was...The Syrians, on the fourth
day of the war, were not a threat to us.’” The New York Times, May 11, 1997

Here is an example of Israeli stealing: “In violation of international law,
Israel has confiscated over 52 percent of the land in the West Bank and 30
percent of the Gaza Strip for military use or for settlement by Jewish
civilians...From 1967 to 1982, Israel’s military government demolished 1,338
Palestinian homes on the West Bank. Over this period, more than 300,000
Palestinians were detained without trial for various periods by Israeli
security forces. “Intifada: The Palestinian Uprising Against Israeli
Occupation,” ed. Lockman and Beinin.

Ther Zionist arguements are mostly propaganda, based on lies perpetuated in the Zionist media. Thanks to the internet, people are realizing that the conception that Israel is this little struggling country being picked on by it's neighbors is a pack of lies. Israel instigates confrontations and meets the resistance of the oppressed with massive air attacks. In 2006, Israel killed over 1400 Palestinians, mostly women and children. In the same year, they attacked Lebanon, killing over 1000, over a border skirmish. In both cases, Israel used white phosphorus, which constitutes a war crime. They also attacked Lebanon with over a million cluster bombs, despite knowing the end of hostilities within a week had been agreed on.

Ahh, Ralphie, Newsvine's most ardent Jew Hater.

Not gonna waste my time on a piece of waste like you.

Oh Jeffie- Don't let the facts I posted get in the way of your arguments. You parasites just keep pushing your Zionist lies. How does it feel to be sucking off the America taxpayer after more than 60 years, like a common panhandler on welfare? You must be a people without any pride. Are you also on welfare here in the US?

Last year alone, your Zionist politicians like Eric Cantor, wrote bills asking the US for 10 billion dollars in loan guarantees, with the US picking up the fees and the interest. Kind of a confict of interest, but nothing new for our Jewish politicians. Then America paid 1 billion for the Israeli"Iron Dome" project and of course the annual 3 billion, just because you are Jewish freeloaders.

The facxt that Zionists planned and sold the Iraq war, which cost America trillions, means nothing to you. Hell Israel didn't spend a penny or lose one soldier. Then you all wonder why people don't like the Zionists and Israel. How dumb can you be?

In the language of Ralph "facts" means "nonsense".

Eli - People like you are my inspiration. Are you claiming that Eric Cantor didn't sponsor a bill for 10 billion dollars in loan guarantees, with fees and interest to be paid by America?

Hey Fast Fred- No one is bitching about Israel being a free state. We are bitching because Israel does what it does with the aid of America and the dollars provided by American taxpayers. They didn't get those F16s , Apache helicopters and plans fornuclear weapons on their own. Here is an example of the true Israeli mindset.

Preeminent Israeli military historian, Martin van Creveld, in
2010 said Israel could find itself one day forced to exterminate the European
continent using all kinds of weapons including its nuclear arsenal if it felt
its demise neared,” and stressed that “Israel also considers Europe a hostile
target.”

“We have hundreds of nuclear warheads and
missiles that can reach different targets in the heart of the European
continent, including beyond the borders of Rome, the Italian capital,” Creveld
said, adding that most of the European capitals would become preferred targets
for the Israeli air force.

The truly sad part is that we are the ones responcible for giving Israel the capability to accomplish their blood thirsty goals. Israel is the country that attacked the USS Liberty in 1967, killing 34 Americansn and wounding 172. The goal was to kill them all, but they were scared off before they could accomplish their falsae flag attack.

6 November 1991: Columnists Evans and Novak
publish interview with Dwight Porter, U.S. Ambassador to Lebanon in 1967, in
which Porter says that during or immediately after the attack on the Liberty
the CIA station chief showed him transcripts of intercepted Israeli messages.
One has Israel ordering the attack on the Liberty, another has an Israeli pilot
replying it's an American ship. When the order to attack is repeated, the pilot
insists he can see the American flag. The pilot is told again: "Attack
it."

Note, he actually believes that it's who Israel wants to wipe out Europe, and not people who have actually been blowing up things in Europe.

Eli - I posted the words of a prominent Israeli, who is close to the military establishment in Israel. If he hadn't spoke those words, I would not have known Israel considered Europe a hostile target. Look him up.

Israel is led by a bunch of crazies, who are far more lethal and ruthless, than the Islamic militants in this world. What other nation would attack the unarmed warship (USS Liberty) of it's greatest benefactor and brag about it by displaying evidence in it's military museum?

Don't try to justify the existence and crimes of Isreal - it will drive a logical, rational mind insane. You only need remember the Zionists are the Chosen Ones, all of their actions are at the behest of Yaweh, and it is His will. Nonbelievers, including Christians, only exist to serve the Chosen Ones - if you are fortunate enough to be chosen for subservience.

No, John - you'd be right if Israel was a theocracy, which it isnt.

Israel was pretty darned happy with the borders given her in '48. They're not in West Bank because G-d "gave it to them" - they're there because the land was used to attack Israel 3 times.

And how did the Arabs get there? By doing the exact same thing to the Israelis for essentially the same reason.

The Israeli Government has used the "settlers" for many years. Now there are enough of them that they are going to be a power block within the government and within the society. Just as our CIA sowed the seeds of future discord with the U.S. support for the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan and Pakistan.......Israel is going to have to deal with people out on their borders who have issues with both the government and the Palestinian Leadership. Folks its called the Law of Entropy. Look it up!