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Subscribe to RSSAfter distancing himself from the traditional pomp and privilege of his new title, Pope Francis – known for his sincerity and frugality – has shown every indication that he plans to remain an educator and a pastor in addition to all of his other responsibilities. NBC's Anne Thompson reports.
The Mercedes popemobile. The 10-room penthouse apartment. The Swiss Guards.
The worldly trappings of the papacy will be a big adjustment for a former prince of the church who tried to live like a pauper.
© Reuters Photographer / Reuters / REUTERS
Pope Francis was known for his common touch when he was cardinal of Argentina.
Before he was Pope Francis, Argentinian archbishop Jorge Bergoglio was known for shunning the perks of the job -- the palace, the chauffeur, the red vestments -- for a simpler life befitting a Jesuit priest.
Now that he's leader of the world's 1.2 billion Roman Catholics, the man who took a vow of poverty at age 22 will have to get off the bus and get used to having a butler.
Or maybe it's the Vatican that's in for a change. Within minutes of being named pontiff, the new boss was already putting a stamp of simplicity on papal life.
He did not sit on the papal throne to receive the cardinals, he didn't don a red cloak over his white cassock, and he declined to take an official car back to the hotel, opting to take the bus with the rest of the group, a Vatican spokesman said Thursday.
In Buenos Aires, Bergoglio walked to his office and often used buses -- likened by one travel writer to "old men in a bar – loud, smoky, rough around the edges" -- to get around town.
Osservatore Romano / Reuters file
He used to take the bus, but this is Pope Francis' new ride.
He's unlikely to have that lack of luxury as pope, if only for security reasons. His main ride will be the white armored Mercedes SUV with an elevated glass enclosure, known to the world as the popemobile. The interior is white leather with gold trim.
For longer jaunts across Italy he has the option of a helicopter, staffed by pilots from the Italian Air Force. Commercial jets are chartered for flights around the world, and the pope sits up front.
His new digs will be first-class, too.
As a cardinal, Bergoglio was entitled to live in an opulent mansion but chose to bed down in a spartan downtown apartment, keeping warm with a stove when the building turned off the heat on weekends, according to The Associated Press.
Soon he'll move to a sprawling wrap-around suite on the top floor of the Apostolic Palace that 200 workers spent three months renovating in 2005.
There's a private chapel, a medical office, a library large enough to hold Pope Benedict XVI's 20,000 books, a state-of-the-art German kitchen with onyx counters, and the office from which he blesses the crowd in St. Peter's on Sundays.
A lavish home fit for a pope
The floors are 16th century inlaid marble polished to a gleam. The loggia that leads to the apartment is covered in historic frescoes. There's access to a rooftop garden, and the attic has small apartments for guests and staff.
The household retinue includes a butler, a couple of secretaries, and women from a lay association known as Memores Domini who cook and clean.
That will seem like a crowd to Pope Francis, who lived alone in Argentina and spent every morning sitting next to his landline phone, personally taking calls from parish priests and recording their complaints and requests in a small notebook, a former aide told NBC Latino.
Luciano Thieberger / AP file
No fancy wines for Pope Francis. He prefers "mate," a traditional South American beverage.
Bergoglio also cooked for himself, and his favorite meal might horrify the average Italian: skinless chicken and salad. He does enjoy a glass of wine -- or a shot of espresso while in Rome -- but usually settles down with a spot of Argentinian tea called mate.
At the Vatican, typical meals might include pasta with salmon and zucchini or rigatoni with prosciutto, prepared on a marble table with vegetables imported from the papal vacation home, Castel Gandolfo. Rich desserts like strudel or tiramisu were on the menu under Benedict's watch.
If he packs on a few pounds, no worries: A major wardrobe change is also in the offing.
While some cardinals seem to love cloaking themselves in the crimson robes that advertise their rarefied status, Bergoglio covered up with a black overcoat. The Argentinian newspaper La Nacion reported that he didn't order new clothes when he was elevated; he had the previous cardinal's hand-me-downs tailored to fit him.
Osservatore Romano / Reuters
As a cardinal, he covered up his telltale red vestments with a plain black overcoat. Pope Francis will now wear white and be outfitted by tailor Gammarelli's.
After Pope Francis was elected on Wednesday evening, the papal tailor Gammarelli's would have offered him a burgundy mozzetta, a short cape either in red velvet trimmed in white fur or in silk brocade to wear over his cassock. He demurred, and no one will be shocked if he decides against the red leather slippers that became Benedict's trademark.
Even though he was his country's top church official, Bergoglio rarely interacted with the press, preferring to make his points from the pulpit. Soon he'll have reporters from around the world scrutinizing his every word and gesture.
Father Jorge, as he was called at home, will be known as His Holiness. But those close to him expect the railway worker's son will cling to some of the pared-down aspects of his former existence.
"This routine is his life's backbone," Father Guillermo Marcó, who worked for him for eight years, told NBC Latino. "And he will try to keep it in place as much as possible."
At a papal briefing, the Vatican offered details about what happened inside the Sistine Chapel and afterwards following the election of Cardinal Jorge Mario Bergoglio of Argentina as the next pope.
Related:
The pope's to-do list: 7 challenges facing Francis
Pope likely to back status quo on gays, abortion
Full coverage of Pope Francis on NBC News
Leave a Comment:
Has anybody here seen a dog dyed dark green?
Hello folks, this mortal man who is just another human has a checkered past.
Don't let anyone kid you the Vatican is worth at a minimum hundreds of billions of dollars. The new Pope Moe Lester in charge will live in the lavish gold encrusted opulence that is the Vatican.
"Former Cardinal and Pope-elect “Francis I”, Jorge Mario Bergoglio, is accused of helping kidnap opponents of Argentina’s military junta during the 1970′s “Dirty War”, and of baby trafficking, by lawyers and members of the Plaza de Mayo human rights group. (Los Angeles Times, April 17, 2005, “Argentine Cardinal Named in Kidnapping Lawsuit”,http://articles.latimes.com/2005/apr/17/world/fg-cardinal17
"General Jorge Rafael Videla and some of his military and police cohorts were convicted by their country’s courts of the murder of 31 people between April and October 1976, a small fraction of the killings they were responsible for. What one did not hear from any senior member of the Argentine hierarchy was any expression of regret for the church’s collaboration and in these crimes. The extent of the church’s complicity in the dark deeds was excellently set out by Horacio Verbitsky, one of Argentina’s most notable journalists, in his book El Silencio (Silence). He recounts how the Argentine navy with the connivance of Cardinal Jorge Bergoglio, now the Jesuit archbishop of Buenos Aires, hid from a visiting delegation of the Inter-American Human Rights Commission the dictatorship’s political prisoners. Bergoglio was hiding them in nothing less than his holiday home in an island called El Silencio in the River Plate. The most shaming thing for the church is that in such circumstances Bergoglio’s name was allowed to go forward in the ballot to chose the successor of John Paul II. What scandal would not have ensued if the first pope ever to be elected from the continent of America had been revealed as an accessory to murder and false imprisonment."
Just in from Reuters, the pope is going to be subletting the papal apartment to tourists visiting rome. No smoking and enforced celibacy. You get three get-out-of purgatory cards per rental. As a special privilege for really humble guests, he will let you take the pope-mobile out for sightseeing tours. Be warned, He personally checks the mileage at checkout and back in. For a bit extra, you can sit on the pope's personal porcelain throne.
@Jen...Did you write that one all by yourself?...As for the Popes personal throne..How would you know?...Unless of course, you licked the rim clean..
Cannot believe the selection of a new church leader garners as much world media coverage as 9/11.
While Pope Francis may be a good and righteous man, it is still the Catholic church which is still governed by mid-evil times mythology that promotes discrimination and persecution of women, gays and non-like believers. It is still a sanctuary for pedophiles who are protected from prosecution by church hierarchy. Nuf said.
the gangs of liars building up on full force to practice the opposite of THOU SHALT NOT BEAR FALSE WITNESS AGAINST THY NEIGHBOR, one of GOD's TEN COMMANDMENTS.
Gangster liars, spread all of your authentic evidences first, before these repetitious exposures of yourselves, lying in your teeth strategies, using the mighty PC.
Pope Francis is just doing what he was brain washed to do by thousands of years of sinful acts in the church.
TO: Ellis Baumgarner. The coverage of the election of this pope is nothing compared to the coverage of 9/11. Have you such a short memory? Perhaps you were too young then to make a resonable comparison to the coverage now. When 9/11 occurred, there was NO coverage of anything else for days. NOTHING ELSE!!!! With the election of the pope, I have still heard that North Korea had shredded the armistice, that there were bombings in Iraq, and the burning of Christian homes in Pakistan. There was coverage of local robberies, crashes, budget shortfalls. The election of a Pope is of great interest to over 1 billion Catholics. That alone is enough to warrant significant attention. If it is truely of NO interest to you, don't read and comment about it. To paraphrase the old bard, methinks you protest too much!
just like these non roman catholics, anti roman catholic pope are being sent to the laundry for good washing.
tinbashr -------- your a troll
debbie,
And the the news of the Popes selection has not been front and center for nearly two weeks and counting?? What other religious leader gets one thousandth the coverage?
Furthermore, I am nearing 3/4 of a century upon this Earth, how about you, if you are not too fickle to state your age?
why do I care? most christiams I know are not Catholic, I do not think this is news!
most Americans are not English, but they follow the Royal family due to our countries heritage. All Christians can trace there heritage back to Paul and the beginning of Catholicisn.
TrustVerify... How about you live up to your name (Find the actual Truth and Verify it) before you start baselessly slandering...
You base your entire judgment on some column written by a likely anti-Catholic journalist who had their column published by an anti-Catholic paper.... I wonder how biased and baseless those words might be?
Also, as I alluded to above, do your research (Not Reuters, LA Times, or Wikipedia). You clearly know virtually nothing about Argentina's history, specifically about what was truly going on during the so-called "Dirty War."
I will give you a few hints and then I recommend doing some viable research:
(1) Figure out where and from whom these accusations originated (actually be understand who they were and what they were trying to do)
(2) Logically deduce their motives for accusing Jorge and targeting Catholic leaders (which they did persecute).
(3) Ask yourself this question: Why might a consistently ethical, selfless, and compassionate man such as Francis I "kidnap" victims of the Junta and apparently "traffic" babies?
Wait! I know the exact answer (lucky you). He was protecting them from a violent, abusive, and powerful organization which had no respect for children and/or their perceived opposition.
Fact: The Argentinian Junta did steal babies to indoctrinate, exploit, and even kill.
Fact: Argentinian Catholic Leaders (such as Francis I) were persecuted and many were even killed.
Fact: No one did more than the Catholic Church to oppose the crimes committed in Argentina.
Until I see valid research (which I won't because I have researched this very historical issue), I wont be swayed.
Be mature, have some morals, have courage, respect life, and accept nothing less than the truth.
Have a wonderful day.
Rah,
15min5k
This attitude should give the others pause to remember the humble lifestyle that Jesus led. "Hmmm, maybe we've been doing it all wrong..."
Only in something as hypocritical as religion could a person who took a vow of
"Poverty, chastity and obedience" have to deal with a sex scandal wearing millions of dollars of jewelry from a marble laden apartment.
St Francis was an environmentalist 8 centuries ago.
-St Francis of Assisi
I hope the new Pope's way's will rub off on the Vatican.
Oh, I'm pretty sure something will get rubbed off in the Vatican.
Some things never change. Here's the new boss same as the old boss!
Pope Moe Lester the XVII.
What other organization can continue to operate after it is caught raping children over and over again. WalMart couldn't continue to sell rakes if they did the same thing. What are they going to say, sorry folks we had a little problem in aisle 3 in the children's half pants off sale but everything is OK now! They would be shut down in a heart beat!
TrustVerify.....your Pope Moe Lester the XVII is getting boring. You are not even remotely close to being as clever as you think you are.
Second that.
3rd that
One time its funny, second times its silly, and third time you need a good slap
corky ------ i think you just put your foot in your mouth ha ha hah
Nothing like eschewing worldly pleasures.
can a pope be impeached ?
I pray for Pope Francis, that he will continue to stand in humilty, against all that has been wrong with the papacy and hierarchy and shine the light on what the church should really be about, the teachings of Christ and humility. I look forward to it. May God Bless him.
Well said. I join you in that prayer...
jenan
Agreed! I am right behind you.
that's what my priest said
Nothing will change, Pedophile priests have molested innocent children in the Roman Catholic Church probably since the beginning of the church. These pedophiles have been protected and their horrendous crimes against children have gone unpunished. It is amazing to me that there are over a billion Catholics. I guess acceptance of pedophilia in the church is the cost of salvation!
Trustverify you post everytime the same thing, question for you, why so angry? Did a priest molest you or was it the rejection?
Hello Joe, when I witness crimes against humanity on the scale that the church has been allowed to get away with, I feel a duty to stand up for the innocent children who have been victimized by an organization that their parents entrusted these children to. These innocent children have no voice and have done nothing to no one. I am their voice. The wealthy Vatican pays settlements to victims, moves the priests to other unsuspecting communities and the pedophilia attacks get a new zip code. This rinse and repeat criminality within the church must and will stop.
In Europe a pedophile syndicate that is embroiling the monarchy, prime ministers, members of parliament and members of the affluent is coming to light in an investigation of the Elm Guest house.
If you give two sh!ts about these children, you would be advocating against the church as well.
If you want to see the scope of the church's crimes against humanity and this site only covers pedophilia settlements in the US alone there are many sites you can research.
If you go to (http://www.bishop-accountability.org/settlements/) you can see the vast and I mean vast numbers of pedophilia settlements the church has paid out (US only).
I am not Catholic, but I respect religion and the leaders of churches. I pray God will give him strength and guidance.
TrustVerify is correct...
Look at the Steubenville rape case that is currently going on. The amount of headlines and coverage is huge. Now look at the tens of thousands of known sexual abuse cases involving the catholic church. By comparison the quantity of news about the depravity of the catholic church should be overflowing in the media. The catholic church uses every legal trick to keep any transparency from getting to the public. And now we are insulted by seeing this new pope washing a woman's feet. Straight from the bible. The bible says that Jesus ran the 'money changers' out of the temple because of the lack of respect for the house of god (in so many words). I wonder what he'd do today with the catholic church. Don't give me the 'he'd forgive them' bull@!$%# line. He didn't seem too forgiving of the money changers. And this appears to be a much larger problem. I just don't understand why the people of the catholic church don't grow a pair and do the Jesus thing. I read these sick comments about people praying for this and that while a veritable sexual circus aimed at innocent children is still going on and being covered up by the church. I am sure your prayers are a great comfort to the next innocent victim of this morally bankrupt organization.
Joe,
Why aren't you angry at centuries of child rape being condoned, covered-up, and rationalized by followers.
People with morals and values are way more disturbed by your lack of anger than by Trust's anger.
@corona...Centuries? I'm not even Catholic and I question your broad sweeping statements. Why don;t you stick with what has been documented, it is sad enough. I'll be honest I had the same reaction about Trust's comment. He is really angry. Either that or he is a paid blogger.
Trust
God can see you trolling!
the lefty liberal medias are the traders of christian bashings, sadistic, meant to degrade the roman catholic church in particular, malicious bullseye targeting the roman catholic religion to feed their egocentricities at all cost. the viewers/listeners of the lefties were sent to the cleaners are the roller trollers having a ball.
If truth were told, the Catholic church is the longest standing tyrannic establishment since man has been upon Earth. The Catholic church's history is filled with tyranny, persecution, war, maiming and rape of innocence, why people still fund and support this mid-evil times culture is beyond rationale.
And I am not an atheist, just anti-man create political establishments that command obedience for fear of the otherwise.
Jessie,
Yes CENTURIES. There are documented stories of priestly abuses of young boys and girls found in almost every century since the church's inception.
Centuries of abuse is an accurate statement.
How can anyone in this day in age, with all the technology and things that have been disproven over the past 100 + years, respect religion.
It is a crutch for the weak and for those who can't seem to believe in themselves or anything that is actually real and tangible. Instead they have been brainwashed into believing and having faith in so far as that there is an all powerful and unseen being that will help pull them through everything in life. THEY ACTUALLY BELIEVE in archaic practices, wizards, gods and monsters. These are the same people who think you are nuts for believing in UFO's, bigfoot, Zeus, Mercury and other such legends... but when it comes to a water walking zombie and his father, it is perfectly sane.
cultist religions have come and go, but the roman catholic church survived. these non roman catholics have a lot of nerve to weigh in with their lies on the roman catholic religion they know nothing, but got their bits and pieces of distorted infos from the lefty medias whose goal is to push their liberal immoral values to the throat of the faithful/believers of the roman catholic religion. why don't they try pushing their lefty ideologues to the muslim religion, and see where they will be pushed back to a ground six feet under.
WASHINGTON (CNS) -- About 4 percent of U.S. priests ministering from 1950 to 2002 were accused of sex abuse with a minor, according to the first comprehensive national study of the issue.
The study said that 4,392 clergymen—almost all priests—were accused of abusing 10,667 people, with 75 percent of the incidents taking place between 1960 and 1984.The number of permanent deacons accused was 41, about one-quarter of 1 percent of the permanent deacons ordained during the period. The number is so small that the survey includes the figure in the overall total for priests.
Just one victim is to many but Im sure Pope Francis will do better then the popes of the past. Also want to point out abuse victim numbers are way higher in our public school system the the Catholic Church
Charol Shakeshaft, the Hofstra University scholar who prepared the report,
said the number of abuse cases—which range from unwanted sexual comments to
rape—could be much higher.
"So we think the Catholic Church has a problem?" she told industry newspaper
Education Week in a March 10 interview.
To support her contention, Shakeshaft compared the priest abuse data with
data collected in a national survey for the American Association of University
Women Educational Foundation in 2000. Extrapolating data from the latter, she
estimated roughly 290,000 students experienced some sort of physical sexual
abuse by a school employee from a single decade—1991-2000. That compares with
about five decades of cases of abusive priests.
Such figures led her to contend "the physical sexual abuse of students in
schools is likely more than 100 times the abuse by priests."
Hello @Torn,
A study done by The National Center on Child Abuse and Neglect found that even though only 25% of citizens in the U.S. are Roman Catholic, 54% of the sexual abuse cases were perpetrated by Catholic priests. The church has paid at least 2.6 billion to settle sexual abuse cases. In 2007 alone the Los Angeles Archdiocese on July 15 announced the largest church settlement of sexual abuse lawsuits to date, agreeing to pay more than 500 alleged victims a total of $660 million. The abuse continues and the wealthy Vatican is easily able to cover these claims. The Vatican even has insurance policies to cover these operating costs.
At the enclosed website you can see who, when, where, the amount paid by the church and the amount covered by Insurance. Can you believe that, the church has insurance for pedophilia?
(http://www.bishop-accountability.org/settlements/)
Trustverify thanx for the site info, but my point is our government school system is full of pedophiles, at a much larger scale, i read about a new case every few days. Just think for the kids sake there should be outrage there too.
Not a Catholic but I pray for Pope Francis. May he provide humble leadership with strength and the Lord's guidance.
I am a Catholic and sure do appreciate your kind words. Too bad there were not more people like you on this Earth
To me, the Catholic Church has stood for a long time for hypocritic excess and waste, and the Vatican has very much seemed to be disconnected from the common people that make up the vast majority of the world's Catholics. It is refreshing to see someone more connected to the Catholic worshippers than the fancy fat-cat cardinals that have shamed the church in the news lately. Although I am not a Catholic, or even a religious person, the Catholic Church holds a recognizable position of power in the world. This new Pope gives me some hope that the Vatican might start looking outward to see how it can make the world a better place, instead of scrambling to hide the dirt and excesses of its recent past.
I'm not Catholic either but I rather like this man's simple approach to his new role so far. Though I admit I am saddened with his views on homosexuality.
Jessie, I agree. And as a Catholic, I do wish the church would open up discussions regarding same sex marriage.
But, it would be nice had he had a bit more backbone to stand up to the military dictatorship. He is more willing to take on the democratically elected President when he disagrees with her views on same sex marriage (perhaps because she IS a she?); but, when the junta was "disappearing" thousands of people, not so much! He opposes same sex couples being able to adopt children; but, I am finding no such stance taken when the stolen babies of the disappeared were adopted by the murderous military "durante la dictadura."
If he wanted to remain in his simple lifestyle, he wouldn't live in his new quarters. Instead, he'd live in a little shack somewhere.
Unless he's a hypocrite.
hypocrite knows it takes one to know one.
IMHO the Catholic Church is going to have to sell a lot of is jewels, gold, artwork, et al in order to be able to pay legal settlements.
the integral; nope, as Pope he is also head of the "Banco Esperito Santo" one of the worlds most powerful banks, unlike our federal reserve, they invest in Precious metals, fine art, factory's, food production(over 50-% of all pasta made in Europe is investments from the bank, the holdings are estimated at over 2 trillion dollars.
see if you can find out who owns our federal reserve bank
Whoa!!......zing!!
Hooker heels takes a shot at the Jews! A true catholic if there ever was one.
atheist crown now is the time to repent, while you are still on earth
Corona, I wasn't even talking to you so kindly take your assumptions elsewhere. God Bless you!
I'm not catholic, but I do pray for Pope Francis. We can all learn to be more humble.
Know what makes me humble? Our troops who risk their lives for me and the USA. That...is humbling. Not some Catholic ritual or any other religions either. Sex abuse is not something to be proud of yet it is status quo with the new Pope dude from what I read and hear.
I respect our troops, but they are not risking their lives for our freedom. Bush and Cheney sent them over there to risk their lives for Oil interests and as an excuse to produce mass weapons for Cheney's weapons production financiers and mercanary armies for proffit. Just the facts. Its a disgrace and treasonous that our troops were put in harms way for this while the real terrorist went off scott free for eight years until Obama actually got him.
As far as the Church goes, yes it is horrible that the sex abuse was covered up. But there are 1 billion Catholics across the world who have a true faith in Jesus Christ who have nothing to do with this. By your logic you should renounce your American citizenship for the corrupt things our country does every day. Don't throw out the baby with the bath water. The religious folks in charge during Christ's times were corrupt then too, it didn't make him give up his fait has a Jew or refrain from dying for all of our sins. I mean this truly and not condescendingly, God bless you, and I pray the peace of Christ which surpasses all thing s will be in your heart.
Rationalize all you want Carl. It doesn't change the fact that 1 billion catholics have everything to do with it.
You , and many like you, support and defend child rape. You support an organization, with your words and participation, that protects child rapist over children; that puts money ahead of morals; and chooses dogma over human rights.
Nothing to be proud of Carl.
Corona, you are wrong. The only thing you have ever heard of about the Catholic church is the child sex abuse. You know nothing else. When you fully educate yourself about it, come back and discuss it. You can't paint all Catholics with the same brush as the one used to paint the priests that committed these horrific acts and those that protected them. You are grossly misguided. The media only reports bad things. That seems to be your source of reference. I've met and known many priests. You have to wonder, though, why parents and victims took payoffs instead of prosecuting the offenders. If that had happened to either of my children, I would have sought prosecution until the end of my life. There are priests and bishops serving time for these crimes.
@Corona-Very well said.
Corona what an ignorant statement you just made. Catholics have their beliefs and the child sex abuse scandal has nothing to do with why they worship in their church. I doubt few of them are not simply horrified on what has happened to these poor children. But their faith in Jesus and their church stand regardless or they simply don;t believe anymore. The priests who committed these crimes are horrible and should be imprisoned and those that covered it up are just as bad and should also be serving time. But to say these people support and defend child rape? That is a terrible statement. You condone 1.2 billion people because their beliefs are not yours.
Corona,
I realize you are just trolling on here to get a rise out of people and I shouldnt reply to you, but I am.
I will use the same logic as you: Charles Manson helped murder people. He is an American. You are an American. Therefore, you murder people.
Are you kind of beginning to see what a dumba$$ you sound like?.....
I understand, it is part of the trolling experience to just say nonsense stuff to get a rise out of people. You have got to find other hobbies though. Go take a walk in the park or adopt a pet or something.
Corky....you are projecting.
Your analogy is flawed. If the police, prosecutor, and judge all conspired to keep the crime secret and transferred Mr. Manson to another precinct to kill again.....that would analogous to the catholic church.
The catholic hierarchy, all the way to the pope, have been shown to be complicit in the cover-up of child rape.
You defend and minimize child rape and I'm the troll?? That is the logic I can expect from someone with the developmental age of 7.
Hooker heels,
I know more about the history of the Catholic church than you. I read sources outside of the faith. You should try it.
Not nearly enough honey......
To this day abuses still occur. You support the church, you support the abuses.
Charol Shakeshaft, the Hofstra University scholar who prepared the report,
said the number of abuse cases—which range from unwanted sexual comments to
rape—could be much higher.
"So we think the Catholic Church has a problem?" she told industry newspaper
Education Week in a March 10 interview.
To support her contention, Shakeshaft compared the priest abuse data with
data collected in a national survey for the American Association of University
Women Educational Foundation in 2000. Extrapolating data from the latter, she
estimated roughly 290,000 students experienced some sort of physical sexual
abuse by a school employee from a single decade—1991-2000. That compares with
about five decades of cases of abusive priests.
Such figures led her to contend "the physical sexual abuse of students in
schools is likely more than 100 times the abuse by priests."
bad people aka devils, devil worshippers live amongst us. up to this day, the roman catholic church have been infiltrated by bad people aka devils, disguising as either clerics or worshippers. this is earth, the humans that live on earth are made of characters of good and evil, characters that can either turn good from evil or turn evil from good. therefore good and evil people are all over, be at your own home, schools, work, government, churches, organizations, bloggers, tweeters, seminaries, convents, airports, etc, etc. yes, everywhere. so, what made you all think anybody in this world, for that matter the roman catholic church can get rid of bad people aka the devils. those candidates for priesthood, to assume they are all good people are in denial or naive. prayers are the the only weapon the roman catholics use to fight these evils, which the new pope had asked the faithful and believers to pray with him and for him to fight these evils. the devils are projecting their outside demeanor as soft spoken, sweet aura, consoling, comforting attitudes. these outside behavior can only be tackled on first sight by a person with sharp, strong wills, wisdoms with GOD given gift of talent to judge human's inherent characters. overtime the true characters of bad people aka the devils are revealed by their dirty deeds and actions. all of you not using your intelligence to the max, or either truly lacking intelligence, kept on repeating the roman catholic church is evil, you all need to calm down, meditate, so you all can make concrete rationale reasonings, and not be hopeless bashers (aka secular progressives) of the roman catholic church with beliefs and feelings, you all are saving this earth from evil people.
Corona, hookers cannot afford the shoes in my AVI, and please don't refer to me as your "honey". Answer the question as to why the parents and victims took payouts. I would have prosecuted. I am not money hungry. As citizens, the victims and their families had the rights to prosecute, but it seems the almighty dollar won.
That's one heck of a ride he's got there. Mercedes? And I do believe that's bullet plated glass.
Simply mind boggling.
Wow!
From giving pedicures to being elected Pope!
This guy is a real go-getter!
He was not giving a pedicure, he was washing someone's feet. Jesus also did this humble task. In Bible times, because people wore sandals instead of shoes, their feet would become dusty and it was up to a servant to wash off the dust. It was a lowly task. Anyone who practices being a servant like Jesus identifies with that task.
I want a pedicure, too. But I am not Catholic.
suds,
You are also not a comedy writer.
If the Catholic Church sold off all the property and treasures they've accumulated over the centuries, actually followed their vow of poverty, and gave their wealth to the poor (you know, like Jesus said), there wouldn't be any poor people.
First, what "vow of poverty" are you speaking of? Only members of certain religious orders take such a vow. Jesus never said that His followers should be poor, nor did the apostles. He did tell people to not be ATTACHED to what they own, or to make having wealth their sole goal in life. In the Scriptural passage that you refer to, Jesus was telling one man in particular to sell what he had and give it to the poor, as this rich man came to him complaining of feeling unfulfilled in life. Jesus' words were situation-specific, not general. (A poor man with a chicken can be more attached to that bird than a generous wealthy man might be to his car.)
Secondly, wealth creates wealth. A poor Church, devoid of wealth, will be able to run orphanages, hospitals, hospitals, health clinics, etc., HOW exactly?
Thirdly, the church doesn't "own" the treasures that you speak of. They belong to all Catholics, and to all of humanity in some sense, our collective cultural inheritance. The White House could sell off its antiques and crystal chandeliers to help poor citizen-Americans, but it can't - they belong to "the people". Same thing.
The new pope can choose to eschew "swanky" Vatican "perks" if he wants to, and he probably will. The simplicity with which he lived his life as a cardinal touches on something at the core of his being. It isn't an affectation.
How many church critics would be willing to forgo buying a new iPhone, and giving that money to the poor?
Well, the Jesuits take a vow of poverty, so he starts from there. He can live in the 'fancy digs,' because that's where it is convenient for him to do so, to be near his daily workplace. But that doesn't mean he has to sleep on silk sheets, in a large bed, or wear expensive clothes. He can move a cot into his bedroom and sleep on that. And given that, when he became cardinal, he had the previous guy's clothes altered to fit him, one might assume he's also not into fancy linen shirts and silk suits.
We may never know what he chooses to do, as flaunting those choices would be inappropriate (remember what Christ said about the pharisee and the publican?), and defeat the reason for making them in the first place. You can imagine all the elaboration scenarios you wish, but until you have something concrete, what you are posting is just speculation, and probably a bit of jealousy as well.
Sure there would. Hand all your money to the poor today, and today the poor will have all your money.
And then tomorrow, they'll be poor again.
@Stephen Kosciesza. Well said. I work in public health (mental health to be exact). There are a few unfortunate people that really need help and want to better themselves. Others just want things to be given to them without working for it. Just like many people who post want to complain about what shambles their lives are in, and then want to blame God for it as if it's Gods fault for not "giving" them more. I had one lady sit in my office and complained that the government won't do anything to help her. She was already getting free housing through section8, free food stamps, free cell phone. I asked her "What else do you want to the government to GIVE you"? Of course she felt like she was entitled to a free disability check each month.
LOL true @ Kosciesza
flbikerchick.....they probably would but they know Obama would take it. And everyone knows how that has been working out
flbikerchick -"If the Catholic Church sold off all the property and treasures they've accumulated over the centuries, actually followed their vow of poverty, and gave their wealth to the poor (you know, like Jesus said), there wouldn't be any poor people."
You mean like Obama and his band of thieves are doing now?
Though a secularist, I live the life of sack cloth and ashes that I've expected the religious to live. So it'll be a nice change if the Cardinals start living that way. Also, if they're sincere in helping the poor, I think Michealango's statue of David's starting bid could easily be a $1billion and who knows where it will go from there. It would help a lot of poor people.
Um, you know that Michelangelo's David is not, in fact, owned by the Catholic Church, right? It's not even in Rome. It belongs to the city of Florence, or the nation of Italy, depending on who you ask.
That is all.
This is a man, that if he stays true to his roots, and given that he has not changed his ways even as a Cardinal, is amazing, please don't be too critical of him, as any person in a position of power does, he must do certain things at the behest of those that protect him, so while he may wish to remain true to his roots, he will, of necessity, have to live in the papal apartments, and ride in papal transportation and possibly even wear the jewelry of the office. He should, if he stays true, be a model to politicians both secular and religious, the world over. I for one wish him Godspeed.
i couldn't agree more!!...well said!!....
I agree. Why not give this man a chance? I loved he asked the people to pray for him and that he took the bus back to the hotel. I hope he can influence the others in this manner.
Pope Francis have to adjust to live in the vatican for security reason. there are evil crazies out there, who are haters of the roman catholic church. the new pope is a top figure of the roman catholic church, although not all haters are violent, the danger of assassination is the biggest concern. Pope Francis fully understand his situation dramatically change overnight such as taking the bus, simply being around loosely among the crowds are no longer an option. Pope Francis cooperations to take the popemobile, swiss guards and the pope personal security will be seen by the haters of the roman catholic church as an open season to degrade the roman catholic church and the pope, calling him all the meanest names to describe the pope, once these changes are in full play.
JessieZ this is the New Socialist America, where there is no place for organized religion in the thought process of the so call enlightened left. Those that believe are so narrow minded and old fashioned, and whats the term that the enlightened left uses so often...oh yeah, "out of touch". Since the Church won't directly benefit the takers that now rule this country, they have no use for them. Since the Church can't be taxed, the Obamalytes can only spew their hate and vilification. Notice how so many no-religious types are weighing in, as if anyone really cares what they think.
While the opulence is a ridiculous spectacle, it's the Pope's words that matter for me. His words are deadly for millions of Africans. Will he repeat the mantra that AIDS is bad but condoms are worse?
Simply put there is nothing Big Faith offers anymore that can't be obtained through purely secular means. Faith does not hold any copyright to morality, good works, or knowledge. Faith is superfluous and religion is poisonous particularly if it restricts free-thought.
I won't try to lay it all out in this thread, but I invite you to poke around here and take some food for thought:
For you Atheist I'm sure your words are true. But for others, faith is a part of them. You won't convert them, but I must say your efforts are relentless.
@ Atheist - luckily the vast majority 80-90% of Africa are not Catholics.
Jessie,
You're 100% right. Faith can be very comforting. Or as you say, faith is a part of them. Rum and coke is very much a part of being a satisfied alcoholic too, eh?
Comfort has nothing to do with whether something is true or not. I'm not as certain as you are that people can never leave faith and move into scientific naturalism. I did it. And nobody "converted" me. I stopped being lazy and nonsense sort of fell away from my world. It became easy to spot. Medical quackery is another field of interest that I take great delight in destroying because quackery kills; often taking advantage of people at their lowest moments (like faith, actually medical quackery is no different from biblical faith healing).
I have zero interest in converting others. That's what religions do; they look at people as souls to be won for a god. I look at people as fellow travelers that can teach each other valuable life lessons and have fun doing it.
I do have an interest in countering supernatural claims that affect the lives of living breathing humans. Particularly in public forums.
Totally bizarre right! I should not be allowed to vote, or sit on a school board, or at the very least NOT have my societal status raised above the opinion level of rapists.
Atheist, I am not a catholic but I am very much a Christian. I take some objection to your free thought comment. I have found it interesting that when most " non-religious" people have something to comment on when it comes to Christian, or other religious, beliefs that it focuses on a lack of freedom. That is in-fact the very opposite of what the God that I serve wants. I am in no way a mindless drone with thoughts programmed into my head. I consider myself well educated and I choose to believe the way that I believe. If God had created, I know that will kick up some controversy, man without free will then there would be no glory for him when man would choose to follow him. The freedom of choice is the very foundation of the Christian religion. Man must choose to accept God as God presents himself to us. I do not feel brought down by this choice but extremely elated. To be forced to serve is demeaning but to serve out of nothing but love and devotion is this highest form of freedom. The ultimate selfless act is to truly give yourself to the service of God. I know that many view this a weak but I ask which takes more strength, to trust only in yourself and your abilities or to release the cares and burdens of life and turn them over to God. One of the hardest things to do is to give up control.
J5432,
I don't know you. As such, you might have free-thought leanings or be on the fence when it comes to faith. I have met Christian pastors who are atheists. I was recently at a the American Atheists convention in Washington DC where a thousand free-thinkers applauded the "coming out" of pastors who were living a double life: these were Christian leaders preaching every Sunday, but at some point in their lives after seminary, they stopped believing the supernatural stuff they were preaching. They were stuck in their jobs. They saw their words helped a lot of people, but they felt guilty for preaching things they thought were lies (and were lies).
Thanks to The Clergy Project, these Christian leaders found a safe place to make a transition out of their churches and into secular life. There are hundreds in The Project now and it's only a year old. Many atheist pastors/priests can't leave easily because theology degrees aren't attractive to employers outside of religion! Many even faced death threats from their "loving" christian flock when they found out their pastor lost faith. Instantly, I know you don't find that hard to believe. Sigh. But I digress.
In reply to your objection about my point about free-thinking, let me ask you to think about the following quote from Voltaire:
"To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize."
If you were a Catholic, I could easily say that the Magisterium is the defacto authority that authoritatively gives answers to all questions of behavioral morals. Catholics cannot reject the teachings of the Magisterium without, according to the church, committing a venial or mortal sin and/or placing themselves at risk of excommunication.
I don't know what kind of Christian you are. If you are only a cultural Christian (one who likes the "smells and bells" and traditions, but rejects all supernatural claims), then you may be a free-thinker. There are plenty of cultural Catholics who are atheists. I used to be one. Lots of cultural Jews who are atheists and so forth. But you aren't a Catholic.
Now back to free-thought and a closer inspection of your words. It seems to me that that when you say things like, "I choose to believe the way that I believe" that is a red flag. On the face, that sentence is not enough to satisfy the definition of freedom of thought. I'm not joking here. You do appear to claim to be a person of faith (talking about Yahweh is a way that suggest you really think Yahweh is every bit as real as the computer screen in front of you, and not just a mental concept). J5432, here's the catch: people of faith cannot be freethinkers because faith is a tool based on either tradition, revelation or authority. Freethinkers base their opinions on logic, evidence, critical thinking. Faith is not a tool based on critical thinking, logic, and reason. See the difference?
At best, you may be a "free-thinker" within the construction of a tautology, but the beginning axioms to create that tautology are not commensurate with free-thought. At all. As such, that is not being a free-thinker and I am just being generous by placing "free thinker" in quotes.
I know it is hard to read that other people might not think you a free-thinker. When I was a Catholic I was told that too. It really got under my skin. The Catholic Church prides itself on education. I had access to fine education. Science was not off limits, even encouraged. This gave the illusion of freedom. But at the root, the Church would not permit me to use the critical reasoning skills of science to explore the environment of faith (unless I came away with answers approved by their authority!).
Many faiths promote compartmentalization: faith and reason must remain separate. Once one uses reason to explore faith, the whole house of cards comes down. You cannot compel a free thinker to accept a claim based on tradition, authority, or revelation which exactly how you hold to your beliefs. Ergo, you are not a free-thinker.
Think about that quote from Voltaire, and I look forward to your response.
Atheist: while I respect the fact that you are an atheist and you're entitled to your opinions...after reading your comments above, I must ask you, who died and made you an authority on what the rest of us need to believe? The very thing you reject, you are guilty of yourself.
How about a makeover for the White House??
I'm with you there!
I've never understood the need for a new set of china for every President!
I find it ironic that the enlightened left vilify the Pope for the opulence of the Vatican, but stand mum about a president that travels around in a million dollar limousine or a million dollar bus and has no problem flying around the country in a tricked out 747 that costs 4 million just to crank the thing up. Typical enlightened left hypocrisy.
George (Francis, if you like) is just a PR man for the controlling powers based in the 4th century AD. Let no man speak for God. This new pope, Francis, seems nice enough. However, is he "clean" from all of the church's misdeeds? Even the concept of a priest, speaking for God, is evil. Yes the Council of Nicene put the bible together, editing as they went. They chose the books that supported the control of the Roman Emperor Constantine. Books that contained other commands, from Jesus, were excluded and eradicated! Some of these texts (Gospel of Thomas) can be dated closer to Jesus's time, than almost all of the books of the New Testament. What the "bishops of Nicene" were commanded to remove, was the dictate of "Let no man speak for God... Let no one stand between you and God." The Gnostic's, who were persecuted to extinction by the early Roman Catholics, followed this command.
"When you were young, you dressed yourself and walked where you wanted to go. But when you are old, you shall stretch out your hands, and another shall dress you and carry you where you do not want to go."
Has he met his buttler yet?
Lavish lifestyle of the catholic church officials not a problem for little old ladies putting their nickles and dimes in the offering plate.
The lifestyle makeover will be for the other people at the Vatican in following this man's lifestyle in following Christ.
I do hope so sandiego1969.
If the people see the new pope continue to act in his modest ways, the others will be expected to comply.
Correction: Mate is NOT a typical South American beverage! Mate is only consumed in Argentina, Uruguay, some parts of Southern Brazil and Chile. Remember, South America is a continent, not a country. Each Country in South America has it's own customs, drinks and food. So branding it a typical South American beverage is just plain wrong. It would be like stating that manioc is a typical African food, when in actuality it is only consumed in a few Central African countries, ie. DROC, Rwanda, Congo, Central African Republic. It's great that we finally have a Pope from the Americas!
Thanks for the correction Burtonjr
It will be interesting to see if the Vatican changes him or he changes the Vatican.........
The pope is an evil joke on humanity. If he really believed in the will of god then why the "pope mobile." The Polytheistic Catholic Church. Worth billions shared amongst a select elite that live like obscene drug lords on money that should go to poor and starving children . Commandment 2 of 10: Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven images. Unless you are Catholic and then Saint Christopher, Saint Joseph, Mary, Saint Peter, Saint Paul, Saint Jerome, the Pope.....these are ALL OK for graven images (can be purchased at the church gift shop). The popes of the past are like a history’s most wanted list for global mayhem and mass murder. The Crusades, The Inquisition, Conquistadors invasion, conquest, rape, pillage and genocide of the indigenous peoples of the Americas are but a few good examples. Between 500-1900 AD the numbers of innocent dead due to activities directed, attended, and condoned by Catholic priests are in the double digit millions. The popes of history have denied proven science over and over and again and even locked up Galileo for life because he said that the sun was the center of our solar system. Add the continued rapes and ritualistic abuse of innocent children around the world by adorned catholic cardinals, bishops and priests and the system wide cover up from the pope on down. How good people can continue to follow such an obviously evil cult is beyond all possible comprehension.
Ben you misunderstand the whole concept if you believe the Saints are graven images to be worshiped. Prayed to and worship are two different things.
That's the same way of thinking the Russians used on children during the Cold War. They put 2 potted flowers next to each other and said we'll water one and leave the other to God. The one left un-watered died.
Since you are obviously not a believer and not an expert in the study of the Bible, perhaps you should not comment on such things. God will not be tested by man. He does not need your approval or acceptance to exist.
Every aspect of society has good people and bad people. You apparently choose to label all of Catholicism bad because of the few monsters among their ranks. So, in that line of thinking, all humans must be bad because of the monsters in our ranks. Therefore, according to your thinking, humanity itself is an evil cult.
So, basically what I'm saying is you are blinded by your lack of knowledge and abscence of God. You will believe in Him eventually. Under what circumstances remains to be seen.
Actually saints aren't prayed to either. They are asked to be interessors, like asking Mary to put in word with her son Jesus.
Ben he rides in the "pope mobile" for the same reason your dear leader rides in a bullet proof tank.
Dumbass.
Sam, I guess you have never prayed the Rosary. 57 Hail Marys in there.