"I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven."

- The Bible.

I find it ironic that children can see past color, see past orientation, and see past belief to get along with others. Perhaps your quote is right, JK.

Chris,

Of course the quote made by JK is right.

There's a big difference between "childlike" and "childish."

Early Out,

Ah, changing your story now?

Luckyjr,

The Tooth Fairy is eligible if a single, Catholic male.

Jeffor,

What a nasty thing to say. Why do you hate us?

I wish Catholics looked to God and not to their Popes.

If they read their Bibles they would realize the Pope, The Vatican and all those men do not even remotely practice what Christ had commanded.

BG,

Why do you think we do not look to God? Jesus started the Church. Good enough for Him, good enough for me.

You are aware that the contents of your Bible was complied by the Catholic Church, right? All of it, except the parts taken out or changed later, was around over 1000 years before the truncated versions in the 1500s started showing up.

Did you know that the Catholic Church goes through the entire Bible during services in a recurring three-year cycle?

Why do folks like you try tell us what we believe?

Look to yourself; it is a full time job.

What a nasty thing to say. Why do you hate us?

Well when you have a Nazi sympathizing, anal rape supporting pope what kind of statements do you expect? I don't hate anyone aside from evil men who protect child rapist like your pope.

NC-492358,

Nonsense.

When is the last time, in three years, you heard sermons about the virtues of slavery and killing children who talk back to parents? Jesus wasn't against slavery. Which Church cycle talks about the fact that the Bible commands women marry their rapists?

So don't be ridiculous. The Catholic Church, like every other sect, does not actually read the whole Bible. They cherry pick.

All this shows is you don't need God to be good. In fact, faith is often the reason which provides a serious detriment to moral and civilized behavior. You have been brainwashed to believe the 3 cycle bible reading lie.

Don't forget that it's an abomination to eat shellfish according to the Bible. Just letting you know for your soul's sake.

Hello folks,

When it comes to bull@!$%#, big-time, major league bull@!$%#, you have to stand in awe of the all-time champion of false promises and exaggerated claims, religion. No contest. No contest. Religion. Religion easily has the greatest bull@!$%# story ever told. Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there's an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever 'til the end of time!

But He loves you. He loves you, and He needs money! He always needs money! He's all-powerful, all-perfect, all-knowing, and all-wise, somehow just can't handle money! Religion takes in billions of dollars, they pay no taxes, and they always need a little more. Now, you talk about a good bull@!$%# story. Holy @!$%#!

But I want you to know something, this is sincere, I want you to know, when it comes to believing in God, I really tried. I really, really tried. I tried to believe that there is a God, who created each of us in His own image and likeness, loves us very much, and keeps a close eye on things. I really tried to believe that, but I gotta tell you, the longer you live, the more you look around, the more you realize, something is @!$%#ed up.

Something is wrong here. War, disease, death, destruction, hunger, filth, poverty, torture, crime, corruption, and the Ice Capades. Something is definitely wrong. This is not good work. If this is the best God can do, I am not impressed. Results like these do not belong on the résumé of a Supreme Being. This is the kind of @!$%# you'd expect from an office temp with a bad attitude. And just between you and me, in any decently-run universe, this guy would've been out on his all-powerful ass a long time ago. And by the way, I say "this guy", because I firmly believe, looking at these results, that if there is a God, it has to be a man.

No woman could or would ever @!$%# things up like this. So, if there is a God, I think most reasonable people might agree that he's at least incompetent, and maybe, just maybe, doesn't give a @!$%#. Doesn't give a @!$%#, which I admire in a person, and which would explain a lot of these bad results.

So rather than be just another mindless religious robot, mindlessly and aimlessly and blindly believing that all of this is in the hands of some spooky incompetent father figure who doesn't give a @!$%#, I decided to look around for something else to worship. Something I could really count on.

And immediately, I thought of the sun. Happened like that. Overnight I became a sun-worshipper. Well, not overnight, you can't see the sun at night. But first thing the next morning, I became a sun-worshipper. Several reasons. First of all, I can see the sun, okay? Unlike some other gods I could mention, I can actually see the sun. I'm big on that. If I can see something, I don't know, it kind of helps the credibility along, you know? So everyday I can see the sun, as it gives me everything I need; heat, light, food, flowers in the park, reflections on the lake, an occasional skin cancer, but hey. At least there are no crucifixions, and we're not setting people on fire simply because they don't agree with us.

Sun worship is fairly simple. There's no mystery, no miracles, no pageantry, no one asks for money, there are no songs to learn, and we don't have a special building where we all gather once a week to compare clothing. And the best thing about the sun, it never tells me I'm unworthy. Doesn't tell me I'm a bad person who needs to be saved. Hasn't said an unkind word. Treats me fine. So, I worship the sun. But, I don't pray to the sun. Know why? I wouldn't presume on our friendship. It's not polite.

I've often thought people treat God rather rudely, don't you? Asking trillions and trillions of prayers every day. Asking and pleading and begging for favors. Do this, gimme that, I need a new car, I want a better job. And most of this praying takes place on Sunday His day off. It's not nice. And it's no way to treat a friend.

But people do pray, and they pray for a lot of different things, you know, your sister needs an operation on her crotch, your brother was arrested for defecating in a mall. But most of all, you'd really like to @!$%# that hot little redhead down at the convenience store. You know, the one with the eyepatch and the clubfoot? Can you pray for that? I think you'd have to. And I say, fine. Pray for anything you want. Pray for anything, but what about the Divine Plan?

Remember that? The Divine Plan. Long time ago, God made a Divine Plan. Gave it a lot of thought, decided it was a good plan, put it into practice. And for billions and billions of years, the Divine Plan has been doing just fine. Now, you come along, and pray for something. Well suppose the thing you want isn't in God's Divine Plan? What do you want Him to do? Change His plan? Just for you? Doesn't it seem a little arrogant? It's a Divine Plan. What's the use of being God if every run-down shmuck with a two-dollar prayerbook can come along and @!$%# up Your Plan?

And here's something else, another problem you might have: Suppose your prayers aren't answered. What do you say? "Well, it's God's will." "Thy Will Be Done." Fine, but if it's God's will, and He's going to do what He wants to anyway, why the @!$%# bother praying in the first place? Seems like a big waste of time to me! Couldn't you just skip the praying part and go right to His Will? It's all very confusing.

So to get around a lot of this, I decided to worship the sun. But, as I said, I don't pray to the sun. You know who I pray to? Joe Pesci. Two reasons: First of all, I think he's a good actor, okay? To me, that counts. Second, he looks like a guy who can get things done. Joe Pesci doesn't @!$%# around. In fact, Joe Pesci came through on a couple of things that God was having trouble with.

For years I asked God to do something about my noisy neighbor with the barking dog, Joe Pesci straightened that @!$%# out with one visit. It's amazing what you can accomplish with a simple baseball bat.

So I've been praying to Joe for about a year now. And I noticed something. I noticed that all the prayers I used to offer to God, and all the prayers I now offer to Joe Pesci, are being answered at about the same 50% rate. Half the time I get what I want, half the time I don't. Same as God, 50-50. Same as the four-leaf clover and the horseshoe, the wishing well and the rabbit's foot, same as the Mojo Man, same as the Voodoo Lady who tells you your fortune by squeezing the goat's testicles, it's all the same: 50-50. So just pick your superstition, sit back, make a wish, and enjoy yourself.

And for those of you who look to The Bible for moral lessons and literary qualities, I might suggest a couple of other stories for you. You might want to look at the Three Little Pigs, that's a good one. Has a nice happy ending, I'm sure you'll like that. Then there's Little Red Riding Hood, although it does have that X-rated part where the Big Bad Wolf actually eats the grandmother. Which I didn't care for, by the way. And finally, I've always drawn a great deal of moral comfort from Humpty Dumpty. The part I like the best? "All the king's horses and all the king's men couldn't put Humpty Dumpty back together again." That's because there is no Humpty Dumpty, and there is no God. None, not one, no God, never was.

In fact, I'm gonna put it this way. If there is a God, may he strike this audience dead! See? Nothing happened. Nothing happened? Everybody's okay? All right, tell you what, I'll raise the stakes a little bit. If there is a God, may he strike me dead. See? Nothing happened, oh, wait, I've got a little cramp in my leg. And my balls hurt. Plus, I'm blind. I'm blind, oh, now I'm okay again, must have been Joe Pesci, huh? God Bless Joe Pesci. Thank you all very much. Joe Bless You!

Compliments of Mr. George Carlin. RIP

No actually the toothfairy is not eligible because he isn't a cardinal. He is well over 80 yrs of age. And he won't be present in the Sistine Chapel at the time of voting. Jeffor the Pope is 83 yrs old and the Nazi's came to power in 1936. so that means.... Do the math now stupid. The current Pope was 6 yrs old when Hitler came to power. Atheist I suggest you pick up a Catholic Missal for this week the first readings are Genesis preatty much all of Genesis. In a two year period the Catholic church reads the entire New Testament in it's weekday masses. It takes 3 years in the Sunday lectionary.

I didn't say he was a Nazi party member but a sympathizer. There's a difference.

Oh and, in case you missed it, you're beloved pope covered up for child rapist.

Atheist,

You are incorrect and that is no surprise. Yes, we do go through the entire Bible in 3 years. There are readings from it every day at the Mass; not just on Sunday.

Who are you to say we do not? You have no idea. Your arguments do not relate to the issue being discussed.

Without God, there is no good or evil. There is only opinions and none of them are binding on any one else.

You need to focus and think through your arguments before spewing. Your hatred is expected but not necessary.

NC-492358

You made a claim and provided no evidence for it. I called you out on it.

Show me the CYCLE (A,B,C) that preaches about condoning slavery, killing children for disobedience and women who must marry their rapists.

Without evidence it's a hollow claim. In fact it's something more. It's called Lying for the LORD.

Try to stay on topic and keep emotion out of your argument. We can talk about where morals come from if you like, but first please provide evidence for your claim.

.

.

Atheist,

Your understanding of the times the Bible was written is understandable.

A lie is only a lie if you know it is wrong and say it anyway.

The readings that mention slavery, etc. are in the daily Mass; not Sunday. The Bible does not condone slavery but makes mention of it since it existed during those times. It discusses the behavior of slaves and the actions of those over slaves.

A slave in the Bible (or in Greek, Roman, Islamic, or Egyptian history for that matter) is not the same as a slave in the Trans Atlantic Slave Trade. This new form of plantation slavery was unique in history in that it was based solely on race.

But what has that do do with the fact that we go through the entire Bible in 3 years with some overlap since the weekday Masses are only in 2 cycles for a two-year run through while the Gospels are in the A, B, C cycle pattern for three years to complete them all.

Maybe you need to know what you are talking about before you attack.

@TrustVerify

Best post I've seen in a long time. and I agree, those fcuking ice capades gotta go.

NC-492358,

We simply contradict one another. You made a claim and have yet to provide evidence, just belief. I made no mention of the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. God's Will is despicable enough!

"When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property." (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)

And in this verse, Jesus clearly approves the beating of slaves, even those who ARE NOT AWARE of their wrong doing:

"The servant will be severely punished, for though he knew his duty, he refused to do it. But people who are not aware that they are doing wrong will be punished only lightly. Much is required from those to whom much is given, and much more is required from those to whom much more is given." (Luke 12:47-48 NLT)

As I said, please consider that you have been brainwashed to overlook these evils. It's called lying for the LORD. Think for yourself and stop trying to defend slavery. And my finger is tapping on my table awaiting the evidence that your Church reads these verses during the Cycle.

The Pope has a pacemaker! What? Relying on science, progress and change?

The real question is why did the Vatican hide the fact that the Pope has a pacemaker?

Chris,

What changes did you have in mind?

NC- step #1- quit harrassing nuns for helping people as Jesus would. They have no obligation to push religion or politics on those they help.

inmissouri,

The Church rightfully tells them to quit tacitly approving of abortion and artificial birth control. The sisters have the obligation to follow the directions of their superiors or they can leave the order they are in or the whole Church.

I am in Missouri also in the Diocese of Kansas City-St. Joseph.

NC, if the Church does not believe in something, then the rest of us are still allowed to believe in, and support it. Christian morality is not absolute, so stop trying to force those morals on others.

Stop fostering an environment that harbors and protects criminals. (child molesters)

Voluntarily remove yourselves from 501.3C status since the church is participating in politics, and attempting to influence public schools.

That will do for starters..

from http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/19/us/vatican-reprimands-us-nuns-group.html?_r=0

Her group was also cited in the Vatican document, along with the Leadership Conference, for focusing its work too much on poverty and economic injustice, while keeping “silent” on abortion and same-sex marriage.

So instead of feeding the poor, they should be busy picketing courthouses? I'd have to say the nuns are better at following a 'WWJD' lifestyle.

Sure, they can leave the Church. But should that have been made an issue in the first place?

What changes did you have in mind?

I don't know. They could do something radical like making it a sin to rape little boys in the name of god.

Our image in the world is not what is important unlike Obama we don't serve you. Our boss will pick the next leader to serve Him not you as we serve Him not you.

Chris,

If you are a Catholic and the issue you speak of relates to God, no, it is not ok to still believe what you want to about God. Are you a practicing Catholic? If not, your opinion is irrelevant.

There is no environment any more that fosters child abuse. New measures have been put in place in every diocese in the world. Read something a bit more modern than 10 years ago.

The Church is able to use free speech as any other entity. Trying to stop it or the people is trying to take away our freedom of religion.

Anything else I can correct you on?

What makes you think we don't care? I am Catholic and I very much care and so do many others I know. However, part of our Christian teaching is about forgiveness and though it is hard to forgive a pedophile it is what we must do.

If you cared you would leave the catholic church and find another avenue for your worship.

Island: It is not the pedofiles who need forgiveness. They are psychologically damaged. It is the criminals in the Church who covered up the incidents and who, even worse, placed the same offenders back into our parishes over and over again. I am a conservative Catholic. I find it difficult to understand how our Church cow tows to the leading proponents of partial birth abortion in the world. I am just as astounded that Cardinals Law and Mahoney are not in prison. I want to know if the current Pope and the former Pope knew about the abuse and attempted to provide cover. If Penance as they preach it means anything, it means there must be a full confession, not a cover up.

Tom, How would IslandGypsy leaving her church in ANY way help the issue? And honestly how terribly rude of you to say that Catholics don't care about the children molested by a a few priests. After all, it was their children! By the way I am not and have never been Catholic but I certainly respect their views.

Tom,

Why do you say we do not care?

How hateful and how incorrect you are. There has been a great deal of effort into ensuring that this does not happen again or if it does, that it is dealt with in the appropriate manner.

Every organization that deals with children has this same problem. If you believe that they do not, they are fooling you or you are fooling yourself.

Who are you to say if we care we should leave? The Church is not to blame; people are. People sin. You do too.

Jatty,

How does the Church kow tow to those who back partial birth abortion?

@NC

Whatever, I've said my feelings about it.

Tom,

So, just as those in the Church have been wrong, you are wrong as well. Ok.

It is just good that your opinion does not count.

NC: Are you joking with me? Cardinal Dolan said a prayer with the DNC right after they adopted a plank in their party platform approving all abortions. The Kennedys, Biden, Pelosi, Sybellius, and other prominent so called "Roman Catholics" speak out daily in favor of abortion, receive Communion every Sunday, and are granted private audiences with the Pope. Yet, each and every Sunday, we are lectured about the sanctity of human life. 54% of Catholics voted for a strong proponent of not only abortion, but partial birth abortion, which is infanticide murder any way you slice it. In my opinion, the Catholic Church needs to be faithful to the teachings of Christ and not so politically correct. However, that includes doing the right thing morally on the abuse scandal. It is a sad day when a prosecutor in Boston has the moral high ground over the RC Church.

Jatty,

Prayer is always good.

No where has the Church done anything but condemn partial birth abortion and all abortion. Dolan did not sanction it then or at any time.

Those "Catholics" who back such abominations are not really practicing Catholics, are they? They may identify themselves as such but that does not make it so.

The Catholic Church is faithful to the teachings of Christ. In this situation, how has the Church been wrong?

Jesus lived and prayed with sinners.

Jatty, the Catholic Church has every right to impose its views on Catholics. The problem comes when it seeks to impose its tenets on the general public. That led to something called the Reformation.

Anyway, the point I wanted to make was that this whole resignation is rather odd. First we hear that the Pope is resigning because of ill health, which suggests that he is going to a hospital or nursing home. Then we are told he is retiring to a monastery, which usually calls for a very rigorous lifestyle.

Jesus admonished sinners. I would have been very content if the Pope had told Pelosi he would be happy to meet with her in order to hear her confession.

Cassandra: This discussion had to do with those who profess themselves Roman Catholic, but practice otherwise. They want the rights and benefits of Church membership, but want to pick and choose the rules they will follow. With respect to your point on the Reformation, I am an abject supporter of Martin Luther. He had many wonderful ideas for a Church which had gone off the track.

Cassandra, so a church that not everybody belongs to had no right to speak out against slavery, as many did? No right to speak out against racial discrimination as many did? Might you be one of those who believes the LIE that the Catholic Church did nothing to oppose Hitler? And are you one of those who would condemn the Catholic Church for that--lie though it might be?

The Catholic Church has a moral duty to speak out on the moral issues of the times.

Leading to the Reformation isn't the only time in history that some have responded to good with evil. And by the way, if you look at history honestly, some of those reformers could be even more brutal in imposing their beliefs than the Catholic Church is accused of being. The Reformation was never about freeing people to believe as they chose. It was about disgruntled malcontents imposing their own dissent on others.

Stephen: I concur, but sometimes I wonder why the Church seems to be so one-sided. An example, the Church speaks constantly of the needs of the illegal immigrants. They admonish the US for not providing better health care, education, and support. However, not once in the last 10 years have I heard the Church speak out against the government of Mexico for not providing heath care or a social safety net for their own people, and for actually encouraging them(as President Fox did) to cross our borders illegally. Mexico has one of the highest GDPs in the world, but also one of the highest poverty rates. Why isn't the Church asking how those two factors can co-exist?

Cassandra,

How does the Church try to impose its will on those who are not Catholic? Surely you do not mean by speaking out against things that are wrong. That is PRECISELY what a church should do.

So, you know the condition of the Pope and how those in a monastery live? Why do you try to make this resignation sound bad or suspicious? I think what he did was very courageous.

Tom, could you tell us, please, why you don't care about the children murdered in Connecticut?

Jatty, I'm afraid I'm way too uninformed about what the Catholic Church in Mexico is saying or doing even to gauge the accuracy of your premises, let alone respond to them. For all I know, they ARE doing just that. I'm not in a position to keep up with every issue everywhere. Until I know that your accusations are true, I don't want to try to address them. And with respect (because your own comment was respectful), it sounds a little like, well, I haven't heard of it, so it must not be happening.

@Stephen Kosciesza

You are a total idiot. What do the murdered kids in Connecticut have to do with this?

Tom if the Catholic Church has the fullness of the faith that I need to acheive heaven why would I leave for a church that only has part of the faith? What do you or your church have that is better? Show me. I have been to many but have not found the real Presence in any other church. All churches are made up of people not living saints. We are trying to be saints but acheiving that well it isn't always that easy. Are you a saint then? Can you show me your perfection that I should try to emulate? Well where do I sit at your feet and learn from you Mr Perfect? I will tell you what the murdered kids in Ct have to do with this. When you made Thou shall not kill a suggestion instead of a command you put all of us in danger. It is now thou shall not kill except when we say you can. But just because it is alright with you that people kill the pre-born and the newly born that survive your murder attempt. Others when you say don't kill the 6 yr old will look you in the eye and say why you are just a man you have no authority and they are right you are just a man. Now I know making lampshades out of people is not normal but when I was a child there was this guy named Ed he did just exactly that. You have taken down a wall that protected all of us and now it will be much harder to put it up again. We will have to make the law, strictly enforce the law and still not be safe until your whole generation dies out. Because it is a part of your thinking pattern so deeply engrained you don't even realize it.

Huh?

Any and all religion is made up hokey bullsh!t. There is absolutly no proof what so ever to your stupid beliefs. The only argument any of you ever have is "It says so in the bible and you can't prove that it's not true."

Well I can tell you that I built a time machine and went back in time and had tea with Mary Queen of Scotts, came back and destroyed the time machine. Just like your bible, there is no way that you can prove that story is not true, but we all know it is bullsh!t.

Brainwashed freak

Tom,

Almost the best argument I can show for there being God is all of creation. Something had to start it. It is not chaos. There is order in the universe and natural laws. What made this organization?

The BEST argument I can use that there is a Supreme Being is: in this great big amazing universe, how can we screwed-up human beings be at the top of the chain of intelligent life? There must be something "else". (You can't use aliens as probably being higher since you can't prove that they exist. I am just using your rules...)

@NC

I don't deny that there is something bigger than us. We are insignificant in the scheme of the entire universe.

What makes me so in your face about it all is that no one can possibly know what it is or can be yet they throw made up folklore stories in your face and call it "truth".

I don't slam just the christian religion I slam every single religion there is and because I call them on it I am labeled an athiest because I haven't been fooled by years of brainwashing starting at birth.

I am man enough to say that I don't know any of the answers and that would make me agnostic, not athiest, yet religious brainwashed Zealots of all religons think that theirs is the only way.

One thing I am sure of is that when we die we will know all the answers or we will know nothing and that is the most that anyone can say for sure.

Now just watch someone is going to spew something stupid at me now about how wrong I am and how right their beliefs are and I'll burn in hell.

jj,

How hateful. You seem awfully interested, though. Why?

NC: I am sad for those who hate that much. I wonder what they will say on their deathbed when their prospects appear somewhat bleak. I can tell you from experience that life travels fast. The years are gone before you are aware of it. The only thing you leave behind is your love for others and the works of kindness that you do.

Jatty,

I agree. We all make our decisions in life and then have to answer for them.

jj it seems someone of your ilk would be excited by that.

You guys really need new lines that Jewish couple from Brooklyn really trashed your nazi crap when the Church and the Jewish group asked them to look into it and gave them full access to all documents in Israel and the Vatican. BTW the Nazi's came to power in 1936 and the Pope is 83 yrs old. Now I know as victims of the NEA you will have trouble with the math so I'll help you. Take 83 subtract 13 to get back to 2000. That leaves 70 subtract 64 the number of years from 1936 to the end of the century. That means your dangerous nazi Joseph Ratzinger was 6 yrs old when Hitler came to power. I don't think they let him vote that year. You people are really too stupid for words.

Possibly he feels a younger and more vigorous Pope would better serve the needs of the Church faithful.

serenity,

We each must make our choices as we see them. I think what he is doing is great and very unselfish.

Peter and a few other Popes also handed on the papacy before they died. You should get Catholic history from Catholic sources these guys lie. If you want an example take the dust jacket to their favorite book the Nazi Pope and put it next to the original picture. It has been darkened, and cropped. So the car in the original is a 1920's model the nazi's came to power in 1936. The guy holding open the door and saluting is the chauffer for the ambassador which is what Cardinal Paceli was at the time. And the other guy in the background is a soldier of the Wiemar Republic. The people in power in Germany at the time. The coal scuttle helmet was in use in Germany from pre-world war I all the way through the second world war. You people are pathetic.

If they elect a pope that tries to push us backwards, they'll be losing a lot of parishioners. They'll keep the core traditionalists, but that won't be enough to support most parishes. Catholicism will dwindle down to a niche religion outside of third world countries. We need someone who can move with the times and engage the younger generations.

I agree. But the last decision they made was to go from a more moderate Pope to one who was more conservative. I feel they have a great fear of change - it's built into the religion. Tradition is very important for the upper echelons of the Catholic faith. I really will be surprised if they elect someone who is more moderate and willing to allow change within the religion. I also will be somewhat surprised if they elect a non-European as Pope since it has NEVER been done. If they do, it will likely be a Cardinal from South America where Catholicism has a greater hold within the populace.

Almost the entire College of Cardinals was appointed by JP II or Benedict. The successor will be a conservative.

Right, of course, Inmissouri! When people turned around and walked away from Jesus because they found his message too difficult, how many times did he run after them and say, "Wait! You're not comfortable with that bit? Let me change if for you!"?

Funny, I can't find any of those moments in the Gospels.

Many of the teachings are hard with which to live. Moreover, the reason Christ was crucified is because he had the gall to criticise his own religion. Apparently, religion and spitituality do not always intersect.

Stephen, the PURPOSE of Christ's teachings was to CHANGE the Jewish religion - the one in which Christ was raised, the one in which Christ was a TEACHER (which is what Rabbi means), the one that Christ intended his word for - not the Gentiles. The Gospels are FULL of Christ changing bits of HIS religion. He was a JEW. He went to temple all of his life. He kept kosher and followed the High Holy Days of the Jewish religion. He did not intend a brand new religion to be created, he just wanted to change the one he knew.

Stephen- Jesus' message was to love others, help them, and not judge them. Most of the rest is tradition rather than anything from the bible.

For example- birth control is banned. I can agree with being against abortion (although it needs to stay legal), but preventing conception is often taking responsibility for your family, caring for how many kids you can afford with the resources you have. If the complaint is that you're preventing God from giving you the kids he wants you to have, there's always a failure rate.

inmissouri,

I disagree. The Church has faced much worse than this before and after almost 2000 years, it is the largest single religion in the world.

Truth and right do not change over time. If the Church abdons them, then it would die out. Not going to happen.

All the voting members of the college of Cardinals have been elevated to cardinal by either John Paul II or Benedict XVI. They are also the only people eligible to be elected. Whoever gets elected will not depart from their path. Are you all ready for Cardinal Dolan maybe? Or the Patriarch of the Marionite Church? But the 6 they listed are 5 conservatives and one not quite so conservative. These are the front runners. Playing who's who is going to be fun simply because it will upset the people on here so much. Jesus as God had no religion and his message he said himself wasn't meant only for the Jews. Jesus as God is outside of and beyond all of our understanding and pigeonholing. If you think you understand God drop it you haven't got it right yet.

I tend to agree, but I do not care who it is. We have to rely and accept the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

So far as front runners are one American Dolan. One Canadian. one African one Brazillian and 3 from Europe.

Pam...

Your Church didn't appear to be all that tolerant in it's view of the Luthern pastor that had the audacity to pray with other faiths up at NewTown Connecticut at the Sandy Hook School. Go fix your own Church before commenting on others choice of worship.

I see why you are still a Lutheran.

Pam you are dreaming of a leader but you haven't even looked at who is eligible. Pam I ask you take out your Bible. The Incarnation of Jesus Christ; when did it occur in Luke 1:38 when Mary proclaimed her fiat to the angel and the Holy Spirit overshadowed her. Or was it in Luke 2:7 when Christ was born in Bethelem and if you say Luke 2 then explain to me Luke 1:41-43. This is one reason the Catholic Church cannot accept abortion or contraception. It would threaten the doctrine of Christ's Incarnation. Solo scriptura folks have fun figuring that out.

He nor the Church ever said the Pope was God on earth.

Youre not a very spiritual person are you Steve? Outside of meetings, trips, many masses a day that he either attends or acts in (because he does have "normal priest duties") in some capacity- and I live down the block so I can safely promise that there is always something going on at the Vatican... he feels (or is there because he has) the spiritual weight of the world on his shoulders- that ages a person- exhausts them even...

Just look at the difference 4 years made for Obama (not a fan myself but thats fine- he got much older "leading the free world").

Plus with Benedict and JPII before him, we're seeing an unprecedented time for the Papacy because people don't die at 50/60 the way they did not so long ago...Longevity is a huge issue in the world today- read any study on life insurance...

Not to say during this time he wrote and published 3 encyclicals and 3 best selling books on Jesus of Nazareth. He took 24 trips outside the Vatican including one to Lebanon where most of us were praying mightily since there had been some rise in violence and at 83 duck and cover is not part of the vocabulary.

Married priests could happen. That change is up to the Pope.

Women priests? Not likely. Women were definitely among His disciples but were not one of His Apostles and were never given the great commission of going out to teach all nations.

Still, it is up to the Pope. You never know what might happen.

Women in the position of power within the Church?

Are you kidding me? They (the Good Ole' Boy's Club) would never let that happen....besides, women's sole duty in this world is to bear children, serve God and her husband, and generally shut up.

NC really you must keep up JP II said he did not have the authority as Pope to change the sacrament of Holy Orders in any core part as Christ established it. The prefect of the Congregation of the Doctrine and Faith declared that an infallible statement. Therefore Holy Orders will always until Christ returns be an unmarried male. Even married deacons after the death of their wife may not marry. In the Eastern Church they will ordain married deacons but they also cannot marry again if their wives die nor can a married man be elevated to bishop. All this by the way is in the catechism which Benedict has asked all of us to read. Benedict has followed God's will all his life How do you know God didn't tell him something like. "Good job, son now rest. I need to put this other guy with these special skills I gave him in here back him up with your prayers OK kid."

lonerb,

You must not be a Catholic or are just not aware of certain things.

John Paul II said "HE" did not have the authority; he believed that the subject of women in the priesthood was settled. His comment does NOT bind another Pope. Popes so far seem to agree with this practice. Jesus had no women as Apostles, and that is why the Church determined that there would be no women priests.

There has been no "ex cathedra" statement by any Pope ever on the subject of women's ordination. Therefore, by definition, that opinion is not "infallible". By the way, The current Pope was the head of the Congregation that you mentioned when JP II was Pope.

In the eastern rite, priests can marry; bishops cannot.

Your comment on deacons apples to the western or Latin rite as concerns remarriage after a wife dies.

I think Benedict was a fine Pope.

Your summary about women and the priesthood is incorrect.

billy,

If you do not believe, why worry about it then?

You do have a nasty little mind, however. Maybe you should get that checked out.

Why would he want to be Pope? He's already worshiped as God. He even worships himself!

Can't you leave politics to political stories and conversations? This is a conversation about the Pope and his decision to step down. American politics have no business in this conversation. Especially disparaging the sitting President. It shows a level of hate that is alarming and may even be pathological.

Simply Stephen, because he wants the Title of: "Pope Hope Dope the First"

Cat

First tell President Hope Dope to keep his stinking "Obummer Care" of forced contraception distribution and forced abortion procedures out of MY Catholic Hospitals...

Oh, PLEASE. Really. Do some more investigating away from Conservative conspiracy "news" and blogs. The parts of the church that actually ARE parts of the church are EXEMPT from the contraceptive coverage requirement. They ALWAYS have been. Businesses that are owned by religious people but are not part of the CHURCH are not exempt. There is a HUGE difference. There goes THAT argument out the window. The "forced abortion procedures" are a figment of someone's imagination since nobody wants to force anybody else to actually get an abortion. There IS a "conscience clause", you know; nobody is going to force a physician to perform a procedure that he doesn't agree with. That's just SILLY and INSANE.

But I really don't understand a religion that places more importance on a developing embryo or fetus than the WOMAN who carries it. I would think that they would both be considered "lives" under your religion and Jesus himself said that sometimes difficult decisions must be made.

Cat why not your are disparaging my leader? Why can't I blaspheme your god the annointed one Obama? I don't see Obama as being willing to step down to Pope from god of the idiotic and deranged. Cat as it stands right now the pastor of my church doesn't have to give his secretary abortion coverage but if we had a school in the CCD building run by the same pastor he would have to give abortion coverage to them. I as a Catholic am the integeral part of the Church and I am not exempt. The Church is not a building on the corner of Powers and Bowie. The Church is the People of God.

lonerb,

Agreed.

loner, if your employees are of a different religion, they are not a part of "The People of God" whom you are arguing is the church, right? Therefore you do not have the right to IMPOSE your religion on them. I don't know how schools are impacted by the coverage mandate, but I'm pretty sure that if the CHURCH runs the school and it is primarily for children of the church that they may very well be exempt.

Now, if you own a BUSINESS that is supposed to make a PROFIT - you better damned well believe your BUSINESS is not exempt.

Then again, I am of the firm belief that in this day and age ALL churches should be TAXED on their income and property. Especially if the church wants to ignore the IRS stricture against the CHURCH meddling in POLITICS. Sorry - either you administer to the souls of your people and ONLY meddle in the souls or you venture out into SECULAR society and pay the piper. Even Christ said to "Render unto Caesar's what is Caesar's" in terms of paying taxes.

Gabe: We don't mind. Our Church has made its share of mistakes over the past 2,000 years. However, that does not undermine the good that it has done as well.

Jatty. Yes, it does undermine the good.

gabe23

It's because this article is about catholics.

Go to an article about stupid islamic stuff and you will see that they are thought of a fools in the comments also

you ought to take the first bus you can.... to see your psychiatrist!

Well, you do have to be Catho9lic to be Pope. Also you have to be a single male.

No not a black POPE, I'm not black, but you can't tell me possibly 50%of the people who dislike our president, dislike him because he is black. I live in the South and I hear people call him NIG**** all the time. People are stupid and they can not get past the color. But then again the Catholics that cannot get past a black POPE might?

Boy are they in for a shock when they get to HEAVEN, JESUS was born in the MIDDLE EAST.
WHAT WILL YOU DO IF WHEN YOU DIE YOU FIND OUT GOD IS BLACK!

It is a political appointment, pure and simple.

If the Cardinals thought that appointing a sock monkey to be the next Pope would help the Church's bottom line, they'd do it.

Jet, And you are still wrong. He is elected by his peers. There for sure is "politics" behind the scene but not of the type you suggest.

The Catholic Church gives away more to help people than does any other entity in the world.

Proof please.

Contrary to popular belief, Cardinal Ratzinger did not cover up child sexual abuse. That belief is based on a document called "De delictis gravioribus", written on May 18, 2001, by Ratzinger to all bishops. Ratzinger only received the authority to deal with sexual abuse of minors in - you guessed it - 2001. Prior to that, things were very decentralized, which is why the abuse crisis has hit certain dioceses and not others. Some dioceses had decent men as bishops, while some had child rapist enablers. But anyway, instead of believing everything I hear, I read this document myself, in both the original Latin and the English translation. It concerns internal Church investigations, and it subjects these ecclesiastical trials to something known as the "secretum pontificium". I've also researched the secretum pontificium, and it means that the trials themselves must be conducted in an atmosphere of confidentiality for the sake of the privacy and mental well-being (given the circumstances) of the underage victim. However, the priest's act of molestation itself is not subject to the secretum pontificium. That is the crucial distinction that many people don't seem to get. When Ratzinger took control, he in fact encouraged victims and bishops to report the abuse to civil authorities and cooperate with civil authorities. He didn't say that ten years later, he said it back then. That's why the Charter for the Protection of Children and Young People, promulgated by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops in 2002, received approval from the Vatican even while De Delictis Gravioribus remained in effect.

And then, even given that people believe Ratzinger encouraged a cover-up with his 2001 letter, some people assume that he was responsible for the sex abuse issue during his whole time as Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, from 1981 to 2005. Many of the cover-ups happened after 1981, but not after 2001; so if Ratzinger was instructing bishops on how to handle this before 2001, he would be complicit in the cover-ups. But this issue was only added to his portfolio in 2001.

Furthermore, De Delictis Gravioribus also demands that bishops penalize molesters. That's not what the enabling bishops did when they shuffled abusive priests to other parishes. It's also important to understand that this has to do with internal Church sanctions, as I noted earlier. The document has nothing to do with cooperating with civil authorities; to say that Ratzinger encouraged bishops to not report abuse to the civil authorities is to simply make a categorical error.

In short, this is a very sensitive issue and the laws are complicated, so throwing around unfounded accusations won't get us anywhere and won't ultimately help prevent further child abuse. Before Ratzinger received control of this crisis in 2001, the cover-up was the result of a culture that was prevalent among many bishops, rather than of any particular instruction from the Vatican. That's why many good bishops did report abuse to the authorities, and that was perfectly fine with the Vatican. Many bishops and cardinals (Bernard Law, Sean Brady, Roger Mahony, possibly Angelo Sodano, etc.) are guilty of covering up abuse; ultimately, Joseph Ratzinger is not one of them. In fact, he's done probably more than anyone to prosecute molesters and end the culture of cover-ups. I understand the need to give victims a sense of closure by bringing perpetrators to justice, but it doesn't make sense to ruin an innocent man's reputation. Two wrongs don't make a right.

No, he did not. An African official did that. Any proof of your claim?